Every time I go around telling people that this, we're doing this kind of advocacy, the first thing that they say is like oh, so you're pushing your curriculum into the schools and, to be clear, like NGPF which is the organization, the nonprofit organization where I've been working since 2018 Does have curriculum. It is available for free. Anybody can look at the lessons, the curriculum, the units, all of the materials for free at NGPF org. Go to curriculum. They have middle school curriculum and high school curriculum and it's all free.
Speaker 2:Hey, this is Allison, and welcome to the inspire budget podcast, where we talk all things budgeting debt and saving money. Today we have Janelle Espinall joining us. She is a Brooklyn born ball of energy with an intimate knowledge of financial education, culture and politics in America. Known on the internet as miss be helpful, she's a millennial financial educator who started her career as a teacher, just like me, and now serves as a director of educational outreach At next-gen personal finance. She is currently on a political roller coaster ride across the country convincing lawmakers to make Personal finance a high school graduation requirement. I know Janelle in person. She is incredible and I think you're going to love today's episode with her. Let's dive in. Welcome, janelle, to the inspire budget podcast. I'm so happy you're here today.
Speaker 1:I'm so happy to be back. It's so nice to chat with you, allison.
Speaker 2:Yes, so you were actually on podcast, episode 28, where we talked about how you changed your mindset around money, but now we're gonna be talking about how you actually became it really involved in advocating for financial literacy in schools. So I want to know when hear your story, when did you realize that this was a passion for you? And then what do you actually do to help advocate for kids Really?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's really what it is. Yes, it's the next generation. So we talked about my personal death story when we first chatted and and that ultimately was kind of the north star that like led me to Become so passionate about personal finance, because I saw firsthand the difference that it made in my life to Learn about money and how it works and I wish that I had learned it sooner. And as I just started going down to the real world and like talking to more people, everybody says it. Every adult that I've ever met has said at some point Like I wish that they had taught me about money in school before. I wish I understood taxes. I wish they taught us about you know, loans and interest rates, and I wish I understood that investing and how it works. Every generation is just gonna continue to say it like, at what point are we going to cut that out and have the next generation say I'm so glad I got that class about money, about taxes, about investing? That led me to kind of shift my work to financial education.
Speaker 1:In 2018 was when I kind of made that pivot and I started focusing on unprofit work, which is like curriculum and offering teachers training, so I actually do certification courses that I facilitate and the teachers sign up and take it. This was all great, it's all free, through a nonprofit that I work with called ngpf. However, about two years ago, we actually decided to pivot and create a new organization affiliated organization, which is also nonprofit called the mission 2030 fund, and that organization does specifically Advocacy work. So that means that we go to lawmakers like representatives and senders and we sit before them and we say, hey, have you seen the latest data around the effectiveness of financial literacy education? Have you seen the stats around the need and have you seen the poll results around parents and students wanting and demanding financial education Seems like we've got the perfect formula here to make it happen. What do, what do we need? You know what do you need to get it done?
Speaker 1:And so once you find a champion, a senator or a representative who is passionate about education Maybe they're a member of the education committee, maybe they used to be in education, for whatever reason, they decide to author the bill, to push it through, champion it.
Speaker 1:Essentially, what their job is going to be is to actually get as many people to support, from the Department of Education, from the teachers union, from the superintendent's board, from all over, right from from the bankers league, from the credit union folks, everybody, small business owners to Come together and agree that this law should be passed and to get everybody to vote yes and to get everyone to support it. So it takes a lot of convincing and phone calls and meetings and Explaining you know what the bill language means and all getting on the same page about how it's going to get done. And that's a lot of work but it's honestly very rewarding because once you get to people to see your points and to come over onto your side, it's just like we're all doing something that's kind of like common sense, which is getting everybody more financial literacy education.
