Inspired Budget

#125: Turning Fear into Financial Power with Farnoosh Torabi

September 28, 2023 Allison Baggerly Episode 125
Inspired Budget
#125: Turning Fear into Financial Power with Farnoosh Torabi
Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

Ready to face your fear of money and unlock the power of financial success?

Join me with personal finance expert, author, and host of the So Money podcast Farnoosh Torabi.

 We'll discuss how fear can be harnessed as a superpower for financial success, navigating the complex maze of fear-based decision-making.

You'll learn how societal norms and parental influence can shape our relationship with money, as well as gain insight into the dangers of toxic positivity and how embracing all our emotions can lead to a balanced life.

It's time to flip your script on fear - don't miss it!

Connect With Farnoosh:
On Her Website:  AHealthyStateofPanic.com
On Instagram: @farnooshtorabi

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Speaker 1:

I was afraid of trying to make more money because it would cost me my time, my relationships. I realized that within that narrative there were so many myths that I was holding on to that I had inherited from my environment, from my culture, that then now, as a woman with agency, I'm like that's not going to be my life.

Speaker 2:

You have to interrupt that and it takes sometimes someone to tell you this is BS.

Speaker 1:

Sometimes it just takes like taking a step back. And then, once I decided I wanted to do this, still do it my way by respecting my fears.

Speaker 2:

Hey, this is Allison, and welcome to the Inspired Budget podcast, where we talk all things budgeting debt and saving money. Today, I am honored to host Farnoush Turabi, a prominent figure in the realm of personal finance, acclaimed podcast host of so Money and an accomplished author with her upcoming book, a Healthy State of Panic. Farnoush's insightful approach to money management, woven with unique perspective of fear as a superpower, sets her apart in the field. With degrees from Pennsylvania State University and Columbia University and features in top media outlets like the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, she continues to educate and inspire millions. Today, we'll be diving into how fear can lead us to make healthier financial decisions and the wisdom hidden in the fear of uncertainty. Welcome, farnoush, to the Inspired Budget podcast. I'm glad to finally have you on to chat with our listeners.

Speaker 1:

Thank you so much, allison, you know, I love you, I know.

Speaker 2:

And I love you too, but I'm excited because you have a new book out and it's not your like everyday personal finance, how to budget or save money or invest. It is all about fear and I want you to tell us a little bit about this book and how you have really like woven in some of your personal experiences from your life and your childhood and how you've used fear to, I guess, take many more steps forward in your life.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, thank you so much. I'm excited so much about this book. It's different for me. I think it's going to be hopefully refreshing for my audience, who's been listening to me on so many for almost a decade talking about money, and now we're talking about fear, which I don't think is completely unrelated to money. I mean, look, I've been in this space for a long, long time and, as you know and I know, when people are talking about money we're talking about life and really high stakes decisions and the emotional underpinning of so many of our financial questions, whether it is about should I buy, should I rent, should I invest, should I not? Should I start the business, should I close the business, should I leave the job, should I ask for more money. We're scared, it's fearful. That fear is the emotional underpinning of so many of our financial questions and I think, when I looked at sort of what I wanted to write about, this is my fourth book. It's been nine years since I published. I've published all the different kinds of books about the basics of money and then the psychology of money and women breadwinners, so now I was really ready to talk about money at the intersection of mental health and fear, being really the overarching emotional complexity that we experience when we're dealing with money.

Speaker 1:

But, to your point, it's also extremely personal because I am the poster child and the poster woman for fearfulness. I grew up terrified a young girl, the daughter of immigrants, the daughter of Iranian immigrants who moved here with the backdrop of a revolution happening in their country, coming to America in the late 70s, early 80s, and I born amidst all of that. They raised me to be fearful, I think, because, allison, being fearless is a privilege that you can afford and my parents were very well aware of risks. They had taken many of them in their lives and now, as Americans, as Iranians trying to live in America, I always say, like the risk bank was closed, like they were not interested in pushing the envelope any further. And I, their daughter, was like sort of the recipient of a lot of the fear based parenting Don't talk to strangers, don't eat your friends snacks, you can't go on sleepovers, you can't. You'll date when you're married, like you know, just get the A's, get into college, play it safe. And it was a great childhood. There are a lot of funny moments as a result of always being that scared, skeptical girl. But, as my mother says it worked out, cause yeah, it sure did I have a great life.

