Ever wondered what it’s like to race on the adrenaline-infused circuits of professional cycling? Join the ride as we roll into an engaging conversation with Skyler, a prodigious former pro-cyclist, who takes us on a tour de force from rugged mountain trails in Oklahoma to the UCI cross-racing championships in Europe.
Fasten your helmets as Skyler navigates us through his early encounters with mountain biking and road racing, the tough love that shaped his career, and the experiences he gained from the rigors of UCI circuit racing. These tales of his grueling transits and fierce competitions will surely get your blood pumping. All the while, we also explore the unique European racing styles, and how Skyler managed to keep pace with the best. Ever wondered how the pandemic affected athletes? Skyler opens up about the impact of COVID-19 on his career and his shift in focus towards coaching.
Finally, we cool down by discussing Skyler's newfound love for just riding. He shares how it serves as a stress-free activity where he can share quality time with his dad, capturing moments and helping others instead of constantly chasing results. We conclude our journey with a dash of tech talk as Skyler recounts his foray into 3D printing - from initial hiccups to running a successful Etsy shop. So, saddle up and join us on this thrilling journey from the racing circuits to podcasting studios, and even a 3D printing workshop. It's a ride you won't want to miss!
Ever wondered what it’s like to race on the adrenaline-infused circuits of professional cycling? Join the ride as we roll into an engaging conversation with Skyler, a prodigious former pro-cyclist, who takes us on a tour de force from rugged mountain trails in Oklahoma to the UCI cross-racing championships in Europe.
Fasten your helmets as Skyler navigates us through his early encounters with mountain biking and road racing, the tough love that shaped his career, and the experiences he gained from the rigors of UCI circuit racing. These tales of his grueling transits and fierce competitions will surely get your blood pumping. All the while, we also explore the unique European racing styles, and how Skyler managed to keep pace with the best. Ever wondered how the pandemic affected athletes? Skyler opens up about the impact of COVID-19 on his career and his shift in focus towards coaching.
Finally, we cool down by discussing Skyler's newfound love for just riding. He shares how it serves as a stress-free activity where he can share quality time with his dad, capturing moments and helping others instead of constantly chasing results. We conclude our journey with a dash of tech talk as Skyler recounts his foray into 3D printing - from initial hiccups to running a successful Etsy shop. So, saddle up and join us on this thrilling journey from the racing circuits to podcasting studios, and even a 3D printing workshop. It's a ride you won't want to miss!
What is up cycling Oklahoma? Thank you so much for tuning in for another episode On this one. It's a good one and we have reached out and gotten a Tulsa folks on here, so hopefully we will have more Tulsa folks on here and people from around the state. It's been a little bit of a challenge coordinating everything and getting things set up, but we have been able to make that one happen and we use some new software. So hopefully we have a YouTube channel where you can listen to the podcast or watch the podcast there with some video. Hopefully we have some good video content coming in the future. I don't know exactly when that's going to be or what it's going to be, but I have some ideas. So we will just be coordinating and trying to make that happen so you can head over to the YouTube channel and subscribe there and watch this interview. Hopefully all interviews in the future will be there and we're trying to try to up our game and make this thing fancy. So I appreciate you listening and tuning in this one is really good.
Speaker 1:I did not know Skyler before this. I had known his name, I remember him from whenever he was racing full time and but I didn't. I never had conversation with him, never met him, so I just knew him from how amazing and fast he was. So I hope you enjoy this. It was a brand new conversation for me, a whole bunch of new information and actually we could have gone for probably another two hours. He had so many stories that we did not get to share about racing in Europe and hopefully we can do a round two in the future because he has some exciting, exciting things in the works and I think it will benefit a lot of people in Oklahoma with the things that he has going. So hopefully you'll stay tuned for round two with Skyler and we'll hopefully do that in the spring, early summer, whenever he gets things launched, and then we can hear more of those Europe racing stories.
Speaker 1:So I appreciate you tuning in. Please subscribe. I've had some great ideas coming in for people we can get on the podcast, so I've reached out to a few of them and those are in the works. So I promise we are trying to keep this thing exciting and fresh and expand to all of Oklahoma and we're working on those things. So if you have ideas and you have suggestions and can help, please let me know how we can do that. This podcast is super fun to do and hopefully it'll continue to grow.
Speaker 1:We can share the stories of all the amazing athletes in Oklahoma, and this podcast is totally made possible by everyone that listens and subscribes, but also by more overhead door. They have stepped up, they have sponsored a few episodes and without their help this one would not have been able to come to fruition because we were able to use some new software that their contributions helped pay for. So, like I said, the money goes right back into the podcast, right back into our community, and more overhead door has stepped up and helped out. So, please, if you have any garage door issues looking at a new garage door, building a new house, just anything that has to do with a garage door situation reach out to them. They are supporting us. Let's support them. It's more as in like the city, more more overhead door. Their phone number is 405-799-9214 405-799-9214.
Speaker 1:Great dudes, cyclists. They are in our community, so let's take care of each other, let's support them, reach out and you can find them on all the socials. But if you have anything that needs to be done, they can help you and I just can't say thank you to them enough for what they've been able to help us do and hopefully we'll have some future, some future sponsorships to continue to grow this and to continue expand the offerings that we have. So we have a lot of cool races going on in Oklahoma right now. There is a ton of stuff. Mountain bike season has kicked off, gravel season is in full swing. There's there's still some crit races, there's some t-shirt rides going on. So please go out and support your local events, support the local cycling community, and it's perfect weather. So go ride your bike, and it doesn't matter if it's 10 miles around a lake, down a bike path in your neighborhood with your kids or on a big adventure. Just get outside, ride your bike, make it happen. So thank you for tuning in. Hope you enjoyed this episode and hopefully we will have some really cool stuff coming to you in the future.
Speaker 1:All right, skyler, like I said, first time using the software, so I'm really hoping that whenever we get done and I hit end recording, it's still there. That's my biggest fear. So it's like I practiced last night. Last night I went out with my girlfriend and I was like, oh, we have to check this, and then we forgot to do that and then she was driving home last night. It's like crap. I got to send you a link and it was like at midnight. I'm like you got to get back on here at mid, like when you get home, so we can practice this. So I practiced like last night seriously like 1230.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's great. Hopefully everything goes well.
Speaker 1:So I'm sure it'll be fine, skyler, you were one of. I've had several recommended. You're actually my first Tulsa person, which I'm sad to say that because I've been wanting to have more and more Tulsa folks on here, because I want to. We just don't. I, the paths don't cross super easy, right, and that's the point for having the software. So now I can do that, because I was trying to schedule times come up there and it just wasn't working. So, yeah, yeah. So thank you for breaking the seal here.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. There's many other names better than me that should have done it.
Speaker 1:I have several lined up and I'm excited to talk to all of them. It seems like Tulsa has a lot of super fast people.
Speaker 2:Yes, it definitely does. A lot of them were well. When I was a junior to like just growing up a lot.
Speaker 1:I got to see them all, and what was taught by a lot of them too, so it's why, like before we get into you and we're all talking about why do you think there's so many fast people in Tulsa? Multiple disciplines too.
Speaker 2:That's a very, very good question that I don't even know if I can answer really. I mean, I know it's been Tulsa. Racing has been pretty strong since, like the mid 80s. I mean there's been guys racing here for forever, like I've always. Once I got into the scene like it was just common knowledge that oh yeah, they're in junior athletes and you know they're going to national championships and all of that, like since you know the mid 80s and it's been just a normal thing and that's like a little wild.
Speaker 1:Is there like junior programs that are there Like because now you have the bike club that's kind of becoming a big thing in the school systems and stuff and what's the junior team that you have?
Speaker 2:There's the flyers Yep Tanner Colbert runs that. Those are probably the current ones.
Speaker 1:Okay, definitely Was there anything that like when you were growing up. That was like getting kids into it, because it feels like around here there's a lot of kids that do well, not a lot. There's some kids that do BMX, but there's really not many kids around here that do anything, unless their parents get them into it like their parent rides?
Speaker 2:Not really. When I was coming up as a junior, I think, like 16 years ago, I'm, from least my memory there wasn't really any junior programs. There were a lot of club teams that really supported junior athletes and supported people getting into the sport from there and that's where really I grew. Soundpony was huge into that, especially in my early years of really supporting me, yeah, helped me out wherever I could. I mean, I owe a lot to my beginning time of my cycling adventure to them, yeah to Soundpony.
Speaker 2:And to the couple guys that run it. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So let's jump off there. How, how well, first I'll tell people who you are, how old you are, the basic like dating app stuff, and then let's talk about how Soundpony got you right or how you got riding.
Speaker 2:Cool, I'm Scott Mackey, I'm 27. I've been riding since I was 13. I actually got into the sport because of my father, my dad. He mountain biked when he was a kid Nothing like serious racing. But he grew up in Taco, oklahoma, where a bunch of other you know strong cyclists kind of grew up from, and so they rode together a little bit and then later in life, you know, he had me and all of that and I was actually golfing at the time and it was just hating it and he's like you know what I'm going to take you and do something that I used to do. I'm going to take you mountain biking. So a friend up the street, his dad was selling some cone and mountain bike for like 200 bucks and I mean it was a heavy piece but it worked for me. I didn't care. I mean I was like I'll cool mountain bike, let's go ride.
Speaker 1:You don't know any different, yeah.
Speaker 2:Exactly. And so as soon as I started doing that, we were going riding, you know, two, three times a week I fell in love. And it's the phone love going to Turkey Mountain. I wanted to go all the time. And so we did that for about a year until I can't remember who told us someone's like you need to come, come do a race, you need to come race. And so we went out and I believe it was the tour to dirt series and I believe my first race was Thunderbird, I think, okay, I think that was my first race ever.
Speaker 2:I raced the junior race, cat twos against one other junior and I loved it, fell in love instantly. I was like I want to race, I want to do this now. And so we did this kind of double time thing of riding, racing and golf for about you know six months Until my mom one day was like why aren't you guys riding? Like what are you doing here? Like why at the house, why aren't you riding? And my dad's like get dressed, we're going. It was like that was the thing that clicked. It was like nope, she's, she's loud enough to be like we're able to go for four hours.
Speaker 1:Easy Dad was pumped because he was finally able to get back into riding.
