Carolyn and Joshua's Insights on Builder-Buyer Communication

Ever wondered how instant communication technologies are reshaping the construction industry? Today, Carolyn and Joshua McMahon return from a brief, unplanned hiatus to share how these advancements are blurring professional boundaries and affecting work-life balance. With a fresh perspective after recharging, they dive into the nuances of after-hours communication between builders and buyers, and why setting clear boundaries is crucial for maintaining healthy relationships both on and off the job.

Communication challenges between white-collar and blue-collar workers pose significant obstacles in the construction field. Joshua opens up about his own experiences of being undermined despite his professionalism, shedding light on systemic issues that need addressing. Respect and clear communication are essential for ensuring every team member feels valued and understood. This segment emphasizes the importance of treating all workers with dignity to attract and retain skilled tradespeople.

Effective communication is key to running a successful construction business. Misunderstandings can arise from different interpretations of messages, but structured communication plans can help bridge these gaps. Carolyn and Joshua praise tools like PhotoCircle for their real-time updates but acknowledge the challenges of meeting all client demands. They discuss the importance of internal team cohesion, high communication standards, and being open to constructive feedback. Wrapping up the episode, they invite you to share your business highs and lows, fostering a community of mutual support and improvement.

Chapters

• 0:03 The Communication Dilemma in Construction
• 12:28 Challenges in Construction Communication
• 17:44 Internal and External Communication in Construction
• 30:44 Business Promotion and Improvement Discussion

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

I love that. I love that.

Speaker 2: 0:05

Hey y'all, Welcome back to another episode of Feed Me your Construction Content. I'm Carolyn McMahon.

Speaker 1: 0:11

And I'm Joshua McMahon.

Speaker 2: 0:12

Hey, people thought we had quit.

Speaker 1: 0:17

Do you really believe they thought we quit?

Speaker 2: 0:20

Well, I mean, the two loyal listeners was like hey, man, what happened to your podcast?

Speaker 1: 0:27

We took a week off.

Speaker 2: 0:30

Yes, unannounced, and unplanned.

Speaker 1: 0:34

We were prepared to jump on the mics and record and I said F it and that was it.

Speaker 2: 0:42

I mean I think you're giving us more credit because I don't even think we were ready. I mean we had nothing left in the tank.

Speaker 1: 0:51

Yeah, I think, just from a professional lifestyle, personal stuff, just everything going on. We're just exhausted. We were burned out. We wanted to show up for you but we couldn't do it.

Speaker 2: 1:02

Yeah, so note to everyone it's okay to take a beat.

Speaker 1: 1:06

That's exactly right and that's what we did, and we hope you're all still there. We'll know in a week. It's all good.

Speaker 2: 1:14

Yes, but good to be back. So you know lots of stuff going on, like you mentioned, but let's just jump right into it.

Speaker 1: 1:22

Yeah, because we can't talk about everything going on in the personal life, but we've got a lot of stuff going on in our personal life and really, really good, positive things. It's so exciting. Can't wait to share that information with you. But here's what we want to jump on the mics and talk about. This is a major frustration for me, and it has been for years, and I'm not going to tell you that the problem or the root of the frustration is the builder suites that make our life so much easier. But I am going to tell you that technology has made things more complicated. Yes, I said it. The construction guy said technology makes our life more complicated, even though it does improve it in some ways.

Speaker 2: 1:59

All right. So let's talk about, let's say something nice about technology. How is it?

Speaker 1: 2:05

improved. Here's the best way you can reach somebody right now. I sent a person a text right before we got on the air at 7.02 pm and I said can you get to this work this week? At my house it's 7.02 at night. I am not expecting him to respond. I would like to say he's not going to read it or see it until the morning. But we all know better than that, because we can reach out and get them right now. So why would I wait?

Speaker 2: 2:32

Well, listen, I mean back in the day, you could still reach somebody. You just actually picked up the phone and left someone a message.

Speaker 1: 2:39

Yeah, when you went to the pay phone. Jesus, we had landlines, oh I thought you were talking about back in the day, your day, ouch. I mean, listen, I have experience with a rotary phone. Yeah, hell, yeah, me too. I would love to have a rotary phone, but we don't need a landline, so why the heck would we have one just for decoration?

