{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.0,"endTime":3.012,"body":"I know what I want the title of"},{"startTime":0.0,"endTime":3.012,"body":"the podcast to be, which is where"},{"startTime":3.012,"endTime":4.182,"body":"are all the good Scrum masters?"},{"startTime":4.318,"endTime":6.038,"body":"Where have all the scrum masters gone?"},{"startTime":6.138,"endTime":7.458,"body":"Oh, I guess I should do an intro."},{"startTime":7.608,"endTime":8.778,"body":"welcome back to Arguing Agile."},{"startTime":8.853,"endTime":13.175,"body":"where have all the good scrum masters"},{"startTime":8.853,"endTime":13.175,"body":"gone on the unemployment line?"},{"startTime":13.245,"endTime":14.655,"body":"why are they on the unemployment line?"},{"startTime":15.975,"endTime":18.585,"body":"are, are they are the good Scrum"},{"startTime":15.975,"endTime":18.585,"body":"masters on the unemployment line?"},{"startTime":18.585,"endTime":19.515,"body":"Is that where they really are?"},{"startTime":19.515,"endTime":20.98,"body":"let's dig into this for a second."},{"startTime":20.98,"endTime":22.72,"body":"I wanna know what makes"},{"startTime":20.98,"endTime":22.72,"body":"a good scrum master."},{"startTime":22.775,"endTime":27.762,"body":"I want to know if what I'm seeing on"},{"startTime":22.775,"endTime":27.762,"body":"TikTok and YouTube telling me that I"},{"startTime":27.762,"endTime":30.895,"body":"can be a scrum master and all my dreams"},{"startTime":27.762,"endTime":30.895,"body":"have come true and make six figures"},{"startTime":30.895,"endTime":32.125,"body":"and I don't need any experience."},{"startTime":32.13,"endTime":32.575,"body":"I can just walk."},{"startTime":32.575,"endTime":33.805,"body":"I wanna know if all that stuff is true."},{"startTime":33.955,"endTime":38.245,"body":"yeah, there's, there's quite a few Scrum"},{"startTime":33.955,"endTime":38.245,"body":"masters in the unemployment line that are"},{"startTime":38.245,"endTime":41.425,"body":"good cuz we started with, you know, where"},{"startTime":38.245,"endTime":41.425,"body":"have all the goods Scrum masters gone."},{"startTime":41.655,"endTime":43.035,"body":", but there's also quite a few there."},{"startTime":43.555,"endTime":46.045,"body":"Or perhaps, how can I put this kindly?"},{"startTime":46.135,"endTime":46.705,"body":"Not so good."},{"startTime":46.795,"endTime":47.235,"body":"Not good."},{"startTime":47.24,"endTime":47.245,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":47.335,"endTime":47.785,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":48.085,"endTime":51.285,"body":"And that's because they took"},{"startTime":48.085,"endTime":51.285,"body":"their lead from social media sites"},{"startTime":51.285,"endTime":52.655,"body":"like TikTok, , whatever you have."},{"startTime":52.705,"endTime":55.405,"body":"They go to these things and"},{"startTime":52.705,"endTime":55.405,"body":"they consume stuff that they"},{"startTime":55.405,"endTime":59.305,"body":"see there , in all earnestness."},{"startTime":59.305,"endTime":59.935,"body":"Is that a word?"},{"startTime":60.235,"endTime":62.365,"body":"Uh, anyway, they consume it seriously."},{"startTime":62.365,"endTime":62.545,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":62.545,"endTime":63.355,"body":"They take it seriously."},{"startTime":63.36,"endTime":66.205,"body":"Ayo is back on the podcast today"},{"startTime":63.36,"endTime":66.205,"body":"to talk about scrum master things."},{"startTime":66.358,"endTime":70.088,"body":"He finally invited me it's always"},{"startTime":66.358,"endTime":70.088,"body":"more than meets the eye, right?"},{"startTime":70.088,"endTime":73.298,"body":"So this is, this goes deeper"},{"startTime":70.088,"endTime":73.298,"body":"than just that superficial slice."},{"startTime":74.158,"endTime":75.568,"body":"let's dig into the first question."},{"startTime":75.778,"endTime":75.958,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":75.958,"endTime":77.758,"body":"I, I saw a lot of videos today."},{"startTime":78.178,"endTime":79.618,"body":"I surfed a lot of TikTok today."},{"startTime":79.678,"endTime":80.548,"body":"Do you surf TikTok?"},{"startTime":81.028,"endTime":85.928,"body":"I, I feel, you can't surf it if"},{"startTime":81.028,"endTime":85.928,"body":"it's forcibly being served to you."},{"startTime":86.308,"endTime":86.438,"body":"Served to you."},{"startTime":86.438,"endTime":87.098,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":87.098,"endTime":87.1,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"startTime":87.105,"endTime":87.188,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":87.193,"endTime":89.348,"body":"I, I've been served a lot of bad."},{"startTime":89.693,"endTime":94.923,"body":"TikTok today, that tells me that I can"},{"startTime":89.693,"endTime":94.923,"body":"be a successful scrum master and make six"},{"startTime":94.923,"endTime":99.878,"body":"figures with a two day certification that"},{"startTime":94.923,"endTime":99.878,"body":"cost me a couple hundred bucks and 2 99."},{"startTime":99.883,"endTime":101.568,"body":"And no, and no, no experience."},{"startTime":102.123,"endTime":104.073,"body":"So what, what's, what's"},{"startTime":102.123,"endTime":104.073,"body":"your hot take on that?"},{"startTime":104.073,"endTime":105.423,"body":"And please don't make me defend this"},{"startTime":107.583,"endTime":108.873,"body":"."},{"startTime":107.583,"endTime":108.873,"body":"Well, you know, it, it is."},{"startTime":109.323,"endTime":110.883,"body":"You get what you, what you get."},{"startTime":110.888,"endTime":114.183,"body":"I mean, you go to a restaurant like that,"},{"startTime":110.888,"endTime":114.183,"body":"you get served things at you, right?"},{"startTime":114.183,"endTime":115.593,"body":"Like you need a different restaurant."},{"startTime":115.863,"endTime":117.663,"body":"TikTok has no filters."},{"startTime":117.663,"endTime":119.673,"body":"Like you can just put up"},{"startTime":117.663,"endTime":119.673,"body":"whatever you like there."},{"startTime":119.673,"endTime":122.253,"body":"Nobody's validating it,"},{"startTime":119.673,"endTime":122.253,"body":"nobody's challenging it."},{"startTime":122.523,"endTime":123.393,"body":"Just like real life."},{"startTime":123.393,"endTime":124.113,"body":"Just like real life."},{"startTime":124.273,"endTime":125.853,"body":". So you got these people"},{"startTime":124.273,"endTime":125.853,"body":"saying, that's a good thing."},{"startTime":126.313,"endTime":128.893,"body":"Buy my certification class at 299."},{"startTime":129.658,"endTime":132.138,"body":"And you'll get a job tomorrow."},{"startTime":132.358,"endTime":132.898,"body":"Not tomorrow."},{"startTime":132.898,"endTime":133.648,"body":"Cause it's two days."},{"startTime":133.708,"endTime":133.858,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":134.188,"endTime":139.768,"body":"Two days from now you'll get a job"},{"startTime":134.188,"endTime":139.768,"body":"that will pay you 150,000 enticing"},{"startTime":139.773,"endTime":141.268,"body":"for those that enter the field."},{"startTime":141.358,"endTime":143.908,"body":"Oh, by the way, don't worry, if you"},{"startTime":141.358,"endTime":143.908,"body":"have no experience, you don't need it."},{"startTime":144.148,"endTime":147.658,"body":"I'll teach you everything you need to know"},{"startTime":144.148,"endTime":147.658,"body":"and then you'll have that certification."},{"startTime":147.663,"endTime":149.398,"body":"New brandish in front"},{"startTime":147.663,"endTime":149.398,"body":"of recruiters, right?"},{"startTime":150.118,"endTime":150.358,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":150.358,"endTime":154.018,"body":"So there's a lot of that"},{"startTime":150.358,"endTime":154.018,"body":"bad scrum, information."},{"startTime":154.023,"endTime":155.128,"body":"I was gonna say bad advice."},{"startTime":155.128,"endTime":156.568,"body":"Bad advice, bad career advice."},{"startTime":156.568,"endTime":157.678,"body":"Definitely bad advice."},{"startTime":157.683,"endTime":158.638,"body":"Bad, bad life coaching."},{"startTime":158.938,"endTime":160.018,"body":"Be careful where you shop."},{"startTime":160.138,"endTime":161.018,"body":"I guess our coach."},{"startTime":161.324,"endTime":162.854,"body":"so I two, my two follow up questions."},{"startTime":162.854,"endTime":164.564,"body":"Why are there so many, I don't"},{"startTime":162.854,"endTime":164.564,"body":"know if you really answered any of"},{"startTime":164.564,"endTime":165.604,"body":"my questions, but that I didn't."},{"startTime":165.744,"endTime":167.984,"body":"The why are there so many of them?"},{"startTime":167.984,"endTime":169.304,"body":"Number one, why are there so many of them?"},{"startTime":169.304,"endTime":173.114,"body":"And number two, if they're all"},{"startTime":169.304,"endTime":173.114,"body":"like peddling wares,   are there"},{"startTime":173.114,"endTime":174.584,"body":"really that many people buying?"},{"startTime":175.214,"endTime":177.704,"body":"that, that to, to prop up in"},{"startTime":175.214,"endTime":177.704,"body":"a whole industry like this."},{"startTime":178.864,"endTime":181.424,"body":"There are, why There's so many, why"},{"startTime":178.864,"endTime":181.424,"body":"do you I, I think there are, I think"},{"startTime":181.424,"endTime":186.044,"body":"there are a lot of, because I do know"},{"startTime":181.424,"endTime":186.044,"body":"of a lot of people who are doing it."},{"startTime":186.914,"endTime":191.324,"body":"So, because ever since the"},{"startTime":186.914,"endTime":191.324,"body":"covid and everything, people"},{"startTime":191.329,"endTime":192.464,"body":"want to do something different."},{"startTime":192.469,"endTime":194.264,"body":"People wanna make more money and do less."},{"startTime":194.474,"endTime":194.504,"body":"Mm."},{"startTime":194.924,"endTime":197.744,"body":"So it all depends on how"},{"startTime":194.924,"endTime":197.744,"body":"they are peddling it."},{"startTime":198.044,"endTime":202.404,"body":"Cause mostly app peddling it as, Hey,"},{"startTime":198.044,"endTime":202.404,"body":"just like I said, you don't have to have"},{"startTime":202.404,"endTime":205.614,"body":"a degree, you don't have to know nothing."},{"startTime":205.704,"endTime":208.374,"body":"I would teach you everything"},{"startTime":205.704,"endTime":208.374,"body":"you need to know, and you're"},{"startTime":208.379,"endTime":211.104,"body":"gonna make this amazing money."},{"startTime":211.204,"endTime":213.724,"body":"So who would not buy that?"},{"startTime":213.724,"endTime":217.864,"body":"If you were not where you are now and"},{"startTime":213.724,"endTime":217.864,"body":"someone says, I'm gonna guarantee."},{"startTime":218.659,"endTime":224.179,"body":"You're gonna get a job paying you"},{"startTime":218.659,"endTime":224.179,"body":"one 10 to one 50 knowing nothing but"},{"startTime":224.179,"endTime":227.119,"body":"what I just taught you, no degrees."},{"startTime":227.629,"endTime":232.159,"body":"Cuz before in order to get a job making"},{"startTime":227.629,"endTime":232.159,"body":"80,000, you have to get a master's."},{"startTime":232.462,"endTime":236.482,"body":"Now you don't even need a"},{"startTime":232.462,"endTime":236.482,"body":"community college, AS or AA degree."},{"startTime":237.052,"endTime":241.372,"body":"I teach you in two days for 300 bucks."},{"startTime":241.582,"endTime":244.792,"body":"Actually 2 99, 99 or penny less."},{"startTime":244.792,"endTime":246.562,"body":"I was gonna say, I don't know, I don't"},{"startTime":244.792,"endTime":246.562,"body":"know where all these certifications are."},{"startTime":246.562,"endTime":249.202,"body":"My, my certification was way"},{"startTime":246.562,"endTime":249.202,"body":"more expensive than 2 99."},{"startTime":249.202,"endTime":249.502,"body":"Yes."},{"startTime":249.502,"endTime":252.862,"body":"If I was gonna do that for"},{"startTime":249.502,"endTime":252.862,"body":"you,  what's there to lose."},{"startTime":252.862,"endTime":255.202,"body":"But 2 99, right?"},{"startTime":256.462,"endTime":258.862,"body":"If you lose 2 99 and you get a job, fine."},{"startTime":258.862,"endTime":260.272,"body":"If you lose 2 99, you don't get a job."},{"startTime":260.752,"endTime":261.472,"body":"That's also fine."},{"startTime":261.472,"endTime":261.772,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":261.772,"endTime":263.662,"body":"So you're making a very compelling case."},{"startTime":263.662,"endTime":267.102,"body":"I'm I'm almost bought into this  and"},{"startTime":263.662,"endTime":267.102,"body":"I hang up, buy his credit card next."},{"startTime":267.102,"endTime":267.312,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":267.312,"endTime":267.702,"body":"You watch."},{"startTime":267.797,"endTime":269.027,"body":"It's the old promise though, right?"},{"startTime":269.267,"endTime":272.547,"body":"You know, it's like anything it"},{"startTime":269.267,"endTime":272.547,"body":"used to have these years ago too."},{"startTime":272.772,"endTime":274.932,"body":"You know, buy my course right?"},{"startTime":275.172,"endTime":277.872,"body":"Real estate or you know, investments."},{"startTime":277.902,"endTime":278.112,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":278.112,"endTime":281.562,"body":"Buy my course and you'll be a"},{"startTime":278.112,"endTime":281.562,"body":"millionaire in two months, three months."},{"startTime":281.622,"endTime":281.952,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"startTime":281.952,"endTime":283.302,"body":"Buy my course only 1500 bucks."},{"startTime":283.352,"endTime":284.672,"body":"Network marketing, same thing."},{"startTime":284.672,"endTime":285.752,"body":"It's quite 200 network marketer."},{"startTime":285.757,"endTime":285.822,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":285.822,"endTime":287.442,"body":"That's that network marketing scheme."},{"startTime":287.832,"endTime":288.102,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":288.212,"endTime":288.632,"body":"Mlm."},{"startTime":289.632,"endTime":290.772,"body":"This running burnt carbs."},{"startTime":290.862,"endTime":292.122,"body":"No it doesn't burn cars."},{"startTime":293.217,"endTime":295.407,"body":"Is this the same thing as that"},{"startTime":293.217,"endTime":295.407,"body":"dude on YouTube being like"},{"startTime":295.412,"endTime":296.637,"body":"running doesn't burn cars."},{"startTime":296.637,"endTime":299.607,"body":"I was like, I, I think"},{"startTime":296.637,"endTime":299.607,"body":"running burns everything."},{"startTime":299.607,"endTime":302.057,"body":"I think it just, if you just"},{"startTime":299.607,"endTime":302.057,"body":"keep running like Forrest Gump,"},{"startTime":302.072,"endTime":303.147,"body":"I think you'll lose weight."},{"startTime":303.147,"endTime":303.927,"body":"Definitely will."},{"startTime":303.977,"endTime":304.277,"body":"I don't know."},{"startTime":304.277,"endTime":305.267,"body":"I think it does work, man."},{"startTime":305.327,"endTime":307.067,"body":"Like I, I'm gonna push back against that."},{"startTime":307.367,"endTime":310.187,"body":"Well that was well thanks for coming"},{"startTime":307.367,"endTime":310.187,"body":"to the podcast, . We figured we"},{"startTime":310.187,"endTime":312.167,"body":"figured it out running Burns calories."},{"startTime":312.235,"endTime":317.615,"body":"If 2 99 gave you co blanche to go into"},{"startTime":312.235,"endTime":317.615,"body":"an organization and practice Scrum"},{"startTime":317.615,"endTime":320.195,"body":"Mastery, you are in for a rude awakening."},{"startTime":320.2,"endTime":324.485,"body":"When you do get that job, if you get"},{"startTime":320.2,"endTime":324.485,"body":"that job right, you're not gonna be"},{"startTime":324.485,"endTime":329.045,"body":"able to successfully do anything because"},{"startTime":324.485,"endTime":329.045,"body":"you've just had, you know, two days of"},{"startTime":329.045,"endTime":330.905,"body":"dubious quality stuff thrown at you."},{"startTime":331.295,"endTime":336.245,"body":"Um, and then you are given this piece of"},{"startTime":331.295,"endTime":336.245,"body":"paper that practically is worth nothing."},{"startTime":336.425,"endTime":339.605,"body":"Well, it's worth 2 99 to you, I guess, cuz"},{"startTime":336.425,"endTime":339.605,"body":"you, that's what you shouted out for it."},{"startTime":339.61,"endTime":339.755,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":340.265,"endTime":343.175,"body":"I doubt if there's a good"},{"startTime":340.265,"endTime":343.175,"body":"ROI on it, to be honest."},{"startTime":343.275,"endTime":346.425,"body":"If my team were to hire"},{"startTime":343.275,"endTime":346.425,"body":"a scrum master, right?"},{"startTime":346.425,"endTime":347.895,"body":"And then it was like,"},{"startTime":346.425,"endTime":347.895,"body":"Brian, congratulations."},{"startTime":347.895,"endTime":348.795,"body":"You're getting a scrum master."},{"startTime":349.005,"endTime":352.755,"body":"The things that I would be looking for"},{"startTime":349.005,"endTime":352.755,"body":"and the things that Look, forget, forget"},{"startTime":352.755,"endTime":358.665,"body":"Brian, the product manager, Brian,"},{"startTime":352.755,"endTime":358.665,"body":"the leader in an organization, right?"},{"startTime":358.905,"endTime":359.715,"body":"The business leader."},{"startTime":360.135,"endTime":364.575,"body":"I'm looking for someone to come"},{"startTime":360.135,"endTime":364.575,"body":"in who has skill and experience"},{"startTime":365.175,"endTime":369.695,"body":"uh, understanding how to break up,"},{"startTime":365.175,"endTime":369.695,"body":"how to vertically slice things."},{"startTime":370.245,"endTime":372.225,"body":"And break up large"},{"startTime":370.245,"endTime":372.225,"body":"things into small things."},{"startTime":372.225,"endTime":376.395,"body":"I could, I could say breaking, you know,"},{"startTime":372.225,"endTime":376.395,"body":"large stories into whatever, but let's"},{"startTime":376.395,"endTime":377.925,"body":"just call it vertical slicing for now."},{"startTime":378.285,"endTime":379.815,"body":"Break large things into small things."},{"startTime":380.115,"endTime":380.655,"body":"Oh, right."},{"startTime":380.655,"endTime":382.385,"body":"They understand that a little bit."},{"startTime":382.505,"endTime":384.125,"body":"They understand how to"},{"startTime":382.505,"endTime":384.125,"body":"influence management."},{"startTime":384.425,"endTime":388.115,"body":"They understand the basics of"},{"startTime":384.425,"endTime":388.115,"body":"change management, or organizational"},{"startTime":388.12,"endTime":390.155,"body":"change Management may be org design."},{"startTime":390.215,"endTime":392.735,"body":"Maybe they've dipped their toes in"},{"startTime":390.215,"endTime":392.735,"body":"organism, read a couple books or"},{"startTime":392.74,"endTime":396.065,"body":"something like that, at least can"},{"startTime":392.74,"endTime":396.065,"body":"talk in, you know, about org design."},{"startTime":396.395,"endTime":399.305,"body":"They understand what the cost of"},{"startTime":396.395,"endTime":399.305,"body":"delay is and why it's important."},{"startTime":399.305,"endTime":403.685,"body":"They understand ROI at a basic, not"},{"startTime":399.305,"endTime":403.685,"body":"even an MBA level at a basic high level."},{"startTime":403.685,"endTime":404.435,"body":"They understand roi."},{"startTime":404.705,"endTime":407.565,"body":"They understand the basics"},{"startTime":404.705,"endTime":407.565,"body":"of budgeting, right?"},{"startTime":407.885,"endTime":410.495,"body":"Because if you're gonna turn to scrum"},{"startTime":407.885,"endTime":410.495,"body":"master here, here's, here's where"},{"startTime":410.5,"endTime":411.755,"body":"I'm, I'm going with these skills."},{"startTime":412.475,"endTime":417.605,"body":"If you're gonna turn a scrum master"},{"startTime":412.475,"endTime":417.605,"body":"into a junior PM and you're gonna strip"},{"startTime":417.605,"endTime":421.385,"body":"away all of the leadership core of the"},{"startTime":417.605,"endTime":421.385,"body":"role, all of the servant leadership,"},{"startTime":421.385,"endTime":424.085,"body":"you're gonna strip all that out because"},{"startTime":421.385,"endTime":424.085,"body":"you don't trust the teams with that."},{"startTime":425.105,"endTime":428.345,"body":"These are the things I need out"},{"startTime":425.105,"endTime":428.345,"body":"of someone at the team level."},{"startTime":428.405,"endTime":430.925,"body":"I need someone that, that knows"},{"startTime":428.405,"endTime":430.925,"body":"all this stuff cuz my developers"},{"startTime":430.935,"endTime":432.105,"body":"they might not know this stuff."},{"startTime":432.11,"endTime":434.865,"body":"They might not have time to"},{"startTime":432.11,"endTime":434.865,"body":"break out and learn these skills."},{"startTime":434.915,"endTime":436.655,"body":"It'd be good for them in"},{"startTime":434.915,"endTime":436.655,"body":"their career if they do."