{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.0,"endTime":1.472,"body":"We're gonna try not to"},{"startTime":0.0,"endTime":1.472,"body":"rant on this podcast."},{"startTime":1.981,"endTime":2.227,"body":"We won't."},{"startTime":2.227,"endTime":3.045,"body":"I'll try that hard though."},{"startTime":3.09,"endTime":6.795,"body":"I came across this article, I was"},{"startTime":3.09,"endTime":6.795,"body":"doom scrolling LinkedIn as, as one"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":6.795,"endTime":10.409,"body":"00 AM and I saw a post put"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":6.795,"endTime":10.409,"body":"up by an, an individual that I will"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":10.409,"endTime":12.699,"body":"not name cuz we're not trying to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":10.409,"endTime":12.699,"body":"blow this individual outta the water."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":12.972,"endTime":17.454,"body":"That basically was, saying the opposite"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":12.972,"endTime":17.454,"body":"opinion of the Roadmap podcast that we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":17.454,"endTime":21.89,"body":"did where the position I was taking was"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":17.454,"endTime":21.89,"body":"I don't give dates, I would rather focus"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":21.89,"endTime":25.463,"body":"on outcomes and knock out the outcomes"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":21.89,"endTime":25.463,"body":"in order of their priority to the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":25.463,"endTime":26.8,"body":"business and their value to the business."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":27.072,"endTime":30.181,"body":"And this, article, at least at"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":27.072,"endTime":30.181,"body":"first glance, maybe I'm wrong."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":30.181,"endTime":32.554,"body":"So that we're gonna dig into it"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":30.181,"endTime":32.554,"body":"here and find out, this article"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":32.559,"endTime":34.436,"body":"seemed to take the opposite stance."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":34.768,"endTime":36.949,"body":"Om has not read, read the article"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":34.768,"endTime":36.949,"body":"yet, so we're gonna read it together."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":36.949,"endTime":38.586,"body":"I have not here on the podcast."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":38.586,"endTime":41.036,"body":"And, again, I've cut out the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":38.586,"endTime":41.036,"body":"names to protect the innocent,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":41.39,"endTime":42.636,"body":"but like not that innocent."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":42.649,"endTime":45.068,"body":"The, yeah, the innocent may or may not be."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":45.292,"endTime":47.319,"body":"let's dig straight into the article, okay?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":47.324,"endTime":47.747,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":47.947,"endTime":49.883,"body":"Like I said, I'm not trying to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":47.947,"endTime":49.883,"body":"blast the author, not naming names."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":49.883,"endTime":51.719,"body":"That's, that's part of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":49.883,"endTime":51.719,"body":"our working agreement."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":51.81,"endTime":54.447,"body":"He introduces this article with"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":51.81,"endTime":54.447,"body":"a shot across the bow, it's the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":54.447,"endTime":55.947,"body":"equivalent of opening up your, sorry."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":56.083,"endTime":58.783,"body":"Like, I guess I'm monologuing and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":56.083,"endTime":58.783,"body":"before we even start the, no, I see"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":58.783,"endTime":60.283,"body":"this as a cry for attention, honestly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":60.338,"endTime":62.956,"body":"Well, that's, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":60.338,"endTime":62.956,"body":"like any YouTuber who opens"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":62.956,"endTime":64.042,"body":"a video welcome everybody."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":64.042,"endTime":67.478,"body":"Like it's this, it's the equivalent,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":64.042,"endTime":67.478,"body":"like he's opening the article with the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":67.478,"endTime":70.651,"body":"equivalent of that Like that should be"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":67.478,"endTime":70.651,"body":"the opening of this podcast, by the way."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":70.651,"endTime":70.76,"body":"Really?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":70.76,"endTime":71.333,"body":"Yeah, it's true."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":71.388,"endTime":71.824,"body":"I agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":71.828,"endTime":72.069,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":72.369,"endTime":75.56,"body":"anyway, he says, I hear more voices"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":72.369,"endTime":75.56,"body":"saying there is a little point in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":75.56,"endTime":78.997,"body":"doing time-based estimation on how"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":75.56,"endTime":78.997,"body":"long building software will take, and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":78.997,"endTime":80.124,"body":"thus we should just stop doing it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":80.897,"endTime":84.906,"body":"Quote, let's just use story points and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":80.897,"endTime":84.906,"body":"estimate complexity, but not the time."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":84.988,"endTime":86.324,"body":"End quote, end quote."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":86.515,"endTime":88.615,"body":"Let's just try hashtag no estimates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":88.778,"endTime":89.188,"body":"End quote."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":89.242,"endTime":92.624,"body":"I, I like that he's throwing shade on no"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":89.242,"endTime":92.624,"body":"estimates in the first two, two sentences."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":92.678,"endTime":95.274,"body":"Mm-hmm but that's only because I,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":92.678,"endTime":95.274,"body":"I think it's funny that like, yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":95.519,"endTime":95.738,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":95.828,"endTime":97.901,"body":"End quote, no estimates, our suggestions."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":97.901,"endTime":102.301,"body":"People around me recently brought up, I'm"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":97.901,"endTime":102.301,"body":"personally skeptical of both approaches."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":102.519,"endTime":108.438,"body":"While I do think that doing time-based"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":102.519,"endTime":108.438,"body":"estimates is really hard, it comes with so"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":108.442,"endTime":110.319,"body":"many benefits for those who keep doing it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":110.574,"endTime":111.528,"body":"unintelligible sneeze-like sound."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":111.738,"endTime":112.038,"body":"Sorry."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":112.038,"endTime":114.001,"body":"Oh no, you got, did you sneeze?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":114.001,"endTime":115.147,"body":"I don't know what no, no."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":115.147,"endTime":115.274,"body":"I know."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":115.338,"endTime":117.147,"body":"I just called it BS right there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":117.147,"endTime":122.874,"body":"I mean, yes, time-based estimates are"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":117.147,"endTime":122.874,"body":"hard cuz you don't foresee the future."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":122.874,"endTime":124.428,"body":"You don't know when"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":122.874,"endTime":124.428,"body":"things are gonna happen."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":124.547,"endTime":128.192,"body":"However, asking people to do"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":124.547,"endTime":128.192,"body":"that just like he's doing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":129.378,"endTime":129.951,"body":"Ishk."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":130.142,"endTime":130.606,"body":"Who knows?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":130.915,"endTime":134.597,"body":"Who, whomever, whomever it is,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":130.915,"endTime":134.597,"body":"whomever it is that is advocating"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":134.601,"endTime":137.378,"body":"this, please stop doing that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":137.824,"endTime":138.697,"body":"What a great start that was."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":138.697,"endTime":139.242,"body":"Yeah, it was."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":139.247,"endTime":142.024,"body":"That was, it was even,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":139.247,"endTime":142.024,"body":"it was too sassy for me."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":142.024,"endTime":144.615,"body":"And that's how you know, That"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":142.024,"endTime":144.615,"body":"we are on the right track."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":144.642,"endTime":144.915,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":144.96,"endTime":147.988,"body":"The next piece of the article,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":144.96,"endTime":147.988,"body":"I attribute much of my success"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":147.988,"endTime":149.078,"body":"in engineering to giving."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":149.078,"endTime":149.542,"body":"Oh boy."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":149.542,"endTime":150.06,"body":"Here we go."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":151.533,"endTime":153.224,"body":"I knew you were gonna"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":151.533,"endTime":153.224,"body":"say that when you read."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":153.306,"endTime":153.715,"body":"Oh boy."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":153.715,"endTime":154.106,"body":"Read that part."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":154.16,"endTime":154.36,"body":"Boy."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":154.451,"endTime":157.06,"body":"It's coming off a little arrogant,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":154.451,"endTime":157.06,"body":"but I'm gonna keep reading."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":157.278,"endTime":160.306,"body":"I attribute much of my success in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":157.278,"endTime":160.306,"body":"engineering to giving estimates"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":160.351,"endTime":162.124,"body":"on software complex projects."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":162.124,"endTime":163.433,"body":"He means complex software projects."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":163.433,"endTime":163.978,"body":"Oh, okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":164.533,"endTime":166.033,"body":"Was he drinking when he No, no, no."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":166.033,"endTime":168.569,"body":"That's let's just give him the benefit"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":166.033,"endTime":168.569,"body":"of her, the benefit of the doubt."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":168.824,"endTime":170.76,"body":"It says his success in engineering."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":170.951,"endTime":174.151,"body":"It sounds like he's had a lot of it"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":170.951,"endTime":174.151,"body":"from, or she Sure from what they're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":174.151,"endTime":177.806,"body":"saying, and they're saying they give"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":174.151,"endTime":177.806,"body":"estimates on complex software projects."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":178.092,"endTime":180.001,"body":"And then also delivered"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":178.092,"endTime":180.001,"body":"to those timelines."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":180.156,"endTime":180.374,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":180.374,"endTime":184.056,"body":"Here, we like, let, let me read on, when"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":180.374,"endTime":184.056,"body":"I was working on Skype, I was part of the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":184.165,"endTime":189.265,"body":"Xbox One   Xbox One is not, they, they,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":184.165,"endTime":189.265,"body":"they really screwed up that branding."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":189.292,"endTime":192.801,"body":"If I have to say so myself because one xb."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":192.956,"endTime":194.265,"body":"One XBONE?!?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":194.392,"endTime":195.019,"body":"Come on guys."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":195.019,"endTime":195.528,"body":"Oh, I know, I know."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":195.556,"endTime":197.792,"body":"Like you think of all the logos"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":195.556,"endTime":197.792,"body":"that you can come up with."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":197.792,"endTime":198.31,"body":"XBONE."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":198.419,"endTime":199.047,"body":"Come on."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":199.183,"endTime":202.506,"body":"Some good and some really"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":199.183,"endTime":202.506,"body":"not the opposite of that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":202.506,"endTime":206.242,"body":"But Xbox One launch team, microsoft"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":202.506,"endTime":206.242,"body":"finalized the Xbox oh one launch date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":206.242,"endTime":210.985,"body":"based on estimates from the 100 plus teams"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":206.242,"endTime":210.985,"body":"working on XBONE including ours a year"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":210.985,"endTime":215.448,"body":"later a year later, we, we launched on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":210.985,"endTime":215.448,"body":"the pre-announced day without significant"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":215.448,"endTime":218.966,"body":"hiccups and without major fanfare and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":215.448,"endTime":218.966,"body":"with, oh, you haven't, is that true?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":219.012,"endTime":222.094,"body":"Xbox One launch Without"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":219.012,"endTime":222.094,"body":"significant hiccups."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":222.148,"endTime":225.148,"body":"Yeah, without significant"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":222.148,"endTime":225.148,"body":"hiccups and with major fanfare."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":225.175,"endTime":225.694,"body":"I don't think that's true."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":225.966,"endTime":226.348,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":226.353,"endTime":226.594,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":226.594,"endTime":229.294,"body":"Well you know what, everything I read on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":226.594,"endTime":229.294,"body":"the internet is true, so let's continue."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":229.375,"endTime":232.785,"body":"Of course, AF After XBONE, I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":229.375,"endTime":232.785,"body":"worked on launching Skype for Web."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":233.057,"endTime":235.612,"body":"Here we ended up beating our"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":233.057,"endTime":235.612,"body":"original estimates leaving"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":235.612,"endTime":238.785,"body":"more time for experimentation"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":235.612,"endTime":238.785,"body":"before the worldwide launch."