Take It To The Board with Donna DiMaggio Berger
Take It To The Board with Donna DiMaggio Berger
Screening Vendors and Service People for Enhanced Security
What's the point of gates, guards, and security cameras if you're letting hundreds of unscreened workers into your community? On this week’s episode of Take It To The Board podcast, host Donna DiMaggio Berger talks with security expert Mark Hall to reveal the alarming blind spot in most residential communities' protection plans.
After spending over two decades in law enforcement, Mark identified a critical vulnerability: communities invest heavily in perimeter security while opening their gates to thousands of unknown service providers each year. This realization, coupled with a horrifying incident where an air conditioning technician with a criminal record took a family hostage, led him to create the Safe Communities Vendor ID Program.
The program's findings are eye-opening. Since 2016, they've identified and prevented 81 registered sex offenders and over 900 recently convicted burglars and thieves from accessing participating communities.
Donna and Mark walk listeners through the program's three-tiered screening protocol, which includes five-year bans for theft-related offenses, ten-year bans for violent crimes, and lifetime bans for sexual offenders and homicide perpetrators. They explain how the program accommodates immigrant workers through foreign government ID verification, addresses identity verification challenges, and operates without cost to associations or residents.
If your community is serious about security, listen now to learn how you can close this critical gap.
Conversation Highlights Include:
- The security gaps in the marketplace that inspired the creation of the Safe Communities Vendor ID program
- Details on the program’s screening protocols
- How Safe Communities communicates with vendors after screening employees, including reports and follow-ups
- Addressing concerns about second chances for individuals with prior convictions
- The frequency with which employers fail to use rigorous screening protocols
- Training programs and ongoing evaluations offered to vendors to stay updated on best practices
- Safeguards in place to avoid mistaken identity and minimize legal liability
- How the program has grown since its inception in 2016
- Vendor screening expansion into industries beyond community associations
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Hi everyone, I'm attorney Donna DiMaggio-Berger and this is Take it to the Board where we speak condo and HOA. Many private residential communities take multiple steps to ensure a certain level of security for their residents. These steps can include screening new purchasers and tenants, installing electronic or manned gates, security cameras, lighting and even roving patrols. However, one piece of the security puzzle that is often overlooked is screening the workers who regularly come into your community. A typical private residential community can have hundreds of different service people on their property in any given year Landscapers, sprinkler repairs, pool service, plumbers, electricians, construction crews, valets and more. Many of these folks are honest, hardworking and crucial to providing essential community services. However, some individuals can present threats to the health, safety and welfare of community residents, and the goal is to prevent those problems before they occur.
Speaker 1:My guest today wants to discuss the serious consequences that can result when a company with whom your community does business or with whom a resident does business fails to screen the employees or subcontractors they send into your community. Mark Hall is the founder of Safe Communities, a business he started in 2016. Since inception, he has processed over 100,000 vendors through his Safe Communities Vendor ID program. Mark is going to tell us today about a number of workers who have been convicted of burglary, theft and violent crimes, including sexual offenses, who have been prevented from accessing communities through his Safe Vendor program, and why community association boards need to start including vendors in the conversation when they think about security concerns confronting their communities. So with that light topic, mark, welcome to Take it to the Board.
Speaker 2:Thanks, Donna. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1:So, Mark, what were the gaps in the security marketplace that you identified and which inspired you to create this whole program, the Safe Communities Vendor ID Program.
Speaker 2:Well, what occurred was I had spent 20 plus years in law enforcement and once I retired from that career, I got into the private sector and I worked as the director of security for eight years at Frenchman's Creek in Palm Beach Gardens, who has an extremely high level of security, and they actually have their own in-house program where they have their vendors go through criminal background check, driver's license check, and they are one of only probably two or three communities that I'm aware of in the state that do that. So once I became a security director and I transitioned out of law enforcement into the private sector and I saw how the operations were and I saw all of these vendors literally thousands a year come through the gates of these gated communities and I really thought that you know the gated communities are gated, they build walls and fences and they install security cameras with video analytics and you know you have to have guest lists and party lists to be able to get in and there's all of these security measures that are taken, which are important and necessary, but then they open their gates to thousands of unknown persons to work in their homes, around their homes and around their community every day, and I saw that as a huge, huge weakness in the security of these communities. What ultimately occurred was there was a story in the Palm Beach Post where an air conditioning contractor had arrived to a single mom's home with two children to service the air conditioning. This was in a community in Boynton Beach and ultimately this AC contractor took the mom hostage and the kids hostage, taped them up and locked the mom in the bathroom and the kids in the bathroom, took her cell phone and ultimately she was able to grab her iPad and from the bathroom while being locked in the bathroom iPad and from the bathroom. While being locked in the bathroom, she was able to message people and get law enforcement in route and was able to prevent anything from happening. As it turned out, they obviously knew who this was because she could. She call a company for service and they sent out a technician. So law enforcement easily located the suspect. It turned out the suspect had a history of being a Pete and Tom and other offenses, theft and things of that nature that, whether the employer or not did a background. He was ultimately hired and this incident occurred.
