MarPro - The Marketing Procurement Podcast

Beth Pope | GoDaddy

June 16, 2021 Rusty Pepper & Dana Small & Beth Pope Episode 2
Beth Pope | GoDaddy
MarPro - The Marketing Procurement Podcast
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MarPro - The Marketing Procurement Podcast
Beth Pope | GoDaddy
Jun 16, 2021 Episode 2
Rusty Pepper & Dana Small & Beth Pope

On this episode we visit with Beth Pope, the Procurement Manager for Marketing at GoDaddy to discuss her perspective as a UNICORN in the world of marpro since she previously worked as a marketer before crossing over to procurement... or as Rusty likes to say, "the darkside"!  

Here are the key lessons discussed in this episode…

  • Lessons learned as a marketer working in procurement
  • Simplifying requirements & processes
  • Gaining acceptance from marketing when launching a marpro department
  • Aligning legal with marpro 
  • Questions marketers need to be asking their marpro peers
  • Roles and playing Good Cop / Bad Cop
  • RFP's - Using discretion to keep vendors honest, while also not being a disruption to the business

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Show Notes Transcript

On this episode we visit with Beth Pope, the Procurement Manager for Marketing at GoDaddy to discuss her perspective as a UNICORN in the world of marpro since she previously worked as a marketer before crossing over to procurement... or as Rusty likes to say, "the darkside"!  

Here are the key lessons discussed in this episode…

  • Lessons learned as a marketer working in procurement
  • Simplifying requirements & processes
  • Gaining acceptance from marketing when launching a marpro department
  • Aligning legal with marpro 
  • Questions marketers need to be asking their marpro peers
  • Roles and playing Good Cop / Bad Cop
  • RFP's - Using discretion to keep vendors honest, while also not being a disruption to the business

SHARE
LIKE
FOLLOW

Dana:

hello and welcome to the Mar pro podcast where we discuss all things procurement. I'm one of your co-hosts Dana small, a marketing procurement professional. I'm joined by my cohost rusty pepper CMO. So rusty, how's it going in Texas? It's

Rusty:

warming up that we're recording this episode number two right before Memorial day weekend. So fired up to be able to get this episode recorded. We've got a great guest that I know we're going to be talking to, but before we get her introduced, how about I asked you a quick question. Okay. How has your experience been thus far working closely with the marketing and sales guy?

Dana:

You know what I think I've worked with marketing and sales for 10 years. So I'm used to it. And some of my friends joke that we're cut from the same block, like it takes on to no one, I called marketing deals and she's like, if I want to look in the mirror, yeah, this is great. I really enjoy, I think marketing professionals are super smart, super sharp, and they're great. They are, they do have that creative aspect that I think I lack in procurement, but I think it's good to have that kind of combination and get you to the other half of your brain

Rusty:

more. I definitely think the more that I been spending time working with you just getting this podcast launch, that was an undertaking in itself. But heck we could probably do an episode on that maybe down the road, just to help other people that maybe what we're trying to do, this, that respect of being able to really have the processes, the, the tool, actually, a lot of the understanding of a lot of the markets. Products that we use, you've introduced me to them like, wow, I didn't even know about that one. And that's, I think a value that marketers need to understand and appreciate the fact that you guys are the sifter of all this information coming in as well, because you've got vendors reaching out and say, Hey, check out our product, check out our product. And I think there's a value there. So anyways, I'm excited for this episode. And why don't I just kick it back over to you? Let you like.

Dana:

Yeah. Yeah. So I'm super excited too, because it's somewhat of a special episode. We do have what we like to call on the business, a unicorn, which is someone who actually has moved from the marketing side over to the procurement side. It's miss Beth Pope from GoDaddy. So hello and

Beth:

welcome, Beth. Hi, I am so excited to be here. Thanks for inviting me. Yes,

Dana:

we are so excited to have you. I've you're one of the first and many, very few that we've actually met that actually has moved from marketing to procurement. Normally it's the other way around or marketers go screaming from our side of the, you are the unicorn, you have made it over. So why don't you give us maybe a brief background about you and how you ended up in your position?

