{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.05,"endTime":0.299,"body":"Today."},{"startTime":0.299,"endTime":1.559,"body":"We're talking about a great article."},{"startTime":1.559,"endTime":5.05,"body":"It's called why do so many"},{"startTime":1.559,"endTime":5.05,"body":"incompetent men become leaders?"},{"startTime":5.379,"endTime":7.81,"body":"And I think it's timely"},{"startTime":5.379,"endTime":7.81,"body":"and I think it's important."},{"startTime":8.04,"endTime":12.46,"body":"This is a Harvard Business"},{"startTime":8.04,"endTime":12.46,"body":"Review article from August 2013."},{"startTime":13.07,"endTime":14.209,"body":"So pretty recent."},{"startTime":14.359,"endTime":15.429,"body":"August 2013?"},{"startTime":15.429,"endTime":16.219,"body":"Is that pretty recent?"},{"startTime":16.229,"endTime":16.969,"body":"Ten years ago?"},{"startTime":17.119,"endTime":18.709,"body":"I'm just being spiteful here."},{"startTime":18.899,"endTime":19.319,"body":"No, no, no."},{"startTime":19.329,"endTime":20.309,"body":"It's not recent at all."},{"startTime":20.539,"endTime":21.509,"body":"Ten years ago."},{"startTime":21.549,"endTime":23.109,"body":"So just bear that in mind."},{"startTime":23.109,"endTime":23.409,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":23.419,"endTime":24.129,"body":"We will come back to that."},{"startTime":24.279,"endTime":27.029,"body":"You know, I don't I was going to"},{"startTime":24.279,"endTime":27.029,"body":"say we'll, we'll come back to it"},{"startTime":27.039,"endTime":30.599,"body":"from the perspective of how has"},{"startTime":27.039,"endTime":30.599,"body":"this changed in the last 10 years?"},{"startTime":30.749,"endTime":32.649,"body":"I don't think it's"},{"startTime":30.749,"endTime":32.649,"body":"changed at all, actually."},{"startTime":32.729,"endTime":37.359,"body":"Yeah, I think this is as relevant as"},{"startTime":32.729,"endTime":37.359,"body":"when it was written back in the day."},{"startTime":37.449,"endTime":41.099,"body":"He says there's three popular"},{"startTime":37.449,"endTime":41.099,"body":"explanations for the clear under"},{"startTime":41.099,"endTime":43.249,"body":"representation of women in management."},{"startTime":43.499,"endTime":46.899,"body":"So it says, why do so many"},{"startTime":43.499,"endTime":46.899,"body":"incompetent men become leaders?"},{"startTime":47.109,"endTime":49.469,"body":"And he pivots straight"},{"startTime":47.109,"endTime":49.469,"body":"into women in management."},{"startTime":49.759,"endTime":51.169,"body":"We're going to ignore that for a second."},{"startTime":51.319,"endTime":55.249,"body":"So we just, we, we, just so we can"},{"startTime":51.319,"endTime":55.249,"body":"get through his opening volley here."},{"startTime":55.249,"endTime":57.169,"body":"It says, number one, they're not capable."},{"startTime":57.319,"endTime":57.739,"body":"Hilarious."},{"startTime":57.949,"endTime":61.879,"body":"Number two, they're not"},{"startTime":57.949,"endTime":61.879,"body":"interested, which is interesting."},{"startTime":62.029,"endTime":65.109,"body":"But company by company, like"},{"startTime":62.029,"endTime":65.109,"body":"there could be a lot to ask."},{"startTime":65.149,"endTime":68.149,"body":"Like, are women interested in the"},{"startTime":65.149,"endTime":68.149,"body":"moving into management positions?"},{"startTime":68.299,"endTime":73.099,"body":"At this company, that could be a very"},{"startTime":68.299,"endTime":73.099,"body":"introspective question to think about."},{"startTime":73.399,"endTime":77.359,"body":"And that might be the"},{"startTime":73.399,"endTime":77.359,"body":"topic of another podcast."},{"startTime":77.359,"endTime":79.849,"body":"And number three, they're both"},{"startTime":77.359,"endTime":79.849,"body":"interested in cable, but unable to"},{"startTime":79.849,"endTime":84.959,"body":"break the glass ceiling in an invisible"},{"startTime":79.849,"endTime":84.959,"body":"career barrier based on prejudiced"},{"startTime":85.029,"endTime":89.199,"body":"stereotypes that prevent women"},{"startTime":85.029,"endTime":89.199,"body":"from accessing the ranks of power."},{"startTime":89.439,"endTime":91.159,"body":"That was a very flowery description."},{"startTime":91.309,"endTime":93.599,"body":"For saying you know, there's no seats."},{"startTime":93.619,"endTime":94.509,"body":"This seat's taken."},{"startTime":94.819,"endTime":95.479,"body":"Yeah, that's right."},{"startTime":95.769,"endTime":96.139,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":96.399,"endTime":97.109,"body":"This seat's taken."},{"startTime":97.109,"endTime":98.059,"body":"Please come back later."},{"startTime":98.209,"endTime":104.849,"body":"So, he purports, I was going to say"},{"startTime":98.209,"endTime":104.849,"body":"declares he says, the main reason for"},{"startTime":104.899,"endTime":110.259,"body":"uneven ratio is our inability to discern"},{"startTime":104.899,"endTime":110.259,"body":"between confidence and competence."},{"startTime":110.279,"endTime":111.439,"body":"He posits that."},{"startTime":111.449,"endTime":112.209,"body":"That's what he does."},{"startTime":112.249,"endTime":113.079,"body":"That's what he posits."},{"startTime":113.419,"endTime":115.419,"body":"He's positing all over the place."},{"startTime":115.569,"endTime":119.429,"body":"This is consistent with the findings that"},{"startTime":115.569,"endTime":119.429,"body":"leaderless groups have a natural tendency"},{"startTime":119.479,"endTime":124.239,"body":"to elect self centered, overconfident"},{"startTime":119.479,"endTime":124.239,"body":"and narcissistic individuals as leaders."},{"startTime":124.389,"endTime":130.329,"body":"As a result, charismatic but incompetent"},{"startTime":124.389,"endTime":130.329,"body":"men have fewer barriers to reach the top."},{"startTime":130.479,"endTime":135.629,"body":"Leaderless groups elect as leaders"},{"startTime":130.479,"endTime":135.629,"body":"men, typically men that they believe"},{"startTime":135.629,"endTime":139.889,"body":"will succeed and they believe"},{"startTime":135.629,"endTime":139.889,"body":"have what it takes to succeed."},{"startTime":140.009,"endTime":140.289,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":140.439,"endTime":144.289,"body":"I think there's a key in what he, what"},{"startTime":140.439,"endTime":144.289,"body":"what the author says here, overconfident,"},{"startTime":144.439,"endTime":146.229,"body":"overconfident, narcissistic."