Speaker 2:It was that incident that actually brought on the thought process as to what could be done, and ultimately not only what could be done, but what's the easiest way for this to occur, and obviously the Internet and having web-based programs are the easiest in order to implement something like this. So what we did was we developed a website implement something like this. So what we did was we developed a website, we created a criteria and we made it to where the community just required it of the vendors, and they sent the vendors to our website. The vendors would then fill out an application. We would then run a criminal background check, a driver's license check as well, and then, if they met the criteria, they could be issued our IDs. They then use that ID to enter the community.
Speaker 1:Gotcha. Well, let me stop you there, because we've already covered a lot of territory, Mark, including the scary story you started with, which really does drive home the point that you can have the best security in the world, but if you're not also extending some sort of vigilance when it comes to the hundreds of people who enter these communities. I think about where I live. I live in a HOA. We have 24-hour guard gate, manned guard gate, perimeter walls, very safe community, but on any given day, there are a lot of people in the neighborhood doing work. As I said in the intro, a lot of these people are honest, hardworking, great people. But if you did have somebody in the neighborhood who shouldn't be there, it can be a problem because they're already past your gate, they're already inside your walls.
Speaker 1:I'm sitting there listening to you about the story with the woman at home with the two young kids, and you know all of us now, I shouldn't say all of us, but some of us listen to all these true crime documentaries on the streaming platforms and I'm thinking about how a lot of the serial killers are always, you know, posing, as you know, electricians. They're out there working on the lines. You know what have you. So, yeah, it really does send a chill down your spine. Are you saying, though, let's say, an association decides to use the program, they would have to run that before they decide to do business with that vendor. Is that correct?
Speaker 2:So the way it works is you know, the vendors won't know that the community is requiring this. So what they do is we actually provide them with a three by five card with English on one side and Spanish on the other, that says we're implementing this program in this community. It tells about the program. Please fill out your application and apply for your ID card. Now what most communities do is they do give the vendors a leeway initially. So what they'll do is it's typically they do what's called a three strikes and you're out. So once they have given you that information card and the vendor takes it back to his employer, it explains the program. If there's any questions, they call us directly. They don't call the property manager, they don't call the security director. We have English and Spanish speaking staff that will answer their questions and what occurs at that point is if they go online, get their ID and we process these backgrounds, they'll get their ID anywhere from one to three business days.
Speaker 1:Okay, I was going to ask you that whether this slows down the process. But every employee let's say we're talking about a landscape crew Are you telling me, Mark, that every individual who's going to be entering the community needs to get that safe vendor ID, every single one?
Speaker 2:Yes, so it's everybody in that vehicle, whether it be one person or five people, they would all be required to get the ID. So typically, once they've been handed the information form, then they come back the next time. The officer at the gate will say hey, do you have your safe communities vendor ID? No, I don't have it yet. Ok, well, strike one. You know, please make sure you get it, because you're not going to be able to keep doing this.
Speaker 2:They come back two days later and again the security officers will be asking all of the vendors for their IDs and if they don't have it the second time, they'll tell them strike two. On a third strike, you will typically be denied access. The resident will be contacted and told that hey, you know about the program because the property management will have already, you know, educated the community about the program and implementation of it. And then, if they don't get it, on the third one, what we have found over with our over 100,000 people who've participated in the program those who don't get it are typically the ones who won't qualify. They won't meet the criteria.
Speaker 1:So they know what you're looking for, mark. They know that you're screening them for possible threats. Okay, so I have a few questions. Let's say that somebody let's say it's a landscape crew, let's use again that example and somebody calls in sick the night before, so they got a temp worker in there. That temp worker is not going to be enough time to get him or her screened, so that goes under the first strike, correct? And what you're saying is make sure if this temp worker is going to come back, we need them screened, okay.
Speaker 2:There has to be a reasonableness to it. I will tell you this we have a couple communities that you only get one strike with that. They're very strict on the implementation of the program. Once they've informed the vendors, then they have to have that ID to the vendors ahead of time and the vendors don't get a strike one. All the vendors who work in that community it's an extremely high-end community they have to have that card or that ID I'm sorry the first time they come on property in order for them to work into the community.
Speaker 2:So each of the communities who adopt this program implement it as they see fit. They develop their own policies and procedures. We help them and we give them sample policies and procedures from the other communities how they've done it and then they determine, based on what they feel is best for their community, how exactly they want to implement it, how many times or chances they want to give a vendor. Some say one, most of them again do the three strikes and you're out. They want to be reasonable. The idea here with the program is not to prevent vendors from getting on property, it's actually let's get them on, and let's get them on in a very expeditious manner. So the screening is important, but getting the vendors to the residents is equally as important.
Speaker 1:Now this applies in, I guess, most communities to the owner's vendors as well. Let's say whether I'm in an HOA and the motor on my fountain just in my backyard just blew out. I need to get a repairman out In some communities. I'm going to have to submit my repairman's credentials through your program and he or she's going to have to be screened. Is that correct?
