Worship and Leadership by LifePoint Creative
This podcast was intended to resource our Dream Teamers at LifePoint Church, with biblical fundamentals on worship, life and a variety of leadership principles.
Worship and Leadership by LifePoint Creative
LIVE from The Gathering: Q&A with Pastor Mike Burnette
Join us as we sit down with our lead pastor, Mike Burnette from LifePoint Church, as he answers some thought provoking questions, raised by our young adult community. He shares his personal stories of faith and leadership live from The Gathering.
Whether you're a young adult forging your own path or someone reminiscing about your formative years, you'll find wisdom and encouragement in Pastor Mike's reflections. Tune in for an episode filled with inspiration and guidance for anyone navigating the thresholds of young adulthood.
Thank you. Hey, this is awesome and this is exciting and we have right here next to me, we have pastor, our lead pastor at LifePoint Church, pastor Mike Burnett. What's going on? Great to be with you guys. What's going on?
Speaker 2:I want to use that intro music every time I come in here, go to work, come home after work, just play. Have like one of my daughters. Hit the button.
Speaker 1:Hit the little button. What's going on? Do they have to call you Pastor Mike at home?
Speaker 2:Just Dr Dad.
Speaker 1:Dr Dad.
Speaker 2:Hey, what's up everybody? It's cool how y'all doing. Are y'all glad to be at the gathering on a Tuesday night? Come on somebody. Can we thank our young adult pastors, pastors Jordan and Aaron Smalley, for just doing an amazing job fostering community. All right, hey Will. Thank you guys for being with us tonight.
Speaker 2:I've gotten a lot of questions about my sweatshirt and I wore it on purpose. It's an illustration. It's also just a sweet brand that this dude has come out with online. It's Holy One Clothing. But if you follow my Instagram page at Pastor Mike Burnett, that's my handle. That's your handle. That's right. If you follow at Pastor Mike Burnett, I just put on my story a picture of you guys and this sweatshirt, but I want to encourage everybody to get one. They said they only made 100 of them, so I've been trying to sling them like crazy. I get nothing for it. I just think it's a bold statement of what we believe and I wore it out last week just out with my family and the looks you get. It's like some people want to argue about it. I think I wore it the week of the election and people want to either argue about it or you'll get like the real saved people but don't want to be publicly saved, and they're like hey. I see your sweater.
Speaker 2:I think it's cool man, so they don't know how to handle it. But this is, this is the declaration of our lives as Christians and I love it. I love how bold it is. I love the design. It's the old throwback run DMC logo. I asked somebody earlier y'all heard run DMC. Right, they're like who's this? Now I'm so old, pastor Elmer. How is it like? The two of us are old enough to be everyone's dad in this room. That's weird. Huh yeah, I have a kid in this room actually. My daughter's a part of this gathering.
Speaker 2:So a couple of years. Last year I got to speak to the football team at Austin Peay and of course Pastor Jordan leads the way as chaplain to the football team and I looked at all the players. I was like all of you are young enough to be my kids. And then the coaching staff was young enough to be like my nephews. You know, so it's weird being the old man in a room, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Hey, you're not that old. Thanks Dad, can we encourage him? He's really really good.
Speaker 2:Hey, so you guys have. First of all, I love hanging out with young adults, college students, and I love the gathering. I love that we have this as part of LifePoint Church and folks that are part of this that aren't a part of LifePoint we're so glad that you're here as well. Prior to moving to Clarksville, which this summer will be 15 years since we moved here to take over this small church out in the field on Rossview Road Anyway, prior to coming here, stephanie and I were young adults and college pastors in Springfield, missouri, and it was the greatest season of ministry honestly great preparation for what we're doing now.
Speaker 2:But I just love this stage of life for a lot of reasons, and so I kind of envy the stage of life that many of you guys are in, because you're forging your values. You're really like solidifying the kind of man or the woman that you're going to be for the rest of your life. You're looking for a soulmate. You know you're looking for that person to do life with forever. I actually didn't.
Speaker 2:Sometimes I struggled with as a college pastor, like folks in their 20s that were single and looking, because I literally heard about and met Stephanie when I was 20. And the Lord told me I was going to marry her right away, which was a gift to me because I needed a wife, you know, and she was 18. We got married at 22 and 20. And so we didn't live in our 20s single, but we've been married since we were 20 and 22. But we were working with college students and young adults and have just loved this stage of life, because so many things are being determined and decided that you will carry with you for the rest of your life and the values that you're deciding on and committing to will be the values that you teach your kids and your grandkids benefit from.
Speaker 2:Some of you are like I can't even think about grandchildren, but I'm telling you, they're coming. They're coming, and who you are becoming in this stage of your life is so important to the generations that will come after you. And I do remember as a college student. So I became a Christian. When I was 17, on Halloween, the Lord's Day, it. So I became a Christian.
Speaker 2:When I was 17, on Halloween, the Lord's day, and my freshman year of college, I moved to the to Knoxville, to go to the university of Tennessee. It was voted the number one party school in America. My freshman year and I left the party scene when I got saved. Both of my brothers were college fraternity presidents and and I used to party with them and like in my house you can just. I mean we didn't have a lot of boundaries. The rules were don't get in trouble, don't hurt anybody and don't get caught, you know, like those weren't officially on the wall, but that's kind of how we lived.
Speaker 2:Anyway, when I became a Christian, I just left that whole life completely Right and I started voraciously pursuing Christ, and the only thing that I was taught as a young Christian was read the Bible every day, pray every day and do what the Bible says. It wasn't a lot of rules, it was a way of life, a pattern of thinking and a pattern of living Read the Bible, do what it says, pray every day and be kind and tell other people about Jesus. So, as a freshman in college at the University of Tennessee, somebody asked me recently where'd you go to Bible college? I said I went to the University of Tennessee. They're like I didn't know they had a Bible school. They didn't.
Speaker 2:But when you're a lone Christian on a wild party school, at a huge football school, and I lived in a dorm called the zoo Hess Hall, my Bible college, my Bible training, a lot of it came of very lonely nights in my dorm room, me and my Bible, and I told the Lord. When I went to college I said I will never go to a bar, a club or a party ever, not one time ever. I promise you God, I will never do it, because I loved doing that before I came to Jesus and I fit in that world. I knew how to party, I knew how much I could handle and still drive home Y'all hear what I'm saying everybody. I just knew that world and so I told the Lord I will never go to a bar, club or party ever in my college career, ever. And I never did. But that meant I had a lot of lonely nights and I had options I could run. So then I had to find other options.
Speaker 2:I always say nobody likes running. People that say they love to run, oh, I love running. It's runner's high. No, you're stupid, nobody loves to run, everybody likes finishing a run. Can I hear an amen from somebody? Nobody likes to run? Anyway, my options were I could go run, I could go out to a movie by myself, or I spent a lot of time in my Bible on Friday nights, saturday nights, weeknights.
Speaker 2:And I'm telling you that freshman year of college for me changed my life, and it wasn't like big gatherings like this. I never knew about things like this when I was a freshman in college, but it was just time with God where his word became so alive to me. It became like what I breathed in and out in the daytime, like I remember the Lord's prayer. You know, our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread. And Jesus, actually he taught us to pray that, but he actually gave commentary on that idea when he said man doesn't live by bread alone but by what, every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Father. And I just I really believed.
Speaker 2:When I was a young person, 18, 19 years old, I believed every bit of this. I believe this is the word of God, that the scripture is from God and for us, and I just believe that this is what I'm going to live with and this is what I'm going to live by. And I was an 18, 19 year old college student alone in a dorm room in the party, in a school in the country, meeting with Jesus on the regular. Second Timothy, chapter three, says all of scripture is breathed out by God. It's 316. I don't know if you've ever done a study on 316s, like we all know. John. 316, right, come on, we know that verse. Please, god, help me you know that verse right.
Speaker 2:And then of course, austin 3.16, if you're over 40 and you're a wrestling fan, Anyway. 1 John 3.16. 1 Timothy 3.16. There's like a pattern of 3.16s in the New Testament. 2 Timothy 3.16 says all Scripture is breathed out by God and it's profitable for teaching, reproofing, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man or woman of God may be complete and equipped for every good work. So here's where I wanted to start tonight's talk. I was in a conversation recently after the election with someone who I respect and love very dearly. And I was in a conversation recently after the election with someone who I respect and love very dearly and I was asking this person some questions about the election and politics and political views. And this person said to me well, you view everything in your world through that Bible. And for this person that said it it was almost accusatory, like I'm narrow-minded and I don't have any other worldview. And I said, well, yeah, I think it's kind of a prerequisite to be a pastor.
Speaker 2:I try to throw a little humor back but I said, and then I really started reflecting on the fact that that was this person's perspective of me, and I said, and then I really started reflecting on the fact that that was this person's perspective of me and I thought what a great compliment that that person realizes that about me, that my life is evidence of the fact that this is what I value most, that the word of God shapes my worldview and one of the things I want to challenge this room as we get into the conversations tonight you're going to hear me and Pastor Elmer reference the Bible a lot, because it is the bedrock, foundational place where we get worldview In our doctrinal statement. And this is like classic evangelical Christianity, right, and that's not a pejorative. That's just a Christianity, right and that's not a pejorative. That's just a description for Christianity that believes in Jesus is Lord. The Bible's true and we want to win the loss to Jesus right, so that version of Christianity. We have a doctrinal statement. It's always the first statement we believe the Bible is true and the Bible is authoritative for faith and conduct. So the Bible is the authority of what we believe and how we behave. And so I want to set the tone for this conversation tonight because we can talk about whatever you want.
Speaker 2:And a lot of times people ask me as a leader or a pastor or the old man in the room, they'll go, what do you think about? And I'll say it doesn't matter what I think and people go. I want your opinion, I go. Well, the Bible says yeah, but what do you think? Well, I've submitted my thoughts and beliefs and my values and my opinions to what God's word says. And there are things that God's word says that I don't like like forgive your people that have offended you or bless your enemies. I don't like that. I wish Jesus didn't say that we're going to write a series next year called I Wish Jesus Didn't Say that. And it's stuff that God's word says that I don't necessarily like, but I choose to surrender my life to Do. Y'all hear what I'm saying, everybody.