Speaker 2:Exactly, Exactly so. I raced mountain biking really heavily for about three years and after my first year went along with end up joining a nine and eight XC. It was a used to be a shop here. Ray Hall was one of the heads of that. Learned a lot from Ray my early days too.
Speaker 2:Ray's a great guy Really helped me out in my father and so I did, you know, the whole tour de dirt series the next year. Believe it as a cat one. And that was just. That was big, because I did my junior year and I did a couple cat two races as well. And how that worked back then was like the points worked as both like my junior points. I was winning, so Ted and guy was getting winner points for upgrades and it's like, well, I'm not technically racing anyone, but I was fast enough. I was still passing people that were racing the cat two race because we'd get sent off kind of mid mid group. So cat it up, do it to the cat ones that next year. And I mean it was a. It was a big step but it went well.
Speaker 1:So you were like 17 in high school racing cat one. I think that was maybe 15.
Speaker 2:Geez 15, maybe 16. I think it was 15.
Speaker 1:Like doing cat one. Yep Progressed really quick. I did yeah.
Speaker 2:If I remember right, the kind of blurs together at this point.
Speaker 1:I think I was 15 when I did that Wow Race that year you went from no bike at 13 to a cat one, like a solid cat one at 15.
Speaker 2:I mean I was, I was able to finish and I was getting. I was getting up there kind of in the top five if I could. And then that following year I did cat one fully. We did a little bit of traveling, went to like the wash dog challenge as well. At this point I was with Soundpony. They really helped me out because they were like well, we want to help you. You're a junior and my dad knew a lot of the guys at T-Town Bike Shop.
Speaker 1:So back to racing too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he was, he was racing, he's been racing this entire time with me, okay, yeah. So he got back in the train racing with me. It was pumped, oh yeah. And so we were going to T-Town all the time and so they were kind of helping me out to like, come on, just join Soundpony and be fine Now you're not with 918 anymore. And I was like, okay, sure, and they helped me out a lot. I mean, I was a junior, I was one of the only ones in Tulsa, so they were helping me out and it went really well that season. I mean couple top fives, I think Kekapodium or two. So it was, it was good.
Speaker 2:What really changed my trajectory, though, that third year, was we went into the shop and Brian Duvall looked at me and he's like you need to come watch Tulsa Tough this weekend, because I had no idea what that was, neither than my dad, like we kind of. Like my dad kind of knew what it was, you know, because he's grown up here. I had no idea. I don't know what road racing, what's that? No, no, no, I'm never aware. Spandex was like the mentality for years, and so it was like, okay, sure, I'll go out. You really want like I'll come out and watch. That light bulb clicked big time. We went out every night Friday, saturday, sunday, and it was Sunday Sunday, did it? Did it with me?
Speaker 1:At Crybaby.
Speaker 2:Yes, seeing that, I was like I have to do this. And it was that, combined with one of the Tea Town guys like placed high and got money, Got more money than I had won throughout the entire mountain bike series and I was like, oh my gosh, you get, there's this and money. Like I want to do road racing, I got to do this, this is awesome and so I told, I told to mention that to Duval.
Speaker 2:And then I think about a week, maybe two weeks later, my dad gets a phone call of hey, skyler's bike's here, ready to go. And it's like, okay, sure, so they had like an old Cervelo R3, which is still riding around Tulsa. There are still junior athletes on that bike, that's awesome. That's my favorite thing.
Speaker 1:I still see it so it just keeps paying it forward.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Well, I ended up I sold it to when I was done. When I grew out of it, I sold to Ben Watkins, who ended up selling it to Tanner, and Tanner's just been cycling it through. That's all the junior athletes he has. It's been really fun to see it around.
Speaker 2:So they got me my first bike and that was it. Like I was like I got the road, I'm loving this. And I think a week later my dad got a call like hey, your road bike's here. He didn't order one. And they're just like why didn't order one? And well, they're like well, your son's not going to go train alone. So we got you a bike. So I think they I think they worked at a dealer gave him a good deal on it.
Speaker 1:Dad was rolling on those coattails.
Speaker 2:Probably probably a new old. Oh, he absolutely was. And he'll listen to this and be like, yeah, I definitely was.
Speaker 1:Smart man yeah.
Speaker 2:But it was, I probably was a new, old stock or something. But so we got in the road racing and I went and did like wouldn't start doing some crit racing. I think I had like I think there was two races left, like a crit race and a road race that season which I did the juniors, where I think both those races I was like the only junior, so it didn't really show anything, but I was like this is cool, like I want to do, like this awesome. And as a junior, even though racing by myself I was still making money, I was like 60, 70 bucks, but to a 15 year old kid I was like absolutely Never won that much money in your life as you did when you won 60 bucks as a junior.
Speaker 2:I think I got 60 bucks for like my overall place in the tour de dirt after like eight races.
Speaker 1:You've never been that rich. Yeah, I was like this is great.
Speaker 2:So we ended up doing the mountain bike season that year, still race cat one another pretty solid year. And then that that next year goes 16. I was like I was 15. Still I remember I was 15 because I was a where my birthday fell. I always fell a little behind in age on the how they do like the USAC age. I was like a year ahead, like I was always. I was always lagging behind on that.
Speaker 2:So that next year I did full, like full road season. The time Tulsa, oklahoma City, arkansas had a ton of road races and crits like Sky2 kind of big road race. San Spring still had a crit. There was a couple down in OKC Like Edmund had something like there was a ton of racing. So I was all about road and I was taken under the wing by Jake Lassley and Brian Duvall. They kind of took me and then we're like you're going to come ride with us, you're going to come training with us and so for a solid year like it was just traveling and racing kind of on the regional level and really enjoying it, doing well, racing against guys like another junior athlete, sawyer Curry he doesn't really race much anymore but he's who I was growing up with and racing with. So you know whatever happened to Sawyer. I believe he just moved on from the sport.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's what I think. Yeah, I think he just kind of got married.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's honestly, that's such a normal thing, for sure. It's just kind of not not necessarily a burn out, but just like going. You know, I, I need to, especially as a junior.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean, we see it as like at this age people get into in the early 20s and then, by like 30, they're kids get to an age they're like, yeah, I'm done Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think it's just one of those things like, from what I've seen, sawyer still doing really well, good, just still riding, but, like you know, not racing anymore, which, yeah, I used to ride and race with dad, yeah, which I mean I don't blame him. Racing takes up a lot of time and it's a lot of training, yeah, but Sawyer and I are racing against each other Jay Myers, another junior, one of his teammates like we were racing all racing together, traveling regionally, kind of always seeing each other at the same races. And then while I was doing that with the racing on the non race weekends, I was still every Saturday, sunday, up at four or five AM going with Jake Glassley, duvall and the other shop guys because they're like, well, you're training with us. My dad was coming along to all of this. Like my dad just was huge in my like.
Speaker 1:So was your dad getting fast. Oh yeah, he was racing around.
Speaker 2:Like we were the same cat for up until cat threes, like we were racing cat threes. They mean up to cat three. How?
Speaker 1:was it when you finally started dropping down all the time?
Speaker 2:I was doing that on the mountain bike, like I was doing that before the road, but it was, it was fun. Like he enjoyed it and I enjoyed it, like it was such a unique experience getting to just travel and race with my dad, like that was super cool and I've come to like to me.
Speaker 2:I took it for granted back then and you know, I think now, looking back, seeing you know all these other junior athletes or like young adults, they're just like oh yeah, like your dad rides with you, and I'm like, yeah, like that's just to me, it was normal.
Speaker 1:Right and that was.
Speaker 2:that was definitely a really cool thing to have and just traveling with me everywhere and learning along with me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So sorry to derail you, but at this point, whenever you're like seeing success, are you what? What category are you on the road at this point?
Speaker 2:Are you still?
Speaker 1:racing juniors or are you now? Are you up into like the I was doing juniors?
Speaker 2:and cat force.
Speaker 2:So, usually what I would do is I do a double day, okay, so I'd go I'd race the juniors that morning and then I'd race the cat for that afternoon, and so I was doing that for about it. Yeah, for that whole year, that whole season I think I did. I did like one cat five race, okay, and what, combined with the cat five race, we also at that time had the Tucson night crit series, which it's not at the like big oval that it is now, where it's just put power down. It was at an old police academy training course, so it was not the best roads and very, very tight corners. So I learned how to corner very quickly and it was cornering at speed.
Speaker 1:Did you feel like your mountain bike background helped in that 100%?
Speaker 2:big time, like the green handling from mountain biking over made it such a breeze.
Speaker 1:Well, that was one of the things I was going to ask you. Like being so young and progressing so quickly in the mountain bike, it's like impressive and like surprising, because for you to get the skill like getting the lungs is one thing, but getting the skills to go that fast on a mountain bike at such a young age and so quickly, is that's what. Like grab my attention and be like well, how the heck did that happen?
Speaker 2:Well, I did forget someone. So I my early year, my early like my first year, year and a half. There was a guy named Wes Gray. He no longer raises anymore, hasn't for years, I haven't seen him in years, but that like first year and a half, he met my dad at Turkey one day and was just like ah, come on, just come with me, let's come, let's go ride. And he was such a great technical rider and we all we, we just learned by following his lines and that's, and he would travel. That first year of Porter Dirt he traveled with us like we traveled with him and that's what we were doing. So I was learning and doing pre rides and rides in the week with with my dad and with him, just following lines and you just naturally like picked that skill up really quickly, like it.
Speaker 1:Just you just found your calling.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was just. It became pretty second nature.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because that's the, that's the hard part for everyone.
Speaker 2:Yes, it definitely is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. And so whenever you were on, when you came to the road, did you feel like now you're racing in a group at speed? Did you have any fear there or have any problems with that? Or, like when you're first getting into like those cat four races and being a junior being, I'm assuming, a little guy, and that was some big grown men Like was that intimidating at all or is it just like, man, this is what it is. Let's just go to the front and go.
Speaker 2:I think maybe like my first couple races, probably I didn't have as much fear because I was doing I was already doing group rides with you know, jay, all the other sound funny guys at this time and Jake and Duvall taught in a very particular way of. I think there was one ride I did to where I was. I was squirrely, I was still new to the road so I was pretty squirrely in the group. To fix this I can't remember which one it was was jaker. Brian stuck me next to the edge on the like River Park Greenway Trail, so it's me like here's me, here's grass, here's him, and he got within like four inches of me. He's like, don't crash. And we rode like eight miles like oh my God.