Speaker 2:So if it's their first time and they're only coming to the community one time for two hours to fix your fountain, they wouldn't be required to get the ID. What the thought process is is it's really for these vendors who are in and out of your property on a regular basis. They get to know the ins and outs of the community, the ebb and flow of the residents, when they're there, when they're not there, when they're on vacation, when the kids are at school, when they're there, when they're not there, when they're on vacation, when the kids are at school, when everybody's at work. That is, what's most important is making sure that the people who are there all the time are the ones who you're doing backgrounds on.
Speaker 1:Although you could, Mark, have an outlier. You could hire Ted Bundy to come out one time to fix the fan. No, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Just like the air conditioning technician that I told you about. That was kind of the reason for our program starting. You can absolutely have that.
Speaker 1:I assume you let clients know that this screening is not going to cover everything and those one-off events which you know, not only with the one-offs, but say they've been through our screening.
Speaker 2:You know, in our agreement with the community, it's very clear that just because they've cleared a background check doesn't mean they won't commit a crime. Just because they've cleared a driver's license check doesn't mean they won't get out and get their driver's license suspended. So it's very clear out and get their driver's license suspended. So it's very clear. Obviously, we've had very good attorneys, like your firm, review the program and make sure that both our company and the client are very clear on what the expectations are and how this works. And it's really, you know, compared to what's happening now.
Speaker 2:For example, in almost every community you have to show a driver's license in order to get in, whether you're a guest or you're a vendor. Well, just because somebody provides you with a physical driver's license, that doesn't mean it's valid. But with our system, when we show our ID, our ID will say they're either a driver or a non-driver. We actually check them in the DHSMV database. So when ours says driver, you know that's a valid driver's license. And then ultimately, these vendors are checked every 12 months. So every 12 months we're running a new background check and every 12 months we're running a new driver's license check so that you know that nothing's happened in that last year that would disqualify them.
Speaker 1:So tell me, Mark, about the type of vendors you've screened.
Speaker 2:Sure. So in our agreement with the community we define a vendor as anyone who provides a service for a fee. So you kind of ran down the list when you opened up the podcast and it's anything from housekeepers to landscapers, to carpenters, to electricians it's anybody again who provides that service for a fee. And the other thing, the other element, to it's vendors that are going to typically be in that community more than three to five times a year. Now, as we said, some communities you get one shot and once you've been told about the program you have to have it. Others, they give a little leeway and it's usually again the three strikes and you're out. But if that vendor is going to continue to come back to the property, they're required to do it.
Speaker 1:Is there anyone who's exempt? What about your accountant or me? Do I need to be screened? Yeah?
Speaker 2:If you're going to be there, say, on a monthly meeting, you technically would be somebody who would have to be screened. Now, there are exceptions and remember, this is just a tool and the community determines how they want to use this tool. So, for example, people who don't or are not required in most communities to get our ID, it's going to be your UPS drivers, your FedEx, your you know, your delivery drivers.
Speaker 1:DoorDash.
Speaker 2:DoorDash, yes, the tractor trailers that come delivered to the clubhouse, things of that nature. There's a whole list of them. Obviously, your government entities, your utility companies, you know to dig, trenching and do other work. So the subcontractors of utility companies and some of these other entities, they do require them to go through our program, but for the most part the community creates a list. We give them a sample list, kind of a best practices based on the communities who currently do it, and they go down that list and they make and create their own policy and then they train their officers on it and the officer administers it.
Speaker 1:Got it. Hopefully they will exclude their friendly community association attorney if he or she is going out frequently. But who knows, you could have somebody go crazy. Obviously you're checking criminal background. What else do your screening protocols cover?
Speaker 2:So the background it accesses, as anybody does that. We do the same or run the same style of background as you would if you were getting hired for a new job. So if you were getting hired at your firm and your firm does normal, say, background, drug tests, things of that nature you use a third party provider to gather criminal background data on that possible new hire and then you review it to see if they they qualify the provider that we use the third-party provider. We do our background checks. They use everything from your local records, your state records, your jails, your county prisons. They gather data from all over. So they have millions and millions of data points where they're drawing this information on a regular basis county clerk's office. And then, if there's any question, what we do is we actually go in because we're based in Florida. Florida has a very liberal information let's say freedom of information, so to speak. So if there's any question as to the background or the disposition, we actually go into the clerk of the court in that county, search for the arrest document and go through and see what ultimately the outcome was to make sure that everything's accurate. Or if there's any questions, but the backgrounds are broken down into really three areas or three levels because Because again, we don't want to stop people from working and ultimately we studied a Bureau of Justice Administration's recidivism report to try and get a handle on how long before somebody you know reoffends under certain crimes.
Speaker 2:So certain crimes like robbery, burglary, theft, those things dealing in stolen property. What the statistics showed for recidivism was that if they were going to do it again, they would do it within five years, they would reoffend within five years and then typically, once that five-year mark hit, the statistics really just dropped off to near nothing. So you know, they grew up, they got married, they found religion. Whatever the case may be, they weren't reoffending and committing those crimes. So as long as you haven't been again, you have to have been either convicted or pled to the crime.
Speaker 1:Plead guilty.