Speaker 1:

I feel like most days I'm putting on my big girl clothes and making big girl decisions and I'm getting out there and I'm not fearless. I'm still terrified, I still think that the world is a scary place, but I think that I have such a good relationship with fear and that's where the book kind of arrives. It's like how to have like an actual relationship with fear, as opposed to doing what everyone's told us to do, which is just to ignore your fears. Fight your fears. That being fearful is cowardice. I disagree.

Speaker 1:

I think that fear is a valid emotion. When it shows up, it's there often to try to protect us. Our job now, as adults, is to decipher whether or not we're going to pay attention to it. What is it trying to tell us? Often, fear has something important to say, to teach, and I think, because it's so personal, you have to get intimate with it.

Speaker 1:

I say show me someone who's fearless and I'll show you someone who doesn't really know who they are, Because when you know what your fears are and you understand the source of your fears, you really know who you are. You really know what you value, you know what you protect, you know how you were raised, you know what your goals are. I mean, all this stuff has, for me at least, come to the surface as a result of having a more mature relationship with fear. And I think you and I are all about financial equity and leveling the playing field, and of course people have different financial means, but fear is abundant. Fear is a natural resource that we all have access to and I say let's leverage it to the best of our ability to make those healthy choices.

Speaker 2:

Wow, I love how you basically summed up that fear is sometimes a survival mechanism, like for your family. That is how they survived and that's how they thought okay, we're going to raise this daughter in America and that is how she survives. You are so scared, right? What do they say? Like I have a cat and this is so random but totally relates. We had a cat growing up that we got in kindergarten. It lived to be 20 years old. It was an outdoor, indoor cat and he survived because he was so scared all the time that he constantly was on the lookout and avoided like dangers and it served him well. And that's a totally random off the wall example. But that fear you had as a child and your parents kind of pushed into you with a survival tactic and look, you didn't just survive, you thrived.

Speaker 1:

So and I also love that.

Speaker 2:

It's very anti, like just super positive thinking, like of that mindset. What is that toxic positivity?

Speaker 1:

Yes, yes.

Speaker 2:

Because it's like, okay, at what point does someone who struggles with depression and anxiety? It's toxic positivity, just it's not helpful because it almost just makes it to where it's this thing that you can never achieve. I can never overcome this fear, but should we have to always overcome the fear?

Speaker 1:

No, fear does not just go away. It is that cat that keeps showing up at your doorstep or that lost puppy. It's not how our emotions work, and, truthfully, I think again. I come from a place and I think we're evolving as a culture. We're coming around to this idea that, like, all emotions are valid. There was a chapter in our wellness culture where it was all about positivity. It was all about happiness, and emotions like fear and anger and sadness were branded as bad. Don't go there, they're not worth your time.

Speaker 1:

I think all emotions are valid, and there's science to prove that. Even just this year, a study came out and said that people who acknowledged these quote unquote bad emotions like sadness, fear and anger as having like they have like a neutral relationship with them, or maybe they even have a positive relationship with them, they are far more fulfilled and wait for it, happy, happier than people who look at these emotions and have a negative reaction to them. And so what this teaches us is that all of our emotions deserve our attention. All of our emotions deserve space in our lives, and it's not to say to always be sad or always be happy. It's just that you have to live life in balance and when you are triggered by something and it makes you sad or it makes you angry, or it makes you fearful, I think it's worth an exploration.

Speaker 2:

I love that. Okay, so then can you give me an example? Can you give me an example of a time that fear, specifically maybe surrounding money you have faced that and said I'm not just going to completely ignore it or pretend like this fear doesn't exist and just kind of push it away and uncover it years later in therapy.

Speaker 1:

Right? Well, that's our instinct, right? We think that when fear shows up, especially in our financial lives, that we have to fight it or we have to pretend it doesn't exist. And then what ends up happening is that we end up feeling we are stuck, we play small, we don't ask for the raise, we don't push the limit, and I don't even mean like taking huge risks. Sometimes we just don't even take any steps to progress.

Speaker 1:

I've seen it all a lot in my own career, where I'm helping people. They're so afraid of, let's say, facing their bills, so they don't open them. And what happens, you know? They think that maybe they're doing the safe thing in the moment, or even the brave thing, but instead they're just building more debt and in a year they are facing something far scarier than there are those who are afraid to ask for more money, so then they don't, and then they end up having a stagnant income for far too long and not ever being able to realize their financial potentials. And so for me, so many examples of how paying attention to my financial fears has been helpful as opposed to ignoring them.

