Episode 195: The WizeTalent Blueprint: Finding the Right Person Every Time

Avoid the mistake of rushing into a hire without a clear process — or you'll end up paying the price with bad hires, wasted time, and the whole exhausting cycle starting over again.

In this episode of The Wize Way Podcast, the Dani Bray breaks down their proven step-by-step hiring blueprint so you can find the right person every time.

✅ The capacity planner that tells you exactly what role to hire for before you post a single ad 

✅ Why a candidate scorecard removes emotion from the process and leads to smarter decisions 

✅ The red flags hiding in resumes, career history forms, and reference checks that most owners miss 

✅ How integrity analysis and personality testing take the guesswork out of hiring 

✅ The onboarding process that sets your new hire and your firm up for long term success

If you're tired of hiring on gut feel and hoping for the best, this episode is your playbook for building a team that actually works.

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PS: Whenever you’re ready… here are the fastest 4 ways we can help you fix and grow your accounting firm:  

 1. Download our famous Wize Freedom Map for FREE - Find out the 96 projects every firm owner must implement to build a $5M+ firm that can run without them - Download here 

2. Need to Hire right now? Book a 1:1 FREE discovery call with our WizeTalent hiring coaches to help find your next team member the Wize Way – Click Here 

3. Work with Jamie and our mentors for 8 weeks - Build a custom business plan for your firm - Apply here

Transcript

Welcome And What You Will Learn

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to The Wise Way, the show for accounting and bookkeeping firm owners who want more time, profit, and freedom in a business that can run without. I'm Brett Ward, your host, and each week we deep dive into the real stories, proven strategies, and battle-tested tools from successful firm owners just like you. Our wise mentors want to share their journey of how they've scaled and systemize their way to freedom so you can too. If you're stuck in the grind or you're ready to scale smarter, this is your blueprint. Let's get into the episode.

Start With Capacity Planning

SPEAKER_04 0:38

We will be talking about obviously the hiring process, but um, you know, what to do to actually make sure that you are finding the right person. Um, it it is sort of like a step-by-step guide. So hopefully you get a lot out of it. Um, but of course, feel free to ask questions throughout the entire session. Um, yeah, you can take yourselves off mute if you want to, or if you you can put your chat, like your questions in the chat box, whatever you feel comfortable doing. Um, and as you know, this is very much an interactive call, so yeah, feel free to just jump in at any time and and ask anything. Um, but we will get started. So the very first thing I would say with any hiring process, before you do anything, you should do a capacity planner just to actually make sure that you know what role to actually hire for. You don't want to just throw, you know, bodies at the problem, as they say. You need to actually know what you're going to be hiring for, because you might look at everything and go, oh yeah, I need another, you know, senior accountant. But then you do your capacity planner and you realize, well, you don't actually need a senior, you might just need, you know, a junior. Um, so I might ask Raul if if it's okay, if you can just tell everyone exactly what the capacity planner is.

SPEAKER_03 2:06

Sure. Sure. Let me share my screen and we'll be able to see it. So here it's when you open your Wise Up, this is the very first thing that you're gonna do. And we will be focusing here on their plan. Sorry, here in the budgets and capacity. This is basically the the plan for the entire year or goal, it's like to prepare this at the beginning of the financial year, but probably during the year, if you're arriving uh the middle of your financial year or something, it's uh uh it helps us to evaluate it how you're going and what is the plan ahead, as Danny mentioned. And and uh talking about hiring here in the team capacity, when we have adding all the people that it is working and we know their capacity, and we can like measure how near, how far are we from from the budget? Um, please make sure that the budget period here, yeah. That's when people it's uh participating in not in the entire financial year, we can adjust just the time that they're gonna be working. And this is something that I can help you with uh to to put the right times and figure out like what are the exactly numbers in that section. And uh for this, uh Danny, uh I have a specific uh team member that I uh created, and all of all of you can create this that it's a new hire, not with the name of the person, just what if what how how this is gonna be affecting my capacity if I hire a person with these specific characteristics? So I will be adding we can add the custom range. So this person is not going to start at the very beginning of the financial year. This person is gonna start just half of the financial year. So since it's uh uh Australian financial year will be from uh July through June. So I have at half of the capacity. This person uh it's here in Ohio. This is appeared from first of January and to the last of the financial year. Once we allocate the budget, we're gonna see here how uh what is the impact of the fee capacity. So see how much this has been increased from adding a new person, and the percentage of the team summary that we have here in the spare capacity, it's gonna be appearing here, like how near, how far are we from it. And yeah, that's that's basically all. So, in the case that you would like to go further and and review anything, I will be adding here my my calendar link. Uh hope that this can help Danny.