Speaker 2:Well, took some type of plea agreement.
Speaker 1:Even a NOLO. Even a NOLO contendere where you're.
Speaker 2:It depends. So if you've taken any type of plea, including NOLO, contendere or no contest, and you've accepted responsibility for that whether it's through pretrial intervention plea or probation agreements, pretrial diversionary program, adjudication withheld, it doesn't matter. If you've accepted responsibility for whatever the charge was, if it's one of those disqualifying charges within the timeframe, then you can't have our ID. Now, if five years have passed and you haven't reoffended in any of one of the crimes we just discussed, then you are eligible.
Speaker 1:Is the five years? Is that the time frame?
Speaker 2:Well, that's the time frame for the types of crimes we discuss. So the robbery, burglary, theft, Right the petty theft.
Speaker 1:For this category, does it matter if the person who committed that crime was a minor at the time?
Speaker 2:So minor records aren't accessible unless you're a law enforcement official and have that database, and obviously we don't. We pull from public databases. So if you were adjudicated an adult, if you were younger than 18 and you were charged as an adult, yes, we would see that, but typically, no, we won't see any juvenile records.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking you know the misspent youth and then, like you said, they grow up and because, listen, I'm sure there's people who will criticize and say, hey, does this program prevent felons from having a second chance? Don't we want to help people get on the right path and get a job?
Speaker 2:No and listen. We've spoken and had people call in and talk to us, especially at the beginning, about that and the concerns over that. And that's really where we utilize the Bureau of Justice Administrations recidivism report and said you know, it's not like we pulled this out of the air. We actually did some research to determine when this kind of dissipates, so to speak, in a person's life and that's why we picked the five years, because we do not want to prevent people from working, but it's also for aggravated crimes of violence, like aggravated battery or assault, aggravated stalking or felony battery. So as long as you haven't done that or any of the thefts in the last five years, then you are absolutely eligible for RID. Okay, Now we move into the 10-year mark. What have you done? That's less than 10 years. That's going to get into things like felony child abuse, sexual assault or battery, unlawful sexual activity, lewd lascivious offenses or indecision, exposure, manslaughter with intentional physical violence and video voyeurism. You cannot have been convicted or pled to any of those crimes in the last 10 years. So those are obviously much more serious crimes and you know we do have those Now, some of them having been in law enforcement, I know that some of these charges and it's the one the one is specific is the lewd and lascivious offense.
Speaker 2:A lot of times that is charged to someone who gets caught if they've been drunk and they go and pee in the bushes in the park, it's just because there was no peeing in the bushes offense in the statute book, so they would be charged with lewd and lascivious. So anytime we see lewd and lascivious, we actually go pull up the probable cause affidavit and we see what it was. Now, if it was due to exposing yourself to somebody, well then you're not going to get our ID. If it was peeing in the bushes, you absolutely are going to get our ID. And again it goes back to that reasonable standard. If a guy peed in the bushes, I don't care, he can work in around my home, but obviously if he exposed himself to somebody, that's not somebody I want working in or around my home. So those are the 10-year crimes, and then there's the lifetime crimes.
Speaker 1:There's the lifetime ban. What's the lifetime ban, Mark?
Speaker 2:So registered sex offenders or predators, solicitation of a minor for prostitution or sexual related crimes or associated offenses, possession or transmission of child pornography or associated offenses, human trafficking, child prostitution and homicide. So those are the things that, regardless of how long it's been, we just don't allow that. Now all of our clients and all the communities who come on board, they all know what these charges are in the time frames and they all agree that they are in agreement with this list. We do have some communities that will ask from time to time if a charge can be added, and we do that. We didn't see certain charges for three or four years into our program and when we came upon them the staff said OK, this is one of those you know we need to make a decision on. So it is understood with our clients that there will be time to time that we add charges to the denial or the denial criteria list in order to keep them safe and their residents safe and they're notified anytime we do add something new.
Speaker 1:Can a community override your Safe Vendors Program? For instance, even with the homicide, they could come and say you know what? This is so-and-so's cousin. We know this person. That was a justifiable homes, whatever it is. Can they override your program?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. You are in control of your community. So there are some communities that have what they call an exception list and we actually have one community in, you know, with the over 100,000 people we process this one community. Within the first three weeks they implemented the program, we identified eight registered sex offenders. Yes, so this told us a few things. One it told us that obviously, these employers aren't doing background checks, or they're doing background checks and they don't care. I don't think it's that If they were going to do a background check, you know, and also they didn't really even have to do a background check. All they would have had to have done is Google the name and it would have popped up. So it was reaffirmation for us that the program was absolutely necessary and relevant and that employers aren't really doing background checks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I find that shocking. You know you're talking about construction crews. Now we've got so many of our clients that are undertaking major concrete restoration, major roof repairs, painting and waterproofing In some of these larger communities. Those are projects that go on for many weeks or months, sometimes over a year. You know, for an employer you're talking about a potential negligent hiring claim and I wanted to ask you about that. So let me back up for a second. You find you do your screening and let's say we're talking about a roofing company, and you find two employees One is in the five-year timeframe in terms of problems, one's in the 10-year. Who do you tell that information to? You? Tell it to the association and to the vendor. Hey, these two guys out of a crew of 30, they're not getting the ID. Is that how that works?
