{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":0.0,"endTime":1.92,"body":"Does any of this"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":0.0,"endTime":1.92,"body":"sound familiar? Are you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1.92,"endTime":5.34,"body":"struggling with getting people"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1.92,"endTime":5.34,"body":"to convert from social media"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":5.34,"endTime":9.63,"body":"fans and followers to actual"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":5.34,"endTime":9.63,"body":"donors? Can you get your email"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":9.63,"endTime":13.59,"body":"list to donate at the rate that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":9.63,"endTime":13.59,"body":"you want? And do you find that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":13.59,"endTime":17.43,"body":"you want a step by step guide to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":13.59,"endTime":17.43,"body":"actually getting people to take"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":17.43,"endTime":22.23,"body":"the action that you need using"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":17.43,"endTime":22.23,"body":"your website, email and social"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":22.23,"endTime":25.23,"body":"media channels? Well, then"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":22.23,"endTime":25.23,"body":"you're in luck, I created the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":25.23,"endTime":29.19,"body":"digital fundraising formula to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":25.23,"endTime":29.19,"body":"walk you step by step through"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":29.19,"endTime":34.05,"body":"this process, and to leave you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":29.19,"endTime":34.05,"body":"feeling calm, refreshed, and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":34.05,"endTime":39.66,"body":"motivated to raise more money"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":34.05,"endTime":39.66,"body":"online. So just go to www dot"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":39.69,"endTime":45.21,"body":"digital fundraising formula.com."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":39.69,"endTime":45.21,"body":"That's digital fundraising."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":45.24,"endTime":49.83,"body":"formula.com. Enroll now and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":45.24,"endTime":49.83,"body":"don't miss it. Class starts"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":49.83,"endTime":50.91,"body":"September 12."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":54.09,"endTime":57.93,"body":"Hello, and welcome to nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":54.09,"endTime":57.93,"body":"Nation. I'm your host, Julia"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":57.93,"endTime":61.38,"body":"Campbell. And I'm going to sit"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":57.93,"endTime":61.38,"body":"down with nonprofit industry"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":61.38,"endTime":66.15,"body":"experts, fundraisers, marketers,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":61.38,"endTime":66.15,"body":"and everyone in between to get"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":66.15,"endTime":69.84,"body":"real and discuss what it takes"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":66.15,"endTime":69.84,"body":"to build that movement that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":69.84,"endTime":73.59,"body":"you've been dreaming of. I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":69.84,"endTime":73.59,"body":"created the nonprofit nation"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":73.59,"endTime":77.7,"body":"podcast to share practical"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":73.59,"endTime":77.7,"body":"wisdom and strategies to help"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":77.7,"endTime":82.11,"body":"you confidently Find Your Voice."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":77.7,"endTime":82.11,"body":"Definitively grow your audience"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":82.14,"endTime":86.1,"body":"and effectively build your"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":82.14,"endTime":86.1,"body":"movement. If you're a nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":86.1,"endTime":89.28,"body":"newbie, or an experienced"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":86.1,"endTime":89.28,"body":"professional, who's looking to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":89.28,"endTime":92.94,"body":"get more visibility, reach more"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":89.28,"endTime":92.94,"body":"people and create even more"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":92.94,"endTime":96.84,"body":"impact than you're in the right"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":92.94,"endTime":96.84,"body":"place. Let's get started."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":103.35,"endTime":106.8,"body":"Hi, everyone, welcome back to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":103.35,"endTime":106.8,"body":"another episode of nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":106.8,"endTime":111.54,"body":"nation. thrilled to have you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":106.8,"endTime":111.54,"body":"here today thrilled to be on"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":111.54,"endTime":115.38,"body":"your walk or while you're doing"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":111.54,"endTime":115.38,"body":"laundry or while you're driving"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":115.38,"endTime":118.71,"body":"the kids around whatever you're"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":115.38,"endTime":118.71,"body":"doing. So happy to have you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":118.71,"endTime":125.1,"body":"listening in today. My guest is"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":118.71,"endTime":125.1,"body":"Catherine Ashton. And she's on a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":125.1,"endTime":128.31,"body":"mission to change the way"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":125.1,"endTime":128.31,"body":"nonprofits raise money, which I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":128.31,"endTime":131.73,"body":"love because I'm on a mission to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":128.31,"endTime":131.73,"body":"change the way nonprofits use"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":131.73,"endTime":135.03,"body":"social media. So we're both on a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":131.73,"endTime":135.03,"body":"mission to change the status"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":135.03,"endTime":140.13,"body":"quo. And as the founder of giant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":135.03,"endTime":140.13,"body":"squid Group, LLC, Catherine"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":140.13,"endTime":144.03,"body":"works with nonprofits to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":140.13,"endTime":144.03,"body":"landowners win grants and fund"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":144.06,"endTime":147.33,"body":"their works. She's a sought"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":144.06,"endTime":147.33,"body":"after coach, speaker and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":147.33,"endTime":151.41,"body":"strategist locally and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":147.33,"endTime":151.41,"body":"nationally, and specializes in"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":151.41,"endTime":156.06,"body":"helping organizations marry best"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":151.41,"endTime":156.06,"body":"practices, and mission aligned"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":156.06,"endTime":161.73,"body":"innovation to drive systems"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":156.06,"endTime":161.73,"body":"level change. Catherine is also"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":161.82,"endTime":164.55,"body":"dedicated to promoting"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":161.82,"endTime":164.55,"body":"inclusivity and equity in the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":164.55,"endTime":169.14,"body":"nonprofit sector, and has been a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":164.55,"endTime":169.14,"body":"raging feminist from a young age"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":169.14,"endTime":173.76,"body":"I need to put that in my bio,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":169.14,"endTime":173.76,"body":"because it's incredible. And I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":173.85,"endTime":177.18,"body":"think it's so evocative and I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":173.85,"endTime":177.18,"body":"love it. In her outside of work"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":177.18,"endTime":181.08,"body":"time, she's volunteering with"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":177.18,"endTime":181.08,"body":"the Austin diaper bank or"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":181.08,"endTime":185.01,"body":"chasing her energetic daughter,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":181.08,"endTime":185.01,"body":"Rosalind down the nearest hiking"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":185.01,"endTime":189.27,"body":"trail, and also your fur babies."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":185.01,"endTime":189.27,"body":"And all the fur babies, two"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":189.27,"endTime":193.65,"body":"dogs, a horse and a cat. And I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":189.27,"endTime":193.65,"body":"bet the cat would go on the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":193.65,"endTime":197.07,"body":"trails if we let her. So really,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":193.65,"endTime":197.07,"body":"when you said it was an"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":197.07,"endTime":199.89,"body":"energetic morning, it really"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":197.07,"endTime":199.89,"body":"was."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":200.31,"endTime":202.35,"body":"I think that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":200.31,"endTime":202.35,"body":"the nonprofit sector breeds"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":202.38,"endTime":205.59,"body":"energetic people, and you throw"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":202.38,"endTime":205.59,"body":"a little, little animal rescue"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":205.59,"endTime":208.62,"body":"in there. And there's truly"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":205.59,"endTime":208.62,"body":"never a dull moment other than"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":209.19,"endTime":211.53,"body":"someone's always on the wrong"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":209.19,"endTime":211.53,"body":"side of the door, which we could"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":211.53,"endTime":214.56,"body":"probably make sort of some"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":211.53,"endTime":214.56,"body":"analogy about nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":214.56,"endTime":217.41,"body":"fundraising. But in my house,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":214.56,"endTime":217.41,"body":"there's always a dog or a cat on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":217.41,"endTime":218.46,"body":"the wrong side of a door."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":218.88,"endTime":220.89,"body":"That's so funny."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":218.88,"endTime":220.89,"body":"I'm sure I'm sure there's a blog"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":220.89,"endTime":224.88,"body":"posted there somewhere. So tell"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":220.89,"endTime":224.88,"body":"me how you got into this work."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":224.88,"endTime":227.97,"body":"Tell me about giant squid group,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":224.88,"endTime":227.97,"body":"and especially how it got the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":227.97,"endTime":229.92,"body":"name. Absolutely. Well,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":229.92,"endTime":232.14,"body":"thank you so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":229.92,"endTime":232.14,"body":"much for having me here. Excited"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":232.14,"endTime":236.97,"body":"to chat with you all today. So I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":232.14,"endTime":236.97,"body":"think like many folks fell into"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":236.97,"endTime":239.07,"body":"fundraising, you know, right out"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":236.97,"endTime":239.07,"body":"of college. That's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":239.07,"endTime":241.62,"body":"a that is a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":239.07,"endTime":241.62,"body":"common theme on this podcast."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":241.98,"endTime":244.59,"body":"I want to say"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":241.98,"endTime":244.59,"body":"I came about it from a young age"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":244.62,"endTime":248.31,"body":"I in kindergarten would force"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":244.62,"endTime":248.31,"body":"people to have mock weddings and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":248.31,"endTime":251.52,"body":"a stage these elaborate you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":248.31,"endTime":251.52,"body":"know, three year olds, I was I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":251.52,"endTime":256.17,"body":"was an event planner from day"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":251.52,"endTime":256.17,"body":"one. And after college, landed"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":256.17,"endTime":258.81,"body":"that first job, I fell in love"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":256.17,"endTime":258.81,"body":"with development, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.93,"body":"event planning, the writing, the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.93,"body":"people, all of it, I love"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":261.93,"endTime":264.63,"body":"getting to work in Excel and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":261.93,"endTime":264.63,"body":"then go out and talk to donors,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":265.02,"endTime":267.3,"body":"and really, really fell in love"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":265.02,"endTime":267.3,"body":"with it. And after about 10"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":267.3,"endTime":271.11,"body":"years doing that set out to see"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":267.3,"endTime":271.11,"body":"if I could provide really high"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":271.11,"endTime":273.99,"body":"quality counsel to small and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":271.11,"endTime":273.99,"body":"startup and grassroots"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":273.99,"endTime":276.78,"body":"nonprofits in a way that was"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":273.99,"endTime":276.78,"body":"accessible to them, both"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":276.78,"endTime":281.25,"body":"financially and capacity wise."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":276.78,"endTime":281.25,"body":"And that happened right when I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":281.25,"endTime":284.4,"body":"had my daughter, Rosalind. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":281.25,"endTime":284.4,"body":"so it really kind of brought"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":284.4,"endTime":287.64,"body":"these two concurrent passions of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":284.4,"endTime":287.64,"body":"mine nonprofit fundraising and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":287.64,"endTime":292.53,"body":"supporting women, particularly"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":287.64,"endTime":292.53,"body":"mothers into one umbrella. So"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":292.53,"endTime":296.13,"body":"start a giant squid group. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":292.53,"endTime":296.13,"body":"always say I wish I had some"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":296.13,"endTime":299.97,"body":"really sexy salient answer or"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":296.13,"endTime":299.97,"body":"like giant you know, it's the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":300.0,"endTime":304.35,"body":"It's unearthing the murky depths"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":300.0,"endTime":304.35,"body":"of fundraising. But really, it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":304.35,"endTime":307.98,"body":"was me and my best friend, my"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":304.35,"endTime":307.98,"body":"husband at a dive bar in Chicago"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":307.98,"endTime":310.38,"body":"when we were shooting the shit"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":307.98,"endTime":310.38,"body":"and somehow came up with that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":310.38,"endTime":314.28,"body":"name. It stuck. And so when I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":310.38,"endTime":314.28,"body":"went to incorporate and make it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":314.28,"endTime":317.37,"body":"official, I chose giant squid"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":314.28,"endTime":317.37,"body":"group. And it's always felt"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":317.37,"endTime":320.97,"body":"really right. But I do think is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":317.37,"endTime":320.97,"body":"the company has grown from, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":320.97,"endTime":324.84,"body":"know, just myself to now 10"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":320.97,"endTime":324.84,"body":"People across the United States."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":324.84,"endTime":327.96,"body":"Yeah, we've got this wonderful"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":324.84,"endTime":327.96,"body":"team of women. We are different."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":327.96,"endTime":330.75,"body":"I always joke if you don't want"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":327.96,"endTime":330.75,"body":"a group of tattooed moms"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":330.75,"endTime":333.45,"body":"swearing at you, you are not in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":330.75,"endTime":333.45,"body":"the right group."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":334.11,"endTime":337.26,"body":"Okay, so that's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":334.11,"endTime":337.26,"body":"really funny. And this is total"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":337.29,"endTime":340.59,"body":"non sequitur. But I have a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":337.29,"endTime":340.59,"body":"friend, her name is Beth Blaney."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":340.59,"endTime":346.5,"body":"And she runs an accounting firm,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":340.59,"endTime":346.5,"body":"and she's tattooed and swears."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":346.5,"endTime":350.16,"body":"And she's, that's her whole"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":346.5,"endTime":350.16,"body":"accounting, like branding. It's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":350.16,"endTime":352.98,"body":"like if you don't want real"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":350.16,"endTime":352.98,"body":"talk, and if you don't want a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":352.98,"endTime":355.77,"body":"bunch of people with tattoos and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":352.98,"endTime":355.77,"body":"piercings, helping you with your"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":355.77,"endTime":358.92,"body":"finances, then this is not for"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":355.77,"endTime":358.92,"body":"you. I love it. And we could"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":358.92,"endTime":361.41,"body":"probably do a whole different"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":358.92,"endTime":361.41,"body":"podcast about professionalism."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":361.41,"endTime":364.8,"body":"And you know what that means to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":361.41,"endTime":364.8,"body":"the workforce. But I digress."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":365.37,"endTime":371.31,"body":"So, I, as I put in our document,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":365.37,"endTime":371.31,"body":"like I started out as a grant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":371.31,"endTime":375.24,"body":"writer for hire. So when I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":371.31,"endTime":375.24,"body":"started my business, so I was in"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":375.24,"endTime":377.79,"body":"the development world did"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":375.24,"endTime":377.79,"body":"fundraising marketing for years,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":378.06,"endTime":383.07,"body":"then I hung up my shingle as a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":378.06,"endTime":383.07,"body":"grant writer for hire, which was"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":383.07,"endTime":386.28,"body":"the first iteration of my"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":383.07,"endTime":386.28,"body":"business. And I know you have"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":386.28,"endTime":388.41,"body":"strong feelings about this, and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":386.28,"endTime":388.41,"body":"I kind of want to kick off our"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":388.41,"endTime":392.01,"body":"conversation about grant writing"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":388.41,"endTime":392.01,"body":"with this thought, you know,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":392.01,"endTime":397.59,"body":"people would often ask me to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":392.01,"endTime":397.59,"body":"work on commission. Why is this"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":397.59,"endTime":400.11,"body":"a terrible practice? And I did"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":397.59,"endTime":400.11,"body":"say no."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":400.63,"endTime":402.34,"body":"Is it because"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":400.63,"endTime":402.34,"body":"you want my blood pressure to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":402.34,"endTime":406.21,"body":"skyrocket first thing in the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":402.34,"endTime":406.21,"body":"morning talking about this? It's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":406.21,"endTime":409.18,"body":"such a great question. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":406.21,"endTime":409.18,"body":"think it's so salient to the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":409.18,"endTime":412.63,"body":"sector as a whole and not just"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":409.18,"endTime":412.63,"body":"grant writing. I actually came"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":412.63,"endTime":415.12,"body":"into this work, and I didn't"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":412.63,"endTime":415.12,"body":"want to write grants. And here"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":415.12,"endTime":418.33,"body":"we are, you know, and we have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":415.12,"endTime":418.33,"body":"30, some grant writing clients"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":418.36,"endTime":421.84,"body":"nationally. But why don't we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":418.36,"endTime":421.84,"body":"write grants on commission is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":421.84,"endTime":424.84,"body":"such an excellent, important"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":421.84,"endTime":424.84,"body":"question. And there are so many"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":424.84,"endTime":429.31,"body":"nuanced answers. The first is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":424.84,"endTime":429.31,"body":"that the Association of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":429.31,"endTime":432.58,"body":"Fundraising Professionals, which"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":429.31,"endTime":432.58,"body":"for most of us is sort of our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":432.58,"endTime":437.17,"body":"only body to go to for resources"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":432.58,"endTime":437.17,"body":"for thought leadership for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":437.17,"endTime":442.3,"body":"ethics guidelines, is very clear"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":437.17,"endTime":442.3,"body":"that fundraising on commission"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":442.3,"endTime":446.11,"body":"is unethical. And grant writing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":442.3,"endTime":446.11,"body":"is fundraising. Right. It's a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":446.11,"endTime":448.75,"body":"different form of fundraising."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":446.11,"endTime":448.75,"body":"But it's it is still definitely"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":448.75,"endTime":452.2,"body":"fundraising, and they have some"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":448.75,"endTime":452.2,"body":"wonderful, wonderful rationale"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":452.2,"endTime":455.47,"body":"behind it. So it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":452.2,"endTime":455.47,"body":"unethical, we don't do it. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":455.47,"endTime":459.58,"body":"if you are a fundraiser who is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":455.47,"endTime":459.58,"body":"immersed in AFP in any way, then"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":459.58,"endTime":463.69,"body":"you should be well versed in the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":459.58,"endTime":463.69,"body":"reasons why we don't fundraise"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":464.02,"endTime":466.75,"body":"on permission. The grant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":464.02,"endTime":466.75,"body":"Professionals Association, I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":466.75,"endTime":470.08,"body":"believe, says the same thing."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":466.75,"endTime":470.08,"body":"And as this question kept coming"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":470.08,"endTime":472.99,"body":"up, like you people would ask"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":470.08,"endTime":472.99,"body":"all the time, I also learned"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":473.26,"endTime":476.47,"body":"that it is against GAAP"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":473.26,"endTime":476.47,"body":"generally accepted accounting"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":476.47,"endTime":480.67,"body":"policies, which I am not an"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":476.47,"endTime":480.67,"body":"accountant. And so that was what"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":480.67,"endTime":483.37,"body":"I was told I would love someone,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":480.67,"endTime":483.37,"body":"you know, maybe an accountant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":483.37,"endTime":484.99,"body":"will elucidate that for us"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":485.08,"endTime":487.51,"body":"my friend Beth"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":485.08,"endTime":487.51,"body":"can talk about it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":488.35,"endTime":490.24,"body":"tell us why"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":488.35,"endTime":490.24,"body":"it's a bad idea. So it goes"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":490.24,"endTime":493.57,"body":"against GAAP, it goes against"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":490.24,"endTime":493.57,"body":"AFP. Any other acronyms we can"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":493.57,"endTime":496.42,"body":"throw in there. And then of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":493.57,"endTime":496.42,"body":"course, often logistically, it's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":496.42,"endTime":500.35,"body":"going to go against the funders"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":496.42,"endTime":500.35,"body":"expectations, right. So to get"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":500.35,"endTime":504.43,"body":"into the nitty gritty, if you're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":500.35,"endTime":504.43,"body":"submitting a grant budget for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":504.43,"endTime":507.34,"body":"$100,000 grant, and you're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":504.43,"endTime":507.34,"body":"saying you're going to pay your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":507.34,"endTime":512.26,"body":"grant writer 10%. Are you really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":507.34,"endTime":512.26,"body":"going to pay them $10,000 to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":512.26,"endTime":514.99,"body":"land a grant. And if you put"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":512.26,"endTime":514.99,"body":"that in your grant budget, that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":514.99,"endTime":519.46,"body":"funder is very, very likely"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":514.99,"endTime":519.46,"body":"going to send out so as an"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":519.46,"endTime":522.67,"body":"organization, then are you not"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":519.46,"endTime":522.67,"body":"going to pay your grant writer?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":522.7,"endTime":524.74,"body":"Or are you going to be in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":522.7,"endTime":524.74,"body":"violation of your grant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":524.74,"endTime":527.17,"body":"contract, which is essentially"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":524.74,"endTime":527.17,"body":"fraud, right? So it's a really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":527.17,"endTime":529.93,"body":"messy situation all over the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":527.17,"endTime":529.93,"body":"place your account, it's not"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":529.93,"endTime":532.12,"body":"gonna let you do it. Your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":529.93,"endTime":532.12,"body":"treasurer is not going to let"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":532.12,"endTime":534.97,"body":"you do it. And then of course,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":532.12,"endTime":534.97,"body":"there's also an ethical"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":534.97,"endTime":539.98,"body":"question, right? Grant Writing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":534.97,"endTime":539.98,"body":"is work. It is skilled labor. It"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":539.98,"endTime":544.12,"body":"is very, very niche. It takes"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":539.98,"endTime":544.12,"body":"time and it takes energy and why"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":544.12,"endTime":548.05,"body":"would you not pay someone for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":544.12,"endTime":548.05,"body":"the hours and hours of expertise"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":548.08,"endTime":552.19,"body":"and project management and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":548.08,"endTime":552.19,"body":"writing that they do? Because"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":552.79,"endTime":557.23,"body":"whether or not you win a grant,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":552.79,"endTime":557.23,"body":"as a nonprofit, has so little to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":557.23,"endTime":561.55,"body":"do with the grant writer, and so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":557.23,"endTime":561.55,"body":"much to do with the maturity of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":561.55,"endTime":565.15,"body":"your organization, the maturity"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":561.55,"endTime":565.15,"body":"of your programs, whether you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":565.15,"endTime":568.57,"body":"fit in the funders priorities"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":565.15,"endTime":568.57,"body":"and like what color the funders"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":568.57,"endTime":570.67,"body":"wearing that day is right? At"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":568.57,"endTime":570.67,"body":"the end of the day, it's a crap"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":570.67,"endTime":574.51,"body":"shot, right? So it really needs"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":570.67,"endTime":574.51,"body":"to be a relationship between a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":574.51,"endTime":578.38,"body":"grant writer whether they are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":574.51,"endTime":578.38,"body":"external, like a consultant or a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":578.38,"endTime":583.42,"body":"vendor, or internal to make sure"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":578.38,"endTime":583.42,"body":"that they are positioning your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":583.42,"endTime":586.33,"body":"organization well with funders"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":583.42,"endTime":586.33,"body":"and helping build those"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":586.33,"endTime":590.8,"body":"relationships. So obviously, I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":586.33,"endTime":590.8,"body":"could go on about this all day."