Speaker 2:I was gonna ask you have a lot of pushback from these people that you're trying to convince and, if so, what is their reasoning for the pushback? Because to me it just seems like you said it's like a no-brainer Hello, you want to teach our kids about all these important things? Well, monies are really important things, so let's do that. So where is the pushback usually?
Speaker 1:I'm just curious. I get that question a lot. It's like well, why would anybody say no to financial education? And the thing is, nobody says no to financial education. People say no to the way that it's going to be implemented and to the impact that it could potentially have, which is sometimes unintended. So, for example, if you think about the school day in a typical high school, it's usually going to be about 8 am to 2 30 or 8 am to 3 pm, and you already have so many requirements that have to happen in that time. So now, if you're going to add a new requirement that didn't exist before, you either need to make the school day longer so that that class can be added to the school day, or you need to take something out to replace it. Right, this is just how it works. Now, if you make the school day longer, the teachers' union is not going to be happy. But teachers aren't going to be happy about that. They sign a contract. Students aren't going to be happy about that. Parents aren't going to be happy about that. Nobody wants that, right. So that's not going to work. So now it means that usually you're trying to see where you're going to fit it into the schedule, which means you're going to have to usually pull something out.
Speaker 1:Now, let's say you pull something out. This is not happening right now, but I'm just going to give you an example. Let's say we take out arts classes like visual arts, performing arts, dance. Now, all of a sudden, you've got the art teachers and the dance teachers and the students who are passionate about art and dance to say why are you removing that class? Why are you taking that away from us? We love this, we need extra curriculars.
Speaker 1:So now there's kind of a battle there. Okay, well, let's say we're not going to touch that. Let's say we lower the amount of foreign language credits that we take. Now you got all the foreign language teachers saying wait, what the students need? A foreign language? There's research that shows foreign language matters. So, as you can see, it's not that people are going to say no to financial education. It's that they're going to be interested in what are the puzzle pieces that need to be put together perfectly in place so that everyone is happy with the way things are going to change in order to make room for a full semester. Requirement of personal finance in high school.
Speaker 2:Has any state or any county been successful and come?
Speaker 2:together with that and if so I mean, I know this is very nuanced, but can you give us like an overview of how they were able to find that success? Mostly not because I expect every single listener to go and march on this or anything, but even just being aware and saying, hey, this is an, this is an opportunity to have or it's an option, it's happening other places. Maybe I should care about it too. So I'm just curious, like just like this overview of how did they make it work? Because I see the issue, I see the issue of not wanting to take it away and everyone thinks that different things are important. So how do you come to an agreement.
Speaker 1:That's exactly right. Everyone thinks that the issue that they care about the most is the most important issue, and so now you've got lawmakers who have to sit down and prioritize these things. And again, like I listen, I think lawmakers have a really hard job. I mean, I didn't run for office, I became a teacher and I know teaching is very hard, but law being a lawmakers also hard, because you have all these constituents coming to you with all of these different issues that they care about and that are all important, and your job is to work with other lawmakers to prioritize them, which means tricky because you're going to say some are more important than others and then that kind of get heated. But I will say so.
Speaker 1:In my book I talk about my work, which was with the state of Florida. I moved to Florida in 2021. And immediately I realized there was an opportunity to get involved there with the legislative work, because in 2019, there had been a law that was trying to. There was a bill that was trying to become a law that was pushing for a financial literacy class to be required for every student in Florida High school students, high school students. So when I'm talking about students, yeah, when I'm talking about these laws specifically mean grades nine through 12.
Speaker 1:So, like high school age students, what happened with Florida was that in 2019, there was a log that got passed. It was called the Financial Literacy Act and it was named after Dorothy Huckel, who was a lawmaker in Florida who had championed financial literacy for many, many years before passing away, sadly. And what happened there was that when it passed the language of the bill this is kind of where we get into, like the legal side right, the language. Right, the language that was written into the bill changed right, because it goes through all of these different processes, it goes to different committees and it goes to different people. It goes back to the other side of the other side of the chamber. So there are some amendments and changes that happen along the way. By the end, the bill that actually got passed and signed into law didn't actually make it a requirement for every student to take and pass the class. What it did was it said every single school in the state of Florida must, must, is required to offer a personal finance class to students. That bill got signed. Everyone was clapping, celebrating. Woo hoo, florida did it. We required financial literacy. Technically, they did require that schools offer it, but they didn't require that every student must take it before they cross the graduation stage.