Speaker 1:

There was a time in my 30s this was after writing a book about being a female breadwinner. My last book is called when she Makes More, and it was no secret that I was making more in my household. I was very proud of that fact, but if I be lying, if I said there was a part of me that didn't want to continue making even more money, you know, because I was looking around and I was looking at people in our field who were talking about making seven figures and seven figure online course lunches and I wasn't doing any of that and I sort of felt like I was. Maybe I had more potential, but I wasn't pursuing it financial potential and I was afraid to become richer because I was afraid of what it would mean from the perspective of like other people looking in and saying this woman is just like, it's never enough for her. She always has to go be making more money.

Speaker 1:

And I was mostly worried about this coming from the people that I loved, you know, like my mom and my parents and friends. I was worried about, really too, that the pursuit of making more money would come at the expense of losing relationships, losing the closeness with my family, my friends, my kids, because I assumed and this was where I was wrong that making more money meant spending more time, spending more time away from your family. That time is money and I, as a result, for a while I just kind of like kept status quo. I was like we're good.

Speaker 1:

Everyone's, everyone's fed. The market just paid, we're due, we have enough. Like this is good, like I'm going to just live in this small space and it was small, we were doing great, but I this comfortable space comfortable right.

Speaker 2:

Comfortable with the income and the time, your balance right, because you assumed that to make more money something would have to give your time and your relationship and your balance.

Speaker 1:

And I was afraid of that. I was afraid of losing those things which are not small things, like, of course. I thought at the time I was being completely rational, like I don't want to, I wouldn't, I value my relationships more than money, and so it seemed like the right, practical thing to do was just sort of like, keep status quo and this is not to say that you're never making enough or you should always try to earn more but for me, I felt like there was more potential. I could feel it, but I was resisting it because of this fear.

Speaker 1:

And it was ultimately a conversation that I had with a financial coach. She was someone I was interviewing on my podcast and she turned the table and said she just started probing me and I got, and I and I started to like unveil everything, I've just told you. I'm like, you know, I just feel like I'm good, I don't I, I someday like the idea of being a millionaire, like, oh my gosh, that's so abstract. She's like what are you afraid of? I said, well, I told her everything that I'm afraid of and she goes. You know, she said let me ask you a question Do you, don't you want to be powerful, more powerful and I said, no, that's gross, I don't want to be more powerful.

Speaker 1:

What does that even mean? Like more power to dominate? She's like oh honey, she's like you're, you're. Your definition of power is the masculine power that we often see depicted in the movies the guy in the you know the tower controlling people with his money. And I said, yeah, I don't, I don't want that kind of power. And she goes. Well, there's not just one kind of power, there's many kinds of power. More money will mean more power to uplift communities, build your dreams, influence people that you want to influence, like create magic, like there's a lot that your financial power can support and help and uplift, as opposed to the power that you think, which is like to control and all the things. And so this is a very long story, but basically, no, I love it.

Speaker 1:

She woke me up to the very first step in the chapter on the fear of money in my book, and the fear of money in the book is central to the book. It's like the middle chapter because I feel like it's just like the nucleus of the book. But the first step when you have a financial fear is to discover where it came from, like who brought it to your doorstep? You didn't maybe just wake up feeling this fear right, there's probably a story there. So I realized that again, I was afraid of making more.

Speaker 1:

I was afraid of financial power because of how I'd seen it depicted around me. It's because of the way that I'd seen people react to it and I didn't want to be at the butt of these people's reactions and I didn't want to be shamed and I didn't want to feel isolated. And. But I recognize that that is a false narrative, or at least it's one narrative. It doesn't have to be my narrative. Am I still somebody who wants to do more with money and have a bigger financial like? Yes, that is still true.

Speaker 1:

And so I had to, for myself, rewrite my financial narrative, which was basically I deserve to make as much money as I want. There is no consequence for that, and I will say this, though you know, going back to the fear of giving up my time straining the relationships with my kids and my family, that again was a narrative that it might be true for some people. Did it have to be true for me? And I was afraid. I think those were healthy fears, Like I don't want to make more money at the expense of my relationships, and so I have the work now is with this fear.

Speaker 1:

what can I do to make more money that still protects my time and my relationships?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and you know what.

