When Systems Fail: First Responders, Crisis Work, And The Cost Of Care

In part 2, the calls keep coming, but the solutions don’t. We sit down with crisis clinician and EMDR therapist Morgan Yaskus to trace how a frayed safety net pushes first responders into impossible roles—and how that mismatch breeds moral injury. From long drives to the nearest DMV or ER to midnight discharges with no plan, we map the structural barriers that turn compassion into exhaustion and good intentions into public criticism.

Morgan shares what mobile crisis teams can do well—resolving most calls on scene, staying with families after deaths, and offering a humane handoff—and where policy still ties everyone’s hands. We talk about the revolving door of brief psychiatric evaluations, the bureaucratic maze of IDs and benefits, and the social media spotlight that amplifies one bad moment over a hundred quiet saves. Small towns feel this even harder: everyone knows everyone, scanners travel fast, and rumors outrun the facts.

We also get practical. Morgan explains how EMDR intensives can speed recovery from single‑incident trauma, why embedded wellness trainings reduce stigma, and how family wellness programs give spouses and kids tools to navigate shift work, hypervigilance, and communication breakdowns. The theme isn’t “do more with less.” It’s “build a system that holds what responders are asked to carry,” with warm handoffs, guaranteed short holds, transport support, and streamlined ID recovery to break the cycle.

If you care about first responder mental health, this conversation is a map and a motivator. Listen, share with your team, and send this to someone who thinks burnout is a willpower issue. Then tap follow, leave a quick review to help others find the show, and tell us: what single policy change would make the biggest difference where you live?

To contact Morgan, go to her website at www.bewildandrooted.com

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Transcript

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SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome to Resilience Development in Action with Steve Bisson. This is the podcast dedicated to first responder mental health, helping police, fire, EMS, dispatchers, and paramedics create better growth environments for themselves and their teams. Let's get started.ai.

Guest Reintroduction And Focus

SPEAKER_00 0:37

You heard me talk about it. I'm gonna keep on talking about it because I love it. I've had about a year and a half, 18 months practice with it, and I still enjoy it. And it saves me time and it saves me energy. Free.ai takes your note, makes a trans what you're talking about a client, just press record. And it does either transcript, it does a subjective, and an objective with a letter if needed for your client. And for whoever might need it. So for$99 a month, it saves me so much time that it's worthwhile. And if you do it for a whole year, guess what? You get 10% off. More importantly, this is what you got. Because you are my audience that listens to resilience development in action. If you do listen to this and you want to use free.ai, put in the code Steve in the promo code area. Steve 50. And you will get$50 off in addition to everything we just talked about. Get free from writing your notes. Get free from even writing your transcripts. Use that to your advantage. Free.ai. A great service. Go to get free.ai and you will get one of the best services that will save you time and money. And I highly encourage you to And by magic, we're already back. Thank you again for continuing with me. I really enjoy our conversation so far. I hope you're enjoying it too.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

It's okay.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

Well, Morgan Yaskis. I want to introduce you in case people didn't catch the first part. This is part two. I know that you worked on a mobile crisis team. You are now in private practice. You work with first responders. I think it's all important stuff. Uh I wonder how your career as a crisis clinician or I that's what I called us when I was a crisis clinician, shaped uh how now you treat first responders, how you treat your clients in general, but particularly first responders nowadays. And knowing about, you know, things like you know, the systematic factors that go through a lot of things, including administration betrayal for some of those guys, because they can't really talk to anyone in their department sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

Yeah. I think, oh gosh, it's it's really a loaded question.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Oh, I know. That's why you pay me a lot of money to be on here so I can send you a lot of loaded questions. She didn't pay me, folks. She did not pay me.

Crisis Work Meets A Broken System

SPEAKER_02 3:01

You know, I I think on paper, crisis work looks very noble, heroic, right? And and in practice, it's not for lack of a better word. I think it's it's we're often being a buffer between suffering and a system that's not built to hold it. At least that and you know, this is all speaking from my experience here in Alaska. And so in Alaska, I think that that's really magnified by the lack of infrastructure and the isolation that we're working with, geographically speaking. And I think one of the most frustrating and heartbreaking realities was how few real options exist, right? So we had our first responders and then we created mobile crisis team, and we're like, this is gonna be so great. We're gonna solve all of the Alaska's problems. And then we did it. Not to say we didn't do great.