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":590.8,"endTime":593.92,"body":"It is definitely a passion"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":590.8,"endTime":593.92,"body":"point. But I think as a sector,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":593.95,"endTime":598.12,"body":"we can come into it with a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":593.95,"endTime":598.12,"body":"scarcity mindset. And I get it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":598.12,"endTime":600.76,"body":"right you're starting out your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":598.12,"endTime":600.76,"body":"boots. Adding everything, you've"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":600.76,"endTime":603.82,"body":"got this passion, and all of a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":600.76,"endTime":603.82,"body":"sudden you go, Oh, fuck, I have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":603.82,"endTime":605.89,"body":"to fundraise. And hopefully I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":603.82,"endTime":605.89,"body":"can swear we've already covered"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":605.89,"endTime":606.22,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":606.25,"endTime":608.29,"body":"That's okay, we"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":606.25,"endTime":608.29,"body":"can put we can put a little"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":608.56,"endTime":611.98,"body":"explicit notice in the podcast,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":608.56,"endTime":611.98,"body":"it's totally fine"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":612.03,"endTime":615.09,"body":"explicit grant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":612.03,"endTime":615.09,"body":"writing. I have to fundraise."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":615.09,"endTime":617.79,"body":"Now how the heck do I do that?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":615.09,"endTime":617.79,"body":"So of course, it makes sense"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":617.82,"endTime":621.6,"body":"that you're you might not be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":617.82,"endTime":621.6,"body":"able to pay 1000s of dollars for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":621.6,"endTime":624.75,"body":"quality grant writing. But"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":621.6,"endTime":624.75,"body":"rather than working on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":624.75,"endTime":628.23,"body":"commission, it's a sign to me"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":624.75,"endTime":628.23,"body":"that you just might not be ready"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":628.53,"endTime":630.54,"body":"to be pursuing high level"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":628.53,"endTime":630.54,"body":"grants."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":631.35,"endTime":633.87,"body":"Absolutely. I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":631.35,"endTime":633.87,"body":"completely agree with that. I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":633.87,"endTime":638.88,"body":"also think it just speaks to the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":633.87,"endTime":638.88,"body":"nature of how we are so focused,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":639.27,"endTime":642.84,"body":"really not on the process, but"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":639.27,"endTime":642.84,"body":"only on the results. And if you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":642.84,"endTime":645.63,"body":"have a fantastic grant writer"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":642.84,"endTime":645.63,"body":"that can create this wonderful"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":645.63,"endTime":650.16,"body":"template for you, and tell"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":645.63,"endTime":650.16,"body":"fantastic stories, and craft"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":650.16,"endTime":653.97,"body":"this narrative that you can then"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":650.16,"endTime":653.97,"body":"use to go to other grant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":653.97,"endTime":658.17,"body":"funders. But it takes hours and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":653.97,"endTime":658.17,"body":"hours and hours of work, as we"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":658.17,"endTime":661.32,"body":"know to submit grants and write"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":658.17,"endTime":661.32,"body":"grants and research grants, like"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":661.32,"endTime":664.77,"body":"you said, if it's going to be a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":661.32,"endTime":664.77,"body":"good fit, just because someone"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":664.77,"endTime":667.23,"body":"has money, like just don't"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":664.77,"endTime":667.23,"body":"submit a grant to MacKenzie"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":667.23,"endTime":671.43,"body":"Scott, you know, because, or"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":667.23,"endTime":671.43,"body":"Oprah or Bill Gates or like any"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":671.43,"endTime":675.15,"body":"number of the people. But the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":671.43,"endTime":675.15,"body":"topic today that I'm really"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":675.15,"endTime":679.89,"body":"interested in, and this is how I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":675.15,"endTime":679.89,"body":"this is how I found you is I'm"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":679.89,"endTime":684.66,"body":"so interested in your take on"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":679.89,"endTime":684.66,"body":"using grant writing as a tool"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":684.66,"endTime":689.43,"body":"for change. And you write you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":684.66,"endTime":689.43,"body":"know, our grants are often full"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":689.52,"endTime":693.21,"body":"of old recycled language and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":689.52,"endTime":693.21,"body":"buzzword description descriptors"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":693.45,"endTime":697.32,"body":"that are more than just boring."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":693.45,"endTime":697.32,"body":"They're harmful. grant writers"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":697.32,"endTime":700.89,"body":"play a critical role in branding"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":697.32,"endTime":700.89,"body":"the organization and crafting"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":700.89,"endTime":705.69,"body":"the ways in which it is"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":700.89,"endTime":705.69,"body":"presented to funders. And you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":705.69,"endTime":710.73,"body":"have a workshop called"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":705.69,"endTime":710.73,"body":"decolonizing, your grant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":710.76,"endTime":714.57,"body":"language and I want to hear more"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":710.76,"endTime":714.57,"body":"about that how it came to be."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":714.9,"endTime":717.06,"body":"And how are people perceiving"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":714.9,"endTime":717.06,"body":"that?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":717.66,"endTime":721.26,"body":"Absolutely. So"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":717.66,"endTime":721.26,"body":"also my favorite topic to talk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":721.26,"endTime":724.05,"body":"about in terms of grants, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":721.26,"endTime":724.05,"body":"I'm really excited to dig into"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":724.05,"endTime":727.83,"body":"it. So we're going to get our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":724.05,"endTime":727.83,"body":"raging feminist hats on and go"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":727.83,"endTime":732.39,"body":"even a little deeper to raging"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":727.83,"endTime":732.39,"body":"anti racists, dismantling the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":732.39,"endTime":734.46,"body":"patriarchy changing the world,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":732.39,"endTime":734.46,"body":"right? Because we could do that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":734.46,"endTime":737.25,"body":"because we work in the nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":734.46,"endTime":737.25,"body":"sector and we could do freakin"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":737.31,"endTime":743.82,"body":"anything. So giant squid group"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":737.31,"endTime":743.82,"body":"works through and intersectional"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":743.82,"endTime":748.32,"body":"feminists and anti racist lens."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":743.82,"endTime":748.32,"body":"That means that everything we do"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":748.35,"endTime":752.28,"body":"is really steeped in trying to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":748.35,"endTime":752.28,"body":"dismantle our own internalized"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":752.28,"endTime":757.2,"body":"racism and, you know, be an anti"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":752.28,"endTime":757.2,"body":"racist firm, which for most of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":757.2,"endTime":761.07,"body":"us is a process. You know, I am"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":757.2,"endTime":761.07,"body":"a white woman from a privileged"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":761.07,"endTime":763.32,"body":"background. And so this is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":761.07,"endTime":763.32,"body":"certainly an iterative learning"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":763.32,"endTime":768.09,"body":"process for me. And I have been"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":763.32,"endTime":768.09,"body":"absolutely fortunate enough to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":768.09,"endTime":771.33,"body":"be very steeped in the community"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":768.09,"endTime":771.33,"body":"centric fundraising movement,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":771.33,"endTime":773.82,"body":"which is a national movement."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":771.33,"endTime":773.82,"body":"I'm not sure if it's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":773.82,"endTime":776.22,"body":"international, I should know"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":773.82,"endTime":776.22,"body":"that but a national movement in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":776.22,"endTime":780.18,"body":"the United States. I imagine it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":776.22,"endTime":780.18,"body":"is. And I know that there's a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":780.18,"endTime":783.18,"body":"ton of great work happening in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":780.18,"endTime":783.18,"body":"England around some questions as"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":783.18,"endTime":786.75,"body":"well. So certainly not unique to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":783.18,"endTime":786.75,"body":"the United States. But really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":786.75,"endTime":791.85,"body":"thinking about how we can turn"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":786.75,"endTime":791.85,"body":"the nonprofit sector on its head"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":791.85,"endTime":794.67,"body":"a little bit when it comes to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":791.85,"endTime":794.67,"body":"these questions of equity and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":794.7,"endTime":799.41,"body":"access to funding. And as I've"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":794.7,"endTime":799.41,"body":"been falling in love with"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":799.41,"endTime":801.66,"body":"community centric fundraising"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":799.41,"endTime":801.66,"body":"and learning so much, I've also"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":801.66,"endTime":804.84,"body":"been watching the Gilded Age,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":801.66,"endTime":804.84,"body":"and I bring that up. Have you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":804.84,"endTime":806.85,"body":"watched the Gilded Age yet on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":804.84,"endTime":806.85,"body":"HBO?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":807.0,"endTime":810.03,"body":"No, oh, my gosh,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":807.0,"endTime":810.03,"body":"I need to put it on my list."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":810.06,"endTime":812.43,"body":"So I've, I've"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":810.06,"endTime":812.43,"body":"been watching the Gilded Age,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":812.43,"endTime":815.31,"body":"which for anyone who hasn't had"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":812.43,"endTime":815.31,"body":"a chance to watch it yet is the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":815.31,"endTime":818.49,"body":"new Julian Fellowes show that's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":815.31,"endTime":818.49,"body":"basically Downton Abbey in the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":818.49,"endTime":822.24,"body":"United States. And one of the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":818.49,"endTime":822.24,"body":"plot lines, and I promise this,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":822.24,"endTime":825.03,"body":"this ties into fundraising is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":822.24,"endTime":825.03,"body":"Clara Barton founding the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":825.03,"endTime":831.72,"body":"American Red Cross, and how it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":825.03,"endTime":831.72,"body":"truly was a tool for rich women"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":831.72,"endTime":834.93,"body":"to have power. And so even if"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":831.72,"endTime":834.93,"body":"you're not a huge fan of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":834.93,"endTime":838.26,"body":"historical dramas, even if you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":834.93,"endTime":838.26,"body":"maybe don't have HBO, I highly"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":838.26,"endTime":842.28,"body":"encourage anyone listening to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":838.26,"endTime":842.28,"body":"this to go watch the episode of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":842.31,"endTime":847.35,"body":"Clara Barton, watching the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":842.31,"endTime":847.35,"body":"American Red Cross, and seeing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":847.35,"endTime":850.65,"body":"how the money behind it and the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":847.35,"endTime":850.65,"body":"intentionality behind it in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":850.65,"endTime":853.29,"body":"terms of who was funding how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":850.65,"endTime":853.29,"body":"they were funding really was a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":853.29,"endTime":856.14,"body":"tool, right. And it was a tool"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":853.29,"endTime":856.14,"body":"of essentially the robber"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":856.14,"endTime":859.2,"body":"barons. So I've had that running"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":856.14,"endTime":859.2,"body":"in the back of my head all"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":859.2,"endTime":861.75,"body":"quarter as we've been doing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":859.2,"endTime":861.75,"body":"this, these workshops, which we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":861.75,"endTime":865.38,"body":"have been doing for a while, but"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":861.75,"endTime":865.38,"body":"I loved that, that repositioning"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":865.68,"endTime":869.1,"body":"that so much of American"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":865.68,"endTime":869.1,"body":"philanthropy has come out of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":869.13,"endTime":872.04,"body":"basically money being a tool for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":869.13,"endTime":872.04,"body":"rich people and philanthropy"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":872.07,"endTime":875.28,"body":"being a tool for rich people."