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":238.921,"endTime":241.569,"body":"When when I joined Uber, we had an"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":238.921,"endTime":241.569,"body":"internal deadline to rewrite the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":241.569,"endTime":244.951,"body":"launch of the new Uber Rider app By"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":241.569,"endTime":244.951,"body":"the end of 2016, we also pulled this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":244.956,"endTime":247.788,"body":"off after a few months of development"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":244.956,"endTime":247.788,"body":"hitting our previously set launch date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":248.115,"endTime":250.415,"body":"Let's stop right here for a second"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":248.115,"endTime":250.415,"body":"because when I originally read this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":250.415,"endTime":255.524,"body":"article, I thought he was lobbying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":250.415,"endTime":255.524,"body":"against the outcome driven roadmap,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":256.179,"endTime":257.706,"body":"like for an output driven roadmap."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":257.706,"endTime":260.697,"body":"I thought he was lobbying for that, but"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":257.706,"endTime":260.697,"body":"now that I've read his paragraphs like"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":260.697,"endTime":265.524,"body":"I've, I've kind of softened where he's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":260.697,"endTime":265.524,"body":"just being dictated milestones and he's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":265.529,"endTime":268.838,"body":"not talking about any scope or whatever"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":265.529,"endTime":268.838,"body":"but he's providing those milestones"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":268.838,"endTime":272.992,"body":"like x X XBONE one, for example, like"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":268.838,"endTime":272.992,"body":"when they launched XBONE one, like"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":273.074,"endTime":274.874,"body":"it had tons of problems Oh, sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":274.874,"endTime":276.183,"body":"Tons of problems."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":276.438,"endTime":279.979,"body":"I can be like Cher and turn back time"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":276.438,"endTime":279.979,"body":"right quick to, to, to go and Google"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":280.306,"endTime":284.338,"body":"problems with the original XBONE  launch,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":280.306,"endTime":284.338,"body":"you're gonna find many pages, I'm sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":284.342,"endTime":287.31,"body":"I'm gonna find tons like games"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":284.342,"endTime":287.31,"body":"that won't even play tons of stuff."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":287.315,"endTime":287.501,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":287.501,"endTime":289.492,"body":"That backward compatibility,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":287.501,"endTime":289.492,"body":"they didn't even do."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":289.601,"endTime":293.492,"body":"Like, I know I'm gonna find a bunch"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":289.601,"endTime":293.492,"body":"of stuff and I'm sure that if I were"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":293.492,"endTime":296.656,"body":"a product manager and I were applying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":293.492,"endTime":296.656,"body":"product management practices to say,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":296.874,"endTime":298.319,"body":"what can we cut to hit this date?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":298.492,"endTime":301.556,"body":"If that's where he is going with,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":298.492,"endTime":301.556,"body":"this, I don't think it's as significant"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":301.901,"endTime":304.629,"body":"as I expected it to be when I wanted"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":301.901,"endTime":304.629,"body":"it to be a subject for this project."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":304.634,"endTime":304.719,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":304.719,"endTime":308.265,"body":"But I haven't seen that yet, so I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":304.719,"endTime":308.265,"body":"haven't seen any notion of just,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":308.269,"endTime":311.892,"body":"just to focus on the the here"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":308.269,"endTime":311.892,"body":"and now, the V MVP kind of thing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":311.892,"endTime":312.165,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":312.492,"endTime":315.629,"body":"What I've seen instead, this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":312.492,"endTime":315.629,"body":"is my take at least, is."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":316.256,"endTime":318.11,"body":"We gave him dates and we met him."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":318.274,"endTime":318.983,"body":"That's what I'm saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":318.983,"endTime":319.038,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":319.065,"endTime":321.474,"body":"So, so I you say, well,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":319.065,"endTime":321.474,"body":"he was dictated dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":321.474,"endTime":323.901,"body":"No, I think he's dictating the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":321.474,"endTime":323.901,"body":"dates, is what I'm saying here."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":324.092,"endTime":326.438,"body":"You know, I gave him a date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":324.092,"endTime":326.438,"body":"and we hit that, and then we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":326.438,"endTime":328.019,"body":"had time to experiment later."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":328.101,"endTime":329.629,"body":"I don't know if one,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":328.101,"endTime":329.629,"body":"that's what I'm saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":329.674,"endTime":332.619,"body":"it sounds great from the purpose of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":329.674,"endTime":332.619,"body":"like getting your name out there on,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":332.838,"endTime":334.447,"body":"on the internet with like a hot take."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":334.829,"endTime":339.119,"body":"But The, the issue is like I have just as"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":334.829,"endTime":339.119,"body":"much experience as this dude does working"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":339.119,"endTime":343.374,"body":"on software development teams, and I know"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":339.119,"endTime":343.374,"body":"that the one person doesn't just sling"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":343.374,"endTime":345.065,"body":"out a date and everybody's okay with it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":345.447,"endTime":346.919,"body":"Unless you're a dictator, of course."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":346.924,"endTime":347.301,"body":"No."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":347.301,"endTime":347.574,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":347.619,"endTime":349.065,"body":"I mean, that, that could happen."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":349.065,"endTime":351.574,"body":"But the, the majority of times"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":349.065,"endTime":351.574,"body":"you have to settle on a date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":351.579,"endTime":354.701,"body":"It's a sort of a negotiation again, unless"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":351.579,"endTime":354.701,"body":"your management's coming down and saying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":354.701,"endTime":360.81,"body":"like, we've set the launch for January"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":354.701,"endTime":360.81,"body":"1st, 2025, and you've got until that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":360.81,"endTime":363.047,"body":"time to figure it out, and whatever's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":360.81,"endTime":363.047,"body":"in is in, whatever's out is out."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":363.047,"endTime":366.756,"body":"I get So those people are these"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":363.047,"endTime":366.756,"body":"the, the people that are suffering?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":366.838,"endTime":370.165,"body":"Yeah, I get that, but I, I'm not"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":366.838,"endTime":370.165,"body":"seeing that at least thus far"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":370.165,"endTime":371.638,"body":"in, in the article I'm seeing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":372.06,"endTime":374.379,"body":"This guy's saying I forgot"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":372.06,"endTime":374.379,"body":"the date we met him."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":374.442,"endTime":375.124,"body":"That's what I'm seeing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":375.124,"endTime":375.288,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":375.369,"endTime":376.733,"body":"And, and if he did great, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":376.733,"endTime":380.242,"body":"Maybe he got lucky or she Well you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":376.733,"endTime":380.242,"body":"know, the, again, we can read on,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":380.297,"endTime":381.988,"body":"maybe we should just, yeah, we should"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":380.297,"endTime":381.988,"body":"read on, just get through this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":382.397,"endTime":387.088,"body":"But software estimation, even when you're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":382.397,"endTime":387.088,"body":"doing hour based estimation, which I have"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":387.088,"endTime":389.188,"body":"done in my career, doesn't work this way."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":389.215,"endTime":391.969,"body":"One person doesn't just sling out"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":389.215,"endTime":391.969,"body":"a date outta the air and then the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":391.969,"endTime":393.469,"body":"whole team comes along with it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":393.515,"endTime":398.529,"body":"Now, you, he may be rewriting history"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":393.515,"endTime":398.529,"body":"a little bit to say the team picked"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":398.529,"endTime":401.747,"body":"the date together, but I committed"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":398.529,"endTime":401.747,"body":"it as part of the team and oh, we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":401.992,"endTime":403.056,"body":"all agree that this was a date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":403.138,"endTime":407.747,"body":"Al, although the alternate that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":403.138,"endTime":407.747,"body":"may be happening here is I have had"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":408.401,"endTime":411.592,"body":"development managers pick a date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":408.401,"endTime":411.592,"body":"because they're under pressure from"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":411.592,"endTime":414.783,"body":"the business, and then they come to the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":411.592,"endTime":414.783,"body":"team and they say, this is your date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":414.889,"endTime":417.335,"body":"the old project management, the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":414.889,"endTime":417.335,"body":"padding thing of like, sure, you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":417.335,"endTime":420.58,"body":"have to deliver it this week because"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":417.335,"endTime":420.58,"body":"next week we are meeting with the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":420.58,"endTime":423.198,"body":"client and then the week after that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":420.58,"endTime":423.198,"body":"they're gonna roll into production."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":423.198,"endTime":425.98,"body":"So I need a little padding in case"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":423.198,"endTime":425.98,"body":"you go over by a couple days like"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":425.985,"endTime":427.426,"body":"that, that type of thing yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":427.616,"endTime":430.271,"body":"Number one, that was, that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":427.616,"endTime":430.271,"body":"was my number one scenario."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":430.298,"endTime":431.58,"body":"Which, so there's two scenarios."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":431.585,"endTime":433.571,"body":"This might be a third scenario."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":433.571,"endTime":438.713,"body":"This might be, and I've worked for people"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":433.571,"endTime":438.713,"body":"like this, is they throw out a date and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":438.713,"endTime":441.586,"body":"then when the team doesn't hit the date,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":438.713,"endTime":441.586,"body":"they just throw the team under the bus."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":442.095,"endTime":444.604,"body":"And then because they're in a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":442.095,"endTime":444.604,"body":"leadership position or a management"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":444.968,"endTime":447.332,"body":"position, management position, or a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":444.968,"endTime":447.332,"body":"lead position of should know better."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":447.377,"endTime":450.677,"body":"Because they're in some sort of elevated"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":447.377,"endTime":450.677,"body":"position from the typical worker on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":450.682,"endTime":455.786,"body":"the line they can go to management"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":450.682,"endTime":455.786,"body":"and say, it wasn't me, all these"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":455.786,"endTime":457.504,"body":"people, or that it was that person."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":457.504,"endTime":458.486,"body":"Blame that person."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":458.786,"endTime":462.327,"body":"And there are some people that are,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":458.786,"endTime":462.327,"body":"are in several development teams who"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":462.327,"endTime":466.909,"body":"have made a, a pretty good career"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":462.327,"endTime":466.909,"body":"off of this type of operations."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":467.018,"endTime":468.9,"body":"whenever something goes"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":467.018,"endTime":468.9,"body":"bad, I blame somebody."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":469.282,"endTime":470.809,"body":"Whenever something goes well, I take care."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":470.809,"endTime":471.409,"body":"I did it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":471.845,"endTime":472.282,"body":"Bingo."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":472.8,"endTime":473.563,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":473.568,"endTime":474.573,"body":"We've all seen that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":474.818,"endTime":476.836,"body":"We've all seen that in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":474.818,"endTime":476.836,"body":"any work of life, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":476.836,"endTime":479.154,"body":"Any kind of work that we do,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":476.836,"endTime":479.154,"body":"we've seen people like that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":479.182,"endTime":479.373,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":479.945,"endTime":480.9,"body":"So yeah, they, they're out there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":480.9,"endTime":482.5,"body":"Right I don't know."