Speaker 2:And it fixed it, though I was really squirrely after that, because then I was like all right, I can just kind of ride here. That's tough love, there it was, but it was like true.
Speaker 1:That's like true roady fashion and style, like in every way. It's like either do it or get out of here.
Speaker 2:Pretty much I think another way. Like I was half willing at one point, like still with my like I was just notorious for it, so I got whacked on the helmet a couple times. That fixed that. But it's just like that's how they learned, that's how they were taught, and like that's hilarious, that's how, that's how it was. Like I don't think you'll see that nowadays, but like for me, I was like that's what worked for me and it was great.
Speaker 2:I learned a lot from them. A lot of pace line techniques like, and that carried over when I started doing like crit racing and all that and getting better at that.
Speaker 1:It just became so how fast did you move up the ranks in on the roadside and the crit side About?
Speaker 2:about a category here.
Speaker 2:Okay, so usually and I made sure it was a rule that my dad and Jake, who was, I believe this point was starting to actually coach me Okay, this point was a rule that we all three had of I need to be winning and before I can move up, so it doesn't matter if I hit the like the minimum points, because at the time you had a calendar year, like now I think it was a big roll over period, but at the time it was, you had one year, started from January 1st and went to the very end of December, and so you get upgrade points and you hit a minimum cap and then I think it was like another 12 on top was your mandatory and I it was always that you have to hit the mandatory.
Speaker 2:That was just kind of the mentality of it. I was like, no, even though I hit the points, I haven't really won, or I've only won one race and it wasn't like a big one, so I'm not ready. I'm not ready, like I wanted to make sure for the junior development side, like they wanted to make sure that I was ready to make that new so smart.
Speaker 1:I mean it's the way. It's like the. It's a hard way to do it because you're you're wanting, because everybody just wants to go up, just because, right, but I don't feel like it. I mean I don't ever do the, I don't do the road stuff, but I see it and I watch it and I'm like sometimes, especially once you get from my opinion, I'm looking at it from the outside Once you get past Kat 3, it becomes like a job Like yeah, ever, like Kat 5 is what it is.
Speaker 1:Kat 4 is like weekend warriors, like they're fast but they they just probably don't have the time to spend on the bike. The Kat 3, these guys are like they're fast, they're putting in effort, they're putting in work, but you can still have like chill life off the bike. Yeah, man, you go to twos like the races get really long, they get really hard, they do, and you may never see the front half of the group ever again. And so, yeah, if you're going to move up like that's a, I feel like the four to three, usually those guys like the top guys in the fours, are probably going to slide in and be the front half of the threes. Like it doesn't seem as vicious, but man, going from a three to a two is like that's a whole another step.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so, like I mean nowadays, with, with this rollover, it's like you can, you know, get one or two top fives or a couple of top tens if it's a big race? And like you do that again the next year. And it's like, oh, now I have the mandatory or now I have the minimum points. It's like, yeah, but you only did that like twice. Like that's not, that's not getting better, it's not getting Well, there's no reason to move up at that point.
Speaker 1:I don't. I don't think I mean I understand the. I want to say I'm a three or I'm a four. I want to say I'm a three or I want to say that I'm a two. I get that part of it but like, when I look at it, I'm like racing is supposed to be fun and if I'm going out there or like getting crushed in the back, that's not fun.
Speaker 2:It's not fun to travel for multiple hours to race for 10 minutes. It's not a good time.
Speaker 1:For real, yeah. So what did you see as you were going up through the ranks and you were getting to? When you got to like a two? What? How old are you? You're still on like.
Speaker 2:I was still high school, I was 17, going to turn 18. That year, man, when I was a, when I was a two, and that year is when I actually got put in contact with a team called think finance. They're now elevate down in Texas and so Bill Marshall, he's a guy up in Kansas City runs a ran KCCX, a big stock across team. I came just kind of know him at racing because we see him traveling, going to like nationals and so like somehow or another like we ended up connected and he got me in contact with them and so I got on I think finances to so were you doing cross at this point also?
Speaker 2:That was going to be my oh cross was the year prior, so there was. There is overlap. I think that year was my first like UCI year. That was my first. I believe my first UCI year or second UCI year. I really should have looked this up for that I could have.
Speaker 1:It's all right. You were about 17 when you did your first UCI stuff.
Speaker 2:I think I was 16. Yeah, 16. I'm going to turn 17. Yes, I was 16. So that year that was a cat three was my first year doing cross, okay, and that was that. But that was at the UCI levels. That year prior I also I did dabble in regional, local stuff and I mean the crossing then was huge. Yeah, it's definitely doing a lot, it's growing back, but then it was huge. I was racing every weekend and I was, I was doing everything.
Speaker 1:I would think that cross would have been like the perfect matchup for your skill set.
Speaker 2:Yes, and that is what it eventually became. I started there, did the regional stuff, did some mountain biking that year. I think that was my last little mountain bike year. Okay, After that I did not. I didn't race mountain bikes anymore. Yeah, I think I only did about three, three and a half years of mountain biking. I kind of like dabbled that last year of it. But cross was taken over. It was my first year doing road and I was like, oh, this, that cross looks cool, Like this is this is something new.
Speaker 1:Cross is so fun and so miserable, oh it is the last one, you're done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've always. I've always. I love cycle cross and it is only fun before and after. During. It's the worst thing ever and you don't know why you're doing it.
Speaker 1:I feel like everyone says the same thing.
Speaker 2:And so that that following years when I did, I went and did the UCI circuit as a junior.
Speaker 1:So they were like really traveling yes.
Speaker 2:At that point I was cross was going to be let's give this a go, like you seemed, in doing the regional stuff, like did really well, like I was instantly racing in the. I was racing the one, twos within like a few races that year prior. So I was like, all right, let's travel, let's give it a go, let's go do this UCI junior circuit, because Jake, lastly, was going and so I traveled with Jake and the other sound phony guys that did cross and that was very eye opening experience. I definitely did. I did okay, but for like a first year traveling like I mean I'd never traveled really 15 hours to go race it breaks a bike before, like that. Yeah, and the the farthest I went was Wisconsin the year prior to go to road nationals and that was a big trip, but like we were doing that on a week, on a weekly basis, so like a bi-weekly basis, because there was a it was the last year of like a junior UCI circuit, so there was five races within. It was like, well, you got to go, we got to do this, go to all of them, see what you can rank overall, get UCI points and that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2:And that I fell in love, instantly fell in love of, like I want to do cross crossing. Crits is what I want to do, cause I love crit racing. Hated road racing. I still do this day. I hate road races and at this point in my life I probably will never do road racing. Why do you hate road races? So that's just so boring, like if you miss the move, that's it, your race is done and you're just gonna sit and it's like, oh, I got to sit here for another 60 miles.
Speaker 1:And it's just like it's just.
Speaker 2:It's boring. I like Chris. It's hour, hour and a half at the highest level and it's fast paced. It's constant attacks and then you're done.
Speaker 1:And if you're done, you're just done early, just pull off and you can hang out Exactly.
Speaker 2:You're done and there's like all right, cool, I'm done for the day. Yeah, rest up for tomorrow and cross kind of like. Met that goal. It's an. It was an hour four to five minutes for the juniors, but then like an hour long for the cat one guys.
Speaker 1:And were you having success at the UCI races early on?
Speaker 2:As a junior I was doing, I was doing decent A couple of top 10s, I think, one top I didn't break the top five, I got like six, six or seven. But I traveled all the big races because that that's what that attached to that little circuit. And so I got to meet a lot of cool people, make a lot of connections, and that's really where I actually started connecting with with Bill Marshall was traveling because well, he's, he runs a cross team. And then Matt Aitkeny, who is a Tulsa guy, who I also rode and trained with like road for KCCX and was like best friends with Bill. So like I was always, it was always like someone knew someone and that's how I got the connection Small world.
Speaker 2:And then I, yeah, and then I I became friends with so and so and went on that way and then I saw what Bill did with the team and I was like, oh, this is really cool, Like I want to get on like a true cross team eventually and so we did that. That was my last year as a junior and then that following year for cross was my first like true UCI season where I was an under 23, but I there weren't really any under 23 races in the States. There's only like two that had like separate categories specifically for us and everything else it's your looped in with the cat one elite guys. So I was racing pro races then at that point.
Speaker 1:That's a big difference. Yeah, I mean like the top, you 23 guys, and then like the P1 elite.
Speaker 2:Yes, and a lot of the top. You two, three guys were also the P1 elite, like it meshed really well together at that front. But that was. It was like oh, I'm no longer racing against like 15 people, I'm racing against, you know, 40 to 50 side cross guys and we're all most of them fast. Yeah, we're all fast, and so it was. It was a good year. That year I also uh, that was going to be my second trip to Europe. I did a trip to Europe the year prior as a junior for the road, okay.
Speaker 1:Um, and you went over and did road races and Yep, okay, how old were you when you did that?
Speaker 2:I was 16. No 17. I was 17 doing that.
Speaker 1:Saw your win over.
Speaker 2:Did you go with him? Yeah, saw me, saw your and Jay all went on the same trip together.
Speaker 1:I remember that because I think that would have been. It was at about the 2010 timeframe, 2012 timeframe, somewhere in that area.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's somewhere like 2011, 2012. I think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Cause, I cause I worked at Schlagels and I remember and I used to like I said, I used to do multi-sport with his dad and I remember when all of that happened and everybody was going and that was like such a cool, big deal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was, that was huge, like that. That racing season, uh, that last year is like a real one. Last year was like a road junior was a lot of that was. I did do some decent travel with Sawyer I mean him and I for I think we pretty much lived together for two and a half months that year.
Speaker 1:Man. So where did you guys go? In Europe, 16 year olds.
Speaker 2:Uh, so we went and Belgium was our home base. We went to a. There was a camp, um ran by the chainstay cycles, um, greg Germer is the owner of that. He hosted a junior camp. He take, uh, he'd bring junior guys over and they'd stay at hit. He owned a pretty big house that sat or house like 15, 16 people at a time, and so he would just host camps over there.
