Government Shutdowns, Setbacks, and Standing Strong — The Pool Pros Who Keep Us Going

In this episode, host Rudy Stankowitz gets into two powerful topics shaping the pool industry right now.

First, we take a hard look at the federal government shutdown and how it’s creating ripple effects across small service-based businesses — including pool service companies. From stalled SBA loans and federal contract delays to the trickle-down impact on cash flow and customer payments, Rudy explains how this period of economic uncertainty requires adaptability and strong communication.

Then, the conversation shifts to something much more uplifting — the 2025 Swimming Pool Industry Mentor of the Year recognition. Rudy celebrates the top ten mentors who have made waves through leadership, innovation, and community support. Together, they discuss mentorship, technology in pool service, pool chemistry innovations, safety, and the challenges of running a modern pool business.

Hear from the industry’s best — Greg Beard, Laci Davis, Shannon Wilson, Maddy Vandiver, Que Hales, Tim Bolden, John Poma, Rich Gallo, Ron Deloux, and Kevin Post — as they share hard-earned wisdom and inspiring stories from the deep end.

💡 Takeaways

Government Shutdown Segment

• A government shutdown can indirectly impact small businesses, including pool service companies.
• SBA loan programs and funding initiatives often pause during shutdowns.
• Federal contracts and payments may be delayed or frozen.
• Permits, inspections, and regulatory approvals slow down due to furloughed employees.
• Economic uncertainty can make customers hesitant to spend or pay promptly.
• Businesses in areas with many federal employees may feel sharper declines.
• Monitoring cash flow and taking deposits for big jobs helps cushion the blow.
• Flexibility and proactive communication with clients are vital during these periods.

Mentorship & Pool Industry Segment

• Mentorship can mean the difference between burnout and breakthrough.
• The best mentors teach from their mistakes and experiences.
• Safety awareness, especially around electricity and water, is non-negotiable.
• The pool industry thrives on community, collaboration, and support.
• Innovation in chemistry keeps pool water safer and cle

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Transcript

Speaker 2 (00:00)
Welcome back to Flock It Friday with me, Rudy Stankiewicz. Today's episode is the grand finale before we crown the 2025 Talking Pools podcast, Swimming Pool Industry Mentor of the Year. That's right, it's the Oscars, but with more algae, fewer tuxedos, and a shocking amount of back hair. We're about to hear from the top 10 mentors one last time. These folks are the Jedi Masters of Skimmer Baskets.

the gandalf level wizards water clarity the only fans influencers of filter pressure gauges okay maybe not that last one but you get the idea and first up ladies and gentlemen is none other than the man the milk the follicular phenomenon himself mister greg beard known across the chlorinated kingdom as beard man and so strap in hold on your polls ⁓ your net polls sickos

Let's dive into this chlorine-soaked showdown of legends.

Speaker 8 (01:00)
Just them a raise letter. It's more of a politer way to kind of, if they want to move on because you're going to charge them more money for the organics that you're pulling out of the pool on top of the organics, wasting down your chemicals and you're having to dump more, then it's time for them to motor on. Let them go find somebody cheaper that needs to hustle and has that drive that wants to go and do that. When you get where I'm at, and I'm back up to 175 pools, man, and it's at 57 years old, you're hustling.

Speaker 2 (01:29)
Yeah. You're hustling. Yeah, you are. Have you ever, have you ever saved someone from a catastrophic mistake, but let them think they figured it out on their own?

Speaker 8 (01:31)
So.

⁓ So I got to tell you probably the most catastrophic thing that I've had in this industry was a guy that I told not to put a basketball court and a barbecue backed up against this pool fence. And needless to say, had told him it's not probably wise to have the basketball being thrown towards the pool. And unfortunately, two years after I got in this business, lost a child to a drought. So ⁓ if you've ever pulled up on one of those situations,

I'll never forget it was in Fountain Valley right up along the 405 freeway and I was running about a half an hour late when I got there there was probably seven fire trucks about 18 squad cars a couple paramedics and an ambulance and I'm thinking wow what's going on here man it was a mass murder or what. Literally by the time I got out of the truck grabbed my stuff started walking towards the house and the police officer says hey sit down on the curb. said well okay well what's going on? goes I need to talk to you. Well okay what's this all about?

I just need to go in there and clean the pool. He goes well you won't be cleaning the pool today and you would have thought at that point in time Rudy that I Was a major felon because I was treated like one and I gotta tell you that they drilled me every which way But Sunday if I closed the gate the last time I was here, what time am I normally here? Duh, duh, duh, duh, duh. Mind you. I don't even know what's going on at this point I didn't even know there was a loss of life

And I had answered probably about a good 50 to 60 questions sat on the curb for over an hour and a half. would not let me leave. And finally I had, told the guy, said, Hey man, you know, something's got to change here, dude. I got work to do. he's like, well, Hey man, we just want to tell you that a little boy lost his life in the backyard today and, and, uh, had jumped over the fence to obviously retrieve some kind of a ball. So telling people, you know, trying to get people to solve their catastrophic problems. That was probably one that sticks in my mind. Um,

I think some of the things that I worry about the most is guys out here playing with electricity, realizing that we've got water that we're dealing with. ⁓ I see a lot of non-bonding issues to where guys go in and they may take an older system that was plumbed in copper and start popping a bunch of PVC in and out of the valves and putting in a PVC plumb pump. ⁓ PVC heaters now going in to where the copper's being.

flow lock adapter on and the thing you know, they're chopping out bond wires. And I'm like, you know, guys back in the day, the copper was your bond. And nowadays, man, that bond bonds are huge. Even if you have to drive a ground rod and hit an electrical with them on grounding, something's better than nothing. So I see that a lot where we are fortunate that we don't have more electrocution, I think. ⁓ Something going back to that phone line. I've heard guys.

I've taught guys electricity over the phone. that brings a tear to my eye because I love the kid that did this is Damien, who's out in Blythe. I literally taught Damien how to wire a complete panel. So I'm in Orange County over the phone. He was in Blythe. You could see him shaking through the phone. He was like, sure, I'm not going to get shocked. Sure, I'm not going to get shocked. Damien, I'm not going to let anything happen to you, buddy. Just listen to what I'm saying to you and I will walk you through this.

Electrocution to me Rudy is something that I think we're very lucky that we don't have catastrophic failure right there.

Speaker 2 (05:01)
I agree, I'm surprised that, and one electrocution is too many, so I'm gonna say that, I have to sit with that. But the number we have, I think since 1990, and this is a few years ago, I know the number was around 90, this is maybe six, seven years ago, so still that's a good 30 some odd year timeframe where there's been 90 electrocutions at swimming pools, and the number is horrendous, but we are,

Lucky it's not been so much more. To your point, not everybody. There's a lot of great folks out there who strive to do things correctly, who keep safety in the front of their mind. But then there's also a lot of folks out there that do things haphazard. And sometimes when you're dealing with electric at a swimming pool, you remember, remember the old ⁓ TV commercial for transmissions where the guy, I always wanted to work on a transmission, that type of thing. You don't do that with electric at swimming pools. just don't.

You just don't.

Speaker 8 (06:00)
It's funny you bring up transmissions. You know, it's a little bit of history about me, seven years old, riding my bicycle on a rainy day after school was looking to go make three or four bucks rolled up on an old transmission shop that was at the corner of Century and Main downtown Garden Grove. Walked up the guy says, Hey, what are doing out here riding your bicycle in the rain? I said, well, I'm looking for a job. said, Hey, you know, that trash can over there is overflowing. Needless to say, I never looked back and I was at 14 was ripping transmissions out of cars at a

Transmission shop and I'll never forget the Sosebee family. Well almost like second dads to me So at seven years old I had already started kind of my mom was always one of those ones as a single man You wanted it you went out earned it and if you wanted to go buy a bike or you wanted to go buy a candy bar You had to have your own money to go get that so it's funny You bring up transmissions because that's been a major major part of my life

Speaker 2 (06:57)
When we created the Talking Pools Podcast Mentor of the Year Award, we knew this couldn't be just another accolade. Not in an industry where mentorship can mean the difference between burnout and breakthrough. So here's a transparent look at how the top 10 mentors of 2025 were selected and why the process matters just as much as the outcome. I completely removed myself, says Rudy Stankiewicz, host of the Talking Pools Podcast.