Beth:

Absolutely. I can't wait for my daughter that you think I'm a unicorn. Do you know hopeful? That will make me okay. So anyway, I actually come from a sports marketing background. So I started my journey at Florida state and I got two degrees while I was there. So I majored in theater and media production. So I was very into being on camera and learning a lot about behind the scenes and. In all areas of the entertainment field and took a job in New York with ESPN right after I graduated. And what was cool about that is that I was actually working for people that I interned with at Florida state. So I worked in the event production department. So I was traveling a lot with NASCAR and college football loved the job, but then I say that I had my quarter life crisis and decided that I wanted to go back to graduate school, to focus on sports marketing in particular. So I got a full ride to Clemson university near my hometown of Atlanta. And the studied sports marketing did my thesis on sports marketing and sponsorship sales, and decided to work for a company called near-field IMG college right out at Clemson. And they represent all of the multimedia rights for athletic departments across the country. And as I moved my way. Through that organization. I lived all over the country. I worked on everything from sponsorship sales, to working events, to getting in front of CMOs, like arrestee and being very forward facing for our company and the universities that I was working with and loved my job there and actually took a job at Clemson university in South Carolina, where I know. And when I moved here, I said, I think I'm ready for a career change and decided to look at some other opportunities and Michelin north America's headquarters are in Greenville, South Carolina, where I live, and there was a position that popped up as a. For marketing communications and motor sports. And so it was all of my worlds coming into one. And I said, let me see what this is all about. I interviewed and learned a little bit about what the buyer role would consist of. And the rest is history. I think Michelin was actually looking for someone with no procurement expertise and they wanted me to. Uh, be in a position where I can really connect with the marketing teams and they knew that I could learn the procurement role if I was willing and able and loved my time at Michelin, they gave me a great foundation in reference to procurement and the position at GoDaddy opened up. And I just thought it was a really unique position. And especially in COVID times, right? I think that GoDaddy is a awesome company right now to be affiliated with because their, their motto right now is really to empower entrepreneurs. And so what's cool about the company is I feel like I'm really a part of the movement here right now and in COVID and really helping entrepreneurs with their business. As far as websites are concerned. So I'm now going, I love it.

Rusty:

The, I got a question for, I wonder about your, the opportunity that came up at Michelin. Cause I think it's interesting. They wanted somebody who did not have buying experience to come into this role. Was that a first time they've ever created a position or was that based off lessons learned from prior experience?

Beth:

That's a great question. So there was actually two people in the role that I was in. I actually back-filled for someone else that moved within Michelin. So if what Dana was saying, it was someone from the procurement side that then jumped back into the marketing side. So I was filling his position. And so it wasn't new. I think that it was just something that they had maybe learned throughout the years. The marketing team requested that someone had marketing experience, Michelin really listened to the business and wanted to make sure that they were filling the position with someone that they were excited about.

Dana:

And I think if you think about a lot of times, Procurement professionals. And especially, maybe at Michelin, probably are very focused, right on cost cutting and savings and more the direct type of procurement versus the focus on marketing. I don't know if you saw that too, where they have a little bit more formalized process and things of

Beth:

that sort. It's actually really funny. I. To our raw materials buyer. And you can just imagine that someone purchasing and buying raw materials is going to have a much different strategy of much different day-to-day process than someone working in marketing. That's talking to people, the motor sports world, and we're talking about how we're going to get signage up and events planned, et cetera, et cetera. So I think that Michelin had a wonderful foundation. They had a procurement department for years, and so it was a great.

Rusty:

I don't think there's any competition between who's going to have more fun and their job, a raw materials buyer, or a marketing buyer. To me, that's just like a no brainer. All right, let's go with mark. Hey,

Beth:

you know what I feel? I don't, if you want to be a raw materials, Bower buyer, more power to you. They're much smarter than me. They probably have the time of their life outside of work. But I think my skillset calls a lot better with the marketing team. Yeah.

Dana:

In pharmaceuticals, right? Raw materials. You're on 24 7. If something had caught gets caught up at right customs and has to come in, you have to be ready to get it through. You don't want to say. Product from getting the patients like that's a huge responsibility and stress. And so I'm with you. I would not want to go to that side. I have much respect for them, but it's this stress in my life. I just don't think I

Beth:

need exactly well. And I think that their skillset is usually focused more on the chemical side. So a lot of them are engineers. And I think that they're very savvy in that type of role.

Rusty:

So what do you look back? What were some of the lessons learned as you came from marketing into procurement? What were some of the hardest adjustments that you experienced?

Beth:

I think it was a really interesting experience. It was an introspective experience, meaning that I was very empathetic to their needs. And so I think a lot of times what drives people in procurement crazy about marketing teams is they're moving quickly. They have outlandish requests, or they might come to you with some ideas that are just really challenging for people in procurement to approve. But since I have lived in their shoes, I found it like a breath of fresh air. I thought it was fun. And innovative. And I liked that we were challenging the procurement process to maybe think a little bit outside of the box. So from my perspective, I've just seen it as a great challenge. And I love the fact that I'm empathetic to what their needs are. And so, yeah, I've seen. So

Dana:

we had talked previously and you said a lot of times marketing folks will panic when they hear procurement and they panic because they hear processes. And me and rusty were actually joking earlier about like he, he gets on here and I'm very processed, focused. It's just, it's, I've learned a lot from this. What do you take away from them? Panicking from the procurement process?