Speaker 2: 3:00

Exactly so, right, and I think for me that note about you know you sent them a text. Hopefully they won't, you know, respond to it until the morning, but it's like, hey, I need to get it out real quick before I forget.

Speaker 1: 3:16

Yeah, you can't delay send the text, right? I can delay send email. So if I get up at three in the morning or something crazy, I will delay send the emails because I don't want my people thinking that I'm working at that crazy hour. When I get up at three in the morning or something crazy, I will delay send the emails because I don't want my people thinking that I'm working at that crazy hour. When I get on them for working late or after hours Cause I'm like don't do that stuff.

Speaker 2: 3:31

Well, wait a minute, wait a minute. You just looked at your phone, did he text you back?

Speaker 1: 3:34

He didn't text me, it's somebody else.

Speaker 2: 3:37

See, you see you're looking at your phone, you're glued to your phone, but okay, so then the broader subject with that is with your buyer relationship.

Speaker 1: 3:47

It's a thousand percent what it is. It's the communication between builders and buyers.

Speaker 2: 3:53

Right. So what happens if you send, or the buyer sends you a text after five o'clock and you respond to it? What?

Speaker 1: 4:05

does that do? Oh, you're instantly the moment you respond to it. You are telling them that it is acceptable to text me after hours, the moment you respond or do something after hours. You have made it acceptable.

Speaker 2: 4:17

Right, right, because you've accepted it by responding and now you've set this really bad precedent.

Speaker 1: 4:23

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 4:24

Because once a text goes unanswered after 5 o'clock, does that ruin or help to dilute your relationship? Absolutely, which is so unfair.

Speaker 1: 4:38

It is unfair because at the end of the day, it's a buyer and seller relationship. Yes, it can be transformational, but overall they're not your friend. They're interested in purchasing a product, so you're trying to do it because I'm their friend, they're my friend, we look out for each other. No, they're looking out for what they want and what they need. And you're looking out for what you want, which is money. You want your commission in the sales side. That's fine, but you're setting up everybody down the road for failure, because your level of communication cannot be replicated among every single stakeholder. That's where it gets wrong. So it's easy to say oh, I can communicate, I'm great, I jump in there, I give them the nice fluffy email, I do all that stuff. But does my production team, does my warranty team, does my design team? Do you have to be really careful about how you communicate and how often, because maybe for you it's okay, but it's not okay for somebody else.

Speaker 2: 5:38

Right, because you've set them up.

Speaker 1: 5:41

Yeah, you've set them up.

Speaker 2: 5:42

Your production team and it's like well, I understand, you know I text your boss and he replies to me, but yet you don't.

Speaker 1: 5:50

That's right.

Speaker 2: 5:51

It's like forgive me for protecting my bandwidth.

Speaker 1: 5:55

Well, that's where I think the technology has really hurt us, because it's made it possible to do that and some managers will expect it. I have worked for managers who I said how quick do you want me to respond to things? Oh, similar to the way you do this one immediately. I'm like really, I'm not glued to my phone waiting to get your message. But some people are looking for that level of service. We're not charging anybody for that level of service.

Speaker 2: 6:21

Right. So yeah, Do you have an adder that says I'm going to be at your beck and call?

Speaker 1: 6:26

You know what? That's freaking great. That's the solution. So we put that as an item that you can choose.

Speaker 2: 6:35

Would you like communication during normal Monday through Friday business hours, or would you like an accelerated experience, or whatever?

Speaker 1: 6:44

I'm going to call it the Maytag service. You remember that the Maytag man is just sitting there waiting for your call. Would you like the Maytag service with this package? That package basically means we have somebody sitting around waiting for your message or your question and they instantly get back to you?

Speaker 2: 6:59

Yeah, I mean you'll get a response within the hour, or whatever. I knew this woman in sales and didn't respect her on a lot of levels.

Speaker 1: 7:11

Oh, please share the tea.

Speaker 2: 7:12

But I mean, she said something very interesting. You remember when Circuit City was around?

Speaker 1: 7:18

Yes.

Speaker 2: 7:19

Yeah, so you know selling those extended warranties for the TVs.