Speaker 6 (07:22)
you

Speaker 2 (07:23)
I had to. I know every single one of the 67 nominees personally. From the beginning, nominees couldn't self-nominate. They had to be nominated by mentees, the very people whose careers they helped shape, and many of them were nominated by more than one. From there, Rudy compiled the full list and created a custom scoring program designed to evaluate each nominee on what really counts. Mentorship Impact Mentee Success Industry Contributions Community Engagement

educational presence, and more. All identifying information was removed. Names, locations, companies. The judges were looking only at contributions and outcomes, not reputations or resumes. That anonymized list was handed off to the eight other Talking Pools podcast hosts and a panel of sponsors. The result? A fair, unbiased, and metrics-driven ranking that gave us the top 10 finalists.

Speaker 6 (08:11)
It's...

Thanks

Speaker 2 (08:20)
the

very best of the best chosen by peers evaluated on substance. At that point, I became a curator, says Rudy. No one knew who they were evaluating. The same process will be used to determine the mentor of the year who will be surprised in person in a first ever doorstep award reveal later this fall. This is how we honor real mentorship by doing the work behind the scenes to ensure the recognition is earned, not handed out.

Because in a trade that's navigating labor shortages, rising costs, and a changing generation, mentors aren't a luxury, they're a necessity. To those who teach, guide, and lead from the trenches, this one's for you.

As far as I'm concerned, every single one of the 70 people nominated for this year's Mentor of the Year award is already a winner. These are the giants, the ones who show up, lift up, and level up this industry without ever asking for a damn thing in return. And our top 10 finalists? They're legends. Straight up, boots on the pool deck, chlorine in the blood legends. But there's only one championship belt, one, a glorious custom-made heavyweight masterpiece being forged right now by Wildcat Belts. Yeah.

those Wildcat belts, the same creators trusted by WWE, UFC, legends of sport and spectacle. This isn't some cheesy plaque or plastic trophy. This is legacy in leather and metal. So here's what's going down over the next few months. We watch, we evaluate, we scrutinize because only one will wear the crown or belt. Only one will be named the 2025 Talking Pools podcast mentor of the year. So keep your ears open, keep your goggles on, and if you're in the top 10, you better be ready.

Speaker 6 (10:06)
you

Speaker 7 (10:21)
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Speaker 8 (10:51)
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Speaker 2 (10:57)
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Speaker 6 (11:37)
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Speaker 7 (12:31)
you

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Speaker 2 (13:04)
Next up in our chlorine coated cavalcade of greatness. Put your hands together, sanitize them, and then put them together again for Lacey Davis, president of the grit game, breaker of glass ceilings, and the only person I've ever seen schedule a marketing campaign, close a deal, and fix a ⁓ suction side.

Air leak all before her latte cooled lacy is the strategic assassin who can turn a pool route into a profit machine faster than you can say who put trichlor in the skimmer and. ⁓ And yes we're still judging you for that she's got this the spreadsheets to make your your account blush the social media chops to make your nephew's influencer career look like a myspace page and a playbook so tight it makes root density look like romance if excellence.

had a brand kit it would be hashtag LACI. Buckle up, strap your net pole to the roof rack and hide your excuses because Lacey Davis is about to teach a master class in getting it done.

Speaker 1 (14:11)
I think truly, I think it was how other people at Disney treated me. And I came into Disney in a very unique way. It was a last minute thought. I had had a very rich career background already. I was a children's photographer for over a decade with a company that I was essentially a partner in. And I had...

done public speaking in Ireland for an anti-trafficking non-profit speaking in a big element speaking in front of universities. ⁓ I was established. Well, I wanted to finish my degree and my degree required that I have an internship and I said, this is silly. I need an internship and they're like, yeah, okay, well, Disney's always hiring. I'll do an internship at Disney. So I came into Disney as an established professional, but I came in at the internship.

And some people treated me like a human being and some people treat me, it says lesser. There was a coordinator. So in the Disney's corporate, goes intern, assistant, coordinator, et cetera. And there was a manager, senior manager. There was a coordinator that I was standing speaking with a manager in my office. And she came in and outside the door, me? And had me follow her into the break room.

and point at the vending machine and say, can you get those chips for me? That's out for her, right? But then on the flip side, I had some managers and I had some senior level managers kind of take me under and not necessarily mentor, but gave me their time and said, hey, have you tried this? Have you talked to this person? This is kind of how we operate here. We do Eaton grades to get to know other departments and kind of led me and gave me that open door for communicating.

Speaker 2 (15:36)
No way.

Speaker 1 (16:02)
And just the, had never been in a position where somebody, I've been very fortunate where somebody treated me poorly in my career. So I think that it was this underlying thing that happens because now when I converse with people, I'll say something and, ⁓ I hear, I hear that manager. Cause that's something she would have said to me or I hear him. Cause you know, I got that, I learned that lesson from him. And so that's something that I think.

can apply to everybody, what no matter where you're coming from is how people treat you in your role. You decide what you do with that and ⁓ people have a much bigger impact than you think they do in the moment.

Speaker 2 (16:45)
That is a fact and you never know when that stuff is going to come up. What's a skill you've mastered that you once thought was completely unrelated to this industry, but now you find yourself teaching it to others all the time?

Speaker 1 (16:59)
that's excellent. ⁓ okay. Outside of social media now, cause I always am a Dallas bum. ⁓ that's okay. ⁓ I think that it's really around purpose, having a purpose and what you're doing from a marketing standpoint. And that, that may sound silly. When I first got into the industry, I eventually took over the social media for the pool company that I was working for.

I followed a lot of their strategy because I hadn't done social media before. didn't have a background in it. I didn't have experience outside of my own personal online diary, right? So ⁓ they gave me this, said, hey, you know, hit the holidays, posts about, you know, happy 4th of July, happy Labor Day, ⁓ post a sale, post, you know, and playbook that they had. And I started thinking through why does, why does anybody care about this? Why does anybody scrolling this feed?

care about, I mean, they see 20,000 happy Fourth of July's, you know, how can we make this something that adds value to them? And so that's something that I teach pretty heavily on. ⁓ I know that we talked to Ipsen, one of your open houses. Thank you for having me. Thank you for being here. Yeah, my pleasure. And we talked about, you know, make sure when you hit post, you're bringing something to the table. You're not just spamming somebody's scroll feed.

And that's going to be the case for a lot of things. That's the case with podcasts. That's the case with a blog. That could be what you're posting on LinkedIn's meta Facebook, Instagram. If you're just spamming it, that used to work. You could do a lot of high quant, but the value that you add brings up your quality and you can post a lot less, a lot less. Not like I would know anything about posting less. my God. We were, when we first asked, we were posting

three times a day, three times a day, just to get our name out there. And once we started, the first time I lost somebody, I lost a follower, I knew it was because I posted too much. And that was about a year in, I said, okay, we hit it, it's time real back, I'm gonna be back. And now we post a handful of times a week, but they're higher quality, and it's always at how do we give value to the pool professional? You know, know your audience. And so that trickling down through, you know,

always be in a spot to add value. didn't think that that was going to come into the social media play of the pool industry.

Speaker 2 (19:27)
Alright, pool pros and chlorine junkies, hold on to your test kits because up next we've got a man who makes calcium scale tremble in fear. The wizard of water balance, the Einstein of plaster problems, the one, the only Q Hales, the guy who looks at your pool math, the way a cardiologist looks at your arteries, calm, serious, and secretly wondering if you've been eating cheeseburgers ⁓ off the backwash hose again. He's the co-founder of OnBalance, which means he has forgotten more about

pool chemistry than most of us will ever know and probably dreams in LSI equations. Rumor has it when Q. Hales walks into a pool store, the muriatic acid bottles stand up straighter out of respect. And if you've ever tried to argue carbonate alkalinity with him, congratulations, you've already lost. So buckle in, lube your pump lid, O-ring, and let's welcome the man who can turn complicated science into practical poolside gospel, Mr. Q. Hales.