},{"startTime":146.529,"endTime":151.699,"body":"I'd be interested in an actual factual"},{"startTime":146.529,"endTime":151.699,"body":"study to link the two together to"},{"startTime":151.699,"endTime":155.624,"body":"say the number of People that are"},{"startTime":151.699,"endTime":155.624,"body":"perceived as having high confidence"},{"startTime":155.774,"endTime":160.384,"body":"also have some kind of narcissistic"},{"startTime":155.774,"endTime":160.384,"body":"narcissistic disorder on top of that."},{"startTime":160.514,"endTime":163.094,"body":"So like how often are"},{"startTime":160.514,"endTime":163.094,"body":"those two put together?"},{"startTime":163.204,"endTime":166.384,"body":"He doesn't really give a, like my"},{"startTime":163.204,"endTime":166.384,"body":"kind of gripe with this article is"},{"startTime":166.384,"endTime":169.874,"body":"a very light on actual statistics"},{"startTime":166.384,"endTime":169.874,"body":"and studies that I could go."},{"startTime":170.034,"endTime":171.264,"body":"Back to and kind of follow."},{"startTime":171.264,"endTime":172.914,"body":"He doesn't sign references"},{"startTime":171.264,"endTime":172.914,"body":"all that easily."},{"startTime":172.914,"endTime":173.454,"body":"Really doesn't, yeah."},{"startTime":173.454,"endTime":177.894,"body":"It's hard to find facts, but, but I mean,"},{"startTime":173.454,"endTime":177.894,"body":"the claim here at the very early beginning"},{"startTime":177.894,"endTime":181.694,"body":"of the article, as a result, charismatic,"},{"startTime":177.894,"endTime":181.694,"body":"but incompetent men have fewer"},{"startTime":181.699,"endTime":183.434,"body":"barriers to reach the top than women."},{"startTime":183.714,"endTime":188.004,"body":"So if, if you noted already, and if"},{"startTime":183.714,"endTime":188.004,"body":"you listen to our podcast on a regular"},{"startTime":188.004,"endTime":192.764,"body":"basis, you you've noted that we made"},{"startTime":188.004,"endTime":192.764,"body":"an intentional pivot from the title"},{"startTime":192.784,"endTime":196.404,"body":"of the article mentioning men in"},{"startTime":192.784,"endTime":196.404,"body":"leadership and then the very first"},{"startTime":196.554,"endTime":199.854,"body":"paragraph of the article or second,"},{"startTime":196.554,"endTime":199.854,"body":"I really don't remember talking"},{"startTime":199.854,"endTime":201.874,"body":"about women in management positions."},{"startTime":202.024,"endTime":205.444,"body":"And he declares that in his very first"},{"startTime":202.024,"endTime":205.444,"body":"paragraph, if I'm not mistaken, in the"},{"startTime":205.444,"endTime":209.084,"body":"article he talks about how few women"},{"startTime":205.444,"endTime":209.084,"body":"there are in management positions."},{"startTime":209.084,"endTime":212.384,"body":"So, again, because he's very light"},{"startTime":209.084,"endTime":212.384,"body":"on facts and studies , I'm going to"},{"startTime":212.384,"endTime":216.334,"body":"assume the management positions he's"},{"startTime":212.384,"endTime":216.334,"body":"talking about are C level executives."},{"startTime":216.484,"endTime":217.384,"body":"That's what I'm going to assume."},{"startTime":217.534,"endTime":219.234,"body":"Maybe it's C level and directors."},{"startTime":219.384,"endTime":222.314,"body":"And you could argue that I mean,"},{"startTime":219.384,"endTime":222.314,"body":"I guess it would be a, it'd"},{"startTime":222.334,"endTime":224.324,"body":"be a pretty good arguing case."},{"startTime":224.474,"endTime":228.544,"body":"It'd be a pretty good case to"},{"startTime":224.474,"endTime":228.544,"body":"argue that leadership positions"},{"startTime":228.604,"endTime":230.204,"body":"are the C level executives."},{"startTime":230.354,"endTime":231.904,"body":"But they're also management."},{"startTime":231.914,"endTime":236.194,"body":"Like, if you're looking for a position"},{"startTime":231.914,"endTime":236.194,"body":"in the hierarchy that both has leadership"},{"startTime":236.214,"endTime":237.589,"body":"and management rolled together."},{"startTime":237.739,"endTime":239.869,"body":"It is the C level positions."},{"startTime":240.019,"endTime":240.899,"body":"I think that's fair."},{"startTime":240.899,"endTime":245.129,"body":"You might even consider the"},{"startTime":240.899,"endTime":245.129,"body":"managing directors, or in some cases"},{"startTime":245.129,"endTime":247.969,"body":"directors, in management positions."},{"startTime":248.119,"endTime":250.989,"body":"So he's saying, really he's"},{"startTime":248.119,"endTime":250.989,"body":"saying that the primary reason"},{"startTime":250.989,"endTime":255.749,"body":"is that we cannot distinguish"},{"startTime":250.989,"endTime":255.749,"body":"between competence and confidence."},{"startTime":255.769,"endTime":258.349,"body":"Yeah, that's an interesting"},{"startTime":255.769,"endTime":258.349,"body":"one to dig into."},{"startTime":258.359,"endTime":260.189,"body":"Like, we can't, why?"},{"startTime":260.339,"endTime":261.809,"body":"Why, why would be the question?"},{"startTime":261.939,"endTime":266.119,"body":"And, what I brought up about management"},{"startTime":261.939,"endTime":266.119,"body":"versus leadership, I brought it up"},{"startTime":266.129,"endTime":271.459,"body":"because I'm questioning whether people are"},{"startTime":266.129,"endTime":271.459,"body":"management roles, like middle managers,"},{"startTime":271.459,"endTime":273.169,"body":"and even like senior level managers."},{"startTime":273.489,"endTime":275.919,"body":"You know, like your director"},{"startTime":273.489,"endTime":275.919,"body":"of HR or your director of"},{"startTime":275.919,"endTime":276.879,"body":"finance or something like that."},{"startTime":277.029,"endTime":278.129,"body":"I don't really think of those as."},{"startTime":278.279,"endTime":279.129,"body":"Leadership roles."},{"startTime":279.409,"endTime":280.189,"body":"No, I don't either."},{"startTime":280.319,"endTime":283.369,"body":"Those are ones I think he"},{"startTime":280.319,"endTime":283.369,"body":"means by management, right?"},{"startTime":283.449,"endTime":283.709,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":283.729,"endTime":284.729,"body":"I'm assuming that."},{"startTime":284.749,"endTime":285.759,"body":"It doesn't make it clear."},{"startTime":286.089,"endTime":286.299,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":286.299,"endTime":289.839,"body":"He seems to be using both words,"},{"startTime":286.299,"endTime":289.839,"body":"leadership and management,"},{"startTime":289.839,"endTime":290.989,"body":"kind of interchangeably."},{"startTime":291.139,"endTime":291.489,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":291.639,"endTime":295.219,"body":"So we can kind of make an assumption"},{"startTime":291.639,"endTime":295.219,"body":"here for the interest of the podcast"},{"startTime":295.249,"endTime":298.669,"body":"that management means directors,"},{"startTime":295.249,"endTime":298.669,"body":"senior directors, et cetera."