Chemistry Myths That Cost Pool Pros Money – Part 2

Are you making pool chemistry harder than it needs to be?

In Part 2 of our Chemistry Myths That Cost Pool Pros Money series, Natalie Hood welcomes Eric Wall back to the show to continue separating fact from fiction in professional pool care.

From the belief that a strong chlorine smell means a clean pool to the misconception that "perfect" test results always equal healthy water, this episode challenges some of the industry's most common assumptions while exploring what truly creates exceptional water quality and profitable service routes.

The conversation goes beyond chemistry, diving into technician training, customer retention, specialty chemical programs, filtration, troubleshooting, and why successful companies focus on systems—not just products.

Whether you're servicing ten pools a week or managing hundreds of accounts, this episode offers practical insights that can help streamline operations, improve customer satisfaction, and increase profitability.

In This Episode

• Why a strong "chlorine smell" usually indicates a water quality problem—not a clean pool.
• The difference between clear water and truly polished water.
• Why customers notice water feel and clarity before chemistry numbers.
• How specialty chemicals can simplify service routes when used correctly.
• Reducing chemical waste and inventory shrinkage.
• Building consistent treatment systems that every technician can follow.
• Why standardized service improves profitability.
• How proper technician training reduces turnover.
• The importance of mentoring instead of simply assigning new employees to routes.
• Why asking questions is one of the most valuable skills in the industry.
• Why filtration is just as important as chemistry.
• Source water testing and why it often gets overlooked.
• Variable-speed pumps during algae cleanup and problem pools.
• Common myths surrounding pool chemistry education.
• How manufacturers' representatives can become valuable technical resources—not just salespeople.
• Practical ways to improve your business by working smarter instead of harder.

Key Takeaways

✔ Water chemistry numbers tell only part of the story.

✔ Customer experience is driven by water clarity, feel, and consistency.

✔ Good filtration and good chemistry work together.

✔ Standardized operating procedures create more profitable service companies.

✔ Better-trained technicians stay longer and provide better service.

✔ Investing in education pays dividends throughout your business.

Featured Guest

Eric Wall

Eric shares decades of industry experience working directly with service companies, builders, retailers, and distributors across North America. His practical approach focuses on simplifying pool care, improving technician success, and helping businesses become more efficient and profitable through education and standardized systems.

Sponsored By

• Blu-Ray XL
• United Chemical
• LaMotte Chemical
• Revved Up Apparel
• Aqua Comfort Water Group
• H2Flow Controls

Also Featured

Natalie shares an update on her "She Swims So They Can" Tennessee Triple Crown Open Water Swim Challenge benefiting Every Child A Swimmer, including sponsorship opportunities that help provide life-saving swim lessons and water safety education for children.

Connect

Questions for Eric Wall?

📧 ewall@thegritgame.com

If Part 1 challenged what you thought you knew about pool chemistry, Part 2 takes it even further by showing how better systems, better training, and better questions create better pool professionals.

Listen now and discover why smarter pool care isn't about using more chemicals—it's about understanding the entire system.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:53

Before we get into today's episode, I wanted to just take a moment to connect the dots from the last couple of weeks. Two weeks ago, Eric Wall and I kicked off our series, Chemistry Myths That Cost Pool Pros Money Part 1, where we started breaking down some of the biggest misconceptions surrounding pool chemistry. Then last Wednesday, I had the opportunity to sit down with Hilda Lopez to talk about open water swimming and my upcoming Tennessee Triple Crown Open Water Swim Challenge, and why I'm raising money for every child of swimmer and why it means so much to me. That episode officially launched this journey, and today I'm excited to announce that the sponsorship opportunities are now open to the public. But before we dive into part two, I'd like to thank two incredible companies that are helping make this challenge possible. First, a huge thank you to Revved Up Apparel, my very first podcast sponsor. They believed in this show from the beginning, and now they're also sponsoring the official fundraising apparel for this campaign. Because of their generosity, 100% of every apparel purchase goes directly to Every Child a Swimmer to help provide life-saving swim lessons and water safety education to children in need. I'd also like to thank H2 Flow Controls. Not only did they proudly sponsor my Wednesday episodes here on the Talking Pools podcast, but they've also stepped up as a champion sponsor for my Tennessee Triple Crown Swim Challenge. Thank you for believing in both this podcast and this mission. If your company would like to support this mission while helping provide life-saving swim lessons to children, I'd love to hear from you. I'll be swimming more than 21 miles across three open water swim marathons, and sponsors will receive recognition throughout the campaign, on social media, and on my official fundraising shirt and throughout all three swims. The fundraiser is called She Swims So They Can, and donations will be accepted through October 3rd following my final marathon. If your company would like to become a sponsor or learn more, you can email me at nhood at thegritgame.com. And if sponsoring or donating isn't possible, sharing the fundraiser is just as valuable. Every dollar counts, every share helps, and together we can help ensure every child has the opportunity to learn this life-saving skill. Like I this is after a day of recovery. And I was like, wow, did you guys just do chemicals? Like, oh no, chemicals are good. You know, normal chemicals. And I was like, no, uh-uh. I no. Like it straight smacked me front and back up and down. You know what time it is? Wednesday vibes on the talking pools punch.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

The future of our industry is shaped by those willing to invest in it. The following companies have stepped forward to support education, leadership, and mentorship across the swimming pool industry. These are the sponsors of the 2026 Talking Pools Podcast Mentor Award, Title Sponsor, Blu-ray, XL, Title Sponsor, United Chemical, Gold Sponsor, Lamotte Chemical, Silver Sponsor, Revved Up Apparel, Supporting Sponsor, Aqua Comfort Water Group. Thank you for helping us recognize and celebrate the mentors who continue to shape the future of the swimming pool industry, and God bless the Pool Pro.