Speaker 1:

The first thing I did was what? I raised my prices.

Speaker 2:

Nice, I thought you're gonna say I wrote another book.

Speaker 1:

No, well, I I just started to charge more money, because that takes no time, that takes no effort, it just takes deciding, and I did. And secondly, I invested in an assistant who could help me manage. And that was a hard decision because you're making an investment and you don't know if it's going to pay off. But I trusted that if I could clear my agenda every day of the tasks that were still important but time consuming, that this assistant could take care of, and then I could go after the bigger paydays of you know require time and making relationships and coming up with decks and plans and a lot of outreach.

Speaker 1:

It paid off within a year. I think that for me, to kind of put a bow on this story, I was afraid of trying to make more money because it would cost me my time, my relationships. I realized that within that narrative there were so many myths that I was holding on to that I had inherited from my environment, from my culture, that then now, as a woman with agency, I'm like that's not going to be my life.

Speaker 2:

You have to interrupt that and it takes sometimes someone to tell you this is BS.

Speaker 1:

Sometimes it just takes like taking a step back. And then, once I decided I wanted to do this, but still do it my way, by respecting my fears about losing time and my relationships, that now the work is like coming up with a plan that works for me, that respects these fears, and I did it. I crossed the seven figure threshold within a couple of years. Didn't think I could do it, didn't feel like it was coming at the expense of my time.

Speaker 1:

I was happier doing things that I loved. It's become a blueprint now for me as I help others figure out how to make more without, because I think this is a universal fear of like we assume that we're going to make more money. It's going to require more time.

Speaker 1:

And I'm not saying that it's going to be easy every day, but it doesn't mean that it's going to destroy you, destroy relationships. We see this all the time though. We see like the real housewives. You know, they get famous, they start making more money. What's the first thing that happens? They make the news for their divorces. They have estranged children. You know, our culture doesn't do a great job of showing that there's another way of becoming, especially as women to become really successful and rich and not be alone.

Speaker 2:

Mm-hmm. This is incredible because I had a business coach once, farnish that told me I can get you. Here's what she said you're going to love this. If you want to make a million dollars in a year through your business, I can get you there, but you're going to end up divorced and estranged from your family by the end of it. Talk about I'm like I don't want to make seven figures find me up yeah like and so I like that just came to me.

Speaker 2:

I'm like, oh my gosh, see my fear around making more money. It's nothing about like relationships necessarily messing up, even though she said that you would think that would immediately be one of my fears. Mine is like the fear of my own doing, like I'm going to increase my lifestyle so much that, yeah, that lifestyle creep will be so much that I won't be able to like control myself. And then if I have a year that sounds good like we'll have to sell the house and sell the dog and all the things right. And so my fear, my thing, is like, oh my gosh, I'm scared of my own doing.

Speaker 2:

It's not even like how others will perceive me or my family or anything like that. It's like, if I make all that money, how am I going to screw it all up? And I feel like a lot of people probably have that thing that the fear isn't the perception, the fear isn't another thing coming after them. It's them, the person and the choices they are going to make. How do you recommend someone overcome that when it's like they are the thing they fear themselves, like they are the thing that they fear?

Speaker 1:

Your own behaviors. I think that, well, what you just described is exactly the beauty of fear sometimes that it turns you inward and requires you to sort of reflect on yourself. Now the work is long and it's not going to be summarized in a podcast, but I think even just recognizing that in yourself is a huge step, and it is what should guide you. It's not saying don't make money. It's saying make money but respect this fear of your potential to mismanage the money, and so maybe what that means is that you need to create really these boundaries. You need to get help, you need to get a financial planner.

Speaker 1:

You need to create some funds that are harder to access. It's not on. Everything is as Marie Forleo says figure out a bowl.

Speaker 2:

Yes.

Speaker 1:

But I think that it starts with really understanding yourself, and that's ultimately what this book is. It's like when you recognize your fears and you explore them and you ask your fears the questions. Essentially, you're getting closer to knowing who you are. And when we are in that place we can make some of the best decisions.

Speaker 1:

It's when we don't know who we are, what we want, what we value, what our goals are, what we care about, and then we try to go make decisions, big decisions about with money, with work. I don't have to tell you it's not going to work out.

Speaker 2:

Right, it's like guessing, you're just guessing, you're guessing and checking at the end, guessing, making decisions. And did this work? Oh no, let me go to the next one.