},{"startTime":298.669,"endTime":302.739,"body":"And perhaps leadership is maybe"},{"startTime":298.669,"endTime":302.739,"body":"managing directors, but largely"},{"startTime":302.739,"endTime":304.259,"body":"it's the C level executives."},{"startTime":304.459,"endTime":307.319,"body":"I'm having a tough time with"},{"startTime":304.459,"endTime":307.319,"body":"conflating leadership and management"},{"startTime":307.319,"endTime":310.824,"body":"for a second I need you to stop"},{"startTime":307.319,"endTime":310.824,"body":"And really pull the two apart."},{"startTime":311.074,"endTime":314.894,"body":"If the author is saying, when we"},{"startTime":311.074,"endTime":314.894,"body":"hire for these high level executive"},{"startTime":314.904,"endTime":317.534,"body":"positions, there we go, that's that"},{"startTime":314.904,"endTime":317.534,"body":"I'll settle on a word that means"},{"startTime":317.534,"endTime":321.524,"body":"absolutely nothing when we hire for"},{"startTime":317.534,"endTime":321.524,"body":"these high level executive positions,"},{"startTime":321.674,"endTime":322.944,"body":"to me, that's leadership position."},{"startTime":322.964,"endTime":327.114,"body":"We're looking for a mix of leadership"},{"startTime":322.964,"endTime":327.114,"body":"and management skill, and we'll"},{"startTime":327.114,"endTime":331.004,"body":"take the management skill because"},{"startTime":327.114,"endTime":331.004,"body":"that's what the organization."},{"startTime":331.154,"endTime":334.084,"body":"values because we don't know how"},{"startTime":331.154,"endTime":334.084,"body":"to put a value on leadership."},{"startTime":334.234,"endTime":335.634,"body":"Yeah, I agree with that."},{"startTime":335.634,"endTime":336.784,"body":"I think that's what he's saying."},{"startTime":336.794,"endTime":340.724,"body":"And he's also saying that people that"},{"startTime":336.794,"endTime":340.724,"body":"are candidates for these positions"},{"startTime":340.724,"endTime":345.514,"body":"can demonstrate these traits by their"},{"startTime":340.724,"endTime":345.514,"body":"competency rather than their confidence."},{"startTime":345.594,"endTime":349.594,"body":"Well, he's yeah, he's also saying"},{"startTime":345.594,"endTime":349.594,"body":"people that are candidates for"},{"startTime":349.594,"endTime":350.954,"body":"these positions can fake it."},{"startTime":351.104,"endTime":356.064,"body":"With their charisma until they got the"},{"startTime":351.104,"endTime":356.064,"body":"job and then, and then, and then it"},{"startTime":356.154,"endTime":359.974,"body":"says, and then the snake gets him on"},{"startTime":356.154,"endTime":359.974,"body":"the snakes and then it says arrogance"},{"startTime":359.974,"endTime":364.154,"body":"and overconfidence are inversely related"},{"startTime":359.974,"endTime":364.154,"body":"to leadership talent, the ability to"},{"startTime":364.154,"endTime":367.444,"body":"build and maintain high performing"},{"startTime":364.154,"endTime":367.444,"body":"teams and to inspire followers, the"},{"startTime":367.444,"endTime":368.884,"body":"best leaders are usually humble."},{"startTime":369.044,"endTime":372.684,"body":"And whether through nature or"},{"startTime":369.044,"endTime":372.684,"body":"nurture, humility is a much more"},{"startTime":372.684,"endTime":375.194,"body":"common feature in women than men."},{"startTime":375.464,"endTime":376.424,"body":"Well, I agree with that."},{"startTime":376.424,"endTime":380.644,"body":"I think on the whole, women have"},{"startTime":376.424,"endTime":380.644,"body":"more humility on the whole, right?"},{"startTime":380.684,"endTime":383.024,"body":"We're not generalizing,"},{"startTime":380.684,"endTime":383.024,"body":"but we kind of are."},{"startTime":383.174,"endTime":384.054,"body":"So I agree with that."},{"startTime":384.204,"endTime":386.884,"body":"You're saying that if you have,"},{"startTime":384.204,"endTime":386.884,"body":"if you need the ability to"},{"startTime":386.884,"endTime":388.404,"body":"build high performance teams."},{"startTime":388.554,"endTime":392.314,"body":"You need humility as a trait,"},{"startTime":388.554,"endTime":392.314,"body":"is what he's saying, right?"},{"startTime":392.464,"endTime":395.984,"body":"He says, an even clearer picture"},{"startTime":392.464,"endTime":395.984,"body":"emerges when one examines"},{"startTime":395.984,"endTime":397.694,"body":"the dark side of personality."},{"startTime":397.704,"endTime":403.374,"body":"For instance, our normative data, which"},{"startTime":397.704,"endTime":403.374,"body":"includes thousands of managers from across"},{"startTime":403.384,"endTime":405.264,"body":"all industries, sectors, and 40 countries."},{"startTime":405.544,"endTime":408.574,"body":"I think he's talking about his own"},{"startTime":405.544,"endTime":408.574,"body":"business, the data from his own business."},{"startTime":408.644,"endTime":409.004,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":409.314,"endTime":411.854,"body":"Shows that men are consistently"},{"startTime":409.314,"endTime":411.854,"body":"more arrogant, manipulative,"},{"startTime":411.924,"endTime":413.754,"body":"and risk prone than women."},{"startTime":413.904,"endTime":417.909,"body":"And he draws a conclusion from this, or"},{"startTime":413.904,"endTime":417.909,"body":"I guess the whoever wrote the summary"},{"startTime":417.949,"endTime":422.369,"body":"for the article draws a conclusion, says"},{"startTime":417.949,"endTime":422.369,"body":"individuals in positions to promote and"},{"startTime":422.379,"endTime":426.999,"body":"hire managers should think more critically"},{"startTime":422.379,"endTime":426.999,"body":"about what seems like a leadership trait"},{"startTime":427.289,"endTime":429.969,"body":"versus what's an actual leadership trait."},{"startTime":430.319,"endTime":434.579,"body":"And again,  I would translate this"},{"startTime":430.319,"endTime":434.579,"body":"into should think about management,"},{"startTime":434.799,"endTime":436.049,"body":"what they need out of management."},{"startTime":436.199,"endTime":438.819,"body":"People doing the hiring should"},{"startTime":436.199,"endTime":438.819,"body":"think about what they need out of"},{"startTime":438.819,"endTime":441.679,"body":"management and what they want out of."