Your on-balance test pool study on plaster color fading. wrote about this in Service Industry News also earlier this year, January 31st, where you compared inorganic mixed and organic pigments under both aggressive and balanced water. What made you choose that range of formulations for the test?

Speaker 8 (20:43)
⁓ Kim and Doug and I semi-regularly get calls from both homeowners and service techs asking for help. Because something happened that they either didn't understand or because they're getting blamed for something that they're convinced wasn't their fault, ⁓ there were consistently ⁓ pools that were losing their blue, ⁓ either fading to white or fading to gray.

and people were calling us and saying, I'm being told that it's because I maintain the water aggressively and yet I have all my readings. I know that that didn't happen. Why are these losing their blue? I talked to the plastering company that I do a lot of work with and he said, won't just do blue pools anymore because they always lose blue. Blue is problematic, was his words. And so what I did was I went to

the suppliers for the plasters and Pool Corp. I went to all the supplies and I got every pool sample that I could find, plaster sample that are used for sales. And ended up collecting about 130 plaster samples. And then I made some of my own too. But I said, there's an easy way to find this out. And again, it just takes somebody taking the time to do it. I cut every one of them in half. I put half in water and half in bleach.

24 hours and then glued them back together. And I figured, you know, that's not going to tell you what's going to happen in a day or a week or a month in a pool, but it is going to tell you if that blues or any other color is going to eventually lose its color because it's not color fast to chlorine or if it is color fast. And so after I did that, I saw that there were consistently some combinations of colors that are used in the industry.

Cobalt, there's the phthalo blues, there's the chromium greens, there's these different colors. And so I picked the four that, two of them that were the most common ones that I knew were going to lose some color, that were combinations. That's another thing is that they usually don't adjust the organic. They make blends of organic and inorganic. So when it loses some color, it doesn't go completely white. So I chose the two most common that are used by all different major ⁓ pigment.

and material suppliers in our industry. ⁓ And then I took the straight cobalt, which is inorganic, and the straight phthalo blue, which is organic. And so I have four sections in these pools. And that's how I picked them. I wanted to go straight inorganic, straight organic, and then have two of them that are the most common blend. We're probably maybe about halfway through that experiment at this time. We started it in the late fall, early winter of last year. At this point,

The inorganic cobalt blue is still as blue as it was on day one. Both of the blends have lost most of their blue. One of them is backed by gray and so it's starting to look gray. The other one's backed by a chromium green so it's looking kind of gray-green. And the one that's the straight organic is starting to fade towards white. So we'll just keep going and taking pictures and at some point we'll say, we've proved our point and then we'll move on to some else.

Speaker 2 (23:59)
So in that same study you observed that the fading was more pronounced at the bottom of the pools. How does that kind of field-specific detail change the way you advise service professionals to care for surfaces, if it does at all?

Speaker 8 (24:11)
Well, we're chlorinating these pools with bleach with sodium hypochlorite. It's heavier than water. ⁓ And so when you pour it in a pool, it's going to go down to the bottom unless you do something to stop it from doing that. ⁓ And so you're generally going to see discoloration down low first ⁓ if it's being bleached from the sodium hypochlorite. ⁓ What would I say? say.

The same with the acid column. It's not smart to add chemicals where they're going to sit concentrated in one spot in the pool unless you're doing it on purpose. Obviously, if you're doing stain removal, sometimes you add a chemical where you want it to sit somewhere and preferentially affect that part of the pool. But as a general rule, and especially in regular maintenance chemistry, don't add chemicals in a way that they're all going to sit in one spot. ⁓ Blend them, feed them over ⁓ a working inlet, ⁓ dilute them, do what you need to do in order to

You're adding enough chemical to affect the entire pool. Don't add it in a way that at least for a short time instead of affecting just a very small part of it, if you can.

Speaker 6 (25:15)
in the pool service scene the pool service ass kickers who listen to the talking pools podcast that's you you a badass mofo look at Fridays with Rudy kicks off the weekend it's Friday again you fucking crushed it times ten building better business through strong education mentorship acumen Benobi want pool guru Kenobi marketing and staff and the skills to help you thrive ancient pool pro secrets you're an automation Yoda the Avengers of the backyard oasis Captain Kirk of the starship pool service my spot by the pool tech talking pools podcast like Rambo

Balls like Mad Max, pool ninja warrior, John Wick precision I'm on a maintenance mission Van Helsing by night with a towel cleansing vision We don't splash and dash, we do what we must The job gets done because I'm bound by trust And the pool service pro's a badass machine Making waves in the game if you know what I mean King and queen of the green, clean like a talking pool

They give all that they've got Replacing seals when that drip falls down Installing new filters, best service in town Cleaning out pumps, chlorinator maintenance Testing water chemistry like Neo in the Matrix Checking for leaks, fixing jets that don't flow Outrunning angry dogs while giving all we've got Like Ellen Ripley in the fight I'll tackle alien pool problems and fears Getting the pH just right, no need for tears United we stand tighter than Tidy Whitey's Two sizes too small, Flock it Fridays with Rudy

down the wall land of the free because of the brave the pros that listen to talking pools podcasts lead the charge their stories being told their legacy is long so this pro's a badass machine chlorinating is the game if you know what i mean like the rock we can't stop king and queen of the clean in the land of the free they give all that they've got

Flock it Friday! Talking Pools Podcast! God bless the pools!

With Pool Service Pros, they're achieving their goals Pool Service Pros, making your waters clean On Rocket Fridays, they're living the dream Rocket Friday! Talking pools, watch rocks, bless the pool

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Speaker 2 (29:12)
Grab your brushes and hide your excuses because next up is the human Swiss army knife of pool professionalism. Shannon Wilson. Shannon is the tech whisperer who can diagnose a pump from 50 feet away just by the sound it makes when you pretend you clean the basket. Field training, nailed, route management, tight.

customer diplomacy. It's turned to Karen into a five-star Google review with nothing but a smile and a water sample. When Algie hears Shannon's on the way, it packs a little suitcase and moves to a coy pond out of shame. And if excellence had a ringtone, it would be Shannon texting you your SOP color coded three days early. Buckle up, lube your pump lid O-ring and give it up for training machine callback killing dream Shannon Wilson.

Looking back at your first year in the industry, what's the moment you still remember thinking, God, I wish somebody had shown me the way.

Speaker 3 (30:12)
I tell you I know things wasn't right when I first got into the industry and we worked at this school and the was jacked and they had a third party so they had they did a third party vendor and when they went around the people that was teaching me all they did was chlorine, chlorine, chlorine. They didn't check anything, didn't test anything. Just hey, long stick, chlorine, we're good. You couldn't drain the pool properly because they cemented and cemented the main drain so there's no

No real major gains just scammers. I mean it was just totally jacked and people went swimming and hold a brick that was laying on the only edge all fell in the water at one time It was like this one whole side this fell through The the problem one of the things I and to be honest with you. I didn't know this was a path I could take for so long I think that's the biggest thing that I like to try to tell people now is get into where i'm at and it's like pretty industry and stuff like that. I didn't know it ever

these paths I could readily take and take serious like being a, you know, PhD, a instructor, you know, also do like the six away for EPA and do a construction. I said, I didn't realize that until the last five, six years that that's something that's, you know, that's achievable and do to create these paths to be able to expand and give your knowledge to you and experiences on top of it. So that would be the part. I wish somebody had the chance to sit me down and go, Hey,

You if you really want to take this serious, here's some paths that you could actually go down.

Speaker 2 (31:44)
So, tell me a time someone on your team kept making the same mistake over and over again. How did you handle it and what did you learn about patience and accountability in the process?