Speaker 2:So I think, when we get into conversations, a lot of times we're in a world and a culture right now where it's like what do you think, what does the common culture think, or what are your trending influencers think? And I just come back to this place right here what does God's word say? What's Jesus say? He actually referenced the scripture constantly. If you go study the gospels, he consistently referenced the Bible and he would say this is the kingdom of God, this is the heart of God on this matter, and part of the revelation of Jesus is it's the full revelation of the Godhead in the heart of the Father, and so everything that Jesus said matters to the Father and should matter to us. So I just want to set that as a groundwork for this conversation tonight, Because I think, if we don't have at least common understanding that the Bible is the framework and the foundation for how we build life and how we just orient our lives, it's our worldview.
Speaker 2:then, honestly, conversations become arguments real fast. You know what I'm saying. And then it's a matter of who can just out-argue people. You ever watch people on social media and it's like, well, that guy's a really good debater and well, man, she really crushed everybody. I just wonder.
Speaker 2:Jesus never tried to win debates, but he always told truth and he always said things that outlasted him. Isn't that great news, everybody? So I think as a worldview, as a groundwork, it's important that you guys decide man, I'm going to let the scripture direct my life. How many of you have just at least said that's where I want to go? Good, that's you would say I want the scripture to direct my life. Every word of scripture is God breathed and profitable. Think of when God breathed. He breathed and creation happened. He created the world through speaking and breath and he breathed out his scriptures. For us that's incredible. So that's kind of a groundwork for how I want to have these conversations tonight and hopefully, honestly, it allows us to stay out of partisan views. Or how I was raised and what my grandmama said what does Jesus say?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I have a question for you based on what you just said About the sweatshirt. Jesus says All right, go ahead.
Speaker 1:What's your handle. No, I'm just kidding. I do want to ask you a question real quick, but it's something I referenced in the sermon this week. I know you guys have been going over the journey in small groups and stuff, and this last week we talked about bearing fruit and I did make a distinct difference between being a disciple and a follower. That disciples we commit to becoming more like our teacher, which is Jesus Christ. Right, we want to be more like Jesus, which a follower. How many of you have followed someone on social media and then unfollowed them just because you wanted to, or they said something, and so there's another level of commitment as disciples. And so what you're talking about right now the Bible. How did that begin, though You're 18, 19 in college, but who put that in you that all of a sudden, the Bible became your go-to? I just spoke with some people before and it's like what do I do when I'm struggling with certain things, but how did this become the thing to go to?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah Well, first of all, christianity is built on Christ right.
Speaker 2:Christianity is not built on the church. The church is built on Christ as well. So Christianity is built on Christ and the revelation of Jesus is in the scripture. All of the Old Testament points towards him, all the gospels reveal him, and then the New Testament looks back on how to live for him. Right, so that's kind of how you orient yourself around scripture. So if I called myself a Christian, actually, did you know this? In the New Testament they didn't call them Christians for a long time. They were called followers of Jesus or followers of the way, and when they use the term Christian, I think it's like Acts, chapter 12 or 16 or something like that.
Speaker 2:It was used as kind of like oh, those are just Clarksvillians, or oh, those are just Tennesseans, or those are just Christians. It was used as like a descriptor, not like a title. But I learned early on, if I'm going to follow Jesus, I need to know Jesus, I need to get to know Jesus. And if you think about all of church history, all of church history is built on understanding and revelation from the Bible, like how we read and interpret the scripture.
Speaker 2:There's no manual outside of that predates the Bible. That goes here's how you do church and be a Christian. It's the scripture, it's the apostles teaching, it's the teachings of Jesus, it's the scriptures. And so when I was, when I was a young Christian, I had a pastor, pastor Greg Harper, who said man, your Bible. Uh, I would hear all these statements in church that I didn't know what it meant, but they would say man, it's a sword Bible. I would hear all these statements in church that I didn't know what it meant, but they would say man, it's a sword. It's a sword, it's a weapon. I was like this sounds awesome man.
Speaker 2:Let's go. But then I found that verse where it talks about the word of God is a sword of the spirit. But then I started thinking about it like what does that mean for it to be a sword? It means it's an offensive and defensive weapon. It's protection for me. It cuts through my heart, it cuts through lies and I just, I don't know. I just I had this understanding that the Bible is important from my youth pastor, that the Bible reveals Christ. It's all speaking about Christ in some indirect or direct way. And if I want to be a Christ follower and I want to be a Christian, then I need to be a person of the scripture. A lot of Christians are really faithful to their church more than they're faithful to the word of God. Yeah, and that shouldn't be the case.
Speaker 1:And so what comes first? Like a lot of people Sorry, the last part of what- fashioned that in me is I was a lonely Christian.
Speaker 2:I was always a popular, well-liked kid. I was voted class clown. My senior year they elected me to be the class speaker for our graduation. Class clown my senior year they elected me to be the class speaker for our graduation. I was always known and liked. I've told my girls just be nice to everybody. Don't be nice to one group or one clique like the jocks or the preps or the nerds or the whatever. Be nice to everybody. Everybody likes people who are nice. You know, and that was me. I was always kind of that kid.
Speaker 2:But here I was on one of the biggest college campuses in Tennessee and I felt very alone because I didn't have anybody growing in Jesus with me. So I like I just became really obsessive about the Bible because and I felt like I met Christ there in my dorm room, in my dark times, in, in my lonely places, like I just met the Lord in his word. And when somebody taught me, when you open your Bible, say a prayer before and after Lord, as I approach your word, speak to me today, amen. Then read it and then when you close it, go God. Here's what I think you said to me today. It was so simple, you know.
Speaker 1:So anyway, all right. Yeah Well, my question was like what comes first? Do you get a revelation of Jesus and his word and then that changes you? Or do you change first, you become a better person and then the Bible makes sense? Because there's a lot, like you said, a lot of people are more faithful to the church, to gatherings. This means a lot more to people than just getting into their Bible because it's probably easier to do that or it makes more sense. So, like, what comes first? Like does the word getting into your word and digging in, will that change you?
Speaker 2:I could lose everyone in my life and I will still have everything because of my relationship with Jesus. You have to get to that place. You have to believe that I could lose my job, my health, my family. I could lose every friend I have, but I still have a friend in Jesus. What a friend we have in Jesus, and I don't think you really get a good. I think the life of a Christian is the unfolding of the revelation of who Christ is.
Speaker 2:So which comes first is an interesting question. I think we live in a culture where people hate to be alone. But you got to get alone with Christ and some of our greatest struggles is, we don't like the idea of being in silence, solitude, listening to the Lord through his word or by his Holy Spirit. And we're in a culture now where everybody has to be connected and liking things and seeing who posts on what, and we're just so digitally connected. Yet still, honestly, if we're honest, we're isolated, but we just don't like loneliness. We think it's a. It's like a scary place or a weak place. But man Jesus was fashioned in isolation. Think about that 40 days after his baptism he was isolated and starving, hungry, and he went through that whole time without any pressure, until the last day the devil tempted him. But anyway, I think we don't like to be alone.
Speaker 2:The question was which comes first? Without faith in Christ, it's impossible to please God, right, so you have to first believe that he is. This is Hebrews 11. Without faith in Christ, it's impossible to please God, right, so you have to first believe that he is. This is Hebrews 11. Without faith, it's impossible to please God, for we must first believe that he is and that he rewards those who diligently seek him. That's the salvation verse. So, like you'll never please God for your salvation unless you believe Jesus is real, is the Son of God, died for your sins, raised from the dead. That's like the base level, beginning of your walk with God. I think a lot of people actually believe Jesus was real, lived, died on a cross and raised from the dead. Most people's issue is they don't want to submit to him. But like the first revelation, and it's the Lord who draws you, the Bible, Jesus said no one comes to the father, no one comes to me, unless the father draws them to me. So the very fact that you can even have a relationship with God through Christ at all is because God's working in you. So that's the first revelation. Like the aha is like God loves me.
Speaker 2:Jesus is real, but unfortunately for many of us we just stopped there. We go, I said the prayer and I'm just going to hang on to heaven and hope I don't go to hell. That's just not Christianity. And then from there you go. Now I want to get to know this God who loves me, I want to walk in a relationship with this Christ who saved me and I want to get to know this Christ. And that's where I mean that revelation never stops unfolding. This week, this morning, I'm reading a passage of scripture in Matthew 25. I've read countless times and I'm seeing brand new things I've never seen before. So the revelation of Christ, that's the adventure of the Christ follower, I mean, think about when Jesus asked people. Are my answers too long? Are these good?
Speaker 2:for the podcast listener. If you think about when Jesus asked everyone to follow him, right, you guys have read your gospels. I'm assuming most of you probably have Read the gospels. Jesus' invitation was always really simple Come with me, come follow me. And Gospels Jesus' invitation was always really simple Come with me, come follow me. And what he never did was tell them where they're going, how long they take and what they were going to do when they got there Never.
Speaker 2:Can you imagine right, if he told Judas what it was going to be like to follow him? We're going to get real close. You're going to see the best miracles ever. You're going to like me. Then you're going to trade me in for a bag of silver. Then you're going to regret that because you're going to see me on a cross and you're going to love me again and in grief and shame you're going to kill yourself. Come with me. The adventure of following Christ is it's like new every day. What's that verse? The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases. His mercies are endure. You know this song. Anyway, his mercies are new every morning, new every morning. I just think every day is an adventure with God and he wants to reveal more of himself to you. So the revelation just continues to unfold and unfold and we never figure him out fully. That's the beauty of this, the beautiful part of it too.
Speaker 1:I believe, like I've always said this, like the greater your revelation of jesus you're greater than your praise, because, unless you realize how great he is and I've been through a season where I've had to learn and accept I've been in church for a long time, I grew up, even from a little kid, and that whole concept of you I'm I like you know, and that Jesus loves you and like you're saying, as a fresh believer, just someone that's barely meeting Christ, understanding all this, you might be in church forever and you struggle with the concept of that. You're loved by Jesus and that being, regardless of what you do and what your life looks like, that God still loves you, like God still loves me. Regardless of all that and that's one of the things that has helped me grow in my faith and even allowing the word of God to become more real is that even the hard things in the Bible are there for me to listen and to grow from, because God loves me, that he's resourced me not just through his word but also relationships, and the only thing that I've always been like when I say like what comes first, like the hangout or like God's word, is what I've been cautious in my life is. A lot of times we'll say, well, I see Jesus in other people, right, and that's true.