},{"startTime":437.315,"endTime":440.885,"body":"But it'd be better if I have somebody"},{"startTime":437.315,"endTime":440.885,"body":"who's now can focus on one of these"},{"startTime":440.885,"endTime":443.285,"body":"things at a time and get better at"},{"startTime":440.885,"endTime":443.285,"body":"it and make the whole team better."},{"startTime":443.87,"endTime":444.83,"body":"And then move on."},{"startTime":445.16,"endTime":447.44,"body":"I don't think there's anything"},{"startTime":445.16,"endTime":447.44,"body":"I listed that you get out of the"},{"startTime":447.44,"endTime":449.3,"body":"cert, out of the two day class."},{"startTime":449.34,"endTime":451.83,"body":"Maybe vertical slicing, maybe they"},{"startTime":449.34,"endTime":451.83,"body":"talk about that in, I think they talk"},{"startTime":451.835,"endTime":455.49,"body":"about that in the base level cSM or"},{"startTime":451.835,"endTime":455.49,"body":"pr, I don't know what they do on psm."},{"startTime":455.91,"endTime":456.12,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":456.12,"endTime":458.25,"body":"I mean certainly that,"},{"startTime":456.12,"endTime":458.25,"body":"that's, that's true."},{"startTime":458.25,"endTime":460.98,"body":"They're not covering all of"},{"startTime":458.25,"endTime":460.98,"body":"those things in a two day class."},{"startTime":460.98,"endTime":463.35,"body":"Cuz two days is just not"},{"startTime":460.98,"endTime":463.35,"body":"long enough to do all that."},{"startTime":463.38,"endTime":465.24,"body":"Well, it's not that they're"},{"startTime":463.38,"endTime":465.24,"body":"not covering, they're not"},{"startTime":465.24,"endTime":466.86,"body":"introducing any of these concepts."},{"startTime":467.01,"endTime":469.35,"body":"They can't, there's no"},{"startTime":467.01,"endTime":469.35,"body":"space, there's no time."},{"startTime":469.635,"endTime":469.815,"body":", right?"},{"startTime":469.815,"endTime":473.745,"body":"In a two day class, you're just"},{"startTime":469.815,"endTime":473.745,"body":"focusing on the basics of Scrum."},{"startTime":474.225,"endTime":475.455,"body":"That's all you're doing really."},{"startTime":475.785,"endTime":480.13,"body":"So if you are hiring a scrum master and"},{"startTime":475.785,"endTime":480.13,"body":"you want those things that you highlighted"},{"startTime":480.16,"endTime":484.66,"body":"out of them, are you making, are you"},{"startTime":480.16,"endTime":484.66,"body":"giving them the responsibility and"},{"startTime":484.665,"endTime":486.52,"body":"more importantly the authority, right."},{"startTime":486.52,"endTime":487.87,"body":"To execute on those things?"},{"startTime":487.9,"endTime":491.59,"body":"Or are you just simply saying, you're"},{"startTime":487.9,"endTime":491.59,"body":"a junior pm you go do all of these"},{"startTime":491.59,"endTime":493.15,"body":"things and what have you come back with?"},{"startTime":493.63,"endTime":496.93,"body":"Doesn't really matter to us, cuz we"},{"startTime":493.63,"endTime":496.93,"body":"know what you, what we want you to do."},{"startTime":496.93,"endTime":497.8,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":497.801,"endTime":497.802,"body":". Right?"},{"startTime":497.86,"endTime":500.26,"body":"You're just essentially"},{"startTime":497.86,"endTime":500.26,"body":"there to check boxes."},{"startTime":500.29,"endTime":500.38,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":500.625,"endTime":502.645,"body":", as long as you say yes to what"},{"startTime":500.625,"endTime":502.645,"body":"we say you shouldn't be doing."},{"startTime":503.025,"endTime":503.34,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":503.42,"endTime":504.22,"body":", you're a great scrum master."},{"startTime":504.25,"endTime":504.34,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":504.825,"endTime":507.455,"body":","},{"startTime":504.825,"endTime":507.455,"body":"I'm sure people have seen that"},{"startTime":507.455,"endTime":509.315,"body":"organization and say, how about this?"},{"startTime":509.32,"endTime":510.425,"body":"And they go, that won't work here."},{"startTime":511.055,"endTime":511.175,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":511.205,"endTime":512.075,"body":"This is what you need to do."},{"startTime":512.105,"endTime":513.575,"body":"This is what we've, this is how we work."},{"startTime":513.645,"endTime":515.985,"body":"Let's just take all my"},{"startTime":513.645,"endTime":515.985,"body":"whole list of things."},{"startTime":516.145,"endTime":517.735,"body":"If you're not doing any of those"},{"startTime":516.145,"endTime":517.735,"body":"things, what are you doing?"},{"startTime":518.008,"endTime":519.718,"body":"just being a yes person, right?"},{"startTime":519.723,"endTime":520.288,"body":"Yep, yep."},{"startTime":520.288,"endTime":520.858,"body":"That's what you're doing."},{"startTime":520.858,"endTime":521.248,"body":"Definitely."},{"startTime":521.578,"endTime":526.798,"body":"And the minute you kind of slightly"},{"startTime":521.578,"endTime":526.798,"body":"even argue against that, you are"},{"startTime":526.798,"endTime":528.388,"body":"rebelling and they don't want you."},{"startTime":528.438,"endTime":528.973,"body":"What is your job?"},{"startTime":528.978,"endTime":533.413,"body":"Is your job akin to like an executive"},{"startTime":528.978,"endTime":533.413,"body":"assistant for the team then at that point?"},{"startTime":533.463,"endTime":535.383,"body":"You schedule the meetings"},{"startTime":533.463,"endTime":535.383,"body":"when they tell you to schedule"},{"startTime":535.383,"endTime":537.003,"body":"meetings, you track down a person."},{"startTime":537.003,"endTime":540.046,"body":"When they tell you to track down a"},{"startTime":537.003,"endTime":540.046,"body":"person, put their stuff on the screen when"},{"startTime":540.051,"endTime":541.456,"body":"they need something put on the screen."},{"startTime":541.456,"endTime":544.396,"body":"That's exactly what this is this"},{"startTime":541.456,"endTime":544.396,"body":"is an admin role, effectively."},{"startTime":545.986,"endTime":550.246,"body":"Exact that, that title you mentioned"},{"startTime":545.986,"endTime":550.246,"body":"as exactly what a lot of companies"},{"startTime":550.246,"endTime":553.576,"body":"have dumbed down a scrum master"},{"startTime":550.246,"endTime":553.576,"body":"to be an executive assistant."},{"startTime":553.576,"endTime":556.853,"body":"And that's why, our last topic"},{"startTime":553.576,"endTime":556.853,"body":"of what does a scrum master do?"},{"startTime":556.858,"endTime":559.763,"body":"That's pretty much what"},{"startTime":556.858,"endTime":559.763,"body":"people look at it as."},{"startTime":559.763,"endTime":561.353,"body":"And when they look at that,"},{"startTime":559.763,"endTime":561.353,"body":"they're like, you know what?"},{"startTime":561.938,"endTime":562.988,"body":"I could have the team do it."},{"startTime":562.988,"endTime":564.518,"body":"So why do I need a scrum master?"},{"startTime":564.751,"endTime":568.441,"body":"So when people look at a scrum master as"},{"startTime":564.751,"endTime":568.441,"body":"just an executive assistant that, okay,"},{"startTime":568.711,"endTime":570.691,"body":"you just set meetings when we need it."},{"startTime":570.961,"endTime":574.591,"body":"You just make sure that the"},{"startTime":570.961,"endTime":574.591,"body":"team has some stuff we tell"},{"startTime":574.591,"endTime":576.391,"body":"you to go, okay, I need this."},{"startTime":576.396,"endTime":577.321,"body":"I need a bottle of water."},{"startTime":577.801,"endTime":580.381,"body":"So go to the store and"},{"startTime":577.801,"endTime":580.381,"body":"get, get us some water."},{"startTime":580.751,"endTime":582.161,"body":"We can't get that database."},{"startTime":582.161,"endTime":583.901,"body":"Yeah, you go talk to that database guy."},{"startTime":584.801,"endTime":587.891,"body":"So that's pretty much what a lot of"},{"startTime":584.801,"endTime":587.891,"body":"people has dumbed down Scrum masters."},{"startTime":588.011,"endTime":591.611,"body":"So when someone who's thinking money"},{"startTime":588.011,"endTime":591.611,"body":"comes and look at it, oh yeah, we"},{"startTime":591.611,"endTime":592.751,"body":"just got an executive assistant."},{"startTime":593.216,"endTime":593.966,"body":"Why do we need that?"},{"startTime":593.966,"endTime":596.246,"body":"Why don't we just have to"},{"startTime":593.966,"endTime":596.246,"body":"product manage product owner"},{"startTime":596.246,"endTime":598.556,"body":"or some guy on the team do it."},{"startTime":599.126,"endTime":600.606,"body":"So just eliminate that role."},{"startTime":600.826,"endTime":601.156,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":601.156,"endTime":604.565,"body":"I've actually had management ask"},{"startTime":601.156,"endTime":604.565,"body":"me why we need a scrum master."},{"startTime":604.565,"endTime":606.725,"body":"What do they do outside"},{"startTime":604.565,"endTime":606.725,"body":"of the 15 minutes per day?"},{"startTime":607.109,"endTime":607.769,"body":"Well, here we go."},{"startTime":607.859,"endTime":609.129,"body":"Like, let's, let's, good question."},{"startTime":609.269,"endTime":612.119,"body":"Let's get into this one because"},{"startTime":609.269,"endTime":612.119,"body":"this is, this is the, the, you"},{"startTime":612.119,"endTime":613.529,"body":"just hit the title of the podcast."},{"startTime":613.529,"endTime":615.389,"body":"You just used the title"},{"startTime":613.529,"endTime":615.389,"body":"of the movie in the movie."},{"startTime":615.809,"endTime":617.309,"body":"Like, why do we need a scrum master?"},{"startTime":617.314,"endTime":618.959,"body":"What do they do outside of the 15 minutes?"},{"startTime":618.959,"endTime":619.919,"body":"Like we had a whole podcast."},{"startTime":619.919,"endTime":621.719,"body":"In fact, our last podcast,"},{"startTime":619.919,"endTime":621.719,"body":"this was the whole."},{"startTime":622.064,"endTime":625.274,"body":"Point of the podcast, but if, if I'm"},{"startTime":622.064,"endTime":625.274,"body":"leadership and I'm gonna challenge,"},{"startTime":625.274,"endTime":626.894,"body":"like why, why can't the team do that?"},{"startTime":627.284,"endTime":630.104,"body":"Like what, what what's your,"},{"startTime":627.284,"endTime":630.104,"body":"what's your, like here, here I am"},{"startTime":630.104,"endTime":632.324,"body":"on the, on the side of the table."},{"startTime":632.324,"endTime":633.509,"body":"I said I didn't want to be on here."},{"startTime":633.734,"endTime":634.784,"body":"I am, I'm management."},{"startTime":635.354,"endTime":638.174,"body":"Om, I don't understand why, why"},{"startTime":635.354,"endTime":638.174,"body":"we have all these scrum masters"},{"startTime":638.234,"endTime":639.284,"body":"organizationally speaking."},{"startTime":639.289,"endTime":641.384,"body":"Like you're, you're,"},{"startTime":639.289,"endTime":641.384,"body":"you're my enterprise coach."},{"startTime":641.384,"endTime":644.044,"body":"Like all these scrum masters, maybe"},{"startTime":641.384,"endTime":644.044,"body":"we've organizationally aligned"},{"startTime":644.044,"endTime":645.424,"body":"them all to you for some reason."},{"startTime":645.424,"endTime":647.734,"body":"Cuz that's the way, because"},{"startTime":645.424,"endTime":647.734,"body":"that's the way budgeting works."},{"startTime":647.739,"endTime":648.004,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":648.009,"endTime":651.304,"body":"And you gotta meet me where I am"},{"startTime":648.009,"endTime":651.304,"body":"and only try to influence it yet."},{"startTime":651.304,"endTime":651.484,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":651.514,"endTime":651.784,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":651.928,"endTime":654.933,"body":"you've kind of gone along with it"},{"startTime":651.928,"endTime":654.933,"body":"hoping that I would just wake up"},{"startTime":654.933,"endTime":658.113,"body":"one day and I would fall in love"},{"startTime":654.933,"endTime":658.113,"body":"with you and then there'll be live"},{"startTime":658.113,"endTime":659.463,"body":"happily ever after or whatever."},{"startTime":659.463,"endTime":660.633,"body":"And then that day never came."},{"startTime":660.753,"endTime":664.173,"body":"So it's funny though because that,"},{"startTime":660.753,"endTime":664.173,"body":"that actually happens in real life"},{"startTime":664.173,"endTime":668.338,"body":"way too, way too often  so I usually"},{"startTime":664.173,"endTime":668.338,"body":"use a metaphor with them, right?"},{"startTime":668.338,"endTime":671.368,"body":"So you've got a bunch of people if you"},{"startTime":668.338,"endTime":671.368,"body":"have a bunch of teams, if you have one"},{"startTime":671.368,"endTime":677.198,"body":"team, you have one, one team basically"},{"startTime":671.368,"endTime":677.198,"body":"the team is rowing a boat, right?"},{"startTime":677.198,"endTime":680.738,"body":"So you've got all these team members and"},{"startTime":677.198,"endTime":680.738,"body":"they're busy developing, rowing a boat."},{"startTime":681.008,"endTime":685.028,"body":"Everybody is rowing in"},{"startTime":681.008,"endTime":685.028,"body":"different directions."},{"startTime":685.068,"endTime":685.898,"body":"They're, they're rowing."},{"startTime":686.108,"endTime":687.278,"body":"Rowing is what they do."},{"startTime":687.668,"endTime":690.938,"body":"Scrum master is there to make"},{"startTime":687.668,"endTime":690.938,"body":"sure that they can sound a drum"},{"startTime":690.943,"endTime":694.958,"body":"beat that makes sure everyone's"},{"startTime":690.943,"endTime":694.958,"body":"rowing in cadence with one another."},{"startTime":694.958,"endTime":698.528,"body":"So you move somewhere, otherwise"},{"startTime":694.958,"endTime":698.528,"body":"you're gonna move, but not back."},{"startTime":698.528,"endTime":700.208,"body":"What we going forward, you're"},{"startTime":698.528,"endTime":700.208,"body":"just gonna keep going around"},{"startTime":700.213,"endTime":701.498,"body":"in circles or, you know, right."},{"startTime":701.498,"endTime":705.728,"body":"And so is there value in somebody"},{"startTime":701.498,"endTime":705.728,"body":"standing at the, the back of the"},{"startTime":705.728,"endTime":710.348,"body":"boat encouraging people to do"},{"startTime":705.728,"endTime":710.348,"body":"things in a synchronized manner?"},{"startTime":710.378,"endTime":713.828,"body":"If there is then you need a Scrum"},{"startTime":710.378,"endTime":713.828,"body":"Master, And if you have multiple"},{"startTime":713.833,"endTime":717.738,"body":"teams and you have all these people"},{"startTime":713.833,"endTime":717.738,"body":"rowing these boats everywhere,"},{"startTime":717.768,"endTime":719.088,"body":"they're gonna get in each other's way."},{"startTime":719.448,"endTime":722.888,"body":"It's not gonna move toward"},{"startTime":719.448,"endTime":722.888,"body":"a destination anytime soon."},{"startTime":723.368,"endTime":727.538,"body":"so when I use that kind of an"},{"startTime":723.368,"endTime":727.538,"body":"analogy, it, you know, it tends to"},{"startTime":727.538,"endTime":729.588,"body":"be a little more effective, right?"},{"startTime":729.588,"endTime":730.968,"body":"They, they kind of understand that."},{"startTime":731.518,"endTime":735.688,"body":"The other thing I tell 'em is, okay,"},{"startTime":731.518,"endTime":735.688,"body":"so let's just run one of the teams"},{"startTime":735.748,"endTime":739.378,"body":"for a sprint or half a sprint without"},{"startTime":735.748,"endTime":739.378,"body":"a scrum master and see how it goes."},{"startTime":739.378,"endTime":742.408,"body":", if they're ED enough, they'd be"},{"startTime":739.378,"endTime":742.408,"body":"interested in finding out, you"},{"startTime":742.408,"endTime":743.818,"body":"know, exactly how that's going."},{"startTime":743.818,"endTime":746.308,"body":"And they'll soon find out that"},{"startTime":743.818,"endTime":746.308,"body":"it's, it doesn't go so well"},{"startTime":746.478,"endTime":749.328,"body":"Again I'm still on the executive side of"},{"startTime":746.478,"endTime":749.328,"body":"the table over here and like you still"},{"startTime":749.328,"endTime":750.528,"body":"haven't given me a compelling reason."},{"startTime":750.528,"endTime":753.888,"body":"Cause I, I speak numbers and I went"},{"startTime":750.528,"endTime":753.888,"body":"to a fancy MBA school and I went to"},{"startTime":753.893,"endTime":755.748,"body":"Stanford or whatever, so I'm smart."},{"startTime":755.748,"endTime":756.558,"body":"Harvard, of course."},{"startTime":756.588,"endTime":756.768,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":756.768,"endTime":757.008,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":757.008,"endTime":757.338,"body":"Oxford."},{"startTime":757.343,"endTime":757.588,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":757.593,"endTime":757.758,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":757.758,"endTime":761.148,"body":"I may have crashed a bank or"},{"startTime":757.758,"endTime":761.148,"body":"two, but but I Oh, oh, you"},{"startTime":761.328,"endTime":763.118,"body":"actually, here, here's, here's the"},{"startTime":763.123,"endTime":766.693,"body":"here's the actual thing I've heard before"},{"startTime":763.123,"endTime":766.693,"body":"from, from actual people with budgets"},{"startTime":766.873,"endTime":771.093,"body":"of why would I spend X amount of dollars"},{"startTime":766.873,"endTime":771.093,"body":"on a scrum master and when I could"},{"startTime":771.093,"endTime":775.233,"body":"spend those same dollars and get another"},{"startTime":771.093,"endTime":775.233,"body":"developer on my team and go faster?"},{"startTime":775.393,"endTime":779.083,"body":"Maybe I came up to my executive"},{"startTime":775.393,"endTime":779.083,"body":"path through development teams."},{"startTime":779.203,"endTime":781.093,"body":"So that is why I think that way."},{"startTime":781.093,"endTime":782.893,"body":"So you're not gonna"},{"startTime":781.093,"endTime":782.893,"body":"change the way I think."},{"startTime":783.293,"endTime":784.433,"body":"What is the counter to this now?"},{"startTime":784.438,"endTime":787.733,"body":"I, I'm just gonna simply illustrate"},{"startTime":784.438,"endTime":787.733,"body":"adding one more rower to the"},{"startTime":787.733,"endTime":789.533,"body":"boat isn't really gonna help you."},{"startTime":790.043,"endTime":790.733,"body":"You could do that."},{"startTime":791.003,"endTime":792.293,"body":"Instead of the scrum master."},{"startTime":792.353,"endTime":795.713,"body":"Now the boat's going around"},{"startTime":792.353,"endTime":795.713,"body":"faster, but still in circles."},{"startTime":795.743,"endTime":799.253,"body":"It is, it, I think, I think one more"},{"startTime":795.743,"endTime":799.253,"body":"rower would help us crash faster"},{"startTime":799.253,"endTime":800.573,"body":"into the rocks . That is true."},{"startTime":800.963,"endTime":801.713,"body":"That is true."},{"startTime":801.713,"endTime":805.403,"body":"If that's what you're"},{"startTime":801.713,"endTime":805.403,"body":"doing, I will say so, yeah."},{"startTime":805.403,"endTime":809.003,"body":"So that, that's the unfortunate thing that"},{"startTime":805.403,"endTime":809.003,"body":"people don't, people don't see the value"},{"startTime":809.003,"endTime":811.403,"body":"of something until it's no longer there."},{"startTime":811.403,"endTime":813.533,"body":"So the developers know"},{"startTime":811.403,"endTime":813.533,"body":"exactly what to do, right?"},{"startTime":813.983,"endTime":818.214,"body":"They know how to code, they know how"},{"startTime":813.983,"endTime":818.214,"body":"to do they,  listen, like I much like"},{"startTime":818.214,"endTime":820.704,"body":"the executive assistant, like they're,"},{"startTime":818.214,"endTime":820.704,"body":"they're sitting when we all used to"},{"startTime":820.704,"endTime":824.394,"body":"work in offices, like I'm sitting"},{"startTime":820.704,"endTime":824.394,"body":"in my chair for eight hours a day."},{"startTime":824.754,"endTime":826.164,"body":"That doesn't guarantee a single."},{"startTime":827.349,"endTime":827.709,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":827.709,"endTime":829.269,"body":"That is true of executives also."},{"startTime":829.299,"endTime":829.629,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":829.719,"endTime":829.899,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":830.209,"endTime":833.169,"body":"That is, I would say that's"},{"startTime":830.209,"endTime":833.169,"body":"double, triple, quadruple true."},{"startTime":833.169,"endTime":835.019,"body":"For some, those chances are"},{"startTime":833.169,"endTime":835.019,"body":"expensive for some executives."},{"startTime":835.019,"endTime":836.679,"body":"So let's just get rid of"},{"startTime":835.019,"endTime":836.679,"body":"the whole company then."},{"startTime":837.009,"endTime":837.219,"body":"No, no."},{"startTime":837.219,"endTime":838.099,"body":"That chairs are expensive."},{"startTime":838.099,"endTime":839.439,"body":"Everybody go home, the corner office."},{"startTime":839.709,"endTime":840.099,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":840.104,"endTime":841.809,"body":"Like I, again, I'm, I'm Mr."