SPEAKER_00 3:51

Okay, but so you told me, wait a minute, this is false advertising.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

That's what's on the resume. But you know, in the Matsu Borough, which which we talked about earlier, it's a it's a huge area, and we have we have one homeless shelter. One. Wow. And it's women's only domestic violence shelter. That's it for a borough that's larger than some states. So there often isn't a clear or available uh next step for a lot of the individuals that we were interacting with. And so we were experiencing that as mobile crisis. And I all I could think about was like, good God, what did these people do before we existed? Because at least what once we were there, they were able to hand off to us and we could problem solve this and they could get back to what their actual jobs were, which wasn't this, right? It's not case management or resource referral. And so I think that that was a big piece of it was was I had that question in mind of like, what did they do? And you know, obviously I asked because I'm curious and I like to talk. Um, and and they were like, Well, we we didn't. And but really, it wasn't that we didn't, it was that they couldn't. What could they do? So these first responders are being called to these scenes that are not medical or not criminal related, and being told to fix it and then you know, getting shit on on Facebook two hours later when they don't. And it's just this like toilet bull effect. It's just so cyclical. And the reality is like that's not a problem that they could solve. And I think that the public was often missing that this isn't about willpower. You know, and and that goes for the okay, I'm gonna paint a picture here, as I like to do. And that goes for the people, these individuals too, because I remember hearing all the time, like, why don't why don't they just stop using? Why don't these people just get a job? Why don't they just get clean? Why don't they just find housing? But you're they're asking the wrong question because what they're really asking, whether they realize it or not, is why doesn't someone with no ID transportation or support system or place to sleep navigate this bureaucratic labyrinth that would frustrate even a fully resourced person. That's what we're really asking. And so please cut me off at any point because I get really heated about this, actually. But to humor me, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:19

I want to hear it. That's why I'm letting you talk.

SPEAKER_02 6:21

Yeah. Someone, someone experiencing homelessness in Wasilla, which is where I am, they want to get a job, but they need an ID. Well, it was lost or stolen. So now they need to go to DMV. Well, guess what? We don't have one here. The next one's like 15 to 20 miles away in a neighboring town. So they have to walk or find transportation. But also to get that, they need a social security card. We don't have that here either. So now you have to go to Anchorage, which is 40 miles over 40 miles away. Again, assuming they can find transportation and get the security card, but also you need a birth certificate to do that, I'm pretty sure. So you're gonna have to order that from Bible Statistics. We also don't have one of those here, which costs money that you probably don't have, takes several weeks and requires a mailing address. So where's where exactly is that gonna be mailed to? Right. And I probably got the order of this all mixed up somewhere. But I think you get the point, right? Like this is a systemic issue, and it's horrible for the people that you know the system's really working against, but it's also horrible for those first responders that you know are are trying to help these people, but it's so much bigger than that. It's so much bigger than that.

The Bureaucratic Maze Of “Getting Help”

SPEAKER_00 7:25

It's a system that's broken. I mean, I remember here in in Massachusetts, they would be like, we can't send you social security or dis disability or social security assistance or even unemployment because you don't have an address. So get an address. But to get an address, you got to have revenue. And if you don't have revenue, they don't want to give you an address. So you're fucking over your people. And that's that's not the cops' fault. No, that's the legislation issue, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:57

And then and then those first responders that are seeing these same people over and over again and know that there's really nothing they can do to help. It's not a lack of desire, at least not from my experience. And I think that's where that moral injury really takes root is responders are asked to carry problems that are literally unsolvable within their scope. And then and then they're the ones who are blamed when it doesn't work. Why are these people still on the streets? Why is this still happening? This is their job. It's not, it's literally not. And I think over time I've seen that create and I felt it, this like internal conflict. But I'm trying to help because I think the reality is anybody that steps into these first responder roles, they're they were trying to help. And then we became a part of the machine that keeps hurting people.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

Right.

SPEAKER_02 8:47

And so what do you do?