SPEAKER_01 6:30

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SPEAKER_02 7:15

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SPEAKER_03 7:37

I didn't swim that morning. I went to a different gym because my eyes are burning.

SPEAKER_08 7:43

That's the thing I learned about the industry right away. First thing I did was a chemical class, you know, and learned that that foam on the hot tub, the public hot tubs, is everybody else's stuff. And I'm like, ooh, everybody's got a everybody either did it or has a memory of the kid with the beard and a hat, you know?

SPEAKER_03 8:03

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, we're we don't play with that stuff. Don't put that on. Yeah, don't do that. Yeah, don't do that.

SPEAKER_08 8:10

But then the smell, you know, I didn't I thought that. I didn't know that till I got into the industry, you know. You always said, Oh, I can smell the pool. Must be clean. On my route, I had everybody on this certain product, and one of the the the consumers was an indoor pool. And the product, once we got about five, six weeks in it, it stopped allowing the chloramines to form. So the smell was gone. She didn't like it. To this day, it's the only one person I ever had that came off of the program because they wanted the smell that is the worst smell. No, your pool is calling for more sanitization. It's telling you it's dirty. She's like, No, I just that doesn't make sense to me. I said, Well, here, you got bleach. I said, Okay, grab grab a jug of bleach, take the cap off, smell it. It's not super strong, right? Now stick your finger in it. And now you can smell on your finger because it's attacking the dirt on your fingers. It's calling for you need to wash your hands. She's like, Okay, that makes sense. I said, That's what's happening to your pool.

unknown 9:11

Yep.

SPEAKER_08 9:12

She went back on a standard chlorine program and she called like a month and a half later, like, when is this coming? When will the smell come back? I don't know. Your pool's not dirty enough yet, you know.

SPEAKER_03 9:22

I said, I don't think I've ever heard that.

SPEAKER_08 9:30

And I always tell it, and they're like, Really? I'm like, yeah, if I'm lying, I'm dying.

SPEAKER_03 9:35

You know what? She should she should come to the gym where I where I swim because if she likes the chlorine smell, maybe she'll like the cologne guy. But actually, I am proud to say he stopped wearing his cologne.

SPEAKER_08 9:46

The cologne guy.

SPEAKER_03 9:48

Yes. I was I complained that uh I was tasting the gentleman's cologne when I was swimming. Literally, I could I'm just gonna walk in the water. I I could taste when your man walked into the pool, indoor pool, I could taste it. And then he would swim in the lane next to me. And when another lane opened, I immediately would move over. And I have a habit of of breathing on my right, instead of doing the one, two, three breathe and switching. Yeah. But he has stopped wearing his clone. However, if she would like to if she likes the smell, maybe she'll like swimming next to him. Um but, anyways, that goes into our next one of where specialty chemicals likely planned this. Yeah, it's weird. Yeah. Of where specialty chemicals are just upsells. And you know, I think some people hear specialty chemicals and they immediately think, oh, well, sales pitch. But I think there's actually, you know, I think specialty chemicals, I think that they have some really good products that they I mean again, they they have some really good products and they are affordable and they really eliminate those crazy back of the truck service routes that we're seeing.

SPEAKER_08 10:57

Absolutely. I I I think everybody needs a specialty chemical at some point, like consistently, because every pool is a little unique in the setting and where it is. And it's bather load. You know, that's the other thing is bather load. Yeah. That's it's not just the outside conditions. Um there's usually not enough out unless there's a hurricane or flood that that really dictate how that pool will be if you are on the right system. You know, we we have those systems out there that you can get on that work with any other chemical, ancillary, you know, chlorine, bromine, all that stuff. It works with everything. It's just it will help simplify what you're doing, especially on service routes. You know, the biggest thing I see is inventory shrinkage. So I talk to these companies, usually if they're they're 50 or to 100, they may not be experienced in because they're probably still running those routes or they only have two guys or so. Yeah. So they can keep a pretty close eye. But once you get over that hundred, hundred and fifty mark, you've got multiple people out on the truck, you've got multiple people out there doing ex doing what they want to do to treat this pool. You're treating it different, Natalie. I'm treating it different. There's no there's no uh streamlining anything because it's the pharmacy on the back of the truck now.