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":482.563,"endTime":485.609,"body":"Let's, let's go back and read on a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":482.563,"endTime":485.609,"body":"little bit more, because I'm still on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":485.609,"endTime":490.163,"body":"the fence about whether he was dictated"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":485.609,"endTime":490.163,"body":"dates or he actually dictated dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":490.163,"endTime":490.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":490.6,"endTime":494.464,"body":"Have you noticed how Apple ships most"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":490.6,"endTime":494.464,"body":"of their Big Bang projects at WW d c"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":494.464,"endTime":495.937,"body":"a date that they commit to far ahead."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":496.264,"endTime":500.055,"body":"How Facebook unveils many of the features"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":496.264,"endTime":500.055,"body":"at F8, how Google launches products at io."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":500.219,"endTime":502.837,"body":"All these launches are date driven because"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":500.219,"endTime":502.837,"body":"that's a great way to grab people's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":502.837,"endTime":504.391,"body":"attention and extensive press coverage."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":504.582,"endTime":505.946,"body":"Let me read the rest of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":504.582,"endTime":505.946,"body":"this before we dig in."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":505.946,"endTime":506.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":506.246,"endTime":508.673,"body":"Publicly traded companies plan"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":506.246,"endTime":508.673,"body":"and budget based in quarters."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":508.809,"endTime":511.455,"body":"They also decide how much to invest"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":508.809,"endTime":511.455,"body":"in projects and people after asking,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":511.591,"endTime":514.101,"body":"how long does it take to launch"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":511.591,"endTime":514.101,"body":"private venture funded companies try"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":514.106,"endTime":517.373,"body":"to get new features out in time to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":514.106,"endTime":517.373,"body":"help with the new fundraising round?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":517.509,"endTime":517.782,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":517.782,"endTime":521.05,"body":"Some businesses are not very date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":517.782,"endTime":521.05,"body":"different, but they are rare, private,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":521.159,"endTime":524.023,"body":"profitable lifestyle businesses,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":521.159,"endTime":524.023,"body":"and some governments are perhaps"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":524.028,"endTime":526.778,"body":"the best example of entities that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":524.028,"endTime":526.778,"body":"don't care as much about dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":526.941,"endTime":529.323,"body":"That's interesting that he's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":526.941,"endTime":529.323,"body":"going down this road governments"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":529.328,"endTime":530.932,"body":"are the most date driven."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":531.041,"endTime":531.369,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":531.373,"endTime":531.941,"body":"I was just gonna say."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":531.941,"endTime":532.214,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":532.323,"endTime":532.459,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":532.459,"endTime":533.659,"body":"They're the most out of any of these"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":533.778,"endTime":537.928,"body":"I would say every, every example he"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":533.778,"endTime":537.928,"body":"just gave apple, Google, Facebook"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":537.932,"endTime":543.137,"body":"launches they're working on the top"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":537.932,"endTime":543.137,"body":"priority and it, it, they, they get"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":543.137,"endTime":549.164,"body":"as much done in the time given on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":543.137,"endTime":549.164,"body":"that priority until it goes to launch."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":549.209,"endTime":549.728,"body":"It's funny."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":549.732,"endTime":554.082,"body":"People used somebody had used"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":549.732,"endTime":554.082,"body":"this example again on LinkedIn"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":554.119,"endTime":556.332,"body":"about apple delivering to dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":556.432,"endTime":559.596,"body":"They, they were, it was a similar example,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":556.432,"endTime":559.596,"body":"but it wasn't exactly this example."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":560.005,"endTime":561.769,"body":"And they were talking"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":560.005,"endTime":561.769,"body":"about the original iPhone."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":562.123,"endTime":564.714,"body":"And I was like, this is such a funny"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":562.123,"endTime":564.714,"body":"example, because the original iPhone,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":564.714,"endTime":567.769,"body":"in the original demo, the original"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":564.714,"endTime":567.769,"body":"iPhone, Steve Jobs had a bunch of, he"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":567.773,"endTime":570.95,"body":"had a bunch of iPhones sitting on the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":567.773,"endTime":570.95,"body":"table and he, it was like a little shell"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":570.955,"endTime":574.141,"body":"game of, of, I'm gonna use this one to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":570.955,"endTime":574.141,"body":"make a phone call and I'm going to make"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":574.169,"endTime":576.296,"body":"use this one to browse the internet and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":574.169,"endTime":576.296,"body":"I'm gonna use this one to do whatever."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":576.296,"endTime":578.696,"body":"Because the, the technology"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":576.296,"endTime":578.696,"body":"just didn't work together."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":578.696,"endTime":582.814,"body":"So the, the teams working on those"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":578.696,"endTime":582.814,"body":"had to create a phone that only did"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":582.814,"endTime":586.678,"body":"that one thing, and it was only some,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":582.814,"endTime":586.678,"body":"some magic in front of the press."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":587.005,"endTime":588.887,"body":"Same thing happened with"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":587.005,"endTime":588.887,"body":"Nokia, by the way back then."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":588.887,"endTime":589.596,"body":"Yeah, I agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":589.793,"endTime":591.893,"body":"This is kind of what we covered"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":589.793,"endTime":591.893,"body":"in our last podcast, where we're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":591.893,"endTime":595.802,"body":"talking about agile purists and, and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":591.893,"endTime":595.802,"body":"the detractors and what, what they"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":595.857,"endTime":597.511,"body":"try to pin on purists and whatnot."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":597.511,"endTime":601.779,"body":"This is like, People know a little"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":597.511,"endTime":601.779,"body":"bit about how software development"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":601.779,"endTime":607.97,"body":"teams work, so they're trying to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":601.779,"endTime":607.97,"body":"bend reality to fit their viewpoint."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":607.975,"endTime":611.87,"body":"And it's just like every example given"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":607.975,"endTime":611.87,"body":"here is these companies aren't doing"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":611.875,"endTime":613.457,"body":"oh you're gonna do this by this date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":613.511,"endTime":615.067,"body":"And then when you're done with that,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":613.511,"endTime":615.067,"body":"you're gonna do this by this date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":615.071,"endTime":617.875,"body":"And when you're done with that,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":615.071,"endTime":617.875,"body":"I got another thing for you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":617.875,"endTime":618.939,"body":"and a date already picked out."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":619.129,"endTime":620.139,"body":"These companies don't work that way."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":620.193,"endTime":620.657,"body":"They don't."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":620.661,"endTime":623.957,"body":"And, and you know, sometimes you'll see"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":620.661,"endTime":623.957,"body":"companies that say, we're gonna deliver"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":623.957,"endTime":627.529,"body":"these features, but in this release"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":623.957,"endTime":627.529,"body":"we're only delivering these features."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":627.829,"endTime":629.084,"body":"These other ones will come later."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":629.084,"endTime":629.375,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":629.77,"endTime":629.811,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":630.448,"endTime":631.702,"body":"That's very, very common out there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":632.493,"endTime":635.084,"body":"He doesn't seem to, or she"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":632.493,"endTime":635.084,"body":"doesn't seem to acknowledge that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":635.466,"endTime":635.739,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":635.743,"endTime":635.811,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":636.12,"endTime":640.484,"body":"So it's not like they are date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":636.12,"endTime":640.484,"body":"driven so much as a launch happens."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":640.511,"endTime":640.675,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":640.679,"endTime":645.011,"body":"And what's in the launch is completely"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":640.679,"endTime":645.011,"body":"flexible based on what the company has"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":645.011,"endTime":646.566,"body":"ready at the time, what they wanted to do."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":646.57,"endTime":648.139,"body":"Sometimes they communicate upfront."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":648.761,"endTime":652.143,"body":"And these are what I like to call"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":648.761,"endTime":652.143,"body":"forward looking statements as the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":652.225,"endTime":653.452,"body":"finance companies call them, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":653.457,"endTime":653.479,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":653.525,"endTime":656.825,"body":"Right you'll see that whenever you see"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":653.525,"endTime":656.825,"body":"any financial news, they'll say in the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":656.825,"endTime":658.434,"body":"next quarter we will be blah, blah, blah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":658.598,"endTime":660.07,"body":"These are all forward looking statements."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":660.12,"endTime":663.039,"body":"When I was editing the, the roadmap"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":660.12,"endTime":663.039,"body":"discussion where I said, well, you should"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":663.039,"endTime":664.539,"body":"you should only do outcome-based roadmaps."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":664.539,"endTime":665.002,"body":"Right, right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":665.166,"endTime":669.007,"body":"When I was editing that discussion, I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":665.166,"endTime":669.007,"body":"thought to myself the, the valid case"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":669.007,"endTime":671.843,"body":"we didn't talk about was  sometimes,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":669.007,"endTime":671.843,"body":"sometimes someone will go to a project"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":671.843,"endTime":676.579,"body":"manager and say, Hey, I'm thinking about"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":671.843,"endTime":676.579,"body":"involving us in this software project."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":676.879,"endTime":677.889,"body":"I'm thinking about it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":678.134,"endTime":680.289,"body":"I've not committed any money,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":678.134,"endTime":680.289,"body":"I've not committed any whatever."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":680.289,"endTime":684.87,"body":"But if I'm gonna go lobby for a budget, I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":680.289,"endTime":684.87,"body":"need to know how big a team I should hire,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":684.87,"endTime":688.416,"body":"how many how much money I should ask for,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":684.87,"endTime":688.416,"body":"how long should I ask for the timeline?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":688.534,"endTime":692.479,"body":"And, and there are some things that, that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":688.534,"endTime":692.479,"body":"Agileists truly would have difficulty"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":693.016,"endTime":694.652,"body":"just conjuring out of thin air."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":694.679,"endTime":695.334,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":695.334,"endTime":698.007,"body":"Using their conjuration magic"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":695.334,"endTime":698.007,"body":"while playing lizards and wizards."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":698.134,"endTime":698.461,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":698.479,"endTime":698.679,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":699.443,"endTime":700.243,"body":"I like Liz and Wizards"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":700.334,"endTime":704.025,"body":"Any agilist worth their salt would never"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":700.334,"endTime":704.025,"body":"say this can be done by this state."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":704.052,"endTime":706.37,"body":"They would say it can"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":704.052,"endTime":706.37,"body":"be done between X and Y."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":706.479,"endTime":706.834,"body":"Ah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":706.861,"endTime":709.116,"body":"So they always provide a range otherwise."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":709.97,"endTime":712.698,"body":"Ah, but that they're gonna be"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":709.97,"endTime":712.698,"body":"wrong, but they're not, they're not"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":712.702,"endTime":713.952,"body":"looking for promotions, you know?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":714.17,"endTime":714.416,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":714.42,"endTime":714.97,"body":"Well that's true too."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":715.08,"endTime":716.716,"body":"which is fo for another podcast."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":716.716,"endTime":717.18,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":717.18,"endTime":719.471,"body":"What do organizations reward?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":719.471,"endTime":719.852,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":719.852,"endTime":721.516,"body":"And those are the behaviors they get."