},{"startTime":441.829,"endTime":445.599,"body":"The leadership from the person what they"},{"startTime":441.829,"endTime":445.599,"body":"need to distinguish the two first of"},{"startTime":445.599,"endTime":449.279,"body":"all, because he's not doing that because"},{"startTime":445.599,"endTime":449.279,"body":"he's using both words all over the place."},{"startTime":449.429,"endTime":450.759,"body":"At least that's my take on this."},{"startTime":450.909,"endTime":454.349,"body":"If they're looking for a management"},{"startTime":450.909,"endTime":454.349,"body":"if they're looking for a person to"},{"startTime":454.349,"endTime":458.329,"body":"fill a management role, they need to"},{"startTime":454.349,"endTime":458.329,"body":"see how the person can demonstrate"},{"startTime":458.329,"endTime":463.039,"body":"that they can Perform right in that"},{"startTime":458.329,"endTime":463.039,"body":"role and that's typically not through"},{"startTime":463.149,"endTime":465.569,"body":"being, humble showing humility."},{"startTime":465.569,"endTime":470.719,"body":"That's typically through a track record of"},{"startTime":465.569,"endTime":470.719,"body":"having achievements having shown that they"},{"startTime":470.719,"endTime":473.389,"body":"can lead and get, get their way basically."},{"startTime":473.419,"endTime":473.749,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":473.899,"endTime":477.149,"body":"The other side of it, though, the"},{"startTime":473.899,"endTime":477.149,"body":"other side of it is interesting because"},{"startTime":477.299,"endTime":481.649,"body":"he's saying that if you put those"},{"startTime":477.299,"endTime":481.649,"body":"people in place with those kinds of"},{"startTime":481.649,"endTime":485.279,"body":"characteristics, He's saying those are"},{"startTime":481.649,"endTime":485.279,"body":"exactly the sorts of things, those are"},{"startTime":485.279,"endTime":488.969,"body":"exactly the sorts of attributes and"},{"startTime":485.279,"endTime":488.969,"body":"traits that bring them down eventually."},{"startTime":488.969,"endTime":490.049,"body":"That's right, that's right."},{"startTime":490.249,"endTime":494.319,"body":"Which is paradoxical, when you think"},{"startTime":490.249,"endTime":494.319,"body":"about it, it's almost contrarian,"},{"startTime":494.339,"endTime":495.429,"body":"right, when you think about it."},{"startTime":495.579,"endTime":497.679,"body":"So, what is he really saying and why?"},{"startTime":497.829,"endTime":499.229,"body":"Let's get, let's get deeper into this."},{"startTime":499.239,"endTime":502.559,"body":"He says, the same psychological"},{"startTime":499.239,"endTime":502.559,"body":"characteristics that enable male"},{"startTime":502.579,"endTime":505.879,"body":"managers to rise to the top of the"},{"startTime":502.579,"endTime":505.879,"body":"corporate or political ladder are"},{"startTime":505.879,"endTime":507.599,"body":"actually responsible for their downfall."},{"startTime":507.859,"endTime":511.999,"body":"What it takes to get the job is not just"},{"startTime":507.859,"endTime":511.999,"body":"different from, but also the reverse"},{"startTime":512.009,"endTime":513.939,"body":"of what it takes to do the job well."},{"startTime":513.969,"endTime":518.169,"body":"As a result, too many incompetent people"},{"startTime":513.969,"endTime":518.169,"body":"are promoted to management jobs and"},{"startTime":518.169,"endTime":520.859,"body":"promoted over more competent people."},{"startTime":521.139,"endTime":524.049,"body":"This one like, this one"},{"startTime":521.139,"endTime":524.049,"body":"certainly rings true with me."},{"startTime":524.334,"endTime":527.464,"body":"Because there's definitely parts of"},{"startTime":524.334,"endTime":527.464,"body":"my career where I felt that, that less"},{"startTime":527.494,"endTime":529.044,"body":"competent people were getting promoted."},{"startTime":529.254,"endTime":531.964,"body":"We're getting promoted, but also"},{"startTime":529.254,"endTime":531.964,"body":"less competent people were getting"},{"startTime":531.974,"endTime":533.434,"body":"many, many, many promotions."},{"startTime":533.584,"endTime":540.174,"body":"Some of those experiences have helped me"},{"startTime":533.584,"endTime":540.174,"body":"have helped me be more vocal in situations"},{"startTime":540.174,"endTime":544.154,"body":"where I felt that like the, the, the"},{"startTime":540.174,"endTime":544.154,"body":"credit, like I don't really need credit."},{"startTime":544.474,"endTime":546.774,"body":"Like, I'm, I don't really"},{"startTime":544.474,"endTime":546.774,"body":"care too much about credit."},{"startTime":546.774,"endTime":549.654,"body":"Like, I, I kind of assume"},{"startTime":546.774,"endTime":549.654,"body":"that credit should be given."},{"startTime":549.664,"endTime":552.994,"body":"Like, whenever you take something that"},{"startTime":549.664,"endTime":552.994,"body":"somebody else participated in or did a"},{"startTime":553.034,"endTime":556.724,"body":"significant amount of work and you use it"},{"startTime":553.034,"endTime":556.724,"body":"somewhere, you should give attribution."},{"startTime":556.724,"endTime":557.974,"body":"Just like if you're citing an article."},{"startTime":557.974,"endTime":559.474,"body":"So, otherwise, it's"},{"startTime":557.974,"endTime":559.474,"body":"called plagiarism, right?"},{"startTime":559.564,"endTime":560.224,"body":"Absolutely."},{"startTime":560.264,"endTime":561.604,"body":"Corporate America does not that way."},{"startTime":561.674,"endTime":564.344,"body":"Like, corporate America, especially"},{"startTime":561.674,"endTime":564.344,"body":"when you work for somebody and"},{"startTime":564.344,"endTime":565.484,"body":"they're using, you know what I mean?"},{"startTime":565.484,"endTime":566.144,"body":"Using your work as like."},{"startTime":566.439,"endTime":570.099,"body":"Hey, this work that's being presented"},{"startTime":566.439,"endTime":570.099,"body":"is not like, I didn't just spin this up"},{"startTime":570.249,"endTime":573.099,"body":"out of my own amazing brain or whatever."},{"startTime":573.099,"endTime":576.229,"body":"I had a whole team and every"},{"startTime":573.099,"endTime":576.229,"body":"consulting firm, whenever I see any"},{"startTime":576.229,"endTime":578.209,"body":"of their slick sides, slideshows."},{"startTime":578.359,"endTime":580.589,"body":"I'm like, Oh, I know what's"},{"startTime":578.359,"endTime":580.589,"body":"really going on here."},{"startTime":580.589,"endTime":583.249,"body":"Don't look at the info on those"},{"startTime":580.589,"endTime":583.249,"body":"slides because you'll see a"},{"startTime":583.249,"endTime":584.499,"body":"different name under author."},{"startTime":584.749,"endTime":584.939,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":584.939,"endTime":586.919,"body":"Yeah, we won't work for people like that."