Speaker 3 (31:57)
of

the things I would say with dad is I finally was sit down and like asked him like tell me what what it is that You do why you do what you're doing like tell me explain me to this process of why you're doing what you're doing compared to what you've been showed to do and so sometimes that's been said to me and explained to me I go Wow, that's actually a good idea was to maybe implement that maybe this maybe something I thought maybe it was wrong and then it was just me being

You know stuck in my my ways so a lot of times that's what I like to do with a lot of people like even if it's like somebody comes in late all the time It's like sit down one. It's like hey, man, just ⁓ recommend you over and over and over of you being late How can we fix this because what i'm doing is not working. So what how can we fix this? So sometimes just having that conversation like hey, man If you come in at 8 30 and maybe work till 5 30, you know type of situation or something like that and it results and sometimes it's just you know

I found it, you know, not it doesn't work a hundred percent of time But a of times just have a conversation and then if it's something that's what they're doing is incorrect It's like no, that's not gonna work It shares why I need you to do this and explain into them the process of why you have to do what you do know That by times that has to click for them. That's at the same make sure you do this Make sure you do this. Make sure you do this and actually explain in great detail why this is so important

And I'm not a detail. I'm not a super detail guy. I'm just more like let's get this guy kind of thing. But sometimes yeah, that's what I'd say

Speaker 2 (33:30)
Alright Pool Warriors, put your goggles on and secure your floaties because here comes a force of nature, Maddie Van Diver. Maddie is that rare breed of Pool Pro who can run a tightroot, crush a green to clean, and still have time to build an empire before lunch. The technical chops that make service techs nod in silent respect. Rumor has it her hustle is so strong, her skimmer nets come with PTO requests,

She doesn't chase success. Success files a 1099 under her name. And if you've ever tried to outwork her, good luck. She's already three counties ahead and ⁓ dropping wisdom all at once. So crank up the pump speed and give it up for the multitasking marvel, the green pool assassin, the growth minded grinder herself, Maddie van Diver. You've got a brand new training riding shotgun with you. What's the very first thing you want them to notice about the way you handle these different pools?

Speaker 1 (34:25)
The first thing I definitely want them to notice is how I kind of approach the situation because those situations I'm not going to approach like I would just going up to any typical route pool. So just the approach to it, because that does play a big factor. You know, if you're if you're coming in freaking out and the customer's home and sees that they're going to start freaking out as well, too. So, you know, if you can go in with a calm approach and everything and just kind of give them that peace of mind because they're already freaking out enough as it is, especially they walk in.

You walk in there's a giant tree in their pool because that has happened before to me after a storm. just watching them and how I watching and how I approach things is a big one for me. I like to have them, you know, especially when they're riding with me at first. I always have this thing with all my technicians with everything I train them on is they'll watch me do it first and then they'll start to do it with me right there. Of course, then I'll let them kind of do it on their own. It's your also your first impression out there as well. It was a really big thing that I want them to see first because it will make a big difference.

Speaker 2 (35:24)
When you're teaching a C-a-a-a CPO class or any pool class where you have a group of people, do you rely totally on the slides or do you bring people out to the swimming pool if there's one at the facility for you to use?

Speaker 1 (35:35)
If I had one at the facility to use, that's what I would do. I have considered bringing out a baby pool and setting it up for CPO classes, know, just like a little blow up one. Cause I mean, at that point, you know, you can mess with the little chemicals and that way they can practice testing and you know, other stuff like that too. So it's an idea that I've actually been considering recently doing. ⁓ But for the most part, I'd say, I wouldn't necessarily say I rely on the slides completely because I do like to show videos too a lot. So, but yeah, that's pretty, pretty much how I kind of kind of do things a lot.

If I'm being completely honest, 99 % chance would not take a class out to a pool that would have patrons using it at the time. If I were going to do that, I probably email, give a phone call to the property, ask them for permission if I can use it and stuff, if we can shut the pool down for certain hours. But if I were in that position, I would say, know, stay calm, you know, we're going to go over these things, let's stay together as a group.

You know, we don't want to be too rowdy, too loud, you know, if we're going to discuss any this stuff, you know, we need to do it very quietly. We don't want them hearing what we're talking about, stuff like that, just because, you know, you just say the word shock and, you know, dropping a nuclear bomb in the pool when that's not necessarily the case. You know, we've actually experienced that with a commercial property this past year that are, you know, we have technicians saying they're shock cool and so, you know, versus boring, which, you know, in our world, we're not going to think much that, you know, however, you know, you have a 70 year old

community full of retired community. So you have 70 year olds, 60 year olds, 80 year olds coming up and they hear you say, shocking the pool, they're going to freak out a little bit. So that would be a big thing is to just kind of watch what you say in front of them is a big thing. And I preach that to my technicians every single week.

Speaker 2 (37:18)
So basically, it's okay to ask questions about it, but wait till we get back to the room. Don't ask anything in front of patrons like, my god, the pH, look at that, they're all gonna melt. Don't say shit like that. ⁓

Speaker 1 (37:29)
Absolutely not. Just wait till we're back in the room because I'd rather not open up that can of worms.

Speaker 2 (37:34)
former trainee of yours walks back into the office after five years. How would you secretly test without saying anything if they carried your lessons with them?

Speaker 1 (37:46)
It would probably have to be around the question about pH and the question would probably be, you know, how are your pH's been kind of thing? How is your acid dose has been? And I say that because I'm a huge advocate and huge creature of acid and base demand tests. My technicians, should we say it till I'm blue in the face? 24 seven. All my technicians keep the Taylor water book on them 24 seven. ⁓ It's in every truck, every new technician, could hand them that as well as a binder with a notebook for training stuff. ⁓

and everything like that. So it would be around that room just because that is something I preach religiously is that acid demand, a base demand test.

Speaker 2 (38:24)
Ladies and gentlemen, strap on your safety goggles and clutch your Taylor test kit because next up is a man whose name echoes through pump rooms and trade shows alike, John Poma. John isn't just a pool pro, he's a walking, talking upgrade package. This guy can take a rookie tech, a broken DE filter, and a customer who Googled, pools really need chlorine? And somehow turn that chaos into a five-star Yelp review before you finish your coffee. He's the fixer.

coach the calm voice in the storm when your pump motor sounds like it's auditioning for a Metallica cover band if leadership had a chlorine level John would test at super chlorinate and rumor has it when John Poma enters a backyard the water balance straightens itself out of pure respect so crank the RPMs tighten those unions and give it up for the legend with more wisdom than a stack of service manuals John Poma you're very active on social media you help a lot of people people ask questions

I've seen you, you're usually one of the first folks to speak up and take somebody by the hand and walk them through something. Where do you find the time?

Speaker 9 (39:31)
Sometimes it's a little bit tough, but I just make some free time when I'm available.

Speaker 2 (39:36)
Why do you do it? Why do you help folks when they ask questions?

Speaker 9 (39:40)
From experience back from when I first started there was no media. The only people that you had that would help you was who you were working for. There wasn't much of anywheres to reach out to ask for help. So I just figure it's just helping people out that are just starting out and don't really know or understand certain things.

Speaker 2 (40:02)
Why do you believe that's important?

Speaker 9 (40:05)
Well from my personal experience when I first started, as most everybody knows, it's always been controversy between builders and service. Well, I went to work for what was known to be a real high rated commercial builder. And every time something went wrong, they would always try to throw us under the bus. And anybody that knows me knows I moved up in ranks relatively quickly. So I was actually put into a position to where I did the turnovers.

And I would go out and then I'd have to go back when it was warranty called and they would be saying it was our fault. And I would have to prove that, you know, what we did not all the standards are above and we did everything accordingly to the plans and what HRS allowed. And, ⁓ a lot of times it was, you know, just bad chemistry that destroy he had seen heaters get destroyed in as little as six months.

When you're standing there and they start saying, it's not my fault, prove that it's my fault. If you don't have chemical experience, there's no way to really be able to stand up and prove that it was chemically their fault. So I had to step out and go and learn as much as I could, as quickly as I could. That way I could defend our product that we were selling.

Speaker 2 (41:24)
Do you think service companies and builders are working together better nowadays, less of the blame game than they were a decade ago, or is it just as bad as it ever was?