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":721.598,"endTime":721.898,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":721.898,"endTime":725.162,"body":"So maybe we'll come in come into that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":721.898,"endTime":725.162,"body":"at, at a different date and time."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":725.162,"endTime":726.116,"body":"I so look for that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":726.171,"endTime":730.075,"body":"I offer into evidence a real"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":726.171,"endTime":730.075,"body":"exchange from my experience as"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":730.512,"endTime":731.712,"body":"a member of development team."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":731.848,"endTime":733.612,"body":"Is how long will this take to get done?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":733.775,"endTime":735.057,"body":"I think it'll probably take a month."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":735.384,"endTime":736.066,"body":"A month?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":736.175,"endTime":736.939,"body":"Really?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":737.021,"endTime":737.73,"body":"A month?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":737.812,"endTime":738.793,"body":"I don't know."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":738.93,"endTime":740.757,"body":"I think you can get"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":738.93,"endTime":740.757,"body":"that done in two weeks."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":741.139,"endTime":741.384,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":741.389,"endTime":742.075,"body":"Well okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":742.075,"endTime":742.539,"body":"Two weeks."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":742.539,"endTime":744.448,"body":"I mean, whatever you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":742.539,"endTime":744.448,"body":"say, like we'll do it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":744.448,"endTime":744.53,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":744.693,"endTime":744.857,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":745.048,"endTime":747.966,"body":"Like that, that's, that's the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":745.048,"endTime":747.966,"body":"estimates he's talking about right now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":748.021,"endTime":749.33,"body":"That's so, yeah, I agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":749.33,"endTime":749.793,"body":"First of all."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":749.793,"endTime":750.012,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":750.012,"endTime":753.312,"body":"Secondly, I wanna say this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":750.012,"endTime":753.312,"body":"to, to your anecdote spot on."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":753.721,"endTime":754.539,"body":"You could do it in two weeks."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":754.543,"endTime":755.275,"body":"You can do it one week."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":755.439,"endTime":756.53,"body":"What quality are you getting?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":757.166,"endTime":757.975,"body":"Look, we make the date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":758.621,"endTime":759.33,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":759.33,"endTime":762.439,"body":"There's some little loose ends over"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":759.33,"endTime":762.439,"body":"here and there, and some rough edges."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":762.439,"endTime":763.502,"body":"We'll take care of that later."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":763.966,"endTime":766.939,"body":"Aka, tech debt later never happens."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":766.939,"endTime":767.13,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":767.266,"endTime":767.593,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":767.757,"endTime":771.139,"body":"So you have all this crap on the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":767.757,"endTime":771.139,"body":"backlog that you know you need to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":771.139,"endTime":775.066,"body":"get to at some point, but you won't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":771.139,"endTime":775.066,"body":"get to it because you keep rinsing,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":775.066,"endTime":776.648,"body":"repeating the same thing over and over."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":776.648,"endTime":780.902,"body":"Until some customer that says, this stuff"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":776.648,"endTime":780.902,"body":"is terrible, it's hurting us, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":781.148,"endTime":782.239,"body":"And we're gonna stop paying you."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":782.293,"endTime":786.466,"body":"That's when you pay attention to TechNet,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":782.293,"endTime":786.466,"body":"which by the way, all of that is avoidable"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":786.466,"endTime":788.048,"body":"if you did the thing right to begin with."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":788.169,"endTime":788.96,"body":"I rest my case."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":788.979,"endTime":789.467,"body":"the defense rest."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":789.766,"endTime":791.266,"body":"Let's see if we agree with"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":789.766,"endTime":791.266,"body":"anything in his article."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":791.266,"endTime":791.429,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":791.429,"endTime":795.375,"body":"He says, good communication is more"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":791.429,"endTime":795.375,"body":"important than good estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":795.648,"endTime":798.729,"body":"I have missed many of my estimates"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":795.648,"endTime":798.729,"body":"and it was rarely a big deal."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":799.011,"endTime":801.211,"body":"I, I, listen, I, I kind"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":799.011,"endTime":801.211,"body":"of agree with that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":801.211,"endTime":802.466,"body":"Let me read the rest of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":801.211,"endTime":802.466,"body":"it before we responded."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":802.466,"endTime":802.793,"body":"Yeah, please do."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":803.12,"endTime":806.338,"body":"While people and businesses"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":803.12,"endTime":806.338,"body":"are date driven, delays are"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":806.338,"endTime":808.138,"body":"common in any part of a company."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":808.329,"endTime":811.82,"body":"If you think delays only happen in tech"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":808.329,"endTime":811.82,"body":"parts of a business, talk with people"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":811.82,"endTime":814.793,"body":"in operations, marketing, recruiting"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":811.82,"endTime":814.793,"body":"other functions, regardless of the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":814.793,"endTime":817.738,"body":"org and function, people tend to be"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":814.793,"endTime":817.738,"body":"overly optimistic in their estimates"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":817.929,"endTime":819.757,"body":"for work they've not done before."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":820.111,"endTime":823.843,"body":"Ever heard of building construction,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":820.111,"endTime":823.843,"body":"project overrun a government initiative"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":824.307,"endTime":826.461,"body":"to be late, Brexit being delayed again."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":826.679,"endTime":829.925,"body":"Where there are people, there"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":826.679,"endTime":829.925,"body":"are delays hang on, I think we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":829.925,"endTime":830.988,"body":"need to stop there because, okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":830.988,"endTime":831.261,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":831.507,"endTime":831.616,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":831.616,"endTime":835.27,"body":"What he's saying is it's,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":831.616,"endTime":835.27,"body":"it's rarely a big deal."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":835.27,"endTime":839.361,"body":"The problem is this, whenever you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":835.27,"endTime":839.361,"body":"provide an estimate, it is misconstrued"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":839.688,"endTime":843.507,"body":"upon delivery the problem, which is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":839.688,"endTime":843.507,"body":"when they hear it as a commitment."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":843.752,"endTime":844.107,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":844.434,"endTime":849.861,"body":"So the word estimate is just that it's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":844.434,"endTime":849.861,"body":"not a guarantee, it's an estimate."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":849.888,"endTime":853.543,"body":"It's a best faith effort of when"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":849.888,"endTime":853.543,"body":"we're trying to do something, which is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":853.543,"endTime":857.552,"body":"why I say people that are savvy will"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":853.543,"endTime":857.552,"body":"never give a a point in time date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":857.552,"endTime":859.27,"body":"They'll say between this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":857.552,"endTime":859.27,"body":"date and that date, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":859.543,"endTime":862.57,"body":"Because they will weigh"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":859.543,"endTime":862.57,"body":"in the risks, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":862.734,"endTime":866.361,"body":"That lie in delivering that, and therefore"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":862.734,"endTime":866.361,"body":"they're guarding themselves a little."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":866.634,"endTime":871.625,"body":"But in most cases like this or others,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":866.634,"endTime":871.625,"body":"even when people say, here's an estimate,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":872.334,"endTime":876.261,"body":"I'm saying it's an estimate, but what"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":872.334,"endTime":876.261,"body":"leadership management, our hearing is,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":876.752,"endTime":878.252,"body":"Oh yeah, you're gonna deliver by then."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":878.334,"endTime":880.898,"body":"So when that doesn't happen"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":878.334,"endTime":880.898,"body":"immediately, it's, you failed."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":880.994,"endTime":881.949,"body":"That's what happens."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":881.979,"endTime":884.024,"body":"I it's, it's never not"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":881.979,"endTime":884.024,"body":"a big deal, by the way."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":884.024,"endTime":884.815,"body":"It's always a big deal"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":884.906,"endTime":889.924,"body":"I'm trying not to dig into the privilege"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":884.906,"endTime":889.924,"body":"that's being exuded from this article."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":890.043,"endTime":892.365,"body":"When you work for companies that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":890.043,"endTime":892.365,"body":"their biggest problem is where"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":892.365,"endTime":893.038,"body":"are they gonna put all the cash?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":893.638,"endTime":895.638,"body":"You know, because they've"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":893.638,"endTime":895.638,"body":"stumbled into a market sale."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":895.665,"endTime":897.956,"body":"Like you weren't there at the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":895.665,"endTime":897.956,"body":"beginning, you just happened to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":897.956,"endTime":899.893,"body":"join them at some point, you know?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":899.893,"endTime":903.356,"body":"Uh, and, and their issue is, what are"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":899.893,"endTime":903.356,"body":"we gonna do with all this success?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":903.384,"endTime":905.293,"body":"My goodness, we're growing so fast."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":905.429,"endTime":906.629,"body":"What are we gonna do"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":905.429,"endTime":906.629,"body":"with all these people?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":906.629,"endTime":907.965,"body":"How are we gonna scale so quickly?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":908.238,"endTime":909.956,"body":"it reads a certain way."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":910.761,"endTime":912.997,"body":"You know, it reads a certain"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":910.761,"endTime":912.997,"body":"way is like, oh, everyone else"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":912.997,"endTime":914.524,"body":"was scared to give a date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":914.797,"endTime":918.643,"body":"And I gave a date and I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":914.797,"endTime":918.643,"body":"was so successful in that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":918.697,"endTime":919.215,"body":"I mean, really."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":919.22,"endTime":921.97,"body":"Were you successful cuz you didn't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":919.22,"endTime":921.97,"body":"write anything in here about how your"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":921.97,"endTime":926.006,"body":"team members or even whether the fact"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":921.97,"endTime":926.006,"body":"that you worked with your team members"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":926.011,"endTime":928.679,"body":"to come up with that to come up with,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":926.011,"endTime":928.679,"body":"or did you just shoot from the hip?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":928.724,"endTime":931.897,"body":"I would also argue no new ground"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":928.724,"endTime":931.897,"body":"has been broken at this point."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":931.897,"endTime":934.515,"body":"Everything he said is like, well,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":931.897,"endTime":934.515,"body":"there was this big yearly event."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":934.706,"endTime":936.316,"body":"Well, I mean, I can hit a yearly event."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":936.724,"endTime":940.052,"body":"I mean, even in the, the podcast we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":936.724,"endTime":940.052,"body":"did about roadmaps that we keep talking"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":940.052,"endTime":944.061,"body":"about like we talked about, like"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":940.052,"endTime":944.061,"body":"regular regulatory compliance dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":944.061,"endTime":944.143,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":944.279,"endTime":946.734,"body":"Like, cool, just put it as a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":944.279,"endTime":946.734,"body":"little mile marker, milestone"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":946.734,"endTime":947.961,"body":"marker at the top of my roadmap."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":947.988,"endTime":948.07,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":948.293,"endTime":948.915,"body":"And I'll hit it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":949.052,"endTime":950.115,"body":"I'll hit it a hundred percent of the time."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":950.12,"endTime":950.415,"body":"Super easy."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":951.124,"endTime":952.243,"body":"Like, I know it's coming up."