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":872.07,"endTime":875.28,"body":"And, and at the same time, we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":875.28,"endTime":878.19,"body":"know the incredible power of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":875.28,"endTime":878.19,"body":"collective grassroots"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":878.19,"endTime":881.52,"body":"fundraising, right? We've seen"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":878.19,"endTime":881.52,"body":"how Kickstarter and GoFundMe,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":881.52,"endTime":885.54,"body":"and all of these platforms"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":881.52,"endTime":885.54,"body":"really, really mobilize people"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":885.57,"endTime":889.56,"body":"and that $5 here and $5, there"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":885.57,"endTime":889.56,"body":"can make a huge difference. But"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":889.56,"endTime":891.78,"body":"you have to have a good story."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":889.56,"endTime":891.78,"body":"You have to have a good story."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":891.78,"endTime":894.18,"body":"You have to know what you're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":891.78,"endTime":894.18,"body":"doing doesn't happen in a silo,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":894.21,"endTime":895.65,"body":"but there's a lot of power."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":896.31,"endTime":899.25,"body":"Don't you feel"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":896.31,"endTime":899.25,"body":"like marginalized groups tend to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":899.25,"endTime":903.36,"body":"raise less money Be on GoFundMe"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":899.25,"endTime":903.36,"body":"and Kickstarter? Because they're"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":903.36,"endTime":905.43,"body":"not maybe a sexier cause? I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":903.36,"endTime":905.43,"body":"don't know."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":905.61,"endTime":908.1,"body":"Probably"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":905.61,"endTime":908.1,"body":"there's our third podcast topic"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":908.1,"endTime":911.16,"body":"of the day. Okay, keep going,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":908.1,"endTime":911.16,"body":"right? Yes. But we do know that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":911.16,"endTime":913.5,"body":"marginalized groups have less"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":911.16,"endTime":913.5,"body":"access to capital in general."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":913.53,"endTime":917.73,"body":"Right. So anyway, all of that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":913.53,"endTime":917.73,"body":"led me to really think about how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":917.73,"endTime":921.21,"body":"this works in grant writing."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":917.73,"endTime":921.21,"body":"Because grant writing is a world"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":921.21,"endTime":925.23,"body":"in which I live daily. And even"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":921.21,"endTime":925.23,"body":"as I was working within"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":925.23,"endTime":927.93,"body":"community centric fundraising"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":925.23,"endTime":927.93,"body":"and doing my own anti racist"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":927.93,"endTime":931.38,"body":"work, grant writing still felt"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":927.93,"endTime":931.38,"body":"like this thing that was sitting"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":931.38,"endTime":934.23,"body":"off in the corner very"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":931.38,"endTime":934.23,"body":"uncomfortably, because I could"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":934.23,"endTime":937.68,"body":"come off an incredible"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":934.23,"endTime":937.68,"body":"conversation with another"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":937.68,"endTime":940.92,"body":"fundraiser or another advocate"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":937.68,"endTime":940.92,"body":"or another raging feminist, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":940.92,"endTime":944.64,"body":"then go write a grant that made"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":940.92,"endTime":944.64,"body":"me want to cringe because of how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":944.64,"endTime":948.15,"body":"we were talking about people."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":944.64,"endTime":948.15,"body":"Because so much of grant writing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":948.15,"endTime":951.15,"body":"how I was taught it over the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":948.15,"endTime":951.15,"body":"last, you know, almost 20 years"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":951.15,"endTime":955.98,"body":"was kind of pandering to the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":951.15,"endTime":955.98,"body":"Foundation's saying how great"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":955.98,"endTime":959.61,"body":"they are all of these things,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":955.98,"endTime":959.61,"body":"really playing up the poverty"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":959.61,"endTime":963.63,"body":"porn of you know, the poor black"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":959.61,"endTime":963.63,"body":"kids in Chicago, public schools"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":963.63,"endTime":967.56,"body":"don't have anything and we need"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":963.63,"endTime":967.56,"body":"to support them. And my team"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":967.56,"endTime":971.37,"body":"actually was the one that really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":967.56,"endTime":971.37,"body":"came up for this idea of using"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":971.37,"endTime":975.69,"body":"your grants as a tool of change."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":971.37,"endTime":975.69,"body":"And how could we use this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":975.87,"endTime":980.1,"body":"incredible platform that we have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":975.87,"endTime":980.1,"body":"as grant writers to try to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":980.1,"endTime":985.98,"body":"change the narrative. And so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":980.1,"endTime":985.98,"body":"what that has has really meant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":986.01,"endTime":990.09,"body":"for us when we talk about is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":986.01,"endTime":990.09,"body":"that grant writing can feel like"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":990.09,"endTime":993.45,"body":"it's happening in a silo, right?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":990.09,"endTime":993.45,"body":"And if anyone listening is in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":993.45,"endTime":996.78,"body":"houseplant, right, or if it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":993.45,"endTime":996.78,"body":"does, we sit in our corner, we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":996.78,"endTime":1000.32,"body":"meet our deadlines, we get"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":996.78,"endTime":1000.32,"body":"information from programs teams"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1000.35,"endTime":1002.84,"body":"are constantly submitting things"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1000.35,"endTime":1002.84,"body":"one minute before they're due."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1003.11,"endTime":1007.49,"body":"And it can feel like when am I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1003.11,"endTime":1007.49,"body":"going to have time to change the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1007.49,"endTime":1010.88,"body":"system when I'm just trying to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1007.49,"endTime":1010.88,"body":"meet my deadlines. But I think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1010.88,"endTime":1013.97,"body":"that grant writers have a huge"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1010.88,"endTime":1013.97,"body":"amount of power that we might"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1013.97,"endTime":1017.81,"body":"not give ourselves credit for."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1013.97,"endTime":1017.81,"body":"Because we get to take"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1017.84,"endTime":1021.71,"body":"everything an organization is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1017.84,"endTime":1021.71,"body":"doing and synthesize it, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1021.71,"endTime":1025.1,"body":"identify, you know, articulate"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1021.71,"endTime":1025.1,"body":"goals and objectives and make"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1025.1,"endTime":1029.33,"body":"sure that what the organization"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1025.1,"endTime":1029.33,"body":"is doing is positioned well. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1029.33,"endTime":1031.79,"body":"so even if you feel like you're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1029.33,"endTime":1031.79,"body":"just sitting at your little"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1031.79,"endTime":1034.28,"body":"desk, and you have a teeny"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1031.79,"endTime":1034.28,"body":"little sphere of influence, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1034.85,"endTime":1038.24,"body":"I'll never forget having a you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1034.85,"endTime":1038.24,"body":"know, an ED who would move every"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1038.24,"endTime":1042.71,"body":"comma, right, I still did have a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1038.24,"endTime":1042.71,"body":"sphere of influence, right?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1042.98,"endTime":1045.68,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1042.98,"endTime":1045.68,"body":"They're not going to rewrite the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1045.68,"endTime":1047.96,"body":"whole grant, they're just going"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1045.68,"endTime":1047.96,"body":"to nitpick it a little bit."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1048.38,"endTime":1051.71,"body":"But I think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1048.38,"endTime":1051.71,"body":"that we can push the bar forward"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1051.71,"endTime":1055.82,"body":"a little bit. And so the two"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1051.71,"endTime":1055.82,"body":"areas where I come to with sort"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1055.82,"endTime":1059.9,"body":"of this, using your grants as a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1055.82,"endTime":1059.9,"body":"tool of change are incorporating"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1059.9,"endTime":1063.62,"body":"conscientious communication into"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1059.9,"endTime":1063.62,"body":"your grants, it's starting to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1063.62,"endTime":1067.61,"body":"think about the language that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1063.62,"endTime":1067.61,"body":"you're using. And the second is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1067.61,"endTime":1072.71,"body":"ethical storytelling. And I have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1067.61,"endTime":1072.71,"body":"been so fortunate to learn this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1072.71,"endTime":1076.46,"body":"from brilliant people, not only"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1072.71,"endTime":1076.46,"body":"in the nonprofit sector, but in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1076.46,"endTime":1079.46,"body":"the communication sector and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1076.46,"endTime":1079.46,"body":"storytelling sector, you know,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1079.46,"endTime":1082.58,"body":"just across across the world, I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1079.46,"endTime":1082.58,"body":"think there's a lot of thought"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1082.58,"endTime":1085.94,"body":"going into this. And so one of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1082.58,"endTime":1085.94,"body":"the first tools I discovered was"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1085.94,"endTime":1088.91,"body":"the social justice phrase Guide,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1085.94,"endTime":1088.91,"body":"which is a collaboration of the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1088.91,"endTime":1091.46,"body":"Advancement Project and the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1088.91,"endTime":1091.46,"body":"opportunity agenda, and I'll"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1092.15,"endTime":1096.98,"body":"show notes, and it's this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1092.15,"endTime":1096.98,"body":"incredible guideline for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1096.98,"endTime":1100.55,"body":"conscientious communication. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1096.98,"endTime":1100.55,"body":"it takes it from that Oh, the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1100.55,"endTime":1104.45,"body":"poor black people and the poor"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1100.55,"endTime":1104.45,"body":"little brown kids at risk kids."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1104.45,"endTime":1109.01,"body":"Yes, at risk, you got me. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1104.45,"endTime":1109.01,"body":"instead talking about let's talk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1109.01,"endTime":1113.27,"body":"about people respectfully, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1109.01,"endTime":1113.27,"body":"accurately, let's talk about"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1113.27,"endTime":1117.65,"body":"their identities. Let's talk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1113.27,"endTime":1117.65,"body":"about their situations. Let's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1117.68,"endTime":1122.33,"body":"outdate let's retire outdated"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1117.68,"endTime":1122.33,"body":"and problematic phrases and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1122.33,"endTime":1126.71,"body":"really reinforce the idea of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1122.33,"endTime":1126.71,"body":"prosperity and community over"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1126.98,"endTime":1130.58,"body":"this sort of white savior ism"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1126.98,"endTime":1130.58,"body":"that we're very good at writing."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1131.06,"endTime":1136.94,"body":"So what that looks like I think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1131.06,"endTime":1136.94,"body":"for most of us is starting to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1136.94,"endTime":1139.73,"body":"think about more intentionally."