SPEAKER_04 12:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 12:12

You know, and just hey, what's the prescription I'm gonna write today? And that's where I think we we don't get ahead, we don't stay ahead. The proactiveness isn't there because we're reacting to what the situation is. Where you can wipe all that stuff out of your vehicles if you're on the right system that works with someone with with chlorine or bromine and will reduce your balancing and all that good stuff. But the main thing is for service companies is everybody in service will always tell you, I'm not as profitable as you as you think I am. You know, I'll get my my chemical statement for the year here, and my profitability is right here. And we worked our butts off. We had we hired four more guys, we were up hot, it was a hot summer. It should be here. And that's because we don't we we can't tell what's going out the back door and not getting recorded, or what's getting overdosed and not recorded to the job. You know, because i let's say I got 10 jobs today, job number three, there's a leak in the plumbing, I gotta fix this while I'm here. It took longer than I had because I had to go run and get two things from the nearest Home Depot, get back on it. Now I'm scrambling. You know what? I'll write everything down at the end of the day. And then by the time you get to the back to the shop, I'm more out. So I you almost got your first curse there. I have to write down what what I use today, you know, and that doesn't affect the usually the tech, but that's a bottom line number. We had some guys uh do do a couple studies with this program that we we talk about, and uh they found out that in one year, and this is up in the Chicago land, these guys had plus or minus 10 stops from the year prior to what they were doing to the new system that they're on now, and they saw a they saw they lost $13,000.

SPEAKER_07 14:00

And that was profit.

SPEAKER_08 14:02

Wow. And and it, you know, in Illinois there's only about four and a half month seasons. So imagine what that looks like in this in the in the Sunbelt, you know, all year round. And and and then these guys only these guys did 190 stops a week. So imagine a guy that does 350 or or 700. Oh yeah, you just can't measure it because people aren't good at recording it. But if you put them on a system where they have to treat every pool the same and it creates predictable water, you streamline your efficiencies and you you make them you make them more effective, you know? Yeah. So it's very important, you know.

SPEAKER_03 14:43

Well, I think you know, your your technicians are saving time, and if your technicians are saving time with those specialty chemicals, you can also expand and grow your route and and your business. Without always adding more people.

SPEAKER_08 14:57

Yes. Because if you're saving an average of 10 to 14 minutes per stop, now I can ask John to to run two more jobs today. Because one, we stopped brushing pools, and he's very happy about that. Yeah. But you get someone who's brushing pools on a Monday and they got 10 stops and it's job six and it's it's already 99 degrees and 104 heat index, and it's gonna be this way all week. I start questioning my life's choices at that point.

SPEAKER_07 15:29

Do I do I want to do this?

SPEAKER_08 15:31

Yeah. I'm not happy because I it's it's a strain. You know, 10, 10, 15 pools a day, some of these guys are stopping at, and that's that's just from you know me traveling all around, and that's a lot. And most of the places they're doing that, it gets pretty flipping hot.

SPEAKER_03 15:48

Yeah, it does, especially right now. I I I've always said there's what is it, there's four seasons, but in the south there's five. You are not Flyden August is their own season, definitely their own season. Well, and then you know, huh? Scorched Earth. Oh gosh, yes, I know it's it has been so hot. The same here, you know, it's it's uh one day it's like 112 plus, not really, but it feels that way. And then the next day it's like low 80s, and I'm like, make up your mind. Yeah, yeah, that's what it is today, but I think tomorrow it's back to thunderstorms, and like make up your mind. Right. Ugh. But well, here's one, and I've talked about this before, but in regards to chemicals, I want to hear what you think. And it's customers only notice when the pool turns green. But what do you think customers actually notice first?

SPEAKER_08 16:33

I think the clarity of the pool, to be honest with you. You've been in this long enough to see the good, bad, and ugly water. And you know, it can be clear, but it's just not polished, right? Yeah. It's kind of it's as simple as even looking at some of the filtration systems, you know, sand, cartridge DE. There's a difference between the sand clear version of clear water and the DE polished water that you have. So it gets down to two microns out of the water, you know, and now we've got this beautiful look. But the majority of what's out there is either cartridge or sand. You know, DE is that smaller percent depending upon where you go. But there again, if you have a specialty chemical system that you use, you can get that same DE polished water. And I've I've heard more people obviously green goes green, you know, gonna be happy about that. But I've Some people actually like green. Right. The aqua, like the the Bahama water. Yeah, clear green, not swamp. We're not talking the bayou here.

SPEAKER_03 17:37

Yeah, if you like green pools, anyway, sorry.

SPEAKER_08 17:41

But you know, I I've I've had a lot of people, you know, because I I get into people's business and stuff and and ask them, you know, good the good, bad, and the ugly questions, so I can share it with the rest of the industry. But water clarity is the thing. You know, it can be nice and it can look clear during the day, but then that night when you turn the light on, it looks terrible.

SPEAKER_04 18:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 18:02

It's atrocious. There's too much TDS in the water. Or you know, it's just it's not as clean as you think it is, because there's clear and then there's crystal clear. Yeah. I think everybody would agree on that. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 18:18

I that's what I was gonna say. The first thing that I notice is how it feels. That's immediately. I mean, of course, the looks, but that that's the first thing that I notice is the feel. Once I start to get in, I'm like, that feels different today. Or I went to a different pool that I hadn't swam at before, and it was normally I wouldn't go there, but I was like, I gotta get this in today. And there they said, Well, well, I looked at the bottom of the pool and I went, a little dirty on the bottom of the pool, and uh look it looked like sand. I said, Oh, yeah, you know, our a vacuum broke, and I went, Okay. And I said, Hmm, okay. And uh wasn't a long swim, but I got in and I think I got halfway through the 50-meter pool, and uh it was just it was you know, when you swim in the ocean, there's like the seaweed and kelp. That's how it felt, but with like someone else's hair. And I was like, Nope, we're done here. I don't just no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I immediately got out and just showered in the hottest water I could ever. And I went to the front desk.