Speaker 9 (41:33)
I see a lot more work in with each other. We've reached out to some, some have asked us cause they want to serve us, you know, and they want to pick up new accounts. So they've asked, you know, and some of them just directly to me, asking me to, you know, take care of pools that we build in their area, you know, and since I'm in the field, I don't have full say so of that, but I do have a little bit that I can put in. You know, they asked me, you know, Hey, who would be good in this area or whatever. So.

I turn it over to the office and let them make the final decision.

Speaker 2 (42:07)
Have you ever had somebody ask for advice and then you give them your best answer and then they all of sudden want to argue with you about what you said?

Speaker 9 (42:18)
Yeah, a few times. Not too often, but it happens.

Speaker 3 (42:22)
You

Speaker 2 (42:23)
How do you react to that?

Speaker 9 (42:24)
Just go off of what you know is right. You know, what your experience was. You can't answer all of them. You don't have the answer for everything. And you're not giving them false information. You're going off of what you believe and what you learn.

Speaker 2 (42:40)
Now, I know quite a few folks know this, maybe not everybody, but when we were doing the alum cyanuric acid removal ⁓ trials, I guess trials is the best word for it, you took on the lion's share of those trials and to me, mean, you worked with me on it, you were out there, you were knocking these things out, you probably did more than, more than.

anyone else or maybe even more than everybody else did combined as far as trying it out went why Why help with something like that? Why why did I mean? I I know we're friends aside from that. Why'd you help me?

Speaker 9 (43:17)
think it was a good stepping point for going back in time. mean, being you both have talked about it, alum's been around forever. They still use it in most water treatment around the world. It's the first phase of drinking water for the most part. So I mean, if it's good enough for drinking water, why not use it on a pool?

Speaker 2 (43:38)
Coming to the mic now, man who put the rock in rockin' pool service, Rich Gallo. Rich isn't just running pools, he's running a damn empire. This is the guy who treats root management like a world tour, tight schedule, packed house, and zero tolerance for roadies who can't keep the pump primed. His customer service game? Let's just say, if Apple ran support like Rich, Siri would be out of a job. He's the mastermind who can turn a swamp green disaster into a sparkling oasis.

before your sandwich delivery shows up. And rumor has it, if you stare directly into his invoices, you'll actually understand what profitability looks like in pool service. So crank the filter speed, slap on your backstage pass, and give it up for the industry's headliner, the pool world's front man, the chlorine soaked legend himself, Rich Gallo. What was your first memory of being around them while they were doing pools, and how did that memory stick with you years later when you started building Pure Swim?

Speaker 3 (44:36)
That's a good question. I remember, you know, I probably was 10 years old when my dad started his company and my uncle and father were working together for another company at the time and branched out on his own. And, just as a little kid, I remember going to see on the weekend Saturday jobs, you'd watch the pool being the excavation being done. And that was unbelievable for a 10 year old to see, you know, you know, a bobcat and to see, you know, never.

never have seen one of those before. we had Tonka trucks, but I never saw a Bobcat. That's impressive. You know, and these dump trucks and the conveyor belts and just seeing these guys like in motion and they just didn't stop and they're digging a hole. And then by the end of the day, this hole is like a swimming pool and you can see the shape of it. It's like you're watching something being created. And even to this day, I'm just in awe how they would actually use

you know, Bobcat shovel and make these conch, these curves and these angles and everything. it's it's just it's an it's an art form and seeing that and being a kid and that it's like, yeah, I want to be involved. I want to be involved. And I got to drive a Bobcat, operate it once and only once. And that's because I rolled it, flipped it, flipped it up and rolled it. Oh, wow. And that was it. Yeah. It was like 14 or 15. But that was a shot deal.

Speaker 2 (46:05)
I have to ask, did you get hurt? I mean that's a... I think you did.

Speaker 3 (46:08)
No,

I probably got just more, you know, shooken up, more embarrassed. You know, the guy was like, yeah, let's see what you can do, kid. And, you know, go in there and hit this, pull this and boom, it went up in the air and rolled back. And I got laughed at and, you know.

I was thinking like the role the role cages. I mean you could pull off a cliff and you'd be okay. I wasn't in any danger, but it just ⁓ it was a great experience

Speaker 2 (46:36)
I'd like to point out at this time to our listening audience that Rich is a trained professional, do not try that at home. So, no. You had, ⁓ so you had kids at a young age. How did that responsibility change the way you approached running a business and guiding the people around you?

Speaker 3 (46:44)
I'm about that.

So I went on my own when I was 18. I went on my own the day I graduated high school. So graduated, walked across the stage around 11 in the morning. Three o'clock I had my first customer. Still have them to this day. They were old then. They are really old now. They're in their 90s. And it's awesome. know, they've been the whole journey they've been there. I could do a podcast just on them. And it was great. So I just, you know, at 18 I started going and

You everybody and everything you heard about business is like, Hey, it's going to take three years before you make a profit. They all lied. It took nine. You know, it was just, it was tough. It's tough to build something. And, know, I had my son when I was 21. So I'm real grateful for that because that really like pushed everything in gear. You know, now you have to, you know, make this work and you got to make it, you know, you got to, you're not living for just yourself. You're living for someone else. So yeah, it was, it was great having them at that age.

I'm 52, 31, now I got two grandkids. I was gonna have granddaughters in turn. Yeah, she's gonna turn two in October next month. I got a little guy named Jimmy Gallo. He's four months now and you know, it's just awesome. Yeah, it's really awesome.

Speaker 2 (48:06)
Isn't it fun, as hard as it was being a young father at times? Isn't it fun being a young grandparent?

Speaker 3 (48:14)
It was awesome. mean, it's totally awesome because it's the same thing when I would go to the back to school nights, you know, and they would think that I'm, you know, my son's brother, older brother, maybe, or they just look at me and they would know I, you he's a guy who had a kid when he was a kid type thing. But I just knew that there would be a balance in this, you know, and I had to work really hard in his first 10 years of life, you know, even his first 20 years. So you got you got that to deal with. And, you know, none of it matters at all.

It all comes down to at one point he'll tell me, you know, what you were just the greatest father ever. And, you know, and he'll mean it, you know, it will just be like some father's day card. And then last month he came over with the family and he's telling me this, you know, these nice things. He's either you're the happiest I've ever seen. You know, I love watching you being a grandfather. So I'm thinking, you know what? I think I did okay. I think I did okay with this kid. He was a great kid. He never gave me a sleepless night. He never gave me a sleepless night. And, you know, so he's doing his thing and.

He's doing real well and but yeah, it was challenging. ⁓ but you know, the kids are a great way to motivate you. It also gave, it also gave me the blueprint for hiring my team. And I realized, you know what? There's a lot of guys out there. Maybe there might be five years older than what I was in their mid twenties having kids. Right. So that's good. But you know what? I want a guy that has a kid or is going to have a kid, wife, girlfriend, what have you, you know, someone that's building a family, right? They have a meaning and a purpose.

Speaker 2 (49:16)
Yeah they are. Yeah they are.

Speaker 3 (49:38)
And it's the same meaning and purpose that I have, that I have now. We do this for our families. make sure that they're gonna be elevated and they're gonna be better off than we ever have been, create opportunity for them. So that really made it clear for what kind of team I wanna assemble. And it's just gonna cost more. You gotta pay that guy more. You gotta pay the benefits are gonna be more, because there's kids. But it's like, okay, let's do this. Let's figure out how to structure the pricing.

but let's take care of everything and everyone. And at the end of it, let's make some money on it.

Speaker 2 (50:12)
So just jumping off that statement, you're a huge advocate of being paid what you're worth in an industry where that's in an industry where it's not really that common as much as we'd like it to be. How are you able to do that?

Speaker 3 (50:29)
⁓ I take care of people who take care of me and the company is 34 years old and I can make this statement and I just realized this the other day. Anybody who's worked here more than one year, need two years or more, everybody who's come to the door and has worked here more than one year has made more money each year working here, including myself, owning the company. So 34 years, that's a long time to say that. I started in the recession, went through the Great Depression, went through earthquakes, ⁓ pandemic.

you fires, we lost 20 % of our accounts this last eight months in the Palisade fires here and you just keep going.