},{"startTime":586.929,"endTime":590.799,"body":"You know, they take, take your PowerPoint"},{"startTime":586.929,"endTime":590.799,"body":"or whatever it is, whatever artifact is"},{"startTime":590.799,"endTime":595.499,"body":"rampant and yeah, they just simply change"},{"startTime":590.799,"endTime":595.499,"body":"it, change the name and take credit."},{"startTime":595.649,"endTime":597.539,"body":"Those are clearly not leaders, right?"},{"startTime":597.689,"endTime":600.329,"body":"They're, they're those people"},{"startTime":597.689,"endTime":600.329,"body":"that show those traits that."},{"startTime":600.644,"endTime":603.614,"body":"You know, this author is talking"},{"startTime":600.644,"endTime":603.614,"body":"about the four, they're not even"},{"startTime":603.614,"endTime":604.894,"body":"really traits or attributes."},{"startTime":604.894,"endTime":606.684,"body":"They're more like disorders, aren't they?"},{"startTime":606.834,"endTime":610.064,"body":"Psychological disorders,"},{"startTime":606.834,"endTime":610.064,"body":"like narcissism, for example."},{"startTime":610.214,"endTime":614.404,"body":"Well, he says, unsurprisingly, the"},{"startTime":610.214,"endTime":614.404,"body":"mythical image of, quote, leader"},{"startTime":614.524,"endTime":618.524,"body":"embodies many of the characteristics"},{"startTime":614.524,"endTime":618.524,"body":"commonly found in personality disorders,"},{"startTime":618.524,"endTime":622.176,"body":"such as narcissism, psychopathy,"},{"startTime":618.524,"endTime":622.176,"body":"histrionic, oh, he's mispronounced"},{"startTime":622.176,"endTime":624.377,"body":"that, histrionic or Machiavellian."},{"startTime":624.377,"endTime":627.679,"body":"The average manager will fail precisely."},{"startTime":627.799,"endTime":631.539,"body":"for having these characteristics"},{"startTime":627.799,"endTime":631.539,"body":"and also like, I don't know"},{"startTime":631.539,"endTime":632.639,"body":"which one of these it is."},{"startTime":632.639,"endTime":637.039,"body":"And maybe it's Machiavellian or"},{"startTime":632.639,"endTime":637.039,"body":"narcissism, but the, the, the, well, I"},{"startTime":637.039,"endTime":638.449,"body":"actually, I guess it could be any of them."},{"startTime":638.669,"endTime":643.039,"body":"The laying blame on other people whenever"},{"startTime":638.669,"endTime":643.039,"body":"they're confronted with evidence of"},{"startTime":643.039,"endTime":645.874,"body":"a failure in any way, shape or form"},{"startTime":643.039,"endTime":645.874,"body":"they'll, they seek the blame of it."},{"startTime":645.874,"endTime":647.799,"body":"I mean, it could be any of these"},{"startTime":645.874,"endTime":647.799,"body":"narcissism, psychopathy, histrionics."},{"startTime":647.799,"endTime":648.669,"body":"Yeah, it could be any of them."},{"startTime":648.669,"endTime":651.089,"body":"Histrionics is simply the"},{"startTime":648.669,"endTime":651.089,"body":"demonstration of it, right?"},{"startTime":651.259,"endTime":652.069,"body":"So yeah, you're right."},{"startTime":652.089,"endTime":653.069,"body":"It could be any of these."},{"startTime":653.219,"endTime":655.389,"body":"I don't necessarily agree that."},{"startTime":655.539,"endTime":659.889,"body":"You know, all leaders embody some of"},{"startTime":655.539,"endTime":659.889,"body":"these characteristics that they don't,"},{"startTime":660.039,"endTime":663.789,"body":"I'm sure everyone listening to the"},{"startTime":660.039,"endTime":663.789,"body":"podcast or watching can identify with"},{"startTime":663.789,"endTime":668.309,"body":"or at least recognize a leader that"},{"startTime":663.789,"endTime":668.309,"body":"doesn't necessarily have these things."},{"startTime":668.529,"endTime":670.379,"body":"They're just a natural born leader."},{"startTime":670.419,"endTime":671.789,"body":"There aren't too many of them."},{"startTime":671.939,"endTime":673.569,"body":"But I'm sure they're around."},{"startTime":673.619,"endTime":674.509,"body":"I can think of one."},{"startTime":674.729,"endTime":674.969,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":674.999,"endTime":678.379,"body":"You know, people that lead nations"},{"startTime":674.999,"endTime":678.379,"body":"aren't necessarily like this."},{"startTime":678.379,"endTime":680.389,"body":"But we're not talking about that when"},{"startTime":678.379,"endTime":680.389,"body":"we're talking about corporate America."},{"startTime":680.409,"endTime":682.219,"body":"I would say that, yeah, definitely not."},{"startTime":682.269,"endTime":687.609,"body":"Like the, the, like the luck that it"},{"startTime":682.269,"endTime":687.609,"body":"takes to be promoted to the head of"},{"startTime":687.609,"endTime":690.839,"body":"an organization, no matter how small"},{"startTime":687.609,"endTime":690.839,"body":"the organization is like, like to be"},{"startTime":690.839,"endTime":693.019,"body":"promoted to the head of like a nation."},{"startTime":693.359,"endTime":695.259,"body":"Like that, that's, that's a lottery."},{"startTime":695.359,"endTime":699.749,"body":"It's a very unique, uniquely sized"},{"startTime":695.359,"endTime":699.749,"body":"winning lottery number that you've"},{"startTime":699.779,"endTime":703.579,"body":"pulled you know, to, to have a career"},{"startTime":699.779,"endTime":703.579,"body":"that, that guides you to that point."},{"startTime":703.879,"endTime":705.389,"body":"But anyway, that's like his point here."},{"startTime":705.389,"endTime":708.999,"body":"It says, well, the average manager"},{"startTime":705.389,"endTime":708.999,"body":"will, will fail precisely for"},{"startTime":708.999,"endTime":710.149,"body":"having these characteristics."},{"startTime":710.329,"endTime":713.929,"body":"The average person in the average role,"},{"startTime":710.329,"endTime":713.929,"body":"if you have these characteristics,"},{"startTime":713.929,"endTime":715.659,"body":"like it's going to lead to failure."},{"startTime":715.809,"endTime":716.129,"body":"Which I agree with."},{"startTime":716.129,"endTime":717.099,"body":"In an average situation."},{"startTime":717.109,"endTime":717.339,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":717.409,"endTime":719.289,"body":"I mean, eventually you will, although."},{"startTime":719.349,"endTime":719.509,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":719.659,"endTime":723.929,"body":"Fast forward from 2013 when the article"},{"startTime":719.659,"endTime":723.929,"body":"was written in 2023, the average"},{"startTime":724.189,"endTime":728.739,"body":"manager, much less leader their tenure"},{"startTime":724.189,"endTime":728.739,"body":"is, you can count it on one hand"},{"startTime":728.739,"endTime":730.039,"body":"with two fingers chopped off, right?"