Speaker 2:No, that's a great question. So we are an FCRA compliant organization and the FCRA is the Fair Credit Reporting Act, which you think. Well, we're not doing credit checks? No, we're not, but under the FCRA the federal government says criminal background checks are part of what they consider under their domain when it comes to the FCRA rules and regulations. So what we've done is all of our staff go through the most intense training with Background Screeners Association and they get certified as the background screener and then every two years they have to get updated and get recertified.
Speaker 2:We do not distribute backgrounds. We're not a credit reporting agency. The only people that we can divulge the background to is the person who applied for it. So under FCRA guidelines, when someone does not qualify, we have certain responsibilities. So we have to inform the person in writing and this goes out in a letter that they've been denied because of their background. We give them a copy of the background that we used to make that decision. We give them a link to all of their rights under the FCRA and then we give them a form that, if something in the background that we've shown them that we use to make the decision is inaccurate, it's a correction form that we then submit to our background provider and they by law have to correct that background.
Speaker 2:So say, for example, you had someone apply for a background and his brother used his name and birth date and got convicted or pled to something and now that's on his background. In order to clear that up or clean that up, we use this process and it's their right and we have had there's only been one or two that I can think of in almost nine years where someone has used someone else's ID and the charge on their background was incorrect. Someone else's ID and the charge on their background was incorrect and it wasn't incorrect because of anything we did or the company did. It was because somebody used their ID. It was a situation with really ID theft. So once our background provider investigates, it goes back to the source, checks everything out. If it needs to be corrected, they remove it from the reporting they do and they inform us that it's no longer on there and then you'll be issued that ID.
Speaker 1:If you do the background and let's say it's not an issue of identity theft but the person doesn't pass, let's say it's the lifetime ban, they don't get three strikes, they're just not getting the card. And do you let the front you know access control know this is not a first strike situation, this is a this person cannot be allowed in.
Speaker 2:So they have access to our database. They can actually have a lot username and login where they can actually pull up all of the vendors that are applying to come into their community or have our ID and they can actually look and see what the status is, if it's pending, if it's denied or if it's approved. It's limited what they can see. So they can see the name of the vendor, the company, and whether it's approved, denied or pending. So they can have access directly to our database and check that anytime they want, which is also the beauty.
Speaker 2:You know, if somebody came to currently, if somebody came to a gatehouse and they didn't have their ID with a driver or they didn't have their driver's license with them, most of the time that community is not going to let them enter With ours, if you give your name and date of birth, they can look right in the database and see. They can look right in the database and see. And not only can they see whether it's approved or not, but a photo of their ID pops up with their picture and their information. So now, even if you forgot your ID, we can verify it based on our program and the ID that we've issued and they can get them into the community.
Speaker 1:So, Mark, what do you do when you're trying to screen people who have no records here in the United States? They've come from another country, they just got here and you really? There's nothing in these domestic databases you can find about them.
Speaker 2:That's another big question that comes up with the boards and the communities. The first question that comes up is we're going to lose all of our immigrant labor force.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Non -US.
Speaker 1:I want to ask you about ICE in a minute.
Speaker 2:So yes, so early on, we understood you know the amount of the workforce in these communities and what it's made up of, so we had to develop a plan to deal with that.
Speaker 2:So if you are within the United States and you don't have the legal paperwork, it doesn't mean you don't work in the US. It also doesn't mean that you haven't been arrested in the US. As we very well know, people who are not from this country get arrested all the time and they remain in our country, so they have arrest records in our country. So what we do is, in order for you to apply, you are required to have a driver's license or a government issued ID from the United States. If you do not, we will accept a government issued ID from your home country and we then vet that ID to make sure it's legitimate, and these include things like Guatemalan consular cards, a Chilean driver's license, a Brazilian passport. So those are the types of documents we get, and we get them all the time, as you can imagine and what we do is now we have a government-issued photo ID from their country.
Speaker 1:A foreign government-issued photo ID Okay.
Speaker 2:From the country of their origin and a couple things happen. We have access to a number of databases to verify that it's a legitimate ID to begin with. You know the consulates and things of that nature, so we verify it and then what we do. So now we know we have their real name and date of birth. We then take that real name and date of birth and we run it in the United States for a criminal history. We are the only country that allows this type of data to be purchased and to be looked at.
Speaker 2:You're not going to find in, you know, guatemala or Mexico or anywhere in South America that you can run, you know, a criminal history. There are some organizations that are international that you could access, very expensive, but that's not realistic and that's not what we're looking for. We're looking for what they've done here in the US and again, as we found, with all the politics have gone on over the last few years, it's been made or shown in the news on a regular basis of the fact that we do have people who aren't citizens but have an extensive criminal history within the United States. So that's how we deal with that If they don't have a social security number because all of our backgrounds are social security. Run backgrounds because that's how you prevent people. For example, if you are Donna DiMaggio and you commit a crime, but later you get married and now on your ID it's Donna Berger Well, I don't like where you're going with this, mark.
