The Leader Fast Lane - Episode 13 - with TTU Athletic Director Kirby Hocutt

In this episode, I am joined by Texas Tech University Athletic Director Kirby Hocutt. Kirby shares about:

1:59 - the role of an athletic director

6:31 - leaders he modeled his approach after

10:31 - how he makes decisions in a rapidly changing environment

17:26 - how to assess culture in an organization

19:00 - the guiding principles of the athletics department

20:38 - how to address high performers that may erode culture

24:58 - ensuring decisions align with values despite external pressure

27:43 - what brings him joy about his job

33:19 - personal habits that help him stay sharp

34:24 - how he resets after tough setbacks

37:16 - your attitude and effort are things you can control every day

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Hello, and welcome to the Leader Facility, the podcast where accomplished leaders from higher education, public service, and beyond share real stories, practical principles, and hard-earned lessons listeners can apply immediately. No buzzwords, no shortcuts, just real leaders sharing real lessons you can apply right away. I'm Lane Mears, Assistant Vice Chancellor for Leader in Culture Development at the Texas Tech University System. Today I am joined by Kirby Hokutt, Athletic Director for the Texas Tech University. Hocutt, a 2026 Sports Business Journal Athletics Director of the Year finalist, has guided the Texas Tech Athletics Department to unprecedented success since being named the 13th Director of Athletics in school history on March 2nd, 2011. Under his leadership, Texas Tech has developed into one of the nation's elite athletics programs, a tenure highlighted by unprecedented revenue growth, significant investments into the student athlete experience, and a transformation of athletic facilities. Texas Tech's programs have not only competed but advanced deep into the postseason throughout HOCU's tenure, as nine teams have finished among the top eight teams in the country for their respective sports, including national runner-up in softball and men's basketball in recent years. And the football team secured its first ever appearance in the college football playoff this past season. A former All Big Eight conference linebacker at Kansas State, HoCut earned his bachelor's degree from K-State in 1995 and his Master of Education degree from the University of Oklahoma in 2001. He and his wife Diane have two sons, Drew and Brooks. It's great to have you on the podcast, Kirby.

SPEAKER_00 1:52

Appreciate it, Elaine. It's uh great to be with you. Appreciate the uh the opportunity.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Good. Well, I look forward to talking. To begin, would you mind sharing with our listeners a little about what the role of an athletic director entails at a large university?

SPEAKER_00 2:08

Number one is you know, the athletic director position at Texas Tech reports to the president of the university. So President Skuvenik is my boss, and I'm I tell our head coaches all the time we're so fortunate we could not have a better boss than President Skuvenik and uh the way that he embraces and believes in the role that college athletics can play within a university in a university setting. Um, so all decisions are are Dr. Skuvenics, he entrusts me to lead our athletics department day to day. Uh he and I talk regularly, uh if not daily, at least two or three times a week and during times of uh um times where there's something going on that is of high public interest, we we talk multiple times a day. So in my role as athletics director, I get to work with 17 sport programs. Um and I say 17, it's it's important to note, Lane, that track and field makes make up six of those. So you have men's indoor, women's indoor track and field, men's and women's outdoor track and field, men's cross country, women's cross country. So with track being six sports, we we have 17 sports, 12 head coaches, uh work with 385 student athletes each and every day uh in those in those locker rooms on those teams. And uh we have about um 225 full-time employees, uh coaches, staff leading those student athletes each and every day. So um, as you can imagine, under the athletic department um umbrella, you know, we have a an annual operation budget this year of$176 million. Uh we have academic support services for all of our student athletes. We provide strength and conditioning, sports medicine, um, sports psychology support for them, nutritional support, um, you know, everything from equipment operations, uh, oversea travel. Uh, so anything that an athlete does during their time here on campus, from training, preparation, competition, or being a college student day to day, uh, we have a staff that is attentive to that and supports them along the way to make sure they progress towards their degree and graduation and prepare them to be leaders.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

That's a lot. Am I right that you are now the longest tenured AD in Texas Tech history?