},{"startTime":730.189,"endTime":731.219,"body":"They don't really fail."},{"startTime":731.219,"endTime":732.609,"body":"They simply move on."},{"startTime":732.759,"endTime":735.079,"body":"You know, and they leave"},{"startTime":732.759,"endTime":735.079,"body":"this damage in their wake."},{"startTime":735.189,"endTime":735.669,"body":"Oh yeah."},{"startTime":735.819,"endTime":738.089,"body":"That's what's different,"},{"startTime":735.819,"endTime":738.089,"body":"I think, from 2013 to now."},{"startTime":738.099,"endTime":738.299,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":738.449,"endTime":740.149,"body":"People just don't think twice about it."},{"startTime":740.149,"endTime":742.099,"body":"I don't think it was different in 2013."},{"startTime":742.169,"endTime":745.979,"body":"I think it was the same in 2013."},{"startTime":746.129,"endTime":749.889,"body":"Project money or leadership patience and"},{"startTime":746.129,"endTime":749.889,"body":"then you the writing's on the wall and you"},{"startTime":749.889,"endTime":753.659,"body":"kind of need to feel out when that writing"},{"startTime":749.889,"endTime":753.659,"body":"is on the wall and then you just move."},{"startTime":753.689,"endTime":756.489,"body":"Again, this is like, this is all the"},{"startTime":753.689,"endTime":756.489,"body":"stuff that Deming was warning about"},{"startTime":756.489,"endTime":761.419,"body":"is a whole, a whole class of managers"},{"startTime":756.489,"endTime":761.419,"body":"who don't actually do any work."},{"startTime":761.419,"endTime":765.769,"body":"They just kind of float between companies"},{"startTime":761.419,"endTime":765.769,"body":"failing here, failing there and they"},{"startTime":765.769,"endTime":770.419,"body":"don't, and by the time the company"},{"startTime":765.769,"endTime":770.419,"body":"realizes, What is actually going on that"},{"startTime":770.419,"endTime":775.399,"body":"this person that they hired in that's a"},{"startTime":770.419,"endTime":775.399,"body":"very charismatic and very ingratiating"},{"startTime":775.409,"endTime":779.129,"body":"and you know, makes you feel a certain way"},{"startTime":775.409,"endTime":779.129,"body":"because they understand they understand"},{"startTime":779.129,"endTime":783.489,"body":"a few things about leadership how to"},{"startTime":779.129,"endTime":783.489,"body":"basically they understand a few things"},{"startTime":783.489,"endTime":785.034,"body":"about how to communicate like a leader."},{"startTime":785.184,"endTime":788.544,"body":"But they really don't"},{"startTime":785.184,"endTime":788.544,"body":"understand leadership, right?"},{"startTime":788.694,"endTime":792.084,"body":"And they definitely don't understand"},{"startTime":788.694,"endTime":792.084,"body":"Management and by the time you realize"},{"startTime":792.094,"endTime":795.194,"body":"something's wrong, you know hey two"},{"startTime":792.094,"endTime":795.194,"body":"years have passed and you've got a"},{"startTime":795.194,"endTime":800.294,"body":"decline on your hands and you've you've"},{"startTime":795.194,"endTime":800.294,"body":"you fired all the Lower level managers"},{"startTime":800.294,"endTime":801.424,"body":"and you fired all the employees."},{"startTime":801.424,"endTime":805.254,"body":"They told you to and there's"},{"startTime":801.424,"endTime":805.254,"body":"only one One one through line."},{"startTime":805.254,"endTime":807.614,"body":"There's one variable that"},{"startTime":805.254,"endTime":807.614,"body":"hasn't changed the whole time."},{"startTime":807.614,"endTime":810.384,"body":"And the company is starting to"},{"startTime":807.614,"endTime":810.384,"body":"say, Hmm, maybe the problems here."},{"startTime":810.434,"endTime":811.504,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"startTime":811.794,"endTime":813.404,"body":"Oh, well, I'm, I'm interested in now."},{"startTime":813.554,"endTime":817.314,"body":"Thinking through how maybe the, the"},{"startTime":813.554,"endTime":817.314,"body":"other aspect of this has changed in"},{"startTime":817.314,"endTime":821.294,"body":"the last 10 years since the article was"},{"startTime":817.314,"endTime":821.294,"body":"written, which is he largely talks about"},{"startTime":821.444,"endTime":824.344,"body":"men here having these disorders, etc."},{"startTime":824.344,"endTime":824.594,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":824.744,"endTime":828.464,"body":"In the 10 years that have gone"},{"startTime":824.744,"endTime":828.464,"body":"by, are we not seeing more?"},{"startTime":828.614,"endTime":832.394,"body":"women leaders, maybe not at the"},{"startTime":828.614,"endTime":832.394,"body":"top level at these maybe not"},{"startTime":832.404,"endTime":834.314,"body":"the fortune 50 or fortune 100."},{"startTime":834.464,"endTime":838.554,"body":"But even there, you're seeing more"},{"startTime":834.464,"endTime":838.554,"body":"CEOs and presidents that are women"},{"startTime":838.594,"endTime":841.004,"body":"today, 2023 than you did in 2013."},{"startTime":841.234,"endTime":846.034,"body":"I wonder if there are examples of You"},{"startTime":841.234,"endTime":846.034,"body":"know, women possessing, possessing"},{"startTime":846.034,"endTime":849.294,"body":"these tendencies and, and those"},{"startTime":846.034,"endTime":849.294,"body":"tendencies bringing them down."},{"startTime":849.444,"endTime":854.184,"body":"Because if, if we find some of that"},{"startTime":849.444,"endTime":854.184,"body":"happening there, then those disorders"},{"startTime":854.334,"endTime":856.074,"body":"are common across men and women."},{"startTime":856.074,"endTime":860.094,"body":"It's just that women tend to possess"},{"startTime":856.074,"endTime":860.094,"body":"more of the other, which is the humility,"},{"startTime":860.434,"endTime":862.394,"body":"the sensitivity, et cetera, right?"},{"startTime":862.644,"endTime":865.524,"body":"Which kind of, kind of balances"},{"startTime":862.644,"endTime":865.524,"body":"some of the other the other"},{"startTime":865.674,"endTime":866.934,"body":"what's the word I'm looking for?"},{"startTime":866.984,"endTime":869.224,"body":"Saboteurs versus sages."},{"startTime":869.374,"endTime":870.494,"body":"I don't have a current study."},{"startTime":870.514,"endTime":873.994,"body":"The study I have is"},{"startTime":870.514,"endTime":873.994,"body":"from 2019 from fortune."},{"startTime":874.004,"endTime":878.384,"body":"They did a a survey of female"},{"startTime":874.004,"endTime":878.384,"body":"CEOs in the fortune 500."