Speaker 1:A lot of people will never step into church, but the only revelation of Jesus that they have is our lives, right, so our testimonies, how we live day to day. But then there comes a point, like you said, like you have to get into the word because God has a revelation for you. He has a purpose and a plan for all of our lives. You can just be secondhand Christian and see what God is doing in everyone's life, but he has something specific for you. And so that's why I believe, like what you're saying is incredible, because you need to personally get into the word, because he wants to personally get to know you and he has something just for you.
Speaker 2:So that's awesome and I think Christians should reveal the hand of God and I think Christians can reveal parts of the heart of God, but the word and Jesus Christ will expose the heart of God and the way of God. There's just no.
Speaker 2:Christianity apart from Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the love of the Father and the Word of God? There's not. I mean, I'm not going to suggest that you won't be saved if you're not a Bible person, but your life will be really hard and, I don't know, it'll be very uninformed. And if your Christianity is just going from one good behavior of Christians to a next, that's not you growing in Christianity, that's you watching others grow in their Christianity. Right, so I'm a huge fan. The Bible should be your worldview. That person that said that to me today kind of meant it as a dig. You view the whole thing, everything so black and white through the Bible. I was like, wow, you can tell whole thing, everything so black and white through the Bible. I was like, wow, you can tell, and it's black and white and red. Thank you very much. Come on, that's a Bible joke right there. You got to be real saved for that joke. Red letter by. Okay, anyway, whatever, black, white and red. Oh, all right, is this helpful so far? Yes, I just want to encourage you guys.
Speaker 2:Hey, listen everybody. You need to hear this. God is so madly in love with you. You're not even here on accident. Some of y'all got suckered into like meatball subs, and that's why you came tonight. I'm just telling you, god is so madly in love with you. He's so in love with you that he brought you here tonight to be reminded, not of anything I have to say, but what he has to say about you. And here's what God has to say about you. You ready?
Speaker 2:Hey everybody, look at me when I tell you this. God sees you, he loves you deeply. He's not ashamed of you, embarrassed of you. He's not done with you. He is for you and he loves you with an unending love. And he loves you so much that he literally gave his own life on the cross so that your sins would be forgiven and your eternity would be captured. And here's the thing Eternity doesn't start when you die. Eternity starts when you die to yourself. You're an eternal person from there forward. Like I'm a son of God, I'm a child of heaven today. That was what I learned when I was 17. You died to yourself.
Speaker 2:No like I can be a part of this family now because I grew up in the South. How many Southerners Y'all know what I'm talking about. Watch this. We respect God, we believe in God. We won't cuss at church property. Y'all hear me Like I knew how to be respectful around Christians and the church world, but I didn't live for God and what I learned was God loved me so much he's inviting me into relationship that that can be such a generic term. Sometimes God wants a relationship with you and people like I don't even know what that means. It's because we have skewed views of relationships. But that relationship invite is that you can be a son or a daughter today. You don't have to wait till you die to figure out heaven. We can live heavenly now, and so I just want you to hear me say that God loves you so much, unending, undying. He only has good for you. He's got more mercy, grace and forgiveness than you've ever even thought is possible, and he has a new life for you, starting tonight, because he loves you so much, amen.
Speaker 1:Amen. You're saying Southerners Respect Church and in California that's where all my friends would go to get high. They'd go to church. What that's the truth.
Speaker 2:It's like let's go to church, bro. That's like some other kind of church, that's different.
Speaker 1:That's some Hollywood church that's Hollywood church, that's in the valley. We're going to kind of flip the script here. Yeah please Turn the page. Turn the page. Well, that's a current reference right, there Come on. Now Turn the page. I'm going to ask this question right here. How can young adults navigate healthy boundaries in dating and non-dating?
Speaker 2:relationships. Oh, we're going for it.
Speaker 1:We're going to go that way. Y'all take out your notepads. How do you navigate, how do we navigate?
Speaker 2:healthy boundaries. Well, first question is do you want to have healthy boundaries? Yeah, seriously, because, honestly, some people don't even know what the concept is right. They don't even know what that means. Healthy boundaries, guardrails, they're, they're borders. Right, a boundary is a border of of how far you can go if you think. Think of your backyard. If you grew up in a house with a fenced-in backyard, that is a clearly defined boundary.
Speaker 2:I grew up in a house. My next-door neighbor was like a really just crazy old mountain man and he would threaten to kill us every time we jumped the fence into his yard. And then he wouldn't and then he'd, you know, do like really. You know, he's the one that gave us moonshine for the first time when I was 11. I mean, he was a terrible and wonderful friend all at the same time for an unbelieving 11-year-old, but anyway, he always threatened us if we crossed the boundary. And, honestly, you just need to establish those things in dating and you need boundaries in various areas. What are our physical boundaries? That seems like the only thing church wants to talk about but I think that's super important.
Speaker 2:Can I just give you, can I give you a perspective on physical boundaries? I think a lot of times we go how much can I do instead of how much can I save for my spouse? And can I just tell you, like one of the greatest gifts and I'm just going to be really honest here One of the greatest gifts my wife and I gave each other on our wedding night was all of our sexual purity and I held onto that for her. Before I knew her. I thought, man, I want to give this to my wife one day and I didn't want to just give her like the last part, I wanted to give her some of the previous parts too. You hear what I'm saying everybody and y'all know what I'm saying. Like y'all are grownups.
Speaker 2:They don't know what you're saying Well, sometimes people, the only thing they have left is intercourse to give away, but they've done oral sex and nude heavy petting and all these other things and give all that. The question is not how much can you get away with now, but how much do you want to give away then? I think one of the traps of immaturity is we only think about now, we don't think about later.
Speaker 2:And mature people understand how to delay gratification for a better time. My wife has never had a boyfriend but me, and the night we started dating, which was November 10th two days ago, thank you, only the girls did that. The girls aww. And the guys are like is there more meatballs, more chicken parm in the back.
Speaker 1:Today is the day I actually proposed to my wife.
Speaker 2:Let's go 18 years ago, hey, so Stephanie and I started dating on November 10th of 2000. And that night, listen. So we had gone on a date, like we went to a campus ministry thing together. It was a Thanksgiving dinner for Chi Alpha at UT and we went together. Then we had the DTR. Come on, that's what they call it these days define the relationship and we decided that was it and I knew I was going to marry this girl way before, then that's a whole other story.
Speaker 2:But I knew we were going to get married and I remember back then people thought I was crazy if they could see me now. And even now people are like that's not true, that didn't really happen. But I promise you, hand to God, when I heard about Stephanie, the Lord spoke to me and said this is going to be your wife. I told her that on our first date, by the way, that was real bold, and she just kind of looked at me like okay, not feeling that.
Speaker 1:Do you recommend that?
Speaker 2:I mean, it worked for me. I've been married 22 years, but anyway. So the night we started dating I want y'all to hear me when I say this the night we started dating. Here's the pattern of dating we get exclusive with a stranger, we give away private parts of ourselves and then we get to know them through those exchanges of privacies, right Like our deep, dark secrets, our family histories, our physical selves. And we do that with relative strangers. We have hookup culture. We have physical intimacy as a gauge of whether or not we're compatible. That is the dumbest compatibility gauge ever. So Stephanie and I met in April of 2000. We began dating officially on November 10th of 2000.
Speaker 2:Do the math. Is that six? Months later. And that night she told me I just want you to know, no one will ever see under my clothes unless they're my husband. She told me the first night. I was like girl, how fast do you think this is trying to go? Actually, I said to her I respect that. I said I respect that and I feel the same way. I said I've saved myself from my wife and you're not her. So I don't have any intentions for that. But we put hard boundaries in place physically.
Speaker 2:And let me tell you something the closer we got to marriage, the more difficult it was to keep those boundaries in place. But we fought together for it and when I was weak, she was strong, when she was weak, I was strong. When we were weak, we didn't hang out together. That's the truth. You got to go. You go, no, but then you need emotional boundaries right, like you need. You need to know what's appropriate to give away to someone else emotionally. I think you need relational boundaries.
Speaker 2:Listen, you cannot cut off all your friends because you've got a boyfriend. In fact, fellas, you can't diss all your bros because you got a girlfriend. Like you actually need a brotherhood and a sisterhood more. When you're trying to figure out, is this the person I want to spend my life with, you need to retreat back to a group of people that will pray for you, that will guard you and cover you. I'm telling you, I've done a lot of weddings and they always have bridesmaids and groomsmen right. Those should be the people you are like leaning on now. Don't just lean on them on your wedding day.
Speaker 2:The craziest weddings are the ones where they're like you know, they found some dudes to fill in the groomsmen spots. They're like I don't even know this brother man, but he just came, he needed a meal. I think you need to lean into your brotherhood and your sisterhood when you're trying to figure out, because they will pray and cover you. You need some relational boundaries. I'm not giving up my friends for you, but I'm also not giving up this girl. I'm pursuing for my bros and guys will clap on their guys, you know, and guys will clap on their guys. Man, whatever, bro, we lost you to that girl.
Speaker 2:Well, that's what is supposed to happen, but you just got to have good boundaries, and you need good boundaries with your family. Now let me just say, if I can give one sentence about relationships and your family of origin, this is assuming you have a healthy family. Now, all of our family's crazy. Come on, how many of y'all got some crazy family members up in here? Okay, all of us got some a little bit crazy.
Speaker 2:And if you don't have any crazy people in your family, you're the crazy one. I don't know if you knew that or not. That's the statistical truth. But if you're dating somebody just trust me when I say this you want to date somebody seriously, that is an addition to your family and not someone who subtracts you from your family. My father-in-law is one of my best friends. In fact, stephanie and I, if she left me, I'm still hanging out with Norman and Jean. Are you kidding me? I love my mother-in-law.