SPEAKER_04 5:00

Yeah, thank you so much, Roll. Um yeah, that that was that was great. And I I didn't realize it so that there's a new feature where you can just sort of add a what if sort of thing.

SPEAKER_03 5:11

It yeah, it doesn't need to just be yeah, it is not a specific feature. Uh it's an employee that we added without the the specific names. So clients can measure like what is the agreement that have with their uh employee and see if these that agreement matches with the profit that we are looking for and see what is the impact of having that person for the half of the financial year or the entire financial year.

Candidate Scorecards Over Gut Feel

SPEAKER_04 5:38

Yeah, that's good. Thanks, Carol. And yeah, so that's that would definitely be step number one, you know, just making sure that you know who you're actually going to hire. Um, and then from there, I would probably suggest doing like a building a scorecard, like a candidate scorecard. Um, there's so many out there. We we personally use one, and I might even share my screen so that I can actually show you what it looks like as well. Um, so with this scorecard, hopefully I'm sharing the right screen. Um with this scorecard, basically it's really important to do because it does take the emotion out of things when you're doing the hiring process. You don't want to just go off a feeling. You want to look at the facts, look at the numbers, and it'll help you to determine who the right candidate is to proceed with. Um so you can see here we've we've done our one is personally done on integrity, that's the number one thing. Um, and then responsiveness and intelligence. So, and that is pretty much in order of how we like to do things as well, because we don't want someone who's super smart but has no integrity. Um, we want to make sure that they do have the integrity first, and then their responsiveness is huge because during the hiring process, if they're not if they're taking ages to respond to you, that's a red flag. Because if then if they're doing that to you now during the hiring process, what are they going to be like when they're actually working for you? So making sure that you do actually um score that. So yeah, so the scorecard is definitely something that I would recommend and keep updating it throughout the entire hiring process. Don't just do it once at the start and then once at the end. Do it after the interviews, after the reference checks, after the the testing. So you just you keep going and then eventually that score will get higher and higher. Um, but yeah, it is good. Our one's pretty good because obviously you'll have more than one candidate in the pipeline. So whoever's got the highest score, that's the right candidate to go ahead with. Um so yeah, that would be number two. And I know I can see Chris here. So, Chris, you've obviously been through our process and you've you've done the scorecard before. Have you found that it's sort of helped you determine who's the right candidate?

SPEAKER_02 8:07

I think when we've got a lot of different ones that we're trying to compare, then yes, definitely. Like it does. Sometimes you get initially uh bedazzled by the initial interview, and it's these little things that can help help you just decide between maybe one or the other, would probably be my comment on that.