},{"startTime":841.809,"endTime":844.089,"body":"Executive in the Boy, I'm,"},{"startTime":841.809,"endTime":844.089,"body":"I'm the, I'm the bad guy."},{"startTime":844.089,"endTime":845.559,"body":"This podcast, I kind of like it."},{"startTime":845.739,"endTime":847.389,"body":"Um, it's like I'm Mr."},{"startTime":847.389,"endTime":849.942,"body":"Executive of Brian and Om's"},{"startTime":847.389,"endTime":849.942,"body":"software development company."},{"startTime":849.942,"endTime":851.412,"body":"Look, my name is on the marquee."},{"startTime":851.532,"endTime":853.692,"body":"That means I know what I'm talking about."},{"startTime":853.697,"endTime":853.902,"body":"Wall."},{"startTime":853.932,"endTime":855.132,"body":"That means I know what I'm talking about."},{"startTime":855.522,"endTime":855.612,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":856.002,"endTime":856.872,"body":"That's how it works."},{"startTime":856.902,"endTime":857.502,"body":"Did you know that?"},{"startTime":857.507,"endTime":859.212,"body":"That's how I know I'm,"},{"startTime":857.507,"endTime":859.212,"body":"because my name is Peter."},{"startTime":859.217,"endTime":859.752,"body":"Peter Norton did that."},{"startTime":859.757,"endTime":861.732,"body":"I wrote my name on a wall and"},{"startTime":859.757,"endTime":861.732,"body":"I know what I'm talking about."},{"startTime":861.737,"endTime":861.942,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":862.062,"endTime":862.362,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":862.362,"endTime":863.562,"body":"Anyway that's, yeah."},{"startTime":863.712,"endTime":866.712,"body":"I'm dipping into Influence by Robert"},{"startTime":863.712,"endTime":866.712,"body":"Chaldini right quick and be like, if"},{"startTime":866.712,"endTime":870.402,"body":"I say my name over and over again,"},{"startTime":866.712,"endTime":870.402,"body":"I, and I associate it with that."},{"startTime":870.402,"endTime":871.122,"body":"I know what I'm doing."},{"startTime":871.602,"endTime":872.202,"body":"It will stick."},{"startTime":872.202,"endTime":872.772,"body":"It sticks."},{"startTime":872.812,"endTime":873.052,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":873.057,"endTime":873.102,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":873.102,"endTime":873.612,"body":"You like that"},{"startTime":874.192,"endTime":875.867,"body":"I think it's a great topic"},{"startTime":874.192,"endTime":875.867,"body":"and I'm wanna say on it."},{"startTime":875.867,"endTime":880.007,"body":"I like you, you, you did highlight a"},{"startTime":875.867,"endTime":880.007,"body":"concept that I wanted to get to which"},{"startTime":880.007,"endTime":883.877,"body":"is you're telling me I need to, you're"},{"startTime":880.007,"endTime":883.877,"body":"telling me I need to hire a scrum master."},{"startTime":884.297,"endTime":887.477,"body":"I'm telling you I think more"},{"startTime":884.297,"endTime":887.477,"body":"developers would be better"},{"startTime":887.482,"endTime":888.587,"body":"cuz then we can move faster."},{"startTime":888.827,"endTime":892.187,"body":"So we, we've countered with,"},{"startTime":888.827,"endTime":892.187,"body":"you know, move faster to where,"},{"startTime":892.847,"endTime":894.947,"body":"you know, you effectiveness."},{"startTime":894.947,"endTime":895.097,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":895.097,"endTime":896.007,"body":"Move faster to where?"},{"startTime":896.077,"endTime":898.267,"body":"I go back to our podcast on Taylorism."},{"startTime":898.897,"endTime":899.137,"body":"Yes."},{"startTime":899.167,"endTime":899.917,"body":"Oh boy."},{"startTime":900.127,"endTime":900.637,"body":"All the way back."},{"startTime":900.637,"endTime":901.837,"body":"I'm reaching now."},{"startTime":902.197,"endTime":903.547,"body":"Also where's Alfonso at?"},{"startTime":903.547,"endTime":904.297,"body":"Where's he been at?"},{"startTime":904.297,"endTime":905.077,"body":"He dropped off the Earth."},{"startTime":905.077,"endTime":906.827,"body":"I seen he did, I dunno, come back."},{"startTime":906.827,"endTime":910.147,"body":"Alfonso, I heard from him a week or two"},{"startTime":906.827,"endTime":910.147,"body":"ago where he, I got one of his apps."},{"startTime":910.177,"endTime":910.567,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"startTime":910.957,"endTime":912.097,"body":"The meeting expense app."},{"startTime":912.157,"endTime":912.667,"body":"Oh man."},{"startTime":912.667,"endTime":913.147,"body":"Fantastic."},{"startTime":913.147,"endTime":913.867,"body":"I use it all the time."},{"startTime":914.107,"endTime":914.767,"body":"Oh, you're really in."},{"startTime":915.367,"endTime":915.667,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":915.697,"endTime":916.577,"body":"We miss you Alfonz."},{"startTime":916.577,"endTime":917.257,"body":"You gotta come back."},{"startTime":917.317,"endTime":918.067,"body":"Yeah, please do."},{"startTime":918.117,"endTime":921.892,"body":"When Alfonz was here and we talked"},{"startTime":918.117,"endTime":921.892,"body":"about Taylorism, we talked about"},{"startTime":921.942,"endTime":926.142,"body":"there's a piece of our Taylorism"},{"startTime":921.942,"endTime":926.142,"body":"podcast talking about brick laying."},{"startTime":926.772,"endTime":930.732,"body":"And what, what they found was like"},{"startTime":926.772,"endTime":930.732,"body":"the, the, the person who's laying the"},{"startTime":930.732,"endTime":935.622,"body":"bricks could be a lot more productive"},{"startTime":930.732,"endTime":935.622,"body":"if you just added an assistant."},{"startTime":935.862,"endTime":939.552,"body":"They carry the wheelbarrow around, they"},{"startTime":935.862,"endTime":939.552,"body":"hand the bricks up the ladder or whatever."},{"startTime":939.552,"endTime":944.214,"body":"They make sure the mortar is, refreshed"},{"startTime":939.552,"endTime":944.214,"body":"when it runs lower, whatever, they"},{"startTime":944.214,"endTime":947.184,"body":"don't need anywhere near the amount"},{"startTime":944.214,"endTime":947.184,"body":"of skill that the brick layer needs."},{"startTime":947.564,"endTime":950.304,"body":"And anyway, it was an example in"},{"startTime":947.564,"endTime":950.304,"body":"the, in, in in the book Principles"},{"startTime":950.324,"endTime":951.224,"body":"of Scientific Management."},{"startTime":951.824,"endTime":956.424,"body":"I think they either doubled or tripled the"},{"startTime":951.824,"endTime":956.424,"body":"brick layer productivity where they could"},{"startTime":956.424,"endTime":961.284,"body":"build, you know, more wall, higher walls,"},{"startTime":956.424,"endTime":961.284,"body":"more distance, faster in the same period"},{"startTime":961.284,"endTime":966.774,"body":"of time when you added an assistant to"},{"startTime":961.284,"endTime":966.774,"body":"help, deal with these tasks that didn't"},{"startTime":966.779,"endTime":969.384,"body":"require a certain level of expertise."},{"startTime":970.104,"endTime":972.444,"body":"And it wasn't until Taylor got"},{"startTime":970.104,"endTime":972.444,"body":"in that, like the brick layer"},{"startTime":972.444,"endTime":973.314,"body":"was doing everything themselves."},{"startTime":973.644,"endTime":975.594,"body":"Come down a ladder, grab a"},{"startTime":973.644,"endTime":975.594,"body":"brick, go back up the ladder."},{"startTime":975.594,"endTime":977.754,"body":"And it was kind of like when you think,"},{"startTime":975.594,"endTime":977.754,"body":"when you talk about it afterwards,"},{"startTime":977.754,"endTime":978.564,"body":"it's like, well, that's kind of."},{"startTime":979.344,"endTime":982.214,"body":"It's the classic elimination"},{"startTime":979.344,"endTime":982.214,"body":"of waste that we talk about"},{"startTime":982.214,"endTime":983.564,"body":"in the lean framework, right?"},{"startTime":983.564,"endTime":983.654,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":983.894,"endTime":984.964,"body":", that, that's what that was."},{"startTime":984.974,"endTime":987.584,"body":"But we didn't know it is that at"},{"startTime":984.974,"endTime":987.584,"body":"the time when that was proposed"},{"startTime":987.584,"endTime":991.424,"body":"years and years ago in a principles"},{"startTime":987.584,"endTime":991.424,"body":"of scientific management book."},{"startTime":991.784,"endTime":993.254,"body":"But yeah, I mean, it makes sense to me."},{"startTime":993.254,"endTime":995.834,"body":"If you're eliminating waste, then"},{"startTime":993.254,"endTime":995.834,"body":"you're gonna get better throughput."},{"startTime":995.934,"endTime":999.084,"body":"okay, so I'm back to being"},{"startTime":995.934,"endTime":999.084,"body":"the combative executive."},{"startTime":999.254,"endTime":1000.544,"body":"I went to Stanford, remember you."},{"startTime":1000.544,"endTime":1001.414,"body":"Well, I'm very smart."},{"startTime":1001.414,"endTime":1002.134,"body":"I went to Stanford."},{"startTime":1002.134,"endTime":1002.974,"body":"Look, I have my tie."},{"startTime":1002.979,"endTime":1003.514,"body":"You get your tie."},{"startTime":1003.514,"endTime":1003.964,"body":"There you go."},{"startTime":1003.994,"endTime":1006.454,"body":"I, I hear what you're saying, like"},{"startTime":1003.994,"endTime":1006.454,"body":"that you're using this brick layer"},{"startTime":1006.454,"endTime":1009.934,"body":"example to, to make an analogy"},{"startTime":1006.454,"endTime":1009.934,"body":"of, oh, well you, you know, you"},{"startTime":1009.934,"endTime":1010.924,"body":"do this for the development teams."},{"startTime":1010.929,"endTime":1011.494,"body":"You add somebody."},{"startTime":1011.564,"endTime":1012.774,"body":", I'm trying to meet you where you are."},{"startTime":1013.439,"endTime":1017.219,"body":"I'm trying to come around, but I can't"},{"startTime":1013.439,"endTime":1017.219,"body":"hire this scrum master physician cuz first"},{"startTime":1017.219,"endTime":1018.629,"body":"of all, scrum Master sounds ridiculous."},{"startTime":1018.629,"endTime":1021.029,"body":"I'm not gonna title them Scrum master,"},{"startTime":1018.629,"endTime":1021.029,"body":"I'll title them something else."},{"startTime":1021.509,"endTime":1023.554,"body":"Brian Agility, , you see"},{"startTime":1021.509,"endTime":1023.554,"body":"where I'm going with this?"},{"startTime":1024.074,"endTime":1027.204,"body":"and second I don't know a way"},{"startTime":1024.074,"endTime":1027.204,"body":"to measure somebody who sits on"},{"startTime":1027.204,"endTime":1029.484,"body":"development team but doesn't actually"},{"startTime":1027.204,"endTime":1029.484,"body":"actively do development work."},{"startTime":1029.484,"endTime":1032.374,"body":"So how am I gonna measure this"},{"startTime":1029.484,"endTime":1032.374,"body":"person, first of all, you have"},{"startTime":1032.374,"endTime":1037.868,"body":"to convince me management that"},{"startTime":1032.374,"endTime":1037.868,"body":"bringing this person on will increase"},{"startTime":1037.944,"endTime":1040.918,"body":"the effectiveness of my team."},{"startTime":1040.943,"endTime":1045.621,"body":"And in order to convince me of that, you"},{"startTime":1040.943,"endTime":1045.621,"body":"have to show me before and after metrics."},{"startTime":1046.131,"endTime":1050.271,"body":"So let's say we agree to bring a scrum"},{"startTime":1046.131,"endTime":1050.271,"body":"master on six month contract to hire"},{"startTime":1050.276,"endTime":1051.771,"body":"some, you know, some, some plan like that."},{"startTime":1051.851,"endTime":1053.591,"body":"Dipping my toes in the"},{"startTime":1051.851,"endTime":1053.591,"body":"water, I'm taking a chance."},{"startTime":1054.361,"endTime":1055.741,"body":"what are you laying down for me?"},{"startTime":1055.746,"endTime":1058.606,"body":"The executive where I, you"},{"startTime":1055.746,"endTime":1058.606,"body":"can prove that like, . Yes."},{"startTime":1058.606,"endTime":1059.476,"body":"We brought this person on."},{"startTime":1059.516,"endTime":1060.266,"body":"It was a good deal."},{"startTime":1060.266,"endTime":1063.176,"body":"They're making an impact"},{"startTime":1060.266,"endTime":1063.176,"body":"here is how I show you."},{"startTime":1064.376,"endTime":1067.016,"body":"Yeah, that's, that's a great question"},{"startTime":1064.376,"endTime":1067.016,"body":"cuz that's something that I think"},{"startTime":1067.046,"endTime":1070.496,"body":"vexes a whole bunch of people out"},{"startTime":1067.046,"endTime":1070.496,"body":"there, they're asked that show me"},{"startTime":1070.501,"endTime":1072.446,"body":"that it works before I spend the money"},{"startTime":1072.576,"endTime":1075.876,"body":"I think if you're gonna do that,"},{"startTime":1072.576,"endTime":1075.876,"body":"you really do need to gather some"},{"startTime":1075.876,"endTime":1079.866,"body":"metrics before, which is, you know,"},{"startTime":1075.876,"endTime":1079.866,"body":"let, let's look at how much wait time"},{"startTime":1079.866,"endTime":1081.396,"body":"there is in the, in the team Okay."},{"startTime":1081.426,"endTime":1085.484,"body":"For, dependencies issues,"},{"startTime":1081.426,"endTime":1085.484,"body":"impediments risks, et cetera."},{"startTime":1085.514,"endTime":1086.294,"body":"What are they doing?"},{"startTime":1086.559,"endTime":1090.399,"body":"so just ask the teams, write down"},{"startTime":1086.559,"endTime":1090.399,"body":"those things when they occur, when they"},{"startTime":1090.399,"endTime":1092.619,"body":"get resolved by the team themselves."},{"startTime":1092.709,"endTime":1092.859,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1093.099,"endTime":1095.659,"body":"or magically, and, and quantify those."},{"startTime":1095.779,"endTime":1095.869,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1095.929,"endTime":1096.229,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1096.229,"endTime":1099.139,"body":"And so numbers make a big difference."},{"startTime":1099.139,"endTime":1100.069,"body":"Write those down."},{"startTime":1100.219,"endTime":1100.429,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1100.429,"endTime":1103.699,"body":"And then hire a Scrum master, but treat"},{"startTime":1100.429,"endTime":1103.699,"body":"that as an experiment, if you will."},{"startTime":1103.754,"endTime":1104.504,"body":"Two to three sprints."},{"startTime":1104.504,"endTime":1104.834,"body":"Maybe."},{"startTime":1104.854,"endTime":1107.704,"body":"Would you quantify them just"},{"startTime":1104.854,"endTime":1107.704,"body":"as, as best as you could?"},{"startTime":1107.704,"endTime":1109.504,"body":"Cause I, I wrote, I'm"},{"startTime":1107.704,"endTime":1109.504,"body":"taking some notes here."},{"startTime":1109.504,"endTime":1109.564,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1109.594,"endTime":1112.264,"body":"Cause again, I'm an executive, so I'm"},{"startTime":1109.594,"endTime":1112.264,"body":"gonna, I'm writing all these down."},{"startTime":1112.269,"endTime":1113.944,"body":"You got, they're going in your"},{"startTime":1112.269,"endTime":1113.944,"body":"Should we putting on your iPad?"},{"startTime":1113.944,"endTime":1114.094,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1114.334,"endTime":1115.654,"body":"They're gonna, they're gonna,"},{"startTime":1114.334,"endTime":1115.654,"body":"they're gonna be on your"},{"startTime":1115.654,"endTime":1117.494,"body":"pip uh, . On, on your pip."},{"startTime":1117.499,"endTime":1121.564,"body":"My pdp . We're gonna take note of all"},{"startTime":1117.499,"endTime":1121.564,"body":"the, the wait time and the dependencies"},{"startTime":1121.564,"endTime":1124.054,"body":"and how many of them there are,"},{"startTime":1121.564,"endTime":1124.054,"body":"and generally how long they take."},{"startTime":1124.059,"endTime":1127.174,"body":"We're, we're gonna track risks and stuff"},{"startTime":1124.059,"endTime":1127.174,"body":"like that, and what we do with them, and"},{"startTime":1127.174,"endTime":1128.524,"body":"whether they blow back up in our face."},{"startTime":1128.624,"endTime":1131.604,"body":"We're gonna look to quantify all"},{"startTime":1128.624,"endTime":1131.604,"body":"these things together somehow."},{"startTime":1131.604,"endTime":1134.994,"body":"I, the executive would prefer"},{"startTime":1131.604,"endTime":1134.994,"body":"that these things get quantified"},{"startTime":1134.994,"endTime":1136.584,"body":"in terms of actual real money."},{"startTime":1137.604,"endTime":1141.444,"body":", but I guess proxy metrics are okay"},{"startTime":1137.604,"endTime":1141.444,"body":"too if we can't tie them into money."},{"startTime":1141.684,"endTime":1144.324,"body":"Proxy metrics can almost"},{"startTime":1141.684,"endTime":1144.324,"body":"always be tied to money."},{"startTime":1144.354,"endTime":1145.164,"body":"Almost always."},{"startTime":1145.164,"endTime":1148.644,"body":"The only ones that can't be are those"},{"startTime":1145.164,"endTime":1148.644,"body":"improvements that the team does, like"},{"startTime":1148.649,"endTime":1152.154,"body":"psychological safety and getting,"},{"startTime":1148.649,"endTime":1152.154,"body":"you know, that trust built it."},{"startTime":1152.154,"endTime":1155.844,"body":"It's hard to quantify that, but"},{"startTime":1152.154,"endTime":1155.844,"body":"for the most part, you can say if"},{"startTime":1155.844,"endTime":1159.924,"body":"there's a delay of X number of hours"},{"startTime":1155.844,"endTime":1159.924,"body":"for something get resolved, you can."},{"startTime":1161.049,"endTime":1161.379,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1161.919,"endTime":1163.209,"body":"Uh, you absolutely can."},{"startTime":1163.629,"endTime":1169.239,"body":"So do that and then treat this"},{"startTime":1163.629,"endTime":1169.239,"body":"as an experiment with management."},{"startTime":1169.269,"endTime":1172.659,"body":"Hopefully leadership will understand, but"},{"startTime":1169.269,"endTime":1172.659,"body":"management, treat it as an experiment."},{"startTime":1172.989,"endTime":1177.399,"body":"Run with a scrum master for a few"},{"startTime":1172.989,"endTime":1177.399,"body":"sprints, tracking the same, exact"},{"startTime":1177.404,"endTime":1181.419,"body":"same type of metrics again, and then"},{"startTime":1177.404,"endTime":1181.419,"body":"do a side by side before and after."},{"startTime":1181.659,"endTime":1181.809,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1182.289,"endTime":1183.579,"body":"perfectly on the same graph."},{"startTime":1183.729,"endTime":1187.699,"body":"So let, let's, let's take an"},{"startTime":1183.729,"endTime":1187.699,"body":"example of the impediment,"},{"startTime":1187.909,"endTime":1189.769,"body":"impediment re resolution, right?"},{"startTime":1189.979,"endTime":1190.099,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1190.159,"endTime":1192.649,"body":"So, developer has work to do."},{"startTime":1192.649,"endTime":1194.673,"body":"He has, to go build this form."},{"startTime":1194.678,"endTime":1194.913,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1194.998,"endTime":1195.303,"body":", right?"},{"startTime":1195.453,"endTime":1199.653,"body":"And then he's finding out, okay, in about"},{"startTime":1195.453,"endTime":1199.653,"body":"two or three days, I'm gonna need some"},{"startTime":1199.653,"endTime":1203.103,"body":"data from the, from the database team."},{"startTime":1203.223,"endTime":1208.113,"body":"Now, would you want him to stop the"},{"startTime":1203.223,"endTime":1208.113,"body":"work and go chase the database team to"},{"startTime":1208.113,"endTime":1212.253,"body":"get that data, or let him keep coding"},{"startTime":1208.113,"endTime":1212.253,"body":"while he's coding to build that form?"},{"startTime":1212.808,"endTime":1217.878,"body":"And let the scrum has to go chase down"},{"startTime":1212.808,"endTime":1217.878,"body":"the database team, get the access, get"},{"startTime":1217.878,"endTime":1222.318,"body":"whatever he needs, get that data so that"},{"startTime":1217.878,"endTime":1222.318,"body":"when that time gets there for him to"},{"startTime":1222.708,"endTime":1225.018,"body":"implement that data, he's doing that."},{"startTime":1225.108,"endTime":1227.868,"body":"So kind of like a division"},{"startTime":1225.108,"endTime":1227.868,"body":"of labor type type stuff."},{"startTime":1228.224,"endTime":1231.388,"body":"well, first of all, I don't,"},{"startTime":1228.224,"endTime":1231.388,"body":"I, I always worry when he has"},{"startTime":1231.388,"endTime":1232.928,"body":"that soft voice . I don't,"},{"startTime":1232.978,"endTime":1236.098,"body":"I'm trying to play the angry executive,"},{"startTime":1232.978,"endTime":1236.098,"body":"but I'm also like, I, I live in"},{"startTime":1236.098,"endTime":1237.298,"body":"the world of product management."},{"startTime":1237.358,"endTime":1241.858,"body":"Like I, I am not going to"},{"startTime":1237.358,"endTime":1241.858,"body":"pick up anything with my team."},{"startTime":1242.218,"endTime":1243.718,"body":"That delay is built into the system."},{"startTime":1244.048,"endTime":1249.148,"body":"I am gonna, I'm gonna destroy any"},{"startTime":1244.048,"endTime":1249.148,"body":"system that has delayed built into it."