Speaker 1:

Instead of making.

Speaker 2:

When you know your fear, you know yourself, you can make decisions that are truly based on your wants, your needs, your values. All of the above, today's episode, is brought to you by my budget to build wealth. Here's the truth. I do not believe actually I refuse to believe that wealth is just for the rich. I believe that wealth can be built on a budget without sacrificing what you love to spend money on. I fully believe that budgeting is the quickest, most effective way for you to reach your money goals. So, whether your goal is to stop living paycheck to paycheck, pay off those student loans that have been hanging over your head, or find room in your budget every single month so that way you can start investing for your future, you're going to need a guide, a plan to get yourself there, which is exactly what I'm sharing in my free training budget to build wealth. In this training, I'm going to be sharing three massive mistakes that people make with their budget and their financial plan, so that way you can avoid them. I'm going to be sharing with you the secret to freeing up more money in your budget each month, so that way you can send extra money to your goals, and I'm going to be sharing with you my tried and true four step framework to budgeting your way to wealth without giving up what you love. Plus, there is a very special free gift for anyone who stays until the end. You can sign up by going to inspiredbudgetcom slash class or just click the link in my show notes. You'll be able to choose a time that works for your schedule and I'll see you there.

Speaker 2:

I love that you talked on how society and the way we look at our emotions has definitely pivoted and shifted over time. I think so many people might also be holding on, though, to that toxic positivity and just saying like there's no room in my mind or in my heart for any negative emotion, right, which, as someone who struggles with depression, anxiety, is just not realistic. It's not, and I love that you said to talk it out. That's something I do with my husband. I'll get these thoughts and I'll be like I need to just like speak this out loud and I just need like a reality check sometimes, and that's okay, that's not bad, and I love that you said that, because I know some people struggle with fear, maybe more than others, and I love how you can use it to know yourself better Now moving forward with the way the world is right now right, this episode's coming out in September A lot of people are still struggling with inflation and feeling a really big pulling towards their budget, and this has caused a lot more fear in people's money and with people's budget.

Speaker 2:

How do you see people taking what's happening right now in the state of the world? Obviously we're not necessarily in a recession, but everyone's freaking out still. I feel like how can people use that to still feel good about their money and feel like, okay, I'm in a place financially where I can feel good about myself and about my money?

Speaker 1:

Well, often when we fear these big kahunas like the recession, inflation, I'm worried about climate risks. Did you read recently that insurance companies are not going to be ensuring homes that are in natural disaster areas?

Speaker 2:

I did, which is a concern for me because I live in Houston, where we have hurricanes, and I have flood insurance and all my friends don't, and I'm like, how do you not pay extra for flood insurance? This is stressing me out, that you're not paying $700 a year for flood insurance because of this fear right, right, and that's you using your fear in a very healthy way. Thank, you I applause you.

Speaker 1:

Good example, yeah, and I think, to use your example of, I think if I could dissect how it worked out in a great way for you. You use that fear in a healthy way, whereas maybe it didn't throw you for a tailspin, it didn't just keep you stuck, because I think a lot of people have this fear they're not doing anything, and so what's the difference.

Speaker 1:

You did something about it, others didn't. I think that when a fear that is so big, that is so external that you can't control, is abstract, you have to bring it to your doorstep, you have to make it super, duper, hyper personal, and so, with a natural disaster, I mean it's like a lot of like what ifs, what ifs, what ifs, but what good is that? That's just keeping you in a place of fear stasis.

Speaker 1:

you need to imagine well, what if a storm hits tomorrow and my basement gets flooded? So create these very specific hypotheticals for yourself, not so that you can get more scared, but so you can be prompted to take action. And maybe the first piece of action is just to educate yourself. Where is my insurance policy? What does it?

Speaker 2:

actually cover?

Speaker 1:

Do I live in a flood zone, doing some shopping around, calling around what would it even cost, right, so that you're not just being paralyzed by this what if? But you're being prompted to do something healthy with this fear, and it prompted you to actually go and sign the contract and get the flood insurance and now you can sleep better at night. I think, with the recession although we're not in one technically, I think a lot of people are reeling from layoffs and the increasing prices everywhere. Everyone's going through a personal recession of some sort, potentially, and so, again, here it's not about worrying will a recession happen. What if a recession happens? Imagine the recession happens and it's tomorrow. Make it really recent, really personal. Give it some immediacy into your life and say to yourself all right, now what Tomorrow?