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1136.94,"endTime":1139.73,"body":"Are you using people first"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1139.73,"endTime":1143.84,"body":"language or identity first"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1139.73,"endTime":1143.84,"body":"language and the the guidelines"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1143.84,"endTime":1146.24,"body":"for conscientious communication"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1143.84,"endTime":1146.24,"body":"have a really wonderful"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1146.24,"endTime":1150.38,"body":"breakdown. So if anyone's like"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1146.24,"endTime":1150.38,"body":"people identity, what? Take a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1150.38,"endTime":1153.53,"body":"look. But for instance, there's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1150.38,"endTime":1153.53,"body":"some easy once no one is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1153.53,"endTime":1155.75,"body":"homeless, right? It's so easy to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1153.53,"endTime":1155.75,"body":"say oh, the homeless, I'm going"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1155.75,"endTime":1159.44,"body":"to help the homeless. No one is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1155.75,"endTime":1159.44,"body":"homeless. They are experiencing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1159.44,"endTime":1160.19,"body":"homelessness."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1160.34,"endTime":1162.83,"body":"I've noticed"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1160.34,"endTime":1162.83,"body":"that lately. I've seen that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1162.83,"endTime":1165.44,"body":"everywhere. And it's really"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1162.83,"endTime":1165.44,"body":"powerful."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1165.77,"endTime":1169.52,"body":"Right living"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1165.77,"endTime":1169.52,"body":"unsheltered and even homeless,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1169.52,"endTime":1171.38,"body":"right, someone who is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1169.52,"endTime":1171.38,"body":"experiencing homelessness,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1171.41,"endTime":1176.3,"body":"there's a whole spectrum, right,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1171.41,"endTime":1176.3,"body":"which I didn't know growing up"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1176.33,"endTime":1179.39,"body":"until I was running with a group"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1176.33,"endTime":1179.39,"body":"called back on my feet."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1179.54,"endTime":1182.3,"body":"I love back on"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1179.54,"endTime":1182.3,"body":"my feet. I know that group talk"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1182.3,"endTime":1183.8,"body":"about amazing storytelling."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1183.92,"endTime":1187.28,"body":"Yes. And stuff"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1183.92,"endTime":1187.28,"body":"like oh, right, you you could be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1187.28,"endTime":1190.52,"body":"living on sheltered or you could"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1187.28,"endTime":1190.52,"body":"be living with your grandmother."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1191.06,"endTime":1194.72,"body":"And you might be considered"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1191.06,"endTime":1194.72,"body":"homeless, but there's a big"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1194.72,"endTime":1195.8,"body":"difference, right? So"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1195.83,"endTime":1197.72,"body":"exactly. When"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1195.83,"endTime":1197.72,"body":"you come back from college and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1197.72,"endTime":1201.65,"body":"you live with your parents, are"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1197.72,"endTime":1201.65,"body":"you There's a whole range."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1201.77,"endTime":1204.26,"body":"That's what I really love about"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1201.77,"endTime":1204.26,"body":"this language. So yeah, keep"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1204.26,"endTime":1205.22,"body":"going. I love this."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1205.28,"endTime":1208.04,"body":"Yeah, we could"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1205.28,"endTime":1208.04,"body":"talk about it all day. So we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1208.04,"endTime":1211.94,"body":"focus on the person, right,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1208.04,"endTime":1211.94,"body":"rather than the condition coded"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1211.94,"endTime":1215.21,"body":"vague terms like at risk. You"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1211.94,"endTime":1215.21,"body":"said that I love that. What are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1215.21,"endTime":1216.83,"body":"you at risk of?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1217.01,"endTime":1219.65,"body":"I can't even I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1217.01,"endTime":1219.65,"body":"work with Boston public schools"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1219.65,"endTime":1224.09,"body":"a lot. And I work with the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1219.65,"endTime":1224.09,"body":"Boston Foundation, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1224.09,"endTime":1228.92,"body":"afterschool programs. And that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1224.09,"endTime":1228.92,"body":"is just the term they use. What"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1228.92,"endTime":1232.4,"body":"are you at risk of what like"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1228.92,"endTime":1232.4,"body":"what specifically is happening?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1232.4,"endTime":1233.0,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1233.51,"endTime":1235.97,"body":"And I think,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1233.51,"endTime":1235.97,"body":"again, it's an opera, what, what"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1235.97,"endTime":1239.24,"body":"it does, and there's so many"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1235.97,"endTime":1239.24,"body":"terms where you can start to use"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1239.24,"endTime":1242.0,"body":"people first language rather"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1239.24,"endTime":1242.0,"body":"than identity first language."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1242.24,"endTime":1245.27,"body":"When we use identity first"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1242.24,"endTime":1245.27,"body":"language. And we use these coded"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1245.27,"endTime":1249.53,"body":"vague terms like at risk, we are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1245.27,"endTime":1249.53,"body":"asking readers and ourselves to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1249.53,"endTime":1252.98,"body":"make a cognitive assumption from"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1249.53,"endTime":1252.98,"body":"what we're talking about to the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1252.98,"endTime":1256.07,"body":"person we're talking about. So"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1252.98,"endTime":1256.07,"body":"at risk, I love that you said"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1256.07,"endTime":1258.32,"body":"you work with Boston Public"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1256.07,"endTime":1258.32,"body":"Schools, I work for Chicago"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1258.32,"endTime":1262.52,"body":"public schools, that same thing."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1258.32,"endTime":1262.52,"body":"And so I know because of how I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1262.52,"endTime":1267.65,"body":"was raised, when I read the word"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1262.52,"endTime":1267.65,"body":"at risk youth in Chicago, it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1267.65,"endTime":1272.87,"body":"paints a very clear picture in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1267.65,"endTime":1272.87,"body":"my head of a young black man in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1272.9,"endTime":1277.55,"body":"a disenfranchised neighborhood."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1272.9,"endTime":1277.55,"body":"And that probably isn't true, if"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1277.55,"endTime":1279.89,"body":"you are sitting at risk of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1277.55,"endTime":1279.89,"body":"something else. And it also is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1279.89,"endTime":1285.53,"body":"such a dishonest representation"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1279.89,"endTime":1285.53,"body":"to paint all people quote at"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1285.53,"endTime":1288.65,"body":"risk because we are making that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1285.53,"endTime":1288.65,"body":"cognitive leap and we're asking"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1288.65,"endTime":1291.11,"body":"our funders to make that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1288.65,"endTime":1291.11,"body":"cognitive leap and I think that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1291.11,"endTime":1294.74,"body":"very harmfully reinforces our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1291.11,"endTime":1294.74,"body":"stereotypes, and that white"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1294.74,"endTime":1295.34,"body":"savior ism."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1295.7,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"So how can we"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1295.7,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"and how do you work with your"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1304.01,"body":"clients to tell these truthful,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1304.01,"body":"empowering stories that really"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1304.01,"endTime":1308.03,"body":"elevate our communities, instead"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1304.01,"endTime":1308.03,"body":"of perpetuating stereotypes and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1308.03,"endTime":1309.26,"body":"tokenism? And we know"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1309.0,"endTime":1311.34,"body":"the problem?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1309.0,"endTime":1311.34,"body":"One thing before we get into"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1311.34,"endTime":1314.82,"body":"that is one thing I have learned"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1311.34,"endTime":1314.82,"body":"and that has been pushback I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1314.82,"endTime":1318.54,"body":"received is when people self"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1314.82,"endTime":1318.54,"body":"identify however you go use"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1318.54,"endTime":1322.02,"body":"that. So for instance, it's not"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1318.54,"endTime":1322.02,"body":"people with autism. You know, a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1322.02,"endTime":1325.2,"body":"lot of people with neurodiverse"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1322.02,"endTime":1325.2,"body":"people self identify as"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1325.23,"endTime":1328.53,"body":"autistic, right? So it would be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1325.23,"endTime":1328.53,"body":"equally as harmful to say, well,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1328.53,"endTime":1332.22,"body":"actually, you're a person living"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1328.53,"endTime":1332.22,"body":"with autism, right? So it does"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1332.22,"endTime":1336.57,"body":"feel like a constant learning"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1332.22,"endTime":1336.57,"body":"of, of how to refer to people"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1336.57,"endTime":1340.02,"body":"accurately and respectfully. But"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1336.57,"endTime":1340.02,"body":"I think the number one thing we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1340.02,"endTime":1345.51,"body":"can do, to educate ourselves and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1340.02,"endTime":1345.51,"body":"then to educate our clients or"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1345.51,"endTime":1349.14,"body":"to write better grants or to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1345.51,"endTime":1349.14,"body":"work more effectively within"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1349.14,"endTime":1352.26,"body":"communities just shut up and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1349.14,"endTime":1352.26,"body":"listen, because I don't think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1352.26,"endTime":1355.86,"body":"anyone's going to come and say,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1352.26,"endTime":1355.86,"body":"Hi, my name is Katherine, I am"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1355.86,"endTime":1360.36,"body":"an actress woman. No one is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1355.86,"endTime":1360.36,"body":"going to say that minority,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1360.6,"endTime":1363.54,"body":"right, yeah, I am an at risk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1360.6,"endTime":1363.54,"body":"minority from a disenfranchised"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1363.57,"endTime":1366.84,"body":"neighborhood. But someone might"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1363.57,"endTime":1366.84,"body":"come in and say hi, I'm, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1366.84,"endTime":1369.42,"body":"know, I live with a mental"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1366.84,"endTime":1369.42,"body":"illness, or I'm autistic, right?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1369.42,"endTime":1372.96,"body":"So we want to listen to people."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1369.42,"endTime":1372.96,"body":"And then as we're writing, I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1372.96,"endTime":1375.87,"body":"think it's a really wonderful"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1372.96,"endTime":1375.87,"body":"opportunity for writers to go"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1375.87,"endTime":1379.95,"body":"back and audit your language to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1375.87,"endTime":1379.95,"body":"see are you empowering your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1379.95,"endTime":1384.78,"body":"constituents? Or are you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1379.95,"endTime":1384.78,"body":"painting them as victims by"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1385.62,"endTime":1388.71,"body":"putting that identity first"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1385.62,"endTime":1388.71,"body":"language by really painting"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1388.71,"endTime":1392.52,"body":"these very vague platitudes of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1388.71,"endTime":1392.52,"body":"disenfranchised neighborhoods"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1392.52,"endTime":1396.15,"body":"and, you know, systems. So"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1392.52,"endTime":1396.15,"body":"getting very active in how you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1396.15,"endTime":1400.35,"body":"talk, getting very specific in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1396.15,"endTime":1400.35,"body":"how you talk, and instead of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1400.35,"endTime":1405.54,"body":"saying, an at risk youth in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1400.35,"endTime":1405.54,"body":"Chicago Public Schools, saying,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1405.96,"endTime":1410.43,"body":"a young black man who is you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1405.96,"endTime":1410.43,"body":"know, x times as likely to be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1410.43,"endTime":1412.47,"body":"incarcerated because of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1410.43,"endTime":1412.47,"body":"whatever, like, paint the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1412.47,"endTime":1414.48,"body":"picture, right, be specific?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1414.9,"endTime":1416.91,"body":"Do you feel like"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1414.9,"endTime":1416.91,"body":"we shy away from that? Because"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1416.91,"endTime":1425.16,"body":"we feel like saying a young"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1416.91,"endTime":1425.16,"body":"black man is somehow taboo or"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1425.19,"endTime":1430.5,"body":"somehow offensive? I really do"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1425.19,"endTime":1430.5,"body":"feel like if I wrote that in a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1430.5,"endTime":1433.8,"body":"grant proposal, someone would"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1430.5,"endTime":1433.8,"body":"say, oh, no, we can't say that."