Speaker 1:So I saw that and what we did was we went to the Florida Department of Education and we said can you show us some of the data from before the law and after the law? And there was very clear data that before the law was passed, there were a lot of students getting financial literacy because it was embedded into an economics class, so at least half the year they were getting personal finance and the other half economics. But because it got pulled out and became an elective that just had to be offered, less students were getting access to personal finance as a result. Now, that was an unintended result, but still, the data is data. So we went to the lawmakers with that data and all the lawmakers in Florida said, oh, that was not the intention, that's not what we wanted to do. So they looked at all of the data and said, okay, let's make a change here.
Speaker 1:The easiest way to go in Florida specifically was to look at the electives, because Florida had the highest number of elective credits that are needed for graduation of all 50 states. In order to graduate, you needed eight elective credits. Really, yeah, every other state it was like six or 6.5 or seven credits of electives, but Florida, for some reason, was eight. We looked at that and said, okay, let's take this to the lawmakers and let's tell them that they have the highest in the nation and if they just drop that by 0.5 years which is one credit, one semester, that, or half of a year, a semester class that we could then say we're gonna lower the electives to 7.5 credits required and now the 0.5 credit that used to be an elective will now be a required personal finance course. So that's what happened in Florida.
Speaker 1:The bill got signed HB 1054. I was at the bill signing. It was a very big success. And after Florida, what do you know? Iowa, georgia, michigan, kansas, new Hampshire, west Virginia, indiana all have passed since then. So we've gone from eight states to 19 states in early 2023.
Speaker 2:That's incredible.
Speaker 1:Do you have a goal?
Speaker 2:Do you have a goal for all 50 states?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so actually the organization's name that was created in 2022, like to do all of this work or sorry, 2021, when I started this work is called Mission 2030 Fund, because the year 2030 is when we wanna be able to say all 50 states now have this is the year 2030. So it's like we're gonna just like put a stake in the ground and say, if we keep doing this work and we go state by state by state, from now 2023, in the next seven years, we can get from 19 to all 50. It's a big, ambitious goal, but like that's the goal, that's what we're working towards.
Speaker 2:You know what you need to look for right. You've seen the success and you're like, okay, here's the pattern we have to follow. People will try to mess it up. There will be different things that happen, but this is kind of the path we will follow to get there.
Speaker 1:I love that let's go. I love that.
Speaker 2:Let's go. Today's episode is brought to you by my budget to build wealth. Here's the truth. I do not believe actually I refuse to believe that wealth is just for the rich. I believe that wealth can be built on a budget without sacrificing what you love to spend money on. I fully believe that budgeting is the quickest, most effective way for you to reach your money goals. So, whether your goal is to stop living paycheck to paycheck, pay off those student loans that have been hanging over your head, or find room in your budget every single month so that way you can start investing for your future, you're going to need a guide, a plan to get yourself there, which is exactly what I'm sharing in my free training budget to build wealth.
Speaker 2:In this training, I'm going to be sharing three massive mistakes that people make with their budget and their financial plan, so that way you can avoid them. I'm going to be sharing with you the secret to freeing up more money in your budget each month, so that way you can send extra money to your goals, and I'm going to be sharing with you my tried and true four step framework to budgeting your way to wealth without giving up what you love. Plus, there is a very special free gift for anyone who stays until the end. You can sign up by going to inspiredbudgetcom slash class or just click the link in my show notes. You'll be able to choose a time that works for your schedule and I'll see you there.