Speaker 1:So you, would and you were doing road racing.
Speaker 2:Not at that point, no, that was. That was for, yeah, road racing, so it's permiss racing. So it's like a mix, it's like circuit racing pretty much. It's essentially a crit race, but for three hours. Okay, two and a half hours, like it's nice.
Speaker 1:It's when you okay, let's talk about this for a sec before we go to your other Europe trips or other Europe conversations. As a 16 year old showing up in Europe completely different style of racing, I mean, cause it's long crits, essentially, what was the first? Like taste, like kick in the teeth of, like holy crap, we are not racing in Tulsa anymore. Um, I'm on the start line.
Speaker 2:I got a. I went, I lined up front row and the official walks by and boop and takes a big ol puff of a cigarette and blows it right in my face and I was just like, ah, cause I read. I read some books before I went and it was like they hate Americans but it wasn't like a hate, like a hatred, like like a true hate.
Speaker 2:It was more of just like you're not good enough to be over here, kind of attitude. Gotcha that right there. I was like ah, cool, ah, that's. Uh, this is a little different to a 16 year old kid. Yeah, that was, that was different. Uh, and the betting board. The betting board really threw me for a loop.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so they take like betting on the oh yeah, oh yeah, full betting All of that's hilarious.
Speaker 2:Um, so you'll go you every single rate, like local Kermis race, if it was hosted at a bar. You go into the bar I mean, you're, you're of age, you go into the bar and you get your number. I would pay 10 euro to get my number and your numbers and I have odds of winning. And so there's a whole betting board. This is amazing. Yeah, the local kids, like they were, like they were the ones we were looking to bet on. Never really any of the Americans, because we're just we're not either doing well or just not known. Um, but yeah, so we go pay 10 euro for the number and go pin up and that's it. You're ready to go. How often were you racing? Um, so as a junior, you're limited to three a week.
Speaker 1:Um, a lot of racing.
Speaker 2:So I was racing three times a week.
Speaker 1:Um and you. Each race is like three hours long.
Speaker 2:Uh, it varied. Some of them. I think the longest one I did was like three. I think it hit like three hours.
Speaker 1:That's rough as a 16 year old to try to be in overseas and trying to get used to a new culture and food and all the things, plus racing three times a week like hard races. That's a rough schedule.
Speaker 2:I mean, I know, I think I barely, I think I finished maybe three of them over there. I at least in the, I finished, I think one in the front group and that was it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it wasn't just so hard.
Speaker 2:It was so hard, it's just, it was the style of racing too. So, like in the States, like you know we're going to create, cornering is a huge part. You want to take all the speed into the corner so you don't really have to pedal hard, going out. Completely opposite experience of they they break as hard as they can and then take the corner slow and then ramp all the way back up to max speed and that's that's it. Over and over and over again.
Speaker 1:Just sprint you to death.
Speaker 2:Pretty much. And then, why do they? Why is that? No idea? I for a while I used to be like, oh, they just can't corner. I think it's more just so you can blow the field apart, like that. So like if you're in the front group you can just that's easy. If you can do that for an hour, well then you're going to be in the lead group and there's only going to be a group of 15 of you.
Speaker 1:Could you ever get in the front and roll corners and get gaps, or would they just always catch back on?
Speaker 2:So we would Uh, I think that you're like we like one or two races we actually were able to, we actually worked together well and we did that a couple of times, but like they were, so they were so far yeah. They, they, they catch us and we would gap them in the corners, or they just catch you on the straightaway and this is like okay. And then attack you and you're like well, I got nothing, I don't have anything to this.
Speaker 1:That was it. That's all I got. Man. What a cool experience.
Speaker 2:So yeah, that was, that was a great experience my first year there was. That was awesome.
Speaker 1:So you went, did you? You got to go back the next year.
Speaker 2:Yep that next year I went for. I went for cycle cross. I think it was was that it was either that blends together, as either that fall or that following fall is when I went um, I went back and I stayed the entire month of December and I went by myself, okay, and then I got to do a cup over there as an under 23. So I was able to do the Zolder World Cup, which was huge. It was like cool.
Speaker 1:And I was like well.
Speaker 2:I was like well, I'm going to be there For the price of going to two UCI races here I can go race for the entire month in Europe. It's a no-brainer. It was. It was a no-brainer. Soundpony helped out a ton in that too. They paid for a decent chunk. I did crowdfunding for that trip. There are a lot of anonymous people that I still really don't know that donated a decent amount of money.
Speaker 1:It's so cool that the community came together for you like that.
Speaker 2:Definitely I owed a lot to the local community big time. Yeah, super cool, and so I spent a whole month over there and I was racing Saturday, sunday and then sometimes a Wednesday race, and it was all UCI stuff.
Speaker 1:How was the difference in style on cross compared to here? Because clearly you told me what it's like difference on their road and crit racing. Was there a different style that they did, or they just were just good?
Speaker 2:They have gears that I don't think exist. It was just mind-boggling. I was able to do peer U2-3 races over there as well on some of the weekends and I just couldn't keep up. I was a pretty decent rider. I definitely had some mental issues I needed to work past to really progress. But it was like man, I've trained and I'm pretty fit and I can barely keep. I can't keep on and I was getting lapped. My goal my entire time over there was to not get lapped. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:That was a huge goal. I think I only did it once and I was like trip's worth it. That was an achievement.
Speaker 1:Was it because there's just so many kids and people that do it that they just push each other so much and then you just have such a deeper pool, so that the people that rise to the top are just that much better, like we are here with basketball or something like that?
Speaker 2:But I honestly think so. They all rode and trained together. All of them did. I mean, they're all living in Belgium and they're all going to the same little training areas and they're all riding, racing together, and that's all they do is just riding, race of bikes. They don't work another job, they don't do anything else. Usually it's the bike, is the life.
Speaker 1:Wake up, ride and go to sleep and are they homeschooled? Or do they grow up homeschooled there so they can ride so much, or is it just like this is what they do like?
Speaker 2:all the time. It's a different kind of schooling. So I mean, from the few people I was able to talk to, like they're more year round, they're done at like one or two PM, they're done for the day or they don't go as live For since they were tiny kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, was there a? Did they have like a different style and technique on cross like they did on the road, or was it just they just have so much power.
Speaker 2:Power was a huge part, yeah, but they're handling skills better. Hands down, hands down, I mean we there are a bunch of Americans that were very, very good at handling and where we always lost out was just the pure power part of it. Okay, I mean myself included, like I had really good handling and I like they were, they were doing things that I just I couldn't walk around and it's just, that's all they do and it's just the I mean they're racing the big races every year, every weekend.
Speaker 2:It's not like here in the States, where it's like we're racing against the small little pocket of us and that's all we ever see to them. It's, I mean, they're. They've been racing with each other forever.
Speaker 1:Did. When you came back from that trip, did you feel like you were actually better? Like, did you get better just because you were racing such fast people? Or was it tough because you're like man, I just got like lapped every race for a month. This sucks.
Speaker 2:Definitely better in the sense of, like, the knowledge I had for the next year and coming back, I mean I was definitely like I came back and immediately, I think two weeks later, was nationals, so I was coming home, so and I that year was my first two, three year I mean I did okay. I think I placed like 11th, I think, which where I should have been projected wise. It wasn't it, but it was. I had a lot of experience that I gained from being over there that I was able to carry on to that into the next season, which helped out a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and at this point, cross was basically your main, main focus.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I did, I did crits, yeah, big time, and I was, I was still a thing finance. And so for the road season we actually transitioned and combined with another team in Texas and formed Elevate and that was a domestic elite team. So that was really my last big, big year of road where I was going. I was doing stage racing as well, going doing like Joe Martin stage race cascade. It was a lot of traveling. I was on the road a lot doing, a lot of big.
Speaker 1:So were you going to at this point where you're out of high school, right?
Speaker 2:Yes, I graduated and I wasn't doing school. I was doing was working at the local shop.
Speaker 1:Okay, so racing was your thing.
Speaker 2:Racing was my thing and I had that conversation with my parents of like, well, I'm doing really well racing. Can't really go to school and do that, so let's give it a go. Let's just take a break on school for a bit.
Speaker 1:At that point, like try being a legitimate pro career, was like kind of like let's just see what happens, and that's kind of the goal and the focus right now. Or is it like this is fun, I can always go back to school.
Speaker 2:Little of both. I mean, the dream was like oh yeah, like we'll go pro and this is what I want to do, but in reality, like 1%, 2% ever actually make enough to support yourself on purely just racing, Yep. And it was also a you can always go to school. Like this, this is a once in a lifetime chance that you have right now, so you're going to do it. You can always go back to school.
Speaker 1:I feel like that's kind of the conversation that Drummond had with his daughter. Yep Was just like look, if you can go to Europe and travel all over the US and somebody's paying for that.
Speaker 2:Do it Cool, go do it.
Speaker 1:Even if it's like for two years or five years, whatever it is. Then you go back to school, then you figure out 100. Yes, and you're going to know when you're alive.
Speaker 2:It is, and I really I feel like I grew up faster doing that and I gained a lot more perspective on kind of life. And now there's the dogs.
Speaker 1:I saw him coming, he woke up and I was like oh no, here we go. I knew it was coming, all right.
Speaker 2:I gained a lot of perspective and just kind of how things work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so going over Europe as a kid, you would mature real fast.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I had to. I mean, I was able to drink over 16, 17, which, which, going back to that, like my parents had to sign a waiver to allow me to do that. And my dad's like, absolutely, now, don't be stupid. He's like, don't be dumb, but you're, it's an once in a lifetime experience, like man, your parents were cool. Yeah, definitely, very, very supportive, very, very supportive. And so I mean I eventually screwed up and my last, my last night there was we can blame Malibu coconut rum for that.
Speaker 1:Terrible, terrible flight. Wait, wait, you were in Europe and you messed up with Malibu coconut rum.
Speaker 2:Yes, it was our last night there. That's a good story. I already had oh yeah, I'd already had like a bomber beer and I was like 14%, like Belgian bomber beer, and I was like this is great, Jacob White was on that trip and so and a couple of other guys were like let's go back to the night market and it was like, okay, sure, I'm drunk right now because I'm.