Speaker 2:

my husband comes home he says I lost my job and one part of our income source is gone Gone.

Speaker 1:

So what would you do? And again it's like preemptive right, so you're still safe, all is good. But you're able to now think a little bit more rationally because actually, if your husband or your spouse came home tomorrow and said I lost my job, it's much harder than to work through these cases and to actually like You're emotionally drained, right, you're like running on empty. And so now, when you have a little bit more emotional capacity to do the research and kind of map out a plan, it's a much better time to do it but you're using that fear to really.

Speaker 1:

you're bringing it home, and that's how you make it healthier for yourself as opposed to living in the abstract.

Speaker 2:

Yes, I love that You're actually just coming up with a plan in advance, instead of a spouse coming home and saying I lost my job. And then you saying like, oh my gosh, the kids. We have to take them out of soccer. We can't ever go out to eat again. How are we gonna pay our? It's all that emotion and when we can not?

Speaker 2:

spend our yes and when we can, it's okay to be emotional, Like I love that point. It's okay to have those emotions, it's okay to be an emotional, but if you can kind of couple that with like facts and a plan, because you've had this fear before, it makes the entire situation maybe like a little more manageable. Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, 100%, and maybe you can, even today, start taking measures to create a buffer for yourself in that event. And I think it's also important you and I, we work in personal finance. We know the cycles, we know that recessions happen every five to six years. We know that the stock market goes up, it goes down. It's par for the course. But I think most people probably aren't familiar with these things, and so when there is an episode of a recession or a bad streak in the market, they think that this is gonna happen all of the time and that we'll never see another a brighter day, and so sometimes your fear just needs some education.

Speaker 1:

It just needs a little bit of history. A history lesson.

Speaker 1:

And that's sometimes all it needs to. Kind of you can lay down that fear. The goal is not to go through life fearful all the time, it's just about. If our goal is to do things not feeling scared, well, that's gonna be a journey. That's not just happen. You don't just go fear, go away and then go do the thing. You have to reconcile and unpack that fear and you have to kind of give it a pat on the back sometimes because it doesn't know what it doesn't know. And you're the person, you're the adult in the room to go. Okay, I'm gonna go like I'm kind of personifying fear here. I'm making it it's easy to kind of talk about it in like the third person you know.

Speaker 2:

No, I love it.

Speaker 1:

It's helpful right.

Speaker 2:

Hold on, you could turn this into a children's book. I want to, okay, okay, have you ever read the book On's Anger? There is a book On's Anger and it personifies, it gives. It's a children's book that gives anger an actual like monster figure and it's about talking to your anger and essentially like doing the work on it and sitting with your anger and like, as you sit with your anger and you start kind of processing these things, your anger grows smaller and smaller and smaller until it's kind of gone and like your anger could be your friend, almost like your anger can be friend Like and it's incredible. It's a wonderful children's book For anyone who has kids that I would say are in elementary school or younger. There's that one and there's another one, stepping Stones, and it is amazing for children. I highly recommend it. You could create a children's book here. I am giving you your next book. Okay, farnish, here's the plan.

Speaker 1:

No, it has come up. It has come up actually Allison in my. I have a group of supporters that are helping you with my launch and I call them the Panic Posse. And someone in the group said did you ever think of turning this into a children's book? Because wouldn't it have been great to have had this book as a kid? Or even a lot of the comments I've been getting. The reviews are like. I wish I had this book 10 years ago, which?

Speaker 1:

I had this book when I was 15. Because, fear again, it doesn't go away, it starts young. And the book I structured. The book is I give fear names. I don't just say fear. The first chapter is the fear of loneliness fear of rejection, and then a fear of loneliness, and then FOMO, and then the fear of exposure, and then the fear of money and the fear of.

Speaker 2:

I think.

Speaker 1:

I thought like there's not just one fear.

Speaker 2:

There's all different kinds of fear and I think.

Speaker 1:

Once you can recognize which fear you're feeling, then you know which tools to grab.

Speaker 2:

You can make it a children's book and then we could do a book for teenagers. There's another book I've read to my kids called Overcoming Anxiety. It's meant for teenagers. I think you should read that because it could help you figure out how to structure your book on fear. I'm like assigning you your next projects, but I think you're right, I love it.