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1433.86,"endTime":1437.94,"body":"So I think we need to really"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1433.86,"endTime":1437.94,"body":"explore. Why can't we say that?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1438.3,"endTime":1440.55,"body":"And what are we thinking when we"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1438.3,"endTime":1440.55,"body":"say that?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1441.2,"endTime":1444.38,"body":"I think you're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1441.2,"endTime":1444.38,"body":"right. And I think that, again,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1444.41,"endTime":1449.87,"body":"our sector, particularly in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1444.41,"endTime":1449.87,"body":"institutional funding, is so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1449.9,"endTime":1454.4,"body":"good at not having real"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1449.9,"endTime":1454.4,"body":"conversations. And again, making"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1454.4,"endTime":1457.91,"body":"those cognitive leaps from at"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1454.4,"endTime":1457.91,"body":"risk youth means this or"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1458.12,"endTime":1458.96,"body":"disenfranchised?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1459.02,"endTime":1461.15,"body":"No, we're not"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1459.02,"endTime":1461.15,"body":"going to really talk about what"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1461.15,"endTime":1463.22,"body":"we're talking about. Right?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1461.15,"endTime":1463.22,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1463.46,"endTime":1466.46,"body":"And so that's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1463.46,"endTime":1466.46,"body":"where you have to be really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1466.46,"endTime":1468.95,"body":"honest with yourself about how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1466.46,"endTime":1468.95,"body":"far you can push it, you know,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1468.98,"endTime":1472.01,"body":"how far what is your sphere of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1468.98,"endTime":1472.01,"body":"influence. And if you have a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1472.01,"endTime":1475.07,"body":"board chair, or an IDI or a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1472.01,"endTime":1475.07,"body":"funder, that is going to lose"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1475.07,"endTime":1478.16,"body":"their shit, then don't write"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1475.07,"endTime":1478.16,"body":"don't get fired because of this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1478.16,"endTime":1479.51,"body":"podcast, right? Don't write it."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1480.59,"endTime":1482.54,"body":"Or maybe write"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1480.59,"endTime":1482.54,"body":"it and then have a conversation"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1482.54,"endTime":1485.6,"body":"around it. Don't submit it"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1482.54,"endTime":1485.6,"body":"without getting Don't be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1485.57,"endTime":1488.93,"body":"like Catherine"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1485.57,"endTime":1488.93,"body":"said and fired. Don't do that."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1489.11,"endTime":1492.35,"body":"But think about maybe bring the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1489.11,"endTime":1492.35,"body":"guideline for conscientious"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1492.35,"endTime":1495.56,"body":"communication to the table."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1492.35,"endTime":1495.56,"body":"Maybe think about, hey, I think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1495.56,"endTime":1498.86,"body":"that we could be clear in how we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1495.56,"endTime":1498.86,"body":"talked about this. I think we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1498.86,"endTime":1501.92,"body":"could use these Statistics"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1498.86,"endTime":1501.92,"body":"instead of the ones we've been"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1501.92,"endTime":1505.52,"body":"using to paint a more"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1501.92,"endTime":1505.52,"body":"descriptive, you know, statement"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1505.52,"endTime":1508.01,"body":"of need, right? So it's a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1505.52,"endTime":1508.01,"body":"conversation and not to say"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1508.01,"endTime":1511.55,"body":"you're gonna go, you know, guns"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1508.01,"endTime":1511.55,"body":"blazing into your 80s office,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1511.58,"endTime":1515.78,"body":"but it's definitely a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1511.58,"endTime":1515.78,"body":"conversation. So that's a big"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1515.78,"endTime":1518.09,"body":"thing. And the other, the other"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1515.78,"endTime":1518.09,"body":"thing that's going to kill this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1518.09,"endTime":1521.78,"body":"whole conversation is character"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1518.09,"endTime":1521.78,"body":"counts, right? Because I'm"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1521.78,"endTime":1522.47,"body":"telling you, oh, my"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1522.47,"endTime":1526.88,"body":"oh my god, I"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1522.47,"endTime":1526.88,"body":"just got posttraumatic stress"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1527.06,"endTime":1529.97,"body":"from character counts on the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1527.06,"endTime":1529.97,"body":"online app on the online"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1529.97,"endTime":1530.78,"body":"applications."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1531.47,"endTime":1533.84,"body":"We just"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1531.47,"endTime":1533.84,"body":"submitted a grant yesterday that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1533.84,"endTime":1536.63,"body":"said, you know, describe your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1533.84,"endTime":1536.63,"body":"history, vision, mission and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1536.63,"endTime":1543.71,"body":"work 75 words. Your history. In"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1536.63,"endTime":1543.71,"body":"that case, forget everything I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1543.71,"endTime":1548.27,"body":"told you. Because if you say,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1543.71,"endTime":1548.27,"body":"you know, men and women who were"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1548.27,"endTime":1551.12,"body":"formerly incarcerated are now"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1548.27,"endTime":1551.12,"body":"experiencing homelessness,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1551.27,"endTime":1554.36,"body":"that's like half your word"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1551.27,"endTime":1554.36,"body":"count. So you might just have to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1554.36,"endTime":1557.51,"body":"put homeless and we're just"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1554.36,"endTime":1557.51,"body":"going to know that next time, we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1557.51,"endTime":1558.62,"body":"can do a little better."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1558.86,"endTime":1560.96,"body":"That's a very"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1558.86,"endTime":1560.96,"body":"interesting point that you're"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1560.96,"endTime":1564.98,"body":"bringing up because I know"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1560.96,"endTime":1564.98,"body":"Boulay of nonprofit, I've talked"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1565.01,"endTime":1570.68,"body":"a lot about this, about how the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1565.01,"endTime":1570.68,"body":"funders do think that they are"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1570.68,"endTime":1574.58,"body":"somehow doing us a favor with"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1570.68,"endTime":1574.58,"body":"these character counts. But then"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1574.64,"endTime":1578.51,"body":"we're not having this universal"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1574.64,"endTime":1578.51,"body":"language. We're not having this"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1578.51,"endTime":1583.07,"body":"universal template that we can"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1578.51,"endTime":1583.07,"body":"all work from. And it's hours of"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1583.07,"endTime":1587.39,"body":"molding your particular grant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1583.07,"endTime":1587.39,"body":"proposal into this person's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1587.39,"endTime":1589.19,"body":"template and this person's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1587.39,"endTime":1589.19,"body":"template and this person's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1589.19,"endTime":1593.57,"body":"template, which the time that"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1589.19,"endTime":1593.57,"body":"that takes and that's what you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1593.57,"endTime":1598.25,"body":"do, all day in and out every"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1593.57,"endTime":1598.25,"body":"day. So I know you see that. So"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1598.25,"endTime":1600.71,"body":"what would what do we say to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1598.25,"endTime":1600.71,"body":"funders, if they're listening,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1601.04,"endTime":1603.59,"body":"what do we say to some some"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1601.04,"endTime":1603.59,"body":"grantmakers if they're in a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1603.59,"endTime":1604.64,"body":"grantmakers listening?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1605.0,"endTime":1607.19,"body":"Yes. Well,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1605.0,"endTime":1607.19,"body":"thank you for listening and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1607.19,"endTime":1610.64,"body":"being part of this conversation."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1607.19,"endTime":1610.64,"body":"And I love that you brought that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1610.64,"endTime":1613.1,"body":"up, because we do do this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1610.64,"endTime":1613.1,"body":"workshop we started with, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1613.1,"endTime":1616.52,"body":"know, grant writers are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1613.1,"endTime":1616.52,"body":"essentially cat herders, right?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1617.06,"endTime":1620.6,"body":"We because the number one"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1617.06,"endTime":1620.6,"body":"challenge we have is this funder"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1620.6,"endTime":1624.32,"body":"expectations, deadlines mean,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1620.6,"endTime":1624.32,"body":"ridiculous deadlines, ridiculous"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1624.32,"endTime":1626.81,"body":"character counts, ridiculous"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1624.32,"endTime":1626.81,"body":"questions, and then the internal"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1626.81,"endTime":1631.37,"body":"politics of your organization."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1626.81,"endTime":1631.37,"body":"So I get why when you are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1631.37,"endTime":1634.31,"body":"dealing with all of that, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1631.37,"endTime":1634.31,"body":"you don't have any brain cells"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1634.31,"endTime":1637.07,"body":"left to right level of time,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1634.31,"endTime":1637.07,"body":"you're going to fall back on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1637.07,"endTime":1640.04,"body":"your old language, totally been"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1637.07,"endTime":1640.04,"body":"there, done that, and probably"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1640.04,"endTime":1644.75,"body":"still do it. So I think for"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1640.04,"endTime":1644.75,"body":"funders, it really is being part"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1645.05,"endTime":1648.05,"body":"of these conversations. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1645.05,"endTime":1648.05,"body":"think there are a lot of funders"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1648.05,"endTime":1652.43,"body":"nationally that are talking"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1648.05,"endTime":1652.43,"body":"about how to make their process"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1652.43,"endTime":1656.63,"body":"more equitable and more"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1652.43,"endTime":1656.63,"body":"accessible to nonprofits. And if"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1656.63,"endTime":1660.32,"body":"you're a funder, wondering how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1656.63,"endTime":1660.32,"body":"to do that, I would say, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1660.32,"endTime":1662.96,"body":"know, look at your local AFP"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1660.32,"endTime":1662.96,"body":"chapter and see who's doing this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1662.96,"endTime":1666.26,"body":"work. Look at the community"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1662.96,"endTime":1666.26,"body":"centric fundraising chapters"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1666.29,"endTime":1669.89,"body":"movement, the slack group is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1666.29,"endTime":1669.89,"body":"wide open. And there are funders"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1669.89,"endTime":1672.08,"body":"in there having these"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1669.89,"endTime":1672.08,"body":"conversations, I've seen them"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1672.08,"endTime":1676.88,"body":"and it's fabulous. But I do"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1672.08,"endTime":1676.88,"body":"think all of this takes putting"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1676.88,"endTime":1680.75,"body":"aside a lot of ego on all sides."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1676.88,"endTime":1680.75,"body":"I know for me, right, I have an"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1680.75,"endTime":1684.47,"body":"English degree, I think I'm a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1680.75,"endTime":1684.47,"body":"pretty good writer. And it is so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1684.47,"endTime":1688.61,"body":"hard to challenge assumptions"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1684.47,"endTime":1688.61,"body":"and timelines and client"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1688.61,"endTime":1691.43,"body":"expectations and find our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1688.61,"endTime":1691.43,"body":"expectations and come to the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1691.43,"endTime":1694.85,"body":"core of this, which is why it is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1691.43,"endTime":1694.85,"body":"iterative. And it is ongoing,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1694.85,"endTime":1697.22,"body":"because we're certainly not"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1694.85,"endTime":1697.22,"body":"going to solve any of this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1697.22,"endTime":1697.85,"body":"overnight."