Speaker 1:I had a 14% beer at 17 years old and he probably weighed like 115 pounds 120, so pretty close.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I was like sure, why not? So we go, and for some reason we came out with a bottle of Malibu coconut rum and I think I just have that bottle.
Speaker 1:You learned a lot of lessons on that.
Speaker 2:Oh, I learned a ton of lessons. It was not a good night. I get through it like nine times that total time.
Speaker 1:Sawyer, did you fly home the next day?
Speaker 2:Oh, yes, we see home at five in the morning. We had to be up to go to the airport at four am. My biggest memory is Sawyer holding my ankles as I'm, because I was on the second floor. As I'm hanging out the second floor window about three in the morning, puking out the window onto the street Like I was just. I was a terrible and it was terrible turbulence too. Like awful, like it fixed me mean, like I'm never, I'm never doing the world was trying to teach you a valuable lesson, which.
Speaker 2:I said I'm never doing this again and I didn't for many, many years, Like I wasn't, I didn't get plastered like that ever again, Like it definitely was like we're not going to do this. And my dad took one look at me because we he.
Speaker 1:I bet you looked like hell when you got off the plane.
Speaker 2:He picked me up and we went to eat Mexican food and a 17 year old kid who'd just been on international flight not wanting to eat me food. He's just like. So what'd you do? How dumb were you. And I had to tell him he's like I told you, don't be stupid, I paid for it.
Speaker 1:Well, one night of stupidity is that you're ahead of the curve.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:So you said you went to Europe three times. Did you go back the next year, or did you take a little bit of a break and then I?
Speaker 2:took a year. I took a year gap Because that, since I was racing with Elevate that year, we were traveling all around the United States doing it, and I mean doing big, big time UCI stage racing as a domestic elite team doing big, big crits I think NRC is what it was at the time. So like in our national race series, and like road was huge for me. How did OK year I mean I was cat it up that year prior? We had to call on a couple of years. I technically didn't have the points to cat up, but it was on the way home from Jerry Land, which is super weak, I mean has many names now. Like I was up there because it was like well, that's seven plus days of crit racing, I can get points there for upgrades. That was my goal. So I was up there with myself my dad do that and it was on the way back. I needed like three points to upgrade and I got a phone call through your still think finance of like so you didn't get the upgrade. Like we're going to cascade, we want you at cascade because, like you need to race, you need to need the experience. So like I don't know how someone I think my coach was was different. It was Adam Mills with source endurance, who's also, hard to think, finance One of the head guys for that, I think him and a couple others made some phone calls and I was all of a sudden upgraded to a cat one and I was. We got home I was put on a flight the next day to fly out to go race cascade, I think it's.
Speaker 2:So was a Washington, oregon. I'm strong, blank up there with West and yeah, I mean I got dropped day three and I was done. I was like I was out. Yeah, I mean I'd never done a stage race like that before. Yeah, so it was. I was a wild adventure. And then so that following years when I did you know more stage racing at that level, went back there and it was a pretty solid year on the road and, chris is where I really excelled at not really in the road racing side or the stage racing side, which was kind of. I was released from elevate that that season. Oh hi, ob, excuse me, sorry. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I got my hat right there OB.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:OB, that makes sense.
Speaker 2:Yes. So I was released from elevate that year right before my first UCI cross race, which was, coincidentally, my first year with KCCX. I had bugged Bill for three straight years to put me on the team every time I saw him and finally he's like all right, fine, whatever, we'll do it. And so he put me on KCCX and I was with him until I was done racing. I was with KCCX for five. Those next five years for cross.
Speaker 1:So you just kind of focused on cross for those next handful of years and like during and this could be too personal and you don't have to get into details but like I'm super intrigued by the business side of domestic well, any pro racing, but the domestic side and the teams and all that kind of stuff. So inside of your professional career when you were traveling, I mean because elevate, I mean that's a legit, legit team, you know, like in any of those were you like making any money or you just getting like expenses covered, like in things like that and they were helping you with some stuff. Or because I think it's so amazing what the athletes on the in the cycling world in the US put on the line and they basically just get to race for free.
Speaker 2:I mean, that was pretty much it. I was racing for free, like all my travel and stuff was paid for. I think I got a stipend like $150 a month. Yeah, I mean I got my bikes and stuff, but it was. I mean so when I was home I still work at the shop, like yeah.
Speaker 2:And the shop that I was working at the time it was Lee's bicycles. Now it's fat tire, as who owns it now. So like for those all that time, like I was working at the spike shop and they all knew that when I needed to be gone for racing I was gone- and when I was here I was working and you were kind of the pre-grabble scene and we can kind of get into your.
Speaker 1:Maybe it may be a possible comeback at some point in the future. But like, is that, like being a guy that's been through the domestic pro stuff and race on such a good level, is it one of those things where you wish that like you could do more of a privateer kind of thing and actually like try to make like real money in a job out of it? Because that's where I see, you know, I talked to Chad here, you know to Hodges, and we talked about that and he's like, yeah, that guy's like super good. I, you know, if I was running the team I'd give him like 12 grand here. I'm like $1,000 a month Like what, what this person is doing so much Like yeah, and that would be like a, you know, pretty big contract.
Speaker 1:I'm just like yeah, it's amazing what what these athletes are doing for 500, oh, for you like 150 bucks a month, 500 bucks a month and things like that. I mean you're making some ish out there when you're winning races and some of that, but like not really no. So the privateer scene is that something that, like you're like dang and that would, that would be cool to try to scrounge up and make that lifestyle happen, or you're just like you know what. This is just the way the domestic pro scene is here and it's just part of the part of the game.
Speaker 2:Um, I don't think I'm upset. I missed out on it because a lot of it's social media. Like you have to be on your social media game, which and really good at it it wasn't. It was a thing, but it wasn't as big of a thing, right, and like I still had to make sponsor posts that was part of the contract and all of that, but it wasn't like a oh, the only way you're going to make money is your social media and how you get picked up on some teams is your appearance and social media and your influence. Like, I think that plays a lot bigger role now than just results itself. Um, which you know, maybe could have helped me because that first road year, like I didn't have the results. I only had the results in Chris, but never in any of the big stage racing, which is what I needed to have, right, that's why I was released.
Speaker 1:Did? Did you um I'm going to kind of bounce around for a second Did you kind of have in your, in all of your racing? I mean, you were racing at such a high level where you were I'm assuming you were going to nationals and stuff what were like your top results that you were like I won this race, it's a massive race. Or I finished on the podium at nationals, like what were some of your big, big results that you had either on cross or or crit racing or whatever? Um, I mean, clearly, on locally, you were winning everything, probably, or pretty close to so. Was there anything regionally or nationally?
Speaker 2:Well, on the local scene, no, I wasn't winning everything. We still had a lot of fast guys like Jake Duvall, kago Waddell, like I. That really like guys like that really helped my development.
Speaker 1:I feel like this field was super deep then.
Speaker 2:It was like you show the race and you're just like, oh man, this is not going to be easy today. Yeah, cause it's just, it's everyone's showing up and it's all heavy hitters, yeah, um, so I feel like there's a couple of super fast dudes now.
Speaker 1:but like I feel like back then and I'd, like I said I was just like I was a multi sport guy back then and so I just would go to the races and watch and I kind of knew of people, but it felt like there were so many like really fast dudes then locally.
Speaker 2:There, there definitely were. Yeah, there were definitely were, that's for sure. Like I mean, and I was riding with all of them yeah, at least all the ones in Tulsa Like it was where you have been like big success locally, though on the cross side you had to have Uh, decent amount. Yeah, I mean, jake was still Jake. So yeah, I believe this. I'm trying to think when Chris Drummond came to the scene and Chris was coming to the scene at this point as well.
Speaker 1:Those two guys were always up there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean yeah, and we had like Paul Bonds coming up from Texas. Like I mean we had a solid cross crew and it was. It was not easy racing.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So local scene was always. It was always good, it was always good training. Yeah, I used all the local races training and it was really good training.
Speaker 1:Did you have any like big results at big races that you were like dude? This was I hang my hat on this one. That's kind of cool.
Speaker 2:Uh, tulsa had a uh, a UCI cyclocross event. They had a one day seat called Hurtland CX Um Malcolm, who runs Tulsa Tough. He hosted that for three years and the last two of them were a UCI event. I, I won. That's that first year of UCI and that is still the one that I will. That's cool. That's me Like I, I worked. I worked for that because I was like, well, this is a UCI race in my hometown on the counter, like I have to do. Well, Right, I've got that. That's points. Like I was chasing UCI points so I can get a better call up at races. Because the better your call up right, the easier it is to get those points. Man.
Speaker 1:I remember watching Brandon, Mila and Drummond like chase UCI points, just like trying to get a point so they can move Same thing, brutal, yeah Same.
Speaker 2:Thing. My first year as an elite was doing exactly that. Yeah, just chasing man OB.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just got hair, cat hair all over the place.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sorry, it's been good.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I remember that and that was almost like the heart. That was almost harder than like getting a good placing because you were, you had to chase so hard just to get one point.
Speaker 2:Oh and the ways they would do it. And sometimes it was digital, like just a random generator, like oh, here's your number, and other times it was you're pulling a number from, you're pulling your number from a bag. I had the worst luck with that. I just I got to a point just like just give me last row, like I was just, and I go in the bag and I'm like there's last row again, like I just I knew it's. I just had terrible luck with that. So chasing that one point was, I mean, just like then it was huge.
Speaker 1:Once you got that they would just start slowly rolling in, yeah, yeah, and that was the end of it. What was the final thing of yours? Like you know what I think I'm, I'm done at at racing at this level and pushing this and I think I've I just want to take a break and try something new. What was the final determining factor there? Pandemic.
Speaker 2:It was, it was the pandemic that year prior. I I mean, I was, I was training and really really racist in training Is school was getting a little harder. I think that was what was gonna be my junior year in 2019. And so that was like I'd been in school already for three years at that point. Okay, what?