Speaker 1:Well, I don't like where you're going with this.
Speaker 2:Mark, if we only ran it by your name and birth date, then we would miss the crime you did under your maiden name. When you run it with a Social Security number, the Social Security comes back to whoever you are. If you've been married 10 times, it's going to run all the names under which you've been married or which is associated with that Social Security number. So it's very. The Social Security number is really the only way to do a true background check.
Speaker 1:What if they don't have a Social Security number issued by the United States government? Every other country has a corollary ID number, or what do you do then?
Speaker 2:No, then then we have to rely the best we can, which is name and date of birth, based on their government-issued ID from their country of origin, and then we have to vet them. You know, obviously we vet them.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, listen, I've had teenagers too. I think we all realize there are fake IDs too. So what are you actually? If somebody gives you a driver's license, how do you know it's a let's say it's a Florida driver's license? How do?
Speaker 2:you know it's a legitimate Florida driver's license. Sure Well, I'll go a step further. When we get your social security number, the first thing we do is run it through the social security administration's database.
Speaker 2:You would not believe the number of dead people that have applied in our communities or who applied for our ID, that the Social Security Administration says this person is deceased and that's something. Obviously that's been. It's come up politically as well. So the first thing we check is, regardless of whether you're a citizen or not or we believe you're a citizen or not if you issue you're a citizen or not. If you give us your social security number, the first thing we do is make sure that's validated and then we validate the government ID. So a Florida ID, a Florida driver's license or any US state, and we've trained all the staff and they go through and they know what the requirements are for each state. So, for example, now Florida, you have to have a real what's called a real ID. And it has the star in the upper right hand corner, it has the hologram. So our staff are all trained in reviewing the IDs, understanding what they're supposed to look at from all the various states. If they have any questions, they are able to look it up to verify it.
Speaker 2:Listen, we have gotten Florida driver's licenses where you can tell from the background that they're sitting on their toilet at home and that's the picture they're using on a Florida driver's license home.
Speaker 2:And that's the picture they're using on a Florida driver's license.
Speaker 2:So we have what we call the wall of shame. It's all of it's, all the people who have, who have provided false IDs. And ultimately what we do is we reach back out to the person or the employer and say listen, because a lot of times they're worried that this is somehow going to get them in trouble. And we advise them if you just provide us with, you know, something from your country, and usually I will tell you 95% of the time they provide us with a passport, and a passport's a pretty good piece of identification. So 95% of the time when we tell them listen, please don't resubmit something that's not accurate. If they have a passport or a consulate card, just provide us with that. And we've only in over 100,000, we've only had one person come back out of Miami who said I have nothing from the United States and I have nothing from my country of origin. So it was only one out of over 100,000 who said I don't have anything. Everybody we have run into and everybody who's applied for our program has some form of identification.
Speaker 1:So what'd you do with that outlier? The one person who said I have nothing.
Speaker 2:Sure, the one outlier. He just failed to meet the criteria and was unable to get an RID. But, as you spoke of before, does that mean they can't work in the community? Well, the community has a decision to make and, ultimately, if they have an exception and they want to make an exception, they absolutely can.
Speaker 1:It's up to them. Yes, let me ask you do you care, or do the communities who work with your company care, if somebody doesn't have the right to work, the legal right to work, in the United States? So I imagine you're doing the background. You're dealing with 100,000 people. Some of these people may not have the right to actually work here. Have you come across that and what do you do with that? I mentioned ICE a few seconds ago because I did a podcast episode, a few episodes back with Ira Kurzban, who's an immigration icon, and we got into the whole ICE showing up in communities wanting to see their employee records, even perhaps wanting to see the records for people who work, who are outside vendors who come in. What do you do when you come across where clearly you have some evidence or strong suspicions these people do not have the ability to legally work in the US?
Speaker 2:Well, so what you're talking about really is their kind of their I-9 status, and what we made sure early on is we did not want to be viewed this was not to be viewed as a an employee background check. So the the employers are responsible for things like I-9 status and whether they're you know their eligibility to work in the United States. We don't get involved with that. It's no different than you know drug testing involved with that. It's no different than you know drug testing. So drug testing, i-9 status, eligibility to work status we do not get involved with that. That is on the employer.
Speaker 1:If I may just interject, I think that's a smart component of your business model, because you are not employing these people, but you are screening them for criminal background.
Speaker 2:for the most part, yeah, and that's how it's written in our agreement is that we're basically a third party that is just doing what the community could be doing. They could very well be checking and doing this. All the same, we don't have any special rights or regulations that give us access. These are things that anybody could do. So ultimately, we're providing this service and providing the IDs on behalf of, and doing this on behalf of, the community. It's not some special permission. We have to access records that not everybody else can access.
Speaker 1:So, mark, I want to know your success stories. Tell our audience some of the success, the big success stories you've had with this program.