Beth:

This is great. Okay. So this is why I like my job too, because I would need the same way if I were there and forget another day in the life, the best couple of years ago. I think what I've learned is that if I'm presenting. Uh, processes to anyone in marketing, they will read the first slide panic and say, I can't handle this. And they run away. So what I have done is I like to do things that I would prefer. And so I would prefer something like a bulleted. Here's this crap here is what you do. You email me for questions to you, click here to see what you need to do next three, as basic as I can make it. And that does not mean that I am trying to dumb it down. It doesn't mean that I don't think that they can read this other document. I would say. That their thought process, as far as processes are concerned is it's very minimal throughout the day. They like to explore and think about other things. Again, outside of the box, they like to utilize their right brain. Their left brain is more for checking their emails. And so when they think of procurement, that's another part of your left brain that I don't think that they really enjoy using. And so what I have always done is I've minimized a lot of their reading materials. So again, I like bullet points. I send them bullet points to follow, and then if I need them to fill in a form, I create that form based on how I would write. To fill out forms. I don't need all this information to confuse me. I asked them for two or three things, and then I, as a procurement manager can figure out the rest. So I think I tried to think about what I would prefer if I was in their shoes, knowing what they have to do on a day-to-day basis. And then I try to reinvent the wheel just a little bit for the marketing. Which is cool.

Dana:

And probably one of the reasons why Michelin did pick you up, right? Because you're able to think, oh gosh, this is way too much. This process is too much. But if I can simplify it in a way that makes sense to me, I know other marketers have a like-mind and they'll understand it from this perspective versus procurement spending 20 minutes on a huge deck. And they'll never get past the first page. You've been able to make that kind of connection.

Beth:

Absolutely. So I've been spoiled here at GoDaddy because my position did not exist before I started. And I'm relatively new to the role. And so I started in January of this year. So I've been there for five months and what's been really unique about this is that it was a divide and conquer approach from a marketing perspective. So our procurement team would say person a take this marketing contract person B take this contract. And I think that it, it works. But no one has a marketing background. And so their approach was similar to Michelin. They said, we want to bring someone in that could both be a resource to our marketing teams, be part of their team, but then also come in with maybe some refresh ideas for the procurement team and have kind of one funnel for all marketing items. So I think that it's, it's been really fun here at GoDaddy because I have been able to create some of my own unique. You know, processes for the marketing teams. And I think it's a great learning curve for the organization. And I'm really leaning on the marketing teams to educate me on what they need and how I can help them.

Rusty:

How receptive has the GoDaddy marketing team been with having this new.

Beth:

I they've been receptive enough. I think that there are certain groups that are still trying to understand what does procurement do? Why am I here? Why can't I just go straight to legal? And I think that the learning permanent always is. And so it's not unique to GoDaddy. I think. What's interesting about GoDaddy as an organization is they've grown a lot. And what I mean by that is they've always been a national company here in the U S they've grown globally. And so I now have the opportunity to work with the marketing team in Australia, in China, in. Germany, wherever that might be. And so every group is unique and we're all trying to build a unique process within the country. And also within the individualized teams here in the U S there's, someone that's buying media every day is going to be different than someone that is a video shoot or someone that is working with an agency every single day. So I think every approach is a little bit unique and I've tried to come up with ways that we can tailor specific processes. Specific groups, but it's still a work in progress. And I like to learn from them as I go.

Dana:

That brings us to, we had a conversation. So this is actually really interesting to me because I know it's new to you, or at least it's new to me, but I think it could be one of those things that is best in practice for procurement professionals. And the process is for you guys, they have to go through you to actually get to

Beth:

legal. Okay, so this is amazing and kudos to my manager. I worked for our chief procurement officer here at GoDaddy, and he is the foundation for procurement here at GoDaddy. So he had seen a lot of other. Groups across the us and how they worked in their procurement organizations. And I think that from what I've been told by him, it's, it was very important that legal and procurement work hand in hand. And so. What that means. And to go off of your question, when we are working with the marketing team and I'm hearing about what they're doing, we're talking about the contract. Once I have approved it. And once I agree to everything that we're going to be doing, then they can. Send it to legal for approval. You're not allowed to contact legal with really any questions until you start with procurement. So talk about an amazing idea, right? And then not go to Eddie. Has these amazing tech platforms that I'm able to utilize. And the communication is there for both legal and procurement to utilize. And it's been an awesome approach. And I think it's been working really well. Are you

Rusty:

able to speed up the response time that legal gets back to marketing with? Because that drives me absolutely nuts. How long it takes to get something simple back. I get NDA.

