Heather Walker – Serving with Levity

Introducing Dr. Heather Walker – Organizational Psychologist, Levity Enthusiast, and Creative Founder/CEO/Podcast Host of Lead with Levity. In this episode, Heather helps us round out our discussion about Inclusive Service by doing what we do best here on Peoplecast… humanizing it! Tune in as we discuss:

The definition of levity
How to use levity to build authentic and meaningful connections
The importance of levity in a work setting
How to serve with levity
And much more!

MORE ABOUT LEAD WITH LEVITY

Lead with Levity LLC is a leadership consulting firm in Austin, Texas that provides executive-level insights and services, giving clients a roadmap of necessary steps toward becoming an employer of choice. We believe that people are capable of greatness beyond what they can see and know—once they have the blueprint to unlock their potential.

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Mike Cole 0:04
Hello, everyone and welcome back to Peoplecast. I'm Mike Cole, your host and with me today as always, is our co host and producer. extraordinare Jerrin Padre.

Jerrin Padre 0:14
Hello.

Mike Cole 0:15
Jerrin. Here we are again. Season two, episode eight now?

Jerrin Padre 0:20
Eight. Yeah.

Mike Cole 0:21
Incredible. Season two episode eight.

Jerrin Padre 0:24
I know I don't know where the time went. But it's about to be the holiday season, which is very exciting

Mike Cole 0:30
In the retail world, it's already the holiday season. and has been since early October.

Jerrin Padre 0:36
That's kind of like the Philippines. They start celebrating the holiday season in like August. Yeah, so retail industry and the Philippines.

Mike Cole 0:45
When do you start decorating for Christmas? If you celebrate Christmas? Sorry, I shouldn't make that assumption.

Jerrin Padre 0:50
No, that's okay. I start decorating right now. Usually once Halloween is over, because my family usually likes having the Christmas tree up. Even during Thanksgiving. So.

Mike Cole 1:03
Yeah, we are post Thanksgiving decorators. So I mean, I mean, we've—you know, we've got fall decorations and things like that and pumpkins up front, but for the Christmas season, we definitely start right after Thanksgiving. So yeah, and then it comes down. We usually take everything down like January 4th, or 5th or February or March or something like that.

Jerrin Padre 1:24
Yeah, it's like February or March for us. No, I'm absolutely serious.

Mike Cole 1:28
Okay, so lights outside and everything stay up until February or March.

Jerrin Padre 1:33
Well, at my parents house, our lights stay up year round. So they don't they don't come down.

Mike Cole 1:38
Okay, so you're those neighbors? All right.

Jerrin Padre 1:41
Yes, we are those neighbors. And then in my apartment, our Christmas tree. It's usually like a smaller Christmas tree because we can't fit a big one in here. But that will stay around through my boyfriend's birthday, which is February 7. So sometimes it'll be in our home past Valentine's Day.

Mike Cole 2:00
See? We'll probably hear from our guest here in just a moment. Get some answers to those questions and even more. Today on the show we have with us Dr. Heather Walker. Dr. Walker, how would you like to be referred to in this episode?

Heather Walker 2:15
You can call me, Heather. That's fine.

Mike Cole 2:19
Okay. Heather it is. You know, again, our show today we have Heather Walker. She is an organizational psychologist, HR professional, founder and owner of Lead with Levity. And she is also a podcast host. She is the host of the podcast called Lead with Levity. Welcome Dr. Heather Walker.

Heather Walker 2:34
Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. How are you both today?

Mike Cole 2:38
I'm doing good!

Jerrin Padre 2:39
Yeah, I'm doing pretty well.

Mike Cole 2:41
I'm under the weather. So if you you know if you notice, my tone is a little different. And I'm a little more nasal today. So but I'm getting there. I'm getting better. And that's a good thing. So. Alright, so usually, Heather, what we do when we kick off our show is we ask a few questions and Jerrin and I were talking in the intro, you're probably listening as well. When do you normally start decorating for the holidays?