Speaker 2:was your degree in Exercise physiology, okay, and I was really enjoying it, but the classes were getting harder and I was also working full-time to pay for my school. So it was like like I had a lot of scholarships but I was working full-time and going to school and training and it just started to kind of pile up. And that year of Cross, like I just I wouldn't do some of the UCI stuff from the very beginning of it and I just was not doing well and my head wasn't in the game and so I was like, okay, I think we're just gonna call this season a wash and be done with it. And ended up doing that and I was fully prepared and geared up to be like all right crit season's coming up 2020, and then Cross, like making my return, like it'll be my senior year, it'll be like I'll be doing my senior level classes but it'll be a less schedule, because how it worked, it was like I was only gonna be in like 12 hours, so it'll work great.
Speaker 2:And then the pandemic happened and that was. That was pretty much the nail in the coffin. While a lot of people got really fit, school got really really hard. Going to an all online program was not good for me, and especially when the professors didn't know what they were doing either. Like it was just all of a sudden we went to spring break and we came back of. Well, now it's all online and the professors don't know what they're doing, and I had a couple of professors just never compromise and like they're supposed to, because it's pretty difficult, I mean lockdown.
Speaker 1:This was your last semester of school.
Speaker 2:Well, it was supposed to be. Yeah, it was going to be. That falling semester was gonna be my last one. And yeah, I struggled through that semester Thankfully my girlfriend is behind me like got me through my classes and I was like, okay, my head was out of the racing and there was no racing. So I was like, well, there's no point To me. I was like, well, what's the point in training? Yeah, super hard, like I don't know what race is coming back, like we're not having a cross this year, so I didn't. So I stopped coaching with Adam at that point and just kind of rode for fun and that was good. I really enjoyed just riding and going out and going hard when I wanted to and going easy when I wanted to. And I tried again that fall semester and it was all online still, nope, I couldn't do it. I made it, I think a month and a half before I withdrew from about every class because I was just like I can't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't think I could ever do online schooling. Doesn't work for me.
Speaker 2:I could do one class online, but having to do four or five, it just didn't work and so I ended up stepping away from school and just doing one class that next semester and I need a gap here for them to go back to full-time school like where they were having in-person classes. So they had one more semester online and so that delayed graduation again. It's like that delayed me, dropping out of all those classes and not doing anything next year, like pretty much delayed me about a year. And at that point it was my senior level classes and I was like I can't do this. I can't work and do this and train to even compete at a high level like I wanted to.
Speaker 1:So I just I didn't. Well, there's no reason to go out there and race and just get your face beat in at that level. Like it wouldn't be enjoyable.
Speaker 2:It was exactly that. It was like it wasn't worth my time in school. I mean, I was-.
Speaker 2:I was there to wait for money and effort and it was like it's my last year of school, let's buckle down, get this done so I can be done with it, cause I kept putting it off, putting stuff off, like I'm only doing a couple of classes or this or that, and it's like no, no, no, let's just buckle down and get it done so you can graduate after a piece of paper and be done with it. That was the goal. And so, like since then, like I haven't really raced or trained like that, like heavily since the pandemic hit, like the very beginning, like I was really training hard prepping for the summer crit season, and then, once all the races were done, I was like all right, I think.
Speaker 2:I wrote sometimes yeah, yes and no, I'm definitely will be racing again, like I'm training to race again, like I want to do regional stuff, but I don't think I'll ever travel UCI Cross like that again.
Speaker 1:You want to get back into Cross side of things or both.
Speaker 2:From a coaching standpoint. Coaching is what I went to school for and that's what I really want to do.
Speaker 1:Okay, Do you have a coaching business now?
Speaker 2:Not yet, I mean, since I just graduated, just moved Like I gave myself about six months before I started up, I have a couple of athletes that are like kind of my testers.
Speaker 1:No, like hey, you're my guinea pig, so if I screw up, sorry, yep, and you can't really screw up that's the good part Like you can, just it's always, it's always. It's always like an experiment anyways, the science experiments of like with each individual, because you kind of have your philosophies. I mean, I've coached multi sport athletes for gosh, maybe 15, 16 years now, and it's one of those things like there's very few things you could do to screw it up. Right, it's just putting it out there and listening to them and having conversations. So you want to do, you want to have like a true business, like like source endurance, that kind of vibe. Is that what?
Speaker 2:you're going for. That's the eventual goal. Yeah, I only want to focus on the junior athletes. Gotcha that's something that I saw, at least in the Midwest wasn't really done super well coming up. I mean there's a lot more programs now, but it's. There's a lot of young kids that have a lot of talent that are just kind of forgotten about if they're not from the East Coast, colorado or California. And I mean I owe all my life experiences and success to, well, people that helped out junior athletes that weren't the shining golden stars, and so I want to be able to, you know, give back in that kind of way and pass on what I've known.
Speaker 1:So what kind of what age group are you wanting to coach?
Speaker 2:I mean coach anyone, yeah, and that's the only way you can really make a living is coaching anyone, everyone. But I'd really love to focus on like your 15, 16, 17, 18 year olds and really like I'd love to be able to help them like go to Europe. Yeah, these big trips are like they're going to, like they didn't have been national. It's like now you're going to nationals, it's like that's a huge thing.
Speaker 1:And you want to do like the cross, the cross and road scene kind of thing. That's what I want.
Speaker 2:Yeah, as much as I tell people nah, cross sucks, I hate it. I love it, but I also hate it Like it's a lot of travel, it's a lot of equipment, it's a lot of expense. A big thing that I never realized was it was like three years ago, maybe four years ago. I'm sitting there at home my dad's like just paid off the last cross card yesterday and I was like the what? He's like the last credit card for all your cross racing and I was like what? And he's like, yeah, like dude, cross wasn't cheap, like that was $600 to $800 every weekend.
Speaker 2:We went minimum and we did that for four or five years, like even with Bill on a KCCX, like I was still putting money in because the cross is expensive. Like I had a lot like taken care of for me and helped out equipment-wise not, but like I still had to get there.
Speaker 1:That was still expensive. Yeah Well, and across their stuff's always breaking. So many different tires, so many different wheel setups, so many like there's a lot to having a good functioning equipment in that sport.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a very equipment-heavy endeavor Big time and especially at the UCI level. Like I mean, I was, I only had two bikes. I wasn't one of the big teams that had like three, four bikes for each rider. Like I had two bikes but I had six sets of wheels. Like I had to lug that every every race. Like we had tent stands and like with Bill and KCCX. Like we didn't have the big budget, like or it's like, oh, we're rolling up like team trail, but Bill has been in the sport for forever, so he had the connections Right.
Speaker 2:So I made friends with a bunch of people and it was like I choked a race and it's like, oh yeah, come hang out on our tent the whole weekend. Yeah, now I had a spot Right and he'd pit for me and be like, oh no, I'll pit for you this weekend and it's another pro mechanic pitting for me. It's just racing for KCCX taught me to kind of open up in the sense of meet people and not just be like in my little closed bubble and circle. It's like no, no, no, I have to go talk to people, otherwise I won't have, I won't have a person pitting for me or I won't have support on the start line, like I have to get to know people which I feel like that's amazing and you didn't realize it at the time, but then kept from especially coming.
Speaker 1:Someone comes from multi-sport and now I do. Basically, the mountain biking side of things is like that's the pieces that I love in those sports is that it's very open. And you know, I remember the very first race I ever did because I came from all of this stuff from not an endurance background and I remember the very first race I did was a triathlon in El Reno. And well, Dan Tiger, which you may know, Dan, who does some road stuff now he won the race and Amanda Stevens, who she was a pro. She ended up being like a legit, legit pro, but they won the race and they were standing there at the finish line cheering for people whenever they finished and I'm like this is amazing, Like everybody's so nice and talking and sharing and helping pair up tires before the race and all the stuff, and I was like this is amazing.
Speaker 1:And then I went to a road race. I'm like why does no one talk to anyone? Why does everyone hate everybody? No one here is having fun at all. And then you go to a mountain bike race and everybody's like drinking beer and hanging out with their dogs. I'm like this is awesome. So, yeah, I love that. That forced you into that and hopefully that carries on growing the sport going towards, especially with juniors and teaching them those traits and skills, because that's the only thing that's going to make the sport more inviting and continue to grow.
Speaker 2:Definitely. Yeah, I mean Cross. I mean I've been out of the Cross game for well, I guess three or four years at this point, but like it's a community, it's a huge community. Like I mean it was the same people traveling to every single big weekend.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Hanging out at the same hotels every single weekend, so like we all just got to know each other and just hang out. And sure there are people that didn't like others.
Speaker 1:But Well, it's always just happened.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just, it's all like you're one big community, you're all helping each other.
Speaker 1:Did you. Before we get into the yard sale stuff, you said you were in Northwest Arkansas. You just moved back from there. What took you to Northwest Arkansas?
Speaker 2:School.
Speaker 1:So school was okay.
Speaker 2:I originally my first year, I actually went to Fort Lewis in Durango, Colorado, and so I spent a year there. I love Durango, but the issue is I don't skier snowboard and I couldn't afford to skier snowboard. So when the snow hit, I couldn't ride my bike outside. Everyone I knew was skiing snowboarding. I'm Mike, yeah, I'm inside. All I did was school and inside and that was it.
Speaker 2:Hmm, and I, that winter was very hard, yeah, very depressed that winter. Yeah, I was like this isn't for me, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not a mountain town kid, yeah. And so I ended up transferring because my best friend Went to the University of Arkansas and I was like, sure, I'll just go there, I'll transfer, and I'm a Native American and thankfully they have if you're native, you have your card, you have in-state tuition. So it was like there's no brainer. Yeah, I want to go to OU or OSU. I didn't want to go back home, right. But Arkansas, it's like, well, mountain biking is getting really big there, like ride cycling is getting huge over there. It's like, absolutely done, we're going to Arkansas. Nice, I was there ever since up until I probably would still be there if the housing prices and rent prices weren't yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just got, you just got priced out.
Speaker 1:That was our only thing my oldest nephew, he that he went to University of Arkansas as well. He graduated gosh been a year and a half ago. Yeah, that's what we keep. We kept telling him like dude, you got to stay out here. Like it's so wonderful there's, so it's so much growth and good thing, because, you know, not just the Bentonville, because he doesn't ride, he doesn't do any of that stuff, but this like Fayetteville, such a beautiful city and so many opportunities out there. If you can like get plugged in and make it happen and yes, but man, it's expensive.