Speaker 2:So I think the biggest success story and what was most shocking to us when we started this, was the number of sex offenders and sex predators that we have identified and prevented from entering our communities. Because understand, with our ID it's not for a specific community. Once you have our ID, that ID gets these vendors into every community that participates and they don't pay extra fees. They pay the one fee one time every 12 months and that ID gets them into all of the participating communities. So we realized very early on the influx of hits we were getting for sexual offenders and predators was just unbelievable.
Speaker 2:To date we are at 81 sex offenders or sexual predators that we have prevented from working here and really mostly in Palm Beach County. They can't work in any of our communities. And then you have to further that we're up over 900 recently convicted burglars, thieves or the lewd lascivious crimes. So we're up over 900 of those persons who we've prevented from working in our communities. But if you think about it, it's about roughly 100 a year. 100 vendors a year we prevent from working in the communities. A hundred vendors a year we prevent from working in the communities. So it's not this overwhelming number of people that we are preventing, the ones we are preventing from working in these communities are some of the highest risk at committing crimes within the community, and some of them are very heinous crimes that the success story with our company is the sheer number of vendors that we have been able to identify and prevent from working inside people's homes so that they are they, their children, their parents are much safer.
Speaker 1:Do you have safeguards in place, mark, where you can prevent cases of mistaken identity?
Speaker 2:Well, mistaken identity. That comes back to. If we deny somebody Correct and they say, hey, that's not me. Now obviously they would have had to provide us some form of government-issued ID. That's when that FCRA requirement kicks in and we have them fill that information out and it comes back. Our background provider then has to investigate it. They're required by federal law and then we get notified whether it was mistaken identity and things of that nature. So there are things in place per federal and because we are FCRA compliant, that those types of things they may initially occur, but ultimately we resolve them and they are, they are fixed.
Speaker 1:You've been doing this for almost a decade. Has it been your experience?
Speaker 2:Mark that some of these vendors that they're getting better at self-screening, that they're undertaking more rigorous hiring protocols that if you don't screen your people we are, and therefore don't waste your money sending somebody who has a bad background because they're going to get caught and they're not going to be let in. So it's hard to tell. We still are doing, you know, a hundred denials a year and of those denials we're still denying somewhere in the range of 10 to 12 sex offenders a year. So that tells me that you know if either the company doesn't have a background check or a standard or they're ignoring them. But again, if it's 100 a year and again roughly 10 of them or 10% of them are sex offenders or predators.
Speaker 1:Just thinking about all the different vendors that regularly service our community associations In the high-rises you're looking at even pool attendants, beach attendants, cleaning crews for the common areas, security guards, construction crews, maintenance and janitorial it's huge. And then some of these people go on to be hired individually by owners to do work inside their properties. Then you've got a lot of these owners in the homeowners associations and in the high-rises that are hiring their own trainers, dog walkers, pet sitters, babysitters you name it. You have so many people coming in and out. I have to tell you I can't believe we're in our fourth season and I never had you on to talk about this before. I'm actually going to share this with my own. I live in a HOA. As I said, we've got a guard gate, we've got man security, but it's something else that's really worth considering.
Speaker 2:We've got man security, but it's something else that's really worth considering. Well, we have found that communities, especially in the north end of Palm Beach County, they have anywhere from one to five thousand vendors a year that come through their gates. And the other thing that's important is we understand that communities have budgets, that all the residents pay their fees and things of that nature.
Speaker 1:So there is no charge to the HOA? I was going to ask what's the cost? No charge to the HOA.
Speaker 2:The program is there is no charge or fee to the HOA or to the resident. The vendors pay a small annual fee every year to have the background run, to get permission to work in those communities. And we have found, you know, because some of the questions that come up. One of the questions, as we already spoke about, was what about those who aren't US citizens? We've addressed that. The other one question that comes up is well, my vendor's going to refuse to work in the community.
Speaker 2:We did a survey amongst the GMs and property managers of our existing communities and we asked them those questions Are you losing your immigrant workforce? The answers were no. Are you losing vendors who don't want to participate because the program's been implemented? The answers no. The other question was are the vendors passing on the costs of this program to the residents or increasing contracts? Their answers were no. So the employers are using this as a tax write off and basically what they're doing is they're using us to do their background and driver's license checks, which they should be doing on their own. But now we are that kind of that third party that's doing it on their behalf, on their behalf.
Speaker 2:But the big questions that came up, those are the three big questions losing the workforce, losing vendors or having increased fees and all of the existing GMs and property managers have come back in a survey and said we are not experiencing that. The fourth question that comes up is this is illegal. You can't do this, you can't make me do this. So one of our communities, one of the first communities that came on board, they had a developer and the developer said Palm Beach County and it went to court and the judge ruled. So now we have case law. The judge ruled that, one, an HOA, poa, condo association, has every right to implement a screening or place requirements on vendors entering the community. And two, they also vetted our company, safe Communities, and said this was a legitimate business that's doing a legitimate background and providing a legitimate service. Therefore, the developer lost the suit and we now have case law that says this is a completely legitimate thing and it's lawful to do and it's highly recommended.
Speaker 1:Well, that's very good for your business model, Mark.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes.