Beth:

Ooh, I love it. So here's another thing that GoDaddy does that I just think is incredible. We have a way to communicate. For quick needs like an NDA. And so those turnaround times are it's as quick as you can make them very quick within 24 hours. I think when it comes to, we'll say a very long-winded scope, right? Or a long-winded master service agreement, there is a way for me to expedite. And a lot of that is just via some communication tools that we have at GoDaddy. I think though, I typically just respect their process. I know that it's not as quick as maybe I would dream it to be, but I can always expedite. I communicate via our system that we use back and forth, but ultimately it's up to them. So there's not a button that I can press that says, please speed up. No. No, there is not, but at the same time I pick my battles when they're necessary. I think that one thing I struggle with rusty is that a lot of people in marketing think that their project is the most urgent and the most important, and they need it now. And

Rusty:

don't worry about sales too.

Beth:

I think, I think most people have that in the back of their mind and I don't blame them again. That's how I would think too. I've got to get this done. So there's nothing wrong with that approach. The challenge that I have in procurement is to prioritize those requests, right. And since I am the funnel for every single contract, it makes it easier for me to. Communicate that to legal, right? So even though legal might seem slow, it might be because there's 25 monster contracts that they're having to figure out in your individualized contract just might not be at the top of the list. So with that set everyone's items are important, but it helps for procurement to know what they should prioritize.

Dana:

Because to me, you mentioned technology, is technology really like the linchpin to this working?

Beth:

No, I would say that the reason this works is because we're following a process. In theory, every organization should be following a business unit, has their budget that they're managing. It's not my job to tell them how they spend their money. And I've made that perfectly clear. My job is to make sure that we are doing the best thing for GoDaddy from a financial perspective and also from a business ethics perspective. And since I see. Varieties of contracts. I think it's important that procurement sees everything. And once I say, okay, they're not ripping us off for no, we didn't just sign another sow with the person that you sit next to every day. I think that having just that second pair of eyes for them is just, is important because legal unfortunately does not have the visibility that I think. As far as what we're spending with, who I think that they're great, obviously reviewing the contracts, making sure that everything is very buttoned up, but as far as the beginning approach and being involved in these early brief meetings like procurement is I think that it's invaluable to not go through procurement. If you're going straight to legal nine times out of 10, Legal has questions for procurement and it slows down the process. So where do the Y's work? Your procurement? It does it slow it down? It's only going to speed it up in the long run depending

Rusty:

on the company. Not every company's organization though is like that. Unfortunately.

Beth:

I w I will say this one thing that I've, I have found impressive. And again, not every company is this legal is responsible for routing our contracts to DocuSign. So no one from the business routes, things for DocuSign, because truthfully they wanted to take that type of burden off of the business. Legal wanted to take that responsibility off of them, and they wanted to take, keep that in house because ultimately they're the ones responsible for the current. Itself, right. The internal teams don't necessarily need to keep holding onto this contract. So I would just say in a perfect world, procurement would be involved in most negotiations, most contracts.

Dana:

We always, at least where I work or like you got to involve us early on and we'll be able, and it's like a goal of ours to expedite that process, to be able to expedite with legal. Right. We somewhat get a little bit trained on. Legal business terms and things of that sort. And that's where we can help, hopefully if we're involved early in the process. But I think we had also a couple other discussions about the dynamic between procurement and legal, right. And how necessary that is and how what's the word for it. It's just, it is maybe it's linchpin. It's so key for us to be productive and get. Through that we need to do. Like that relationship really is key for procurement to get anything done. We can negotiate the best business terms and rates, but if legal can't get them into the contract, then you know what good is, what we've done.

Beth:

Well, and I think that's a great point. I think it's been something I've had to work on throughout the past several years is looking at literally every person I work with within an organization as if I'm rusty a client, I am having to make sure that my relationships are strong. Whether it's with legal, whether it's with accounts payable, whether it's with the marketing team, I have to have a great relationship with all of those people are, my job becomes so much harder and it just becomes impossible to do my job, frankly. And I think when it comes to legal, I think that having that solid relationship and the trust sits there, I think this is super helpful. As an example, I love the. If legal sees something that maybe they're uncomfortable with and they think that I would be uncomfortable with it. They looped me in right there. I'm not perfect. I don't catch everything all the time and they could easily just route it and get it done. But I think. If you have that really good relationship with legal and they understand what you're trying to accomplish, and you communicate that within it only helps your job and your role. So I think it's important, not just with legal. I think with accounts payable, even you have to have a great relationship with them.

Rusty:

So let's talk about marketing's return on investment and the tools you use to track and create the scorecards and measure the success of their agencies and partners. Have you found with our certain tools that you use and Dana jumping here as well from your experience?