},{"startTime":1249.639,"endTime":1252.519,"body":"An organization that is questioning"},{"startTime":1249.639,"endTime":1252.519,"body":"the value of a Scrum master is"},{"startTime":1252.519,"endTime":1254.619,"body":"unlikely to have effective POs."},{"startTime":1254.679,"endTime":1255.519,"body":"I'm just saying that."},{"startTime":1255.519,"endTime":1255.669,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1255.909,"endTime":1259.389,"body":"Well, they may have effective"},{"startTime":1255.909,"endTime":1259.389,"body":"POs with ineffective teams,"},{"startTime":1259.449,"endTime":1260.469,"body":"so they may have frustrated."},{"startTime":1260.469,"endTime":1264.249,"body":"I've, I've seen organizations"},{"startTime":1260.469,"endTime":1264.249,"body":"where the POs, the POs do know"},{"startTime":1264.429,"endTime":1265.989,"body":"the POs are talking to customers."},{"startTime":1266.139,"endTime":1267.069,"body":"They are in front of customers."},{"startTime":1267.189,"endTime":1270.954,"body":"They do know the why, and they do"},{"startTime":1267.189,"endTime":1270.954,"body":"know the what but their teams are"},{"startTime":1270.954,"endTime":1276.583,"body":"incapable of slicing work into"},{"startTime":1270.954,"endTime":1276.583,"body":"vertical slices, delivering anything"},{"startTime":1276.583,"endTime":1279.503,"body":"that takes less than three months"},{"startTime":1276.583,"endTime":1279.503,"body":"or whatever to get it product."},{"startTime":1279.743,"endTime":1281.213,"body":"I, I've seen that, you know,"},{"startTime":1281.363,"endTime":1282.293,"body":"it's prevalent, right?"},{"startTime":1282.293,"endTime":1284.483,"body":"This is another reason"},{"startTime":1282.293,"endTime":1284.483,"body":"why you need scrum master."},{"startTime":1284.483,"endTime":1287.693,"body":"We can come in and say, listen, we"},{"startTime":1284.483,"endTime":1287.693,"body":"need to slice the work appropriately."},{"startTime":1287.753,"endTime":1290.633,"body":"We need to make sure we don't"},{"startTime":1287.753,"endTime":1290.633,"body":"over commit things like that."},{"startTime":1291.263,"endTime":1292.493,"body":"The teams aren't gonna do that."},{"startTime":1292.643,"endTime":1295.533,"body":"You ask a developer and stroke"},{"startTime":1292.643,"endTime":1295.533,"body":"their ego and say, you can do this."},{"startTime":1295.533,"endTime":1298.713,"body":"Surely you could have this knocked"},{"startTime":1295.533,"endTime":1298.713,"body":"down in, in a few hours, and then"},{"startTime":1298.713,"endTime":1300.143,"body":"they struggle on it for a few days."},{"startTime":1300.723,"endTime":1304.523,"body":"But that's how, you know those people"},{"startTime":1300.723,"endTime":1304.523,"body":"subvert you know, the team, right?"},{"startTime":1304.523,"endTime":1305.963,"body":"They'll just go in and"},{"startTime":1304.523,"endTime":1305.963,"body":"say, you can do this."},{"startTime":1305.963,"endTime":1307.163,"body":"Surely Right."},{"startTime":1307.223,"endTime":1308.033,"body":"You can do this."},{"startTime":1308.033,"endTime":1308.753,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1308.813,"endTime":1311.663,"body":"Let me ask you another question and,"},{"startTime":1308.813,"endTime":1311.663,"body":"Ayo maybe this is your question too."},{"startTime":1311.663,"endTime":1314.713,"body":"I, if you were to come into an"},{"startTime":1311.663,"endTime":1314.713,"body":"organization and you're new to the"},{"startTime":1314.713,"endTime":1316.153,"body":"organization as a scrum master mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1316.403,"endTime":1319.083,"body":", and, and you come in like they,"},{"startTime":1316.403,"endTime":1319.083,"body":"they hire you in, congratulations"},{"startTime":1319.123,"endTime":1319.833,"body":"Ayo by the way, you're hired."},{"startTime":1319.833,"endTime":1320.313,"body":"No, thank you."},{"startTime":1320.523,"endTime":1324.093,"body":"We can't pay you in money, but we"},{"startTime":1320.523,"endTime":1324.093,"body":"can pay you in that drink . Um, like"},{"startTime":1324.783,"endTime":1326.283,"body":"which you bring, which you br Yeah."},{"startTime":1326.288,"endTime":1327.213,"body":"You have to bring drinks."},{"startTime":1329.973,"endTime":1330.783,"body":". I'm a manager."},{"startTime":1330.788,"endTime":1331.973,"body":"Do you get it now anyway?"},{"startTime":1331.973,"endTime":1332.293,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1332.298,"endTime":1332.433,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1332.433,"endTime":1333.843,"body":"Anyway sorry."},{"startTime":1333.873,"endTime":1335.313,"body":"Also, we're gonna need you"},{"startTime":1333.873,"endTime":1335.313,"body":"to work on the weekend."},{"startTime":1335.403,"endTime":1335.463,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1335.493,"endTime":1338.723,"body":"Um, and uh you come in"},{"startTime":1335.493,"endTime":1338.723,"body":"and say, well, look, we."},{"startTime":1339.293,"endTime":1342.473,"body":"We've gone on a limb and we, we've"},{"startTime":1339.293,"endTime":1342.473,"body":"decided we wanna hire you to be our"},{"startTime":1342.473,"endTime":1343.793,"body":"first scrum master in the organization."},{"startTime":1343.793,"endTime":1345.323,"body":"We haven't had scrum master before."},{"startTime":1345.473,"endTime":1347.093,"body":"We're taken a chance six months."},{"startTime":1347.148,"endTime":1350.328,"body":"And with the option, if we think"},{"startTime":1347.148,"endTime":1350.328,"body":"that the position is valuable, we'll"},{"startTime":1350.328,"endTime":1352.638,"body":"hire you on permanent after that"},{"startTime":1350.328,"endTime":1352.638,"body":"and it'll be a permanent position."},{"startTime":1352.638,"endTime":1356.578,"body":"And that we, everything's I'm assuming"},{"startTime":1352.638,"endTime":1356.578,"body":"we're not playing any games in this."},{"startTime":1356.578,"endTime":1357.478,"body":"Yeah, no politics."},{"startTime":1357.478,"endTime":1357.658,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1357.828,"endTime":1357.948,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1357.948,"endTime":1361.028,"body":"No politics, no games in this, but"},{"startTime":1357.948,"endTime":1361.028,"body":"anyway, like we're gonna avoid all that."},{"startTime":1361.088,"endTime":1362.678,"body":"He comes in at eight and leaves at six."},{"startTime":1362.683,"endTime":1363.418,"body":"What the hell's wrong with it?"},{"startTime":1363.418,"endTime":1363.818,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":1363.818,"endTime":1364.478,"body":"What is wrong with that guy?"},{"startTime":1364.983,"endTime":1365.438,"body":"? Oh boy."},{"startTime":1365.443,"endTime":1366.608,"body":"Do you remember those days?"},{"startTime":1366.613,"endTime":1366.858,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"startTime":1366.858,"endTime":1367.628,"body":"Oh boy."},{"startTime":1367.778,"endTime":1369.518,"body":"You have metrics that"},{"startTime":1367.778,"endTime":1369.518,"body":"I'm measuring against."},{"startTime":1369.518,"endTime":1371.988,"body":"I'm like, okay Ayo welcome"},{"startTime":1369.518,"endTime":1371.988,"body":"to the organization."},{"startTime":1372.168,"endTime":1373.008,"body":"It's your first day."},{"startTime":1373.138,"endTime":1375.028,"body":"We've been tracking our"},{"startTime":1373.138,"endTime":1375.028,"body":"cycle time, lead time."},{"startTime":1375.088,"endTime":1375.778,"body":"Let's start with there."},{"startTime":1376.048,"endTime":1379.768,"body":"We're tracking our cycle time, lead"},{"startTime":1376.048,"endTime":1379.768,"body":"time, and, and, and through the tracking"},{"startTime":1379.768,"endTime":1383.938,"body":"of our cycle time, lead time, we have"},{"startTime":1379.768,"endTime":1383.938,"body":"the cost, we have the wait times so"},{"startTime":1383.938,"endTime":1388.258,"body":"we can put a cost of delay to the wait"},{"startTime":1383.938,"endTime":1388.258,"body":"times because we, we, we know the time"},{"startTime":1388.258,"endTime":1393.108,"body":"from when our team picks it up and"},{"startTime":1388.258,"endTime":1393.108,"body":"does the first set of requirements."},{"startTime":1393.113,"endTime":1393.198,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1393.608,"endTime":1395.508,"body":", I'm gonna say requirements cuz"},{"startTime":1393.608,"endTime":1395.508,"body":"that's where, where that kind"},{"startTime":1395.513,"endTime":1396.468,"body":"of organization now Yeah, yeah."},{"startTime":1396.528,"endTime":1398.988,"body":"Before the dev team actually picks"},{"startTime":1396.528,"endTime":1398.988,"body":"it up and starts working on it."},{"startTime":1399.048,"endTime":1402.018,"body":"And then maybe the dev team in"},{"startTime":1399.048,"endTime":1402.018,"body":"our organization hands off to some"},{"startTime":1402.018,"endTime":1403.218,"body":"other team to deploy stuff to."},{"startTime":1403.278,"endTime":1405.528,"body":"So there's a, there's a cost of"},{"startTime":1403.278,"endTime":1405.528,"body":"delay at the beginning and there's"},{"startTime":1405.533,"endTime":1406.518,"body":"a cost of delay at the end."},{"startTime":1406.518,"endTime":1407.718,"body":"Like we're tracking all that."},{"startTime":1407.988,"endTime":1408.258,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1408.288,"endTime":1411.918,"body":"We know that cost of delay is bad"},{"startTime":1408.288,"endTime":1411.918,"body":"and we're also tracking dependencies"},{"startTime":1412.068,"endTime":1413.178,"body":"and we're tracking the work items."},{"startTime":1413.208,"endTime":1415.158,"body":"How many of them and"},{"startTime":1413.208,"endTime":1415.158,"body":"how long the delay is."},{"startTime":1415.368,"endTime":1418.728,"body":"When something is dependent on another"},{"startTime":1415.368,"endTime":1418.728,"body":"team has it go off and get worked and then"},{"startTime":1418.728,"endTime":1420.138,"body":"come back to us and then we can do it."},{"startTime":1421.108,"endTime":1424.258,"body":"And we're tracking risks and things"},{"startTime":1421.108,"endTime":1424.258,"body":"that could be, we're tracking, maybe"},{"startTime":1424.258,"endTime":1426.598,"body":"we're tracking technical that may"},{"startTime":1424.258,"endTime":1426.598,"body":"maybe actually, with our metrics, we're"},{"startTime":1426.598,"endTime":1428.098,"body":"actually quite advanced with our metrics."},{"startTime":1428.188,"endTime":1431.573,"body":"We just don't know what to do"},{"startTime":1428.188,"endTime":1431.573,"body":"because we're so busy a developers"},{"startTime":1431.573,"endTime":1432.413,"body":"are so busy during the day."},{"startTime":1432.953,"endTime":1434.783,"body":"Welcome to my interview as a scrum master."},{"startTime":1434.933,"endTime":1435.023,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1435.213,"endTime":1438.333,"body":", you have six months basically to"},{"startTime":1435.213,"endTime":1438.333,"body":"prove that you can knock these"},{"startTime":1438.333,"endTime":1439.383,"body":"numbers down as a scrum master."},{"startTime":1439.683,"endTime":1440.013,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1440.553,"endTime":1445.653,"body":"Let's also assume you've got, you're"},{"startTime":1440.553,"endTime":1445.653,"body":"working for, in this organization, you're"},{"startTime":1445.653,"endTime":1449.703,"body":"working directly for the ceo, so climbing"},{"startTime":1445.653,"endTime":1449.703,"body":"the ladder of management and getting"},{"startTime":1449.703,"endTime":1451.863,"body":"the right people's ear is not an issue."},{"startTime":1452.043,"endTime":1452.343,"body":"Hmm."},{"startTime":1453.273,"endTime":1453.813,"body":"I understand."},{"startTime":1453.813,"endTime":1455.103,"body":"We're taking a huge assumption here."},{"startTime":1455.108,"endTime":1457.893,"body":"Yeah, I was gonna say you're blessed,"},{"startTime":1455.108,"endTime":1457.893,"body":"but let's, let's pretend that's"},{"startTime":1457.893,"endTime":1459.273,"body":"the, that's the role you have."},{"startTime":1459.453,"endTime":1460.653,"body":"You have carte blanche."},{"startTime":1460.653,"endTime":1461.043,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":1461.048,"endTime":1464.133,"body":"I said carte blanche, . There may be"},{"startTime":1461.048,"endTime":1464.133,"body":"more french words in this podcast."},{"startTime":1464.853,"endTime":1466.033,"body":"you, you can sac."},{"startTime":1467.729,"endTime":1471.179,"body":"you can basically recommend anything"},{"startTime":1467.729,"endTime":1471.179,"body":"like you, you work directly for the ceo."},{"startTime":1471.179,"endTime":1474.869,"body":"So what, what's your, I was gonna"},{"startTime":1471.179,"endTime":1474.869,"body":"say 30, 30, 60, 90 plan, but I,"},{"startTime":1474.869,"endTime":1475.889,"body":"it could be longer than that."},{"startTime":1475.889,"endTime":1479.429,"body":"Yeah, it could be, you know what,"},{"startTime":1475.889,"endTime":1479.429,"body":"what, what's your tiered step plan"},{"startTime":1479.429,"endTime":1482.159,"body":"here to, to let you know that you"},{"startTime":1479.429,"endTime":1482.159,"body":"are the person I want to hire."},{"startTime":1482.619,"endTime":1487.084,"body":"Part of the, the grief that"},{"startTime":1482.619,"endTime":1487.084,"body":"surrounds this topic online is"},{"startTime":1487.214,"endTime":1488.894,"body":"people wanna hire a life coach."},{"startTime":1489.359,"endTime":1493.019,"body":"and a life coach is not really gonna"},{"startTime":1489.359,"endTime":1493.019,"body":"make impactful organizational change."},{"startTime":1493.139,"endTime":1496.019,"body":"They're just gonna make me feel"},{"startTime":1493.139,"endTime":1496.019,"body":"good about, like, oh, we're meeting"},{"startTime":1496.019,"endTime":1500.039,"body":"you where you are and the way"},{"startTime":1496.019,"endTime":1500.039,"body":"you are right now, Ayo is great."},{"startTime":1500.044,"endTime":1501.479,"body":"You don't need to change anything."},{"startTime":1502.139,"endTime":1503.039,"body":"That's not true."},{"startTime":1503.044,"endTime":1505.329,"body":"Thank you for gracing"},{"startTime":1503.044,"endTime":1505.329,"body":"my couch for an hour."},{"startTime":1505.334,"endTime":1506.229,"body":"I'll see you next month."},{"startTime":1506.402,"endTime":1508.082,"body":"I'm hiring, I'm taking a chance."},{"startTime":1508.672,"endTime":1512.392,"body":"This is a way this person who thinks about"},{"startTime":1508.672,"endTime":1512.392,"body":"it, master I'm taking a chance on, I could"},{"startTime":1512.392,"endTime":1515.002,"body":"be hiring another developer and I think"},{"startTime":1512.392,"endTime":1515.002,"body":"that that's the right thing to do, but"},{"startTime":1515.002,"endTime":1518.932,"body":"I'm taking a chance on this person that"},{"startTime":1515.002,"endTime":1518.932,"body":"supposedly could accelerate my business."},{"startTime":1518.932,"endTime":1520.612,"body":"You see the disdain that"},{"startTime":1518.932,"endTime":1520.612,"body":"I said in the, yeah."},{"startTime":1520.612,"endTime":1520.822,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1520.842,"endTime":1521.162,"body":"Of course."},{"startTime":1521.172,"endTime":1522.277,"body":"What, how are you gonna prove this?"},{"startTime":1522.277,"endTime":1523.267,"body":"How, how are you gonna prove this?"},{"startTime":1523.597,"endTime":1526.117,"body":"Like, I, I'm tracking these"},{"startTime":1523.597,"endTime":1526.117,"body":"problems, so I, I'm committed,"},{"startTime":1526.427,"endTime":1528.677,"body":"what are you going to do mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1528.683,"endTime":1533.867,"body":"in the organization to try to improve"},{"startTime":1528.683,"endTime":1533.867,"body":"all, all of the metrics I'm tracking,"},{"startTime":1533.867,"endTime":1537.347,"body":"which is the wait time, the dependencies,"},{"startTime":1533.867,"endTime":1537.347,"body":"the risks, the cost of delay."},{"startTime":1538.577,"endTime":1543.317,"body":"Let let, let's just kind of go one or two"},{"startTime":1538.577,"endTime":1543.317,"body":"steps at a time on this one, maybe, right?"},{"startTime":1543.467,"endTime":1547.217,"body":"So what's the first thing you would do to"},{"startTime":1543.467,"endTime":1547.217,"body":"a short term, long term like that, right?"},{"startTime":1547.487,"endTime":1548.537,"body":"What's the first thing you would do?"},{"startTime":1548.597,"endTime":1551.747,"body":"Because you, you've, you've been told"},{"startTime":1548.597,"endTime":1551.747,"body":"what metrics they're already measuring."},{"startTime":1551.957,"endTime":1554.527,"body":"So they have the metrics and"},{"startTime":1551.957,"endTime":1554.527,"body":"they have the metrics and they're"},{"startTime":1554.532,"endTime":1555.197,"body":"looking for you to improve."},{"startTime":1555.287,"endTime":1556.767,"body":"Maybe I'm not measuring any of this stuff."},{"startTime":1557.252,"endTime":1557.447,"body":", maybe."},{"startTime":1557.452,"endTime":1557.687,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1558.077,"endTime":1560.927,"body":"The reality that I've been"},{"startTime":1558.077,"endTime":1560.927,"body":"in is they don't even know"},{"startTime":1560.927,"endTime":1562.427,"body":"what cycle time time means."},{"startTime":1562.457,"endTime":1565.217,"body":"They read it somewhere maybe, right?"},{"startTime":1565.277,"endTime":1567.407,"body":"Maybe, oh, maybe they saw a TikTok video."},{"startTime":1567.467,"endTime":1567.857,"body":"I don't know."},{"startTime":1568.007,"endTime":1572.027,"body":"But first thing I would do is to say,"},{"startTime":1568.007,"endTime":1572.027,"body":"okay, you're measuring all these things."},{"startTime":1572.027,"endTime":1575.087,"body":"Let me look at the things"},{"startTime":1572.027,"endTime":1575.087,"body":"you're measuring as variables."},{"startTime":1575.092,"endTime":1576.887,"body":"Make sure they're the right"},{"startTime":1575.092,"endTime":1576.887,"body":"things you're measuring."},{"startTime":1577.757,"endTime":1581.747,"body":"Whether I agree or not agree, I will"},{"startTime":1577.757,"endTime":1581.747,"body":"still baseline all of that stuff."},{"startTime":1581.747,"endTime":1582.067,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1582.167,"endTime":1582.527,"body":", right?"},{"startTime":1582.527,"endTime":1585.587,"body":"That's the first thing I would do, is"},{"startTime":1582.527,"endTime":1585.587,"body":"put a date against what you're measuring"},{"startTime":1585.887,"endTime":1590.267,"body":"and the values and baseline it, and,"},{"startTime":1585.887,"endTime":1590.267,"body":"and then go about my business as a scrum"},{"startTime":1590.267,"endTime":1592.487,"body":"master and come back to it periodically."},{"startTime":1592.697,"endTime":1596.777,"body":"Initially, maybe every sprint or two"},{"startTime":1592.697,"endTime":1596.777,"body":"sprints, come back and look at that"},{"startTime":1596.782,"endTime":1598.967,"body":"and add to that, add to that graph."},{"startTime":1598.967,"endTime":1599.957,"body":"Like, here's your baseline."},{"startTime":1599.957,"endTime":1600.647,"body":"How are you doing?"},{"startTime":1600.647,"endTime":1602.567,"body":"How are you tracking against that, right?"},{"startTime":1602.587,"endTime":1603.027,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1603.107,"endTime":1608.147,"body":". So the baseline is a, a, I was"},{"startTime":1603.107,"endTime":1608.147,"body":"gonna say a line in the sand."},{"startTime":1608.337,"endTime":1609.617,"body":"A, a line on a graph."},{"startTime":1609.707,"endTime":1613.217,"body":"Um, if you are improving,"},{"startTime":1609.707,"endTime":1613.217,"body":"trend the team, right?"},{"startTime":1613.222,"endTime":1613.507,"body":"It's a trend."},{"startTime":1613.507,"endTime":1613.987,"body":"It's a trend."},{"startTime":1614.207,"endTime":1614.357,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1614.357,"endTime":1618.887,"body":"So if you're improving the team,"},{"startTime":1614.357,"endTime":1618.887,"body":"you, you wanna see where your data"},{"startTime":1618.887,"endTime":1620.657,"body":"points are against that, right?"},{"startTime":1620.697,"endTime":1620.857,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1620.857,"endTime":1620.858,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1620.863,"endTime":1622.457,"body":"And you map that over a few sprints."},{"startTime":1622.577,"endTime":1623.057,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1623.137,"endTime":1626.717,"body":", and I guarantee you, if you're scrum"},{"startTime":1623.137,"endTime":1626.717,"body":"master worth salt, you are going to"},{"startTime":1626.722,"endTime":1631.427,"body":"see a deviation from that trend line"},{"startTime":1626.722,"endTime":1631.427,"body":"towards the better you, you're gonna"},{"startTime":1631.427,"endTime":1634.767,"body":"see that cuz you're doing your job"},{"startTime":1631.427,"endTime":1634.767,"body":"and, and so periodically you would"},{"startTime":1634.827,"endTime":1637.44,"body":"get in front of that manager Yeah."