Speaker 1:

I love all your ideas. You have the best ideas and here's.

Speaker 2:

The deal is like we weren't growing up learning how to do this. None of our parents taught us how to do this. You have had to figure it out through a lot of inner work. As a parent, I don't necessarily know how to teach my child this, if I'm still working through it, if I'm not even able to verbalize it, but you have the power to verbalize it in a way that makes sense.

Speaker 2:

Why not create that resource for parents to read their children a book? Give their teen a book and read through it with them, because that, as a parent, that gives me the resource to say like okay, I know this is important, but I maybe don't feel qualified or I might not have the vocabulary or know how to phrase it in such a way that connects with them. If you have a book that you can read alongside them which is what I do with my children it gives you the language to speak. You're not just speaking that language as you're reading it, you're using that language in everyday life and you're coming back to it. Okay, farnush, where can we find a healthy state of panic? And then, eventually, your children's book and your book for teenagers, thank you.

Speaker 1:

By the way, I have used this advice on my kids.

Speaker 1:

Really quick story. My daughter came home from school she was in kindergarten at the time. She's in first grade now and she was had bruised her face, she'd fallen off like the jungle gym or whatever and she didn't want to go to school the next day because she was afraid of what the kids were going to say and how they were going to react. And as a mom I'm like I want to protect her and in the moment I was like yeah, let's just like call in sick, but I knew that's not the right you know. Like yeah, I wanted you know. But so I said that's not the rational thing to do and you're not going to, even though I knew she might go to school and be made fun of. I was like we need to find a way to address your fears, but still go do the thing of going to school. So I said to her let's.

Speaker 1:

It was in the morning, at breakfast, so I said let's email your teacher, let's write her a letter to in case she doesn't read the email and I want you to pull her aside when you get to school and just let her know and the letter will say it will be from us that you're afraid of being made fun of for the scars on your face from when you fell off the jungle gym.

Speaker 2:

Right.

Speaker 1:

And she's like all right, and my daughter, you know she's, she's like OK, mommy, and I, you know, I had to make sure this teacher saw this note because I didn't think I could start calling the school. It was so you know how it is in the morning, like you want to deliver a message to a teacher. Like how do you? You were a teacher like yeah, yeah all the reinforcement.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's a little bit of chaos.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and so I'm waiting at home. My daughter's at school now and I get an email from her teacher around 10 am. She was like thank you so much for letting me know about Colette's fears. We talked about it before we started the morning and, with her permission, I asked her can I tell the classroom what you're afraid of? And she said OK, so we discussed it. We discussed.

Speaker 1:

Wow, my daughter is afraid that her scars are going to be, they're going to stand out, and the kids are going to make a comment about it, and she's afraid. And then do you know what she said? It was the most beautiful experience because first of all, the kids, everyone embraced. But other kids then started to share their fears and like, oh, that happened to me too. On the playground I fell and I got hurt and I got bumped, and so it was just I got goosebumps, but it was like my book coming to life, but for the kindergartners.

Speaker 2:

And I just oh, OK.

Speaker 1:

I mean that's probably going to be the book. I mean it just wrote itself. There you go, but you can, you can learn more about it. A healthy A, a healthy state of panic dot com.

Speaker 2:

Yes, and then we'll link to that in the show notes. The book comes out.

Speaker 1:

October 3rd, so if you want to buy it before then which I would really appreciate because it would really really help with just some bestseller lists that we all want to get on but I am offering some really awesome bonuses for those who do want to purchase early, before the pub date, and that's all available at a healthy state of panic dot com.

Speaker 2:

Yes, go grab your copy. Order it in advance, because not only do you get the bonuses, but then it's also basically going to arrive in a couple of days.

Speaker 1:

Whenever, it is released, you'll get it sooner.

Speaker 2:

You get it a little bit sooner. So go grab your copy. Check out for our new show's podcast Also so money. I have been on there twice, two times, and it's a great podcast. Be sure to subscribe to us. Well, for a new. I completely forgot we actually have our three questions. We continue to just chat on and on, so I like to end Oops, I like to end our interview with three questions, just to get to know you better. So the first one is what's one thing you're looking forward to?

Speaker 1:

One thing I'm looking forward to is my book party. It's going to be fun. It's going to be the night before the book comes out in Brooklyn, where I lived for over a decade with raised two kids, and it'll be nice homecoming. We live in New Jersey now, so it'll be nice homecoming you can. I think that might be tickets still available.