Speaker 2 (51:08)
If you could go back and teach little kid Rich, you when you were little, how to brush a pool using only a broom from the garage, what would the lesson you'd want him to walk away from that with be?

Speaker 3 (51:22)
I want him to know that ⁓ you can utilize anything around you to do anything and to pivot and to be able to get through any task. And it's not always going to be, you know, clear black and white. And it's not always going to be the thing in front of you. But if you start to look outside and you start to think outside the box and you start using the principles of being an outlier, a contrarian, and you do things your way and it makes sense to you, there's nothing you can't do.

Speaker 2 (51:53)
When you were just starting out, was there a mistake you made that seemed small at the time but ended up shaping how you approach training or preparing people today?

Speaker 3 (52:02)
God. Well, like any successful person, Honest successful person. I have failed more than I have succeeded. you mean from, you want something specific, like from the very beginning?

Speaker 2 (52:15)
Anything that stands out, as far back as 34 years is wrong.

Speaker 3 (52:19)
I can give you a highlight. I can give you the best of best of best of best of Check this out, right? All right. Okay, so you're rocking and rolling this happened ten years ago 24 years into the deal. You got a great team get the best guys every year I can make that statement I got the best guys I've ever had working for me right now ten years ago. They're the best guys So we're draining a pool and we're draining a pool because I think we're doing some lights and it's a salt pool big pool So I tell the two guys there listen

Speaker 2 (52:23)
Give me the best.

Speaker 3 (52:48)
You know it's real important when we drain these pools right here, we want to have the hose stop right at end of the driveway so it doesn't go over the sidewalk so somebody doesn't trip and break their neck. And you really have to understand that. So I explained it to them and they understood it. And no matter what, it cannot go over the sidewalk. Well, it didn't go over the sidewalk. The hose is about 10 feet short. So instead of running it down the driveway, just 10 feet short, no big deal, now they thought on their own, we're going to put it in a planter.

one of these little garden drains. Because why not? That's what drains do. But what they did is they hung out for about 10, 15 minutes. They waited and watched the water go down the street. Everything's fine. And they're thinking they're hitting a home run. I get a call the next morning from the homeowner. This house is registered as a California historic landmark. It's got a plaque on the front door. And she was a child celebrity. So she has all her heirlooms. ⁓ in California, born and raised.

I've never seen, I've never heard of until that day, a house having a basement. So this guy had a basement. Apparently that pipe was broken and that pipe goes right into the basement and there was six and a half feet of water in this basement and everything that wasn't floating was completely damaged because of the saltwater. So that's how I started that day. And I'm thinking, God, I have insurance, but do I have enough? Well, that guy took the hit as a homeowner and blamed himself for not telling us.

And really, got over there. Yeah, I got over there immediately to just damage control, whatever, you hey, I got insurance. We got we'll figure this out. Never made a claim. Didn't cancel us. Kept kept the job going with the lights. Real sad to see the wife take all her childhood stuff and lay it on a, you know, chase lounge to dry out with towels. But he was the coolest guy ever, you know, and that was my biggest screw up. And at the same time, my biggest lucky break.

Speaker 2 (55:03)
Yeah. I ask who the celebrity was?

Speaker 3 (55:06)
⁓ she was on member bewitch She's tabitha

Speaker 2 (55:10)
Yes.

Wow, okay. There you go.

Speaker 3 (55:14)
Yeah, isn't that cool?

Speaker 2 (55:17)
Next up is a man whose name strikes fear into leaky backwash valves everywhere. Ron DeLue. Ron is the pool world's Yoda with a net pole, only taller, louder, and with a toolbox that could double as a NASA launch kit. He's the guy other pros call when their easy fix turns into a five-hour YouTube rabbit hole. Mentoring? He does it like he changes pump seals. Precise, efficient, and without spilling a drop of coffee. They say Ron once trained a rookie so well, the kid went from what's this doohickey?

to diagnosing complex hydraulics in under a week. That's not teaching. That's sorcery. Customers bow. Techs listen. And filter cartridges realign themselves out of respect when Ron walks into a backyard. So tighten your unions, grab your voltage meter, and prepare yourselves. Because the man, the myth, the callback assassin is here, Ron DeLue. If you had to start over and staff your initial team, but you could only use characters from a sitcom,

Which sitcom would you choose? my-

Speaker 9 (56:19)
god the monsters

I don't know, that's the first winter popcorn I used to love that program.

Speaker 2 (56:27)
That's a good see Herman out there There you go, that's awesome Which the one Herman drove or the one grandpa drove because this was pretty sharp to They were both pretty cool if I recall so yeah Can you could you share a story from the field where you didn't you weren't trying to be a mentor? But all of a sudden it hit you like hey, that's what I am. That's what I'm doing here. I'm helping this person.

Speaker 9 (56:30)
Hot Roddy, girl.

⁓ yeah, I don't know until some of this stuff came up. ⁓ I just always, I'll tell you what, when I first started, I I've been in other businesses and people in other businesses don't help you succeed. But this business, when I got into it, I can remember some of the stuff and I'd be at the parts house and I'd be talking to somebody and some guy in the pool business would say, I got lots of experience in this, blah, blah, blah. How you do it?

Speaker 2 (57:04)
No

Speaker 9 (57:23)
And I remember thinking, you know, that's competition, but those guys are really helpful. All of them. Everyone I ran into would help me, you know? And of course, I didn't realize there are 60,000 pools in San Diego. But anyway, so I just have always liked to help people. And ⁓ Rudy, he's a African-American gentleman. First met him four years ago.

And he was afraid to get in. He's from Alabama or somewhere. He's afraid to get into business because the racism and stuff. And my nephew and I got together and talked to him says, no, it's not like that. It's not like that. OK, not here. These people, I have black customers, I have white customers, have Asians, you name it. ⁓ And finally, after about a year, he made the step and he's been four years. He's got 80 pools now and he's overwhelmed.

And have a good time.

Speaker 2 (58:21)
Well, there you go. But it's not a bad problem to have a lot of customers. that's for sure. Yeah. So

Speaker 9 (58:28)
Yeah, I'm really proud of him and happy with what he's done. He's done a good

Speaker 2 (58:34)
He's got a great name. Yeah

Speaker 9 (58:36)
Yeah. ⁓

⁓ There's a lot of them like that. There's just a lot of them. mean Chuck, ⁓ he came out of prison and I knew his mother and we went and visited him a couple times and ⁓ he went to work in the yards on parole and the parole agent used to call me and check in with me every how's he doing? Because I'd bike ride with him and do different stuff and I'd say he's doing fine. He's doing exactly what he needs to do. ⁓

And then we all went to dinner one night, his girlfriend and myself and my wife and some other friends. And I said, why don't you get in a pool business? And he looked at that and he got into a pool business. He's been at about three, four years now. think four. And he's off parole. He's doing great. Loves it. Making good money.

Speaker 2 (59:22)
That's fantastic. Doing great. That's fantastic.

How have the fires in recent years affected you? The fires in California in recent years?

Speaker 9 (59:35)
Say again?

Oh,

the Cedar Creek fire, that was the worst. When the heck was that? 15 years ago, there were some guys out hunting. They got separated, got lost. One of them shot a flare up and he caught the whole place on fire. the fire department wouldn't go out after dark. And I had burned thousands and thousands of acres. I mean, just half of the mountains went down and we were, it just put soot in every pool.

It wasn't a pool that didn't get wiped out in San Diego. So we cleaned it up, filters. I mean, it was like, start the engine and keep going all day. And, that was ⁓ probably two months before Thanksgiving. And, and and a wind came in, we had no rain and all that soot went in the air and just trashed all the pools. Yeah. And there was the same thing, clean them all up, vacuum them, clean the filters.

Speaker 2 (1:00:23)
Does it change?

Speaker 9 (1:00:37)
I mean, it was ⁓ a tough time. So far, that was the worst fire we've ever had in this area. They changed the rules and the military also helped with water helicopters and stuff. a fire comes up, man, they're all over. So, but up north, bad news.