Speaker 2:Like you want, you want somebody that's an addition to your family. You want somebody that you can't wait to bring home and they can't wait to get to know your family better. But sometimes our family boundaries get so twisted up and then we we find someone who really doesn't match our family values or our DNA and they pull us away from our family. And I just don't think that's the way this is again assuming healthy, general, healthy family dynamics. And I just don't think that's the way this is again assuming healthy, general, healthy family dynamics. And if you've got like a really abusive family or you know a non-God-fearing family and you meet a wonderful woman of God, then there's a dissonance there.
Speaker 2:I understand that but you still have to navigate healthy families. So physical, spiritual, emotional oh spiritual boundaries, my Lord, never date a non-believer. Never date a non-believer. Never date a non-believer, I don't care how hot he is, I don't care how kind he is. I'm just telling you from 24 years of ministry experience. Back me up on this, Pastor, homer, it never builds your faith. It will always cost you always. I cannot think of any times where someone dated a non-believer, pursued a non-believer, got engaged, fell in love, got married to a non-believer and that person's faith exploded. Never. And because we love Jesus more than anybody, listen, because we believe his word is the foundation and this is the framework of our lives, are y'all back to the beginning of this talk tonight? You need someone who's going to challenge you in faith and push you.
Speaker 2:Stephanie and I like one of my favorite things, and she would get so annoyed with me. I'm just a logic brain, a thinker, I ask a lot of questions, I'm a little argumentative and I was new to Christianity. She grew up in church so I'd ask her questions about stuff she's believed her whole life, like how do you know you're saved? She goes what I go. How do you know? Like you know you're saved, she's like by faith.
Speaker 2:I was like that ain't enough. How do you know we're dating? She's like are we really going here? I was like yes, and I think it caused a fight. She was like my father prayed with me when I was four years old. I was like what does that have to do with anything? Your dad's name's not in the Bible. Tell me why you're saved. But it was us sparring to get tighter in our language and we were sharpening one another. She didn't like the means by which that happened. She's forgiven me, but I do want to encourage you like your spiritual boundaries are super important. Never give your heart away to someone who doesn't love your God. Anyway, those are some of the boundaries I would encourage you with dating so good.
Speaker 1:How many of you in the room are dating right now? Well, that is an awkward question, just blasting folks. How many of you are single?
Speaker 2:It's like half of them. I have so many commentaries on that question though.
Speaker 1:How many of you are scared to answer that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I want to know how many of you are with somebody that you're kind of not clear but you don't know what to.
Speaker 1:Then you're waiting on her to go oh, we are, yeah, yeah I was just curious when you're talking they got official right here at the gathering at the gathering made it happen. Oh man, all right, we're gonna um. Another question for you. We're living in what has been described as the anxious generation. What would you say to someone that's battling anxiety, panic, overly stressed?
Speaker 2:There's a great book out called the Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt, h-a-i-d-t. And he's on social media, ironically, because he hates it and thinks it's one of the major causes of heightened anxiety, depression, suicidal ideation, especially among teenage females, and the stats bear this out. So this isn't just his opinion. This is statistical, data driven analysis. Uh, the founders of social media groups like, uh, twitter, youtube, facebook many of them have come out saying we won't even let our own kids have this stuff.
Speaker 2:Um, but I do want to say there's a lot of factors that probably push us towards anxiety, depression, all of these things in our lives, and a lot of times we don't want to deal with those things like the contributing factors. So we want to continue with the things that have maybe contributed to our anxiety or depression, and then we want to add medications or add treatments or add behavioral activities to cope with those things. And I just want to say, first of all, if you can just look at my real face oh, I'm not on screen here, so this is great. If you can look at my face for a second I just want to tell you you don't have to live in anxiety and depression and fear. You don't have to.
Speaker 2:And the reason I can say that is because the scripture says God has not given us a spirit of fear, but power, love and a sound mind. What do you believe? Do you believe that, or do you believe I'm just stricken with anxiety and depression? Now, I'm an educated person. I believe in chemical depression. I believe in all those things.
Speaker 2:I also believe the word of God that says he's a healer. I believe the body of Christ is strong among us. Ephesians 3.20 says God is able to do exceeding abundantly. Above all, we can ask or imagine according to the power at work in us. There's something about the collection of us where we experience the power of God. I also believe the commands of Jesus and the Apostle Paul. When it comes to anxiety and worry, jesus said in Matthew 6, do not worry. He didn't say hey.
Speaker 2:I wish you wouldn't worry, he didn't say hey, if you get around to it, just calm down. He gave it as a command language. In fact, you need to always pay attention when Jesus gives command language. But he said do not worry. He said don't worry about the things of this world. And then he gave benign examples what you'll eat, what you'll wear. And then he said this unbelievers worry about those things, but you belong to your father, who knows every need you have. And then he says do not worry, believe in your father, who knows you. And then he says seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness.
Speaker 2:Now, a lot of times we take that verse and we go okay, I'm worried about my exams, I'm worried about my relationship. So I'm going to seek God about my relationship. I'm going to seek God. I'm going to pray every day about my girlfriend. I'm going to pray that God change her heart, make her fall in love with me and marry me. Whatever. I'm just talking about counseling session I had once.
Speaker 2:He didn't say seek God about the thing you're worried about. He just said seek God. I mean, if Jesus? Let me ask you how many of you guys have just got something you've been worried about Seriously? Be honest, okay, if Jesus walked in the room. Would you only talk to him about that or would you look at him and go tell me whatever you want to say. Man, can I just be around you? What kind of cologne you got on, bro? Where'd you get that robe? Like how many of you would just try to get around him? But very often, what? Often what we do is we seek first the kingdom of God as it pertains to the thing I'm worrying about, which actually makes you worry in prayer, and then you're trying to give God your worries. Jesus said do not worry about the things of this world. Go read it. Matthew 6, 25 through 33. Don't worry about what you'll eat, what you'll wear, who you'll marry, what you're going to do in your career. He said Gentiles, unbelievers, non-faith people worry about these things, but your father in heaven knows all of these things. Then he said seek first the kingdom of God, which is what the reign of Christ, the word of God, the heart of God, and seek his righteousness, which is what His right activity among us. Has he ever let us down? No, can we seek the favor of God? Can we seek the down? No, can we seek the favor of God. Can we seek the word of God, can we seek the righteousness of God. And then Jesus said and all these things will be taken care of.
Speaker 2:I've been in ministry like 24 years and I remember starting out in ministry I just couldn't figure out what the next step was, what the next part of my journey was, and I started out as a music director at a church and then a youth pastor. For four years I was on staff in Knoxville and then I was looking at going into seminary and I just remember this verse coming alive, going. You know what? I don't have to figure out the last step, I just need to trust God for the next step.
Speaker 2:And many of us are worried about stuff like so far out that you I mean even God's not thinking that far out in your life. He's trying to get you to brush your teeth every day. You know what I'm saying. Like he, let's figure out today.
Speaker 2:You know that passage that says the word of God is a light unto my path and a lamp for my feet. If you think about this, in the old Testament days a lamp was a flame, just a flame. It wasn't like a light, like like these kinds of flashlights. You know it was a flame and the goal of that flame was just to give you the next three to five feet in front of you to see your path. And I'm telling you, if you would just say Lord, what's today, what's this week? James says. It's like James chapter two. He says don't say tomorrow I will do this or that, rather say if it's the Lord's will tomorrow, tomorrow I will do this or that, rather say if it's the Lord's will, tomorrow I will do this or that thing. So so when it comes to anxiety and worry and depression and all those things, jesus says don't worry.
Speaker 2:And then Paul says in Philippians four do not be anxious about anything. I just want you to hear me say it again Some of you that are dealing with anxiety, some of you are medicated for anxiety and depression. I just want you to hear me say it because I love you. You don't have to live that way. And maybe some of the causes of your anxiety it would be better for you to just eliminate than to medicate. If you've got friends that cause you anxiety and worry, get rid of those friends, and some of us anxiety and worry. Get rid of those friends and some of us go. Well, if I get rid of these friends? How will they ever come to know Jesus? God cares more about them than you do. Some of you got really toxic home lives and family of origin lives and that causes you worry and anxiety. Well, part of growing up is putting up some boundaries. But I'm just telling you you don't have to live that way. Stress is not from the Lord, fear is not from the Lord. Worry and anxiety you don't have to live with that.
Speaker 2:Paul says do not be anxious about anything, but in all things, with prayer, petition and thanks Notice those.
Speaker 2:That's his formula. Prayer petition, which is like repetitive asking. Prayer is just communion with God, not even about the thing. Prayer is just I have a relationship with God. Petition is saying okay, lord, here's the thing I'm petitioning you for. And then with thanksgiving, he says, with those three things prayer, petition, thanks then submit your request to God and the peace of God. That surpasses all understanding. How in the world can you be at peace right now when it feels like your whole family's falling apart and Uncle Bob left Aunt Susie and our world is falling apart and our family's just crazy? Right now I have peace how? Because I've sought the Lord with prayer, petition and thanksgiving and the peace of God that surpasses understanding will guard and rule your heart and your mind in Christ Jesus. So I just want you to be encouraged. Anxiety and depression has become like a tagline for a lot of people in your generation. You don't have to live that way. I don't say bury your head in the sand and act like things aren't problematic. They just don't have to rule your life because our.
Speaker 2:God is greater, our God is stronger. Our God is higher than any other. Come on, that's a song. We should write a song right now.
Speaker 1:Do you know the name of the song?
Speaker 2:Our God is greater. Our God, our God, I think it's called.
Speaker 1:Jesus Saves. Jesus Saves Sweatshirt, oh man.
Speaker 2:Is this helpful for anybody Like am I speaking to stuff that you're dealing with?
Speaker 1:Okay, good, I want to ask one more question, and then we're going to go to an open mic, if Pastor Jordan is that okay? Yeah, all right, so the microphone's here, Microphone's here, Capture it for the podcast. So then, so y'all get ready for your question. But in relation in relation to anxiety and all these things that we're talking about, stress it, stress. It's like I hear this a lot.
Speaker 2:You have to decide.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry to cut you off.