Speaker 2:I'm curious because you know I used to be a teacher and I have children who will be going into high school eventually one day, and I'm wondering do you have any hand on what the concepts are required to teach? And I'm curious what is it that they are required to talk on? Is it just like budgeting and saving money? Do we talk about investing? How much can a high schooler actually handle?
Speaker 2:whether they are 14 versus 18 in that semester time to actually retain the information. Because, you know, it's one thing to just spew it at them they memorize it for a test. It's another thing for them to actually say, okay, I've learned this, let me take it forward with me, right?
Speaker 1:That's a great point and an excellent question, because it kind of looks different in every state and that's the thing about education. Like in our country, education is not one of these federal level issues that, like, the federal government can just say like this is what every state has to do, because some issues are federal issues that everyone has to do it. That way, education is a state issue, so that means it's local control issue, which means every single state gets to determine when they pass their law what's going to get taught in that course. So, for example, you might see, like right now in the state of Georgia, georgia passed SB 220, which is the financial literacy requirement for a full semester, which could be either a math class or a social studies class or an elective. So they gave a lot of flexibility for students to fit it into their graduation requirements. They could count towards math credit, towards social studies or towards an elective right.
Speaker 1:But here's the thing about Georgia's standards it's one of the only states. It actually, I think currently is the only state where the financial literacy law that got passed mentions cryptocurrency. Yeah, all the other states if you look at the laws. So HP 1054 in Florida does not mention digital currencies. It says banking, credit investing, insurance, real estate investing. It mentions all of the basic core concepts around money and most states do. They say banking, budgeting, investing, taxes, insurance, paying for college, all of these things that like, generally speaking, we could call those like the pillars of personal finance, like the basic big topics.
Speaker 1:But in Georgia, the law says cryptocurrency has to be taught as well. So that brings in this next piece of well the teachers themselves need. If they don't understand this, how can they be expected to teach it? So, on top of like being very clear about the topics in the law, like or assigning it to the Department of Education or the Board of Ed of that state, and saying by this day, at this time, the Board of Ed or the Department of Ed must publish the specific topics that are going to be taught in this class.
Speaker 1:Like the law can't say that, so that the law doesn't. The lawmakers don't get to decide it. The education professionals do, but they're being told when they have to do that by. In Georgia, the law specifically listed it and in other states it might not. The important thing is that there has to be some way where it's addressed, either in the law or in assignment to the DOE to do it. The second piece is that there has to be some clarity around teacher training, like there has to be a piece involving how can the teachers get their training that they need to teach it.
Speaker 2:Can you imagine like any teacher teaching this, Like if they're not even aware? I mean, it's one thing, and a lot of times teachers are given some sort of resource, which means that this is the time for different education companies and textbook companies to step up and create some sort of curriculum for it that the schools can purchase and districts can purchase, and all of that. But it's very exciting but also a little scary to say who is going to be teaching this and what is the spin, what is the biased view that children are going to have, especially when it comes to things that we as adults might not know much about because they are so brand new. So it's like scary but exciting and I'm kind of like I want to be the one to.
Speaker 2:Part of me. I've always thought like I ever went back to teaching. I would go back as a high school teacher and teach like a personal finance class because I'm like I think that would be fun. But yeah, wow, that's so fascinating.
Speaker 1:No, it is. And one thing I'll tell you is that's the trick about this work. Every time I go around telling people that this we're doing this kind of advocacy, the first thing that they say is like oh so you're pushing your curriculum into the schools. And, to be clear, like NGPF which is the organization, the nonprofit organization where I've been working since 2018 does have a curriculum. It is available for free. Anybody can look at the lessons, the curriculum, the units, all of the materials for free at ngpforg go to curriculum. They have middle school curriculum and high school curriculum and it's all free.