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":952.243,"endTime":954.561,"body":"I'll put my team on it when, when"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":952.243,"endTime":954.561,"body":"I need to, and then we'll hit the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":954.561,"endTime":956.388,"body":"date and we'll be compliant and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":954.561,"endTime":956.388,"body":"we'll move on to the next thing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":956.506,"endTime":958.715,"body":"He's not pointing out any smoking"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":956.506,"endTime":958.715,"body":"guns to me, is what I'm saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":958.715,"endTime":959.07,"body":"I, I agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":959.124,"endTime":959.97,"body":"Absolutely agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":960.734,"endTime":961.988,"body":"It's kind of underwhelming really."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":961.993,"endTime":962.724,"body":"It, it really is."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":962.724,"endTime":964.834,"body":"I'm, I'm, I'm actually kind of, I'm"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":962.724,"endTime":964.834,"body":"getting disappointed let's, let's read"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":964.839,"endTime":966.77,"body":"on to see if I can get excited again."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":966.77,"endTime":966.852,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":967.015,"endTime":967.752,"body":"That's what I'm trying to say."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":967.752,"endTime":968.543,"body":"I need to get excited."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":968.761,"endTime":968.979,"body":"Yep."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":969.061,"endTime":973.115,"body":"If only I had more ice how, how and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":969.061,"endTime":973.115,"body":"when the delay is communicated matters"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":973.224,"endTime":974.67,"body":"far more than the delay itself."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":974.87,"endTime":979.315,"body":"The other issue with what he's saying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":974.87,"endTime":979.315,"body":"now is like, n none of the dates matter."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":979.561,"endTime":980.597,"body":"All the dates are made up."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":980.843,"endTime":981.961,"body":"Everyone misses dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":982.315,"endTime":983.079,"body":"Who cares?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":983.27,"endTime":987.797,"body":"Why, why you, and the way you display"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":983.27,"endTime":987.797,"body":"your evidence of why you missed it"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":987.852,"endTime":989.324,"body":"is paramount, is what he's saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":989.406,"endTime":992.27,"body":"And I, I, I don't know about that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":989.406,"endTime":992.27,"body":"because I know of people that will"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":992.274,"endTime":994.256,"body":"just simply say, But you said uh."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":994.447,"endTime":998.084,"body":"Yeah, but look, what he's saying here"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":994.447,"endTime":998.084,"body":"is like, that, that, that's trivial."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":998.52,"endTime":1000.211,"body":"He, he, he's basically trivializing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1000.256,"endTime":1001.738,"body":"Trivializing, is that a real word?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1001.738,"endTime":1002.365,"body":"It is a word."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1002.37,"endTime":1002.838,"body":"Trivializing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1003.02,"endTime":1005.474,"body":"He's, he's saying it's, it's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1003.02,"endTime":1005.474,"body":"trivial when you miss the date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1005.474,"endTime":1007.984,"body":"It's like when you give a how confident"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1005.474,"endTime":1007.984,"body":"are you that we will, whatever,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1007.984,"endTime":1010.929,"body":"and you say, I am 78% confident."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1010.929,"endTime":1012.484,"body":"And then the thing doesn't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1010.929,"endTime":1012.484,"body":"happen and you're like, Brian,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1012.484,"endTime":1013.738,"body":"you said you were 78% confident."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1013.956,"endTime":1017.802,"body":"And, and then Brian would say, well, you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1013.956,"endTime":1017.802,"body":"never hold me to that in the past, so"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1017.802,"endTime":1021.715,"body":"why should I worry about, oh, Brian would"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1017.802,"endTime":1021.715,"body":"say, well, There was still that 22%."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1021.906,"endTime":1021.988,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1021.988,"endTime":1022.615,"body":"22%."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1022.67,"endTime":1023.27,"body":"What do you want, man?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1023.352,"endTime":1025.015,"body":"Like, you didn't ask for a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1023.352,"endTime":1025.015,"body":"hundred percent certainty."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1025.215,"endTime":1027.779,"body":"The, the issue with that is your"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1025.215,"endTime":1027.779,"body":"business will start treating"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1027.779,"endTime":1029.388,"body":"you in that disingenuous manner."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1029.393,"endTime":1029.643,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1030.015,"endTime":1030.234,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1030.238,"endTime":1032.224,"body":"That's a, that's a big problem forward."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1032.279,"endTime":1036.006,"body":"It is a big problem because going forward"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1032.279,"endTime":1036.006,"body":"you have a credibility issue now, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1036.011,"endTime":1036.37,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1036.37,"endTime":1039.152,"body":"With your business and your stakeholders,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1036.37,"endTime":1039.152,"body":"why would they believe you when"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1039.156,"endTime":1041.824,"body":"you say, well, this time it's 85%."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1042.015,"endTime":1042.234,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1042.824,"endTime":1043.388,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1043.393,"endTime":1046.243,"body":"This time, this time"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1043.393,"endTime":1046.243,"body":"I'm confident in my 85%."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1046.434,"endTime":1050.079,"body":"Whereas last time when I said 85%,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1046.434,"endTime":1050.079,"body":"well, last time you said 78%, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1050.084,"endTime":1050.306,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1050.415,"endTime":1050.77,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1050.961,"endTime":1053.634,"body":"And so you missed it and we're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1050.961,"endTime":1053.634,"body":"gonna give you a pass on that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1053.634,"endTime":1057.534,"body":"But now that you're saying 85, well,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1053.634,"endTime":1057.534,"body":"heaven forbid if you missed the 85."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1057.534,"endTime":1057.588,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1058.297,"endTime":1059.115,"body":"Good grief."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1059.161,"endTime":1063.497,"body":"No, you, you can't erode confidence in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1059.161,"endTime":1063.497,"body":"the business like that by, by treating"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1063.497,"endTime":1066.743,"body":"dates flippantly like this, that takes,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1063.497,"endTime":1066.743,"body":"I really want to use the word flippantly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1066.77,"endTime":1067.479,"body":"Flippantly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1067.561,"endTime":1068.788,"body":"Flippantly is a great word."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1069.197,"endTime":1072.579,"body":"It takes a long, long time"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1069.197,"endTime":1072.579,"body":"to build up that confidence."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1072.606,"endTime":1072.879,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1072.879,"endTime":1074.789,"body":"And it takes a split second to lose it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1075.157,"endTime":1078.648,"body":"pushing back on estimates also misses"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1075.157,"endTime":1078.648,"body":"the bigger point about engineers"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1078.648,"endTime":1081.293,"body":"staying focused on delivering"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1078.648,"endTime":1081.293,"body":"the largest business value."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1081.566,"endTime":1082.993,"body":"I, I don't understand what I just read."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1083.039,"endTime":1085.384,"body":"First of all, there is no bigger"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1083.039,"endTime":1085.384,"body":"point about engineers staying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1085.384,"endTime":1086.775,"body":"focused on delivering the largest."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1086.775,"endTime":1086.776,"body":"Sorry."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1086.78,"endTime":1089.039,"body":"I I read that twice and I, I"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1086.78,"endTime":1089.039,"body":"don't understand the point."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1089.584,"endTime":1092.889,"body":"So he's saying, he's saying because"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1089.584,"endTime":1092.889,"body":"we're not estimating in time, we're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1092.893,"endTime":1094.99,"body":"not focused on the lo delivering"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1092.893,"endTime":1094.99,"body":"the largest business value."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1095.234,"endTime":1095.998,"body":"Is that that statement?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1095.998,"endTime":1096.052,"body":"That's what he's saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1096.052,"endTime":1097.434,"body":"That's why I said it's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1096.052,"endTime":1097.434,"body":"unintelligible sneezing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1097.452,"endTime":1101.011,"body":"There's a thing about writing whoever"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1097.452,"endTime":1101.011,"body":"the author of this is there's a thing"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1101.039,"endTime":1102.62,"body":"about writing and being an author."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1102.839,"endTime":1104.011,"body":"It's called show Don't Tell."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1104.148,"endTime":1104.339,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1104.557,"endTime":1106.248,"body":"Every time you have to say,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1104.557,"endTime":1106.248,"body":"I'm really good at this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1106.439,"endTime":1110.257,"body":"It makes me think, me the viewer"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1106.439,"endTime":1110.257,"body":"think you're not actually good at it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1110.261,"endTime":1110.802,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1111.02,"endTime":1112.384,"body":"Okay, let's, let's keep reading."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1112.766,"endTime":1112.984,"body":"Now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1112.984,"endTime":1113.366,"body":"I'm done."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1113.748,"endTime":1116.748,"body":"I feel he started it at this point for"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1113.748,"endTime":1116.748,"body":"every, or she, for every, oh, he or"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1116.748,"endTime":1118.984,"body":"she for every major project shipped."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1118.984,"endTime":1122.993,"body":"We, we shipped something different"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1118.984,"endTime":1122.993,"body":"on the launch date than we agreed"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1122.993,"endTime":1124.884,"body":"to originally for Skype and XBONE."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1125.148,"endTime":1127.52,"body":"We didn't ship group video"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1125.148,"endTime":1127.52,"body":"calling on launch date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1127.52,"endTime":1131.048,"body":"We, while playing games, The"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1127.52,"endTime":1131.048,"body":"platform turned out not to leave"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1131.048,"endTime":1133.83,"body":"enough e CPU processing to decode"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1131.048,"endTime":1133.83,"body":"more than two streams reliably."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1133.966,"endTime":1135.657,"body":"So we cut this feature,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1133.966,"endTime":1135.657,"body":"we cut the feature."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1135.657,"endTime":1135.82,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1135.825,"endTime":1138.002,"body":"I, dude, everything he's saying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1135.825,"endTime":1138.002,"body":"is that's, to everybody else."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1138.002,"endTime":1141.657,"body":"Everything he's saying is, is completely"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1138.002,"endTime":1141.657,"body":"agrees with, with, with, hang on."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1141.657,"endTime":1142.693,"body":"Let me see if I can skim this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1142.693,"endTime":1145.284,"body":"Because like for the people listening,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1142.693,"endTime":1145.284,"body":"like a lot of this guy cut out."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1145.289,"endTime":1145.43,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1145.639,"endTime":1147.893,"body":"Similarly, for every project with"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1145.639,"endTime":1147.893,"body":"a fixed deadline, we ship different"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1147.893,"endTime":1149.366,"body":"functionality to what we planned."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1149.611,"endTime":1150.266,"body":"Oh, really?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1150.266,"endTime":1150.32,"body":"Wow."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1150.484,"endTime":1152.502,"body":"Similarly, for every project"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1150.484,"endTime":1152.502,"body":"with a fixed deadline."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1152.507,"endTime":1152.611,"body":"There we go."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1153.348,"endTime":1155.639,"body":"But, but the stakeholders"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1153.348,"endTime":1155.639,"body":"were never surprised."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1155.802,"endTime":1157.548,"body":"We had continuous conversation"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1155.802,"endTime":1157.548,"body":"with the business."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1157.548,"endTime":1158.884,"body":"We kept hitting our milestones."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1158.889,"endTime":1160.493,"body":"Yeah, you, that's, you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1158.889,"endTime":1160.493,"body":"kept changing them though."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1160.875,"endTime":1162.32,"body":"In order to hit 'em, you just said that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1162.62,"endTime":1162.92,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1162.92,"endTime":1165.02,"body":"Estimates and deadlines are"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1162.92,"endTime":1165.02,"body":"great for getting things done."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1165.157,"endTime":1167.339,"body":"They heavily incentivize team to focus."