Speaker 2: 7:24

Yeah yeah, terrible, nobody wanted to buy them, but she had this great spin. So you know selling, you know those extended warranties for the TV, yeah, yeah, terrible, nobody wanted to buy them, but she had this great spin. She didn't offer you a really a warranty, but she said how much do you want to pay when something goes wrong with your TV and the? You know buyers. Kind of like looking at her cross side Well, what do you mean? Well, why should I have to pay for anything? It's like, well, you wouldn't if you bought this warranty, right? So you tell a buyer, well, how long do you want to wait for a phone call? And if I say, well, I shouldn't have to wait more than an hour, that's great. I'm so glad that you said that to me. We have this service, this concierge service, where we kiss your ass and it's going to cost you an X amount of dollars.

Speaker 1: 8:05

The conversation concierge.

Speaker 2: 8:08

Conversation concierge Right Concierge Concierge.

Speaker 1: 8:11

I'm supposed to be the one bad with vocabulary and I can't even talk.

Speaker 2: 8:16

Yes, yes, yes, I'm usually the one flubbing everything up, but yes, that's what you need and like what we joke about it is, do you want to pay me to be?

Speaker 1: 8:27

your fluffer. Well, that's, that's really what this is getting to. So some of what kind of drove this is, the constant communication with clients and the constant back and forth. You know how you would kind of put your email together and you get all your ideas out. Well, not everybody can get all their ideas out, so they send 15 emails.

Speaker 2: 8:46

Oh God, and I listen, I have, I'm victim, I or I am, I'm to blame for guilty I'm guilty. I'm guilty because I do have a lot of things swirling around and I probably should write them down before I, you know, mouth vomit all over an email and then followed up, and then I forward that email and go oh shit, I forgot to say this and oh Christ, you probably think I'm an idiot and I forgot this. Yeah, I'm that person.

Speaker 1: 9:16

Well, maybe take your time and think about everything you want to do. What do we challenge ourselves with? Who, what, when, why, how? So, as you're doing the email, put all that thought into it and make sure you're getting what you need out of it, and then maybe be okay with waiting for a reply and maybe they answer the questions that you're also thinking of.

Speaker 2: 9:34

Okay, you know. So yeah, waiting is definitely not one of them, but I think where?

Speaker 1: 9:39

I get frustrated with some of this level of communication is that people can be downright nasty, because Mike Tyson would say you know, people are really big. I wish I knew the quote off the top of my head. But basically he's saying everybody's a tough guy on the internet because nobody's there to punch you in the face. And that's what this stuff has created.

Speaker 2: 9:59

Oh right, but is it like a keyboard warrior?

Speaker 1: 10:01

Absolutely. I can talk to you like however I want. I can talk down to you, because you don't exist. But boy, the moment we're face to face, oh, you got a different tune and I think that's a problem, that's a society problem. That's not a problem specifically with builders, although we're builders, so I'm sharing it from a builder perspective.

Speaker 2: 10:19

Oh yeah, but you could be in anything and there's some sort of conflict and it's okay for me to treat you like shit in an email and be real nasty and have this just air of.

Speaker 1: 10:31

I don't know Superiority.

Speaker 2: 10:32

Superiority.

Speaker 1: 10:34

People come across like I'm better than you, and I think that that's a problem. And here's one of the things that I love and I'm trying to figure out a new way of answering it. Customer has question. Hey, you know, I got these gaps in the sod. This is what I'm seeing. How do you fix this? Oh yeah, no problem, here's my answer. Oh yeah, but look, I'm seeing these gaps in the sod. What can you do? Like? Okay, wait a minute. Are you asking me a question? Are you trying to tell me what you want me to do? Because I've answered it and then I answered it again. Then I answered it again and you're still asking me the same question.

Speaker 2: 11:08

So when is it okay to cut through the bullshit and say like, right, get through the bullshit, Tell me what you want.

Speaker 1: 11:19

Well, bullshit. Tell me what you want. Well, that's what I think you have to do. So let me share a story. We got a stop work order in one of our communities from the community complete bullshit. Okay, they don't have any jurisdiction over this. I looked at all their damn guidelines. I've read their manual three or four times. But you talk about superiority. These people carry the freaking like the flag in everything. Okay, I hope they're listening, I don't a crap. They give us and stop work order $5,000 fine, even though none of their guidelines have any of this. So now I say and so this is their grounds for it.