Speaker 1:In the legislative work that we're doing, so when I'm talking to lawmakers, when I'm talking to education leaders, I'm not there with NGPF. I'm there with the Mission 2030 Fund, which is advocating for financial literacy education. Now we may say don't worry, because the laws they don't need to include like a budget, like they don't need to include a lot of money here, because there's really no need to buy like textbooks. For example, if you buy a financial literacy textbook and it includes the 1040 EZ for tax forms, right, the moment the 2019 legislation passed for tax changes, the 1040 EZ was gone. There's no such thing as a 1040 EZ. So now all those textbooks that were printed and paid for are outdated and incorrect. So, when it comes to stuff like money, which constantly regulations, legislation is changing every day. Technology comes out buy now, pay later, cash out, venmo all these things trading platforms that didn't exist two to five years ago. This is changing so fast that it has to be online based. So our curriculum is all online, it's all free and we never, ever, ever, included in any of the legislation that.
Speaker 1:If you look at the bills which I encourage people to go, look at the bills that have passed they don't prescribe what curriculum. The person who gets to decide the curriculum is at the school level the teachers, the principal. They get to decide what curriculum they're gonna use to teach, as long as it hits all of the standards and all of the topics listed in the bill or listed by the DOE. And the key that you said, which I love, is the bias the curriculum at NGPF, and one of the reasons why I love the work I've been doing with them is that the goal is to stay unbiased in every single topic. So when we teach cryptocurrency, we're not evangelizing for cryptocurrency. We're also not trying to tell people to stay away from cryptocurrency. We're just teaching what is cryptocurrency, helping them explore this so they can decide for themselves whether they wanna do it or not.
Speaker 1:Same thing with credit. As a teacher, it's not your job to tell students go get a credit card, go get good credit. It's also not your job to tell students stay away from credit, don't ever have credit. That's not your job. Your job is to teach them what is credit, what are the benefits, what are the drawbacks? Why does a person, would a person, find themselves in a situation where they might need it? What happens if a person never has credit? You're just exploring the topic of credit and then letting them use their critical thinking skills to make a decision about whether they wanna use that in their financial life or not.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's also like I think. A lot of times when we think about what our kids are learning at in school, we think, oh my gosh, it's like a parent telling them, but it's not like I can have a very biased opinion. I'm going to be very biased whenever I talk to my children about money, because it's my right, it's my job, I am an influential person in their life and I'm trying to influence them and you have your values.
Speaker 2:you have your values that you wanna instill in them at home. Yeah, Exactly so. I will do my best to instill those values in them, and if they say that's not a value for me and their adults, okay, I cannot do anything about that. But when it comes to teachers, it's very different, because we cannot instill those types of values, especially in the public education system.
Speaker 1:So wow, it's so incredible.
Speaker 2:I do have one final question for you. I just wanna know what are some of the most common financial challenges that you are seeing young people like teenagers facing today. And then, what do you think that obviously the schools, but also parents, can do to help them overcome that? Before we release them into this big world, what are the challenges they're facing? What can we do in the schools and as parents to help get them through that?
Speaker 1:I love this because I actually dedicated the whole second chapter of my book to this topic and that's why this is like perfect. So I think what happens is a lot of times we teach students the things that they need to learn, memorize, know right, and we don't actually teach them before you even get to the knowledge, like the mental things that they need to understand are happening in their minds before they even hit the knowledge. So in chapter two of my book it's called like it's all about getting your mind right, and the focus there is about understanding that you, as a person, you may think that you are in full control of the decisions that you make with your money, but most of the time almost all of the time you're not, and the reason why is because you have these cognitive biases. That means that your brain shoots into automatic mode and doing things a certain way because of the psychology that we have developed and the way that we look at things and assign value or not assign value to them in society as they relate to money. So, for example, if you walked on a window with a display and you see there's a Gucci shirt or a Fendi purse, it's gonna catch your attention. You can't trust your brain in those instances, Like you have to really ask yourself are you finding this Fendi purse to be pretty, or is it just that your brain is doing what it would do if it were, like, addicted to things? Because when you look at name brand things or anything that like is perceived to be cool, your brain responds in the same way as if you were snorting cocaine or winning at gambling. And that would be it. Yes, it's literally like as if you were on a high of drugs or gambling.