},{"startTime":1637.5,"endTime":1641.28,"body":"And say, here is how"},{"startTime":1637.5,"endTime":1641.28,"body":"we are tracking today."},{"startTime":1641.55,"endTime":1645.33,"body":"And then you're gonna say"},{"startTime":1641.55,"endTime":1645.33,"body":"extrapolate this six months out."},{"startTime":1645.87,"endTime":1646.5,"body":"Boom."},{"startTime":1646.98,"endTime":1647.67,"body":"There you go."},{"startTime":1648.605,"endTime":1651.815,"body":","},{"startTime":1648.605,"endTime":1651.815,"body":"we talked about this actually last night"},{"startTime":1651.965,"endTime":1652.395,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"startTime":1652.395,"endTime":1655.005,"body":"There's a element of self-promotion"},{"startTime":1652.395,"endTime":1655.005,"body":"here that a lot of people"},{"startTime":1655.005,"endTime":1655.905,"body":"are uncomfortable with..."},{"startTime":1656.158,"endTime":1659.037,"body":"before  you'd put times and dates"},{"startTime":1656.158,"endTime":1659.037,"body":"to things that had dependencies."},{"startTime":1659.307,"endTime":1663.147,"body":"Now there's almost no dependencies in"},{"startTime":1659.307,"endTime":1663.147,"body":"any of the backlog items cuz we vet"},{"startTime":1663.152,"endTime":1666.267,"body":"them out after the refinements and make"},{"startTime":1663.152,"endTime":1666.267,"body":"sure that things that have dependencies"},{"startTime":1666.267,"endTime":1670.437,"body":"either either get moved off until the"},{"startTime":1666.267,"endTime":1670.437,"body":"dependencies are knocked out and, you"},{"startTime":1670.437,"endTime":1674.308,"body":"know, kicked down in the backlog or"},{"startTime":1670.437,"endTime":1674.308,"body":"we break them up and hand 'em to the"},{"startTime":1674.313,"endTime":1675.957,"body":"teams that are responsible or whatever."},{"startTime":1676.317,"endTime":1680.157,"body":"Or maybe the better thing is"},{"startTime":1676.317,"endTime":1680.157,"body":"we've done a little responsive"},{"startTime":1680.157,"endTime":1681.957,"body":"organizational design here and there."},{"startTime":1681.957,"endTime":1685.287,"body":"Little, little sprinkling around"},{"startTime":1681.957,"endTime":1685.287,"body":"here in this first six months."},{"startTime":1685.347,"endTime":1687.297,"body":"You'd be weird really"},{"startTime":1685.347,"endTime":1687.297,"body":"doing well to do that."},{"startTime":1687.357,"endTime":1688.437,"body":"I, I, I mean, it depends."},{"startTime":1688.437,"endTime":1691.397,"body":"It depends it depends"},{"startTime":1688.437,"endTime":1691.397,"body":"how much they're hurting."},{"startTime":1691.847,"endTime":1695.297,"body":"I've gone into an organization, I've,"},{"startTime":1691.847,"endTime":1695.297,"body":"I've gone into this product, but"},{"startTime":1695.302,"endTime":1701.587,"body":"product wearing my, like, Hey, I've"},{"startTime":1695.302,"endTime":1701.587,"body":"been in an agile coach role before  hat."},{"startTime":1701.977,"endTime":1704.797,"body":"basically the, the person with"},{"startTime":1701.977,"endTime":1704.797,"body":"experience in the room hat."},{"startTime":1705.217,"endTime":1705.517,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1705.857,"endTime":1708.222,"body":"And I've recommended organizational"},{"startTime":1705.857,"endTime":1708.222,"body":"changes to say like, Hey,"},{"startTime":1708.222,"endTime":1710.172,"body":"if we change these things, I"},{"startTime":1708.222,"endTime":1710.172,"body":"think we'll be more efficient."},{"startTime":1710.322,"endTime":1713.472,"body":"Your positioned at a different level"},{"startTime":1710.322,"endTime":1713.472,"body":"at that point than a scrum master"},{"startTime":1713.472,"endTime":1715.662,"body":"typically would be, especially"},{"startTime":1713.472,"endTime":1715.662,"body":"if they were the first Scrum"},{"startTime":1715.662,"endTime":1717.072,"body":"master this company's looking at."},{"startTime":1717.522,"endTime":1718.992,"body":"So there's no credibility, right."},{"startTime":1718.992,"endTime":1722.502,"body":"You build your own credibility to"},{"startTime":1718.992,"endTime":1722.502,"body":"your point about self-promotion."},{"startTime":1722.562,"endTime":1722.802,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1722.832,"endTime":1726.462,"body":"That is very much true that people,"},{"startTime":1722.832,"endTime":1726.462,"body":"people are afraid to do that"},{"startTime":1726.672,"endTime":1727.892,"body":"and I don't know why they are."},{"startTime":1728.142,"endTime":1728.232,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1728.237,"endTime":1730.512,"body":"So at that point in time, you've been"},{"startTime":1728.237,"endTime":1730.512,"body":"more of an agile coach then, right?"},{"startTime":1730.782,"endTime":1734.542,"body":"I'm glad you brought it up and I'm"},{"startTime":1730.782,"endTime":1734.542,"body":"gonna pivot right now because so there"},{"startTime":1734.547,"endTime":1739.542,"body":"is the like this is a real thing with"},{"startTime":1734.547,"endTime":1739.542,"body":"the people, like the people near the"},{"startTime":1739.542,"endTime":1741.582,"body":"top of the field, the people that"},{"startTime":1739.542,"endTime":1741.582,"body":"have been practicing the longest,"},{"startTime":1741.822,"endTime":1743.142,"body":"they will tell you that title creep."},{"startTime":1743.637,"endTime":1745.137,"body":"in the field is a real thing."},{"startTime":1745.287,"endTime":1747.477,"body":"Like it used to be"},{"startTime":1745.287,"endTime":1747.477,"body":"everyone was Scrum masters."},{"startTime":1747.567,"endTime":1747.717,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1747.962,"endTime":1753.177,"body":". And then the, some scrum masters re"},{"startTime":1747.962,"endTime":1753.177,"body":"retitled themselves as agile coaches"},{"startTime":1753.177,"endTime":1756.597,"body":"because they felt that the, the, the,"},{"startTime":1753.177,"endTime":1756.597,"body":"the, the pool of people that were Scrum"},{"startTime":1756.597,"endTime":1760.347,"body":"masters were like getting diluted with"},{"startTime":1756.597,"endTime":1760.347,"body":"a people with two day certs, didn't"},{"startTime":1760.347,"endTime":1761.337,"body":"really know what they were doing."},{"startTime":1761.337,"endTime":1764.397,"body":"Or people that didn't have development"},{"startTime":1761.337,"endTime":1764.397,"body":"backgrounds that didn't really know how"},{"startTime":1764.397,"endTime":1766.677,"body":"to train other people in XP and whatever."},{"startTime":1766.677,"endTime":1768.687,"body":"And then they, they called"},{"startTime":1766.677,"endTime":1768.687,"body":"themselves agile coaches."},{"startTime":1769.047,"endTime":1772.437,"body":"And now, now you have another"},{"startTime":1769.047,"endTime":1772.437,"body":"level of the enterprise coaches"},{"startTime":1772.437,"endTime":1775.107,"body":"and I see product coaches, now it's"},{"startTime":1772.437,"endTime":1775.107,"body":"starting to become a hot thing."},{"startTime":1775.112,"endTime":1775.427,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1775.507,"endTime":1778.157,"body":", the growth product managers are be"},{"startTime":1775.507,"endTime":1778.157,"body":"starting to become a hot thing, they're"},{"startTime":1778.157,"endTime":1781.657,"body":"breaking up the fellowship now and"},{"startTime":1778.157,"endTime":1781.657,"body":"going different ways at the end of the"},{"startTime":1781.662,"endTime":1783.607,"body":"movie because they're all trying to."},{"startTime":1784.717,"endTime":1786.067,"body":"Bring their own rings into the picture."},{"startTime":1786.067,"endTime":1786.367,"body":"Exactly."},{"startTime":1786.467,"endTime":1786.907,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1786.907,"endTime":1787.027,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1787.157,"endTime":1788.027,"body":"Here's another thing."},{"startTime":1788.027,"endTime":1790.487,"body":"You, we can go back to that 2 99."},{"startTime":1790.817,"endTime":1794.597,"body":"You could hire, you could have the,"},{"startTime":1790.817,"endTime":1794.597,"body":"the, the Scrum masters as the assistant"},{"startTime":1794.597,"endTime":1801.477,"body":"brick layer  and the scrum coaches as"},{"startTime":1794.597,"endTime":1801.477,"body":"the actual brick layer , how about that?"},{"startTime":1801.877,"endTime":1805.473,"body":"You, you could, but that's why we, we"},{"startTime":1801.877,"endTime":1805.473,"body":"needed to get through the , what are"},{"startTime":1805.473,"endTime":1806.703,"body":"you gonna do for the organization?"},{"startTime":1806.883,"endTime":1808.803,"body":"I'm, well, I'm trying to get you"},{"startTime":1806.883,"endTime":1808.803,"body":"through the, the, what are you"},{"startTime":1808.808,"endTime":1810.033,"body":"gonna do for my organization?"},{"startTime":1810.093,"endTime":1813.093,"body":"Uh, discussion, not, oh, number"},{"startTime":1810.093,"endTime":1813.093,"body":"one, because I'm quite enjoying"},{"startTime":1813.093,"endTime":1814.173,"body":"playing the angry manager."},{"startTime":1814.413,"endTime":1817.383,"body":"Uh, but also, oh, the, actually"},{"startTime":1814.413,"endTime":1817.383,"body":"the obstinate manager is"},{"startTime":1817.473,"endTime":1818.173,"body":"what I'm playing right now."},{"startTime":1818.173,"endTime":1818.823,"body":"OB Obstinate."},{"startTime":1818.823,"endTime":1819.003,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1819.003,"endTime":1820.083,"body":"Cause I don't wanna change my ways."},{"startTime":1820.443,"endTime":1824.763,"body":"I just wanna layer this new, new fan"},{"startTime":1820.443,"endTime":1824.763,"body":"angle, agile stuff over my current"},{"startTime":1824.768,"endTime":1828.003,"body":"way of working and say, see, we were"},{"startTime":1824.768,"endTime":1828.003,"body":"doing it the right way the whole time."},{"startTime":1828.213,"endTime":1829.803,"body":"Now give me my yearly bonus."},{"startTime":1829.833,"endTime":1830.163,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1830.223,"endTime":1833.823,"body":"You, you just brought a new set of"},{"startTime":1830.223,"endTime":1833.823,"body":"terminology on what we were already"},{"startTime":1833.823,"endTime":1835.773,"body":"doing all along Anyway, , right."},{"startTime":1835.953,"endTime":1837.213,"body":"We have project managers."},{"startTime":1837.543,"endTime":1841.023,"body":"What no project managers in, we'll"},{"startTime":1837.543,"endTime":1841.023,"body":"just call 'em project managers"},{"startTime":1841.438,"endTime":1843.153,"body":"that's, or agile delivery leads."},{"startTime":1843.158,"endTime":1843.713,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1843.813,"endTime":1844.483,"body":"You're gonna get that."},{"startTime":1844.543,"endTime":1847.633,"body":"You're absolutely gonna get"},{"startTime":1844.543,"endTime":1847.633,"body":"that going into an organization."},{"startTime":1847.693,"endTime":1850.873,"body":"You need to look sideways too,"},{"startTime":1847.693,"endTime":1850.873,"body":"not just the team that you're"},{"startTime":1850.873,"endTime":1852.883,"body":"coaching or, or, or Scrum Master."},{"startTime":1853.068,"endTime":1853.173,"body":"Mm."},{"startTime":1853.723,"endTime":1858.873,"body":"Well look at how other teams are working,"},{"startTime":1853.723,"endTime":1858.873,"body":"that's gonna give you a sense of what"},{"startTime":1858.873,"endTime":1862.143,"body":"the level of agility is at that company."},{"startTime":1862.803,"endTime":1866.343,"body":"And once you establish that, you"},{"startTime":1862.803,"endTime":1866.343,"body":"can basically play your next card."},{"startTime":1866.343,"endTime":1866.733,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":1866.738,"endTime":1866.873,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1866.873,"endTime":1867.313,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1867.533,"endTime":1871.413,"body":"So, so step one is come"},{"startTime":1867.533,"endTime":1871.413,"body":"up with some baselines."},{"startTime":1871.413,"endTime":1873.253,"body":"Come up with the, the"},{"startTime":1871.413,"endTime":1873.253,"body":"current level of, yeah."},{"startTime":1873.253,"endTime":1877.323,"body":"So have, have a baseline of where, where"},{"startTime":1873.253,"endTime":1877.323,"body":"the company is and where the team is,"},{"startTime":1877.863,"endTime":1882.153,"body":"and then see how you can, you can grow"},{"startTime":1877.863,"endTime":1882.153,"body":"that, how you can make that better."},{"startTime":1882.663,"endTime":1884.283,"body":"And then you can display that."},{"startTime":1884.283,"endTime":1887.163,"body":"So create some kind of like,"},{"startTime":1884.283,"endTime":1887.163,"body":"like a, like a dashboard."},{"startTime":1887.163,"endTime":1887.403,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":1887.683,"endTime":1891.013,"body":"I'm, I mean, I, I'm a hundred percent"},{"startTime":1887.683,"endTime":1891.013,"body":"on board for more transparency"},{"startTime":1891.073,"endTime":1892.273,"body":"through throughout all layers."},{"startTime":1892.453,"endTime":1894.253,"body":"I'm also a hundred percent"},{"startTime":1892.453,"endTime":1894.253,"body":"on board for anything that is"},{"startTime":1894.253,"endTime":1895.963,"body":"one, a single source of truth."},{"startTime":1895.993,"endTime":1896.393,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":1896.473,"endTime":1897.433,"body":"that I can drive the whole business to."},{"startTime":1897.913,"endTime":1899.983,"body":"If I can have a single source of"},{"startTime":1897.913,"endTime":1899.983,"body":"truth for where things are and I"},{"startTime":1899.988,"endTime":1901.243,"body":"don't have to drive around, oh, okay."},{"startTime":1901.243,"endTime":1903.913,"body":"I'll go to this project manager, he"},{"startTime":1901.243,"endTime":1903.913,"body":"tells me something and I go to this other"},{"startTime":1903.913,"endTime":1906.913,"body":"project manager, but I really don't go"},{"startTime":1903.913,"endTime":1906.913,"body":"to them very often cuz every, they always"},{"startTime":1906.918,"endTime":1909.913,"body":"spin it where it's not their fault and"},{"startTime":1906.918,"endTime":1909.913,"body":"they always tell me everything's good."},{"startTime":1909.913,"endTime":1910.993,"body":"So I don't really go to them anymore."},{"startTime":1911.113,"endTime":1913.953,"body":"And then I go to this other project"},{"startTime":1911.113,"endTime":1913.953,"body":"manager cuz they tell me the, the"},{"startTime":1913.958,"endTime":1916.213,"body":"in the weeds kind of stuff, and"},{"startTime":1913.958,"endTime":1916.213,"body":"then I know who else to talk to."},{"startTime":1916.273,"endTime":1920.593,"body":", rather than play that game, I would"},{"startTime":1916.273,"endTime":1920.593,"body":"rather go to one single source of truth"},{"startTime":1920.983,"endTime":1922.603,"body":"and see the information from myself."},{"startTime":1922.608,"endTime":1924.853,"body":"So I, I'm, that's good for"},{"startTime":1922.608,"endTime":1924.853,"body":"me, that's good for me."},{"startTime":1924.913,"endTime":1927.108,"body":"As, as the obstinate"},{"startTime":1924.913,"endTime":1927.108,"body":"executive in this example."},{"startTime":1927.498,"endTime":1933.168,"body":"But now, okay, now I'm seeing the, the,"},{"startTime":1927.498,"endTime":1933.168,"body":"the problem with presenting clear data to"},{"startTime":1933.408,"endTime":1939.408,"body":"people, especially people in management"},{"startTime":1933.408,"endTime":1939.408,"body":"role is once they see it presented in"},{"startTime":1939.413,"endTime":1944.028,"body":"a, in a transparent and clear way, once"},{"startTime":1939.413,"endTime":1944.028,"body":"you go through the, the time of getting"},{"startTime":1944.028,"endTime":1948.018,"body":"every team to track their metrics and"},{"startTime":1944.028,"endTime":1948.018,"body":"getting every team to fill out their"},{"startTime":1948.018,"endTime":1951.138,"body":"stuff every day and to move work items"},{"startTime":1948.018,"endTime":1951.138,"body":"and stuff like that, once you get all"},{"startTime":1951.138,"endTime":1954.318,"body":"that stuff down and you get it and you"},{"startTime":1951.138,"endTime":1954.318,"body":"roll it into a dashboard for an executive,"},{"startTime":1954.323,"endTime":1958.058,"body":"the executive, the first thing I'm gonna"},{"startTime":1954.323,"endTime":1958.058,"body":"say is, okay, this is this is great."},{"startTime":1958.118,"endTime":1959.528,"body":"Okay, so what do we do with this?"},{"startTime":1959.708,"endTime":1960.848,"body":"So what, actually, no, I'm sorry."},{"startTime":1961.028,"endTime":1964.358,"body":"They'll say, so what are you"},{"startTime":1961.028,"endTime":1964.358,"body":"going to do next with this?"},{"startTime":1964.778,"endTime":1969.008,"body":"Of course, the wait time is this, and of"},{"startTime":1964.778,"endTime":1969.008,"body":"course we need less risks, and of course"},{"startTime":1969.008,"endTime":1970.508,"body":"we need to manage the dependencies of."},{"startTime":1971.588,"endTime":1972.568,"body":"A hundred percent on board."},{"startTime":1972.808,"endTime":1973.468,"body":"Great response."},{"startTime":1974.308,"endTime":1974.908,"body":"What's next?"},{"startTime":1974.908,"endTime":1975.058,"body":"What?"},{"startTime":1975.058,"endTime":1976.378,"body":"Like, that's the first 30 days."},{"startTime":1976.498,"endTime":1980.248,"body":"What, what's the, the mi"},{"startTime":1976.498,"endTime":1980.248,"body":"like the 30 to 90 day range."},{"startTime":1980.248,"endTime":1982.498,"body":"Now, how are you gonna drive"},{"startTime":1980.248,"endTime":1982.498,"body":"change for the organization?"},{"startTime":1982.498,"endTime":1983.338,"body":"What does that look like?"},{"startTime":1983.343,"endTime":1984.088,"body":"How are you gonna start?"},{"startTime":1984.328,"endTime":1986.698,"body":"Because in the first 30 days that"},{"startTime":1984.328,"endTime":1986.698,"body":"I've had a scrum master working"},{"startTime":1986.698,"endTime":1990.658,"body":"in my organization, I've taken it"},{"startTime":1986.698,"endTime":1990.658,"body":"upon myself, the very busy manager."},{"startTime":1990.663,"endTime":1992.938,"body":"I'm very busy to read the scrum guide."},{"startTime":1992.998,"endTime":1995.398,"body":"And I found this little"},{"startTime":1992.998,"endTime":1995.398,"body":"snippet inside the scrum guide."},{"startTime":1995.398,"endTime":1995.998,"body":"And it says,"},{"startTime":1996.075,"endTime":2001.96,"body":"and I quote, , the scrum master is"},{"startTime":1996.075,"endTime":2001.96,"body":"accountable for the team's effectiveness."},{"startTime":2002.4,"endTime":2005.49,"body":"that's what I read online"},{"startTime":2002.4,"endTime":2005.49,"body":"in your Holy Scrum document."},{"startTime":2005.82,"endTime":2008.46,"body":"Like it says, you are accountable"},{"startTime":2005.82,"endTime":2008.46,"body":"for the team's effectiveness."},{"startTime":2008.7,"endTime":2012.66,"body":"So, so that means I need some kind"},{"startTime":2008.7,"endTime":2012.66,"body":"of metric for the, for the team's"},{"startTime":2012.99,"endTime":2017.13,"body":"effectiveness that I can hold you to."},{"startTime":2017.46,"endTime":2017.79,"body":"Oh boy."},{"startTime":2019.35,"endTime":2020.91,"body":"Again, well, I sound really combative."},{"startTime":2020.915,"endTime":2022.48,"body":"I'm really getting, this is fine."},{"startTime":2022.48,"endTime":2023.31,"body":"I'm into this role."},{"startTime":2023.46,"endTime":2024.21,"body":"Let, let's get in this."},{"startTime":2024.21,"endTime":2026.01,"body":"So what, what are you going,"},{"startTime":2024.21,"endTime":2026.01,"body":"what are you gonna, yeah."},{"startTime":2026.01,"endTime":2027.18,"body":"How are you gonna show that?"},{"startTime":2027.27,"endTime":2030.21,"body":"So you talk about, so then we"},{"startTime":2027.27,"endTime":2030.21,"body":"show you de delivery, right?"},{"startTime":2030.63,"endTime":2034.47,"body":"Every sprint we deliver, we"},{"startTime":2030.63,"endTime":2034.47,"body":"plan, we gonna deliver this much."},{"startTime":2034.74,"endTime":2036.93,"body":"And we show you how the"},{"startTime":2034.74,"endTime":2036.93,"body":"trends has been going on."},{"startTime":2037.32,"endTime":2040.02,"body":"We've delivered this form, we've delivered"},{"startTime":2037.32,"endTime":2040.02,"body":"that form, we've delivered that form."},{"startTime":2040.32,"endTime":2043.35,"body":"We show you how much we're"},{"startTime":2040.32,"endTime":2043.35,"body":"progressing through the"},{"startTime":2043.35,"endTime":2045.06,"body":"delivery of the entire product."},{"startTime":2045.12,"endTime":2045.21,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2045.645,"endTime":2048.33,"body":". So we say, okay, we're gonna"},{"startTime":2045.645,"endTime":2048.33,"body":"deliver some refund stuff."},{"startTime":2048.39,"endTime":2048.48,"body":"We've."},{"startTime":2049.005,"endTime":2052.785,"body":"In the past month or so, we've"},{"startTime":2049.005,"endTime":2052.785,"body":"delivered you the, the scan bar."