Beth:

Ooh. I love that question. So I am a marketing research nerd, love it, love doing marketing research. And truthfully I do some side marketing research jobs just for fun. I just love the data behind it. And I just love doing deeper dives of perception and brand awareness, et cetera. But to answer your question directly, there are tools that you can use. I think that GoDaddy actually has an internal system that they use to really treat. ROI. And I think that's really helpful from a procurement perspective. I'm not having to recreate the wheel. I know that at Michelin, it was something that was more on. Procurement to provide. And I think that there's several businesses out there that, that are tools for procurement. I know that currently we work with a company that helps us with market intelligence reports. And what's really neat about these market intelligence reports. They can include everything from some KPIs to look for some ROI that you should be looking for. They compare different companies. The industry that you're look that you're trying to compare, and they really give you a very thorough market intelligence report. As an example, there's been my team in Canada. They wanted to have some comparables with agencies that they work with. They wanted to make sure that their rates were. We're good enough and that we didn't need to really go in hard with the rates. And they also wanted to see, okay, well, given COVID how is this looking and for next year, how should our media look as we move forward? And I was able to work with this company and get a market intelligence report that both helped me from a negotiation perspective, and then also helps them from COVID-19 perspective and looking at. How everything has changed since the pandemic. So to answer your question directly there's tools out there, we utilize them. And if you don't, then you're doing yourself a disservice

Dana:

turning into my field like procurement. I don't know if you feel this way. Oh, there's MarTech stack. I feel like there's starting to be. And I was thinking about this morning, a procurement stack, like you have all these different layers. Benchmarking then you have finding vendors and suppliers in certain places, you have RFP RFX events, you have all these different ones that you can either layer on top or add to it. And we're really starting to look, obviously, not as crazy as a market tech stack or the space, but we're getting there. There's a lot of new tools that are coming to be able to help procurement, because I think it's been lacking in the

Beth:

past. I totally agree. And I think from my perspective, It's, that's why I liked my job. I love running RFPs. I love sourcing for vendors. I love just being that, that person that the internal team comes to and says, what should we do? What should our strategic approach be? Why should we leave this vendor? Do you have some recommendations? I love doing all of that research on my own to help our internal teams. And so if I'm able to piggyback off of. Uh, MarTech tool, like you're talking about I'm going to do it right. And I think that the way I see my role is truly to be a resource to the marketing teams. So when they have these questions, I want them to think, oh, procurement is a place that I can go to either run this RFP. They can do all that legwork for me so that I know we're in a competitive market. I don't know if this vendor is the best, can they help me figure that out? I'm working towards that. I want them to see me is not someone that just says approve a PO right, as part of my job. But at the same time, I want them to see me as someone that's really doing a lot of the digging for them so that they're not having to do it on their own.

Rusty:

I think marketers would appreciate that. Staying on that topic. What are some of the questions that marketers should be asking? There are more pro peers.

Beth:

The first thing I thought about is they need to always, they always need to think of their mark pro peers as someone that can help keep their vendors honest. That's what I always say. I said, even though we love vendor a, we love vendor a is what they would say, but we're a little concerned about ABC. My response is always, let's keep them honest. Let's run an RFP. It's healthy. It's healthy for both of us. It's good to make sure that from our perspective that we know what they have to offer, because I would say nine times out of 10 marketing companies are changing all the time and their offerings are changing. I don't know that they're changing until. Marquis where we asked, tell us some innovative ideas that you have or go daddy. I think that it's good for them. It's good for us too, because we're able to see what other companies are out there. And so I love keeping our vendors honest and I love challenging the team to. That way. So I would say that's to me that the go-to and then the second thing would be laying on your approach. People for any, anything that from a process perspective is maybe frustrating you within the organization. I think every one of procurement is very good at just processes in general. And that's what I do every day. I help people with processes. And so even if it has to do with how accounts payable is paying a vendor, is there a different process that we can. Incorporate. I think that procurement's a good person to go to and maybe ask questions about processes and maybe challenge the organization on processes. I think that senior leadership looks at procurement for process questions, right? So I would say that would be the number two that I could think of. So this brings

Dana:

me to a really good question, cause this is a super pet peeve of mine that I guess I haven't been on the marketing side. And I love to hear your perspective on is that a lot of times, as a procurement professional, at least when we could visit in person and have RFPs in person and have them pitch, you would see sometimes the marketing. Hugging and saying, Hey, by the way, how's, how's your husband doing? And just you're like, what is going on here? Like the relationship. Yes. I understand you guys work closely together, but are you BFS? Like outside of work, are you catching drinks? And to me, procurement, I'm going, you can't see clearly when you have these blinders on, if they are your bestie. And so as procurement and. Why are you hugging them? You can't hug them. This has gotta be fair. But I think as procurement, you can be that outside person to say, okay, they're great. Let's just make sure that there's nobody else greater. And if they are we'll stick with them, there's no problem. But keep them honest. Let's keep them honest and make sure that they have the best value in they're giving us everything that they could. See that as a Pepe or am I just a