Speaker 2 (1:00:56)
I've seen them in videos of dipping the bags down into people's pools to grab water to dump. And that's just, it's amazing and it's fantastic. But at same time, it's pretty interesting. mean, when it's not happening in your backyard, it's pretty interesting to watch when it is, I'm sure it's amazing to see.

Speaker 9 (1:01:19)
Yeah, that fire, ⁓ that Crest community, I think almost every home up there burned to the ground on that Cedar Creek fire. I went up there, it was just devastating. And a lot of pools, but it's rebuilt now. I mean, it years ago. but it was a bad one. The worst one I ever saw here. But there's a lot of brush up there that's pretty dry.

Speaker 2 (1:01:45)
If you had to design a first week survival guide for anyone getting into this business, what would it have to say on page one?

Speaker 9 (1:01:56)
⁓

my gosh, survival kite. Get a truck that runs.

Have somebody help you get the right equipment. ⁓ Survival. Of course, back then we used the Thomas brother to survive. Today we use our phones. Yeah, because they've got to get to the, they buy pools and the guy they're buying them from most likely will, ⁓ you know, take them out for two or three weeks, but you still got to find them till you get used to them. For ⁓ when I started, I kept a route book.

Speaker 2 (1:02:13)
Yeah

Speaker 9 (1:02:33)
with the addresses, all that stuff. Today they got stuff on the phone. So they just put all the addresses in and stuff and they can go from place to place. But that's something you need. I remember the first week was terrible. It raining and I wasn't prepared for what happened. ⁓ So that would be one of the things to make sure you got all the addresses at the correct location. ⁓ And you open up accounts at the wholesale house. So that would be about it. And make sure you got the right equipment.

Speaker 2 (1:03:02)
Have you ever had somebody clean the wrong pool, the pool at a house that you didn't take care of and they just cleaned it by accident?

Speaker 9 (1:03:09)
⁓

not that I can recall. That one hasn't happened yet.

Speaker 6 (1:03:18)
sun comes up.

already out there. One truck, one pole, one mission. Keep paradise from going green.

Empty the skimmer baskets, net the leaves The water don't rest and neither does he Brush that tile till the scale disappears Been breathing chlorine fumes for twenty years

Check the pump, backwash the filter, that's a pain The hum of the motors, calling her name She treats the algae, fights the bloom The backyard priestess, with a test kit of doom

You see reflections, he sees algae stains Every clear pool's a war, she's waves God bless

Under a blistering sky When paradise turns to hell below Yeah

I'm a... Poop Pro.

Speaker 2 (1:05:18)
The leaves.

the tile.

slow and smile.

to clear.

Speaker 6 (1:05:33)
Peace.

Speaker 4 (1:05:34)
Just c-

Speaker 6 (1:05:38)
GAAAA-

Speaker 3 (1:05:39)
Just the poo. ⁓

Speaker 2 (1:05:46)
In July 1994, a Florida man became infamous after getting his penis stuck in a pool suction fitting at a Lakeland motel, requiring police and paramedics nearly an hour to free him. The bizarre incident, widely reported by the Associated Press and Tampa Bay Times, has since become a legendary cautionary tale among pool professionals.

Hide your half empty reagent bottles, because storming the stage now is none other than Tim Bolden. Tim isn't just a pool pro, he's a pool problem terminator. The man shows up in your backyard and algae files for witness protection. He's got the knowledge, the grit, and the kind of swagger that makes a filter backwash itself just to avoid disappointing him. Rumor has it, Tim once trained a rookie so thoroughly,

that the kid started correcting YouTube pool experts in the comments section within 48 hours. His scheduling? Sharper than a fresh razor blade on a vacuum hose. His fixes? Tighter than a Union nut after three cups of coffee. And his business game? Let's just say Excel spreadsheets get butterflies when he logs in. So fire up the circulation system, raise your chlorine to shock level, and give it up for the one-man demolition crew of inefficiency. Tim Bolden.

Will net in Atlanta with a lightsaber would you train your text to be like Jedi Knights or have them figure it out like a Star Wars blooper reel

Speaker 4 (1:07:19)
⁓

Definitely a Jedi Jedi Knight definitely I'm not a big Star Wars guy, but ⁓ I think Jedi Knight would be the way to go

Speaker 2 (1:07:29)
I think that's probably best. hey, you bought out a partner, is this correct? That's huge. How scary was that?

Speaker 4 (1:07:37)
I did, ⁓

It was a huge undertaking for me, you know, I'd worked for this gentleman since 2008 when I got back to the States He employed me and and kind of promised me from the get-go some ownership as long as I grew it was this Now this was that was my previous employer so this one was you know someone in the local market and You know promised me ownership and I worked my ass off for four years and then in 2014 he gave me a piece of the pie

Speaker 2 (1:07:55)
teacher that you were talking about.

Speaker 4 (1:08:11)
And I grew it from 2014 to 2020. And then we had an evaluation done on the company and I was able to secure the company 915 of 2020.

Speaker 2 (1:08:21)
Congratulations!

Speaker 4 (1:08:23)
You know, again, it's a big process and having, you know, a safety net with a business partner and stuff like that was beautiful. ⁓ So, you know, kind of taking that away and everything's on my shoulders. ⁓ It taught me a lot, a lot of pressure, a lot of stress, but it's definitely worth it. Well worth it.

Speaker 2 (1:08:42)
Endgame earth is closed 915 of 2020 What an undertaking in a year when the whole world went to shit? How do I mean? How did that add to the stress level here? You are buying a company? Ever literally everything on the entire planet had just closed in September things are still iffy pool service personnel throughout the United States aren't considered essential in every single area and

How much stress load does this add to that undertaking?

Speaker 4 (1:09:15)
It's pretty significant because everything was remote based. So my attorneys, the bank, all the financial aspects of what you have to go through was all digital and over the internet. And Zoom had been around for some time and those platforms, but I had never really used them that much. it was tedious because you didn't have someone there next to you to help you.

I'm a hands-on person. Someone walked me through anything face to face. I've got it. ⁓ It was a lot of things that I wasn't accustomed to. I had to create a business plan. I had to create what the trajectory of the business looked like over the next three years because I had to finance ⁓ the loan. So it taught me a lot about business, ⁓ which I didn't have. I ran the company as a whole, but not so much the financial aspect prior to purchasing the company.

So I think that was a huge blessing going through that process, allowing me to understand terminology that, you know, in the financial world that I probably wasn't a hundred percent accustomed to. But it was difficult, but you know what? Difficult times create diamonds and, you know, diamonds in the rough. And, you know, it was a tough time to go through, but I wouldn't have changed it for any.

Speaker 2 (1:10:33)
How badly do you wish you could have bought stock in zoom in 2019?

Speaker 4 (1:10:38)
That would have been beautiful. We may not be sitting on this call today.

Speaker 2 (1:10:43)
You offer benefits and career paths and that's not always seen in this industry. What's your philosophy on making pool service a career so that it's not just a summer gig?

Speaker 4 (1:10:56)
I think it goes beyond just the pool industry as a whole. you know, yeah. So basically, you know, it starts at day one, but you know, my, my big phrase that I like to say is we hired to retire. ⁓ you know, the, the pool industry is known as a lily pad. You know, people don't grow up saying I'm to be a pool guy. And, know, you kind of accidentally fall into the industry as most of us have. And, you realize that it's a pretty lucrative industry and it's fun. ⁓ you know, I, I absolutely love being around water. ⁓

You know, being living in Atlanta really sucks because I'm nowhere near water ocean wise. ⁓ but yeah, I think the biggest thing is, is being able to show, ⁓ new staff opportunities that they can have within our organization. ⁓ you know, if they come in as a maintenance tech, ⁓ they can always move to the repair department and they can move into renovations. ⁓ today is the last day of mine.

or yesterday was the last day of my non-compete with my old business partner. So we're starting new construction moving into this fall. So there's opportunities for designs and, you know, install crews and stuff like that. So I think that's the beauty of it is, is we don't necessarily, if you want to come into our company and stay in a department because you love that, that's fine. That's okay. ⁓ But I think the opportunity to be able to show people pathways where they can see an actual career and long-term benefits. I think that's what

Speaker 3 (1:12:00)
okay

Speaker 4 (1:12:24)
kind of wins over our staff and they understand the amount of energy that myself and my GM, our leadership team puts into the company. And that allows them to reciprocate it because they see us do. I'd say we're a true team and the decisions made in the company go all the way down to the greenest person in the company.