},{"startTime":878.534,"endTime":885.304,"body":"And in 2013, that number was 20"},{"startTime":878.534,"endTime":885.304,"body":"and in 2019, the number was 33."},{"startTime":885.454,"endTime":888.784,"body":"So it's not a whole lot, but it hasn't"},{"startTime":885.454,"endTime":888.784,"body":"really increased by a whole lot."},{"startTime":888.794,"endTime":890.824,"body":"And you know, again, 2019."},{"startTime":890.974,"endTime":894.394,"body":"There's only six years past"},{"startTime":890.974,"endTime":894.394,"body":"2013 or whatever, but let me"},{"startTime":894.394,"endTime":895.664,"body":"see if they haven't updated."},{"startTime":895.814,"endTime":896.344,"body":"We're in our 8."},{"startTime":896.404,"endTime":898.544,"body":"2 percent of the Fortune 500."},{"startTime":898.694,"endTime":901.994,"body":"Which is not not a lot"},{"startTime":898.694,"endTime":901.994,"body":"but it has gone up, right?"},{"startTime":902.144,"endTime":903.614,"body":"Well, it's I mean, it's doubled."},{"startTime":903.764,"endTime":904.074,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":904.224,"endTime":907.444,"body":"I mean, if you're measuring it"},{"startTime":904.224,"endTime":907.444,"body":"compared to saying it should be 50%."},{"startTime":907.474,"endTime":909.644,"body":"Yeah, but yeah, it's clearly not that."},{"startTime":909.684,"endTime":911.104,"body":"Yeah, it's clearly not that."},{"startTime":911.104,"endTime":911.464,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":911.514,"endTime":912.804,"body":"Which is unfortunate."},{"startTime":912.924,"endTime":916.394,"body":"I think Well, it's unfortunate compared"},{"startTime":912.924,"endTime":916.394,"body":"to, so compared to what he's saying,"},{"startTime":916.394,"endTime":919.004,"body":"most of the character traits that"},{"startTime":916.394,"endTime":919.004,"body":"are truly advantageous for effective"},{"startTime":919.004,"endTime":922.984,"body":"leadership are predominantly found"},{"startTime":919.004,"endTime":922.984,"body":"in those who fail to impress others"},{"startTime":923.064,"endTime":924.824,"body":"about their talent for management."},{"startTime":924.974,"endTime":927.424,"body":"That, I mean, that's a,"},{"startTime":924.974,"endTime":927.424,"body":"that right there is a key."},{"startTime":927.574,"endTime":929.924,"body":"Sadly, he didn't really support"},{"startTime":927.574,"endTime":929.924,"body":"that statement very well."},{"startTime":929.924,"endTime":935.104,"body":"He, he has a Alice Eagley study"},{"startTime":929.924,"endTime":935.104,"body":"that, that female managers are more."},{"startTime":935.349,"endTime":939.559,"body":"Likely to elicit respect from their"},{"startTime":935.349,"endTime":939.559,"body":"respect, better communicate their"},{"startTime":939.559,"endTime":943.539,"body":"vision, empower mentor subordinates"},{"startTime":939.559,"endTime":943.539,"body":"better ways of transformational"},{"startTime":943.539,"endTime":945.689,"body":"leadership that he indicates."},{"startTime":945.699,"endTime":947.699,"body":"It doesn't give a link to"},{"startTime":945.699,"endTime":947.699,"body":"the study, which is weird."},{"startTime":947.699,"endTime":948.379,"body":"I don't know why not."},{"startTime":948.679,"endTime":953.269,"body":"So yeah, from that perspective, yeah,"},{"startTime":948.679,"endTime":953.269,"body":"like it's, it's, it's too bad that it's"},{"startTime":953.269,"endTime":957.999,"body":"not more than that,  knowing what happens"},{"startTime":953.269,"endTime":957.999,"body":"at fortune 500 companies were like just"},{"startTime":958.009,"endTime":963.179,"body":"trying to change like agility and trying"},{"startTime":958.009,"endTime":963.179,"body":"to make tiny little changes in small teams"},{"startTime":963.409,"endTime":966.789,"body":"in a tiny little corner that most people"},{"startTime":963.409,"endTime":966.789,"body":"you're pretty sure don't even know exist."},{"startTime":967.109,"endTime":967.999,"body":"I can only imagine."},{"startTime":968.149,"endTime":971.619,"body":"Trying to convince the the mad"},{"startTime":968.149,"endTime":971.619,"body":"professional management of that"},{"startTime":971.619,"endTime":975.479,"body":"organization that they need to"},{"startTime":971.619,"endTime":975.479,"body":"empower their teams and they"},{"startTime":975.479,"endTime":978.969,"body":"need to look at leadership from"},{"startTime":975.479,"endTime":978.969,"body":"a transformational leadership."},{"startTime":979.119,"endTime":983.949,"body":"You know, level about increasing their"},{"startTime":979.119,"endTime":983.949,"body":"problem solving and creativity and"},{"startTime":983.949,"endTime":987.179,"body":"communicating vision through all levels"},{"startTime":983.949,"endTime":987.179,"body":"of the organization effectively I mean,"},{"startTime":987.179,"endTime":989.369,"body":"come on, they're going to be like,"},{"startTime":987.179,"endTime":989.369,"body":"what are you talking about, Brian?"},{"startTime":989.369,"endTime":991.399,"body":"What, what, what, what's going on here?"},{"startTime":991.529,"endTime":992.319,"body":"Get out of my office."},{"startTime":992.469,"endTime":993.629,"body":"Yeah, I agree with that."},{"startTime":993.769,"endTime":994.879,"body":"I wonder now, though."},{"startTime":995.059,"endTime":998.149,"body":"You know, given that statistic, we"},{"startTime":995.059,"endTime":998.149,"body":"found that the number of women have"},{"startTime":998.189,"endTime":1001.389,"body":"doubled a huge total of 41, right?"},{"startTime":1001.569,"endTime":1006.639,"body":"I wonder how much of that is because"},{"startTime":1001.569,"endTime":1006.639,"body":"of this whole diversity thing that"},{"startTime":1006.639,"endTime":1010.479,"body":"people are jumping on the bandwagon,"},{"startTime":1006.639,"endTime":1010.479,"body":"say, look, we have 10 women on our"},{"startTime":1010.629,"endTime":1012.769,"body":"management position management circus."},{"startTime":1012.849,"endTime":1014.839,"body":"That's not a great,"},{"startTime":1012.849,"endTime":1014.839,"body":"that's not a great reason."},{"startTime":1014.839,"endTime":1017.229,"body":"Like the, the, the reason, the"},{"startTime":1014.839,"endTime":1017.229,"body":"reason should be everything that"},{"startTime":1017.229,"endTime":1020.529,"body":"he notes here at the end is like"},{"startTime":1017.229,"endTime":1020.529,"body":"you want more effective leaders,"},{"startTime":1020.749,"endTime":1022.149,"body":"regardless if they're managers or not."},{"startTime":1022.149,"endTime":1025.879,"body":"You want more effective leaders"},{"startTime":1022.149,"endTime":1025.879,"body":"who can elicit respect and pride."