Speaker 2:It is like I mean yeah, it just. I mean we were priced out like, yeah, the wages weren't matching.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know how they're gonna keep up with that out there, with what's happening and everything else it's it's turned into Benville's, turning into a mini aspen.
Speaker 2:It's what it is. Yes, like easily, like, oh, we were like my girlfriend, I. We were living in Rogers because that was cheaper at the time. Even that's now, oh well, rogers. Rogers is great, but we can't afford to live there. Yeah, I know if we wanted to live anywhere, it was gonna be 40, 45 minutes out outside of town and it's like that's then there's no purpose of living out there. There's. No, it's not worth it.
Speaker 2:No, I can you're living there for the fun stuff and then if you can't live by the fun stuff, then no exactly and it was like, well, if we're gonna pay that price, we're gonna go back Tulsa, like I, I better connections here, like I can grow my side here. And she lucked out and got a job at one of the hospitals here and so it's like sure, it's home for me. It's yeah, we'll make the jump and she's always like Tulsa, so it's, it was an easy jump.
Speaker 1:Did you get to ride? Anyway, you're any mountain biking and stuff out there.
Speaker 2:To get back into that, oh, I mean, yeah, I was riding all the time, I just wasn't training but mountain biking like I don't think I touched my road bike For like two and a half years like you're living in Northwest Arkansas.
Speaker 1:Dream for all.
Speaker 2:I was doing this mountain mountain biking. Gravel is all I did.
Speaker 1:What was your favorite? Some of your favorite trails out there.
Speaker 2:Hobbs State Park definitely has my favorite out there. For sure their car salute that goes by like so.
Speaker 1:Fun. Yes, I would agree. That may be my favorite trail out there. It flows so well. Yes, and it seems like you're. I mean, it seems like you're always flat. But sometimes you look down you're like, how am I going? Like 24, and now it's kind of getting sketchy because, like I'm getting too fast here.
Speaker 2:Exactly you never think you're climbing, but you're climbing all the time.
Speaker 1:But when you're climbing you're still going like a good speed, so it doesn't feel like a drag like it can out there. Yeah, I agree that trail is so fun.
Speaker 2:It's beautiful. Halfway through you can jump in the lake and hang out, get back on your bike and go home.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's, that's a great trail. What was your least favorite trail out there? Because I think back 40 and big or Little sugar is a big sugar, little sugar, whatever it's little sugar little sugar. I think those are overrated. To be honest with you, they can I bar personally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they get bored. I enjoy them. Honestly, I'm gonna say so. I'm gonna get flack. I'm gonna say slaughter pen. I can't stand it because I rode it every day like I was. I was working up, I was working at a shop in Bentonville and I was just my lunch breaks. I was. I rode the same trails every day. The tourists were always there every day. Yeah, I couldn't ride there on the weekends like yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean super busy can't you have 1500 to 2000 people there every weekend? Yeah, just riding all the trails, and it's like, yeah, I can't ride here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because everything's multi-directional.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's super sketchy, so that's probably my least favorite. I just it's. I think it's way overrated for what it is. There are some cool trails in slaughter pain, but as a whole I'd rather go somewhere else.
Speaker 1:Yeah, personally, yeah, I totally understand that for sure. Yeah, I think it's a really awesome Intro to Bentonville mountain biking because you can see in Bentonville.
Speaker 1:You can ride out there. You get to see the downhill runs like, you get to see all the stuff and I I enjoy slaughter pin, but you know what you're getting when you go there. Yeah, it's, it is what it is. But it's nice that you can just ride from downtown to there and make it's in like an easy loop situation. But man, there's so many awesome trails outside of that little yeah, cluster. That's so much nicer, I agree.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's slaughter pin, like it's always under construction.
Speaker 1:It's the same thing every time, yeah yeah, I understand I get it All right. Well, you've listened to a couple of episodes and you said Waddell and drumming is who you listen to. All right, well, I'm sure drumming. I'll appreciate him being called out on that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he didn't mention me at all.
Speaker 1:He's selfish. You know how drumming is. He's such a selfish jerk, I know right.
Speaker 2:It's like, chris, I I was there with you and Jake all the time racing cross like come on.
Speaker 1:He always talks about Jig, never Skyler. What a jerk this guy it's our. Everyone that comes on here should give drumming a hard time. He deserves every bit of it, 100%. All right, so let's jump into yard sale. Question number one for everyone is Favorite piece of equipment under $100 a good set of bike lights, 100%.
Speaker 2:I Did a lot of training at night too, because I was at good work and I'd ride home from the shop at like 7 pm, so in the wintertime that's nighttime. Yeah, so I've, I mean I've always.
Speaker 1:What's your not, what's your lights? Go, go to lights.
Speaker 2:It's a bond trigger, ion 700 that is, I think, 13 years old at this point. It's still kicking like they still make them. They're way better now. But I think I paid 80 bucks for the front light and I got like a small blinker for the rear and now for 80 bucks you can get like a 1500 and oh yeah, for like eight hours. Yeah, I wish my I probably in a place at this point, barely last two hours now, I don't upgraded lights.
Speaker 1:I've got lights. Literally got lights yesterday and, yeah, well, I got. Well, I screwed up in order to because I kept putting them in my cart, just yeah, sort the ones that I wanted and I forgot to delete one of them. So I have two, but one's like a 1300 and one's a 1500 and I'm like these things are like my headlights on my car. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 2:Oh, they're good now. It's awesome.
Speaker 1:It's amazing, yeah, it's, so that's a good one, I agree.
Speaker 2:I'd probably my my go-to. That'd be my recommendation.
Speaker 1:What's your favorite piece of equipment of any kind, of any price? It could be a bike, it could be tires, it could be kit, it could be anything.
Speaker 2:Probably my court power mirror just be. It's caused me enough suffering in life.
Speaker 1:That's a good one.
Speaker 2:I'm really like. I'm not really super number driven, but I like to see it and I mean, without that thing I probably would never have gotten to do half the experiences I did, because I wouldn't have been trained well enough for it. I mean that's, yeah, it's, it was my lifeline for years.
Speaker 1:Just one of these are some of the fun questions that I've been wanting to add, especially now that I'm talking. You know, when I get to talk to some guys that were at the really top level, what was the highest watt number you ever saw?
Speaker 2:that you ever put out, that you I think maybe like 1200 maybe, but I was also, I guess, like 132 pounds time. Oh my, so like it evens out your raceway. Yeah, I fluctuated between like 132 to 136 for Many, for many years, up until like my last year, wow. And then, even then, I was only like Maybe 140.
Speaker 1:I topped out at man, I was doing like a lot of you know, oh, somewhere around five, like Cross-season I would.
Speaker 2:I always had like the good, the train for it. I just always like myself out mentally and any of my races I was like one fall and like that was it. That was my biggest issue. The cross. Five watts per kilo is brutal. There's something, it was something around there. Yeah, I remember Looking years. Yeah, there's something around there.
Speaker 1:What's your hardest workout that you remember having to do?
Speaker 2:So I named it F you, adam, I Remember what it was it was. I think I had three 25 minutes at lapid threshold in every. It was every Two minutes or three minutes. I had to do a minute at VO to.
Speaker 1:It was something like that and then recover at threshold for 25 minutes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was like 20 or 25 minutes per interval and I remember and yeah, I had to do three of those. I think it was 20 minutes and I do three of those. So essentially an hour threshold over the course of like two hours with 30 sprints mixed in or 20 sprints mixed in, roughly yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I don't think I finished it. I remember right, I didn't finish it.
Speaker 1:I think Adam was just trying to see what he can make you do.
Speaker 2:Oh, probably. I mean at that point I was. That season was my best year across and I was Doing threshold workouts three or four times a week. Man, like that, like For a solid six and a half months. All I did was threshold. Now, really fast racing because of it yeah, I was doing the threshold for cross.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what was the biggest Week you ever had on the bike hours wise, I.
Speaker 2:Think I talked like 28 30. Oh my god, it was because of Stage racing. Yeah, we did a bunch of. It was probably like either Redlands or Cascade, like I had about, which mean like my morning spins and cool down spins and all that. It was like close to 30 hours week, 30 hours a week. I would never want to do that again. No thanks, that's too much for me. Like 12 to 15 is my sweet spot.
Speaker 1:Is that kind about where you trained at your training block? Yeah, I'm. Favorite place to ride besides slaughter pin I.
Speaker 2:Honestly, I'm gonna say Turkey Mountain on the mountain, but old Turkey's changed a lot. Yeah, it's, it's definitely changed a lot. Now that I'm like I'm back, moved home, I'm riding Turkey again Like I mean, they did the whole revamp for it. Yeah, I think they needed it, I think it's for the better hundred percent. But old Turkey and I spent so much time there for four straight years like it always holds a special place in my heart and the old, rough Turkey Mountain that just only like 9% of the athletes Mountain bikers could really ride in in town, just because it was that eroded and, yeah, unmaintained. But what they've done to it is really good. I really, I really think they did a good job. It's a lot easier, but I I mean it's what's needed. It's got people on bikes and that's what matters.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I remember I didn't. I had kind of started getting into some off-road Multisport races, yep, and they did off-road do it Turkey one year and I was like I'm gonna go and they were paying, which doesn't happen in multi sport. So like I'm gonna go do this race. It's gonna be amazing, dude. Where athletes do not need to go is the old Turkey. Yes, it was such a beatdown I, I, oh it sucked to run it much.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah and it was I think it was in like July or August. It was awful. I mean, oh my god, it was so awful it was not a lot of fun, I know.
Speaker 2:July and August. That's the best time to go, of course.
Speaker 1:Yeah, everyone do like a four-hour Endurance race at Turkey in July and August. It's a great idea.
Speaker 2:It sounds great.
Speaker 1:Um Dream bike Could be any kind.
Speaker 2:Honestly, probably a newer a lace print. I I've been racing a rim brake a lace print for Since my freshman year of college and I love it. Yeah, and it's about time I need to make them jump the disc. I really, really need something new. I probably won't end up getting in the lay Um just because I I don't work for a specialized store, but that's always been very, very solid bike and I've really enjoyed it. So that's, that'd be my. I'm honestly, that's my best recommended. You want a crit bike? Do that 100%, like you're not gonna crack it, that's true. And it's not that expensive to replace. It's like, well, you break it. At retail, that's another 1200 bucks and you get a new frame and fork.