Speaker 2 (1:12:48)
Alright, pool pros, tighten your goggles and silence your beepers because closing out this chlorine soaked hall of fame is the man, the legend, the final boss of pool knowledge, Kevin Post. Kevin isn't just in the pool industry, he's basically the settings menu. Every builder, service pro, and operator eventually has to scroll down and click ask Kevin when they've completely fried their mental motherboard. He's the guy who can walk into a room full of people arguing about water balance and settle it with a single sentence.

and a perfectly drawn diagram that makes you feel like you should have stayed awake in chemistry class. Rumor has it Kevin once adjusted a commercial pool system so precisely that the water achieved a state of zen. Ducks landed on it, meditated, and then left reviews on Yelp. He's got more acronyms under his belt than a government agency. And when he talks, even the NSF standards stop and take notes. So crank up your recirculation rate, sharpen your pencils, and bow to the oracle of operations. Kevin Post. ⁓

So you're the CEO of this large consulting firm for the industry, like you said, representation in all of the States, got this big massive project going on in New York. I know you have other projects going on as well. So you decided you didn't have enough on your plate. You might as well just be board president for CMAQ. What were you thinking?

Speaker 4 (1:14:07)
I don't know if I was thinking at the time, and I was also one of those voluntold situations. you know, the creation of the Monacoatic Health Code and the creation of the CMAC goes back through Councilman Hunsaker's legacy all the way back to Joe Hunsaker. He was in the room during the first conversations of a national code being needed to be created. Scott Hunsaker served on the board and treasurer helping create the CMAC originally. ⁓

Carl Nylander, one of my business partners, served on the board as well as president, technical chair committee. So we've had a long history in just supporting that. so as I stepped into the CEO role, I kind of felt like it was my turn to take the reins on the CMAC. And as we were looking at growing in new directions and where do we go from a sustainability standpoint, which a lot of other people on the board.

kind of asked that I would step in as the board president. And ⁓ so I said yes. I don't know why I said yes, but I did. I've actually, it's been great. The board's always really great to work with. And I'm excited about trying to figure out where we go next.

Speaker 2 (1:15:16)
I'm ask you a question. We can strike this if you want to strike it. Is the CMAC in trouble?

Speaker 4 (1:15:21)
It's a fair question. ⁓ The CDC is in trouble. However, as a board president, when I came in, even before what's happened with the CDC, I made the comment that the CMAC has been funded by the CDC for over 10 years. The CDC has never had a history of indefinitely funding ⁓ initiatives like this. They typically set up the seed funding for the initial three to five years and help that

hope that it becomes a self-sustaining. So we had already passed the typical length of CDC support. So regardless of what happened to the CDC, my mission as the president was to figure out how we're self-sustaining. ⁓ I always wanted to basically be the CDC partner where we say, hey, we are the providers of this ⁓ ongoing ⁓ update cycle and we'll do all this as a partner so that you can have an updated model aquatic health code at all times. So it didn't really change

our direction, it just really validated the fact that ⁓ whether it was going to happen for reason A or reason B, that the idea that CDC's funding of things like this is going away. So regardless of whether it was because of our tenure or just because of new direction of politics. ⁓ So that's, I would say that's where we are. ⁓ I'm actually really excited about the opportunities. We're looking at where our past revenue streams have been and how we can enhance on that.

We're looking at gaps in the industry and where we feel we can fill it. And then of course, we're also looking at partnerships with other industry organizations ⁓ where we feel are doing a great job, but maybe we can help fill the gap again. ⁓ interesting time for the CDC though.

Speaker 2 (1:17:04)
I am a huge proponent of the CMAC. I think Christie Reister is fantastic. I think Dewey is fantastic. I just an observation as a member, just something that I see and I could be wrong, but to me, I see heavy involvement from health officials, sanitarians. I see heavy involvement from the aquatics industry and I see the involvement from the pool industry to be lacking in comparison. Can you do me?

And do everybody a solid do me a solid do the C Mac a solid just explain the benefit because I've done it before and maybe your words will sound better than mine have in becoming a member of this organization and you know talk about the ability to move mountains but I'll let you take it if you could please.

Speaker 4 (1:17:52)
Sure. Yeah, as you said, you the CMAQ, it was created as a very unique, you know, council for the ModicQuadric Health Code. ⁓ One of the key aspects is how the voices are divvied up. It has a large input from public health, which is important. ⁓ It also then has, you know, input from operators, ⁓ industry leaders, all aspects. ⁓ Anyone is allowed to be a member and then members have the voting right on any changes.

⁓ Change requests are all public. So the reason I'm sharing this is ⁓ it's a great organization to get involved in because it's a very transparent method that you said moving mountains. You don't move a mountain overnight and you don't do it by yourself. ⁓ So if you look at what the organization has done over the past 10 years, it's just really impressive and you have to kind of take a step back to realize how far it's come. ⁓ But getting involved specifically with the CMAC, you're involved in setting

um, you know, creating our next round of guidelines. So, you know, I mentioned earlier, uh, cold plunges, uh, we've have surf venues, we have large swimming lagoons. Um, you know, all of these, uh, new directions and research is coming out of the, the CMAC and going through the CDC. My favorite part about it is the volunteers that we have. You mentioned our staff, which are amazing, but it's also then the volunteers are some of the, the ultimate experts.

You and I, when we're in the room with them, we say, we're just some pool boys. These people are just really smart and we can learn a lot. ⁓ And so I think as we look at the industry, ⁓ the CMAC has provided a lot of education for public health and commercial pool operators where those opportunities may not have existed without.

Speaker 2 (1:19:45)
What job do you think you had as a teenager best prepared you for what you're doing right now?

Speaker 4 (1:19:50)
I don't think it was actually my job. I was on my high school drum line and ⁓ we were national champions. And what I learned was hard work, ⁓ practice, eggs perfect. And then teamwork where we were absolutely, ⁓ we were scored as a unit and ⁓ therefore our weakest link was going to be our lowest, you our score. And so we learn about how to bring people up instead of put people down.

Being the best by yourself meant nothing. Being the best with your group meant everything. ⁓

Speaker 2 (1:20:25)
When you think back to your first year in this business, what do you wish somebody had whispered in your ear to make things easier?

Speaker 4 (1:20:36)
You don't have to know everything to be an expert. So when I started at Councilman Hunsaker, it about 18 years ago, I tell people I thought they hired me because I knew everything about pools. I was ready to be a pool consultant. Now, 18 years later, I can still only think about all the things I don't know. And what I've learned is I have a network of people. I know people who know things I don't, and therefore I know how to get information. I have access to information. ⁓

And with that, that goes directly to this topic of mentoring. The people who meant the most to me were people who shared information and were never trying to hide it, never trying to position themselves. And so early on, I felt like I needed to be the owner of something special to stand out. When really, if you're the sharer of knowledge is when you stand out and you almost start learning more when you become the teacher and start putting yourself out.

Speaker 2 (1:21:30)
And there you have it folks, the chlorine drenched circus, the mentor gauntlet, the top 10 legends of the 2025 Talking Pools podcast, Swimming Pool Industry Mentor of the Year. We've laughed, we've learned, we've probably voided a few warranties just listening to this episode. Whether it was Beard Man's follicular filter, Q Hales, his wizardry with the LSI, Shannon's checklist that could run NASA, or Kevin Post adjusting reality itself until it met NSF standards.

Every one of these giants reminded us why this industry is built on more than PVC glue and caffeine. It's built on people willing to teach, to guide, and to occasionally show you how not to electrocute yourself with a bad timer install. So raise a net pole and salute, give your cartridge filter a hug, and remember, mentorship may not come with a warranty, but it damn sure keeps the pumps running. I am Rudy Stankiewicz, this is the Talking Pools Podcast. Until next time, be good, be safe.