Speaker 1:So what I do in the chapter is focus on what does the research say, and this is what I think the answer to your question is that we should be doing in schools and parents should be doing at home is focusing on the psychological piece. What does the data show that your brain is doing and what can you do to like check yourself to a double take and like interrupt, interrupt your brain and prevent it from doing the thing it would automatically do, just because it's an autopilot mode and not thinking really about what it's doing with money? So I go through a bunch of different behavioral science and behavioral economics examples of ways that people's brains trick them and how you can use that to your advantage. So I talk about one where, like, there was a conference and a bunch of the attendees were asked like next week, when you come back for the part two of the conference, there's going to be bananas and there's going to be chocolates in the snack area. What, next week, when you come back, will you pick bananas as a snack or chocolate? Almost everybody like the majority of them said that they were going to pick bananas because you know they wanted to be healthy. They wanted to be like oh, we're at a conference, you know we're going to go with the healthy option. The following week, when they came back, they actually recorded how many people said they were going to pick bananas and how many said chocolate, and how many did it. The majority of them picked chocolate as a snack. They left the bananas right there and just walked by them and grab chocolate.
Speaker 1:And that's one of the biases that I wrote about in chapter two of my book, which is like you are going to think that in the future you will always do the right thing, you're always perfect in the future, like I'm going to save more when I get away.
Speaker 1:I'm going to increase my retirement contributions when I get my bonus check, I'm going to do this and that I'm always perfect in the future.
Speaker 1:But the reality is what you're not doing now, right now, today is not magically going to start happening tomorrow. You have to start doing it now so that tomorrow and the next day and the next day you've already started doing it and it's now happening. So it's like this battle between, like our current present self and our future self that we think now I'm not doing it, but don't worry, I'm going to do it tomorrow. I'm always going to do it tomorrow. So I think when we teach students about behavioral economics, the psychology of money, these biases, these tactics being used by advertising companies and marketing agents to trick our brains, then we teach them to really mind their money. That's why my book is called Mind your Money, because it's like it's this combination between the money, the stuff that you do with money, and the money skills you need to know, but also it's being taking tapping into the power of your brain so that it works with you and for you and not against you when it comes to your money. Oh my gosh, I love that Okay.
Speaker 2:So when is your book out?
Speaker 1:My book comes out May 30th 2023. Mind your Money is insightful stories and strategies to help you reach your hashtag money goals.
Speaker 2:I love it. Okay, and we'll link to the book down below, because this episode will be out by then. Janelle, this was incredible. If this is just like a taste, just like a preview of what is in your book, then I think people are going to love it, because it was fascinating. Now, at the end of every episode, I like to ask my guest a couple of questions so we can get to know you outside of all of the amazing work that you're doing with money. Yes, let's do it so don't think too hard about them.
Speaker 2:The first question is what's one thing you're looking forward to?
Speaker 1:I'm looking forward to having some free time over the summer this summer with my parents. One of the things that they've been doing for the past few years is just like getting themselves established as like being officially retired, and we finally got into a groove where they can spend half the year in Dominican Republic with their families, where they were born and raised, and the other half here in the States and like in New York, with their kids and our family, and so this summer they're going to be coming back from DR spending some time with us. I kind of like actually miss them. They've been in DR for a while now. I'm like I'm going to be with my mom and dad this summer and I will have my book published, so I think they'll actually be able to hold the copy in their hand and like I'll get to see them and be proud of me. Oh that's wonderful.
Speaker 2:The second question is what's one money mistake you've made that you would tell everybody to avoid?
Speaker 1:Oh, this one's easy Co-signing alone for someone else. Girl, I did it. I did it when I was in my early twenties. I didn't know any better, and a good friend of mine, her little sister, was not able to go back to college because they had, like you know, her financial aid had her account like paused because they hadn't paid for the next semester, so she couldn't even register for classes, and so family they all tried and they all couldn't didn't get the credit to qualify to co-sign. They asked me to co-sign this loan for her.