Heather Walker 3:07
Oh, man, I'm really the worst to be honest with you. So we haven't done anything here yet. Typically, I will start decorating maybe the day after Thanksgiving because we celebrate Thanksgiving. So the day after, you know we're pulling out the tree and putting everything on it as an—and that was as a younger person. As an adult, though, to be honest with you, it's more like, "Alright, I'm pulling out the box." And the box sits there for two weeks. And then we slowly put up the tree and then maybe another week goes by, and then it's like, "Hey, we really need to decorate this tree, we need to put something on this tree." And so then, you know, finally, the day before Christmas or something like that, there are lights on a tree. But you know, that's as far as it goes, folks. We're not putting up lights anywhere else, or any more decorations because the tree is like enough. Like we're barely able to handle the tree right now.

Mike Cole 4:07
So here's the thing, right? If you don't do all of that, then guess what? When it comes time to take it down? No time at all. Whereas some of my neighbors, it's a two or three month process to put it up and, you know, a week long process to disassemble it and pack it all up. So I think you've got the right idea. Minimal is probably best. That way it doesn't take you as long to pack it up and put it away.

Heather Walker 4:33
Right. These days, I'm all about stress less. And you know, if you're just sitting at your in your home in your pajamas, no one else is coming over. No one else is looking at this tree, and I don't care about the tree, then I'm not putting up that tree. It's just not happening. But next year, next year. If—when the world is opened up again and we have people over and a party at the house and everything, maybe I'll make sure that I have lots and lots of decorations.

Mike Cole 5:03
Alright, so aside from the holidays, question for you that kind of deals a little bit more with our topics that we're going to talk about today.

Heather Walker 5:09
Okay.

Mike Cole 5:11
One of those questions is, when you're shopping, and you're ready to check out, leave the store and you have self checkout available or you have real cashier available. Which one do you choose?

Heather Walker 5:23
Don't judge me, okay?

Mike Cole 5:27
I feel like there's a drumroll that needs to happen here.

Jerrin Padre 5:29
No judgment!

Heather Walker 5:31
I go with the self checkout, usually, but that's because—where are y'all? Where do you live?

Jerrin Padre 5:38
I live in Los Angeles.

Heather Walker 5:39
Okay, you're in LA.

Mike Cole 5:41
And I am in Northwest Arkansas,

Heather Walker 5:43
Arkansas. Okay, cool. So, Arkansas dude, you'll understand. We have a lot of Walmart's out here. Right. And Walmart's recently made this move to basically, instead of separate checkout aisles, now they herd you all together like cattle into this massive section of self checkouts. Have did they do that in Arkansas yet?

Mike Cole 6:11
Oh, yeah. I am in the epicenter of what happens with the really big retailer. And we have a lot of test pilot stores around here that yeah, we call them stock yards. That's that's kind of how you feel. You feel herded it in and it's basically a stock yard, just kind of milling about with the other customer cattle, and you're just trying to make your way out as quickly as possible. So.

Heather Walker 6:34
Well, I'm glad we have the same impression of it. That's how it feels. So I don't really have a choice when I go to Walmart. And it's very close to my house and I shop there all the time. But because I'm so conditioned to check myself out, even though I never held a job. I feel like maybe I should add that to my resume, like cashier. For many, many years. I've done this. And I haven't gotten paid. I haven't gotten paid anything board. I've been volunteering. That's right.

Mike Cole 7:06
Okay, so self checkout. And sometimes, you know, because it's not an option, right? Because real cashier is not an option. So we got that. What about this? How about—do you prefer an audiobook? Or are you a page turner?

Heather Walker 7:21
This is gonna sound weird. The way I describe this, but I love paper, I like to write on it. I love to read things off of paper. But as a mom, I am busy. I don't have time and I will fall asleep in the middle of reading anything. So I have to listen to audiobooks.

Mike Cole 7:41
Cool. You survived, Heather. You survived the episode, you didn't hang up, you didn't disconnect. So that's a good thing.

Jerrin Padre 7:46
You did it!

Heather Walker 7:48
Are we done? That's it?

Jerrin Padre 7:50
That's it.

Mike Cole 7:53
Alright, so I'll tell you what, let's get into the meat of what we're gonna talk about today, and really want to learn a bit more about you. Now, I think we want to drill just a bit deeper and find out some questions about your past. And that sounds really bad. But I promise you, it's not ominous. It's not menacing. But so first question I have for you is, what was your first job? The first job that you made money, put it in the bank.