Beth:

crazy, I'm the worst too? Cause I'm a very, Hey, how are you? Let's talk, let's do this. But I think one thing that I have done is from a professional perspective is I've really tried to hone in on the excitement and the hugs, right. When we're doing a pitch, I just don't think that's appropriate. I have always taken the approach to the marketing team. Do it, give the hugs you be the nice person. You were the one that they're going to have to work with all the time. I should be the one that's being the reserved one, take a step back. And I would say from a procurement perspective, let me have those hard conversations. I want them to adore you. I want them to love you and trust you. Let me have those conversations. Let me negotiate with them. You don't need to be doing that. You need to be the one that they come to and say, let's get drinks after work. That should not be my role. And so I think that it's actually healthy. I think that their life that I have always recommended that they keep their personalities alive. And let me take that more harder approach. I agree with

Rusty:

that. I agree with that. A hundred percent of it. I think most markers and even sales were the relationships that we've got and receptive to that because it should be business fun. Let's look at it from a sales perspective, there were ones in the trenches with them day in and day out on the creative side, on the campaign side. But then when it gets down to keeping them honest and the business elements y'all should come in and play that heavy there. But, and when you are sitting there saying, let's keep these, let's keep the vendors on. RFPs are expensive for companies to run. And is there a better way of keeping vendors? Honest without having to go through RFPs, especially if like a S very small chance that the business is going to change hands, there's gotta be a better way.

Beth:

So I'm going to speak from a procurement lens, and then if you want, I can speak from a sales lens. I've done both right from a procurement lens. My procurement Beth would say, If you want our business, you'll do an RP because if you want our business, these are our needs and we need our needs met. I think from your lens, my recommendation would be how valuable is this relationship? Should we participate in this RFP? Is it worth our time? Is it worth time? And if the answer is no walk away, RFPs are not mandatory. They're not something that you have to do. And so I think it depends on the vendor relationship. Candidly,

Rusty:

if you're 90% sure that look, we're going to retain them, we're not going to make a change, but we just wanna make sure do a benchmark. Water it down a little bit, shrink it down and make it, yeah,

Dana:

that's what I'm saying. There are ways, and I don't know, maybe Beth has seen this too, but really if you have discretion, like I know in most of my positions, we weren't very formalized procurement until we became part of the process, but I had discretion. And so to your point where I see I'm like, I don't want to put them through the grinder and we know it's a ton of time and a ton of money and we don't want to waste people's time and money. If we know there's a preferred provider. And they're going to get picked out anyways. We don't want to waste my own time and money or anybody else's. And I think if you have discretion are in our position, you're more than allowed to. But I think sometimes our hands are tied because certain places say, no guess what? It's been three years. You need to get this out and to

Beth:

discuss. And that's the thing and great point. I didn't think of it like that. I think some companies make you do an RFP if you're at a certain threshold and it's been, we'll say three to five years, if they don't, I still think it's recommended that your organization set some sort of threshold and run an RFP. Now, if you're getting an RFP rusty from. From an organization every year, walk away. No, I'm just teasing, but I think again, how valuable is that relationship for you? And I think that you just have to understand that it's usually a company protocol and to Dana's point, if you're a good procurement manager, you already have a good working relationship with this vendor, especially if they've already been a current. They know that this RFP is probably coming up. They're not blindsided. They're not coming from left field. I think that it's a great question because it weighs heavily on procurement managers to make the right call. And also

Rusty:

too, what happens is we talk about bridging that gap, right? The whole point of what we're trying to do here with Mar pro in this podcast is. Yeah. Find ways to get marketing and procurement more closely aligned. And a lot of times when you go to these reviews unnecessarily, sometimes where they're very in depth. And like I said, it can be really disruptive, especially if you're in a busy season where you just got to do it. It's like, Hey, we cut this in half. Can we just look at it this way? Do we need to send it out to 15 vendors? No, because also vendors are talking behind the scenes going, yeah, this is a joke. This is. We're all going to flush the floor at pricing, just to screw with the incumbent and make you put the pressure. And that's what people are, they're all doing. Cause they all know each other. It's a small circle typically in these different businesses and it just, it becomes a game. And I just

Dana:

interesting because I always thought that was going on behind the scenes to me. I'm like they have to be talking. There's no way you can be within pennies of the. Smart person and not be talking behind the scenes. There's just no way. And I think that brings up a good point. That procurement has to use some type of discretion, even if you're forced to do it every three years, you still can say, all right, let's do an abbreviated version or let's do we don't have to throw research at them. And they only have to come back with a full pitch and everything. Let's do something a little bit shorter. And that's one of the things I like to preach to other Amar pro people in. Use your discretion. Don't do it just because you have to do it in a way that makes sense for everybody and is efficient for everybody. And that