SPEAKER_08 19:23

That's a big one. Oh my god. Good water quality, your hair doesn't feel like it's fried out. Oh, actually, you feel that your hair just feels like if we pull it enough, it'll just fall right out.

SPEAKER_03 19:35

No, actually, that's that's a great question because I noticed after um where my hair was truly exposed out of because I wear a swim cap on the bottom parts, because a swim cap it does not keep your water dry, ladies. Don't if you think a swim cap is gonna keep your water dry, it's not. It's not. But your water dry? Your hair, yeah, your hair dry. A lot of people are like, oh, I'll put a swim cap on, I'll keep my hair dry. That's not what swimmers use hair caps for. But that's a myth. But I'll say it, like around the sides, it felt burnt almost. Like I had taken a too hot of a straightener to my hair. And because I know you straighten your hair all the time, Eric. You totally get it. Yeah. But and I had to go and deep condition my hair for a couple days, and my husband was like, What are you doing? I said, My hair is still screwed up from that like 15-second swim I did the other day.

SPEAKER_08 20:30

Right. Yeah, you know, and the thing is the water feel the water look uh is the big thing. Because you know, you it's like a hot tub. You get in the right hot tub, that feels so silky smooth in there because you know, they have the aerate the the the air going into it and it's aerating that water, you're in all that oxygen, and it just it just makes anything feel good, you know. And then of course a bore pool. I mean, you've got a nice silky smooth feel.

SPEAKER_04 20:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 20:55

But um, you know, I I'd say clarity and feel of the water are the first two things that really people notice.

SPEAKER_03 21:02

Well, what's interesting, and I'm gonna actually I'm gonna jump one and go into a different myth, is I asked them um about the testing and they what what the results were of their testing. And they said, Oh, well, our test results are in range, so the pool is fine. And that's one of the next myth is that if your test results are in range, the pool is healthy. However, I got out, my hair was fried for a few days. It's I still can kind of feel it. I'm still yeah, I'm even using my kids like detangler because it's so soft. It's like the Olaf princess, whatever it is, spray on the bottom part, and it still feels like it's fried. But you know, I I think test results they do tell part of the story, but I don't think I'll go back to that pool.

SPEAKER_08 21:44

Well, in your case, I I I'd venture to say that they weren't being honest with you. Probably not. Usually when your hair gets burnt like that, it's been my I mean, it could be high chlorine or it could be low pH.

SPEAKER_04 21:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 21:59

People say that high pH can do the same thing. I mean, you think nobody thinks about not many people. They always think low pH is you know acidic acid, you know, obviously. But you know, remember on uh fight club where we poured the lye. Lye is all base, so that would be high pH. And it was very uh you know, it burned them. It can be long I would venture to say that that's not true because it's your chemical levels need to be on. I mean, you could have organics in there and stuff, but um your your clarity and your feel are gonna help you know what the truth is. I think you know No, I agree.

SPEAKER_03 22:41

Your case, yeah, it's it's I think you've seen even as we've been talking this whole time, if you see me kind of like touch back there, that's what I'm touching. My husband's like, Well, what can you do? I'm like, Well, normally I would cut it off, but since my hair's so long, We're just gonna deal with it.

SPEAKER_08 22:54

And they're not gonna tell you, no, our chlorine's 14, you know.

SPEAKER_03 22:58

Yeah, yeah, they're not gonna say that to me. But they they probably yeah, yeah, but I I will say we'll not be going back to that one, which was a bummer because it was a gorgeous, it it's a gorgeous pool.

SPEAKER_08 23:09

But that's the problem right there. How many other people are like you? Probably a lot, that are gonna say this is a terrible feel of experience, and I won't go back there because I know something's off. And that's what you don't want your consumers to do, is they swim and go, man, they are just this is not how it should feel, you know. And that's why being that proactive and not allowing it to get there, going back is important because once it's hard enough to get your service route built. Yeah. I don't want to swap 20 or 30 percent of it every year for new people. I want to grow. That's a lot of work. Yeah. And so, and if you're losing that much, there's problems.

SPEAKER_03 23:54

You don't have the right losing that much, yeah. You need to take a step back and reevaluate what's going on.

SPEAKER_08 23:59

I mean, even 10% to me, you know, I mean, it to me, there's there's still a problem I gotta put my finger on because I I want to grow 10%, not go back 10%, and then have to grow 20 to get my 10, you know? Agreed. Working harder to get there and we don't have that luxury in a short season, right? Yeah. We got a short season this year, so I don't want to work twice as hard because I can't retain my customers. I gotta figure out why I'm not retaining my customers.

SPEAKER_03 24:27

Right, right. Well, and this actually this this leads perfectly back into the one I skipped, and it's that training new technicians takes months. I mean, it doesn't really have to.