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1167.339,"endTime":1169.793,"body":"We built Skype for XBONE in 16 months."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1169.957,"endTime":1173.093,"body":"We spent most of the 16 months in a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1169.957,"endTime":1173.093,"body":"way, similar to hashtag no estimates"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1173.093,"endTime":1176.23,"body":"philosophy promoted, even though"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1173.093,"endTime":1176.23,"body":"this was not a thing back then."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1176.72,"endTime":1179.802,"body":"Our pace picked up from jogging to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1176.72,"endTime":1179.802,"body":"running for the last four months, two"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1179.807,"endTime":1182.584,"body":"months to the launch, we realized we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1179.807,"endTime":1182.584,"body":"were behind and started sprinting."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1182.857,"endTime":1184.957,"body":"We were more productive and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1182.857,"endTime":1184.957,"body":"produced at the same value in those"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1184.957,"endTime":1187.084,"body":"last four months that we did in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1184.957,"endTime":1187.084,"body":"the previous 12 months combined."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1187.084,"endTime":1188.584,"body":"Why the sudden productivity change?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1188.857,"endTime":1190.411,"body":"We had a big deadline coming up."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1190.411,"endTime":1191.748,"body":"There was no option of not shipping."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1191.748,"endTime":1193.63,"body":"Suddenly the whole team"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1191.748,"endTime":1193.63,"body":"became focused distractions."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1193.634,"endTime":1195.539,"body":"We were all gone and we"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1193.634,"endTime":1195.539,"body":"moved at a faster pace"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1195.893,"endTime":1197.257,"body":"I don't see anything else"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1195.893,"endTime":1197.257,"body":"in what he just said."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1197.257,"endTime":1200.366,"body":"He said the closer we got to the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1197.257,"endTime":1200.366,"body":"deadline, the artificial deadline,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1200.584,"endTime":1202.084,"body":"the more the whip got cracked."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1202.089,"endTime":1202.493,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1202.493,"endTime":1202.739,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1202.793,"endTime":1203.23,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1203.23,"endTime":1205.548,"body":"That's, that's the way software"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1203.23,"endTime":1205.548,"body":"development was done in the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1205.739,"endTime":1206.993,"body":"nineties and early two thousands."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1206.993,"endTime":1208.62,"body":"How is that different to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1206.993,"endTime":1208.62,"body":"how I was doing Waterfall?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1208.62,"endTime":1208.875,"body":"Really?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1209.62,"endTime":1211.93,"body":"You know, the closer you got"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1209.62,"endTime":1211.93,"body":"to the deadline, people just"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1211.93,"endTime":1213.32,"body":"kept getting whipped harder."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1213.402,"endTime":1213.484,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1213.489,"endTime":1213.73,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1213.866,"endTime":1214.875,"body":"I, I believe him."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1214.93,"endTime":1218.557,"body":"I don't, that that doesn't, that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1214.93,"endTime":1218.557,"body":"doesn't support hour base estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1218.693,"endTime":1219.948,"body":"That actually works against mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1220.22,"endTime":1221.257,"body":"The argument he's trying to make."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1221.33,"endTime":1221.575,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1222.066,"endTime":1223.43,"body":"Boy, I'm, I'm glad he's with us now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1224.248,"endTime":1225.42,"body":"Software has too many unknowns."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1225.693,"endTime":1228.28,"body":"Learning to estimate different types"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1225.693,"endTime":1228.28,"body":"of unknowns giving estimates than"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1228.285,"endTime":1230.025,"body":"missing them forces deeper reflection."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1230.134,"endTime":1232.589,"body":"Oh boy, I, this is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1230.134,"endTime":1232.589,"body":"getting philosophical now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1232.618,"endTime":1236.731,"body":"giving estimates then missing"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1232.618,"endTime":1236.731,"body":"them forces deeper reflection and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1236.731,"endTime":1239.622,"body":"faster learning about the types"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1236.731,"endTime":1239.622,"body":"of unknowns in the software world."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1240.222,"endTime":1240.958,"body":"No, no, it doesn't."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1240.958,"endTime":1241.34,"body":"No, it doesn't."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1241.345,"endTime":1242.504,"body":"Absolutely doesn't."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1242.504,"endTime":1243.122,"body":"Absolutely doesn't."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1243.277,"endTime":1245.895,"body":"No, I, I certainly make"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1243.277,"endTime":1245.895,"body":"to differ on that one."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1245.922,"endTime":1246.249,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1246.249,"endTime":1248.545,"body":"I, I, I, I disagree with that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1246.249,"endTime":1248.545,"body":"statement philosophically,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1249.268,"endTime":1251.599,"body":"Logically, emotionally, you name it!."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1251.816,"endTime":1252.471,"body":"Spiritually."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1252.471,"endTime":1253.834,"body":"Spiritually, religiously."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1253.834,"endTime":1254.216,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1254.298,"endTime":1256.28,"body":"Any, any enigmatically."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1256.386,"endTime":1258.486,"body":"Emphatically, theoretically, practically"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1258.947,"endTime":1259.438,"body":"wait a minute."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1259.438,"endTime":1262.002,"body":"Like, giving estimates and then"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1259.438,"endTime":1262.002,"body":"missing them does not force a deeper"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1262.002,"endTime":1264.865,"body":"reflection, giving estimates and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1262.002,"endTime":1264.865,"body":"then missing them; all that does is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1264.893,"endTime":1266.12,"body":"f look, where am I on camera, dude."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1266.124,"endTime":1268.083,"body":"The under, all that, all"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1266.124,"endTime":1268.083,"body":"that does is confidence."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1268.111,"endTime":1271.193,"body":"All that does is undermine confidence"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1268.111,"endTime":1271.193,"body":"and it forces your, your management."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1271.193,"endTime":1271.574,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1271.574,"endTime":1272.093,"body":"Not leadership."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1272.202,"endTime":1274.574,"body":"It forces your management to, to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1272.202,"endTime":1274.574,"body":"pick somebody out of the crowd"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1274.574,"endTime":1275.502,"body":"and be like, it's your fault."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1275.502,"endTime":1276.047,"body":"Get outta here."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1276.238,"endTime":1276.483,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1276.483,"endTime":1277.029,"body":"That's all it does."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1277.033,"endTime":1277.793,"body":"Somebody gets shocked."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1277.983,"endTime":1279.238,"body":"What about your stakeholders though?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1279.238,"endTime":1280.438,"body":"What happens with your stakeholders?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1280.443,"endTime":1282.783,"body":"You say, well, I'm gonna do it by"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1280.443,"endTime":1282.783,"body":"this date, and then you miss it"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1282.783,"endTime":1283.903,"body":"and you go, it's all right though."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1284.227,"endTime":1286.008,"body":"cuz it, it, it makes us focus sharper."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1286.012,"endTime":1286.444,"body":"It's not our right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1286.499,"endTime":1287.171,"body":"No it's not."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1287.317,"endTime":1287.508,"body":"Alright."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1287.512,"endTime":1289.826,"body":"That's not, that's, that's the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1287.512,"endTime":1289.826,"body":"recipe for working in the middle"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1289.826,"endTime":1290.862,"body":"of the night and coming on's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1290.862,"endTime":1291.299,"body":"Saturday."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1291.299,"endTime":1293.999,"body":"And I'm gonna need you to work on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1291.299,"endTime":1293.999,"body":"Sunday pajama parties and all of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1293.999,"endTime":1295.244,"body":"that stuff that happens, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1295.617,"endTime":1298.535,"body":"I'm gonna need you to work on Sunday"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1295.617,"endTime":1298.535,"body":"as well don't you go ahead and, yeah,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1298.735,"endTime":1303.417,"body":"do those TPS reports by tomorrow"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1298.735,"endTime":1303.417,"body":"morning in fact, just do it right now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1303.444,"endTime":1303.717,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1303.717,"endTime":1304.999,"body":"What else is in here while I'm waiting?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1305.599,"endTime":1307.967,"body":"Software has too many unknowns,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1305.599,"endTime":1307.967,"body":"when you end up giving estimates,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1307.967,"endTime":1309.249,"body":"then miss them by a large margin."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1309.412,"endTime":1311.88,"body":"You cannot avoid being uh,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1309.412,"endTime":1311.88,"body":"having an honest conversation"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1311.88,"endTime":1312.644,"body":"with yourself and your team."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1312.644,"endTime":1313.271,"body":"What do we miss?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1313.408,"endTime":1314.09,"body":"Why do we miss it?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1314.226,"endTime":1316.217,"body":"How can we try to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1314.226,"endTime":1316.217,"body":"account for it next time?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1316.38,"endTime":1318.617,"body":"If you don't have estimates, you'll"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1316.38,"endTime":1318.617,"body":"end up asking these questions."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1318.621,"endTime":1319.926,"body":"Far fewer."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1320.212,"endTime":1320.594,"body":"Times."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1320.758,"endTime":1324.33,"body":"I feel an agile coach worth their"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1320.758,"endTime":1324.33,"body":"salt would step in at this point"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1324.33,"endTime":1327.112,"body":"to say I'm sorry, how, how did"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1324.33,"endTime":1327.112,"body":"you come to this conclusion?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1327.112,"endTime":1330.93,"body":"Like, that's a question that you should"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1327.112,"endTime":1330.93,"body":"pose to the team, not a statement"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1330.93,"endTime":1333.821,"body":"that you should make, which is, if"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1330.93,"endTime":1333.821,"body":"you don't have estimates, you'll"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1333.826,"endTime":1335.412,"body":"ask these questions far fewer times."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1336.121,"endTime":1338.985,"body":", Why are you not inspecting after"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1336.121,"endTime":1338.985,"body":"every cycle that you're done with?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1339.149,"endTime":1339.34,"body":"Bingo."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1339.344,"endTime":1341.794,"body":"Even, even if you have an artificial"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1339.344,"endTime":1341.794,"body":"date set by somebody who doesn't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1341.794,"endTime":1343.812,"body":"sit on the team and doesn't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1341.794,"endTime":1343.812,"body":"know how the work is produced or"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1343.812,"endTime":1346.508,"body":"whatever, listen, dates are reality."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1346.508,"endTime":1348.035,"body":"A date will come down set by marketing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1348.144,"endTime":1350.327,"body":"If you have a physical component of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1348.144,"endTime":1350.327,"body":"your software dev development, if"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1350.327,"endTime":1352.944,"body":"you have a hardware component, dates"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1350.327,"endTime":1352.944,"body":"will be set by your manufacturer."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1352.971,"endTime":1354.635,"body":"The devices will ship by this date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1354.88,"endTime":1356.217,"body":"Dates could be set by your management."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1356.353,"endTime":1359.94,"body":"I'm not arguing against having"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1356.353,"endTime":1359.94,"body":"little diamonds on the top of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1359.94,"endTime":1361.63,"body":"milestones on the top of your backlog."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1361.794,"endTime":1362.667,"body":"That's not what I'm saying."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1362.858,"endTime":1366.185,"body":"What I'm saying is he's, he's saying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1362.858,"endTime":1366.185,"body":"if I don't do it in time estimates,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1366.33,"endTime":1368.276,"body":"I won't inspect it after the fact."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1368.521,"endTime":1370.103,"body":"And, and I'm saying"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1368.521,"endTime":1370.103,"body":"that's completely wrong."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1370.158,"endTime":1374.63,"body":"This is putting the, this is putting"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1370.158,"endTime":1374.63,"body":"the cart in the next cart before"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1374.63,"endTime":1376.458,"body":"the horse, not just your own cart."