Speaker 1: 11:47

Well, you didn't have the ENS measures in place. I said uh, with all due respect, you could bring DEQ themselves out here and they would say I had my stuff in place the way it's supposed to. So I think you're way off your rocker and you have no bearing on this discussion. So now, when they say, when are you going to do this, I say can you be more clear? Am I in danger of a stop work order? Of fine, my first response was I've got 30 days to remedy that per DEQ guidelines. And here it is in the manual, their manual, which is official government document. Okay, it's official.

Speaker 2: 12:19

But did they have to like adhere or they have to uh no, they do whatever they want.

Speaker 1: 12:24

They're a professional organization. I was fit to be taught talking to these individuals.

Speaker 2: 12:31

Yeah, and you had a great relationship with them. I mean, no, I never had a great relationship.

Speaker 1: 12:35

I was kissing his ass to make to help him think that, hey, we really care and we want to do things right, and I did want to do things right, yeah, you repaired the relationship as best you could. Yeah, two years of kissing this guy's ass, for then him to shove it up my ass.

Speaker 2: 12:50

Are you done?

Speaker 1: 12:52

I will never build another house in that community. The builder I represent might build houses in that community. I will never be a part of building another house in that community period. Are you done? I'm done. That's the best part. So, as I'm talking to the individual and I say, hey, this is my take, so-and-so, his response was are you done? I'm like, yeah, I'm done. I'm the seven-year-old kid, Gramps, Tell me what I need to know. How disrespectful can you be? And I was as respectful as I could be. I was doing everything I could. When I was losing my cool. I said please bear with me, I've lost my cool, Let me get my composure. And they said no problem, Take your time. And I got myself under control again.

Speaker 2: 13:34

Only to be popped in the head again. Hats off to you, because I would be like apoplectic, I mean I would just be foaming at the mouth and I think it's almost like as a parent, like I need to walk away. Otherwise I'm going to do something that you know may be bad.

Speaker 1: 13:50

I'm getting frustrated just thinking about the damn situation, because I can't tell you how many times I sat on these meetings to get my plans pushed through, for them to never have said anything about these items, that they're like these are county requirements. I'm like. It's not in the landscape plan, it's not on the building plans, it was never in the meetings that we had. Where does it come from? Oh, and it's not in your guidelines that you've said you better read those guidelines because I'm going to quiz you on it. Okay, it's not in there. So what am I supposed to do? So we've got this great flow of information, all this communication, all this stuff, but what do you do when the documentation isn't there? Then what the hell are you supposed to do?

Speaker 2: 14:32

I don't know. I'm feeling like we're off topic.

Speaker 1: 14:37

It's all about communication and how people can think it's not even think if it was, think they wouldn't just be doing it the way they do it. People just talk to you like you're beneath them. And I heard this interesting thing from from the owner and he said you know, I'm going to get to speak on this panel and I was like, oh, this is great, that's what we need you doing. And he said they want me to speak about how we get more people into the trades. I said oh, this is easy. White collar people need to stop treating blue collar workers like they're beneath them. That's how you get more people in the industry.

Speaker 1: 15:13

There, I said it. We treat and this is my prime example the person picking up your garbage. You won't say good morning to you, won't say hello to you, won't say good morning to you, won't say hello to you, won't say thank you, because that individual is beneath you. That's a blue collar worker. Why do you think they don't want to go into those industries? Why do you think they don't want to come into construction? Because we treat people poorly who are in that world.

Speaker 2: 15:32

Right. So you know I'm the buyer. I have a multimillion dollar house that I want.

Speaker 1: 15:38

I can't self-perform that, so I need to hire, that's right, you might be the smartest lawyer and the most well-paid lawyer, but without that plumber you don't have a house.

Speaker 2: 15:51

Well, right, and when I need a lawyer, I go hire a lawyer. I don't go hire a plumber to do my legal documents or whatever. But when I need a plumber, I need someone who is skilled in that trade. When I need someone to build my home, I employ someone who's skilled in that trade to do it, and I'll be damn fun to tell them how they need to do their jobs.