SPEAKER_00 4:49

You know, I believe that is true. So um I just uh completed my 15th year at Texas Tech. So it's it's gone fast and it's been awesome.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

Well, I'm I'm fairly new to tech, um, a little over 10 months now. Um but it's a great time to be at Texas Tech all around, from the uh athletics to the academics to what's going on uh statewide. It's uh it's a great time to be at Texas. And thank you for for all that you're doing.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

Well, thank you. It's you know, you when you when you go through your career, you never you never say, hey, you want to be somewhere for 15 years. You always hope that you have that opportunity. A lot of athletic directors today do not have that opportunity. But you know, I had been prior to Texas Tech, I'd been the athletics director at the University of Miami uh for three years. Prior to that, was the athletic director at Ohio University for about two years and seven months. And I always felt like, you know, it really takes, I I believe, and I still believe this, five years to change the culture, to change the direction of an organization the size of ours. And the fact that I've had the privilege and the honor to be here for 15 years to work with so many great coaches and great athletes, and then just the people, uh, the Red Raider Nation. You you will not find better, a better fan base, a more passionate fan base. There may be some that are larger than ours, but none more passionate or engaged or supportive or generous than the Red Raider Nation. So it just it's been a such a blessing to be here for 15 years.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

And if so, what what principles or or lessons did have you taken from whoever you've modeled your leadership after?

SPEAKER_00 6:46

Yeah. You know, I I think everybody that I've worked for or worked with uh you know has made an impact on me. You try to continue to improve each and every day and try to learn from from those um that you're you're around and you're doing this journey with. I I would say that you know, if you go back to playing college athletics, I I played football as you mentioned earlier. I don't know if anybody listening will still remember the big eight conference. That was a long time ago. Um that's when we had eight conference members, and then we had 12, then we had 10, and now we're at 16. So it continues to to uh go way back. But I I played football at Kansas State for Bill Snyder. And I think if if anyone knows the Kansas State football story, Coach Snyder took over a program that was at the very bottom, Sports Illustrated. The year I went had labeled it as Futility U, the worst college football program in America. In my junior and senior years, I had I was fortunate to be a starter, um, team captain my senior year. Uh we finished both of those years ranked in the top 20 in the country. And so I learned a lot of things from Coach Snyder and the program that he had put in place at that time. Number one is you got to expect great things out of yourself. You you've got to expect greatness. And then I also learned from Coach Snyder that no attention, the attention to detail can never be too small. And uh it's it's the attention to details, it's the habits that you build every day that's gonna uh lead to your to your success. You know, and then I would say when I was finished playing at Kansas State, I had the opportunity to go intern at the College Football Association. It no longer exists. Uh Chuck Nynus was the executive director. Chuck was a giant in our industry. He was the number two guy at the NCAA for a long time. He was the commissioner of the um of the Big Eight Conference, he was the interim commissioner of the Big 12 conference. Um and you know, I saw a Chuck. He had when I interned with him, we were in Boulder, Colorado at the College Football Association. He had fun every day. You know, he it it never it never was an eight to five job. It was, you know, what we're doing is training the leaders of tomorrow through the sport of football. And man, I just learned to enjoy each and every day and enjoy the people that you you work with. And I think that relational component I really saw in Chuck Ninas during those years. So to answer your question, I my mind immediately goes back to Coach Schneider during five years that I played for him at Kansas State, and then that first uh professional internship I had with with Chuck Ninus.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

That's great. You mentioned Coach Schneider. Um, and it makes me think, you know, we we here at the Office of Leader and Culture Development do programs for students, faculty, staff, and administration across the Texas Tech system on values, character, leadership, difficult conversations, those types of things. And we're really digging into what it means to help people develop stronger character. And it is, it's those little decisions, it's the little things day by day that that can either build up or tear down character. And when you've got someone, a leader who emphasizes that, who lives it, um, and can walk people through that development, it's it's powerful. I mean, I've experienced it in my life, you as well, and it's something that we're trying to help across the system with different cohorts across uh across these universities. I've got a few different topics I'm gonna ask a couple questions on. Um, first one is is the high-stakes environment of college athletics right now. It's arguably, maybe inarguably, more complex now than probably ever before with with NIL, with realignment, with the transfer portal. Um how do you operate? How do you make decisions when the ground is constantly changing?