},{"startTime":2052.785,"endTime":2052.995,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":2053.055,"endTime":2053.805,"body":"That works."},{"startTime":2054.315,"endTime":2057.245,"body":"Now we are gonna deliver"},{"startTime":2054.315,"endTime":2057.245,"body":"to you the actual hardware."},{"startTime":2057.245,"endTime":2057.275,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":2057.365,"endTime":2058.985,"body":"That actually scans that scan bar."},{"startTime":2059.555,"endTime":2064.055,"body":"Now we're gonna show you the, so"},{"startTime":2059.555,"endTime":2064.055,"body":"that, that delivery over time showing"},{"startTime":2064.055,"endTime":2068.855,"body":"you how we are progressing towards"},{"startTime":2064.055,"endTime":2068.855,"body":"the final goal of the product."},{"startTime":2070.115,"endTime":2074.375,"body":"And we could create a dashboard if"},{"startTime":2070.115,"endTime":2074.375,"body":"you want to, that shows you how much"},{"startTime":2074.38,"endTime":2079.115,"body":"we've done over the past few sprints or"},{"startTime":2074.38,"endTime":2079.115,"body":"weeks or whatever you want to call it."},{"startTime":2079.215,"endTime":2081.795,"body":"Would you start with"},{"startTime":2079.215,"endTime":2081.795,"body":"the volume of delivery?"},{"startTime":2082.215,"endTime":2083.025,"body":"I'm going down this road."},{"startTime":2084.255,"endTime":2089.505,"body":"I've also been in organizations"},{"startTime":2084.255,"endTime":2089.505,"body":"where like take it from me, everyone"},{"startTime":2089.505,"endTime":2091.185,"body":"listening, all bo, both of you listening,"},{"startTime":2091.618,"endTime":2096.538,"body":"."},{"startTime":2091.618,"endTime":2096.538,"body":"you can fix the delivery problems"},{"startTime":2096.838,"endTime":2101.081,"body":"and say we are delivering twice"},{"startTime":2096.838,"endTime":2101.081,"body":"the work in half the time."},{"startTime":2101.251,"endTime":2106.021,"body":"And then the business is still"},{"startTime":2101.251,"endTime":2106.021,"body":"infuriated because they could care"},{"startTime":2106.021,"endTime":2107.431,"body":"less about anything you're delivering."},{"startTime":2107.551,"endTime":2110.251,"body":"So if the metrics I'm judging"},{"startTime":2107.551,"endTime":2110.251,"body":"you off of are all metrics"},{"startTime":2110.251,"endTime":2112.422,"body":"about working in the business."},{"startTime":2112.646,"endTime":2114.536,"body":"Ed, you're gonna, you're"},{"startTime":2112.646,"endTime":2114.536,"body":"gonna like this one."},{"startTime":2114.596,"endTime":2115.916,"body":"Uh, got, got this one for you."},{"startTime":2115.926,"endTime":2117.236,"body":"He, he just looked up at the monitor."},{"startTime":2117.241,"endTime":2117.386,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2117.503,"endTime":2119.203,"body":"Gino Wickman Traction book."},{"startTime":2119.253,"endTime":2122.253,"body":"It's the book where they introduced"},{"startTime":2119.253,"endTime":2122.253,"body":"the entrepreneurial operating system."},{"startTime":2122.333,"endTime":2123.293,"body":"The EOs e os."},{"startTime":2123.353,"endTime":2123.623,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2123.628,"endTime":2128.003,"body":"And, and uh, in that book, he outlines"},{"startTime":2123.628,"endTime":2128.003,"body":"the concept of everybody at the"},{"startTime":2128.003,"endTime":2130.67,"body":"company has to work in the business."},{"startTime":2131.04,"endTime":2133.345,"body":"You're an employee, you're punching out"},{"startTime":2131.04,"endTime":2133.345,"body":"work, you're sending it to customers,"},{"startTime":2133.395,"endTime":2137.535,"body":"you're making money for the company"},{"startTime":2133.395,"endTime":2137.535,"body":"that's working in the business."},{"startTime":2137.54,"endTime":2137.935,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":2137.985,"endTime":2142.335,"body":"But then he outlines a concept of"},{"startTime":2137.985,"endTime":2142.335,"body":"occasionally you have to stop, take a"},{"startTime":2142.335,"endTime":2146.925,"body":"big step back and look at the business"},{"startTime":2142.335,"endTime":2146.925,"body":"from outside and work on the business."},{"startTime":2147.625,"endTime":2149.185,"body":"This is what I'm driving to is."},{"startTime":2149.65,"endTime":2152.72,"body":"You spend a significant amount of"},{"startTime":2149.65,"endTime":2152.72,"body":"time fixing the delivery function."},{"startTime":2152.725,"endTime":2152.83,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2153.49,"endTime":2155.05,"body":"delivery function is very important."},{"startTime":2155.62,"endTime":2158.4,"body":"Without the delivery function,  if"},{"startTime":2155.62,"endTime":2158.4,"body":"you're going six, eight months"},{"startTime":2158.4,"endTime":2161.52,"body":"without delivering anything, truly"},{"startTime":2158.4,"endTime":2161.52,"body":"everyone will be outta the job."},{"startTime":2161.55,"endTime":2162.66,"body":"I've seen that happen too."},{"startTime":2162.72,"endTime":2162.96,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":2162.96,"endTime":2163.08,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":2163.17,"endTime":2164.07,"body":"No, no delivery."},{"startTime":2164.075,"endTime":2166.89,"body":"And the management just gets"},{"startTime":2164.075,"endTime":2166.89,"body":"frustrated and says, I'm just"},{"startTime":2166.89,"endTime":2168.95,"body":"canning this whole team, you're out."},{"startTime":2168.95,"endTime":2169.63,"body":"You're all gone."},{"startTime":2169.68,"endTime":2172.56,"body":"Oh, yeah, I'll, I'll start"},{"startTime":2169.68,"endTime":2172.56,"body":"over and I'll take a chance."},{"startTime":2172.98,"endTime":2176.22,"body":"I've seen that, so I hope I"},{"startTime":2172.98,"endTime":2176.22,"body":"obviously been on projects like that."},{"startTime":2176.25,"endTime":2176.46,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2176.49,"endTime":2177.3,"body":"Don't let that happen."},{"startTime":2177.84,"endTime":2185.095,"body":"But the metrics associated with"},{"startTime":2177.84,"endTime":2185.095,"body":"working on the business, the attempts"},{"startTime":2185.095,"endTime":2188.585,"body":"and things that we've tried, things"},{"startTime":2185.095,"endTime":2188.585,"body":"that we've failed, succeeded."},{"startTime":2188.585,"endTime":2188.735,"body":"What?"},{"startTime":2189.565,"endTime":2193.265,"body":"and you showing progress that goes way"},{"startTime":2189.565,"endTime":2193.265,"body":"deeper than fixing the delivery function."},{"startTime":2193.385,"endTime":2193.505,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2194.375,"endTime":2198.665,"body":"And I would argue, I would argue"},{"startTime":2194.375,"endTime":2198.665,"body":"that most Scrum Masters number one,"},{"startTime":2198.67,"endTime":2202.325,"body":"self-promotion, that's why I brought up"},{"startTime":2198.67,"endTime":2202.325,"body":"self-promotion real or well real early."},{"startTime":2202.585,"endTime":2203.965,"body":"That's why I brought up self-promotion."},{"startTime":2203.965,"endTime":2208.375,"body":"I think it's important managers, if"},{"startTime":2203.965,"endTime":2208.375,"body":"you read the Amazon book the Working"},{"startTime":2208.375,"endTime":2211.645,"body":"Backwards Amazon book about how they"},{"startTime":2208.375,"endTime":2211.645,"body":"appoint single threaded leaders to say,"},{"startTime":2211.645,"endTime":2214.975,"body":"okay, you're Ayo, you're the person in"},{"startTime":2211.645,"endTime":2214.975,"body":"charge of all of this segment of the"},{"startTime":2214.975,"endTime":2219.655,"body":"business, Amazon Alexa, whenever anyone"},{"startTime":2214.975,"endTime":2219.655,"body":"in the business wants to know about the"},{"startTime":2219.655,"endTime":2222.235,"body":"future of Amazon Alexa, we all go to you."},{"startTime":2222.575,"endTime":2223.065,"body":"Okay?"},{"startTime":2223.225,"endTime":2225.085,"body":"You have the budget, you have"},{"startTime":2223.225,"endTime":2225.085,"body":"all the teams, everything."},{"startTime":2225.085,"endTime":2228.205,"body":"We all go to you completely your"},{"startTime":2225.085,"endTime":2228.205,"body":"responsibility, single threaded"},{"startTime":2228.205,"endTime":2229.105,"body":"leader in the organization."},{"startTime":2229.285,"endTime":2232.435,"body":"So if you are the single threaded leader"},{"startTime":2229.285,"endTime":2232.435,"body":"in the organization that we go to for the"},{"startTime":2232.435,"endTime":2234.535,"body":"effectiveness of whatever teams, right?"},{"startTime":2234.54,"endTime":2237.355,"body":"Whatever team or teams you're assigned"},{"startTime":2234.54,"endTime":2237.355,"body":"to, hopefully it's not a lot of"},{"startTime":2237.355,"endTime":2238.795,"body":"teams, cuz that gets ridiculous."},{"startTime":2238.795,"endTime":2239.125,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":2239.242,"endTime":2242.392,"body":"What are your metrics now"},{"startTime":2239.242,"endTime":2242.392,"body":"for working on the business?"},{"startTime":2243.062,"endTime":2246.512,"body":"I feel the problem, what we're having"},{"startTime":2243.062,"endTime":2246.512,"body":"now and the, the, the, the obstinate"},{"startTime":2246.512,"endTime":2249.547,"body":"manager that I'm playing on TV right"},{"startTime":2246.512,"endTime":2249.547,"body":"now they don't talk about, nor do"},{"startTime":2249.547,"endTime":2255.367,"body":"they have awareness about working on"},{"startTime":2249.547,"endTime":2255.367,"body":"the business, continually improving."},{"startTime":2255.372,"endTime":2256.467,"body":"He's asked you some questions."},{"startTime":2256.472,"endTime":2259.207,"body":"I'll let you respond first, but I"},{"startTime":2256.472,"endTime":2259.207,"body":"have something I wanna jump in with."},{"startTime":2259.537,"endTime":2262.477,"body":"Let me, lemme let you go because it"},{"startTime":2259.537,"endTime":2262.477,"body":"looks like, okay, so let me look."},{"startTime":2262.477,"endTime":2263.137,"body":"Spin in there."},{"startTime":2263.257,"endTime":2267.907,"body":"One are, one of the things about these"},{"startTime":2263.257,"endTime":2267.907,"body":"types of metrics, they're typically"},{"startTime":2267.907,"endTime":2271.447,"body":"bundled up under feely, right?"},{"startTime":2271.597,"endTime":2274.477,"body":"Oh, the teams is, the teams are happier."},{"startTime":2274.477,"endTime":2276.067,"body":"Now, how do you know how much happier?"},{"startTime":2277.297,"endTime":2278.347,"body":", 30% happier."},{"startTime":2278.677,"endTime":2281.437,"body":"You can't really peg"},{"startTime":2278.677,"endTime":2281.437,"body":"down a percentage on it."},{"startTime":2281.797,"endTime":2284.917,"body":"So I think it goes back to"},{"startTime":2281.797,"endTime":2284.917,"body":"what we were talking about."},{"startTime":2286.117,"endTime":2287.947,"body":"We said, how do you improve"},{"startTime":2288.367,"endTime":2290.557,"body":"The team's effectiveness."},{"startTime":2290.74,"endTime":2294.977,"body":"Most of the time, management,"},{"startTime":2290.74,"endTime":2294.977,"body":"management are, are focused on the"},{"startTime":2294.977,"endTime":2298.067,"body":"team's efficiency, not effectiveness."},{"startTime":2298.247,"endTime":2303.377,"body":"So when you talk about metrics that"},{"startTime":2298.247,"endTime":2303.377,"body":"speak of improvements or otherwise of"},{"startTime":2303.377,"endTime":2308.897,"body":"effectiveness, they're kind of gone"},{"startTime":2303.377,"endTime":2308.897,"body":"like, oh, the teams are happier now."},{"startTime":2308.897,"endTime":2309.977,"body":"How much happier are they?"},{"startTime":2309.977,"endTime":2311.687,"body":"How do you know they're"},{"startTime":2309.977,"endTime":2311.687,"body":"happier, first of all?"},{"startTime":2311.847,"endTime":2312.167,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2312.252,"endTime":2312.497,"body":". Right?"},{"startTime":2312.977,"endTime":2314.527,"body":"How do you measure happiness?"},{"startTime":2314.837,"endTime":2315.557,"body":"Are you tracking it?"},{"startTime":2315.827,"endTime":2316.457,"body":"Exactly."},{"startTime":2316.457,"endTime":2318.107,"body":"You have to do that."},{"startTime":2318.377,"endTime":2320.537,"body":"You have, and there are ways"},{"startTime":2318.377,"endTime":2320.537,"body":"to do this, first of all, so."},{"startTime":2321.752,"endTime":2325.292,"body":", our audience are thousand,"},{"startTime":2321.752,"endTime":2325.292,"body":"48 people out there."},{"startTime":2325.297,"endTime":2326.482,"body":"Oh you complain."},{"startTime":2326.572,"endTime":2328.262,"body":"Oh, you can't measure this stuff Om!"},{"startTime":2328.312,"endTime":2331.312,"body":"I say, no, you absolutely can."},{"startTime":2331.352,"endTime":2331.792,"body":"Yeah, yeah, right."},{"startTime":2331.792,"endTime":2332.812,"body":"There are ways to do this."},{"startTime":2333.282,"endTime":2334.632,"body":"Again, baseline is important."},{"startTime":2334.872,"endTime":2336.402,"body":"Day one, baseline, everything."},{"startTime":2336.513,"endTime":2339.573,"body":", are your team members hanging"},{"startTime":2336.513,"endTime":2339.573,"body":"around longer as teams?"},{"startTime":2339.573,"endTime":2340.653,"body":"Is their team churn?"},{"startTime":2340.683,"endTime":2341.793,"body":"Is it slowed down?"},{"startTime":2341.793,"endTime":2342.693,"body":"Is it sped up?"},{"startTime":2342.693,"endTime":2347.153,"body":"Look at those things because that's"},{"startTime":2342.693,"endTime":2347.153,"body":"a direct result of the team members,"},{"startTime":2347.153,"endTime":2349.403,"body":"being content with working on a team."},{"startTime":2349.403,"endTime":2350.183,"body":"They hang around."},{"startTime":2350.213,"endTime":2350.303,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2351.053,"endTime":2352.973,"body":"happy teams are productive teams, right?"},{"startTime":2353.093,"endTime":2353.423,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"startTime":2353.783,"endTime":2354.473,"body":"Productivity."},{"startTime":2355.023,"endTime":2358.943,"body":"The obstinate manager in me might"},{"startTime":2355.023,"endTime":2358.943,"body":"have a an evolution in my thinking."},{"startTime":2358.993,"endTime":2363.823,"body":"If you were to capture that, oh, oh, this"},{"startTime":2358.993,"endTime":2363.823,"body":"is just a, this is a fluffy metric and I,"},{"startTime":2363.973,"endTime":2365.743,"body":"there's no value in this metric for me."},{"startTime":2365.743,"endTime":2367.483,"body":"It's just, well, what do I"},{"startTime":2365.743,"endTime":2367.483,"body":"care about people's feelings?"},{"startTime":2367.603,"endTime":2368.743,"body":"What a statement."},{"startTime":2368.773,"endTime":2370.273,"body":"What a statement to get outta somebody."},{"startTime":2370.273,"endTime":2370.543,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":2370.573,"endTime":2371.623,"body":"Like, what do I care about?"},{"startTime":2371.623,"endTime":2374.113,"body":"Feel . What good is empathy?"},{"startTime":2374.143,"endTime":2374.803,"body":"What good is human?"},{"startTime":2375.333,"endTime":2375.543,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2375.613,"endTime":2378.733,"body":"the first thing you went to, which"},{"startTime":2375.613,"endTime":2378.733,"body":"is, which is, is not a knock on you."},{"startTime":2378.763,"endTime":2382.633,"body":"I expect 99.9% of ScrumMasters"},{"startTime":2378.763,"endTime":2382.633,"body":"to tell me the exact same answer."},{"startTime":2382.813,"endTime":2386.113,"body":"I'm gonna stabilize delivery first"},{"startTime":2382.813,"endTime":2386.113,"body":"because without delivery, yes."},{"startTime":2386.143,"endTime":2387.373,"body":"We can't do anything else."},{"startTime":2387.373,"endTime":2389.353,"body":"Yes, I, I would've,"},{"startTime":2387.373,"endTime":2389.353,"body":"that's not a bad answer."},{"startTime":2389.403,"endTime":2394.263,"body":"If you show me that delivery cadence,"},{"startTime":2389.403,"endTime":2394.263,"body":"what your team is working on down to"},{"startTime":2394.263,"endTime":2398.643,"body":"the story level, I mean real low level"},{"startTime":2394.263,"endTime":2398.643,"body":"details, and then you overlap that,"},{"startTime":2398.703,"endTime":2403.743,"body":"that happiness metric over every day"},{"startTime":2398.703,"endTime":2403.743,"body":"at the end of standup, hit the button."},{"startTime":2403.863,"endTime":2406.803,"body":"Are you, you know, smiley"},{"startTime":2403.863,"endTime":2406.803,"body":"face straight whatever."},{"startTime":2407.183,"endTime":2408.503,"body":"I call it the man face neutral."},{"startTime":2408.503,"endTime":2410.223,"body":"Face neutral man or, or mad face."},{"startTime":2410.223,"endTime":2410.823,"body":"I dunno if I'm happy."},{"startTime":2410.823,"endTime":2411.873,"body":"Or that mad face upside down."},{"startTime":2411.873,"endTime":2412.773,"body":"Or maybe, maybe there's four."},{"startTime":2412.773,"endTime":2413.973,"body":"Maybe there's an actual mad face."},{"startTime":2413.973,"endTime":2414.123,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2414.123,"endTime":2414.423,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2415.828,"endTime":2420.748,"body":"just sh show me that overlapping, because"},{"startTime":2415.828,"endTime":2420.748,"body":"I guarantee you that on, on certain"},{"startTime":2420.748,"endTime":2425.098,"body":"days where it's like the majority of"},{"startTime":2420.748,"endTime":2425.098,"body":"sad faces or whatever it's gonna be"},{"startTime":2425.098,"endTime":2428.788,"body":"when we're in the mid sprint, when"},{"startTime":2425.098,"endTime":2428.788,"body":"we're having problems or issues cropped"},{"startTime":2428.788,"endTime":2430.378,"body":"up or, or just in the deployment."},{"startTime":2430.378,"endTime":2430.678,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2430.713,"endTime":2433.518,"body":"But I guarantee you those, those"},{"startTime":2430.713,"endTime":2433.518,"body":"days where we knock out the sprint"},{"startTime":2433.518,"endTime":2436.818,"body":"goal or people swarm and knock"},{"startTime":2433.518,"endTime":2436.818,"body":"out a story or a story ends, yeah."},{"startTime":2436.818,"endTime":2438.348,"body":"Those are gonna be the happy days."},{"startTime":2438.628,"endTime":2442.528,"body":"I, I would be looking for trends like"},{"startTime":2438.628,"endTime":2442.528,"body":"that and then I'd be looking back to my"},{"startTime":2442.533,"endTime":2447.898,"body":"delivery I'd, I'd actually be looking"},{"startTime":2442.533,"endTime":2447.898,"body":"back to delivery to try to use delivery"},{"startTime":2448.978,"endTime":2450.658,"body":"to increase the happiness in my teams."},{"startTime":2450.808,"endTime":2454.768,"body":"And now we're at, now, now,"},{"startTime":2450.808,"endTime":2454.768,"body":"like we just went through Huge."},{"startTime":2454.768,"endTime":2455.728,"body":"Went to Warp Drive."},{"startTime":2455.758,"endTime":2456.088,"body":"Yes, we did."},{"startTime":2456.088,"endTime":2458.248,"body":"And we are in a whole"},{"startTime":2456.088,"endTime":2458.248,"body":"different universe right now."},{"startTime":2458.248,"endTime":2460.678,"body":"We didn't even know"},{"startTime":2458.248,"endTime":2460.678,"body":"that we could get here."},{"startTime":2460.678,"endTime":2462.538,"body":"We thought it was gonna"},{"startTime":2460.678,"endTime":2462.538,"body":"take thousands of years"},{"startTime":2462.588,"endTime":2469.338,"body":"the happy, sad me mad that, that"},{"startTime":2462.588,"endTime":2469.338,"body":"you talked about the Japanese."},{"startTime":2469.338,"endTime":2470.268,"body":"We've been doing it for years."},{"startTime":2470.268,"endTime":2471.558,"body":"They call it the Nico Nico."},{"startTime":2471.708,"endTime":2471.828,"body":"Mm."},{"startTime":2472.188,"endTime":2472.728,"body":"Calendar."},{"startTime":2472.908,"endTime":2474.618,"body":"So basically, it's really simple, right?"},{"startTime":2474.648,"endTime":2477.648,"body":"You have a sprain, two,"},{"startTime":2474.648,"endTime":2477.648,"body":"three weeks, whatever it is."},{"startTime":2477.948,"endTime":2482.385,"body":"Just drop a calendar and ask your team"},{"startTime":2477.948,"endTime":2482.385,"body":"you know, on the way out of the, the Daily"},{"startTime":2482.385,"endTime":2487.5,"body":"Scrum perhaps just reflect on yesterday"},{"startTime":2482.385,"endTime":2487.5,"body":"and put one of the images on there."},{"startTime":2487.53,"endTime":2488.91,"body":"Like, how did the yesterday go?"},{"startTime":2488.91,"endTime":2492.24,"body":"Did you feel happy, sad, mad, glad."},{"startTime":2492.945,"endTime":2493.215,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2493.215,"endTime":2496.605,"body":"Just put that on there and at the end"},{"startTime":2493.215,"endTime":2496.605,"body":"of the sprint you can look back and as"},{"startTime":2496.605,"endTime":2498.045,"body":"Brian was saying, you could see trends."