Speaker 2:You guys have to decide what rules your life the cares of this world or the word of God? Anxiety, depression, worry all that stuff tends to be related to cares of this world. But I've just decided this is more important, this is more valuable, this is stronger. And look, I've been through some really hard things in my life.
Speaker 2:My wife and I, two years into marriage, had a total lost fire. We lost everything. In an apartment fire. Some dude was cooking drugs, three stories above us blew up. His lab burned our whole house down and I remember standing there trying to fix it, but I didn't have a hose. I didn't have anything. I didn't have a cell phone. I was standing in my shorts and a t-shirt, with no socks on and an afro. I'd grown my hair out. It looked awesome and I had nothing to do. I couldn't do anything and I went and stood alone in a parking lot of a building that had also burned down like five years earlier, I should have never moved to this apartment complex. And I got alone with God and I just chose that night.
Speaker 2:Here's what I prayed to the Lord. I mean I was losing everything. I owned all my dating pictures, my music from my college and high school. Everything I owned was in that apartment and I raised my hands to the Lord. I said God, I'm your son, so that's your problem. I'll never forget telling the Lord that it's like he wasn't paying attention, like, hey, bro, are you awake? I'm your son, that's your problem. I choose to worship you. Like that's just a choice you got to decide. Does the cares of this world rule your life or the word of god? You're starting to ask a question cares of?
Speaker 1:the world do they rule your life? A lot of people, especially at this age, struggle with finding their calling or purpose because some of those things are overshadowing they can't even start the journey. So how would a young adult be able to discern their calling and purpose? Just with the Lord and their journey.
Speaker 2:Sure, well, the calling of God for every Christian is to follow Jesus. Let me just start there. And I'm in ministry. I mean, I have two graduate degrees, I have a doctorate in ministry and I just live in pastor world and I hear a lot of ministry. People use the word calling synonymous with what they're going to do with their lives and unfortunately we've bifurcated the idea of called to ministry versus I'm a teacher, I'm a lawyer, I'm a stay-at-home parent, I'm a Marine, I'm a soldier. Your calling is not what you do, it's who you are in Christ. So your calling is to relationship with Jesus, and that's going back to what I was saying earlier. Jesus invited everyone to do the same thing. What was that? Follow me, come with me, and along that journey your assignment and purpose may change and morph. How many jobs have you you had?
Speaker 2:I've had a bunch of jobs, I've delivered pizzas, I've gone to graduate school twice, I mean, I've been a college pastor, I've been a college professor, I've taught voice, I've been an opera singer, all of those things while following jesus. So I think we get really wrapped up in like I gotta have all the answers of what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life, and we're trained with that like in middle school. What do you want to do when you grow up, bobby? What do you going to do for the rest of my life? And we're trained with that like in middle school. What do you want to do when you grow up, bobby? What do you want to do when you grow up, sally?
Speaker 1:It's career day, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like I would dare a kid to go whatever God asked me to do. What if we just lived with that answer? I'll do whatever God asked me to do and I'm going to tell you right now. I pastor LifePoint Church. This is my 15th Christmas at LifePoint and this summer will be 15 years that we've been there.
Speaker 2:Praise the Lord, god gets all the credit. But I want to tell you I would do anything God if he wanted me to be a night DJ at a Christian radio station in Tulsa, oklahoma. You're listening to Foxfire 1240 AM radio. This is Mike at midnight coming in. We got a new ditty from the newsboys I would do whatever God told me to do. I'm telling you the truth.
Speaker 2:I just have committed that, and so we're trained with this like figure out your purpose, figure out what you're going to do for the rest of your life. How about I'm going to do whatever God tells me to do and I'm going to trust the Lord that for some of us it may be seasonal and for some of us it may be one season for my whole life, and some of us grew up with parents, or maybe your generation has grandparents who did one thing for 45 years, and God may let you do that, or God may let you do 20 things over 40 years. But ultimately our calling is to follow Christ with our whole heart, mind, soul and strength. Worldview is about our mind. Strength is about our actions. Heart is about our passions and our convictions. And so I'm going to follow Jesus with everything. But your calling is to Him. Your calling is to friendship and relationship and intimacy with Christ. Your calling is to my. Worldview is shaped by the Bible. That's your calling. Your purpose is to make Christ known.
Speaker 2:The YWAM missions organization has a purpose statement. They said the purpose, the aim of human, of the Christian life is to know God and make him known. Hey, I don't care if you're a lawyer, a doctor, a dentist, a teacher, a stay-at-home mom, I don't care what you do. Do you have it in your heart to help other people know Jesus? Everybody know who.
Speaker 2:Kevin Kennedy is the lawyer in town.
Speaker 2:Kev's got you covered. Come on, he's the hottest TikTok star in Tennessee. Kevin loves Jesus and I can tell you with absolute conviction Kevin loves Jesus. He's got a big, flashy personality. He's got diamonds on every finger. He's got a law firm. Kevin loves Jesus. In fact, on both building programs that we've built, lifepoint Church, kevin's been one of the first donors to those churches. He doesn't even attend our church. Kevin loves Jesus and he will pray with clients before they go into court. He'll pray with the judge. He'll pray right in front of everybody and then he'll go come on somebody, say you love Jesus.
Speaker 2:It doesn't matter what you do, the chief aim of man this is, I think one of the old church fathers maybe said the chief aim of man is to know Christ and to make him known to others. That's our purpose and you can do anything if you go Lord. I want to be the most God-honoring attorney this city has ever seen. I want to be the most God-honoring stay-at-home parent. I want to be the most God-honoring soldier ever. Man. I love working with soldiers because you guys are.
Speaker 2:You live life on mission. Like you have mission as a way of life, and I just say, part of your mission as a Christ follower is to make Christ known in the fob or at the, on the deployment or in training. So there's fluidity. If you, if you can approach your life with an open hand and say, god, I'll do whatever you want me to do, then you don't have to have ownership over the steps in the process. You go, god, just you want me to do, then you don't have to have ownership over the steps in the process. You go, god, just lead me and direct me.
Speaker 2:Y'all hear what I'm saying, everybody. I don't know if that sounds real hippie, like just free spirit. Vibe, I'm actually a real control freak. I really am. I want things to make sense. Have a plan A plus B equals C. I don't believe in all this kind of crazy kind of how you feel nonsense. I'm like it's got to make sense. But when it comes to your life, you go. But my life is in your hands, lord, and that's my purpose is to please the Lord.
Speaker 2:That's awesome.
Speaker 1:Is that good for y'all? Yeah, that's good. All right, so we're going to open it up. Does anyone have a question? Yeah, if you do have a question, you can send to the mic. I need you to just say your name. You don't have to give your middle name and all that.
Speaker 2:Actually tell us your name, age and dating status and if you're looking no, I'm just kidding, don't do that. And your handle.
Speaker 1:No handle. Your handle. All right, my name is Cameron what's?
Speaker 2:up Cameron, everybody. What's up Cameron?
Speaker 5:And I kind of have a two-part question. The first one is just what would be your advice to somebody that wants to uh get a foot into the door into ministry? Yeah, whether that be schooling experience, uh like, do you have to go to Bible college or a vocational school? Um? And then the second question is how do you know if you should be a leader? Um, cause I think it's in James three. Uh, in James 3, it says not many of you should become teachers, for you know that we will be judged by a higher standard. So is that just like how to fight with that? Like, how do you recover from sin, or if you should be slipping into sin at all. On that, just want to get your thoughts on that.
Speaker 2:Okay, so that question is shaped by something. Deeper that you're asking trying to figure out qualifications, Right yeah. Deeper that you're asking trying to figure out qualifications, Right yeah.
Speaker 2:First part of your question is if I'm feeling stirred in the ministry. I would say do ministry where you are now. Bloom where you're planted. It was one of the best pieces of advice I was ever given. Bloom where you're planted and wherever you are in this season of your life is where God's planted you. So don't wait for the next season to say God, when this season comes, then I'll be effective. So bloom where you're planted. And every Christian is commissioned by Jesus to make disciples. Every Christian. Nobody's exempt from that, by the way. All of you are commissioned by Christ to make disciples.
Speaker 2:So when I got asked to go on staff at my first church in Knoxville, I was actually taken by total surprise because I'm going into my senior year as a music major, an opera singer, and I was planning to put I had five operas, my senior year and a senior recital and I was putting together my packet for graduate schools in New England, new York, cincinnati, conservatory schools, like that and my pastor, the month before school starts, called me where the church Stephanie and I were attending together and he said hey, I want to know if you'd come on staff and join me as our choir director. He said I'll pay you $150 a week. I go. I've been paying you to come to church. What's up with that? You're going to pay me? That's great. Okay, y'all aren't real saved if you don't get that joke. That's hilarious. And then he said six months later he said I think you should pray about being our youth pastor after graduating college. Now I had finished three operas and I'd done my senior recital and I'm looking at going to grad schools. And he said why don't you pray about being our youth pastor? I said youth pastor, I don't even know what I'm doing there. What are you talking about? Well, he and my Chi Alpha pastor had been watching me and I kept my calendars for years. I have them somewhere in my house, but I had calendars. In college I learned how to keep a paper calendar for all my classes and schedules and all my work, and I kept everything on a paper calendar, a week at a glance at a time, and every single week. I would have between five and 10 young men on campus that I would meet with and I just said hey, let's meet up for coffee. That was my invite, let's grab lunch. And they all knew like Mike was going to ask them how's your prayer life? What are you reading in the word?
Speaker 2:I didn't even know that I was discipling people. I had no idea that's what I was doing. I just did it. I just nobody gave me permission to do it, nobody asked me to do it. I just loved people, I love Jesus and I was trying to bring that intersection. So I'll never forget this guy, tommy Casey, good Lord in heaven, trying to bring that intersection. So I'll never forget this guy, tommy Casey, good Lord in heaven. Tommy Casey, what a wild one.
Speaker 2:I discipled that guy from start to finish. Like I introduced him to Jesus and then I just would sit with him. He would spend the night. I was an RA in a dorm one semester. He'd spend the night. I couldn't get rid of the guy. He's like tell me more. I was like, well, I don't know a lot, man, I've just been serving God a couple of years. He's like, well, you know more than me. I was like, well, that's fair, and I would just teach him what I was reading. I'd go hey, this morning I read this what do you think? And he's like I've never heard that before. I was like yeah, me neither. It's all brand new. Like no Christian will be excused in judgment, missouri, with a lot of Bible college kids, and I actually did.