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1698.54,"endTime":1701.66,"body":"What I love"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1698.54,"endTime":1701.66,"body":"about your particular your"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1701.66,"endTime":1703.94,"body":"company and the things that you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1701.66,"endTime":1703.94,"body":"teach and things you write"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1703.94,"endTime":1708.29,"body":"about, you talk about bringing"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1703.94,"endTime":1708.29,"body":"in the voices of your community,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1708.65,"endTime":1711.65,"body":"how do you think we can best do"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1708.65,"endTime":1711.65,"body":"this as grant writers."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1712.49,"endTime":1717.74,"body":"So in addition"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1712.49,"endTime":1717.74,"body":"to educating ourselves on people"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1717.74,"endTime":1721.07,"body":"verse identity, first language"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1717.74,"endTime":1721.07,"body":"and how groups self identify,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1721.07,"endTime":1724.73,"body":"and how we can just become"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1721.07,"endTime":1724.73,"body":"stronger writers, you know,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1724.73,"endTime":1727.79,"body":"stronger writers about social"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1724.73,"endTime":1727.79,"body":"and economic and racial justice,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1728.09,"endTime":1732.2,"body":"I think we can get specific in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1728.09,"endTime":1732.2,"body":"our systems and how we talk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1732.47,"endTime":1736.07,"body":"about and to our people by"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1732.47,"endTime":1736.07,"body":"bringing in some concepts of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1736.07,"endTime":1739.49,"body":"ethical storytelling, which is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1736.07,"endTime":1739.49,"body":"another area where I just feel"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1739.49,"endTime":1743.99,"body":"incredibly privileged to have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1739.49,"endTime":1743.99,"body":"learned from fabulous"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1743.99,"endTime":1746.12,"body":"storytellers and fabulous"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1743.99,"endTime":1746.12,"body":"communicators, and I'll make"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1746.12,"endTime":1750.59,"body":"sure that we have that available"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1746.12,"endTime":1750.59,"body":"in the show notes for y'all. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1750.59,"endTime":1754.34,"body":"so I think another area were"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1750.59,"endTime":1754.34,"body":"fundraising in general, grant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1754.34,"endTime":1760.34,"body":"writing, annual appeals, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1754.34,"endTime":1760.34,"body":"name it is very, very harmful is"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1760.34,"endTime":1764.33,"body":"when we just tell stories about"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1760.34,"endTime":1764.33,"body":"people without thinking about"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1764.33,"endTime":1768.83,"body":"why and how we're telling the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1764.33,"endTime":1768.83,"body":"story. I love using stories and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1768.83,"endTime":1771.56,"body":"grants, and I am that person"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1768.83,"endTime":1771.56,"body":"where if they say anything else"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1771.56,"endTime":1774.23,"body":"you want us to know about how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1771.56,"endTime":1774.23,"body":"many characters do I have, okay,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1774.23,"endTime":1777.26,"body":"like, let's find a story, right?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1774.23,"endTime":1777.26,"body":"Anytime you give me an extra"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1777.26,"endTime":1779.54,"body":"character count, I'm going to be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1777.26,"endTime":1779.54,"body":"putting a quote or a story in"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1779.54,"endTime":1785.63,"body":"there because I think the people"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1779.54,"endTime":1785.63,"body":"with whom we work are so much"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1785.63,"endTime":1787.82,"body":"more exciting and important than"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1785.63,"endTime":1787.82,"body":"anything we could say about our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1787.82,"endTime":1793.28,"body":"organization. Right? They are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1787.82,"endTime":1793.28,"body":"the magic sauce. But if you are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1793.28,"endTime":1796.25,"body":"just going to your program"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1793.28,"endTime":1796.25,"body":"manager and this was Catherine"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1796.28,"endTime":1799.31,"body":"10 years ago, and I still cringe"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1796.28,"endTime":1799.31,"body":"and say I need a story for this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1799.31,"endTime":1802.58,"body":"grant. Can you get me one and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1799.31,"endTime":1802.58,"body":"they come back and they say, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1802.58,"endTime":1805.28,"body":"know, Susie was a 10th grader at"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1802.58,"endTime":1805.28,"body":"this school and blah, blah,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1805.28,"endTime":1810.83,"body":"blah. And these very personal,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1805.28,"endTime":1810.83,"body":"very intense stories. It's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1810.83,"endTime":1815.36,"body":"incredibly exploitative. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1810.83,"endTime":1815.36,"body":"always ask people, and this was"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1815.36,"endTime":1818.33,"body":"something that I have heard from"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1815.36,"endTime":1818.33,"body":"other speakers and other"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1818.33,"endTime":1822.71,"body":"coaches, and even funders and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1818.33,"endTime":1822.71,"body":"nonprofits themselves. If you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1822.71,"endTime":1826.22,"body":"found out someone was using your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1822.71,"endTime":1826.22,"body":"story, without your consent, how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1826.22,"endTime":1826.82,"body":"would you feel?"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1827.689,"endTime":1830.929,"body":"I think what's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1827.689,"endTime":1830.929,"body":"so interesting about that is the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1830.929,"endTime":1835.489,"body":"Donors Choose method that I've"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1830.929,"endTime":1835.489,"body":"been reading a lot about. They"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1835.489,"endTime":1840.529,"body":"do everything in terms of asset"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1835.489,"endTime":1840.529,"body":"framing. And they always train"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1840.529,"endTime":1842.749,"body":"people that when they're raising"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1840.529,"endTime":1842.749,"body":"money and Donors Choose, they"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1842.749,"endTime":1848.119,"body":"say, would the people in your"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1842.749,"endTime":1848.119,"body":"classroom be proud to share this"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1848.119,"endTime":1852.349,"body":"story? Or would they be"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1848.119,"endTime":1852.349,"body":"embarrassed about how you talked"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1852.349,"endTime":1854.569,"body":"about the classroom? How you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1852.349,"endTime":1854.569,"body":"talked about the school? Because"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1854.569,"endTime":1857.389,"body":"donors chooses teachers raising"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1854.569,"endTime":1857.389,"body":"money for their classroom? Most"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1857.419,"endTime":1860.809,"body":"most of the time? So I love what"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1857.419,"endTime":1860.809,"body":"you said, it's sort of like,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1860.839,"endTime":1864.379,"body":"would they be proud to share it"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1860.839,"endTime":1864.379,"body":"on their social media channels?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1865.07,"endTime":1866.45,"body":"And is that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1865.07,"endTime":1866.45,"body":"the story they would choose to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1866.45,"endTime":1870.2,"body":"tell? Because I promise they"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1866.45,"endTime":1870.2,"body":"have a story to tell. And so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1870.2,"endTime":1872.63,"body":"logistically, and again, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1870.2,"endTime":1872.63,"body":"know, if we're sitting here"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1872.63,"endTime":1876.65,"body":"going, Okay, what, what can we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1872.63,"endTime":1876.65,"body":"do, this will be a system change"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1876.65,"endTime":1879.08,"body":"for letter nonprofits. And it's"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1876.65,"endTime":1879.08,"body":"one that I'm still working with"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1879.08,"endTime":1885.2,"body":"my clients ask permission before"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1879.08,"endTime":1885.2,"body":"using stories, which takes time,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1885.56,"endTime":1888.05,"body":"you have to email them, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1885.56,"endTime":1888.05,"body":"they're not going to email you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1888.05,"endTime":1890.27,"body":"back. And then you have to email"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1888.05,"endTime":1890.27,"body":"them again. And then you have to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1890.27,"endTime":1893.06,"body":"find time to interview them."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1890.27,"endTime":1893.06,"body":"It's going to take time, and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1893.06,"endTime":1895.46,"body":"you're going to feel like but I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1893.06,"endTime":1895.46,"body":"have this grant to tomorrow,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1895.46,"endTime":1899.06,"body":"right? So again, a process, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1895.46,"endTime":1899.06,"body":"can do it, maybe you can do it"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1899.06,"endTime":1903.11,"body":"next quarter, but ask"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1899.06,"endTime":1903.11,"body":"permission. And as a writer,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1903.5,"endTime":1906.2,"body":"that is truly my favorite part"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1903.5,"endTime":1906.2,"body":"of writing a grant is when I can"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1906.2,"endTime":1910.01,"body":"interview constituents. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1906.2,"endTime":1910.01,"body":"always use very, very open ended"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1910.01,"endTime":1912.26,"body":"questions, you know, tell me"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1910.01,"endTime":1912.26,"body":"about yourself, tell me about"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1912.29,"endTime":1917.06,"body":"whatever organization right, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1912.29,"endTime":1917.06,"body":"know, and the power, I get"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1917.06,"endTime":1920.93,"body":"chills, the power, the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1917.06,"endTime":1920.93,"body":"excitement, and the intensity of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1920.93,"endTime":1924.41,"body":"the stories are incredible. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1920.93,"endTime":1924.41,"body":"going back to when we talked"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1924.41,"endTime":1926.81,"body":"about, you know, how we might be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1924.41,"endTime":1926.81,"body":"uncomfortable getting very"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1926.81,"endTime":1932.36,"body":"specific about who we're talking"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1926.81,"endTime":1932.36,"body":"about. People get very, very"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1932.39,"endTime":1935.09,"body":"open when they feel empowered to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1932.39,"endTime":1935.09,"body":"tell their story."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1935.959,"endTime":1937.489,"body":"And when they"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1935.959,"endTime":1937.489,"body":"feel like the story doesn't"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1937.489,"endTime":1938.629,"body":"define who they are."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1939.049,"endTime":1941.209,"body":"And it's this"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1939.049,"endTime":1941.209,"body":"incredible part of their journey"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1941.209,"endTime":1943.789,"body":"and an incredible obstacle that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1941.209,"endTime":1943.789,"body":"they overcame. And they're the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1943.789,"endTime":1947.029,"body":"starring role of this, you know,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1943.789,"endTime":1947.029,"body":"when your nonprofit was sort of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1947.029,"endTime":1951.049,"body":"the, you know, the support Best"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1947.029,"endTime":1951.049,"body":"Supporting Actress and I had a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1951.049,"endTime":1954.109,"body":"woman that I was interviewing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1951.049,"endTime":1954.109,"body":"for an organization that works"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1954.169,"endTime":1957.859,"body":"in the mental health space. And"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1954.169,"endTime":1957.859,"body":"I was really, you know, probably"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1957.859,"endTime":1959.929,"body":"assuming I was going to some"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1957.859,"endTime":1959.929,"body":"touchy feely stories about how"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1959.929,"endTime":1963.169,"body":"we sort of had a general crisis"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1959.929,"endTime":1963.169,"body":"and blah, blah, blah, she got on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1963.169,"endTime":1966.049,"body":"the phone and about 30 seconds"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1963.169,"endTime":1966.049,"body":"and was like, and then my son,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1966.409,"endTime":1968.419,"body":"and I feel comfortable sharing"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1966.409,"endTime":1968.419,"body":"this because she did my son"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1968.419,"endTime":1971.719,"body":"stabbed a kid in the eye with"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1968.419,"endTime":1971.719,"body":"scissors and got expelled. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1971.719,"endTime":1974.119,"body":"had a complete breakdown,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1971.719,"endTime":1974.119,"body":"because I had no idea what to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1974.119,"endTime":1979.069,"body":"do. And I felt like a terrible"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1974.119,"endTime":1979.069,"body":"mom, I never would have assumed"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1979.069,"endTime":1982.489,"body":"that that would be a story that"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1979.069,"endTime":1982.489,"body":"I would share. But that was her"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1982.489,"endTime":1985.039,"body":"story to tell because she needed"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1982.489,"endTime":1985.039,"body":"to tell it."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1985.93,"endTime":1987.73,"body":"She needed to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1985.93,"endTime":1987.73,"body":"tell it. This has been"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1987.73,"endTime":1991.87,"body":"wonderful. So the last I guess"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1987.73,"endTime":1991.87,"body":"the last question I would ask"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1991.87,"endTime":1994.09,"body":"you, there's so many, I think we"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1991.87,"endTime":1994.09,"body":"need to do 10 more."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1994.87,"endTime":1996.16,"body":"We could talk"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":1994.87,"endTime":1996.16,"body":"about this forever,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1996.0,"endTime":1999.06,"body":"We definitely"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1996.0,"endTime":1999.06,"body":"need to talk just the basics of"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1999.06,"endTime":2002.6,"body":"grant writing at some point. But"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":1999.06,"endTime":2002.6,"body":"that's another episode. But what"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2002.6,"endTime":2005.21,"body":"are some of the trends that you"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2002.6,"endTime":2005.21,"body":"see? What are some of the grant,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2005.21,"endTime":2008.03,"body":"you've got your finger on the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2005.21,"endTime":2008.03,"body":"pulse of grant writing? What do"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2008.03,"endTime":2013.25,"body":"you see in terms of funders and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2008.03,"endTime":2013.25,"body":"foundations and is giving up is"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2013.25,"endTime":2015.74,"body":"giving down or what do they want"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2013.25,"endTime":2015.74,"body":"to see"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2016.52,"endTime":2018.95,"body":"two trends"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2016.52,"endTime":2018.95,"body":"that I've seen over the last few"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2018.95,"endTime":2023.9,"body":"years is I think giving isn't"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2018.95,"endTime":2023.9,"body":"necessarily up or down as much"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2023.9,"endTime":2031.85,"body":"as contracted to really focus on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2023.9,"endTime":2031.85,"body":"renewals. And I think that was a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2031.85,"endTime":2034.28,"body":"result of the pandemic. And I"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2031.85,"endTime":2034.28,"body":"think, you know, for those of us"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2034.28,"endTime":2036.14,"body":"who were fortunate enough to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2034.28,"endTime":2036.14,"body":"continue to receive"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2036.14,"endTime":2040.16,"body":"institutional fundraising during"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2036.14,"endTime":2040.16,"body":"2020 2021, there were a lot of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2040.16,"endTime":2042.8,"body":"funders just saying, Hey, we're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2040.16,"endTime":2042.8,"body":"just automatically going to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2042.8,"endTime":2045.14,"body":"renew your grant. Don't worry"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2042.8,"endTime":2045.14,"body":"about it, just give us an"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2045.14,"endTime":2048.95,"body":"update, which was such a gift."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2045.14,"endTime":2048.95,"body":"And equally as much. I've seen a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2048.95,"endTime":2052.46,"body":"lot of funders now saying we're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2048.95,"endTime":2052.46,"body":"not opening our portfolio to new"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2052.46,"endTime":2054.89,"body":"funders right now. We really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2052.46,"endTime":2054.89,"body":"want to make sure that we're"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2054.89,"endTime":2058.46,"body":"continuing to invest in our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2054.89,"endTime":2058.46,"body":"current fundies, which is,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2058.46,"endTime":2061.64,"body":"again, great if you are a"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2058.46,"endTime":2061.64,"body":"current funding, but it can be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2061.64,"endTime":2065.21,"body":"hard to find new opportunities"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2061.64,"endTime":2065.21,"body":"right now, because of the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2065.21,"endTime":2068.63,"body":"continued uncertainty of just"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2065.21,"endTime":2068.63,"body":"the world. And so I've certainly"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2068.63,"endTime":2071.27,"body":"see that as a trend. And the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2068.63,"endTime":2071.27,"body":"other trends that I've seen,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2071.27,"endTime":2075.71,"body":"which I think completely echoes"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2071.27,"endTime":2075.71,"body":"our whole conversation is the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2076.1,"endTime":2081.53,"body":"institutional focus on Dei,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2076.1,"endTime":2081.53,"body":"which, you know, podcast number"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2081.53,"endTime":2084.86,"body":"37 can be equally as"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2081.53,"endTime":2084.86,"body":"performative. Right? What's your"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2084.86,"endTime":2087.35,"body":"dei initiatives? How are you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2084.86,"endTime":2087.35,"body":"incorporating it? And so I think"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2087.35,"endTime":2093.2,"body":"that dei and inclusion and all"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2087.35,"endTime":2093.2,"body":"of that is now the big sort of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2093.2,"endTime":2097.67,"body":"buzzword topic in the sector,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2093.2,"endTime":2097.67,"body":"which it might have been, you"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2097.67,"endTime":2100.46,"body":"know, data 10 years ago, right"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2097.67,"endTime":2100.46,"body":"everyone wanted your Data 10"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2100.46,"endTime":2102.53,"body":"years ago now everyone wants to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2100.46,"endTime":2102.53,"body":"know what you're doing to be"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2102.83,"endTime":2106.97,"body":"diverse, equitable and"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2102.83,"endTime":2106.97,"body":"inclusive. So those are the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2106.97,"endTime":2109.76,"body":"trends I see. And I'm sure by"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2106.97,"endTime":2109.76,"body":"the time that we talk again,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2109.76,"endTime":2111.17,"body":"they will have completely"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2109.76,"endTime":2111.17,"body":"changed."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2111.55,"endTime":2113.41,"body":"Exactly. That's"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2111.55,"endTime":2113.41,"body":"the great thing about the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2113.41,"endTime":2117.16,"body":"sector. That's the fantastic"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2113.41,"endTime":2117.16,"body":"thing about working in the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2117.16,"endTime":2120.91,"body":"sector, the only constant is a"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2117.16,"endTime":2120.91,"body":"constant change and deadlines"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2120.97,"endTime":2125.32,"body":"and deadlines and arbitrary"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2120.97,"endTime":2125.32,"body":"character counts, we can always"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2125.32,"endTime":2130.54,"body":"count on that. So where can"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2125.32,"endTime":2130.54,"body":"people find out more about giant"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2130.54,"endTime":2132.52,"body":"squid group about you connect"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2130.54,"endTime":2132.52,"body":"with you?"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2132.7,"endTime":2136.93,"body":"Absolutely. We"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2132.7,"endTime":2136.93,"body":"are on the interwebs across the"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2136.93,"endTime":2139.72,"body":"internet at at giant squid"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2136.93,"endTime":2139.72,"body":"groups, our website is giant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2139.72,"endTime":2144.58,"body":"squid group.com, social media at"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2139.72,"endTime":2144.58,"body":"giant squid group and I'm on"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2144.58,"endTime":2148.3,"body":"LinkedIn, I would love to"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2144.58,"endTime":2148.3,"body":"connect with folks. And we have"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2148.33,"endTime":2151.09,"body":"some self paced classes if"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2148.33,"endTime":2151.09,"body":"anyone just wants to sort of"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2151.09,"endTime":2154.54,"body":"dabble in some of the things we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2151.09,"endTime":2154.54,"body":"do. One of the things that we"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2154.54,"endTime":2158.74,"body":"offer is almost all of our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2154.54,"endTime":2158.74,"body":"offerings or pay what you want."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2158.77,"endTime":2162.07,"body":"So all of our self paced"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2158.77,"endTime":2162.07,"body":"classes, our membership program,"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2162.07,"endTime":2165.28,"body":"or group coaching programs are"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2162.07,"endTime":2165.28,"body":"pay what you want. So we really"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2165.28,"endTime":2168.31,"body":"try to make it as accessible as"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2165.28,"endTime":2168.31,"body":"possible as part of our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2168.31,"endTime":2171.52,"body":"commitment to economic justice."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2168.31,"endTime":2171.52,"body":"So certainly hope that you can"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2171.55,"endTime":2173.74,"body":"download some of our templates"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2171.55,"endTime":2173.74,"body":"are come take one of our"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2173.74,"endTime":2177.22,"body":"classes, or come join our next"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2173.74,"endTime":2177.22,"body":"you know decolonizing your grant"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2177.22,"endTime":2178.18,"body":"session workshop."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2178.24,"endTime":2181.57,"body":"Yes, I will post"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2178.24,"endTime":2181.57,"body":"all of those links in the show"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2181.57,"endTime":2184.33,"body":"notes. Keep doing the amazing"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2181.57,"endTime":2184.33,"body":"work. I encourage everyone to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2184.33,"endTime":2189.19,"body":"contact Katherine and her crew,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2184.33,"endTime":2189.19,"body":"and learn more about how to"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2189.19,"endTime":2191.29,"body":"decolonize your grant writing,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2189.19,"endTime":2191.29,"body":"how to use grant writing for"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2191.29,"endTime":2195.46,"body":"social change and all of the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2191.29,"endTime":2195.46,"body":"fantastic resources on their"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2195.49,"endTime":2198.88,"body":"website and socials. So Thanks,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2195.49,"endTime":2198.88,"body":"Katherine, for joining me today."},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2199.18,"endTime":2200.98,"body":"Thank you so"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2199.18,"endTime":2200.98,"body":"much for having me, Julia. It"},{"speaker":"Catherine Ashton","startTime":2200.98,"endTime":2202.18,"body":"was absolutely a pleasure."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2209.02,"endTime":2211.6,"body":"Well, hey there,"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2209.02,"endTime":2211.6,"body":"I wanted to say thank you for"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2211.6,"endTime":2214.48,"body":"tuning into my show, and for"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2211.6,"endTime":2214.48,"body":"listening all the way to the"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2214.48,"endTime":2218.29,"body":"end. If you really enjoyed"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2214.48,"endTime":2218.29,"body":"today's conversation, make sure"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2218.29,"endTime":2221.74,"body":"to subscribe to the show and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2218.29,"endTime":2221.74,"body":"your favorite podcast app, and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2221.74,"endTime":2224.14,"body":"you'll get new episodes"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2221.74,"endTime":2224.14,"body":"downloaded as soon as they come"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2224.14,"endTime":2228.43,"body":"out. I would love if you left me"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2224.14,"endTime":2228.43,"body":"a rating or review because this"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2228.46,"endTime":2232.18,"body":"tells other people that my"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2228.46,"endTime":2232.18,"body":"podcast is worth listening to."},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2232.72,"endTime":2235.63,"body":"And then me and my guests can"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2232.72,"endTime":2235.63,"body":"reach even more earbuds and"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2235.63,"endTime":2239.29,"body":"create even more impact. So"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2235.63,"endTime":2239.29,"body":"that's pretty much it. I'll be"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2239.29,"endTime":2242.92,"body":"back soon with a brand new"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2239.29,"endTime":2242.92,"body":"episode. But until then, you can"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2242.92,"endTime":2247.27,"body":"find me on Instagram at Julia"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2242.92,"endTime":2247.27,"body":"Campbell seven seven. Keep"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2247.27,"endTime":2250.24,"body":"changing the world. Nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Julia Campbell","startTime":2247.27,"endTime":2250.24,"body":"unicorn"}]}