Speaker 1:

You can get it on the website, but I'm excited to celebrate this book. As you know, as an author, it's a long, multi-year process, and to be able to just have my friends and family and fans there and celebrate is going to be really and it's coming up, so I'm really looking forward to it.

Speaker 2:

And I have a dress, finally I don't know what else oh yay. The second question is what's one money mistake you've made that you would tell everybody to avoid?

Speaker 1:

Don't start a business with people you don't really know.

Speaker 2:

That's a good one. That's a big one.

Speaker 1:

I have a business and then a few years ago I decided to start a side business with two lovely women entrepreneurs who came to me with the best business idea and, honestly, we did the thing, we pulled it off. But it was an events-based business and with COVID it immediately like kind of shut it down. We did it once and then we couldn't pursue it again. I just found that I didn't know these women enough personally to know, if we would actually be able to work well together.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

I think that too often we just focus on is it a good business? Is there money? Do you have professional experience? They all had professional experience, Like they were the best in the business and class to do what they were doing. We all came together for a reason because I was going to be sort of the media content expert, One was going to be the design build expert and the other person was a marketing genius. So the three of us were like a professional force, but personally we had very different personalities, very different temperaments, and so when we had to talk about things like money, which is emotional, it was tough. And I would say to anybody when you're partnering with anyone, even on a lesser scale, even if it's just to partner for a one-off event, like really get to know their personalities well so that you can prepare at least for what's going to inevitably be emotional conversations around money and the business not just all business.

Speaker 1:

It's very emotional.

Speaker 2:

That's so true. My last question isn't a question at all. Just complete this sentence my favorite thing I've ever spent money on is my House I live in currently, I love our house.

Speaker 1:

I know that home buying is having a moment and it's not for everybody. And we definitely. It's in the book. I talk about buying this home in the pandemic Before well, right at the beginning of the pandemic, so we were not involved in like these 20 way bidding wars.

Speaker 2:

Oh, that's nice.

Speaker 1:

Happened, so we got lucky. In that sense Did you get the? Low mortgage, though Did you get those low interest rates. Oh, that's nice, good.

Speaker 2:

So we're never moving, and yeah that's how I feel, too, I would I sometimes look at homes and I'm like oh, look at this math. Like not at 7%? Yeah, absolutely not.

Speaker 1:

You know that show, love it or List it, I'm like I'm loving it and I'm never listing it until I. But no, I truly love it and I hope everybody loves their home and that was always my goal. I met a woman one day. She was like I just love my house so much and you know, we lived in a small Brooklyn apartment at the time. I liked our house, it was good, it did, it served us, but it wasn't like I couldn't wait to go home, you know but I just love my home.

Speaker 1:

I love coming home from vacations and just living in my own bed. I just love. I love our home.

Speaker 2:

I love our home too. I do. Sometimes I want to change it, but then I'm like, no, I love it. It's the perfect size for when my kids leave. It's not too much of a house. Also, Like that's. One of my big things is, I don't want something so massive that it doesn't make sense to keep it whenever it's just my husband and I and my cat and dog and whoever else comes by. But yeah, I love it. Well, thank you, Farnoosh, for joining us. I'll link to your podcast and your new book that's coming out soon A Healthy State of.

Speaker 2:

Panic. And then is that gonna be in stores or mostly online?

Speaker 1:

I hope it will be in stores. Stores are getting very, very, very picky. They're getting very. 70% of what's in a bookstore is a book that has already proven its track record, and so the newer books have a harder time getting real estate.

Speaker 2:

But we've also heard it's mostly fiction now, like even Barnes and Noble is going towards more fiction.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's true, the non-fiction self-help section is getting smaller and smaller. But hey, thanks to the internet and you can still order from your favorite independent bookstore online, and so if you want to support your indies, you can still do so online Awesome.

Speaker 2:

Well, thank you so much. Thank you, I hope you enjoyed today's episode and, as always, if you're enjoying the Inspire Budget Podcast, be sure to leave a rating and review. I'll be back next week with another brand new episode, see you then,

Fear's Impact on Financial Decisions
Embracing Fear
Overcoming Fear of More Money
Using Fear as a Financial Motivator
Children's Books Addressing Fear and Anxiety