SPEAKER_08 24:39

It doesn't. If again, if you have the rights, there are some systems out there that you can start out by training your people how to read pH and alkalinity, free chlorine, and a calcium level. And then you guys can probably agree with me that most of us that are probably listening or or or bend in the in the trenches on this, we learn faster from seeing a chemical turn a pool. You know, I made a mistake. I've had to go back several times and before we got into a a rhythm with the system to where it it made things easy. But then then phosphates trumps everything, you know. Uh the even the best systems out there, the if you're not proactive with reducing phosphates, it's in the source water now, right? Uh, but going back to the training thing, we we can start out slower with the right systems. We have the right systems out there that allow you to simplify the training and allow less phone calls coming into some one person or multiple and will still allow for less callbacks for the customer because we're unifying the system with everybody. And the system is simple. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:52

So and I think too, by you know, really mentoring those new technicians, right? Set them up for success. Don't don't don't do like a quick one-day run through. Don't don't just throw a you know a guide or manual at them. Actually mentor them, right? You know, give them give them the education. Yeah, yeah. Ride-alongs. I think ride-alongs are great.

SPEAKER_08 26:16

Two or three days or two or three mornings, you know. Yeah. Hey, you know what? I'll I'll commit to I'm gonna commit to you three hours a day for the next two weeks. You know, but I gotta go after that. You know, I think that you're correct in that, you know, even with the simple systems, you still want to make sure they're doing it. And if we if we spend the time in not just throwing them to the wolves and letting them get frustrated and and then upset, and you know what happens a month and a half later after you've taken all those phone calls, is they quit. Yeah. Now you're so angry that you spent that time on that person that you take it out on the new guy that or or gal that replaces them.

unknown 26:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 26:57

And it's just a trickle-down effect, you know. Yeah. And it just gets everybody hot and bothered. So I think if you spend a little time with people out in the field, if they're in that role, just like construction, put them next to you, don't give them to the senior crew and let them dog on them say, uh, you know, you you tend to not burn them out as fast, you know.

SPEAKER_03 27:18

And I think by encouraging them to ask questions, right? I mean, I I think it's so healthy to ask questions and to encourage them because again, they they may if they're brand new to this industry. There's a lot to learn, and you should never stop learning, right? I'm still learning. This is a when I joined the grit game, it was a very different part of the industry than I've I was used to. And I had so many questions, but you guys were great. You you answered my questions. Um, you're very open when I when I first came on. And I mean, I would call and be like, hey, how do I approach this? And you guys were like, oh, you do it this way. And I'm like, oh, that's really cool. You know, it was just, it was different and I loved it. But if I hadn't have had that, and if it let's say it was like a different company, I don't know if I would have been able to hack it, right? Because it's just it's different. But by having that support and being able to ask those questions, it really opened up different doors where I was like, oh, hey, okay, I got it. You know, it gives you and it gives you the confidence that you need to grow.

SPEAKER_08 28:19

Absolutely. I'll tell you a really quick story. When I first started at Superior, uh, I was making my rounds, trying to meet customers. And back then there was very little training. They give you stacked literature and you had to work through it or ride with the reps. So that's what I did. So I I I was uh two weeks in, I had gone out to Galesburg, Illinois, and met, had an appointment with Dave Munson, and uh he had me come in and we started talking. He goes, uh, how long have you been in the business? What do you know about the pool business? I said, I know nothing. I've only been here two weeks. And he still tells that story today. Uh I just I said, But if I don't, if you ask me something I don't know it, I'll find out and I'll get back to you. And he he he said, you know what, we're gonna do just fine together. Because I was honest about it, you know. And and I would I would lean on him and a couple other dealers to to ask those questions because they they gave me the invite. And uh he was the one that said, listen, don't let anybody give you any shit because everybody was new at one time.

SPEAKER_03 29:16

Exactly.

SPEAKER_08 29:17

These guys have been there 40, 50 years, no one fell out at birth knowing how to do any of this. So don't let them give you a hard time. Yeah, they're giving you a hard time, they just don't have the patience to teach you. Exactly. And that's not where you need to go for exactly. And I truly believe it, you know, it it being the director of training. Um, I have that demeanor. I don't get mad, I don't get uh I don't yell at people, you know. I I my dad was that way, and he he was not a yeller. I want to clarify that. But he always taught me you treat people like you want to be treated, and you never treat them as if it was if there were something stuck to the bottom of your shoe.

SPEAKER_04 29:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 29:55

And it will get you further in life. You can be enraged and so flipping mad that you want to rip their arm off, but you can also deliver the same message with a smile.

SPEAKER_04 30:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 30:06

And so that's where I've always tried to train our team and and when I go in to do these trainings, whether it's chemical or or different construction products and stuff, and try to be uplifting, so you know, try to energy interject some humor so one, they'll remember you, you know, it sticks out. But two, just I always say that look, we're gonna start off.

SPEAKER_07 30:27

There is no dumb questions. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 30:36

Because let me tell you, they were new as well. And they lean on somebody. So you all can lean on me. And it goes very well. You know, I I get I get a lot of calls from people who who are just getting into the into certain categories of the business, and and it's nice because you know, I take the time and to my own defa my own fault, you know, I answer weekends and nights and all that stuff. But you know what? I I mean it helps. You know, we are a multi-billion dollar industry, but we are a small, tight network.

SPEAKER_03 31:05

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I would I couldn't.

SPEAKER_08 31:08

You gotta be there for each other.

SPEAKER_03 31:09

Yeah, it's a it's it's a s it's small, but at the same time, it's such a large industry. And I mean, the ones that say are truly the ones that have the heart and love this industry. So, you know, no, no, no dumb, silly questions.