Beth:

we're not wasting time. See that I've learned being on the dark side of procurement. Now I'm just, I'm kidding. But I think definitely

Rusty:

the dark

Beth:

side, I would say what I have learned procurement knows everything. Procurement knows if we're going to. If we're going to RFP, because we know we're not going to work with this vendor, or they know that finance has had issues with payments. They know that legal is filing a settlement with a company and that we shouldn't be using them. Procurement knows everything. And so running an RFP, if it is, if they're just doing it to waste your time. They shouldn't be in the role that they're in. So I'll tell you this. I would say that nine times out of 10, at least what I've seen, and this is not just with marketing it, procurement is running an RFP. They're not doing it just for fun. It takes a lot of time out of your day to run an RFP if you're on a procurement. So I think that there's usually either other things going on. Or they might have to do it, but they know that there's a method behind the madness is I'm going

Rusty:

to give you perspective from marketing side nine out of 10 times, we think you are running it just to run it. We think you'll love it. And you think it's fun. And y'all like to waste our time. That is, I know I get that. But what I'm saying is we survey marketing and salespeople nine out of 10 times, that's the feedback they get.

Dana:

I do it for the chotchkies. Everybody loves the swag, please, when we could do it in office. That's my favorite part when they would come up with these great ideas. And we've talked about this before, rusty, where I just love to see these people, that creative, that they come up with and these different ideas and how they can pull through the campaign ads. And to me, that's what I love about. Yeah, it's super cool. And I feel like I've learned a lot in the past 10 years about marketing. Am I a marketer? Heck no, but I think it's interesting to see that and how it works and how consistency matters with brands. And you learn so much having that kind of insight as a procurement person. We're not going to just do it to do it. I think that's the old trash. Right. That's what we're trying to get out and move into a new light for a Mar pro is you don't have to just do it to do it use discretion, and yes, you can still do what the company requires, but you don't have to do it in a way that's time-consuming and costly. And a lot of times I've said to people during our fees, if we're not going to, if these, they really don't have. Let's not waste their time or their money like that to me is the wrong thing to do in business just to do it right. You're wasting everybody's time and money, including my own. And I'm just not appreciative of it. So when you can, you should try to use your discretion for not going through this whole huge process. And maybe it's shortened, right? Maybe you say, okay. Why don't you guys just give us a quick pitch stack of what you think it would be. Don't have to go through it's a half hour, give us some quick ideas and what you think would make sense. And we've done that too. And especially when marketing, I need this in two weeks. Can we get this RFP done in four weeks? Okay. But we're going to have to figure out a way to get it done in a way that makes sense. We're going to have to expedite calls. We're going to have everybody on one single call and all suppliers. And while we answer the questions that were submitted, we just have to find ways to be more efficient and that's fair. Right? And at the bottom, at the end of the day, you want everything to be fair. And I think if you're not, and you're just hammering on a marketing or on a supplier, It's not beneficial for anybody. I don't think

Rusty:

it real quick though. I don't think everything has to always be fair though. Life isn't fair. And I don't think business always has to be fair, but at the end of the day, let's not waste time. There's, let's look at it more strategically and say, how do you get, like in a convent should have an advantage. If they put the time they've been NG and they're doing really kick ass work for you, you know what? They should have the advantage to win that business and retain it. If they're doing a poor job or if there's problems with their operations, the way they're doing. I get that they're there. They're there. They're open to getting beat, but yeah.

Dana:

But the arrogance, sometimes I have seen with people have lost them. I cannot tell you how many times I've seen an agency come in. They are then comment. They know our business sometimes better than we know it. Sometimes they own like all our material and they own our background. And some of their people have been there longer than our internal people. So they really have the knowledge base we don't have, but they come in so arrogant, they think. Screw the pooch. They just completely lose the business. And it is so sad and you're like, these guys are really good, but they just came in. Like I have the business and that pretty much lost them business. So as much as income, it does have the edge. And if, I think if they spend the time, then they still will have the edge. You come in like saying I'm the incumbent, I've got this in my pocket. Your host,

Rusty:

you should always be pitching and you should always be bringing value. Sorry about that. I know every time you try to talk, right? No, we're not going to talk. This is our podcast.

Beth:

No. I was just gonna say, I think both of y'all are right. I think that though, from a procurement perspective, I think it's key for everyone in sales and marketing to understand that procurement knows a lot more than you think they know. There really is a method behind the madness. And what I mean by that is that we know when vendors are starting to get arrogant. We know when we're starting to hear from internal teams that there's. Or we know that prices are lower and maybe they'd come to procurement and said, we're not budging. You guys don't know that kind of stuff, because it's not your job to play the bad guy. So I think it's key that the I, what I'm hearing. Is that if you are upset with the RFP, I think you have to have a very transparent conversation with procurement and say, why are we running this? Is it strictly for protocol or not? If it's strictly for protocol, tell their manager that it's a waste of your time and they probably won't have to run it, or if it's not protocol and it's something that they think is actually going to help you. They're going to tell you. If it's something that's confidential, they're going to tell you that. So I think it's more about the conversation that the sales and marketing teams are having with that procurement manager. And usually you don't have to run one managers can veto you having to run one.