SPEAKER_00 8:48

Right. And and you know as much as I do, you didn't even mention the hospitals in your area, but I'm assuming they're few between you know, like the other part too is the hospital system is a slave to man uh the the the crappy health care management stuff. So basically, like, oh, so you're not suicidal anymore, your meds haven't kicked in. We don't care about that. You're no longer suicidal. Go home. We'll give you a list of therapists that may or may not have openings, and you don't have a phone to call any, but anyway, I can go on and on myself about these things.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

Yeah, I mean, uh for us, we have one, I mean, technically, I think we have like two hospitals, but one ER, and it's again 15 miles from where I live. And I mean, with mobile crisis, it still exists. I'm just not on the pigment anymore. But with with mobile crisis, if somebody was experiencing an acute mental or behavioral health emergency, um, whether it was like psychosis, suicidality, whatever it might be, before we existed, the only option was to call law enforcement or EMS to transport that person to the hospital. That's it. That was the protocol, right? And then we thought this was gonna get better once mobile crisis team existed. And it did in terms of we were able to leave, I want to say, I don't remember the numbers for sure, but it was like 87, somewhere around their percent of calls were resolved within the community. But there was still a chunk that that needed additional care that we would transport to the hospital. And we're hoping that by our presence of being there through the triage and really sitting next to these individuals, that whole process that it would work better. And it just didn't. And again, like you were saying earlier, like this, it's actually it's a systemic issue and it's a policy issue because we were doing for us, it's a Title 47. That's our involuntary commitment. But Alaska law doesn't even guarantee a 24-hour psychiatric hold if we do that. So there were several times that I would bring an individual in and I'd be sitting with them and I would go to fill out paperwork and give it to the right person. And by the time I came back, which just doesn't take very long, they'd be getting discharged. And I'm like, hold on. What do you mean? And that happened more times than I can count. And what was worse is when they would, you know, they would triage them and they would do like an intake, whatever their process was, and we would leave because we'd have another call. And they would discharge these people back to the exact same circumstances with no connection to care, no follow up follow-up plan. It's like 1 a.m. in the middle of winter, and now they're 20 miles from where they were to begin with. What are we doing? So then what do they do? They call 911 again, or if they don't, somebody else does because they see this person on the side of the road in the middle of winter at 2 a.m. And they call 911. And then it's the same responders coming again. And so it's like as the responders, you're just feeling like you're like resetting the cycle, knowing full well you're gonna see the same person again in a couple hours or a couple of days, maybe in worse shape, or now more mistrust, mistrusting, mistrustful, whatever the right word is. You know, and essentially moving further away from any kind of stability, even though your only goal was to create stability by doing this in the first place. And so it's it's frustrating and it's heartbreaking. And I think, like, you know, when you talk about moral injury, that paints the picture right there, because it's not that they they don't care, the system ties their hands.

Hospitals, Holds, And The Revolving Door

SPEAKER_00 12:25

I mean, you talk about distance, sometimes it's just lack of a lack of resources, period. I I know in our area here in the Metro West of Boston, if you don't get into a shelter when it's cold or even warm, it doesn't really matter by 7 p.m. ish. Luckily, some of them are 9 p.m., but that's the latest. If it's 11 p.m. and you're homeless and they want you to resolve that as a police officer, a crisis clinician, usually both, uh you're like, uh don't know. There's a laundromat over there, you can sleep in there for until tomorrow morning. It's open 24 hours, but we have lack of resources too, because uh we've also come to a point as a government where we don't trust to give people the resources they need. And that's a whole different ball of wax. And I don't want to get into too much of that because people will say, Oh, you're blaming one party. No, I blame both parties. I don't give a crap. I'm not, I'm not, I don't favor anyone. Uh but the b the bottom line is you're right, and then the police officer is still dealing with it. I mean, like, how many guys come in here and say, I really wanted to help this homeless woman, this homeless man, this suicidal man, suicidal woman? Uh and they weren't able to, and then two years down the road, two months down the road, whatever the case the case may be, they're they hung themselves or they're found, you know, dead on the side of the road because it was like 10 degrees the night before. It it's it's a systematic issue. I don't I think Alaska has a little harder. I don't I'm not trying to compare apples to oranges here. Yeah, but nonetheless, I don't think it's that different across the country.