SPEAKER_08 31:23

Natalie, I had color in my hair 20 years ago when I started, and this this liquid chlorine's taking it all from the what color? It was kind of an Auburn reddish color. I was a ginger.

SPEAKER_03 31:33

Were you a ginger? I was my husband's a ginger. Hello. Uh, when you when you said my hair actually used to be purple like 12 plus years ago. That was nice. So every time I got in the water, I I was like, oh, I'm killing purple smurfs because it would just drip out. Well, we are actually, let's see, we have two more and they kind of go into each other, but one the second to last one is the biggest pool problems uh happen because of bad chemistry. I mean, do you think that chemistry really is the root cause?

SPEAKER_08 32:04

I would say it's probably three-quarters of the problem. You know, where what can kill you is perfect water chemistry and terrible filtration.

SPEAKER_04 32:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 32:12

You know, whether the system's old, hasn't been changed out, the sand's 10 years old, you know, we've all heard the horror stories, right? You can have spot-on water chemistry and have such poor filtration that you're just there's nothing you can do to get ahead of it.

SPEAKER_04 32:29

Right.

SPEAKER_08 32:29

Uh and that's where you yell at people to overshock the bejesus out of things.

SPEAKER_04 32:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 32:35

You know, also sometimes, you know, people overlook when they have a problem. Everybody's on variable speed pumps now. I think they're great until you have a problem.

SPEAKER_04 32:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 32:46

And what people fail to remember is when you're down on that low speed during the day to save that energy, you're getting a quarter of the filtration you should be. That's about it. And so it's gonna take you twice as long to clean that pool up. So, you know, we try to spread the message that listen, when you have a green pool or you have a problematic pool, like phosphate issue or metal issue, all of that, you need to put that thing in service mode so it runs full bore until that that pool is clean and shut your heater off, you know. But but you know, there there is some truth to that. It's not totally reliant on the chemicals. So we've seen some weird stuff in our day where people hardly use anything at all and they have great water, you know. Yeah it's that that right combination of source water anymore. You know, I've looked at the source waters from all around. That's why I always ask people, do you test the source water that's coming into this pool? This could be your problem.

SPEAKER_04 33:44

That's a great question. Yep.

SPEAKER_08 33:45

I would up here, I I was uh no, I was in Florida. I was down in Florida around the the Boca area, and that the highest I'd ever heard uh phosphates coming out of the faucet was 1,200 parts per billion. Down there, 2300 parts per billion. The guy swore to me, showed us a water test, came out of the source water, tested it three times. And I'm like, wow, you know, I'm like, that's the highest I'd ever heard. Back around the Coreia area, it came out about two, three hundred, you know, because they use it for the lead abatement to help the our old water infrastructure stay. And uh or to keep the lead at bay, you know, without shearing off too much. But at the same time, you know, this is this is going into drinking water and there are pools. Uh-huh. So but I I think it it's not entirely accurate when it's more things, but it can be in the right setting. Yeah, poor filtration, poor source water, and bad chemicals, yeah, you're gonna have a bad time.

SPEAKER_03 34:42

Yeah. Yeah, but there's definitely, I think I would say there's definitely, you know, it there's underlying issues. It's not just that. It's it's you gotta drop troubleshoot to better understand, evaluate the whole system before you really decide on a treatment plan.

SPEAKER_07 34:55

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 34:56

And then I like this one. Pool chemistry is the hardest part of pool service. And I would say that I think people assume chemistry is the hardest skill to learn.

SPEAKER_08 35:06

I would say if you have the right teacher, it's not. I've been through some great classes and I've been through some classes that were not. I'm a doer. I'm not never a good test taker, I was never a great student, I was a great worker. You know, I wanted to be out, I learned faster and and and retained more hands-on. So for me, chemistry in a classroom sounded a lot more challenging until I had the right person teach me.

SPEAKER_03 35:39

Yeah, I couldn't agree more.

SPEAKER_08 35:46

I know five syllable words that I can use to make up two hours worth of stuff, right?

SPEAKER_04 35:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 35:53

So I don't think it can be hard if you have the right teacher. Also, if you have the right system in place, you don't have to worry about getting into the weeds very often. Those are the phone calls that people don't mind, is when you get into the weeds on something on a specific scenario that you haven't come across. Right. Every day, every stop, the same question over and over again. The guys the the person is not retaining that's to be a heartache for everyone, even them. Nobody wants to.

SPEAKER_04 36:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 36:29

Um, but you know, how we train our dealers that that get on our program is we go in person, we sit down with all the techs, and we we we go through what we need at their level. So if we have zero to five ten-year guys, then we'll run a basic quick through. So we get some some some basic 101, but then I can hold the the the senior tech's attention by getting into the weed. We usually segment it up. And I do all right, hey, give me your one to two year guys and then give me your your tune above all in a second session. We'll split them up if I know it's that diverse. Because you you have to talk on different levels with different people because someone wants to hear after I've been there five years about pH and alkalinity. Yeah, you're not telling me anything new on pH and alkalinity anymore. Pretty straightforward. Yeah, but scenarios and what those guys want to do is they want to get in the weeds of certain scenarios. What happens when this is low, this is high, and this is non-existent? Okay, this is what you do.