Rusty:

You're taking it for exactly what I'm trying to. The whole point of this is how do we change that dynamic of that perspective? If like you said, you procurement knows way more than marketing gives them. It depends on again. I think it depends on the business and actually who's in that position, but for this argument's sake, say that's, that is a fact procurement then needs to do a better job. In my opinion, as a marketer and sales guy to say, Hey, we need to share this information. You need to help us know that so that we're more aware of these problems with our agencies, with our partners. So. We can also on our side help, we have the relationship. Why not leverage it to say guys, you guys are on thin ice right now. And here's what we're hearing. You guys are screwing up the accounts payable. You're this and this. We're about to go to RFP. If this doesn't change, I don't see that happen. The quarterly

Dana:

business reviews come in and the problem I found as much as we want to run that. And that's a very process oriented thing for the procurement side marketing people are like, oh, I talked to them weekly. I don't need your stupid quarterly business review every single time. If I can get by yearly reviews, I'm happy, but we have a process for supplier relationship management and it is a very rigid, but again, As a Mar pro professional, you have the ability to say, listen, these things aren't going to translate. Let's do things agency focused, right? Are we happy with creative? Are they getting it done on time? How many rounds of revisions did we have to go through till we got a final product, right? You have that ability to take the QBR and. From something very rigid and process to something that does make sense so that we can share with the marketing team, Hey, and by the way, and I like to do this. So, and when the other brand team was using them for this, and this is what's happened just to let you know the bigger picture, right. Because I think best too has a global view. I have a global view of what they're doing and what they're spending on. Blending in with an internally where there are actually trying to make ends. And so I think that's part of our position as a professional is to have those quarterly business reviews and to give you guys that additional information

Rusty:

PBRs are, I think are a really important part of that process. And I think everybody should embrace that from all sides of the table, from the customer, the clients. Marketing side procurement, anybody that's going to be there, even finance. If they're there, they should all embrace that process. Even though it can be, it's like, oh, this you can go. They can drag on. But at the end of the day, the intent is how do you further along the business relationship so that you're extracting the most value,

Beth:

true professional that can do QPRs for their. More power to you. I beat that a long time ago. It is unrealistic. No way. Can you do that with all your vendors? I think that if you can do mid-year reviews and commit to that's where you should head, that's my recommendation and I'm sticking to it.

Rusty:

Stephanie depends on the volume, the size of the vendor. You're not going to do it with everyone, but if they're spending a percentage of more in your, in the overall spend and more. That it's justified. I agree. And also too depends on how lean your department is too. But other organizations, they have multiple people that are managing different products within the overall category and they segment it out differently. And it's a little bit more feasible. I know we're starting to get towards the end of our time and I'll tell you, this has been pretty enlightening. Is there anything else before we put a bow on it? We want to make sure we discuss or talk about

Beth:

today. I think it's important for. Everyone to just. Think of procurement as part of their team. I think that should be the end goal, right? That's in a perfect marketing procurement world that, that this Mar pro person is not part of the procurement department, that they are literally part of the marketing team and they're there to help them with everything that's going on. Now, I say that knowing. You are part of the market. You are part of the securement team, but I think that should be it an end goal to where the communication is there. That trust is there that willingness to bend over backwards for the marketing team is there. And I doubt every organization has that right back. I'm sure. So I think that should be a goal of someone in my seat to have that right. And that would be the last thing I would say.

Rusty:

And there's a reason why marketing procurement, there's marketing in there. You're a part of marketing and marketing needs to understand that. And we need to embrace that the same time. The procurement, you also needs to understand. There are, you know, it's a marketing function that. And there are some differences in way that we operate because it's not always black and white with the metrics, even though that we do try to rely on it's becoming more important, but there is some creative element. There is some intangibles that are hard to measure that, go into it. And so I think the close we get to it again, I that's what the power that these conversations are because the more we can all align ourselves, the better it's going to be for everybody. That's a more pro on both sides of the table. So this has been great. We talked about. Being empathetic to the marketing's needs. We've talked about how procurement illegal or operating more closely together and why it's an, a brilliant, poor way to funnel it through. Especially, I think it's interesting that we are doing it at go daddy. We talked about what questions marketers should be asking their procurement peers. And it's been a really fun conversation. And I appreciate the time to share your input and helping us bridge that gap. Thank

Beth:

you both. This has been fun.