Tell Your Team You Are Hiring

Job Ads That Sell The Role

Career History Forms To Spot Gaps

Pre Screens Before Long Interviews

Structured Interviews And Reference Checks

SPEAKER_04 8:24

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, because it it really does take the emotion out of things. Um, so the next thing I would say is make sure your your team is actually aware that you're going to be hiring someone. Um, I know for some clients that's a bit, you know, some people just don't want their team members to know because they're not sure how they're gonna feel about things. I've been in c like conversations, um, like in meetings with potential clients, and they're like, oh, we're we're doing this on the down low. I don't want anyone to know, the the walls have ears and everything. And I just think that's that's not a good approach because your team is eventually gonna find out. Um, it's always good to be upfront and honest about why you're hiring this new person, um, because it it one, it'll help them also see where they're where their actual role is going as well. You know, if you've got a team members who are afraid that they're gonna lose their job, that's not a good sign. Um so you yeah, you should definitely be keeping everyone in the loop so everyone's aware of of what's going on. Um, and then the next thing is obviously creating the job description. So with the job description, you want to make sure that you're covering off different things, but you don't go into too much detail. You know, the I think one of the biggest turnoffs with candidates looking at job descriptions is they click into the job ad and they see this really, really long description of every single thing that they're gonna do. Um, no one has time to read that. And you've got to think of it from a candidate's point of view. They're not just applying for your job, they're applying for hundreds of jobs. So you want to make sure that your ad is standing out, and the best way to do that is to sell. You know, it's it's all about marketing. So make sure that you do have a description at the start of who your firm, like what your firm is, what you do, your values, your missions, all that. And then creating an advert video. You'll so people who have worked with me before will have heard me say this. Doing an advert video is super important because it actually gives the, you know, gives a chance to um showcase who you are, who your firm is. And lately we've actually been noticing that having employee testimonies, and if you don't have employees, if you have contractors, you can do that as well. But yeah, having testimonies from your actual staff to show what it's like working for your firm is really, really good because they're not just hearing it from your point of view, they're hearing it from your staff's point of view. So if you can do that, um, and it doesn't have to go for long, especially if you're you're camera shy and everything, or if your staff are camera shy, a 30-second video is all you really need. Yeah, just telling people a bit about the firm, about the role, you know, why you're hiring this person. And please don't say it's because you know you're overworked and you need help. It's gotta be more than that. It's gotta be, you know, career growth and and and all of that as well. Um, so yeah, highly recommend the advert video. And if anyone needs a copy of job descriptions, we have so many, we've got one for every role. So just just let me know in the comments and I I can send that through to you after this call. Um, and I did see a comment about this the candidate scorecard. Yeah, Randy, we can send that across to you as well. Um, yeah, so there's that side of things. Then the next thing is uh really important, a career history form. So when anyone applies, you don't want to just read their resume because you know you want more than that. So we personally get them to do a career history form, which is basically you're asking questions that that are actually in their resume, but they've got to sort of put it again in this form. And that's really important because one, it it does sort of tell you if they actually are willing to go through the hiring process. I've had candidates say to me, why do I need to fill this out? Everything's in the resume. If from the get-go, if they're not willing to do things, um, that's a red flag. If I see, you know, referred to resume, I I go, well, if you if you're too lazy to just fill out a little thing that says what your responsibilities are, what are you going to be like when you work for my clients? So yeah, getting them to uh do that that career history form and then you cross-reference as well. So what they've told you in their resume, is it the same thing that they're telling you in the career history form, or is it completely different? I've had candidates say one thing, you know, that they could say that they've worked for a firm for two years in the resume, but then in their career history form they've said four years. So that's you know, that's not right. You so you need to make sure that those things are aligning. Um and then from there, always pre-screen your candidates because it just sort of cuts the time of the actual interview process in the sense of you do the pre-screening, you determine if they are actually worth proceeding with in the interview process. Because the last thing you want is to just go off what they've written and then jump straight into the interview and then realize five minutes in that this is not the right candidate, and then you've got to cut it short. But the interview slot says, you know, one hour. So it's disheartening for them because obviously they know that they've they haven't done a good job because you know they've you've ended the call five minutes in. Um, but it's also wasted your time as well. So just yeah, doing a pre-screening um Zoom is a good one, as in not Zoom like this, because that would be like an interview, but um your phone. So you can do Zoom phones and stuff, so you can call them. Um, so no matter where they are in the world, yeah, just give them a quick call and sort of ask them a bunch of questions about, especially if it's you know, individual tax returns, but it just depending on what you need them to do, um, ask them a little bit of technical questions, and then that will determine if they should be actually interviewed or not. And so, and that's where you would fill out that scorecard again, like you would update it then to see should you actually proceed with them. Um, and then from there, you've obviously got the interview process, but the biggest thing is don't just ask random questions. Uh, you should be asking specific questions. Uh, what we personally do is we ask them questions about their second most recent job and then their most recent job. And then we go on to questions about character and integrity and how they handle different situations. Um, but they are all very specific. So, and again, if people need help with the interview process at all or a guide or whatever it is, feel free to let me know and I'm happy to help you out there as well. Um, and then of course the reference checks. And Chris, I'm gonna call on you again because I'm not sure if if you had an issue with the reference checks. If you um when we did the hiring process for you, did someone try and pretend to be their own reference?

SPEAKER_02 16:04

Uh I don't think it was their own reference. I think it was they had a friend that was uh like yeah, it wasn't it wasn't a uh work colleague, it was definitely a friend. I remember that. I don't think I don't think they try to use themselves, I don't remember that that happening, but yeah, or it definitely wasn't a uh reputable person that was uh whether you're getting a reference from.

SPEAKER_04 16:24

But yeah, and this is why we do the reference checks. Don't ever skip this this section because you do determine if they are the right person by doing these references. And we do it online. So our one you can you can tell if someone has tried to be their own reference or if they've gotten a friend or whatever the case is, because ours users you know, it detects IP addresses and emails and all of that. Um, but yeah, even giving them a call, like giving the reference a call and asking them questions that a friend would wouldn't know, but an actual boss would. And it's gotta be someone that they reported to, someone that they, you know, that trained them or whatever the case is, it can't just be a coworker. Because a coworker is just gonna say, yeah, they've that were great, but they're not gonna know like the you know, the nitty-gritty sort of stuff. So make sure that it is an actual manager that you do speak to.

SPEAKER_02 17:20

Um this is something I've never been never been a strong point of mine in the past. So that's why uh yeah, you guys have been good with uh getting them out. I've never really looked at it that deep, and I've just taken them at face value. And it's this is definitely a bit of process.