SPEAKER_03 37:32

So um they want to know how the the the whole pool system works, not just the chemistry.

SPEAKER_08 37:39

But the way we teach and we teach the system, it it attracts the newbies, and no one has said it's been over challenging right now. You know, the ones we've worked with over the past almost four years, no one has got off the system. And two, those guys, it gives them an opportunity to grow without feeling like they're idiots. Right. Like, oh my god, these guys are busting my chops, I know nothing. Well, now they can call when they get in the weeds on a certain situation that isn't, hey, what do I do when the pH is eight? You know?

SPEAKER_03 38:09

Yeah, which is which is important, right? I mean, which is very important.

SPEAKER_08 38:13

Well, they have to feel like they're vesting into the company too.

SPEAKER_03 38:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 38:17

Always just getting slapped down when they have a question, right? Right. So nope, that's not healthy for anyone. I would be upset if every time I called you, you got down on me and like, well, or again? Like, what do you mean again?

SPEAKER_03 38:29

Yeah, probably not gonna stay either.

SPEAKER_08 38:31

Yeah, let me go work a couple extra hours for you, Natalie.

SPEAKER_03 38:34

You're right. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_08 38:36

So you gotta keep it up upbeat and positive.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

You have to. Well, and you I mean, especially if someone's, you know, being asked to be there, right? Maybe if it wasn't their choice, you need to make it to where it it's gonna be of interest to them, but also down to their level of understanding, right? Because again, everyone learns at a different level. Right. And I I love that by how how you're doing that, you're you're making sure that no matter what level they're at, you're able to deliver that information. And again, I I've everyone's been there in a classroom, you know, middle school, high school, college, what have you, where the instructor's talking about something, you're sitting there and you're like, I have no idea what they're talking about, right? And the whole rest of the class is like, oh yeah, I'm sorry, but the whole rest of that class, not not every other person in there understands what they're talking about. That's they're just joining it's not true. It's not true. Yeah, yeah. So so be the person that asks questions to better understand. Because most likely there's a few other people in there that also don't understand.

SPEAKER_08 39:37

Hey, it's your paycheck. That's what I always say. It's your paycheck. Yeah, yeah. You want to earn it, you ask the questions, you know? Yeah, there's nothing wrong with nobody pays your bills but you. So ask the question. That's why I don't, I don't even when they you get some that are a little silly, you know, and I I don't I don't miss a beat. I just roll with it and I don't I don't poke fun and you know, uh just everybody wants to be heard, you know, when they can and and uh I give them that audience, you know.

SPEAKER_03 40:07

I know I definitely I I've asked Johnny a couple silly questions. I'm like, I know this is a weird question, but I'm gonna ask it. And he's like, oh gosh, no, but what now? But again, it's better to ask than not ask at all.

SPEAKER_08 40:17

So the question is the one you leave there with.

SPEAKER_03 40:20

Exactly. Absolutely. And I I think it's and I think it's also healthy and important to to challenge things, right? So if you hear something, I think it's okay to challenge and ask why that is. I think so many people in this industry, they hear something and they say, Oh, okay, that that must be how it is. No. Just because you someone says something and because they've been in the industry for 30, 40, 50 plus years doesn't mean you have to necessarily go, oh, okay, well, you know, so-and-so said this, so that that must be the way to do things.

SPEAKER_08 40:50

Yeah. No. That's why I never just give one short, like, no. I always no, but this is why, you know. And you know, or yes, but you also want to check this, this, and this, you know. So I always try to make it so they remember something other than a yes or no, you know.

SPEAKER_03 41:07

Yeah. Yeah, definitely more than that.

SPEAKER_08 41:09

Usually a two-part answer in most cases in our industry.

SPEAKER_03 41:13

Yeah, definitely. Or sometimes three or four, depending on who you're talking to. Correct. Yeah. Well, you know, we've busted all these different myths today, but if you could have our listeners walk away, remembering just one lesson from what we've kind of talked about about, you know, whether it's like better pool professionals tomorrow morning, um or tomorrow, what would that lesson be?

SPEAKER_08 41:33

What I would say is uh take a look at what your your company is doing, what your infrastructure and how you have it set up. No one in this industry that I've met yet is doing this as a hobby, as I said earlier. This is all business, right? And we're not doing this to do something. We we we're doing this to make a living and and to build something, right? So look at some of your options that you've never looked at. I challenge everyone that if you've been doing it for more than six, eight years, it's time to look at what else is out there. You know, there are things that have been around that are unchanged for a very long time, but there are also ways that you can work smarter, not harder. And not only for you as a company, but for your employees. And that's the thing with the high turnover and the training that is involved, even in building a pool or changing liners, it doesn't even have to just be chemicals. Everything has some or auto covers. That's a big one, right? Yeah. So look at how you can set your your people up to succeed, not fail. And and if, you know, you obviously you can reach out to us and we can we can shed some light on some of the things that we are talking about but not talking about throughout this. But you know, we're truly here to help. And one thing that we at the grit game do is we train every product that we recommend or we we sell. So we do offer that training because things like this are very important for us. You know, it's getting out that knowledge that one, you're not alone in some of the struggles for sure, because I get all over the country with my role, and I get to see the good, the bad, and the ugly of how businesses are being run. And sometimes the ugly is just because they they they feel like they're they're underwater because they don't take time to go to the shows. They don't take time to go to branch open houses and things where the reps are. So it's one of those deals like, guys, invest in your business and find out what's out there that will make your life easier. Because I guarantee at whatever pain point you have in your business, there is a product or a software that will help cure that pain point, but you got to get out of your office to find it, right? Or or reach out to your reps because that is a big thing. I'm sorry to derail, but that is a big thing I see all the time. It's like, oh, I didn't know about that. Well, it's been around 30 years. Oh, really? Well, when was the last time you went to a show? I always ask that. Oh, I haven't been to a show in 10, 15 years. And so how do you find new stuff?