SPEAKER_00 11:03

Very carefully. Very carefully with as much time as you're afforded to make those decisions. Nobody ever ever remembers how fast you made a decision, but they will sure remember the outcome of that decision. Uh but you're you're what you said and how you framed it is so true. Uh, college athletics is extremely complex today. It's ever evolving, it's ever shifting. Um, you know, we're in an industry right now that you know I cannot get our leadership team or our athletics department's team together. And I've said this in front of our entire athletics department to stand, to stand up and not be able to say, this is our these are our three-year objectives, or these are our five-year objectives. We're we're looking, you know, 12 months out, knowing that we are going to have to pivot multiple times before we we achieve any objective that we set for 12 months out. It just, you know, the things that you mentioned, the transfer portal, NIL, we're living in this revenue share uh space. And as we're living in this new revenue share world, the governance model to oversee the revenue share model is being built while we fly this plane. And so we're trying to build the govern the governing body called the Collegiate Sports Commission, and it's being challenged already. Uh, it's been in place for nine or ten months now, and um you know there are different cases that are being heard now that are challenging the the rule-making authority of this new governance body, and we're not even a year into it yet. So so many of the decisions in college athletics today are not being made in conference rooms, athletic director conference rooms, they're being made in Congress, they're being made in a courtroom, and so the the job over the course of the 15 years I've been at Texas Tech or the 20 plus years I've been an athletics director has changed immensely. You know, never did I believe I would be tracking the development of a bill to be uh sent to Congress or being asked to contribute to a bill that's uh going to go before Congress. Or there would be executive orders coming out of the office of the president pertaining to what we do each and every day. So uh I could go on and on, but to answer your question, how do you make decisions very carefully? And you surround yourself with the best thinkers that you have, and you take as much time as you as you have or as much time as you need to make a decision.

SPEAKER_01 13:55

Yeah. I I can only imagine that it's it's radically changed that process. You know, my in my background in international development work, we it was one of my strengths was the strategic thinking, the long-term planning. Like you've talked about a three-year plan, we had five-year plans, but in the new dynamic, there's no um things change so quickly that you can't do that anymore. And I just wonder practically, has that has that tightened up your circle of input? Or uh I just you know, how how does that practically work to the extent that you can share what that looks like to make make decisions in this expedited time frame?

SPEAKER_00 14:36

That's a really good question. And I will tell you, college athletics today is not a real healthy place overall to be in. And and my so my mind is going to, you know, when we got beat in the Orange Bowl in the college football playoff this year by Oregon, uh, that was on January 1st. If my memory is correct, the football transfer portal opened on January the 2nd. So here we come back from having the best football season in Texas Tech University history, won our first Big 12 conference championship, played in the CFP. The next day the transfer portal opens, and our coaches are having to dive into building next year's roster. Fast forward to basketball season. It's me immediately when you know our season ended in the NCAA tournament this year, we were in the transfer portal. Coach McCaslin is still trying to navigate and put together next year's roster. So it's it's very, very challenging. So do you ask has the circle of influence tightened up? I think in in some ways it's expanded because we need the best thinkers at the table, we need legal counsel at the table. We you know, we're having to bring in uh more of our internal governance staff, our compliance team to help us navigate and understand the road ahead, you know, with our fundraising units, with our corporate um development units, with our um revenue producing units, with our ticket office. How are we gonna put this puzzle together in this new world and make sure that we stay between the lines? And at the same time, we play offense and as and we're as proactive as we possibly can be.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

Yep. Well, that's good. That's that's encouraging. Um for for our listeners that that may not be involved in athletics but but are facing some high stress situations of their own, the the the fact that your your response is that you you really need to expand your input um is encouraging because I think a lot of people that the tendency is to close ranks.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Yeah, and that you know, I would say the but the the strength of Texas Tech Athletics is is our people. And when you get into a changing landscape or a changing environment, a high stressed environment, the more, the more minds, the more talent we can have around the table, the more confident I'm gonna be in ultimately having to make the final decision um that that we're in the right place. And um, we've we've thought about every angle.

SPEAKER_01 17:24

Great. Good. I'm gonna shift to the topic of culture and standards. Um when you walk into a program or department, what are the first signals you look for to assess culture?