Speaker 1: 16:16

But that's where we get things wrong is that you have so many people who do tell the people installing the toilet or fixing the leak how to do it, and it's the way we talk to them that makes the problem. And that's where I'm coming back full circle. The communication, the text messages, emails, all these forms. We can say things however we want. We can add the tone, we can say we can't read tone through email or text Bullshit. You know what somebody's saying. You know when they're pissed off Some people. You have a hard time reading tone because maybe there's no tone intended. Right, because my messages are short, but it doesn't mean I'm mad, I'm just trying to be direct.

Speaker 2: 16:53

Right, right, and that's your style and that will always be your style. I have a hard time, you know, fluffing up an email and I feel almost sometimes when I'm in email mode, that my correspondence is not clipped, but it's very formal. Yeah, what did you say? That you want to keep everything in an email concise and things. You know they take your house to court.

Speaker 1: 17:18

Well, everything I want to do is to prepare for court now. I hope I never have to go to court, but it's like if I say something, I'm okay with it showing back up in the court of law, right, because I'm not. I don't feel like I'm saying anything that's gonna hurt me or hurt my, my client or anybody else right that's not my intention. Now you can take something out of context and make it out to be something harmful, but that is not my intent.

Speaker 2: 17:42

Well, right, but the same thing. Like who's gotten in trouble texting their spouse. And they're like well, what do you mean? You said this in a text and you read your text and you're like well, I said this.

Speaker 1: 18:04

And it's like oh, do I want to go? Yeah, I want to go, and he's like you know, out to the bar, and it's just the the way they were taking the text message out of context. And one guy's like, oh, you know, we're having a good conversation. The other guy's pissed off.

Speaker 2: 18:13

But the other guy has no idea yeah, you're just completely clueless to the situation, but yeah so. But what happened this evening is that there was a comment made about you know, it seems that you're frustrated in communicating you know and who has you know in our business, what type of communication or what program, what we I trying to say about how you communicate with a client, when, during what hours? Is it weekly communication If someone calls?

Speaker 2: 18:48

you midweek with a problem? Do you talk to them? Do you really try to fit them back into the mold of hey, I've acknowledged your email or I've acknowledged your call. We're going to talk about this more in depth on this predetermined date that we've, you know, we've agreed to.

Speaker 1: 19:07

I think that's some of the frustration I guess I have when it comes to the communication, because you have the suites right the builder suites where you can communicate through them, or you have email or you have text, and then what we're doing this is just only for us. We'll do that communication throughout the week with clients. We're also uploading pictures throughout the week as they're happening. Shout out to my boy, christian, who said get this PhotoCircle app. This app is genius, it's free. You set up a project for each one, you share it with the clients. They get the pictures in real time. It's brilliant.

Speaker 1: 19:40

And then on Fridays, we send a weekly update newsletter, if you will. This is what happened this week. This is where we might be stuck. These are selections that you need to be focused on. Whatever the case may be, we try and get all of it in there. It's not enough. For some clients it's not enough and you're like okay, so what else do you do? So where I'm at my frustration with it is I have plenty of Monday morning quarterbacks telling me oh, you got to do this, you got to do that, and it's like great, thank you. But I don't have anyone saying why don't you let me do that. What if this person does that? It's easy to critique and bring people down, but it's really damn difficult to have ownership and accountability of something and take it because if I don't like your communication style with buyers do I still think you're a great designer. So I'm going to fire you because you don't do a good job of communicating with buyers, but you're the best damn designer I've got.

Speaker 2: 20:40

Well, right, and at the same time it's like what did you hire me to do? I?

Speaker 1: 20:44

hired you to design, do some selections, do that stuff. So I'm going to find somebody to help with the communication. So my point is if other people see an issue with communication, we need someone to step up. You don't need more people managing one person, because it's not going to make it better.

Speaker 2: 21:01

You just you know, but you need to be the total package. You got to be the total package you can't have any issues, any chinks in your armor, anything.

Speaker 1: 21:13

Well, as we discuss this and as I think more about it, I want to define what a customer is and what's a customer to you I mean, I would imagine a customer or someone that pays for goods and service. Hell yeah, that's a customer okay, yay but who else is a customer?

Speaker 2: 21:31

A vendor.

Speaker 1: 21:32

Who else?

Speaker 2: 21:33

Oh Christ.

Speaker 1: 21:36

Well, let's think about it Sales sells the house.

Speaker 2: 21:38

Yes.

Speaker 1: 21:38

Who's their customer?

Speaker 2: 21:40

The buyer.