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1376.949,"endTime":1380.085,"body":"You really should be just"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1376.949,"endTime":1380.085,"body":"trying it out one time and then"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1380.085,"endTime":1381.721,"body":"inspecting and adapting from there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1381.721,"endTime":1384.04,"body":"So you put a date out there and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1381.721,"endTime":1384.04,"body":"it doesn't work to his point."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1384.04,"endTime":1384.421,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1384.421,"endTime":1387.203,"body":"Forces great conversations,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1384.421,"endTime":1387.203,"body":"meaningful convos, whatever else."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1387.23,"endTime":1387.83,"body":"Okay, fine."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1388.185,"endTime":1392.277,"body":"But how about doing that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1388.185,"endTime":1392.277,"body":"before putting the data out?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1392.33,"endTime":1392.385,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1392.44,"endTime":1395.467,"body":"Work with your team and say, Hey,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1392.44,"endTime":1395.467,"body":"what do we think is reasonable?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1395.467,"endTime":1395.849,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1395.849,"endTime":1395.85,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1396.23,"endTime":1399.121,"body":"Adding everything that you think"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1396.23,"endTime":1399.121,"body":"you need to add in for, to account"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1399.121,"endTime":1402.04,"body":"for uncertainties and complexity"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1399.121,"endTime":1402.04,"body":"and all the unknowns, et cetera."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1402.044,"endTime":1402.121,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1402.576,"endTime":1407.017,"body":"Now, You put out a date, but I suggest"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1402.576,"endTime":1407.017,"body":"you don't put out a singular date."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1407.017,"endTime":1410.808,"body":"I suggest you put out a range that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1407.017,"endTime":1410.808,"body":"says between X one, Y one Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1410.835,"endTime":1413.917,"body":"Whatever, whatever the date"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1410.835,"endTime":1413.917,"body":"ranges are between August 30th and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1413.962,"endTime":1415.762,"body":"October 15th or whatever it is."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1416.035,"endTime":1419.735,"body":"You know, if you land somewhere in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1416.035,"endTime":1419.735,"body":"there, you could claim success, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1420.426,"endTime":1422.58,"body":"If you, if you don't, yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1422.58,"endTime":1426.453,"body":"You know, just look at it as you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1422.58,"endTime":1426.453,"body":"get closer to it before you get to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1426.453,"endTime":1429.862,"body":"it and say, we're gonna change that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1426.453,"endTime":1429.862,"body":"because we've learned something."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1429.917,"endTime":1430.653,"body":"This is why."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1431.035,"endTime":1434.635,"body":"So, changing the dates, for"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1431.035,"endTime":1434.635,"body":"changing the dates purpose."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1434.635,"endTime":1434.99,"body":"No."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1434.994,"endTime":1439.135,"body":"Change it with a rationale and say"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1434.994,"endTime":1439.135,"body":"to your leadership, we learned this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1439.735,"endTime":1443.417,"body":"The date range you gave me earlier"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1439.735,"endTime":1443.417,"body":"will now change as a result, unless"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1443.417,"endTime":1447.262,"body":"you tell us we can cut scope, we can"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1443.417,"endTime":1447.262,"body":"live with these risks, we can accept"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1447.267,"endTime":1448.817,"body":"these or mitigate these, et cetera."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1448.821,"endTime":1448.999,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1449.071,"endTime":1449.253,"body":"Fine."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1449.562,"endTime":1452.208,"body":"You know, but it's, it's informed"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1449.562,"endTime":1452.208,"body":"decision making at that point."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1452.208,"endTime":1452.971,"body":"Right, right, right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1453.135,"endTime":1456.917,"body":"So yeah, I I, I don't agree with"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1453.135,"endTime":1456.917,"body":"this idea that you missed dates and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1456.917,"endTime":1459.808,"body":"you have convos with your team and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1456.917,"endTime":1459.808,"body":"it's more meaningful suddenly now."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1459.808,"endTime":1462.171,"body":"It's kind of like after the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1459.808,"endTime":1462.171,"body":"fact, you've already failed once."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1462.171,"endTime":1462.226,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1462.226,"endTime":1466.199,"body":"You've already undermined, your"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1462.226,"endTime":1466.199,"body":"confidence is already eroded in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1466.203,"endTime":1467.453,"body":"the eyes of the stakeholders Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1467.453,"endTime":1468.844,"body":"And possibly the management."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1468.849,"endTime":1468.862,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1469.035,"endTime":1469.226,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1469.417,"endTime":1470.726,"body":"How you get that back."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1470.808,"endTime":1473.644,"body":"It takes way longer to get that back."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1473.671,"endTime":1473.726,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1473.726,"endTime":1473.89,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1474.517,"endTime":1476.371,"body":"If you've been in the trenches,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1474.517,"endTime":1476.371,"body":"you know what I'm talking about."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1476.371,"endTime":1479.644,"body":"And that, and that's if you don't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1476.371,"endTime":1479.644,"body":"have a culture that washes out these"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1479.644,"endTime":1480.926,"body":"people that give bad estimates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1480.93,"endTime":1481.008,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1481.062,"endTime":1485.808,"body":"You know, or, or in the example"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1481.062,"endTime":1485.808,"body":"that Deming warn warned against of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1485.862,"endTime":1489.917,"body":"you have a management culture that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1485.862,"endTime":1489.917,"body":"once they fail a couple times, they"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1489.917,"endTime":1493.162,"body":"just you know, throw themselves on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1489.917,"endTime":1493.162,"body":"the sword and go get another job."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1493.217,"endTime":1495.4,"body":"And then you basically, like you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1493.217,"endTime":1495.4,"body":"have a culture of management that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1495.48,"endTime":1496.571,"body":"never learns from their mistakes."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1496.817,"endTime":1498.653,"body":"They just wash out gracefully."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1498.762,"endTime":1498.871,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1499.09,"endTime":1502.144,"body":"From there and and then you never get"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1499.09,"endTime":1502.144,"body":"that skill at the management level."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1502.344,"endTime":1504.699,"body":"he talks about technical debt and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1502.344,"endTime":1504.699,"body":"estimating technical debt to say,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1504.971,"endTime":1508.071,"body":"oh, I, I, I don't, I don't want"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1504.971,"endTime":1508.071,"body":"the team to work on technical debt"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1508.071,"endTime":1510.744,"body":"because they end up taking months"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1508.071,"endTime":1510.744,"body":"and I don't see any value in it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1510.835,"endTime":1514.108,"body":"If you're a product manager and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1510.835,"endTime":1514.108,"body":"you can't paint the technical debt"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1514.108,"endTime":1517.026,"body":"that you're resolving with value,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1514.108,"endTime":1517.026,"body":"you have a different problem."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1517.299,"endTime":1518.39,"body":"Estimates are not your problem."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1518.39,"endTime":1519.599,"body":"I don't believe anything he says here."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1519.671,"endTime":1521.467,"body":"Let's cut to the summary of the article."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1521.467,"endTime":1522.694,"body":"He says, yes, you should estimate."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1522.694,"endTime":1523.321,"body":"That's a summary."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1523.485,"endTime":1527.04,"body":"It's ridiculously hard to do and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1523.485,"endTime":1527.04,"body":"most engineers are bad at it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1527.044,"endTime":1529.685,"body":"However, being good at it"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1527.044,"endTime":1529.685,"body":"will make you stand out."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1529.69,"endTime":1530.585,"body":"That's, that's his claim."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1530.585,"endTime":1532.44,"body":"Being good at estimating will"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1530.585,"endTime":1532.44,"body":"make you stand out, but he"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1532.444,"endTime":1533.149,"body":"doesn't say hard to do it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1533.221,"endTime":1536.512,"body":"I, I will throw out also He does"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1533.221,"endTime":1536.512,"body":"say, if you never give estimates,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1536.512,"endTime":1537.63,"body":"you'll never be good at them."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1538.121,"endTime":1541.285,"body":"I you don't have to do time-based"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1538.121,"endTime":1541.285,"body":"estimates for that statement to apply."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1541.285,"endTime":1541.366,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1541.557,"endTime":1543.712,"body":"And I think there is a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1541.557,"endTime":1543.712,"body":"takeaway in that statement."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1543.748,"endTime":1546.176,"body":"If you don't do estimates,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1543.748,"endTime":1546.176,"body":"you'll never be good at them."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1546.176,"endTime":1548.821,"body":"There is a takeaway in that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1546.176,"endTime":1548.821,"body":"statement of, Hey, it's a muscle"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1548.821,"endTime":1551.739,"body":"we have to build in order to get"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1548.821,"endTime":1551.739,"body":"Yeah, it takes practice for sure."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1551.739,"endTime":1552.53,"body":"I, I get with that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1552.603,"endTime":1557.153,"body":"He doesn't even get into a lot of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1552.603,"endTime":1557.153,"body":"the typical people pleasing behaviors"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1557.153,"endTime":1559.28,"body":"that teams and individuals do, right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1559.28,"endTime":1561.489,"body":"When they're asked for dates you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1559.28,"endTime":1561.489,"body":"know, committing to things that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1561.489,"endTime":1564.735,"body":"they know they can't do and forcing"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1561.489,"endTime":1564.735,"body":"their teams to take up the slack."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1564.735,"endTime":1566.017,"body":"He, he doesn't really"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1564.735,"endTime":1566.017,"body":"talk a lot about that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1566.307,"endTime":1569.044,"body":"He doesn't really talk about"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1566.307,"endTime":1569.044,"body":"different styles of estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1569.044,"endTime":1570.516,"body":"We did a whole podcast on estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1570.516,"endTime":1570.844,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1570.871,"endTime":1575.626,"body":"And we did a podcast about how to, how"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1570.871,"endTime":1575.626,"body":"to not have to deal with estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1575.63,"endTime":1575.789,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1575.953,"endTime":1576.416,"body":"We did that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1576.416,"endTime":1580.044,"body":"I, I feel like, anybody reading this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1576.416,"endTime":1580.044,"body":"article would benefit from either"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1580.462,"endTime":1582.126,"body":"or both, both of those podcasts."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1582.126,"endTime":1582.18,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1582.462,"endTime":1587.071,"body":"And then you know, basically his takeaway"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1582.462,"endTime":1587.071,"body":"is estimating and being deadline driven"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1587.462,"endTime":1591.544,"body":"it's basically good for you he says, I've"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1587.462,"endTime":1591.544,"body":"seen teams burn out after sprinting to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1591.544,"endTime":1592.935,"body":"try to make deadline after a deadline."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1593.126,"endTime":1596.916,"body":"I, I would argue if you're sprinting to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1593.126,"endTime":1596.916,"body":"make deadline after deadline, your issue"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1596.916,"endTime":1601.58,"body":"is some cultural command and control"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1596.916,"endTime":1601.58,"body":"some, something in your environment is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1601.585,"endTime":1605.535,"body":"wrong because the agile is supposed to"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1601.585,"endTime":1605.535,"body":"be about working at a sustainable pace."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1605.644,"endTime":1606.216,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1606.221,"endTime":1607.416,"body":"See our podcast on that?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1607.416,"endTime":1609.089,"body":"The, the the previous podcast, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1609.089,"endTime":1609.335,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1609.471,"endTime":1609.989,"body":"I agree."