unknown 44:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 44:10

Do you go to your do you go to your branch open houses when they have all the reps there? Oh no, those are shit. Well, so you do what? You Google? Because I'm gonna tell you right now, you can't Google the right amount of stuff. And even AIs are not gonna give you what you're truly after. You need to talk to people that have experienced things, and so that's the one thing is, guys, if if you're in this to win it, every one of you can be a lot more profitable than you currently are if you have the right tools and the know-how. And there are people out here that are willing to help you, and you know, it's it's all for the greater good. Like I said, I I believe this will be my last industry I'm in because I love you know, and I'm not full of sales. I if if you've been around. Me or heard me talk or been in your office, you'll you you know this saying I'm about to tell you. I'm not gonna sell you one thing. I want to come to the Christmas party. In order for me to come to the Christmas party, I can't be selling you smoke and mirrors, right? So we truly are in we truly invest into businesses. We we truly do to to a fault. So uh hopefully that wasn't too long of a message, Natalie. But we are passionate. We are very passionate in helping people grow their businesses.

SPEAKER_03 45:22

No, I think you said it perfectly because again, I think so many people, when they hear the word sales rep or sales manager, they just think that, you know, those individuals are just out there to sell. But quite frankly, those it the individuals that I have met, especially, you know, with the grid game and others, they know so much about this industry. And I have learned so much from them that I didn't know before. I mean, right? That how how much time you spent in the industry, how much time Johnny spent in the industry. I mean, there's just so many people that are out there, you know, in sales that did so many things on different parts of this industry before. And so it just until I got into this part of the industry, I didn't realize it. But now that I've I've started to understand it more, I'm like, oh wow, you know, that's absolutely right. There's so many years in this.

SPEAKER_07 46:11

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:12

And it's just the passion. It's and it it's that's why I've stayed for so long. I mean, I actually I don't think I've been in any other industry. I I did real estate for a little while, but every time I've gotten out, I've gotten you know sucked right back in. So I'm kind of here to stay.

SPEAKER_08 46:25

And I will tell you, there's not one time that I've I've spent time with a company that I didn't learn one or multiple things that I've shared with other companies from that forward. That's the thing, is I feel pretty blessed that I am in the position I am in because I get to go around and see where there's good models, there's okay, that we make better, and then there's poor that we really get up to speed. And I learned something from all of them. Because even some that aren't doing so well, they've got some cool tips and tricks. They just didn't have the right products to get them there. So, and one last thing. Guys, if uh if a rep comes in to see you or calls you, give them five minutes. Give them five minutes because we know you you've got more important things to do than see another sales rep. But you may learn one thing that may say that may solve a pain point that you're currently sitting in that chair wondering how you're gonna get through. And I'm telling you, you can lead out by that visit by saying, I got five minutes. Tell them what your problem is, see what they have. Or they know someone. Because even if I don't have the product for you, I know who to call that probably does.

SPEAKER_04 47:34

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_08 47:36

But you gotta give us a minute. There's people a fight to get into. I gotta beg, borrow, and steal and sneak through the back door. Yeah. It shouldn't have to be that way. I get you guys are busy, but really, there is no good time to book an appointment with you guys. So give us a minute.

SPEAKER_03 47:51

I love it. I love that. Yeah, the it's the if we don't have it, it's the miracle on 34th Street. Right. We'll help you find it. Right. Well, thank you, Eric. It's been, I really appreciate you you coming on and really educating me. I've I know I've learned something. I always love learning um every single time I I meet with someone. And, you know, as we wrap up today's episode, I hope there's a few things that have come clear. Um, but you know, great pool service, it's not about just using more chemicals or memorizing a list of water chemistry numbers. We don't want to do that. You know, it's really about understanding the entire pool system and, you know, making informed decisions. So, you know, again, a huge thank you to Eric for coming on and joining us. And, you know, again, sharing your experience and your practical insights and for helping to separate the fact from the fiction and really for everything that you do to educate and support professionals throughout the this industry. And again, guys, until next time, I'm Natalie Hood, and this has been another Myth Busting Wednesday. If you have any questions or wish to reach out to Eric, he can be reached at ewall at gritgame.com. And actually, if they wanted to uh touch base with you via phone, what would the best number be?

SPEAKER_08 48:58

Um Well, I'm gonna make one correction. It's ewall at thegritgame.com.

SPEAKER_03 49:04

Sorry, ew all at the gritgame.

SPEAKER_08 49:06

Yeah, you can hit me on my cell. I mean very transparent with that. Uh three zero nine five one two two four.

SPEAKER_03 49:13

You heard it from your guys. All right. Thank you guys for listening. Until next time. Have a good season.