Speaker 1: 21:41

That's one customer. But what do they have to deliver internally? They take their sales package and they bring it back to the office. Who does it go to? It goes to your construction lead so they can do red lines. It goes to your purchasing department so they can do purchase orders. It comes to the designer so you can do design selections.

Speaker 2: 21:55

It goes to your president to sign the contract.

Speaker 1: 21:57

So that piece of documentation goes to several internal customers and what we fail to realize is the customer is not only the person paying the bills, the customers are also internal. Why don't we have the same communication standards with internal customers, in other words, for the people who think that, oh, if you just did this, would the communication be better. Well, what if I shared the same level of communication I get from people with you? Would you be okay with that if I had the same style? So the point is we can have sympathy for our customers Our customers are paying the bills but we need to have sympathy for our internal customers too, because ultimately, your internal customers and everybody that's touching your flywheel is what makes your business successful. One piece of that flywheel breaks off, you create a problem.

Speaker 2: 22:48

Well, okay. So when someone says something like that to you, are you receptive to ideas Like cool, you want to come at me with?

Speaker 1: 22:56

how.

Speaker 2: 22:56

I suck at this.

Speaker 1: 22:58

That's ultimately what I want. I don't need you to tell me hey, you suck, Okay, got it. Thank you. Now what? No, no, that was it. I just want to tell you you suck, Okay, got it yeah. I don't have anything real for you, I just have some?

Speaker 2: 23:11

Yeah, Can I give you some feedback? I Melody Hackett. That's exactly right, I'm going to give you some feedback. You know sticking up your ass, but right, it's so, but you have to be open.

Speaker 1: 23:24

If you're open-minded and adaptive, if you, if you have a need to improve. A need or.

Speaker 2: 23:37

Need to improve, a need or need? Okay, like I'm driven to improve, you can admit that this is where I struggle.

Speaker 1: 23:41

I might not like it, but if I think about it for a second and I will always think about it I'm going to realize oh yeah, shit, they're right, I've got to do better at that.

Speaker 2: 23:49

Right and so cool that you know. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. I suck, I got it. What do you have for me?

Speaker 1: 23:57

right, because if you're not part of the solution, you're a part of the problem that's the point and that's what I think we need more of, because communication is coming at our people at a record pace. Covid, we saw burnout and said, oh, it's not real, it's all bullshit. Okay, we're going to start seeing it again, especially as the market starts to tighten. Stress is going to get higher. People are going to be more wound up. It's going to be more challenging. We got to figure out how to deal with this stuff.

Speaker 2: 24:28

Yeah, it's funny. You know, months ago it does backfire. You could be the most amazing communicator, but once there is a pause in your communication, Dead. Oh my God, it's like I thought someone thought that I had died. Like, is she okay? I haven't heard from her.

Speaker 1: 24:47

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 24:48

You know, I think I forgot to. Oh God, I was setting my out of office and I just forgot to turn it on. And this was before when I made this stance, that I was not getting my email on my phone. No way, I mean, I resisted.

Speaker 1: 25:03

You were dug in.

Speaker 2: 25:04

I dug in for a year. I didn't.

Speaker 1: 25:06

You should go back to it. Those emails will be there tomorrow, I bet you.

Speaker 2: 25:11

Yeah, they will. But it was so funny because one of my best clients man, she was wrapped around the axle, she was beside herself that I had not called her and when I got back and I realized what had happened, I called her. I'm like Audrey, you know better. I was out of town and I forgot to turn my out of office in. It's just, but it's almost used against you.

Speaker 1: 25:38

Well, yeah, because she wasn't worried that something happened to you. Did Carolyn lose her job? No, she was pissed off. You didn't respond to her. I mean, you know you telling that story made me think about this thing. So when we had a loss in the family, I sent a message to clients saying, hey, I'm sorry, and now, mind you, I'm doing my job as director of construction, but I'm also managing 18 homes. Because that's what we needed to do at the time. I sent a message to all the buyers and said hey, I'm really sorry, I had a loss in the family. I'm going to get back to you next week. I had this great customer respond. Does that mean nothing got done this week? You cannot make this stuff up. I'm at my lowest point in my entire life. And that's the response from a buyer.

Speaker 2: 26:26

Right, and do you unload on them and make them feel like shit Because you kind of want to.