Speaker 1:I think I was my, it was my first year teaching and so I went ahead and co-sign this loan because I didn't realize that I wasn't just vouching for her. I was actually accepting the debt as my own in the event that she didn't pay. So no, that co-signing is not like like authorized user status where you can just take it away, or like it's not less vouching for someone Like you are literally taking on that debt as if it were yours. In the event that that person doesn't pay, you are fully responsible for paying. It. Messed up my credit. I had to end up paying a couple hundred dollars, like I, just every month for a few months cause she wasn't paying and finally, eventually, I recommended to her that she do a loan consolidation and she put all her loans with one company, which eventually wipes me off of her loan. So thank goodness it worked out, but I would I would never recommend anybody to co-sign any loans for any.
Speaker 2:Did they use those words? Did they say generally will you co-sign this?
Speaker 1:They you know what it is. I don't even think any of us knew that language at that time. We were all just I think what?
Speaker 1:they said was like can you add your name so that she can? Yeah, so she can go back to college, which is like they attach it to something that's so emotional. Of course we want to go back to college, Like we want to see our people succeed, Like I was like, if I can help in any way, like I'll do it. I didn't know anything about money at that time, so I would. If I could go back in time, I would say I'm so sorry, honey, Like me, I can't do it. Your mom and dad can't do it. Maybe you just need to get another type of loan or take a semester off and work and come back and pay Like, but me, I am not going to take on that for you to reach your goals, I would not do it, yeah.
Speaker 2:Wow, oh my gosh. Well, I'm glad that you got that all figured out and that yes, you were able to get that kind of off of you, me too. Okay, the last one is just finished. The sentence my favorite thing I've ever spent money on is oh my gosh, this is hard Massage A massage I will.
Speaker 1:I will spend how I look If I'm, if I have been exercising, doing everything right, running around and all this stuff and like I have that tension in my body and I'm also just like a very energetic person. I use my body, my hands, a lot when I'm talking, like I get that tension in me. But go get a full body deep tissue massage. I will spend money on it because it's so worth it. I feel 10 years younger and I'm like, oh, all the stress is gone and like girl massage I will. I've spent like $300 on a one hour deep tissue full body massage and that's a lot of money but I'll do it again because it was worth it.
Speaker 2:You know, I have a massage gift card that I got for Christmas that I haven't used. I know.
Speaker 1:Or give it to me. I know right, and it's to me it's like, oh, it's the time.
Speaker 2:I'm like, oh, I need to get it. I'm like, oh, I need to just book, I need to just go, but when am I going to go? And I'm like, no Allison, just do it, do it, girl, cause it's worth it.
Speaker 1:It's self care, it really is self care. And what I find? That when I'm getting a massage my mind is like off. It's fully present, because I'm really feeling like where they're really touching, where they're working, where they're nudging, and for me that means my brain is off. It's kind of like meditating, but you get a physical relief at the same time as you get the mental relief, so it's like a double win.
Speaker 2:Nice Well, thank you so much for joining us, and I will link to your brand new book, mind your Money, and the show notes. If you're listening, be sure to grab it, because it sounds like it's amazing. I know I'm going to go ahead and get my own copy.
Speaker 1:Yes, I'm sending you a copy, of course. Oh wonderful, Thank you Okay bye.
Speaker 2:Thank you for joining us. I hope this episode inspired you. I hope it inspired you to really want there to be change in our school system when it comes to how we are teaching our kids about money and what they're going to be learning, because I know that it has such a massive impact on their future life. If you enjoyed today's episode, please leave a rating or review. I read every single review that I get yes, even the bad ones, and it means the world to me whenever I can read what you're thinking about the Inspire Budget podcast, especially if you're loving it. I'll be back next week with a brand new episode. See you then.