Speaker 2:I was a professor in residence at a Bible college in Minneapolis two years ago and I had an open forum like Q&A deal with a group of Bible college students and this kid was, like I feel, called the pastor. I want to pastor a church, a church planning church, and I want to be a traveling evangelist and I want to preach to the world like Reinhard Bonnke. That's what he told me. If y'all don't know who Reinhard Bonnke is, google him Worldwide evangelist. And I asked him this question I go who are you preaching to now? And he goes well, I'm in Bible college. I'm not really ready for that. I go oh okay, do you serve at your local church? Are you on a dream team? He goes no man, I'm in Bible college. I said why would God trust you with the world if he can't trust you in your own church? That guy quit talking to me, honest to God. He quit talking to me. He got really mad at me and I was like I don't even. I'm not trying to offend you, I'm just trying to probe some questions with you. So if you feel called to ministry, then start doing ministry. You don't need a job at a church, you need to get on a dream team. Are you on a dream team? Okay, good, yeah, you were about to get called right out, weren't you? He's got the lanyard. I would encourage you to find three men that you can just meet with. Say, hey, let's grab coffee. Some of y'all are like he's going to ask me, Let him do it and just begin.
Speaker 2:I had a youth pastor. His name's Brian Rosignol not related to the company that has the skis, but Brian felt called to preach. He was a little odd and people didn't know how to take him. Brian would write a sermon a week. No lie, this is a true story. Brian would write a sermon a week and preach them to his and his siblings' stuffed animals Truth. That kid went to Bible college and seminary. He's pastoring a church out west. He just flexed his gifts that God had put in him. So do something with him. Don't wait to be invited, just start doing something with it, right?
Speaker 2:And then the second question you asked was from James. James is specifically giving a prohibition to leaders in the church, not just anybody who teaches the gospel, like shares the gospel. He's talking about leaders in the church pastors, shepherds, are held to a higher standard. But all of us have issues and make mistakes and all of us have sin issues. Like we got shadows, we got the dark side of our leadership, we got egos, and the way to grow your anointing is to walk in humility and walk in death to those things in your life every day. Right? So I have things in my life that I've confessed to brothers in Christ or I'm accountable to people. Like I don't have anything going on in my life that would disqualify me from being y'all's pastor. That's what James is talking about.
Speaker 2:But every Christian is called to share the gospel, even though you have issues. But you should not keep living in your issues and go well, you know, god knows my heart. That's one of the worst things Christians say. God knows my heart, yeah, it's wicked. That's what he says. The heart's wicked. That's why you need the Holy Spirit to change your heart from the inside out.
Speaker 2:So if you got some sin in your life, confess it to your small group. Don't confess it to the guys you're discipling. Confess it to your brothers in Christ or maybe to a pastor over you. So you guys, you heard me talk about it a couple weeks ago in the sermon. Everybody needs a Paul, a Barnabas, a Timothy, a spiritual father, spiritual brother, spiritual sons or mothers, sisters, daughters. You need to confess to your fathers and brothers, not to your sons. Ladies, you need to confess to your spiritual mamas, your spiritual sisters. Get that stuff out and be accountable in this group and be able to pour out with a pure heart to ones that you're mentoring. Great question, cam. Thanks for serving in ministry. Yeah, come on up, tell us your name. Hey Pastor, my name's Rave Rave.
Speaker 2:Rave, rave. Yeah, that's a cool name. I thought you said Rave and I was going to go really bonkers over that name.
Speaker 7:That would have been a lot cooler bud.
Speaker 2:Everybody. His new name is Rave. Everybody say hi Rave, Hi Rave, you're welcome.
Speaker 6:Appreciate it. And one of your opening statements you said something about opinion versus what the Bible says. People ask you your opinion and you say I follow the Bible. You can kind of clarify what you actually said?
Speaker 2:Yeah, people will ask my opinion as a leader, as a pastor. They'll go. Pastor Mike, what do you think about blank political issue or social issue or whatever I go? Well, it doesn't really matter what I think because, I've submitted my thoughts and opinions to the teachings of Scripture and the truth of Jesus. I still have those opinions, but they're second and not nearly as influential as what Jesus has to say about them.
Speaker 6:Yeah, of course I was kind of asking my question from the approach of questions or opinions on certain topics in the Bible, and the first thing that came to mind when you said that was the topic of baptism tends to be pretty controversial. Even churches of the same denomination will have differing opinions on importance, and I was wondering how you tackle that.
Speaker 6:And I was also wondering, on that specific, how you tackle topics like that as a pastor and a follower of Christ, and also specifically to baptism, where you stand on that and if you maybe even have any battles with that specific topic personally, because I do. Okay.
Speaker 2:You want to debate it out right now? I'm just kidding you kind of do. I can see it in your face. He's like well, since you asked me, okay, let me just say as a general practice, I will have a discussion with any Christian about any topic. I'm not trying to win a debate with saved people, so I've just settled on certain issues where I land on things that don't cost Christians their salvation.
Speaker 2:Baptism is one of those, in my opinion. I would be glad to discuss different views, and I know what they are. I mean, some churches view that you're not saved until you're water baptized, and it's a literalist reading of Acts, chapter 2, where Peter says repent of your sins, repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of your sins and you'll be saved. Well, if you literally read that text that way, then you have to literally read the entire chapter of that way, and that becomes very problematic really quickly. But others say you don't have to be baptized at all. Then there's the debate on the language you use when baptizing. Do we baptize in the name of the Father, son and Holy Spirit? Do we baptize in Jesus' name only? Then the debate is do you submerge, do you sprinkle? Can you do infant baptism, or a person has to come to faith in baptism, and the only people debating these things are Christians saved people debating with saved people, which is why I said I will discuss it, but I'm not debating with Christians. I think there's a lot of division there. In fact, the entirety of church history is riddled with divisions on interpretation of Christian doctrines. We're not debating with lost people about Christ and Him crucified. We're debating with saved people about who's more saved and who's more right on our salvation. So I just decided I'm not debating Christians and trying to win arguments. I'll discuss those differences and if they're not salvific, then we can agree to disagree. I call them secondary issues. There's a bunch of those in my opinion. So, to answer your first question, I'm just not interested in debating Christians. I'll discuss, but I'm not going to debate and I'm certainly not going to divide over those things. And that's actually why we have so many denominations.
Speaker 2:Christianity is one of the most denominated religion on the planet and it's because Christians decided they're going to nuance things and fight with one another. And if you don't agree with me, I'll go start my own church and I think that grieves the Holy Spirit. Actually, the one thing Jesus prayed for Christians for all time is that we'd be unified. John 17,. Jesus prayed specifically for Christians that would become Christians. For people who would become Christians, he said I pray that they would be one, just as you and I. Father and Son are one.
Speaker 2:But Christians are not known for unity and it's because of divisions over secondary issues. The primary issues are the Bible is true, jesus is Lord, the only way to heaven. You must be born again and you can live a spirit-led, spirit-filled life. Those are four things we're not going to move on. Those are classic Christian doctrines.
Speaker 2:Secondary issues would be debates on baptism, debates on election versus free will, like predestination, calvinism, arminianism. That is the ultimate fight among Christians. It's like Army and Navy guys arguing over who's got a better military. You're all basically paid on the same pay scale and fighting the same wars. Like, at the end of the day, you're soldiers and I think, christians. Fighting over some of these things is more divisive than helpful. So did the first part of your question. How do I handle those debates? I just choose my battles very carefully and I, when I was younger, I used to love arguing my personality trait I'm a D on the disc, I'm an eight on the Enneagram, whatever, and I'm known, myers-briggs is the debater. So I love good, healthy debate but I've just decided I'm not debating with brothers to win an argument.
Speaker 2:My position on baptism, since you brought that up, is baptism is a full submersion response to your salvation. You're fully submerged in water and the formulaic language that we use at LifePoint is I baptize you in the name of, because of your profession of faith, I baptize you in the name of the Father, son and Holy Spirit and we do a full submersion baptism as long as you can physically do that. We don't baptize infants in our church because of that Acts 2 text where Peter said believe and be baptized. You can't be a believer Like I've got four kids and none of them got were born saved. So you have to become a Christ follower, become a believer to be baptized. So that's where we've landed as a church and we've had actually you asked does that come up recently?
Speaker 2:Last month somebody was debating me in the lobby about mode of baptism and language and I just said we're just not. We've landed on a decision as a church. This is where we're at and this is what we do, and she wasn't happy with that. She's still in our church and she won't let me baptize her, even though she's been baptized. So she wanted me to baptize her again when we did river baptisms, and so we kind of had this back and forth and I just said well, here's where we're at, and I'd love to baptize you if you want me to so.
Speaker 2:Is that helpful? Yes, yeah, good Thanks, rave. That's the coolest one, rave.
Speaker 1:We got three more. All right, cool, go ahead.
Speaker 2:I would encourage you as Christians don't fight Christians.
Speaker 4:Okay, hi. My name is Symphony. Hello, symphony, hi. Okay, hi, my name is Symphony. Hello, symphony, hi, okay. I have two questions. My first question is how do you stay encouraged once you've reconnected with God and not slip into anything worldly? How? Do you stay encouraged when you, once you've reconnected with God and not slip into anything worldly.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 4:And then my second question is how do you step into your spiritual gifts?
Speaker 2:Okay, okay. And then my second question is how do you step into your spiritual gifts? Okay, so that's actually like four questions, not two. How do you stay encouraged when you're reconnected with God and not slip into worldliness? Okay, so again this comes back to worldview, the thing I was talking about at the very beginning. You know that old hymn I have decided to follow Jesus. I have decided. You just got to decide.