Speaker 1: 26:34

No, I didn't.

Speaker 2: 26:34

I know you didn't, you took the high road but, man, at that moment I may have done something different.

Speaker 1: 26:43

You know, I took the high road. It doesn't matter, I don't want to get into it all, but I took the high road. That's the way I do, that's what I normally do, and I find fault in whatever I'm doing. The high road that's the way to do, that's what I normally do, and I find fault in whatever I'm doing and I need to do something different because obviously I let this person down Right and I think that's what overarching, that's what's frustrating about the communication today, and well, right, the the communicating after five what that means to your family.

Speaker 2: 27:08

You know, we just had Amy McGorian on, you know, from town bank a couple of weeks ago and she was talking about, you know, having a career, raising a family, doing things you know, outside of normal business hours. It's kind of what's expected of you, things that you do and, granted, you set the parameters, you respond when you need to, but at the same time people just don't appreciate what you do. I let a text go on Friday because, honestly, there was nothing I could do about it, nothing. And the buyer sent another text to me and the superintendent on Saturday, again, great, it's information. I love how you taught me. It's just information, carolyn. And so Monday I mean, I was on it on an email, I had talked to the superintendent, I sent her a note and I'm like, hey, we're engaged with the vendor, just wanted to let you know. But in that moment it was not imperative for me to respond and for me I'd respond and then forget about it because it no longer looks like it's red or whatever that's right.

Speaker 2: 28:14

But I didn't feel bad and before it could have been bad because I'd set myself up, because I often would reply to her and honestly, I don't give many people my cell phone. Anyway, it's my personal phone. I'm not reimbursed from it.

Speaker 2: 28:30

Then you shouldn't give that number out and people should not feel comfortable reaching out to you on that I know, and it's fun, I joke and I'm like, hey, this is my cell phone number, use it for good, not evil. That's usually you know what I preface it with, but it's, it's self-serving. You know, the only time I do that is if it's self-serving. I was like, hey, I need a quick answer. I'm gonna text you and you know so. That often the case. But it's just funny again, just how people are so willing to turn on you.

Speaker 1: 29:00

Well, it's the way of the world, right? I mean, that's what we're seeing and, uh, you're not going to change that. I think for us as builders, as communicators, we got to keep our heads up. We got to keep lifting each other up. Stop tearing one another down. It's not easy on anybody in the industry right now. We need to look out for each other.

Speaker 2: 29:20

And be okay to thank folks for bringing it to your attention that you suck. Thank you for that information. I'd like to challenge you with coming up with a solution.

Speaker 1: 29:33

That's the key Come with solutions. If all you're doing is bringing people down or telling them how they suck, you're taking a low road. You're not a leader, you're a manager, and it's not effective.

Speaker 2: 29:46

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 29:46

It's not effective. Short term it's not effective. Long term is damn sure not effective.

Speaker 2: 29:50

For sure.

Speaker 1: 29:50

And you're. You know, everybody get theirs when it comes to that.

Speaker 2: 29:55

Right. So folks in the industry, if you have something that works, is it clearly defined at the beginning of the process and you tow the line the entire time. You set boundaries, you have something on your email that says when you'll respond to something, your voicemail when you respond to something, and then you know, do folks respect it because you actually do what you say you're gonna do? I mean, I'd love, I'd love to know yeah, me too. Let's do it heck, yeah, so we're back you don't sound so excited I mean we, I'm excited hell.

Speaker 2: 30:31

Hell yeah, we're back. We're back For now.

Speaker 1: 30:36

Not for now.

Speaker 2: 30:37

I think we're back for a while we're back, we're trying to get some cool guests on. Yeah, you know what, if you're in the industry.

Speaker 1: 30:44

You want to jump on the mics? We make it super easy for you, let's go. We want to talk about your business. You want to promote your business? Let's do it. Let's talk about what you're doing great.

Speaker 2: 30:54

Heck yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:55

You want to talk about pisses you off, let's talk about it.

Speaker 2: 30:57

Or what you're not doing so well and maybe we can help you.

Speaker 1: 30:59

Let's definitely talk about what you're not doing well.

Speaker 2: 31:03

Make us feel better about ourselves. Okay, until next week.

Speaker 1: 31:12

See ya yeah.