Heather Walker 8:19
So my first job was I worked at a library. I was like a librarians assistant. At the age of 14, I was in a special program. And it was one of those jobs where it was downtown, the downtown library. I took the public bus home. So it felt adult. And I wasn't working in the library itself. I was working in the back office like the corporate side of it. And when your library and you take an oath of silence. Right.

Mike Cole 8:50
Really? Wait, I'm sorry, back up. You take an oath of silence as a librarian.

Heather Walker 8:56
No, you don't? Well, I don't know. I didn't make it all the way through. I was just like an librarians intern or something. Maybe they do. But I'm just trying to say that in the back office they were quiet there too. It was a very quiet, peaceful environment. But one thing that I loved about it was that was my first intro to office life. And one thing I love about office life is cake. There's always cake and potlucks and snacks and I must have gained so much weight that summer because I was just constantly eating.

Jerrin Padre 9:34
I want that office life experience. That sounds great!

Heather Walker 9:38
I definitely think that it shaped who I you know, my career and all of that because I started off in an office setting and kind of continued in office settings throughout. I've never worked in, you know, like a retail environment or restaurant environment. or anything like that. So I started off there and start off with, "These are the rules." And then I ended up working in HR and HR has some pretty solid rules. So it all shaped me. It definitely did. But yeah, I started off in the library.

Jerrin Padre 10:16
You know what's wild, is our first guest of this season, Amber Cabral. Her first job was also in the library. And so she was our first episode, you're our last. It's like book ends.

Heather Walker 10:32
Yeah, that's cool!

Jerrin Padre 10:33
Yeah, it was funny, because she said that it taught her that she loves books. But she didn't necessarily love organizing them, sorting them. All the admin work that went into the library, but she did learn that she loved books, which is great.

Heather Walker 10:48
That's true. That's true. I guess. I should have said what I said differently, because that's perfect. What she said is perfect. I basically did the kid equivalent of what did you do in school? What was your favorite part of school? And I said, "Recess."

Mike Cole 11:09
So, the library job, was that—did you have that job in the same place that you grew up?

Heather Walker 11:15
Yes, it was here in Austin, Texas.

Mike Cole 11:17
So you're a native Texan?

Heather Walker 11:21
Sort of. I was born in New York. But as they like to say, my parents brought me down here as soon as they could. So I think I should probably say, I'm a native Texan. But it's hard for me to say that because, you know, the rest of my family is kind of in New York. But yeah, I was born down here. And I can say y'all with the best of them. And all y'all, and, you know, I can throw out some slang and Texas drawl and all of that. I can do all of that. So maybe maybe I am a Texan.

Jerrin Padre 11:57
You're a code switcher. You can chameleon camouflage yourself into any state or city that you live in.

Heather Walker 12:06
Oh, I like that. Yes. A code switcher.

Jerrin Padre 12:10
Yeah. So beyond working at the library. Were there any other formative childhood memories that maybe foreshadowed where you are today? Whether or not you knew it at the time?

Heather Walker 12:21
Yeah, so, when I was a little kid, my mom had a dream of—so my, my mother is from Jamaica, she came over here when she was 21. And moved to Texas for all the opportunities that were down here at the time, in the wild, wild west. And she wanted to become an engineer, which is a big thing here. And gosh, that is an awesome career in Austin, Texas, now that we've got Google and Tesla, and Apple, and just all of these big companies. So her dream was to become an engineer, and she was in school, she's in college, and she used to have all of these books that were just spread out all over the bed. All of the papers and everything—I knew my dad must have been upset. Really, really upset because there was no room for him. Like, there was enough books to cover a half side of the bed. And one of the books that she had that I really enjoyed and loved was an Intro to Psychology book. And I used to read that book—like it was a good read, you know? Not like something that you were assigned, but like, "Oh, my goodness, people are fascinating. The human mind is fascinating." Our spirits what gives us energy and joy and excitement—that totally fascinated me. So I used to read her psychology books. And I think that was way before high school. That was when I was a little kid. So I didn't know at the time that I was going to go on to become a psychologist. But I did know at that time that people are fascinating. And I want to study and understand them a little bit better.