Speaker 1:Yep.
Speaker 2:It's Another three or four for a frame.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're pretty bulletproof. They are a great crit bike, for sure. Yes, um, all right, this one, because I looked at your instagram before I got on here. Oh boy, tell me about etsy, etsy.
Speaker 2:Oh, so my last year of college uh, I got her laugh.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she definitely laughed because she.
Speaker 2:Uh, she definitely laughed. So I got into 3d printing. Um, I, I mean, I watched 3d printing videos for years and so I was like I won't won. So I bought a 3d printer just on a whim, um, and I started making like cosplay helmets and stuff for myself. Like I was like you know, I can just buy a file and print it out and I just have to like build, sand, prime it, like put a lot of elbow grease into, but like I can make what I want as long as the file exists. So I did that. And in my last year in college I was like, uh, you know, I've gotten good enough. Sure, I'll try and sell it, and so like it funded Uh, kind of my like extra money for like my last year. It was good, really, yeah, I mean I was. I was making like a helmet every couple weeks.
Speaker 1:How long does it take to print one of those helmets?
Speaker 2:Um Depends on what size it is and like which one specifically, usually about two, three days.
Speaker 1:To print, and then how long does it take you to do all the detail work to it?
Speaker 2:In the beginning. A lot of uh in the beginning. It would take me like 10 15 hours total. Oh my gosh, um, to get it finished now. I'm good enough now to where it's. It's pretty easy. I could probably spend about four hours in total. Okay, um, and it'll be ready to go.
Speaker 1:But well, I'm gonna put the link in the show notes, because I don't want people to be wondering. Because it's it's wild, because I had a three. I bought a 3d printer for the bike fit studio, so yeah, like shims and wedges and all kinds of things like that and I sucked at design thing like a design is so freaking hard if that's not like your world.
Speaker 2:It is and that is so hard. So are you designing them? No, are you just fine? Okay, I am just getting the files and making it like that ridiculous. I I'm gonna have dabbled in modeling of it. I can do some Some simple stuff, but right now I can't make anything like that. It's impressive.
Speaker 1:People that notes what's the coolest thing you've printed.
Speaker 2:No, I wish I had my collection. I it's still most my stuff still in arkansas. Still it was like that's like the least important thing to bring is all my helmet collection.
Speaker 1:Well, here's the thing. You have my number. Send me a picture, because this will come out in a couple weeks. So send me a picture and we'll have.
Speaker 2:We'll be able to put it on I will be able to do that, okay, um, probably my favorite one that I made. Um, that's actually a good question, man, that's a really good question. I gotta think it doesn't look the prettiest. It'd be my mando, my mando, mandalorian helmet. Okay it? It definitely does not look like it was supposed to. I did not do any of the methods correctly, but it was the first helmet I made. Okay, so for me, I will always keep it, as cruddy and crappy as it looks, but I will definitely always keep. I mean, I've made some way cool that I don't even know. I made like custom commissions for Wow, that like I don't have. Like I, I made them send pictures and I had pictures of them somewhere. I've been that right, was it like, yeah, a lot of the stuff like I, I made and Sold and sent off. Uh-huh, I was making money, I made it. It paid enough.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's awesome. I I had. No, I, I have no idea about this world, and so when I saw that I was like dude, those are kind of cool because I don't need I'm not even a star wars person but when I saw it I was like that's kind of badass.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I, I've really enjoyed it as it became a hobby. Um, I have, I probably won't start it again for a bit, just because it definitely makes, uh, it makes a big mess, um, definitely stains some things, and I mean we already weren't getting the security deposit back in the last place anyway. So it's okay, but I'm not gonna ruin this one.
Speaker 1:That's a good idea.
Speaker 2:We're gonna wait until we're gonna wait, a bit good thinking and kick that back out.
Speaker 1:But are you? But you said you're gonna get back into racing.
Speaker 2:Yes, I will. Uh, that plan is for Back in the crits this coming spring. Um, I'll probably dabble in some cross stuff Um, this fall, just Just cuz. Um, I'm out there. Yeah, I mean, there's some local stuff that's popped up, so I'll definitely go do that Um. But yeah, uh, my plan is to I mean, I'm out of school now and yeah, you know, to be a good coach, I gotta be in the community and I gotta really show that I know what I'm doing.
Speaker 1:So that's a big, big part of it.
Speaker 2:Time to get back in the racing and I'll do crits for sure. Um, whenever travel for cross I'm, I'll burn, probably dabble in some mountain bike racing too. I really enjoy, I really enjoyed mountain bike racing. I just I couldn't do all three, so I had to.
Speaker 1:Well, the cap on tour to dirt scene is really close to being really really good again. The guys that are there, they're like Fast. There's just not quite enough of them, yep, but the guys that are there are like it's a, it's a good group of guys racing in the cat ones right now, and it would. It would be awesome to see, like, just like, if there was like three or four more guys. It would be like really good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, really really good so it'd be awesome to see some guys come back into that world. Um so, and hopefully you'll have the coaching service up soon, um.
Speaker 2:Maybe I mean I, I gave myself. Maybe I mean I I gave myself six months. So I told myself when I moved here.
Speaker 2:You have six months to kind of not really relaxed but more of kind of get back into it, get back into the sport, get the feel of things, kind of do some extra learning and training on it. Definitely have some, like you know, my guinea pig clients. But before really going full ball, I want to do it right, like I don't want to, just like I don't want to be another one of those internet coaches that just I mean, that's why I went to school. It's because I didn't want to be another internet coach that just does copy paste plans for every single athlete. Like a lot of the athletes, if they have the same goal, they'll be doing mostly the same thing, but everyone but they're also different people, so they have different things, they have different life schedules. So you need to do it right and you need to know how to work it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you want to dig into the and work with like, like in a real elite coaching level of not just like here's your plan, go, do it Correct and like I would love to eventually I mean, it's why I went to school of I want to train really top end athletes. Yeah, I love that. That. Like well, that 1% better is the difference between first and third. So that's what they're going for, mm-hmm. Yeah, but you got to know what you're doing to do that.
Speaker 1:Well, hopefully someone out there will hear this and be like hmm, I think I would like to be in so they can reach out to you. They, you may not be ready yet, but I would encourage them to reach out to you.
Speaker 2:They can get. They can get on a list. I'll start making a list.
Speaker 1:That's right. Maybe they could be a guinea pig too. So, or be ready whenever you're ready, to start rolling it out, because it'll be be about time for for those seasons to get fired up and people looking for coaches anyway, so it'd be perfect timing. So it would be Cool. Well, skyler's or anything else that that you want to add on here that we didn't touch on.
Speaker 2:No, not really. I mean there's, there's. Hey, one other thing I was going to ask you.
Speaker 1:How did your coaching mountain biking, going with your athlete behind you? Oh, yes, I saw. You took her for the trail. You took her mountain biking.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she's been mountain biking once and that's been about it. She likes road and gravel stuff, but we did one mountain bike trip and that ended in a crash and I don't think we haven't really been back since and we're not going to touch mountain biking Okay, not in that side of the room. She's had some. She used to be rock climber and so she she had a major injury, a lateral tear, so she had that repaired, and so there's definitely a big fear of falling and re-injuring, which is a very big possibility. So I fully understand that road biking and gravel is a lot safer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, are you going to get back into the gravel scene? Definitely, oh, I love gravel.
Speaker 2:I will. I told myself this and I will stand by it I will never race gravel, We'll only ride it. We'll only ride it because I wanted one thing that says fun, exactly.
Speaker 2:Yep, so that, and that's gravel still something my dad does. So it was the one thing that I'm like no matter what, we can go to a gravel event, we can ride together, yeah, and I'm not going to be like, oh, but now I'm missing it, like, oh, I could win this race, like I'm going to no, even though we came to get, I know, I said I was going to ride with you, I'm going to go win, yeah, which he would gladly support me doing, right, but I'm like, no, I want one thing in this sport to still be just pure fun. Yep, and that's what I chose gravel as Cause it's easy. It's like, well, you go out and ride 60, 80 miles and just kind of have a good time. You can drink some liquor while you're going and just hang out, and it's just fun. Yeah, that's the thing of it. It's the experience instead of the result.
Speaker 1:Yeah, cause that's the way I like. I mean, clearly I'm not at the competitive level that you guys are at and I have zero chance of winning any gravel anything. Let's just be honest and call it what it is. But it's one of those things like why would I go out and smash myself and suffer for like a 25th place finish?
Speaker 1:Yep, when I, me and my brother can go ride and it's the one thing that we can he's he's not riding right now because of some things, but like we always would go ride together, yep, if we want to stop and take a picture of something cool, let's do it. We want to eat cookies at the? We see somebody that needs a flat chain? Like let's. We truly just like to along. We see friends we ride with them. People pass us, we ride with them. Like it is pure fun. I've never like tried my hardest at any gravel event ever and I really have no interest in that. Like, I just want to like always ride with friends and take pictures and just enjoy being out there. So I love that that you're keeping that at that level.
Speaker 2:That's yeah, and that's my same vibe of like. I want to just be out here and hang out with friends and have a good day.
Speaker 1:Cool, that's what it's about. I love that you're still riding with pops.
Speaker 2:Yeah, still, I mean he can beat me now. He's enjoying it now, cause now we're going to ride in the mountain. He's like he'll ride. I'd be like this isn't as fast as I usually go and I'm like I think I know, I know I'm dying here, but like you just got to, I love that. Yeah, I got to give me some time.
Speaker 2:Like you're not going to be here long, I'll be beating you again Like I keep telling him that, but he's, I think he's just more glad I'm. I'm back in town. He has a riding buddy again. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:That's the big, big part of like oh, enjoy, enjoy making those life memories, cause that it's not going to get better than that Definitely won't. That's awesome. Thank you so much for your time, yeah, and hopefully can good luck on the coaching business. I hope you blow it out. We definitely the world needs really good coaches, cause there's not enough of them Definitely does so good luck in that, good luck back in Tulsa and hope to see you out racing soon.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely. Thank you for having me on the show. Awesome man.
Speaker 1:See you, thank you.
Speaker 2:That's awesome.