Speaker 2:That is the most encouraging thing you can do is decide and then orient your life around your decision. Like man, I'm going to go to church. You know what I've? Hey, can I just be real honest. This is going to sound really sanctified. I've never skipped church as a Christian. I've been sick, I've been out of town or like inconveniently unable to go to church, and I you know I was going to church before YouTube and the internet but I've never been like I've just been out of church for four weeks. Never happened to me one time since I became a Christian and I've never had anybody making me go to church. I just decided I'm going to be a church person. I tithe 10% of every dollar I've ever made as a Christian has gone to God, period. I don't even pray about it. I just do it, I've just decided those things and that's encouraging.
Speaker 2:Part of growing up is discipline and just putting some parameters around your life, coming back to guardrails and boundaries, right. So that's encouraging. But then the accountability piece and I think accountable to sisters in Christ, mothers in the faith, and accountable to the word of God and to the Holy Spirit, so just putting yourself into places of accountability and submission. My life right now. I've got four men in my life that have full access to any part of my life. They can have at any time. They can read my text messages Any of you could read my text messages right now. I mean I have nothing to hide on my phone. But I have four guys in particular that have full access to my whole life, my private life, my secret. They can track my Internet history on my phone or my laptop. They can call my internet history on my phone or my laptop. They can call my kids without my permission and ask how I'm doing at home, because I've submitted myself to people for that and so I think part of it is you just like. That encourages me. That means there's guys who pray for me and love me and care for me in that way. Keep me in the paint as a leader. Coming back to your question about James, keep me out of disqualifying myself. That's really encouraging and and it's really hard to slip into worldliness when people have your back. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Hey, symphony, I couldn't help but notice the last couple of times we've talked. Man, your mouth has gotten real just foul. What's up with that? And you have the choice. Don't judge me. How dare you cancel, cancel or thank you for loving me, Thank you for being my sister, thank you for caring for me, one of the things we've been talking about recently.
Speaker 2:It's always interesting, I think, how people react to correction. By the way, part of remember what I said in 2 Timothy 3.16, all scripture is profitable for teaching, rebuking, reproofing, correcting and training. Sometimes your walk with Christ is going to require some correction. Hello, man, we just hate being told no, we hate correction. We're just like come at me, I'll cancel you, bro. But it's a gift of the Spirit that there are people in your life that will correct you.
Speaker 2:And how people react to correction often reveals more of their character than the thing they did that required the correction. So let's say, symphony and you and my daughter are close right. So let's say you get a little clappy with your mouth and you start cussing a little bit and Lucy reaches out Symphony. I've just been nervous about just stuff I've been hearing you say it's real negative, it's real foul, and you lash out at her. That says more about you than the actual language that she called you to talk about. But if you respond with thank you for loving me, thank you for getting my six, thank you for protecting me, would you pray with me? Would you hold me accountable? That reveals so much of your character.
Speaker 2:Your response to correction will often reveal more of your character. I long for correction. I want to be correctable. I have one of my mentors. He's one of our overseers, rod Loy man. That dude has given me the hammer numerous times on decisions or leadership stuff and without fail, every time he's given me correction, my response is yes, sir, because I want to be a man under submission and under authority, right. So I think it's encouraging. It helps keep you guarded to have accountability of the scripture, of the Holy Spirit and of the body of Christ. And then, what was your second question?
Speaker 4:The second one was how do you step into your spiritual gifts?
Speaker 2:Well, you go back to my sermon from two weeks ago.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yes, and you listen to that sermon where I talked about. Everybody is gifted and there's lists of gifts listed in Romans 12, 1 Corinthians 12, and Ephesians 4 have gifts of nine, nine and five. I believe it is Gifts listed, but I don't believe that's exhaustive. I think there are gifts in you that may not have made the Bible but they're still what God has made you good at Like. You're an encourager, right? That's a gift that you have.
Speaker 2:Some people have a gift of generosity, of leadership, a gift of faith, gift of tongues, miracles, whatever. Those are listed spiritual gifts. But all of you have gifts and the place you discover those is in the body of Christ, because that's what the gifts are for to build the body of Christ, to build a church. I think it's interesting that a lot of us go to school and pay a lot of money to discover passions, but we never spend any time discovering God-given gifts. So I have a degree in music. That's a passion, but my gift is pastoring and I learned that in the church. So, anyway, I would encourage you to go through GrowthTrack. That's a real practical step, but you've already gone through that. I mean all right.
Speaker 7:Hello, my name's Nathaniel, a very common question I get from non-believers is if your God is so just and so right and so mighty, then why does evil still exist in the world? Why does he allow these horrible things to happen? And I would like to know a better way to approach that.
Speaker 2:Sure. How do you approach it so?
Speaker 7:far. I can't give you a better way if I don't know your way Exactly, exactly. Usually, when they ask that I'm like, well, god gave us this thing called free will, right, so that doesn't mean he has 100% control of us at all times. He didn't set us up to be that way. So I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want to worship or follow someone that controlled every single thing I did. That's usually how I approach it.
Speaker 7:And then I bring up the fact that he did help us by sending his only son to give his life for us and redeem us in that way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, your head's definitely in the right direction. In fact, I think your answer is great. So the theological term for this is a theodicy. How does a good God allow for pain and suffering? Right, it seems like a misnomer and a dichotomy, and it seems like God is now on the hook for pain and suffering. Okay, as a framework for how we view this question, the scriptures have to inform us right.
Speaker 2:Genesis, chapter one God created everything and it was good, it was very good. Six stages of creation, six days of creation, however you want to describe. See that God created everything and it was very good. And then the Lord gives parameters of how to do life in his creation and he tells Adam and Eve to be fruitful and multiply. This was a command of God before sin entered the world. Right? So, being fruitful, multiplication, it's also how God created us. We weren't created to create, we were created to procreate. So we have the ability of procreation, not creation. But we're made in the image and the likeness of God, and the first family were made without sin, but with the potential to sin.
Speaker 2:And that's free will, and with free will, god. Here's how we know that humanity had free will. God gave them a boundary and they pressed it. God said you can eat everything in this garden. You can have all that you want of this one tree in the midst of the garden. Do not eat, for when you eat it you will surely die. That's the phrase that actually is the source code of the whole problem of evil. You will surely die. What is death? Separation from God and distance from his kingdom. Over and over again you see Jesus in the gospels referring to being cast out of the kingdom. In that place there's weeping and gnashing of teeth. That's life today, without God Life of weeping and gnashing of teeth, outer darkness, a life of pain and calamity and misery. So the consequence of having it our way is in that when we eat of that fruit we will surely die.
Speaker 2:So the devil the Bible says the serpent is more crafty than any animal and the devil comes in this way to tempt Eve. Not Adam who's the leader, but Eve. And if you notice in the question in Genesis, chapter three, when Eve is tempted by the devil, the devil says to her did God really say that question is the question of sin, every time you're tempted? Did God really say you can't have sex before marriage? I mean, is that really in the Bible? Did God really say you can't hate people because they have brown skin? Did God really say that? One thing I just want you to always remember the devil will always lower the voice of God and elevate the voice of you. Okay, that's what he always does. Did God really say you can have it this way?
Speaker 2:So he says to the woman, he says to Eve did God really say you can't eat from any tree in the garden? And he's testing her right, because that's not what God said? And she said no, he didn't say that. He said if we eat and the devil says to her, you will not die, god didn't mean that. So he'll test you first with. Did God say it? Then he'll test you with. Did God mean it? He said God, you're not going to die If you eat this. Here's what he said. If you eat of this fruit, you'll be just like God.
Speaker 2:The temptation of the garden of Eden is to lower the voice of God, to question if God meant it and if you do it your way, you'll be like God. Well, she gave in to that. I mean, she didn't really give away all of her security for fruit, my Lord. She gave away for the right to be like God. And when that happened, god pronounced judgment and he said you'll sweat to work, you'll have pain and childbearing, and the theologians described this as the fall of mankind. Now, who caused that? To your question, who caused that? Humanity caused that right. But it's so easy to blame God. Here's what God did. I'm giving you all freedom, but one boundary. Here's what God did. He was so good, he goes. I'm going to give you one boundary. And then we decided to violate that one boundary and as we live in the consequences of that violation, we want to blame God for being unjust and unfair and ungodly. He was God and right and fair from the beginning. So then, the entirety of the Old Testament is and right.
Speaker 2:Then, by the way, when mankind fell, god says to the serpent through the seed of this woman, I'm going to crush your head. And that's the first time the gospel is mentioned in the Bible, genesis 3.15. He says through the seed of this woman, I will defeat you and crush your head. But all of Genesis, through Malachi, is the story of a people trying to please God through law and behavior modification, awaiting the seed of this woman who would become Christ. Paul says in Galatians the seed of that woman is Jesus. And so the seed of that woman that would crush the head of Satan and the power of sin is Jesus. Here's what I this is the conversation I was having the other day with that person was telling me your whole worldview is the Bible. I go exactly. All the political pain is solved if everyone would give their lives to Jesus. The wars around the world would stop if everyone would give their lives to Jesus. Because through the seed of that woman, war stopped, beating stopped when people sincerely give their lives to Christ and surrender to Christ.
Speaker 2:The Bible says that the Holy Spirit of God himself comes to dwell on the inside of believers. That changes the heart of wicked and evil people and the solution of wars and abuse and pedophilia and all the things that you're referring to when unbelievers say how just is your God? He's so just that he made a way of escape for that through Christ. And what people want to demand is that God change. And God says I'll never change, but I'll change you. When I live on the inside of you by faith in Christ, my spirit will dwell on you and the scripture says that'll take a stony heart and turn it into a heart of flesh. He'll take the tablets on the walls that have the laws and he'll write them, rather on our hearts. So what changes an abuser, jesus? What changes an addict Jesus?
Speaker 2:We have a hope center with our church with 32 men right now craving sobriety and if you ask them what changes their lives? I've got one guy I was talking to last week. He said I've been through dozens of programs and he said I've never been sober this long in my life. I met a guy his name's Fon. He's 25 years old. He said I've just gotten seven months sober, pastor Mike. And I said how long has it been since you've been sober? Seven months, he said since I was 11. And I said what's the difference? He said I met Jesus and Jesus changed my life. How good is our God? God actually made the way. God made the transition. God is so good that he said I'll change you if you let me in you.