Jerrin Padre 14:20
Yeah, I'm with you. I remember taking AP psych in high school and that was as a teenager, that was probably the best class I could have taken. I feel like they should make an Intro to Psychology class or a philosophy class mandatory. In high school, or you know, formative education just because you learn so much about introspection and yourself, your biases, just things that make interacting with other humans a little bit easier and understanding and empathizing with other humans easier. So I'm totally with you.

Heather Walker 14:53
Oh, yeah, I wish we learned so much. So much in high school, Junior high, elementary school even. Soft skills, how to communicate with other people, conflict resolution, how to take care of yourself. I mean, we had health. Health class, but that's what—I remember in health class, one day, our health teacher came out and he just was like, "Hey, y'all. You know, it wouldn't kill you to wear some deodorant every once in a while." So that's the kind of health education that I remember receiving, nothing about, you know, balance, like having balance in your life, or what to do when you get super stressed out or, you know, setting boundaries with other people and all of these skills that as adults—and even as kids—it would have been really cool. Like, I could imagine the superpowers that I would have as an adult, if I learned and got to practice all of that stuff as a child. And I think that there's more resources out there now for kids, thanks to all of these free apps, YouTube and all the free videos. So there's so many free resources out there now. And it really excites me because I think that information is just more accessible than ever before. And if you want to know, there's a way to find it. You know, where there's a will there's a way,

Jerrin Padre 16:31
Yeah, it's not just limited to a 300 page self help book at a library.

Heather Walker 16:36
Exactly.

Jerrin Padre 16:37
You can literally access the information in a 15 second video if you need it.

Heather Walker 16:42
Exactly. Yes, I live my life in 15 second bites these days. I definitely appreciate those short videos.

Jerrin Padre 16:52
So as an organizational psychologist, you can go so many different directions with that background. So how did you get to what you're currently doing today with Lead with Levity?

Heather Walker 17:04
You know, it's a really interesting question. And you're absolutely correct. And I feel like it is constantly evolving. Even though I've kind of doubled down with psychology. You're right, I can go in so many different directions. And I have squirrel syndrome. I love to go in so many different directions. But all that to say that I started to get into Lead with Levity, and levity in particular, because it's really important how we connect with each other. And going back to what I said before about just being fascinated with humans. I'm fascinated by just how we've managed to develop as a society. Each society relies so heavily on communication. Communication, understanding, and mutual trust. And when you have those things you're able to build together with other people, there's less resistance, things are easier, you can go a lot farther. So I spent some time watching teams work in different kinds of environments. And in retail and restaurant in the office setting. Wherever I am, I observe teams, and the teams that lead with levity, that had fun, that uplifted each other and supported one another. Those were the teams, not only as a customer, that I wanted to be closer to, but as a co worker that I wanted to actually work with. And so it helped with things like collaboration, it helped with my experience as a customer or as an employee. And it really served as sort of the social glue that kept things going. And that made the environment just a better place to be in. Because we all have a choice. You know, we can choose to kind of show up with our blank stares. And just like, "I'm here and I'm here to do a job." Yeah, you can show up like that. And you can be super serious and super tight and stressed—well, you're stressing everyone out when you do that. Or you can choose to be human. And that's what it's all about. So, within psychology, I mean, I focus a lot on learning and development compared to all of the other different areas that I could go in just because I care about seeing people grow. And I feel like if we can grow individually, we can show up in a better way for the people around us. And that's only going to cause ripple effects that help our community grow and help our world grow. So that's what I'm all about.

Mike Cole 19:49
So this season, Heather, has been about inclusive service. And, you said yourself, you watched teams in retail roles and in office settings. So, a question for you is what comes to mind for you when you hear the words inclusive service?