},{"startTime":2498.345,"endTime":2500.325,"body":"There were certain times when"},{"startTime":2498.345,"endTime":2500.325,"body":"everybody's happy because things"},{"startTime":2500.325,"endTime":2501.915,"body":"were really just falling into place."},{"startTime":2502.215,"endTime":2506.595,"body":"Other times when majority of the people"},{"startTime":2502.215,"endTime":2506.595,"body":"were not happy because, and then you"},{"startTime":2506.595,"endTime":2510.885,"body":"can dive into the, because why, how do"},{"startTime":2506.595,"endTime":2510.885,"body":"we prevent that from happening again?"},{"startTime":2511.605,"endTime":2517.215,"body":"So again, management may or may"},{"startTime":2511.605,"endTime":2517.215,"body":"not understand that leadership"},{"startTime":2517.215,"endTime":2519.165,"body":"certainly will understand."},{"startTime":2519.165,"endTime":2520.545,"body":"That is my hope out there."},{"startTime":2520.815,"endTime":2520.975,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2520.995,"endTime":2521.265,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2521.265,"endTime":2525.735,"body":"Because happy teams are more"},{"startTime":2521.265,"endTime":2525.735,"body":"productive that there's been a whole"},{"startTime":2525.735,"endTime":2527.025,"body":"bunch of research done on that."},{"startTime":2527.625,"endTime":2527.865,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2528.195,"endTime":2532.87,"body":"There's actually a tool that my last"},{"startTime":2528.195,"endTime":2532.87,"body":"company that we had where we do,"},{"startTime":2533.38,"endTime":2538.765,"body":"it's not really a retrospective, it's"},{"startTime":2533.38,"endTime":2538.765,"body":"like,  a, a quarterly event where"},{"startTime":2538.765,"endTime":2543.085,"body":"we, the teams get together and we"},{"startTime":2538.765,"endTime":2543.085,"body":"I'm trying to remember what, what,"},{"startTime":2543.235,"endTime":2544.585,"body":"what the, what the tool was called."},{"startTime":2544.585,"endTime":2549.205,"body":"Where we, we go through and we have"},{"startTime":2544.585,"endTime":2549.205,"body":"different items to, to talk about."},{"startTime":2549.205,"endTime":2553.735,"body":"Okay, what do you, it is, I guess it"},{"startTime":2549.205,"endTime":2553.735,"body":"goes in the line of a retro, but it's not"},{"startTime":2553.735,"endTime":2558.355,"body":"really a retro wear on a quarterly basis"},{"startTime":2553.735,"endTime":2558.355,"body":"saying, okay, what do you think happened?"},{"startTime":2558.355,"endTime":2560.125,"body":"How did this happen?"},{"startTime":2560.205,"endTime":2561.585,"body":"did we think we're, we're doing good?"},{"startTime":2561.635,"endTime":2564.695,"body":"Kind of just, just try trying to"},{"startTime":2561.635,"endTime":2564.695,"body":"measure that, that happiness of"},{"startTime":2564.845,"endTime":2566.245,"body":"how people see the team is and."},{"startTime":2566.69,"endTime":2571.55,"body":"That, that actually fosters discussion"},{"startTime":2566.69,"endTime":2571.55,"body":"within the team of, okay, you obviously"},{"startTime":2571.55,"endTime":2573.86,"body":"have some people that, that don't"},{"startTime":2571.55,"endTime":2573.86,"body":"want to talk, but you have Sure."},{"startTime":2574.22,"endTime":2578.38,"body":"But you have, they kind of, everybody has"},{"startTime":2574.22,"endTime":2578.38,"body":"to participate is a team participation"},{"startTime":2578.385,"endTime":2583.13,"body":"that everybody has to move some item to"},{"startTime":2578.385,"endTime":2583.13,"body":"where they think this, is it going good?"},{"startTime":2583.135,"endTime":2583.94,"body":"Is it going bad?"},{"startTime":2584.15,"endTime":2585.26,"body":"And then we could talk about that."},{"startTime":2585.26,"endTime":2589.33,"body":"And then when you're done, it creates some"},{"startTime":2585.26,"endTime":2589.33,"body":"kind of a diagram that you can actually,"},{"startTime":2589.4,"endTime":2593.5,"body":"anonymously share with management and"},{"startTime":2589.4,"endTime":2593.5,"body":"say, okay, this is what the team said."},{"startTime":2593.5,"endTime":2593.86,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2593.94,"endTime":2595.28,"body":"on this different items."},{"startTime":2595.28,"endTime":2595.7,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":2596.02,"endTime":2597.79,"body":"are, are we getting management buy-in?"},{"startTime":2597.795,"endTime":2600.76,"body":"Are we, are we, are we getting,"},{"startTime":2597.795,"endTime":2600.76,"body":"we delivering, are we doing all"},{"startTime":2600.76,"endTime":2603.22,"body":"this kind of different stuff,"},{"startTime":2600.76,"endTime":2603.22,"body":"different items on that list?"},{"startTime":2603.275,"endTime":2606.485,"body":"and you can share that with management"},{"startTime":2603.275,"endTime":2606.485,"body":"and showing that, okay, the team is"},{"startTime":2606.485,"endTime":2608.915,"body":"doing well, the, the goal is being met."},{"startTime":2609.058,"endTime":2612.053,"body":"there might be some items there where we"},{"startTime":2609.058,"endTime":2612.053,"body":"we don't even know why we're even working"},{"startTime":2612.053,"endTime":2613.913,"body":"for this company in the first place."},{"startTime":2614.043,"endTime":2617.86,"body":"I think those kinds of reflective"},{"startTime":2614.043,"endTime":2617.86,"body":"experiences are useful, but because"},{"startTime":2617.86,"endTime":2624.14,"body":"they are longer in terms of ti the time"},{"startTime":2617.86,"endTime":2624.14,"body":"horizon, monthly, quarterly, that's where"},{"startTime":2624.2,"endTime":2630.03,"body":"I think you could use in the day kind"},{"startTime":2624.2,"endTime":2630.03,"body":"of things like this, Nico Nico matrix?"},{"startTime":2630.05,"endTime":2630.83,"body":"Because people forget"},{"startTime":2630.951,"endTime":2632.211,"body":"Three months out and you go, wow."},{"startTime":2632.241,"endTime":2633.081,"body":"How do we feel?"},{"startTime":2633.131,"endTime":2635.711,"body":"they focus on the last emotion they had."},{"startTime":2635.771,"endTime":2635.951,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2636.161,"endTime":2636.791,"body":"Right, right."},{"startTime":2636.971,"endTime":2640.931,"body":"Which is maybe last week, you know,"},{"startTime":2636.971,"endTime":2640.931,"body":"you got three whole months out there."},{"startTime":2640.931,"endTime":2641.201,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2641.571,"endTime":2644.421,"body":", so yeah, you could, you could"},{"startTime":2641.571,"endTime":2644.421,"body":"try and use both that way, maybe."},{"startTime":2644.426,"endTime":2644.851,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2644.921,"endTime":2648.656,"body":"There is a way you can you could do"},{"startTime":2644.921,"endTime":2648.656,"body":"this in Excel or anything like that."},{"startTime":2648.736,"endTime":2649.056,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2649.286,"endTime":2653.916,"body":"You could superimpose sprints,"},{"startTime":2649.286,"endTime":2653.916,"body":"just anonymize the dates."},{"startTime":2653.916,"endTime":2656.076,"body":"It says day one, day"},{"startTime":2653.916,"endTime":2656.076,"body":"two, day three, right."},{"startTime":2656.081,"endTime":2656.166,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2656.196,"endTime":2656.396,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2656.436,"endTime":2661.866,"body":"And just look out for four sprints, five"},{"startTime":2656.436,"endTime":2661.866,"body":"sprints out, and superimpose those images"},{"startTime":2661.866,"endTime":2666.771,"body":"and see, when I did this one time, what"},{"startTime":2661.866,"endTime":2666.771,"body":"I found is those team members that were"},{"startTime":2666.776,"endTime":2670.241,"body":"always, ugh, things aren't going so well."},{"startTime":2670.421,"endTime":2671.591,"body":"Over four sprints."},{"startTime":2671.591,"endTime":2676.361,"body":"You could see a slight change I'm like,"},{"startTime":2671.591,"endTime":2676.361,"body":"oh, there's maybe a glimmer of hope here."},{"startTime":2676.811,"endTime":2677.201,"body":"You know?"},{"startTime":2677.411,"endTime":2678.901,"body":"So I took it as a positive."},{"startTime":2678.906,"endTime":2681.621,"body":"But you wouldn't know that"},{"startTime":2678.906,"endTime":2681.621,"body":"until you actually track it."},{"startTime":2681.621,"endTime":2681.741,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":2681.981,"endTime":2684.351,"body":". So that's really, I guess the"},{"startTime":2681.981,"endTime":2684.351,"body":"bottom line on that is track it."},{"startTime":2684.831,"endTime":2688.881,"body":"Track it with people such"},{"startTime":2684.831,"endTime":2688.881,"body":"as the obstinate manager."},{"startTime":2688.941,"endTime":2692.901,"body":"You could say, look, if we're doing"},{"startTime":2688.941,"endTime":2692.901,"body":"this well, and it's only been four"},{"startTime":2692.901,"endTime":2695.451,"body":"sprints, if I extend that out."},{"startTime":2696.011,"endTime":2697.151,"body":"He told me I have six months."},{"startTime":2697.151,"endTime":2697.541,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2697.601,"endTime":2698.741,"body":"I'll just go three months."},{"startTime":2699.311,"endTime":2701.741,"body":"Here's how, here's where we"},{"startTime":2699.311,"endTime":2701.741,"body":"are, here's where we will be."},{"startTime":2702.071,"endTime":2705.141,"body":"Cuz when you extrapolate,"},{"startTime":2702.071,"endTime":2705.141,"body":"it does a magnifying impact."},{"startTime":2705.231,"endTime":2705.381,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2705.441,"endTime":2708.711,"body":"So show that to I think, I guess I'm"},{"startTime":2705.441,"endTime":2708.711,"body":"going back to our self promotion thing."},{"startTime":2708.891,"endTime":2711.861,"body":"Use that your advantage and"},{"startTime":2708.891,"endTime":2711.861,"body":"go, maybe I don't get that"},{"startTime":2711.861,"endTime":2713.631,"body":"exact, but I'm gonna be close."},{"startTime":2713.631,"endTime":2714.741,"body":"So we're gonna be so much."},{"startTime":2715.491,"endTime":2718.161,"body":"In this example where I pitched, I"},{"startTime":2715.491,"endTime":2718.161,"body":"was like, you're working for the ceo."},{"startTime":2718.161,"endTime":2719.331,"body":"That's highly irregular."},{"startTime":2719.541,"endTime":2719.661,"body":"Very."},{"startTime":2719.661,"endTime":2725.391,"body":"So if you join the company as an"},{"startTime":2719.661,"endTime":2725.391,"body":"executive, like that is likely the"},{"startTime":2725.391,"endTime":2728.271,"body":"advice you're going to get is you"},{"startTime":2725.391,"endTime":2728.271,"body":"need to do more self-promotion."},{"startTime":2728.421,"endTime":2729.831,"body":"Self-promotion, because you, you."},{"startTime":2730.491,"endTime":2734.241,"body":"A member of leadership and as a member"},{"startTime":2730.491,"endTime":2734.241,"body":"of leadership, you need to walk around."},{"startTime":2734.246,"endTime":2736.671,"body":"I just, I, I was just texting"},{"startTime":2734.246,"endTime":2736.671,"body":"with Ed this morning about this."},{"startTime":2736.881,"endTime":2740.061,"body":"As a member of leadership, you need"},{"startTime":2736.881,"endTime":2740.061,"body":"to repeat the vision for your whole"},{"startTime":2740.061,"endTime":2743.541,"body":"team to hear, you need to repeat why"},{"startTime":2740.061,"endTime":2743.541,"body":"we are here doing what we're doing."},{"startTime":2743.691,"endTime":2746.031,"body":"You need to repeat the mission"},{"startTime":2743.691,"endTime":2746.031,"body":"and, and maybe the vision."},{"startTime":2746.061,"endTime":2746.211,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2746.241,"endTime":2747.351,"body":"Um, both actually."},{"startTime":2747.351,"endTime":2748.401,"body":"You need to keep repeating them."},{"startTime":2748.401,"endTime":2752.881,"body":"And, and if I, the, the top executive,"},{"startTime":2748.401,"endTime":2752.881,"body":"if I have not projected the vision"},{"startTime":2753.001,"endTime":2755.041,"body":"and, and, and my leaders don't"},{"startTime":2753.001,"endTime":2755.041,"body":"know what it is, so they don't"},{"startTime":2755.046,"endTime":2756.361,"body":"know what to repeat, you failed."},{"startTime":2756.391,"endTime":2757.381,"body":"You need to let me know."},{"startTime":2757.411,"endTime":2761.851,"body":"Any leader that catches it needs to bubble"},{"startTime":2757.411,"endTime":2761.851,"body":"it back up to say, Hey, I don't hear"},{"startTime":2761.851,"endTime":2764.476,"body":"anyone talking the mission and the vision."},{"startTime":2764.506,"endTime":2765.406,"body":"let's discuss that."},{"startTime":2765.586,"endTime":2768.616,"body":"Cause I, I, like, I feel if, if we're"},{"startTime":2765.586,"endTime":2768.616,"body":"gonna go with some more advanced stuff,"},{"startTime":2769.006,"endTime":2771.106,"body":"we didn't even get into helping product."},{"startTime":2771.256,"endTime":2771.556,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2771.716,"endTime":2776.608,"body":"I feel the, the effective of Scrum master"},{"startTime":2771.716,"endTime":2776.608,"body":"in this organization kind of knows what"},{"startTime":2776.613,"endTime":2778.168,"body":"the product hierarchy should look like."},{"startTime":2778.348,"endTime":2778.588,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2779.108,"endTime":2783.662,"body":"The CSM and the Cspo class"},{"startTime":2779.108,"endTime":2783.662,"body":"together, they're like 75%"},{"startTime":2783.662,"endTime":2785.852,"body":"overlap is a lot of overlap."},{"startTime":2785.912,"endTime":2786.722,"body":"And that's for a reason."},{"startTime":2786.932,"endTime":2787.142,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2787.142,"endTime":2788.582,"body":"Obviously it's a lot of overlap."},{"startTime":2788.672,"endTime":2791.102,"body":"So, so if, if only one of us is, is."},{"startTime":2791.612,"endTime":2795.482,"body":"Quote, trained, certified,"},{"startTime":2791.612,"endTime":2795.482,"body":"whatever you wanna call it."},{"startTime":2795.512,"endTime":2796.112,"body":"Ordained."},{"startTime":2796.212,"endTime":2796.237,"body":"Yeah,"},{"startTime":2798.721,"endTime":2801.926,"body":"even in the old executive assistant"},{"startTime":2798.721,"endTime":2801.926,"body":"model of the scrum master?"},{"startTime":2802.066,"endTime":2804.406,"body":"Let's say that you don't even want"},{"startTime":2802.066,"endTime":2804.406,"body":"to climb, you don't even want to be"},{"startTime":2804.406,"endTime":2805.666,"body":"running up this hill like Kate Bush."},{"startTime":2805.754,"endTime":2809.204,"body":"You heard on TikTok, you can"},{"startTime":2805.754,"endTime":2809.204,"body":"make 150 gs and then you saw."},{"startTime":2809.684,"endTime":2812.174,"body":"You saw all these people that work"},{"startTime":2809.684,"endTime":2812.174,"body":"at Google that, you know, they,"},{"startTime":2812.384,"endTime":2813.644,"body":"they take the bus for two hours."},{"startTime":2813.644,"endTime":2815.954,"body":"They eat lunch for five hours,"},{"startTime":2813.644,"endTime":2815.954,"body":"and they only work for like"},{"startTime":2815.994,"endTime":2817.104,"body":"30 minutes during the day."},{"startTime":2817.228,"endTime":2818.578,"body":"I feel like I'm making a statement."},{"startTime":2818.668,"endTime":2819.808,"body":"I'm not trying to make a statement."},{"startTime":2820.038,"endTime":2823.558,"body":"The point is like there, that there"},{"startTime":2820.038,"endTime":2823.558,"body":"are people who are like I don't,"},{"startTime":2823.558,"endTime":2827.528,"body":"I actually, Brian, I hear your"},{"startTime":2823.558,"endTime":2827.528,"body":"whole podcast, but I disagree."},{"startTime":2827.533,"endTime":2828.728,"body":"I don't need to do any of this."},{"startTime":2829.068,"endTime":2829.938,"body":"I'm getting paid a lot."},{"startTime":2830.178,"endTime":2831.138,"body":"I don't have to do any of this."},{"startTime":2831.198,"endTime":2833.238,"body":"It sounds like a lot of work for how long?"},{"startTime":2833.405,"endTime":2834.465,"body":"for how long though."},{"startTime":2834.545,"endTime":2835.385,"body":"That's, that's the thing."},{"startTime":2835.39,"endTime":2837.815,"body":"Because, because that, that's,"},{"startTime":2835.39,"endTime":2837.815,"body":"that's, that's the one thing,"},{"startTime":2837.815,"endTime":2841.355,"body":"that's the one thing I keep going"},{"startTime":2837.815,"endTime":2841.355,"body":"back to a lot of these people."},{"startTime":2841.88,"endTime":2845.84,"body":"who get that, yes, there's, there's always"},{"startTime":2841.88,"endTime":2845.84,"body":"that chance that they will get that job."},{"startTime":2845.89,"endTime":2850.99,"body":"But I guarantee you, three months down"},{"startTime":2845.89,"endTime":2850.99,"body":"the line, the company was smart up"},{"startTime":2850.99,"endTime":2853.32,"body":"and no, this guy he doesn't know Jack."},{"startTime":2853.71,"endTime":2856.86,"body":"He just got coached through the"},{"startTime":2853.71,"endTime":2856.86,"body":"interview and he got the job."},{"startTime":2856.86,"endTime":2860.31,"body":"But now, three months down the"},{"startTime":2856.86,"endTime":2860.31,"body":"line, there's no productivity."},{"startTime":2860.43,"endTime":2860.49,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2860.49,"endTime":2862.68,"body":"There's no delivery, there's"},{"startTime":2860.49,"endTime":2862.68,"body":"no efficiency, there's nothing."},{"startTime":2862.903,"endTime":2863.503,"body":"Fake it."},{"startTime":2863.503,"endTime":2864.433,"body":"Fake it to you."},{"startTime":2864.583,"endTime":2866.173,"body":"Don't make it till you get fired."},{"startTime":2866.178,"endTime":2868.728,"body":"The other element that we haven't"},{"startTime":2866.178,"endTime":2868.728,"body":"talked about in here, which like,"},{"startTime":2868.728,"endTime":2871.038,"body":"I guess it's kind of good that we"},{"startTime":2868.728,"endTime":2871.038,"body":"haven't talked about it cuz it's gonna"},{"startTime":2871.038,"endTime":2872.778,"body":"burn all like a, a million hours."},{"startTime":2872.928,"endTime":2875.428,"body":"Talk about it is like with your agile..."},{"startTime":2876.228,"endTime":2877.518,"body":"implementation."},{"startTime":2877.613,"endTime":2878.003,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":2878.003,"endTime":2878.783,"body":"I'm calling it that."},{"startTime":2879.293,"endTime":2880.913,"body":"I call it implantation, but implant."},{"startTime":2881.003,"endTime":2885.118,"body":"Oh, no, . That sounds so  when,"},{"startTime":2881.003,"endTime":2885.118,"body":"when the person who's sponsoring"},{"startTime":2885.123,"endTime":2887.548,"body":"Agile at your company leaves No."},{"startTime":2887.788,"endTime":2890.188,"body":"And you know that that's when"},{"startTime":2887.788,"endTime":2890.188,"body":"all the Scrum masters get fired"},{"startTime":2890.298,"endTime":2897.363,"body":"When the single person who, who is"},{"startTime":2890.298,"endTime":2897.363,"body":"sponsoring agile at your company"},{"startTime":2897.723,"endTime":2901.323,"body":"leaves like that's when everything"},{"startTime":2897.723,"endTime":2901.323,"body":"erodes and, and goes away."},{"startTime":2901.413,"endTime":2904.773,"body":"But I, but I feel only, only in the case"},{"startTime":2901.413,"endTime":2904.773,"body":"where, again, the, where I was talking"},{"startTime":2904.773,"endTime":2909.033,"body":"about you, you could be an executive,"},{"startTime":2904.773,"endTime":2909.033,"body":"a, a high powered executive assistant"},{"startTime":2909.873,"endTime":2914.043,"body":"who is skilled in self-promotion, and"},{"startTime":2909.873,"endTime":2914.043,"body":"you will make it through that round"},{"startTime":2914.043,"endTime":2917.343,"body":"of firings because people will say"},{"startTime":2914.043,"endTime":2917.343,"body":"to themselves like, well, we can't"},{"startTime":2917.343,"endTime":2918.603,"body":"possibly get rid of this person."},{"startTime":2919.203,"endTime":2923.583,"body":"They're, they do all these"},{"startTime":2919.203,"endTime":2923.583,"body":"things because my perception is"},{"startTime":2923.913,"endTime":2925.263,"body":"they do all these things well."},{"startTime":2925.263,"endTime":2930.903,"body":"Well, I, if you don't have metrics"},{"startTime":2925.263,"endTime":2930.903,"body":"in place, , that's not like ingrained"},{"startTime":2930.903,"endTime":2932.253,"body":"in your organizational culture."},{"startTime":2932.253,"endTime":2938.433,"body":"Data driven decision making or you're"},{"startTime":2932.253,"endTime":2938.433,"body":"not measuring the scrum master on any"},{"startTime":2938.433,"endTime":2941.463,"body":"of the work they do on the business."},{"startTime":2941.643,"endTime":2943.533,"body":"You only track work done in the business."