Speaker 2:But we want to blame God. And how good is your God that he allows all this bad? No, we have allowed all this bad. We have, as a human race, we invited this in through disobedience and, honestly, all of the pain of this world I feel like I'm yelling at you. I'm giving all these answers to the world, to you All. The pain of this world is ultimately back to the same problem humans wanting to do it their way and God sits there going.
Speaker 2:I've made a way of escape. That's actually what the Bible calls the gospel. It's a way of escape for this world War, poverty, abuse, racism, sexism all those ills are changed when someone believes on Christ. It's impossible to please God without faith in Jesus. Listen to me when I say this no one will ever please God enough if they don't believe in Jesus. Hebrews 11, 6.
Speaker 2:But when you say yes to Jesus, the Spirit of the living God, the same Spirit who created the Bible says in Genesis 1, in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, and the earth was void and without form, and the Spirit hovered over it all. The same Spirit that created it all will recreate you. 2 Corinthians 5 says you become a new creation. So how good is our God that he goes? No, this is the only way. This is the only way to change. And we want to keep blaming God instead of us. So I would say you're on the right track. It's the theodicy, it's the free will of mankind, our choice to embrace sin and deliver the consequences of that sin. And the solution is not fix God to fix the earth. The solution is church, preach the gospel and win people to Christ. You know how to change abusers, lead them to Jesus. Is that helpful? Praise God, all right. Good, I get to preaching now. Man, I love that question. All right, we got one more question, bruno.
Speaker 3:How's it going Great? So my question to you is this actually happened earlier today. Me among my brothers in Christ were discussing some issue. It was pretty trivial, hardly worth bringing up. I quoted something from the Old Testament and their reply to me was Christ fulfilled that. Christ had fulfilled that, so we don't have to follow that. So I guess my question is what part of the Old Testament do we follow today and which ones do we not?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a great question actually, bruno, thank you for that. You're welcome. The old People don't say you're welcome enough. You know what I'm saying. Know what I'm saying?
Speaker 2:So, all right, your Bible is divided into two grand divisions the Old Testament and the New Testament. So Genesis to Malachi is the Old Testament. Testament is not synonymous with covenant, okay. So the Old Testament is the story of a people trying to live for God under an old covenant. Covenant is law, is expectation. So your question is do we have to keep the Old Testament? What you're asking is do we need to follow the Old Covenant? Do you understand the difference? So this is the story of people under the old covenant. Your question is do we need to follow the old covenant and which portions do we keep and which portions do we not?
Speaker 2:The old covenant is made up of 613 roughly laws. Some are covenant with God laws, some are covenant with people laws and some are just social and communal laws like dietary restrictions, clothing restrictions, etc. Jesus actually eliminated the dietary restrictions In Mark's gospel chapter. In the middle, somewhere he said give thanks for anything you eat and bless it and enjoy it. And the commentator says by saying this, jesus made all foods now clean. So this dietary restrictions of the Old Testament, of the Old Covenant we don't have to follow anymore. Now you can. If you don't want to eat pork or shellfish, give me back your bacon wrapped shrimp, but you can and you can eat what you want. Just give thanks to the Lord for it. Dietary restrictions clothing like you couldn't mix fabrics in the old covenant, you couldn't mix cotton and wool, you had to have pure clothing. So all of the ceremonial restrictions were lifted. The dietary restrictions of the old covenant, those 613 laws were lifted. Restrictions of the old covenant, those 613 laws were lifted. Now the covenant with God laws are still expected and they're most clearly seen in the Ten Commandments.
Speaker 2:God is first in your life, no other God before him. Number two number two is the idol rule. Graven images aren't right. Right, we don't worship idols. Number three God's name should never be taken in vain. And number four the Sabbath is for rest and worship. Remember the Sabbath, keep it holy.
Speaker 2:Jesus would come along in Mark 12, 30, and 31 and say the two great commandments are love God and love others. Love God with all your mind, heart, soul and strength, and love your neighbor as you love yourself. And he said. In doing this you'll keep all of these other 10 commandments. So the first four commandments of the 10 are loving God. God is first no idols, don't take God's name in vain and worship on the Sabbath. That's all love God language. And then number five is honor your father and mother, don't murder, don't steal, don't commit adultery, don't lie and don't covet. Those are like loving people laws.
Speaker 2:And so the question is do I need to keep the Ten Commandments? I mean, if you'd say yes, yeah, of course you would say yes. So the covenant laws with God and with people still matter. The dietary and the clothing laws those are lifted for us. However, the real question is about the penalty of violating the law. So in the new covenant the difference is not should we still love God and love people and tithe and do some of the things in the house of worship? Of course you should still do those things. The difference in the new covenant is you don't have to pay for the sin when you violate it, because Jesus has paid for the sin when you violate it.
Speaker 2:The book of Hebrews, chapter 10, I believe it is says whenever we sin, there's no next year sacrifice remaining for us to go back to. So we like in the Hebrew tradition. You had an annual day of atonement where you sacrificed an animal annually from all the last year's sins and sometimes, if you were real holy, you do one monthly because you were just living wild. You know what I'm saying. But what the writer of Hebrews is saying is if you've accepted Christ, there's no next year. Sacrifice the sacrifice. The final sacrifice is Jesus. And so now in the new covenant we're still expected to love God, love people, tithe, be kind like, do ceremonial things in the body of Christ, go to church, pray, worship all those things.
Speaker 2:The difference is in the new covenant, when you violate one of those commandments, you go to the Lord for forgiveness, for repentance and restoration. You don't go sacrifice a bull or do some penalty of penance. This is where the Catholic church, honestly, it's kind of confused a lot of people, because every time you screw up you got to go pay it off. But Jesus has paid it all. Come on somebody. There's another song. We should write that one too. Does that make sense? Is that helpful?
Speaker 3:The only part I'm confused about is what exactly is the line between Old Testament law and the Old Covenant?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so again the Old Testament. Yeah, so again the Old Testament. Genesis, through Malachi, is the testament, the story of a people trying to please God in an old covenant system. So there's not a line there because that's not a fair delineation that needs to be made. The question is where's the line between old covenant and new covenant? The new covenant is completely about Jesus, his sacrifice on the cross, his death, burial and resurrection, paying for our sins, forgiving our sins and offering us eternal life. In the old covenant we had a sacrifice system. We had 600 plus laws that were impossible to maintain and to keep. The writer of Hebrews says the law in the old covenant was imperfect and inadequate to change the heart of a person. The new covenant, however, can change your heart from the inside out, and that's where the Lord writes his laws on our hearts. But the old Testament is the story of people under the old covenant. The new Testament is the gospels and the story of a people in a new covenant. So they're not synonymous, but they are very closely linked together.
Speaker 2:Honestly, I miss being a young adults in college pastor. I miss dreaming with people in your age group. I miss wrestling through the hard stuff that you're going through in this stage of your life and I miss looking young men or women in the face and going you're a world changer, you're different, like. God can use you, right where you are, to change the world. And I'm just telling you, man, jesus actually recruited young people around your age. Many scholars believe that some of the disciples were in their late teens and early 20s. I'm just telling you, you're world changers. You don't need to wait to be given permission to go hard for Jesus. Let me encourage you to let your worldview be shaped around Christ. Desire personal holiness, like get old, fast and be boring you know what I'm saying Like just desire to come away with Christ. Let me challenge all of you this semester Fast a day or two, have a personal retreat with God. Get alone in your dorm room with your Bible no music, no videos, no social media. Fast from the culture for a season and get alone with Jesus. He will impress you with how much he wants to meet with you and let your world be shaped first by him and your desire to please him. I'm telling you, guys, you're world changers. You excite me like crazy. I've loved, loved, loved. I honor Pastor Jordan and Aaron and their vision for this group and I've loved watching it grow and evolve and move. I mean, my Lord, you're world changers. That campus needs you to come alive. The Army Post needs you to come alive for Jesus. Just be bold and don't wait for permission to go hard with Christ and for Christ. Y'all.
Speaker 2:Hear me, everybody, father, I pray right now for a deep, deep well of anointing and drive and desire for the things of God, for the presence of the Lord. I pray that God, world-changing leaders, would just come alive tonight in this room. Thank you, lord, that you'll transform hearts and minds forever because of what's been deposited in this group of young leaders tonight. I thank you, lord, that you'll transform hearts and minds forever because of what's been deposited in this group of young leaders tonight. I thank you, lord, that you're a forgiving God.
Speaker 2:Some of us have made mistakes and made decisions where we have felt like we've disqualified ourselves. I pray that we would find forgiveness, that we would find freedom from those beliefs and that, god, we would walk in victory over anything that would keep us from walking close to you. Lord, I just pray for a deep, deep desire for more of your presence, more of your word, more of your grace and goodness. I thank you, lord, that you have good plans for these young leaders, these young adults, god, you know their future, you know who they're going to marry, you know who they're going to do life, with what they're going to do and their purpose. But, god, more than knowing what they're going to do, you want to know them and I just pray for a deep desire to know you, to know your word, to know your presence.
Speaker 2:Would you fill us with your Holy Spirit tonight, baptize us with your spirit, burn in us a desire for your word In us with your spirit, Burn in us a desire for your word in Jesus' name. Would you guys just pray this with me Everybody in the room say, god, I love you, I give my life to you. Say I believe in Jesus, that he died for my sin, that he raised from the dead to give me new life. Say God, call me in the secret place, speak to me in your word, meet me in my prayer closet, make me a new person In Jesus' name. Thank you, lord, amen.
Speaker 1:Hey guys. Well, thank you guys for letting us be part of tonight here at the Gathering. Was this helpful for you guys? Yeah, hey, Pastor Jordan, Pastor Aaron, thank you so much for letting us come. Pastor Mike, thank you for the great insight. Love it. Thank you for the awesome sweater.
Speaker 2:Come on, get you one everybody.
Speaker 1:If you get one, tag me in a photo and I'll share it with the owner of the company and for those of you joining us online listening to today's podcast, we just want to give you more information on the Gathering. It's our young adult gathering here in Clarksville. You can find out more about the Gathering at LifePointChurchtv. Forward slash the Gathering. Or you can follow them on social media at LPCYA. And one more time live from the Gathering. Come on, make some noise. We love you, guys. Until next time.