Heather Walker 20:06
Well, for me, when I think about inclusive service, I think, "You're welcome here. We thought about you, we have designed a scenario with you in mind. And we want you to have the best experience possible." So, for me one example of this that really rings true, like good case, bad case. For me, it's hair. I'll use my hair as an example. So I really enjoy what Target has been doing over the last few years, with all of their branding and messaging in the stores and the images in the stores, I feel like they are doing some work to try to be more inclusive of different body types, colors of skin, and bringing in products that celebrate people's natural hair. It doesn't have to be 100% bone straight, like how many people are born with 100% bone straight hair? I don't know. So I love that target has been making a move to celebrate curls, and to celebrate beautiful skin. And I love that. I absolutely love that. Because for me, for the longest time growing up it was I have to do all of these really barbaric things to straighten my hair so that I could fit in, in the community, at work, wherever I am. And my hair needs to like—when the wind hits it, or if there's like a little bit of breeze, it needs to move and kind of flow with the wind. And y'all don't know, it takes a lot of work to get my hair to do that. It just doesn't want to do that. So growing up, you know, we had to resort to things like chemical relaxers, and I've had chemical burns on my scalp because of that. And putting metal combs on the stove, to straighten a child's hair. And now I have a kid, I can't imagine doing that with my kid. I can't imagine putting oil on her hair and then running a hot metal comb over that, like, no, that's—what? But that's something that was accepted for a very long time. So I feel like, for me, inclusive service, it reflects where we're at as a society of also being inclusive of where people are at and what's natural for people, and understanding that that looks different for different types of people. And what's natural for me might not be natural for you, you're natural is something different than mine. And it's okay to celebrate both of those things, and offer a service that meets both of those needs. And I understand that it does take some resources to make sure that you're meeting all of those different needs. But it's entirely possible.

Jerrin Padre 23:14
Yeah, that definitely resonates. Circling back to levity really quick. Your mission statement is to support leaders who care about the environment they create with data and insights that improve levity at work. And so I just wanted to hear from you, and maybe have you talk more about the importance of levity at work, and how that plays out in a customer service setting. Like how can people serve with levity? How can people maintain levity in more stressful situations which we know happen in service industries constantly? How does that play out?

Heather Walker 23:50
Yes, it is so important. Like I said it humanizes us. And when you're working with someone—I'm going to take a second. I'm going to ask you a question. Mike, Jerrin.

Mike Cole 24:04
Okay!

Heather Walker 24:07
Yeah, I'm going to ask you a question. Would you rather work with someone who is serious all the time? Who takes on the perspective that I'm not here to make friends I'm here to get the job done? Or would you rather work with someone who is a little bit looser? Who does take time to celebrate those moments? Who is a little bit silly? And is okay with having fun at work? Which person would you rather work with?

Jerrin Padre 24:40
I mean, definitely the latter. Yeah.

Mike Cole 24:42
Yeah. I mean, I think it's a healthy dose of both. I think you have to understand, you know, when to get the work done and when, you know, serious time is. But certainly I would rather have somebody who's probably 70/30

Heather Walker 24:57
Exactly.

Mike Cole 24:58
70% light hearted fun. And then the other 30% is let's just get the job done. So that way I know—I know how to take them. Because those people who are serious all the time by the book, they tend to be hard to read. So you really don't know where you stand in my opinion.

Jerrin Padre 25:14
Yeah, definitely.

Heather Walker 25:16
Very good point. That's a very good point. And, you know, I would even maybe potentially flip that percentage. So 70% get the job done. 30% have fun. And I say that because there's this misconception when I talk about levity that, you know, we're just going to be sitting around a campfire, joking all day, not doing any work. And that's not the case at all. That's not the case at all. It's more of a mental break, if you will, allowing yourself to indulge in a joke, indulge in a light moment, and enjoy the people that are around you. To see the humorous side of a situation even. I've seen people make jokes when they're hanging a whiteboard. And they're movers, right. And they're hanging a whiteboard. And they're, they're joking about how high and, "Oh, this is way too high." And you can find the humorous side of almost anything in life. And it's really about taking a little bit of time to recognize that. So yeah, it's more of a pressure valve. If you will. Think of it like lunch, we need lunch, we need to eat. We also need levity throughout the day. And these are moments, moments that are uplifting, moments that are fun. They feel good. You feel lifted. So the next part of that question, I think, was it how?

Jerrin Padre 26:46
Yeah, how does that—how do you see that playing out in a customer service setting? Where levity can sometimes be hard to find or can really enhance an experience as well, but I just I did want to get your perspective on that. Right, right.