SPEAKER_02 14:02

No, I I don't think it is. And I think like with you know, when we were kind of talking about what what are the unique challenges to Alaska, and I was trying to think of my answer, and I was like, they're not unique to Alaska, and actually that's the problem. Like that's what I want to talk about. It's like it's not unique because I think any people from any state could listen to this and relate to a part of it, and that's the problem, right? Like it's just so much bigger than than I think we sometimes want to admit that it is.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

I mean, uh, I've worked with therapists from everywhere in the country. Name it, I probably worked with one of them from one of the states. And yeah, same. I was talking to someone from Iowa recently, and the same thing that you just described, there's parts of Iowa where you gotta drive 15 miles to get to the hospital, and the hospital says, Well, you know what? It's been like 10 minutes there in the the the ambulance, they're not suicidal anymore. Let's prepare their discharge papers. And you're like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Now they're far away from their home, they don't have any resources, and now they're pissed.

SPEAKER_02 15:05

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

I think that there's so much that we can do in this country to change things, but I I don't want to at the risk of being called a socialist, I just think that we need to do something for the community at some point in time.

Moral Injury And Public Scrutiny

SPEAKER_02 15:19

Yeah, you know, I I something about what you said just reminded me too of um, you know, mobile crisis team was created to to bridge the gaps. That was our that was our goal. And I, you know, I'm not sure exactly what it was that you said that reminded me of this, but I remember having a conversation with the first responder, and they were like, mobile crisis team is the best thing that that could have happened to us. And I was like, oh, I'm so glad you think that. But they had a very specific example, which I thought was so interesting because I would have never thought of like this having been our role. But they're saying when they called us for loss of life calls, that it was so life-changing for them to know that when they walked away from the scene, that these individuals were still going to be cared for. And I was like mind blown because I never really I have been very lucky to not experience that kind of loss in my life. And so I was a little naive to it. But I'm like, what did you guys do before? Like this was mind blowing to me. And then once I really thought about it, they were like, yeah, we would just have to we we'd be doing CPR on this individual with their whole family around. Follow time of death, pack up and leave because we have more calls to go on. And I was like, that is horrible for the family, of course. But also these responders, like they never, their the loop was never closed. And that's like where I was like, how do you live like that? Because I'm like, I need answers to everything all the time, like all of the time. And that was a big piece of it was like we were able to not complete the scene. I don't know what you would say, but just be there longer and provide real long-term resources and you know, just stay with people until their family showed up, things like that. It's a big state. People are driving four hours sometimes. And that gave a sense of peace to these first responders in a way where I'm like, that's not what we were created for. That's not why our role existed, but it became such a beautiful piece of the role that I think is worth highlighting for because, like, yeah, when we're talking about moral injury, like mobile crisis was absolutely able to bridge that gap a little bit. It didn't go away entirely, but I'm like, there's so much, so many parts and pieces to being a first responder that people don't think about like that. And and I mean, this was like a year into me working in that role, and I hadn't thought about it because I hadn't experienced it. Why would I? Right. And it's just there's there's just so many things like that that I think, yes, what they do is it's is heroic, absolutely. But what we're not seeing, uh there's just so much that we're not seeing that's a part of this too.

SPEAKER_00 17:59

I mean, I'm I had someone who was dispatched, and that's recently on my podcast. That's where we talked about. It's like, you know, you get a 911 call, you take care of the call, and then oh yeah, officer's here, and then they hang up and you don't know what's happening because guess what? Phone's still ringing, still need the next phone call. The other part too that really struck me in what you said is that you know, police officers sometimes do want some sort of closure. We do get some closure by, you know, sending someone home, someone getting help in the hospital, getting arrested, whatever. There's always some closure, but it's not full closure sometimes. And I think about particularly again, not only Alaska, and like I said, we talked about earlier, probably across the country. Um I know that some of the smaller departments around here, there's like sometimes two or three officers for the whole town or that we're in. And it's those two to three guys who end up like going to all these calls, but they don't have time for closure, they don't have time for that. They just move on, and the calls don't stop because oh wait, wait, no, Johnny's at the 27 Hollis Street. Okay, we'll we'll we'll wait to have our crisis until he's done with 27 Hollis Street. It doesn't matter. And so I think that's the other part too that I'm sure is a challenge for you guys. Not only is there's moral injury and stuff like that, I think it the guys also go like from call to call. And it's like if they start breaking down, it's not like they can tag someone in.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

Right. Yeah, exactly. I think too that you know it's exactly what you just said. It's there, there's I think there is grief of being fully conscious inside a structure like this, right? That that really only uh functions well if you're like not paying attention to it. Because when you're paying attention to it, you're realizing it's not functioning very well. And so when you refuse to like dissociate from that, and when you're staying awake and you're connected, it it does it starts to take pieces of you. I think it really does.