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1610.235,"endTime":1611.053,"body":"I I think that's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1611.057,"endTime":1615.471,"body":"So this, this is classic though,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1611.057,"endTime":1615.471,"body":"because what, what he's saying keeps"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1615.471,"endTime":1617.026,"body":"the team doing what they're doing."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1617.353,"endTime":1618.362,"body":"I feel Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1618.553,"endTime":1622.507,"body":"Keep doing what you're doing and just keep"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1618.553,"endTime":1622.507,"body":"practicing and you'll get better at it."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1622.507,"endTime":1622.698,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1623.026,"endTime":1627.108,"body":"And keep estimating, even if those"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1623.026,"endTime":1627.108,"body":"estimates are going to be wrong and you"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1627.113,"endTime":1628.635,"body":"just talk about why they were wrong."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1628.635,"endTime":1629.971,"body":"But you keep estimating right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1630.226,"endTime":1634.353,"body":"Point in time estimates are bad if"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1630.226,"endTime":1634.353,"body":"you do what he or she's suggesting"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1634.353,"endTime":1638.253,"body":"here, how do you think this will"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1634.353,"endTime":1638.253,"body":"be received by your leadership?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1638.58,"endTime":1640.735,"body":"Okay, first time, second time, third time."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1640.739,"endTime":1641.989,"body":"How many times are you gonna have, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1642.18,"endTime":1647.771,"body":"Sometime at one point they're gonna say,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1642.18,"endTime":1647.771,"body":"yeah, you said that last time, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1647.826,"endTime":1648.807,"body":"Why should we believe you?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1648.812,"endTime":1650.963,"body":"This, this, this, there's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1648.812,"endTime":1650.963,"body":"this credibility issue, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1651.107,"endTime":1653.426,"body":"Everything in this article,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1651.107,"endTime":1653.426,"body":"this leads to a blame culture."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1653.616,"endTime":1653.807,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1653.853,"endTime":1655.926,"body":"I'm not dismissing his opinion outright."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1656.444,"endTime":1658.571,"body":"I, I've tried to consider"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1656.444,"endTime":1658.571,"body":"everything he said here."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1658.726,"endTime":1662.962,"body":"However, everyone that has had a similar"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1658.726,"endTime":1662.962,"body":"take that he has in this article, That"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1662.962,"endTime":1668.536,"body":"I have encountered in my career has been"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1662.962,"endTime":1668.536,"body":"the type of  that when the date comes in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1668.536,"endTime":1673.691,"body":"on time, they somehow snake themselves in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1668.536,"endTime":1673.691,"body":"where they're taking credit for it to say,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1673.773,"endTime":1675.818,"body":"I was a single person that achieved this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1675.9,"endTime":1680.591,"body":"And every time the date slips by, they"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1675.9,"endTime":1680.591,"body":"find a way to either blame it on somebody"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1680.591,"endTime":1685.854,"body":"else or absolve themselves of making"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1680.591,"endTime":1685.854,"body":"any changes in any way, shape, or form."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1686.1,"endTime":1689.1,"body":"So, a, I've only seen"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1686.1,"endTime":1689.1,"body":"this turn out negatively"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1689.291,"endTime":1691.991,"body":"yeah, I concur with your,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1689.291,"endTime":1691.991,"body":"your conclusion there, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1691.991,"endTime":1693.764,"body":"So people are usually"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1691.991,"endTime":1693.764,"body":"in it for themselves."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1693.927,"endTime":1698.536,"body":"If you're a team member where somebody"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1693.927,"endTime":1698.536,"body":"is committing a date or a series of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1698.536,"endTime":1702.245,"body":"dates on your behalf, ask yourself"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1698.536,"endTime":1702.245,"body":"the question, what's in it for them?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1702.318,"endTime":1702.864,"body":"Seriously."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1702.891,"endTime":1703.845,"body":"And then go from there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1703.9,"endTime":1707.882,"body":"You'll be well advised to do"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1703.9,"endTime":1707.882,"body":"that as early as possible because"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1707.936,"endTime":1711.182,"body":"guaranteed, as Brian just said,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1707.936,"endTime":1711.182,"body":"there's something in it for them."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1711.186,"endTime":1716.009,"body":"And when that date happens, which is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1711.186,"endTime":1716.009,"body":"usually some fortuitous happenstance,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1716.009,"endTime":1721.054,"body":"it's not because of diligent, purposeful,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1716.009,"endTime":1721.054,"body":"methodical approach that brings you there."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1721.3,"endTime":1721.773,"body":"Mm-hmm yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1721.773,"endTime":1723.354,"body":"They're gonna get what they wanted."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1723.359,"endTime":1723.554,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1723.559,"endTime":1723.709,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1723.709,"endTime":1724.991,"body":"The people that put out the dates."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1724.991,"endTime":1725.073,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1725.073,"endTime":1727.336,"body":"The person that put out the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1725.073,"endTime":1727.336,"body":"dates but then they're gonna do"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1727.341,"endTime":1728.4,"body":"that again and again and again."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1728.4,"endTime":1730.918,"body":"And it, it's at the expense of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1728.4,"endTime":1730.918,"body":"the team members usually Right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1730.982,"endTime":1733.991,"body":"When it doesn't happen, which"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1730.982,"endTime":1733.991,"body":"is more the eventuality."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1734.036,"endTime":1737.064,"body":"They will pass the blame to somebody else."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1737.118,"endTime":1738.864,"body":"Usually the team don't"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1737.118,"endTime":1738.864,"body":"be, don't be that person."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1738.864,"endTime":1740.064,"body":"They will still be there, but yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1740.064,"endTime":1741.673,"body":"Don't be that person to take the blame."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1741.745,"endTime":1743.082,"body":"We have two podcasts on this."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1743.327,"endTime":1747.554,"body":"We have a podcast on estimation about"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1743.327,"endTime":1747.554,"body":"all, about different types of estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1747.554,"endTime":1747.609,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1747.827,"endTime":1750.664,"body":"And we have a podcast on"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1747.827,"endTime":1750.664,"body":"moving past estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1750.709,"endTime":1754.118,"body":"Before I try to enact any of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1750.709,"endTime":1754.118,"body":"this, I would definitely watch the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1754.118,"endTime":1756.136,"body":"podcast on moving past estimation."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1756.164,"endTime":1756.3,"body":"Yep."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1756.545,"endTime":1757.991,"body":"To see what the future looks like."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1758.182,"endTime":1760.164,"body":"You don't need any of"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1758.182,"endTime":1760.164,"body":"this stuff to be good."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1760.445,"endTime":1760.891,"body":"Correct."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1761.182,"endTime":1765.6,"body":"I, I, if you're working on the top"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1761.182,"endTime":1765.6,"body":"business priority, the thing that"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1765.6,"endTime":1768.873,"body":"brings most value to the business"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1765.6,"endTime":1768.873,"body":"and you're working on it nonstop, and"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1768.873,"endTime":1773.218,"body":"you're delivering things I can't say"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1768.873,"endTime":1773.218,"body":"iteratively, iterative iteratively."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1773.518,"endTime":1776.586,"body":"If you're delivering things"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1773.518,"endTime":1776.586,"body":"iteratively, That's the best I can do."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1776.768,"endTime":1777.977,"body":"That was, that was spot on though."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1778.277,"endTime":1779.968,"body":"Then the business is not gonna complain."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1779.977,"endTime":1784.332,"body":"I, I, I tell people all the time,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1779.977,"endTime":1784.332,"body":"if you are delivering software on a"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1784.332,"endTime":1788.941,"body":"regular basis, all the other vanity"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1784.332,"endTime":1788.941,"body":"metrics sort of take a backseat at"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1788.941,"endTime":1791.832,"body":"the point where you're delivering"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1788.941,"endTime":1791.832,"body":"things to customers, to, to users,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1791.832,"endTime":1793.932,"body":"to actual users on a regular basis."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1794.477,"endTime":1798.023,"body":"If you can do that, most all the"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1794.477,"endTime":1798.023,"body":"rest of the metrics that he's kind"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1798.023,"endTime":1800.204,"body":"of talking about here is like, oh,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1798.023,"endTime":1800.204,"body":"well you told me it was gonna be"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1800.204,"endTime":1804.914,"body":"done in 25 hours, but you turn it in"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1800.204,"endTime":1804.914,"body":"in 23 and I'm really disappointed."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1805.632,"endTime":1810.104,"body":"And we do individual numbers and like all"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1805.632,"endTime":1810.104,"body":"that kind of stuff fades away when you're"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1810.104,"endTime":1815.586,"body":"delivering things into the waiting hands"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1810.104,"endTime":1815.586,"body":"of actual users and they're happy about"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1815.586,"endTime":1817.495,"body":"it and they get it on a regular cadence."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1818.341,"endTime":1820.468,"body":"I would say do that first"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1818.341,"endTime":1820.468,"body":"before you, before you mess"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1820.468,"endTime":1821.45,"body":"around with any of this stuff."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1821.454,"endTime":1822.841,"body":"I fully concur with that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1822.845,"endTime":1825.977,"body":"So remember, measure the right things."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1826.021,"endTime":1826.976,"body":"And then measure them, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1827.412,"endTime":1830.235,"body":"So ultimately, it's all about"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1827.412,"endTime":1830.235,"body":"what the customer wants you that's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1830.235,"endTime":1831.598,"body":"the ultimate measure really."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1831.598,"endTime":1835.358,"body":"It's not about what somebody in the,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1831.598,"endTime":1835.358,"body":"in the middle middle management."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1835.521,"endTime":1836.367,"body":"He never brings that, none of that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1836.371,"endTime":1836.885,"body":"He never right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1836.889,"endTime":1838.33,"body":"He never brings that up in this article."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1838.33,"endTime":1842.803,"body":"But, how are you delivering value"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1838.33,"endTime":1842.803,"body":"to your customers in a timely"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1842.803,"endTime":1845.012,"body":"manner with quality products?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1845.23,"endTime":1846.485,"body":"That's the only thing that matters."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1846.485,"endTime":1852.158,"body":"So, measure that, and anything else is"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1846.485,"endTime":1852.158,"body":"really just an interim vanity metric"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1852.676,"endTime":1854.848,"body":"that is put out there as a facade, right?"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1855.076,"endTime":1855.13,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1855.13,"endTime":1856.521,"body":"This is an agile facade."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1856.521,"endTime":1856.522,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1856.794,"endTime":1859.521,"body":"So just, yeah, just, just"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1856.794,"endTime":1859.521,"body":"be, be mindful of that."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1859.794,"endTime":1860.23,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1860.23,"endTime":1863.558,"body":"So I think we might have beaten this"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1860.23,"endTime":1863.558,"body":"one to death already, so thank you for"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1863.558,"endTime":1867.735,"body":"staying with us those of you that have,"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1863.558,"endTime":1867.735,"body":"and Yeah, subscribe and like, and let us"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1867.735,"endTime":1869.126,"body":"know what else you'd like us to cover."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1869.153,"endTime":1869.562,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1869.562,"endTime":1873.626,"body":"Go to arguing agile.com and there's"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1869.562,"endTime":1873.626,"body":"a form on the site and you can even"},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1873.844,"endTime":1875.889,"body":"send us a little voicemail Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"does at 2","startTime":1875.889,"endTime":1877.362,"body":"Of your, we, we love voicemails"}]}