Speaker 1:So any last thoughts for our listeners about screening vendors that are brought into the community either because they're doing business directly with the association or because they're doing business with a resident in the association.
Speaker 2:Well, all of the communities agree in our agreement that it does have to be everybody who comes into the community, regardless of who they're going to work for, you know, with the exceptions of the you know, the truck drivers delivering to the clubhouse and the utility workers and things of that nature. But outside of the exceptions, ultimately everyone who comes through has to do it, otherwise it doesn't work. Another good thing is we've never had a community that started with us who, after having started with us, said you know what? This just isn't for us. It's not working out. We don't like the program. The program's caused us problems. So everyone who has started with us has stayed with us.
Speaker 2:However, we have had to break ties with two communities because the communities were not implementing the program across the board and actually what we discovered was they were discriminating as to who they were requiring to have the background.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's not good. And we said, hey, we can't be associated with that and we want your business and we love your community, but if you are going to continue to discriminate and pick and choose as to who you're going to do background checks on, we can't have our name associated with that. So we had to end our agreement with two communities. Actually, because all we have is our reputation and you know, if they let people in or they let vendors in without running them through the program and that vendor does something, people are not going to look at that community and say, oh my gosh, they allowed them. They're going to look and say the safe communities vendor id program doesn't work. So that's why it was critical when we found that they weren't applying the program across the board, that we just ended our relationship with them and told them to defend the future. They wanted to do it, you know, as everyone else does it, and equitably. We would absolutely love to to work with them again.
Speaker 1:Well, and to that point, Mark, far too many people believe they can accurately assess risk. And I think it was a book I I'm going to say it was by Adam Grant, I believe that's the author, I may be wrong who had a book and the premise of the book was basically, they did studies, they tested, and people were really bad at assessing risk.
Speaker 2:In fact, lay people, they thought to your point when they start, rather than applying it uniformly, and the goal is to time where they'll say well, I've had my air conditioning guy for 20 years and we're like well, that's fine, but your neighbor has a new handyman or a new cleaning service every month and they're just going through the cheapest person they can find and they're not any screening. So, yes, your air conditioning guy might be a wonderful guy and you have him over for dinner and you know his family, but your neighbor might have. You know they're only here six months a year and they're having all these people come work on their house and you have no idea who they're hiring and ultimately it could be those vendors who victimize you, not necessarily your vendor.
Speaker 1:And to fill out the application for the vendor's employee. What are we talking? Half hour, 15 minutes Longer.
Speaker 2:It takes longer. If you wanted to read the disclaimers, that's probably the longest portion, because we have to be very transparent with what we're doing, how we're doing it, why we're doing it. It takes longer to do the disclaimers than to read the disclaimers than it does to fill out the application, because really it comes down to your name, data, bar social security number. You have to take a selfie of yourself, so we have a recent photo and you have to photograph your government issued photo ID and that all attaches right in the website and it's not a long process. It will take you long. Again, it will take you longer to read.
Speaker 2:The beauty of this, what we've done. Obviously. Nine years ago we started with plastic ID cards. We realized, through collaboration with our communities, that these ID cards are being passed around to different vendors, that they would expire and their security officers wouldn't catch it, things of that nature. So now our IDs are digital and go right to the smartphone and they're what's called live IDs. So there is a running clock down to the hundredths of a second. So no one's going to pass off their $1,000 iPhone to somebody else to get into a community to work. So now all of our IDs are digital, they're live IDs and we have the ability, if something happens with that vendor, with a push of a button it disappears. With an old plastic ID card we don't go to their house and confiscate it.
Speaker 2:So we've taken that to the next level, where now we have a far more secure ID. It's digital, it has a barcode. You can scan the barcode and it'll autofill the access control software because all of the access control companies have adopted the barcode and it'll auto-populate, which expedites time at the gate. So we've stayed with the times, so to speak, and we've automated this and we have the app and we have the digital ID, and it's been a huge success.
Speaker 1:So, Mark, final question where can people find you?
Speaker 2:Sure. So our website is safevendornet one word, safevendornet, and all of the information's on there. My information's on there and you can call us and we'll come out and do a demonstration. I just did one yesterday for a North End, palm Beach County community and we'd love to show you how it works. We will give you all of the names and phone numbers of the GMs and the property managers who currently use the program and we say listen, don't take our word for it, call them and ask them about the program.
Speaker 1:You do Broward as well. Miami, all of the tri-county. What about West Coast?
Speaker 2:So technically we are nationwide. No, even better, because it's web-based, we can do this nationwide. Now it's important to know that if, for example, a community in California wanted to do it, california is very difficult to get criminal records. There are states that don't want to give them up, but right now we are concentrated in Florida and it doesn't matter where you are, it's the entire state of Florida and we've got some interest in the Carolinas and Georgia and we're working on that.
Speaker 1:Mark, thanks so much for joining us today.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's my pleasure and I thank you for having me.
Speaker 1:Thank you for joining us today. Don't forget to follow and rate us on your favorite podcast platform, or visit TakeItToTheBoardcom for more ways to connect.