SPEAKER_00 17:38

Yeah, great, great question. Um immediately you want to get to know the the people and what what's the attitude around the program? What's the attitude that we're bringing into the department, uh, into the program each and every day? You know, what efforts being put forward to continue to challenge ourselves in that department to grow? Uh, how do how does how do the team members in that department how do they treat each other? How do they work together? Uh how do they challenge each other? Um, I think is is a big thing. And then, you know, what are what are the values that are are guiding or or um or directing that that department? If it's an athletics department or you know, overall with 385 and student athletes and or you know, our fundraising department, what are the values that are driving them and they're adhering to each and every day? And you know, I know as an athletics department, I believe mission and guiding principles are so important. And you know, a particular unit could take what we have and come up with their own principles, but they need to be in alignment with the department overall. And you know, as an athletics department, we have four very simple guiding principles. Um, do the right thing, win every day, and winning's not always on the scoreboard, right? We we could lose on the scoreboard, but we could still win that day. I strongly believe that. Um, third is success is built on healthy relationships. You're you're only gonna be as good as the people you have around you or supporting you, and then respect the past and invent the future. And we were talking about leading in a high-stakes environment before. And I think it's so important that we respect those who came before us, built the foundation in which we operate on today. But at the same time, we've got to invent the future. We can't continue to do the thing, things the same way that we did them five years ago. We've we've got to be proactive and uh be aggressive in how we're going to uh move this department forward. So it's a long answer as to what when you walk into a program, what what are the signals you look for related to culture? But I think it's it's uh the the the core values, but also the attitude and energy and how how your teammates in that department are working together.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Yep. Yep, the relationships are key. That's great. I I love those four principles um that that guide guide the department. Um and and like you've said, they're they're fully in line with the university's values, with the system's values, and um it is key. That alignment is key, even though there may be some tweaks and and uniqueness with each each different department. What another question on this topic is how do you handle high performers who produce results but that may tend to erode culture?

SPEAKER_00 20:51

I I would say you just have to address it. You have to talk about it, right? I mean, you want high performers, you you want individuals that are driven and uh want to be the best in their chosen field or industry, but you know, you're only going to be as strong as your weakest link. And um I think in those cases you you've got to you've got to address things. I I believe communication is the most important thing that we do each and every day. And I believe it can be the most challenging thing that we do each and every day. So, you know, if if there's an extremely high performer but is causing stress somewhere within the organization or um is not treating people with respect, I I think you've got to you've got to address it. You've got to talk about it in a way that uh you you hope you can get to the point where that individual can accept it or or or at least be a have an awareness. Have an awareness and and that he works within a department, an athletics department, where it's okay to have. Disagreement. We're going to have disagreement, but we are ultimately all moving towards the same mission and the same goal. And we need to have a healthy environment. And a healthy environment's not always one that everybody's going to agree with everybody. There's going to be disagreement. There's going to be challenging times. But uh I think a healthy culture is that you're able to uh address conflict, have conflict, and move forward as a as a team. So short answer is I think you've got to address it. You've got to talk to that individual or employee about it. Um because you want, you know, you need all the high performers within a department or within a team that you can have.

SPEAKER_01 22:46

This is something that we hear fairly frequently from from folks, staff, faculty across the system of having this situation where you've they've got a colleague or a supervisor or a direct report that is a high performer, but that has a negative net effect on the team dynamic. And our our guidance, and based on the research and books, just like you've said, is that communication, direct confrontation is is vital. But the hard part comes when the person is not willing to change. And and our our insight is at some point a leader that uh accepts that toxic behavior sets the new norm um for the team. And and that can, despite the high performance, can have a long-term net negative for a team. But each situation is unique, but I think that's a common issue that that people across the system are facing.

SPEAKER_00 23:48

Yeah, and I've told um some members of our team, I I think uh as I continue to grow as an as a leader, as an athletics director, I I've said, you know, I believe in the past three years I've gotten I've at least have an awareness now that I am becoming more and more comfortable being uncomfortable. And is that being comfortable having to have those uncomfortable dis discussions, addressing those things, being able to stand in front of an athletics department or sit in front of my boss, the president, and say, I don't, I wish I could see the future. I wish I could tell you and anticipate what this profession is gonna be like in two or three years, but I can't. And I'm okay saying that because there's so many moving parts right now. Yeah, but we're gonna do everything we can to be proactive and to adjust and to make sure that we we put Texas Tech in the very best position that it can be in as we go into these uncharted waters uh of the future that are in front of us.