SPEAKER_00 19:53

I mean, we talked about it earlier. It's a small community. You probably know someone, and then it starts like getting Getting under your skin. You go to the same call. You've helped Johnny a couple of times or Jane. And Jane, two years later, is found dead because of you know purposeful or you know. Sorry, I'm not very good at saying nice things here. That m messes up you. Like, oh, what did I do wrong? Or what could I have done more? Or, you know, like we forget how personal sometimes these police officers take these things.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't go away when the call ends.

SPEAKER_00 20:29

No.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

Especially not in a you know, in smaller towns. I mean, this I think this is true everywhere, but definitely in smaller towns. Because, like you said, like there's tons of family relations here. There's everyone when ties school together. Like, there's so much connectedness, which is really beautiful and also makes it that much harder sometimes. And now we're in this era of social media, so everything is posted. I don't know how it is for you guys, but I know like our law enforcement radio channels are private, but our fire and EMS ones aren't. So that gets publ like published to Facebook so quick. So quick. Like you can't escape it even if you wanted to.

SPEAKER_00 21:10

Not only that, I mean, around here, this is when my big biggest pet peeve. There's sirens going down Mullen Street. Do you know what I'm saying? No, I'm not a police officer.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

An emergency, that's what.

unknown 21:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:22

Not a I'm not a police officer, not a firefighter. I don't know what the fuck's going on. How about you wait a little bit?

SPEAKER_02 21:28

You'll find out when everyone else finds out. It's gonna be okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:31

In Massachusetts, there's something called the police logs you can look at. Look at the police the next day. Yeah, but yeah, no, those are the ones that drive me nuts. I hear sirens on Mullen Street. Yeah, that's probably because there's an emergency. But you know what the emergency is? Yes, I do know, but I will not share it with you. Thank you. I mean, that's the other part, too.

SPEAKER_02 21:53

Even if I knew, I'm not gonna share it. So why like this is a silly question? I want you to think about that.

SPEAKER_00 21:59

Yeah, social media has made people not only like selfish, but they made them ignorant sometimes. And yes, I said that. And if you want to fight me on it, please send me a message. But I think that that's what it is. Like when the ambulance goes by my office, do you think I go, Oh my god, I wonder where they're going? I don't know where they're going. I don't care. If I need to really know, I'll look tomorrow in the paper or the next day when the police logs come out.

SPEAKER_02 22:23

And if it's relevant to me, I'll find out. I will.

Social Media, Small Towns, Big Impact

SPEAKER_00 22:26

They didn't come into my building, so I should be I'm fine. Yeah, you know, I think that that's the other part too, is that the scrutiny that they go through. I think that you talk about moral injury, not only about but even you know what's that what's that saying in business? If you have a good experience, you may tell two to three people. If you have a bad experience, you're gonna tell nine to eleven people. And so the cop is tired or is trying to get to the next call, and this wasn't their priority, and they got to kind of cut you short and say, Hey, listen, you can go to a court magistrate, here's how you do it. And they live he didn't pay attention, didn't seem to care about my problem. Uh yeah, because the other one was a murder, just for the record. You yeah, your little court thing is not as important, but you don't think about that, you're only thinking about your own self-centered world. I think that's the other moral injury that happens with a lot of police officers. And I I've I forget to mention my firefighters, EMTs, and paramedics here, but they're the same boat.

SPEAKER_02 23:23

Yeah. Well, I think you know, you you said it earlier, like the one bad thing happens and it's headlines everywhere. And I think that's even a bigger issue in the smaller towns because everybody knows everybody. So as soon as one person even catches when and it's on Facebook and outshared a hundred times, and you can't escape it, and you're seeing these people again. You're gonna see them again. You can almost damn near guarantee that. And yeah, it's just like constant state of having to defend yourself. I'm like, these are the last people that should have to do that. Not to say there's not bad apples sometimes, sure. Sure, but you could say that about any profession. And you don't come after the rest of them the way that you do these guys, so or girls. And I think, yeah, it's just it's so it's hard to watch. It's really hard to watch, let alone, I'm sure, experiencing it.