Integrity Analysis And Skills Testing

SPEAKER_04 17:34

It is it is really important to do. Um if Tim was here, he would tell you the story about he, I think it was he did a reference check for someone. Um he had just done an interview with them, they they were great. Um, they said that they had worked for a firm for 11 years, um, but this firm was like just down the road. And he doesn't usually do this, but he was like, you know what, I'm just gonna call them because they're just down the road. I sort of know them. Um turns out she had never worked for this firm at all. They had never heard of her. Um, so that's why it's super important to actually do the reference check because you just you never know. Uh yeah, so that's that's the next thing. If you can do an integrity analysis, um, and that's basically where you would take all the information that you have from them so far, and you put it into an AI platform and you ask it to analyze everything, it's really good because it does give you like an analysis of if they've got high integrity, if there's any issues going on, um, yeah, any integrity issues. That's really important to do as well. So that's something that we would definitely recommend. And then from there, and this is really important, not as important as integrity, but super important, you've got to test your candidates. You've got to give them an assessment to do to make sure that they have the skills that they say they have. You don't want to just take their word for it. Um actually, Paul, can I call on you for this? How did you go with the hiring process? How did you find um with the assessments and everything? Did you have, were there times where you're like, oh yeah, this is this person's great, but then they didn't score so well, or what was your experience there?

SPEAKER_01 19:20

Yes, so with the interviews that we uh had with Chris, um basically, you know, a few of the applicants um seemed to present well and the regimes were well, but um I didn't score very well on the scorecard. Um and the and if I remember right, uh one of the um one of the applicants that actually did something on the regimen that they worked for a period of time that it wasn't as long. Um I think there were some inconsistencies there. So the analysis of the of their replications through your system is very, very good, very detailed. I highlighted a lot of issues that we avoided.

Personality Fit And Better Onboarding

Final Hiring Advice And Closing CTA

SPEAKER_04 20:01

Thanks, Paul. And yeah, that this is this is why we you know you you put them through these things to make sure that you are finding the right person. And I I can see that there's a few questions in the chat, so I will I will get to them in a moment. I'll just we're nearly at the end of this sort of section and then we'll we'll move on to the next section. Um, but yeah, so with the assessments, another good assessment to do is a personality test as well. Um, and it's just a good way to determine, you know, how they should be managed. What kind of personality do they have? You know, do they prefer someone who's going to, you know, look over their shoulder and and which most people don't, um, or do they need autonomy? Like what kind of style? And also are they a finder, minder, or a grinder? You know, you could hire someone and the personality test might say that they're, you know, a a minder, but you're hiring them for a for a grinder position. Um, and that's not a bad thing because it means that you've got something to work towards with them. That's a career path plan right there from the get-go. Um, yes, I definitely recommend doing a personality test. And then also making sure that, like I said earlier, updating the scorecard throughout the entire process. But the final thing I would suggest, and this is the step that a lot of people miss with the hiring process, it's the onboarding session. So you hire this person, and then that's sort of it. You you sort of go, okay, well, we'll see you on the first of March, and that's it. Um, you need to have communication before that, but you need to make sure that you've got a planned, like a, you know, what's going to happen in their first week. And I would suggest when they first join, having like a five minute meeting with every person on your team, regardless if it's in person or over Zoom, um, just to meet everyone. And then having step-by-step plans to to basically help them transition well into this position and know where they're going to be in three months' time, nine months time. But yeah, the onboarding session is super, super important because you don't want to hire someone and then just go, okay, here's your work. Good luck with everything. You need to make sure that they they know what they're doing, they're comfortable enough, and that they know exactly who they're reporting to as well. Um, yeah, I've had I've I've had some candidates say to me that they've less left their position because they had too many people that they were reporting to. They didn't know what was going on, and this was from the from the start. Um, so it's super important that they know if they've got a question, who who do they go to? Um it could be more than one person, but there's got to be a main person, like a like a mentor basically, who's going to train them up, who's gonna be that that person to to answer any questions that they have. Um yeah, so the onboarding session is sorry, the onboarding process is really, really important. Um but yeah, so that's that's the process. This is what I would recommend if you're hiring someone. You need to make sure that you've you've thought about this. You you haven't just gone, okay, I need to hire someone, so I'm gonna post the ad, interview them, reference, and that's it. You've got to actually do a step-by-step process to make sure that you are finding the right person. Um, and it sometimes it can take a little a little while. It can take a month or two, but you would rather spend a little bit more time finding this person than rushing the process and then having to start again in a couple of weeks' time because you've realized that it's not a good fit for for either of you.

SPEAKER_00 23:48

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of The Wise Way. If today's episode sparked an idea or helped you see things differently, please don't forget to leave us a review. And if you haven't subscribed to the podcast on your favourite platform yet, please go ahead and do that as well. Let's continue the conversation here through YouTube or any other social platforms that you can find us on. And just remember, if you're not a subscriber of our weekly Friday tip newsletter, you can get that to your inbox every week going forward. Whether you're starting out or scaling up, you don't have to do it alone. Let's build a business that works for you, the wise way. We'll see you in the next episode.