SPEAKER_01 24:56

Yep. Great. Continuing on the theme of of values. Um I've talked about it on this podcast before, and we've already talked about it a bit here, is that one of the main things that drew me to this job was the reality that the Texas Tech system prioritizes not only the development but the operation operationalization of values that they permeate the entire system and universities within the systems. How do you ensure that decisions align with values when there's external pressure from wherever that might come from? When those that the values may be intentioned with expediency.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

Yeah. Well, I think um that comes from one having a set of guiding principles or core values that are real, um making sure that they are in place, that uh you talk about those. So when times of urgency come or times of conflict come, that uh you you have those guideposts in place. And I think one of the things that's critical is alignment. So when there's external pressure, external pressure to win at any cost, or external pressure to make whatever decision may be in front of us. That I know that President Skuvenic and I are lockstep in what our values are, that we are lockstep in what our goals are and how we're going to operate, that I know with confidence that um Chancellor Creighton is going to be right there as Chancellor Mitchell was to uh support and that our alignments are our um our values are in alignment with one another. And then through the leadership of the Board of Regents, that you know how important they they embrace how visible of a role that intercollegiate athletics plays within higher education. And I think it even goes to our fan base and the Red Raider Nation. And Red Raider Nation, we want to win, but we want to do the right thing. We want to win the right way. We want to play the game aggressively, we want to be a disruptor, but we want to stay between the power the boundaries as well. So, you know, I I believe that the work we do on a daily basis prepares us to make sure we stay between the guidepost of our values when those points of crisis present themselves.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah. Excellent. I'm gonna I'm gonna zig a little bit from from our our strain of conversation thus far, and maybe even from the some of the questions I shared with you. It's been a tough time, uh, stressful, you know, like you've talked about hectic. And what what gives you the most joy about what you're doing? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:00

Um being around our athletes.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

You know, I had an opportunity last uh last weekend to speak at uh the uh Family Promise. It's uh it's an organization here in town that um is addressing homelessness, helping families who need help. And before the event, there was a reception, and Coach Jerry Glasgow and um I think it was six members of our softball team came for the reception and it was a QA answer. And just sitting to the side, watching those young women answer questions from the audience about their experience and about Texas Tech. Um, I just I could not have been more proud of a group of student athletes as I was that evening and the answers and the experience that Texas Tech that they were sharing. Uh, what gives me joy is being in the corner of the locker room, watching that football team celebrate in Arlington after winning that Big 12 conference championship, and then just watching how much they that meant to our fan base. I mean, that was a surreal moment and uh day. And so just watching our athletes have success because I know, you know, we all know this, but I think sometimes as fans, it's easy to be critical of performance on the court or on the field or on the track. But I will never lose sight of how hard it is to win. And I see those athletes every day balancing training, academics, social life, being a young adult. And then when it all comes together and they win at the highest levels or win on a daily basis, that's that's complete joy for me because I tell you this, and and you know, you know this lane, we got good kids, we have great young people at Texas Tech. And I could not be more proud of the um of the athletes that we get to work with and serve every day.

SPEAKER_02 30:10

Yep. Yeah, we're gonna be able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 30:12

And in this environment, people forget that. In the world of NIL, man, boy, they're getting a lot of money, and some of them are, and and that has changed. But you know what? They're still young people, and it's still our responsibility to be a positive influence in their development and to prepare them for their success in life, wherever that might take them.

SPEAKER_01 30:32

Yep. That's great. And that's one of the great things about athletics, about sports in general. I mean, I I I played it my whole life, not at the level you did, but it's just something that they're, you know, you see the fruit of that consistent effort, like you said, winning every day. And when you can have that great success and it all it's all worth it, even then when you don't win. Um, just the fruit of the labor, the pride, the satisfaction that comes with that is really, really powerful.

SPEAKER_00 30:59

Yeah, I'll tell you a quick story. Just this is this is what brings me so much enjoyment and pride. So, JT Toppin, everybody knows. I mean, national player of the year candidate, right? He's one of the top two or three basketball players in our country. And what a an example of the how talented our student athletes are. Last year, I received a call from the 100 black men of West Texas, Reggie Dile, who's become a friend. And Reggie said, I want you to know something that's happening, and this is he doesn't want it to be known, he doesn't want any media attention. But um JT Toppin has aligned uh with us and the community for a turkey giveaway, and he did not want a sponsor for it. He's paying for this all out of his own pocket, NIL, and we've got it set up where we're gonna do a turkey giveaway um in a couple of nights. And you know, the next time I saw Toppin, I said, I'm just so proud of you. And he kind of looked at me and I said, I'm not gonna say a word, but Reggie told me what you were doing, and you know, JT just smiled from ear to ear. And everybody knows what a great basketball player Toppin is, but I will tell you, he is a he is an impressive young man who's gonna have a great career ahead of him and in basketball and then whatever comes out of basketball. But I I guess it's getting to see our athletes behind the scenes, like I saw with seen with JT multiple times, that just make you um make you so proud of uh what our coaches and our communities doing each and every day. Because I tell our uh our fan base, you know, that uh when kids come to recruiting visits, or you ask, um, you know, I'm doing some exit interviews now with student athletes who have spent the last number of years here graduating and move forward. And um, everybody love they all love living in Lubbock, Texas. And I tell our community, they're a part of that, right? They create this home a home away from home environment that just makes it so real and authentic. And it's it's a lot of fun to be a part of that, that side of it.