Heather Walker 27:01
So okay. levity is one of those things that helps reduce stress, and it improves your ability to communicate with someone else and connect with someone else. And I recently spoke to someone who is a lawyer, and he uses jokes when he meets with people, he arbitrates. And you know, sometimes in arbitration, you're you're coming in, and it can get kind of tense. And he uses the jokes to kind of lighten the mood a little bit so that people are willing to speak and willing to interact with him and each other. In a retail setting, it might be the signage that you use. So I recently traveled to Florida, and we traveled on Spirit, don't judge me. We traveled on Spirit. And on the way back, I just noticed all of the Spirit signage, I think they changed it. Instead of regular signs about safety and stuff like that. Their signage is memes. So, yeah. And it's really cool. It's silly, it makes you want to look at it and pay attention to it. And they could have gone with a serious sign. But they decided to go with memes. And that's the choice you have as an employer, or as a service provider, you can indulge in humorous moments, in lots of different ways. It could be through your scripts, it could be through the visuals that you use, or the way you deliver your service. So you know, one thing that I really appreciate—I used to live in St. Louis. And we had a Popeye's out there, where the people that were making, they're frying up the chicken, they had a song that they sang, like it was a production every time someone ordered some chicken.

Jerrin Padre 29:03
Oh my gosh.

Heather Walker 29:04
And that's something. Yeah. But it was cool. It was really cool. And it made me feel like, "Wow, if I have the choice of going to this one restaurant over here versus this restaurant where they sing and dance, and it's like a fun experience. I'm going to go to the place where I feel better because of the service that I'm getting." Because it's clear that the employees enjoy what they're doing. They weren't forced, it was something they came up with. And they were allowed to do it. So that's a part of it too. As managers, sometimes our employees will come up with really interesting out of the box ideas, and we can choose to poopoo it and say, "No get back to work." Or we can let them run with it. So Jerrin, earlier you were telling me that you know you were allowed to run with this podcast. That is awesome because you're able to bring something that's out of the box to your organization and to the world, even, because they allowed you to do that. So that's kind of how it plays out. Oftentimes, it's like an idea. And then you let that idea grow. And you water it a little bit. And if you continue to do that, over time, you're going to have a culture where people go out of their way to delight the customer, because it makes them feel good, too.

Jerrin Padre 30:34
Yeah. And like you said, I think levity makes things a little bit more human and allows people to connect.

Heather Walker 30:43
Yeah.

Jerrin Padre 30:44
And I think the purpose of, you know, this podcast, too, is humanizing a bunch of these different topics and issues. And I think levity is a huge part of that.

Heather Walker 30:54
I think so too.

Mike Cole 30:57
Yeah, I think Heather, what you've done, I mean, you've you've tied a lot of things into—and this is a shameless plug for a course that we just launched with Media Partners. But the course is called Fill the Glass. And a lot of the pieces that you talked about fall in with the objectives of that course. One of the core objectives is make it fun. And we teach that it doesn't have to be over the top, it doesn't have to be this big extravagant thing. But it's so small things like having that, you know, when somebody orders chicken, they—you know, it's a production. And I would venture to say that they probably didn't go to Popeye's corporate to get approval for that. They just did it because they know that it was, you know, something they could offer their customers that was different than the restaurant down the street. So really glad that you went some of the places that you did, because it truly does tie in with that. So I think we have a lot of good content here. Truly, a lot of what you said today is going to resonate with all of our listeners, I would venture to say. Definitely resonated with me. We really appreciate you being on the show and kind of giving your perspective around leading with levity and your perspective on inclusive customer service. I think it hits spot.

Heather Walker 32:05
Oh, thank you so much for having me. This has been a really great conversation. And I really appreciate the work that you're doing to spread the message about how we can do work differently.

Mike Cole 32:18
Oh, no, you're welcome.

Jerrin Padre 32:19
Thank you.

Mike Cole 32:20
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, to our listeners, thank you again for listening today. Our guest has been Dr. Heather Walker. Heather, if people are looking to find more information out about you, where can they go?

Heather Walker 32:33
They can go to www.leadwithlevity.com

Mike Cole 32:39
Fantastic. Again, Heather, thank you so much. And thank you everyone for listening. Tune in next time to Peoplecast!

Jerrin Padre 32:45
Bye!

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Heather Walker – Serving with Levity

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