SPEAKER_00 24:17

Right. I mean, like it's the argument. If you listen to my podcast, you've heard me make this argument. You know, 95% of therapists want to do their job, help people, and hopefully go home and everything goes hunky-dory. The baker wants to make 95% of them want to make their bread, not hurt anyone, and kind of move on. But I forgot 5% on both of those because 5% can are assholes. And guess what? Police is the same thing, fire is the same thing, but we concentrate on the five percent in those particular jobs. While in therapy, I can tell you horrible stories about therapists doing absolutely unethical jobs. Yeah, and that doesn't make it to the back page of anything, and somehow that's okay. But if a cop coughs the wrong way, let's put it on the front page. And again, not saying that they're all good cops, there's about five percent I know that are not good people, that's not what I'm saying. But it's like, why are we always emphasizing the negative for other people while we de-emphasize it in pretty much every other population? And that's another moral injury that they face because you're happy to see the cop when you're in trouble, but when you do something wrong, you're not happy to see the cop. How the hell do they win?

SPEAKER_02 25:28

Right.

SPEAKER_00 25:29

So, anyway, that's my little show myself. I can go on and on about that. But I would like I would rather hear a little more about what you do. I mean, I I before the interview we were talking, fellow eye movement desensitization and reprocessing therapists, emdr for those who I don't I don't like to use acronyms because that just makes it too fl uh too I know better than you shit. But I know you're an EMDR person. I know you do some wellness workshops. So can you share a little bit about all that?

Beyond The Call: Closure And Care

SPEAKER_02 25:58

Yeah, yeah. I uh do I do EMDR in my in my typical practice, but I also do offer some EMDR intensives, which they are intense, they are, but they're just they're longer, right? And so these sessions are ideal for people who maybe don't want to commit to like long-term weekly therapy. And they're they're they're more focused, they're more efficient, and they're more tailored really to to more like single incident traumas, things like that. And so I do offer those. I also offer, yeah, wellness trainings and partnered with our EMS department out here. So next next month, actually, I'll be there for a week doing some wellness workshops and trainings. And my my doctorate, I talked a little bit about, and I think it was in the last episode, but it's in community prevention, intervention, and advocacy. And so my research and my dissertation in capstone are is all around creating family wellness for first responders, family wellness programs and initiatives. Because, you know, we've talked a lot about first responders and what they experience. But what we haven't touched on at all actually is what the family experience is also. Right. And so I think that's something that I've just noticed that there's a gap that I really, really want to work to fill. And I have these relationships built with our first responders here. And so I think it's just an opportunity that I don't want to pass up. And so hopefully that'll be uh coming soon in the future, too.

SPEAKER_00 27:25

Well, I agree with you. And if you go back to a few of my podcasts, we talk about the impact on partners and families in general because that's so important in having that regular communication, particularly when you have two people who are both first responders who live in the same house. That communication is key. So I definitely support the family stuff. How do we reach you though? How do we find you?

SPEAKER_02 27:51

Yeah, I uh can have you link my website, which is bewildandre.com, and then I am on Instagram as well, and it's wildandreed.wellness. And so those are the two best ways.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Well, I'll definitely put that in the show notes, and I'll definitely be part of your following on those things. But I wanted to thank you. I know that you have someone in your life. I I don't share people's stories because it's not mine to share. But you have someone who's in the Massa who's from the Massachusetts area and the families around here. So if you ever think about it, if you are ever around here and you reach me out, reach out, I'll leave you my phone number. Please come and see me. Love to talk to you face to face. It'd be great.

SPEAKER_02 28:34

Yeah, I'll be in the area in like a couple weeks, actually, which it'll be during the holidays. That might be a crazy time. But if not, then in the summer, I think it'd be great. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 28:43

And I will not ask you to go do the touristy shit in Boston, I promise.

SPEAKER_02 28:47

Oh, yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

I'll bring you to uh the Sturbridge Village or something a little more rustic. That'll give you a lot more.

SPEAKER_02 28:54

Oh, I don't know what that is, but it sounds cool. So I'll take you up on it.

SPEAKER_00 28:57

All right. Well, I I and it's a sincere invitation, by the way. Love would love to meet you and your your loved one that has family around here. It'd be great. But I want to thank you for being part of Resilience Development in Action, and I will talk to you soon.

SPEAKER_02 29:14

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 29:15

And for those of you who are listening, still looking forward to seeing you for episode 241, and I hope you join us then.

SPEAKER_01 29:23

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