SPEAKER_01 33:16

That's great. Love to hear it. For you personally, what are what are some habits or routines that that help you stay sharp as a leader?

SPEAKER_00 33:27

You know, you have to take care of yourself. Um and during stressful times or busy times, it can be that can be challenged. But I've always found that that uh I'm the best athletic director, the best husband, the best father. Uh when I make sure I'm getting when I'm exercising. Um exercises aren't as strenuous as uh they they once were. But when I'm getting exercise, uh when I'm getting, if I get seven hours of sleep, uh if I get a little bit of separation and downtime to do what I enjoy doing in my free time, that's when I'm the best athletics director, that's when I'm the best husband, that's when I'm the best dad. So I think you've got to have um you you've you've gotta have balance, and and that's hard, but you gotta you gotta find a way to have balance in your life when you can to be at your very best.

SPEAKER_01 34:23

Yeah. You may it may be a similar answer, but um how do you reset after a tough loss or a major setback?

SPEAKER_00 34:34

You know, um it's it's it's knowing that there's a bigger picture out there, right? When we lost to Oregon, um that hurt. Uh and you know, when Alabama beat us in basketball, that hurt. When LSU beat the Lady Raiders, that hurt. But it's it's a lot bigger than that. It's it's the moments, it's the experience that um you're having with each other, with student athletes, how you're how you're raising the brand profile of Texas Tech. Uh, when you see our television viewership increased 52% in football this year, what I'm seeing is hey, people from the East Coast to the West Coast, they know about Texas Tech. People are tuning in, people are saying, what's going on at Texas Tech? How are they doing this in Lubbock, Texas? So, you know, you you always want to win in this profession. You're not always going to win. So it's about developing young people and it's about raising the profile of Texas Tech so we can continue to grow and we can continue to produce the the very best leaders um in this country. And um, so I want to win as much as anyone, maybe more than anyone, but I know that uh as long as we're prepared and give our best effort, that it's it's even a bigger game than just the wins and losses.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

Yep. That reminds me of a principle from a book called Atomic Habits, one of my favorite books by James Clear. He he talks about when you're developing habits and maybe have a setback, you know, look, don't look at the snapshot of where you are, look at the trajectory of where you were and where you're headed. And that helps bring perspective to a setback that you know you're on the right track. Uh, so keep going.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Absolutely. When I when I came 15 years ago, I said I want to be the very best athletics department in the state of Texas because I know when you're the very best in the state of Texas, you're gonna be relevant nationally. And you know, the University of Texas did not go to the college football playoff this year, Texas Tech did. So it the trajectory of Texas Tech Athletics has never been better. And uh we're gonna continue to build on that each and every day.

SPEAKER_01 36:56

That's great. Uh well, we're we're right up against our our uh our deadline here, and just wanted to um see if you had any final words of advice to listeners across the system and beyond on leadership and and what people can do to continue to press on and succeed.

SPEAKER_00 37:16

Oh, I I I don't I don't know if I have I would have uh advice, but I'll just you know I I used to tell my two boys each and every day the two controllables that you have is attitude and effort. And I would say, you know, we we live in a great place in Lubbock and West Texas, we work at a great university. Um and uh just try to bring a positive attitude and and uh energy to what we do each and every day and uh make tomorrow better than today.

SPEAKER_01 37:49

Yep. That's great. Attitude and effort, and that's that's part of winning every day. Is if you can bring that no matter what the results of today, that'll lead to results at some point down the down the line. I appreciate that. Well, Kirby, thank you so much for joining me. Uh, it's been great to hear about your leadership journey and get practical takeaways that we all can incorporate leading our teams. To those listening, thank you for joining me on the Leader Fast Lane. If today's conversation sparked a moment of reflection or a lane change in how you think about leadership, take a minute to share this episode with someone you lead or learn from. Join me next time when I'll be joined by Andrew Natios, the executive professor at the George H.W. Bush School of Government at Texas AM University. You can find more episodes wherever you get your podcasts. Until next time, keep leading with purpose, integrity, and clarity, especially when it's hard.