},{"startTime":2943.533,"endTime":2947.943,"body":"You track lines of code or some other"},{"startTime":2943.533,"endTime":2947.943,"body":"ridiculous metric like that, you know,"},{"startTime":2947.948,"endTime":2952.683,"body":"or, or amount of features delivered per"},{"startTime":2947.948,"endTime":2952.683,"body":"whatever week or month or whatever it is."},{"startTime":2953.013,"endTime":2954.543,"body":"And this person can't contribute to that."},{"startTime":2954.963,"endTime":2957.453,"body":"So then I go, it comes back to the"},{"startTime":2954.963,"endTime":2957.453,"body":"conversation we started with is"},{"startTime":2957.458,"endTime":2960.003,"body":"like, well, why wouldn't I just"},{"startTime":2957.458,"endTime":2960.003,"body":"spend my money on a developer"},{"startTime":2960.008,"endTime":2961.563,"body":"to row me into the rocks faster?"},{"startTime":2962.373,"endTime":2962.943,"body":"That's what I need."},{"startTime":2962.943,"endTime":2964.173,"body":"I need to get to where I'm going faster."},{"startTime":2964.233,"endTime":2964.743,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2964.903,"endTime":2968.373,"body":"And, and you know, and you'll get"},{"startTime":2964.903,"endTime":2968.373,"body":"the result you're looking for, right?"},{"startTime":2968.373,"endTime":2968.583,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":2968.583,"endTime":2970.833,"body":"You get what you paid for, you"},{"startTime":2968.583,"endTime":2970.833,"body":"crash, you crash into the rocks."},{"startTime":2970.838,"endTime":2970.893,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2970.953,"endTime":2974.823,"body":"You get what you paid for because"},{"startTime":2970.953,"endTime":2974.823,"body":"the product wouldn't there."},{"startTime":2974.823,"endTime":2977.313,"body":"There's no efficiency, there's"},{"startTime":2974.823,"endTime":2977.313,"body":"no effectiveness, there's just."},{"startTime":2977.688,"endTime":2978.198,"body":"Rowing."},{"startTime":2978.198,"endTime":2978.918,"body":"Just speed."},{"startTime":2978.918,"endTime":2979.308,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2979.698,"endTime":2983.268,"body":"For the sake of speed, we're"},{"startTime":2979.698,"endTime":2983.268,"body":"just speeding in a circle."},{"startTime":2983.278,"endTime":2985.348,"body":"You know the other thing I had"},{"startTime":2983.278,"endTime":2985.348,"body":"written down that we didn't, I"},{"startTime":2985.348,"endTime":2988.048,"body":"didn't bring up cuz we like, we"},{"startTime":2985.348,"endTime":2988.048,"body":"were just kind, I'm trying, I'm just"},{"startTime":2988.048,"endTime":2989.068,"body":"trying to cook these it up topics."},{"startTime":2989.218,"endTime":2991.938,"body":"Is who is, who is accountable?"},{"startTime":2992.448,"endTime":2993.948,"body":"For continuous improvement."},{"startTime":2994.158,"endTime":2994.938,"body":"I thought you said a scrum."},{"startTime":2995.088,"endTime":2995.998,"body":"Oh, the organization."},{"startTime":2996.008,"endTime":2996.998,"body":"Oh, the organization."},{"startTime":2997.098,"endTime":3001.388,"body":"No, in the, in the example where I'm,"},{"startTime":2997.098,"endTime":3001.388,"body":"I'm the obstinate manager saying, I"},{"startTime":3001.393,"endTime":3002.498,"body":"just wanna hire another developer."},{"startTime":3002.498,"endTime":3003.488,"body":"Just gimme another developer."},{"startTime":3003.488,"endTime":3004.238,"body":"More developers."},{"startTime":3004.238,"endTime":3004.778,"body":"That's the answer."},{"startTime":3004.778,"endTime":3005.948,"body":"More developer, whatever."},{"startTime":3005.948,"endTime":3008.588,"body":"The que like, oh, I can't sell"},{"startTime":3005.948,"endTime":3008.588,"body":"things fast enough, more developers."},{"startTime":3008.588,"endTime":3009.128,"body":"That's my answer."},{"startTime":3009.218,"endTime":3011.678,"body":"Oh, I don't know how to, like,"},{"startTime":3009.218,"endTime":3011.678,"body":"I'm, I'm getting audited cuz"},{"startTime":3011.918,"endTime":3012.878,"body":"I, I can't hire accountants."},{"startTime":3012.878,"endTime":3013.568,"body":"More developers."},{"startTime":3013.568,"endTime":3014.168,"body":"More, more you."},{"startTime":3014.168,"endTime":3015.398,"body":"You mean more sales guys?"},{"startTime":3016.298,"endTime":3018.518,"body":", my building's falling apart,"},{"startTime":3016.298,"endTime":3018.518,"body":"my plumbing doesn't work."},{"startTime":3018.518,"endTime":3021.548,"body":"More developers,  building it faster."},{"startTime":3021.608,"endTime":3022.623,"body":"The concept I just brought up."},{"startTime":3022.623,"endTime":3027.513,"body":"I want to make sure that I am putting"},{"startTime":3022.623,"endTime":3027.513,"body":"some effort into working on the business"},{"startTime":3027.513,"endTime":3031.898,"body":"and that my business, the package of my"},{"startTime":3027.513,"endTime":3031.898,"body":"business is improving the, the process."},{"startTime":3032.698,"endTime":3034.568,"body":"Policies, the stuff"},{"startTime":3032.698,"endTime":3034.568,"body":"with the people, right?"},{"startTime":3034.778,"endTime":3035.438,"body":"What we talked about."},{"startTime":3035.498,"endTime":3035.648,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":3035.648,"endTime":3036.608,"body":"Nico is with Nico."},{"startTime":3036.608,"endTime":3036.848,"body":"Nico."},{"startTime":3036.848,"endTime":3037.178,"body":"Nico."},{"startTime":3037.208,"endTime":3037.658,"body":"I like it."},{"startTime":3037.888,"endTime":3038.378,"body":"Nico."},{"startTime":3038.378,"endTime":3038.818,"body":"Nico."},{"startTime":3038.823,"endTime":3039.428,"body":"We are improving."},{"startTime":3039.458,"endTime":3043.033,"body":"How, like that You're not gonna"},{"startTime":3039.458,"endTime":3043.033,"body":"get that out of  any of the"},{"startTime":3043.033,"endTime":3044.293,"body":"working in the business metrics."},{"startTime":3044.323,"endTime":3044.623,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":3044.683,"endTime":3046.273,"body":"You only get that when"},{"startTime":3044.683,"endTime":3046.273,"body":"you take a step back."},{"startTime":3046.573,"endTime":3050.453,"body":"So if we don't have Scrum masters, if we"},{"startTime":3046.573,"endTime":3050.453,"body":"have scrum masters, it's straightforward."},{"startTime":3050.453,"endTime":3051.143,"body":"Okay, cool."},{"startTime":3051.293,"endTime":3053.783,"body":"The Scrum masters for their team, or"},{"startTime":3051.293,"endTime":3053.783,"body":"they're segmenting the organization"},{"startTime":3053.783,"endTime":3056.333,"body":"or whatever they're responsible"},{"startTime":3053.783,"endTime":3056.333,"body":"for that they can bring it to us."},{"startTime":3056.633,"endTime":3058.613,"body":"They can roll it up all the"},{"startTime":3056.633,"endTime":3058.613,"body":"way up to the leadership team."},{"startTime":3058.613,"endTime":3061.343,"body":"They can do leadership team"},{"startTime":3058.613,"endTime":3061.343,"body":"retrospectives, for example."},{"startTime":3061.433,"endTime":3064.313,"body":"There's a lot of ways we can utilize"},{"startTime":3061.433,"endTime":3064.313,"body":"Scrum Masters in the organization."},{"startTime":3064.313,"endTime":3065.543,"body":"They don't have to just serve a team."},{"startTime":3065.603,"endTime":3065.843,"body":"Correct."},{"startTime":3066.993,"endTime":3071.003,"body":"Uh, but if I don't have them, if I don't"},{"startTime":3066.993,"endTime":3071.003,"body":"have Scrum master in my organization"},{"startTime":3071.033,"endTime":3073.973,"body":"or someone's playing the role, I"},{"startTime":3071.033,"endTime":3073.973,"body":"haven't got to say that in a long time."},{"startTime":3073.978,"endTime":3074.504,"body":"No, that's right."},{"startTime":3074.813,"endTime":3075.343,"body":"I like it."},{"startTime":3075.348,"endTime":3077.033,"body":"Like who's, who's, who's accountable?"},{"startTime":3077.033,"endTime":3081.473,"body":"I mean, o other than the, the cop out"},{"startTime":3077.033,"endTime":3081.473,"body":"answer of, well, leadership obviously."},{"startTime":3081.773,"endTime":3084.803,"body":"Your manager's responsible for"},{"startTime":3081.773,"endTime":3084.803,"body":"making, he, they're gonna tell you,"},{"startTime":3084.953,"endTime":3088.823,"body":"you must, continuous improvement"},{"startTime":3084.953,"endTime":3088.823,"body":"is mandatory and you must do it."},{"startTime":3088.823,"endTime":3090.023,"body":"And fun is mandatory."},{"startTime":3090.023,"endTime":3092.783,"body":"And you must say you"},{"startTime":3090.023,"endTime":3092.783,"body":"will now have fun . Yeah."},{"startTime":3092.788,"endTime":3094.583,"body":"For the next 13 minutes."},{"startTime":3094.643,"endTime":3094.913,"body":"No."},{"startTime":3094.913,"endTime":3097.553,"body":"So  scrum masters, right?"},{"startTime":3097.763,"endTime":3102.233,"body":"So the latest scrum guide says"},{"startTime":3097.763,"endTime":3102.233,"body":"the scrum master coaches the team,"},{"startTime":3102.263,"endTime":3103.983,"body":"the Scrum master coaches product."},{"startTime":3104.013,"endTime":3104.623,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3104.703,"endTime":3106.343,"body":", the scrum master coaches,"},{"startTime":3104.703,"endTime":3106.343,"body":"the organization."},{"startTime":3106.343,"endTime":3106.823,"body":"Organization."},{"startTime":3106.843,"endTime":3109.753,"body":"If they're not there, that's three"},{"startTime":3106.843,"endTime":3109.753,"body":"levels of coaching you're missing."},{"startTime":3110.023,"endTime":3110.293,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3110.953,"endTime":3113.413,"body":"Think about that for a second, right?"},{"startTime":3113.418,"endTime":3113.583,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":3113.773,"endTime":3119.383,"body":"Three levels of coaching that is"},{"startTime":3113.773,"endTime":3119.383,"body":"just gone prominently absent, right."},{"startTime":3119.383,"endTime":3120.283,"body":"It's not there."},{"startTime":3120.463,"endTime":3123.343,"body":"So you're gonna feel that"},{"startTime":3120.463,"endTime":3123.343,"body":"it's completely vacated."},{"startTime":3123.343,"endTime":3123.613,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3123.613,"endTime":3125.593,"body":"So yeah, you're gonna"},{"startTime":3123.613,"endTime":3125.593,"body":"definitely feel that."},{"startTime":3125.713,"endTime":3126.583,"body":"Why do we need it?"},{"startTime":3126.612,"endTime":3128.047,"body":"We should bring it back to that question."},{"startTime":3128.047,"endTime":3131.678,"body":"It's like, why do we need"},{"startTime":3128.047,"endTime":3131.678,"body":"to fill that vacant seat?"},{"startTime":3131.748,"endTime":3132.068,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3132.153,"endTime":3137.468,"body":", why, why do we need to make sure we are"},{"startTime":3132.153,"endTime":3137.468,"body":"continually improving as an organization?"},{"startTime":3137.619,"endTime":3141.789,"body":"That's one of the questions that anybody"},{"startTime":3137.619,"endTime":3141.789,"body":"interviewing at an organization should"},{"startTime":3141.849,"endTime":3146.079,"body":"ask the interviewer, not just Scrum"},{"startTime":3141.849,"endTime":3146.079,"body":"Masters, product owners, anybody."},{"startTime":3146.979,"endTime":3150.519,"body":"What are the top two challenges"},{"startTime":3146.979,"endTime":3150.519,"body":"that this organization has today?"},{"startTime":3150.999,"endTime":3153.189,"body":"And how have you been addressing them?"},{"startTime":3153.189,"endTime":3156.999,"body":"Because presumably assuming the,"},{"startTime":3153.189,"endTime":3156.999,"body":"the you is directed at somebody"},{"startTime":3157.389,"endTime":3161.079,"body":"like a, an obste manager or"},{"startTime":3157.389,"endTime":3161.079,"body":"whoever is interviewing you, right?"},{"startTime":3161.084,"endTime":3161.169,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":3161.349,"endTime":3163.209,"body":"Well, how have you tried to address those?"},{"startTime":3163.479,"endTime":3166.929,"body":"And if they can't answer"},{"startTime":3163.479,"endTime":3166.929,"body":"that, or if they sugarcoat it."},{"startTime":3166.999,"endTime":3168.799,"body":"Or if they am out their way through it."},{"startTime":3169.394,"endTime":3173.354,"body":"Leave, don't work for that"},{"startTime":3169.394,"endTime":3173.354,"body":"company because they don't know."},{"startTime":3173.594,"endTime":3174.794,"body":"They don't know what they don't know."},{"startTime":3175.244,"endTime":3176.504,"body":"They're not hiring you for that."},{"startTime":3176.504,"endTime":3180.224,"body":"They're hiring you for a Scrum master"},{"startTime":3176.504,"endTime":3180.224,"body":"role or a product  owner, a role."},{"startTime":3180.644,"endTime":3183.674,"body":"If leadership has not done their"},{"startTime":3180.644,"endTime":3183.674,"body":"job and they don't understand the"},{"startTime":3183.674,"endTime":3185.834,"body":"challenges that they're faced with today."},{"startTime":3186.034,"endTime":3191.194,"body":"You are, you are basically Sisyphus, you"},{"startTime":3186.034,"endTime":3191.194,"body":"know, trying to push that rock uphill"},{"startTime":3191.194,"endTime":3194.944,"body":"and you're on your own and the hill is"},{"startTime":3191.194,"endTime":3194.944,"body":"pretty steep and the rock is amazing."},{"startTime":3194.944,"endTime":3196.474,"body":"May, maybe that's why they need you."},{"startTime":3197.474,"endTime":3201.104,"body":"You're not Hercules, you're Sisyphus"},{"startTime":3197.474,"endTime":3201.104,"body":". Maybe that's why they need you."},{"startTime":3201.104,"endTime":3203.954,"body":"It's too big for you to, to show them"},{"startTime":3201.104,"endTime":3203.954,"body":"what they show, what they don't know."},{"startTime":3203.954,"endTime":3204.734,"body":"Shove up hill."},{"startTime":3204.914,"endTime":3205.244,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3205.304,"endTime":3206.684,"body":"I'm Kate Bush only running."},{"startTime":3206.689,"endTime":3206.924,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":3206.924,"endTime":3208.364,"body":"I, I like running up the hill."},{"startTime":3208.369,"endTime":3209.174,"body":"I'm only running up that hill now."},{"startTime":3209.174,"endTime":3210.944,"body":"That song's now playing in my head."},{"startTime":3211.314,"endTime":3214.509,"body":"I, I wanna go back to what we"},{"startTime":3211.314,"endTime":3214.509,"body":"started with is, is why do we"},{"startTime":3214.509,"endTime":3216.099,"body":"need a scrum master kind of thing."},{"startTime":3216.099,"endTime":3216.369,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3216.369,"endTime":3218.199,"body":"The value with the"},{"startTime":3216.369,"endTime":3218.199,"body":"value of a scrum master."},{"startTime":3218.754,"endTime":3222.534,"body":"After a few sprints of having"},{"startTime":3218.754,"endTime":3222.534,"body":"been on the job, if you didn't"},{"startTime":3222.954,"endTime":3226.194,"body":"benchmark to begin with, the current"},{"startTime":3222.954,"endTime":3226.194,"body":"state of play, I like to call it."},{"startTime":3226.554,"endTime":3227.304,"body":"Current state of play."},{"startTime":3227.634,"endTime":3232.284,"body":"And then you continuously updated"},{"startTime":3227.634,"endTime":3232.284,"body":"that every whatever, situational."},{"startTime":3232.284,"endTime":3233.754,"body":"Maybe every sprint, maybe every month."},{"startTime":3233.754,"endTime":3234.589,"body":"I'm more busy manager."},{"startTime":3234.619,"endTime":3237.194,"body":"Om You're not getting more"},{"startTime":3234.619,"endTime":3237.194,"body":"than a touchpoint every month."},{"startTime":3237.224,"endTime":3237.854,"body":"That's, I'm fine."},{"startTime":3237.914,"endTime":3238.194,"body":"I'm fine."},{"startTime":3238.194,"endTime":3239.024,"body":"And I might miss a month."},{"startTime":3239.084,"endTime":3240.524,"body":"The metrics are Yeah."},{"startTime":3240.794,"endTime":3242.264,"body":"Or miss every two months."},{"startTime":3242.774,"endTime":3243.884,"body":"I'm, I'm fine with that."},{"startTime":3244.034,"endTime":3244.874,"body":"That that's on you."},{"startTime":3245.084,"endTime":3249.644,"body":"But I will, I will plot"},{"startTime":3245.084,"endTime":3249.644,"body":"right on that chart."},{"startTime":3249.734,"endTime":3249.824,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3249.824,"endTime":3252.074,"body":"Those things that we talked"},{"startTime":3249.824,"endTime":3252.074,"body":"about earlier in the podcast."},{"startTime":3252.134,"endTime":3252.284,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3252.524,"endTime":3256.574,"body":". So when we do meet, I can say,"},{"startTime":3252.524,"endTime":3256.574,"body":"look at the deviation between"},{"startTime":3256.574,"endTime":3257.984,"body":"the status quo you had mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3258.434,"endTime":3260.024,"body":"and where we're going, where we are."},{"startTime":3260.024,"endTime":3263.804,"body":"Sorry, not we're, and I'm gonna"},{"startTime":3260.024,"endTime":3263.804,"body":"now extrapolate that Right."},{"startTime":3263.984,"endTime":3269.084,"body":"In a straight line, extrapolation and"},{"startTime":3263.984,"endTime":3269.084,"body":"say if I continue to get the gains that"},{"startTime":3269.089,"endTime":3271.439,"body":"I've gotten, Over the last few sprints."},{"startTime":3271.919,"endTime":3271.949,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":3271.949,"endTime":3272.639,"body":"Months, whatever."},{"startTime":3273.059,"endTime":3274.769,"body":"Um, that's where we're going, right?"},{"startTime":3274.769,"endTime":3276.809,"body":"That's the little bit of"},{"startTime":3274.769,"endTime":3276.809,"body":"that is self-promotion."},{"startTime":3276.809,"endTime":3276.899,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3276.899,"endTime":3279.269,"body":"But a lot of that is"},{"startTime":3276.899,"endTime":3279.269,"body":"evidence based, right?"},{"startTime":3280.739,"endTime":3282.479,"body":"So projections are what they are."},{"startTime":3282.599,"endTime":3285.949,"body":"Forward looking statements is what"},{"startTime":3282.599,"endTime":3285.949,"body":"financial financial people call"},{"startTime":3285.949,"endTime":3287.959,"body":"that, but that's all we've got."},{"startTime":3287.959,"endTime":3289.909,"body":"We don't know what's gonna"},{"startTime":3287.959,"endTime":3289.909,"body":"happen in the future."},{"startTime":3289.909,"endTime":3293.509,"body":"What we do know is what's happened"},{"startTime":3289.909,"endTime":3293.509,"body":"from day one that I, I joined this"},{"startTime":3293.559,"endTime":3299.589,"body":"company to now, and if I continue,"},{"startTime":3293.559,"endTime":3299.589,"body":"there's no reason to doubt that I can"},{"startTime":3299.589,"endTime":3301.209,"body":"continue along this projection line."},{"startTime":3301.329,"endTime":3302.469,"body":"That's what I hope to deliver."},{"startTime":3302.979,"endTime":3306.549,"body":"So six months later we, we"},{"startTime":3302.979,"endTime":3306.549,"body":"meet the obstinate manager and"},{"startTime":3306.549,"endTime":3308.093,"body":"we say, , where's my offer?"},{"startTime":3308.163,"endTime":3309.243,"body":"I've done all these things."},{"startTime":3309.243,"endTime":3309.483,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3309.543,"endTime":3311.733,"body":"Because you've now got data behind it."},{"startTime":3311.823,"endTime":3312.123,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3312.213,"endTime":3314.133,"body":"You've now got that line they had before."},{"startTime":3314.163,"endTime":3314.373,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":3314.553,"endTime":3315.483,"body":"That line would not have."},{"startTime":3316.308,"endTime":3317.238,"body":"Had they not hired you."},{"startTime":3317.318,"endTime":3317.638,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"startTime":3317.723,"endTime":3319.358,"body":", that is, that is your baseline."},{"startTime":3319.488,"endTime":3322.108,"body":"And then you've got that line"},{"startTime":3319.488,"endTime":3322.108,"body":"that's higher, no matter how"},{"startTime":3322.108,"endTime":3323.218,"body":"higher, that doesn't matter."},{"startTime":3323.218,"endTime":3325.828,"body":"What matters is the projection, right?"},{"startTime":3325.828,"endTime":3328.678,"body":"So at six months you project"},{"startTime":3325.828,"endTime":3328.678,"body":"out another six months."},{"startTime":3328.948,"endTime":3331.198,"body":"You wanna hire me today,"},{"startTime":3328.948,"endTime":3331.198,"body":"Brian, as the manager."},{"startTime":3331.978,"endTime":3335.259,"body":"Here's where I've got to today"},{"startTime":3331.978,"endTime":3335.259,"body":"in six months, but here's where I"},{"startTime":3335.418,"endTime":3336.688,"body":"can get to in the next six months."},{"startTime":3336.738,"endTime":3337.278,"body":"Where can I sign?"},{"startTime":3337.378,"endTime":3339.028,"body":"That's really the approach, I think."}]}