},{"startTime":1026.059,"endTime":1028.159,"body":"You want them, you want"},{"startTime":1026.059,"endTime":1028.159,"body":"better communicators in"},{"startTime":1028.159,"endTime":1029.129,"body":"charge of your organization."},{"startTime":1029.279,"endTime":1032.559,"body":"You want a better problem solving at"},{"startTime":1029.279,"endTime":1032.559,"body":"all levels your organization like these"},{"startTime":1032.559,"endTime":1036.119,"body":"are the things you should be shooting"},{"startTime":1032.559,"endTime":1036.119,"body":"for and if you should be trying to"},{"startTime":1036.129,"endTime":1040.689,"body":"find a person to lead your organization"},{"startTime":1036.129,"endTime":1040.689,"body":"that can get you all these things."},{"startTime":1040.879,"endTime":1045.349,"body":"I'm certain to think that like"},{"startTime":1040.879,"endTime":1045.349,"body":"the hiring for quote management."},{"startTime":1045.499,"endTime":1051.789,"body":"In organizations is just like objectively"},{"startTime":1045.499,"endTime":1051.789,"body":"broken or clunky or something's"},{"startTime":1051.939,"endTime":1054.209,"body":"drastically wrong with the hiring process."},{"startTime":1054.359,"endTime":1056.379,"body":"Well, first of all, you're"},{"startTime":1054.359,"endTime":1056.379,"body":"absolutely correct, right?"},{"startTime":1056.379,"endTime":1057.579,"body":"It is completely broken."},{"startTime":1057.729,"endTime":1060.009,"body":"But who's formulating these policies?"},{"startTime":1060.159,"endTime":1060.999,"body":"That's probably men."},{"startTime":1061.149,"endTime":1061.599,"body":"Probably."},{"startTime":1061.749,"endTime":1064.339,"body":"So it's not surprising that"},{"startTime":1061.749,"endTime":1064.339,"body":"it's broken, I would say."},{"startTime":1064.489,"endTime":1067.169,"body":"Eh, I mean, maybe but how is it?"},{"startTime":1067.179,"endTime":1072.769,"body":"Like, aren't the majority of"},{"startTime":1067.179,"endTime":1072.769,"body":"shouldn't HR have a Hang on, hang on."},{"startTime":1072.919,"endTime":1078.439,"body":"So my challenge to what you just asked oh,"},{"startTime":1072.919,"endTime":1078.439,"body":"like it's predominantly men doing this."},{"startTime":1078.589,"endTime":1082.779,"body":"Yeah, but the majority of even a quick"},{"startTime":1078.589,"endTime":1082.779,"body":"Google search, it says visor, visor."},{"startTime":1082.809,"endTime":1085.149,"body":"Is that a, is that a credible visor?"},{"startTime":1085.149,"endTime":1086.519,"body":"Zippia?"},{"startTime":1086.669,"endTime":1087.639,"body":"Zippia?"},{"startTime":1087.789,"endTime":1091.609,"body":"Like, there's a lot of non"},{"startTime":1087.789,"endTime":1091.609,"body":"credible sources that I'm seeing"},{"startTime":1091.609,"endTime":1092.309,"body":"on the internet right now."},{"startTime":1092.309,"endTime":1094.339,"body":"Now you're a really non"},{"startTime":1092.309,"endTime":1094.339,"body":"credible source, Quora."},{"startTime":1094.599,"endTime":1097.869,"body":"Anyway, the, the, like the"},{"startTime":1094.599,"endTime":1097.869,"body":"first hit on Google, Visor."},{"startTime":1098.039,"endTime":1098.559,"body":"Visor."},{"startTime":1098.569,"endTime":1099.979,"body":"Why, why is it got an E in there?"},{"startTime":1100.219,"endTime":1103.679,"body":"Anyway, the, the first credible"},{"startTime":1100.219,"endTime":1103.679,"body":"hit on Google, it says, 76"},{"startTime":1103.709,"endTime":1105.519,"body":"percent of HR managers are women."},{"startTime":1105.669,"endTime":1106.279,"body":"That's what it says."},{"startTime":1106.499,"endTime":1111.049,"body":"Like, so, I, I, I would think that the"},{"startTime":1106.499,"endTime":1111.049,"body":"majority of people doing hiring and"},{"startTime":1111.059,"endTime":1113.179,"body":"having influence over hiring are women."},{"startTime":1113.359,"endTime":1114.879,"body":"So why, why would they?"},{"startTime":1115.029,"endTime":1118.679,"body":"Not have more influence In, in"},{"startTime":1115.029,"endTime":1118.679,"body":"kind of what we're talking about?"},{"startTime":1118.829,"endTime":1119.609,"body":"That's a good question."},{"startTime":1119.609,"endTime":1122.789,"body":"I, I was assuming that there'd"},{"startTime":1119.609,"endTime":1122.789,"body":"be more men in the game."},{"startTime":1122.989,"endTime":1124.699,"body":"let's put this aside for a second."},{"startTime":1124.759,"endTime":1128.719,"body":"The fact that the hiring process is super"},{"startTime":1124.759,"endTime":1128.719,"body":"clunky and completely broken when it comes"},{"startTime":1128.724,"endTime":1133.759,"body":"to the executives because, because again,"},{"startTime":1128.724,"endTime":1133.759,"body":"like we know, like working with executives"},{"startTime":1133.759,"endTime":1136.909,"body":"and director level and above, we know"},{"startTime":1133.759,"endTime":1136.909,"body":"that just working with those people to"},{"startTime":1136.909,"endTime":1138.889,"body":"affect change is extremely difficult."},{"startTime":1139.039,"endTime":1140.899,"body":"And anything that crosses department."},{"startTime":1141.049,"endTime":1143.099,"body":"difficult because of so"},{"startTime":1141.049,"endTime":1143.099,"body":"many different reasons."},{"startTime":1143.249,"endTime":1148.029,"body":"So I, I wrote down a note before"},{"startTime":1143.249,"endTime":1148.029,"body":"we started about to talk about"},{"startTime":1148.039,"endTime":1150.499,"body":"HR as part of the problem."},{"startTime":1150.649,"endTime":1155.069,"body":"So if you want to talk about management"},{"startTime":1150.649,"endTime":1155.069,"body":"in like roll the clocks back way"},{"startTime":1155.069,"endTime":1159.249,"body":"to like the early 1900s to talk"},{"startTime":1155.069,"endTime":1159.249,"body":"about like management, management."},{"startTime":1159.399,"endTime":1161.719,"body":"Talk about a good friend, Fredrick wins."},{"startTime":1161.719,"endTime":1162.019,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1162.019,"endTime":1162.119,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1162.429,"endTime":1167.979,"body":"Talk about Taylor is Taylorism management,"},{"startTime":1162.429,"endTime":1167.979,"body":"meaning I'm going to go out and get my"},{"startTime":1168.279,"endTime":1172.369,"body":"timekeeper and go out and get my the,"},{"startTime":1168.279,"endTime":1172.369,"body":"the, the person that tells everyone how"},{"startTime":1172.369,"endTime":1176.349,"body":"to do the work and tells them they're"},{"startTime":1172.369,"endTime":1176.349,"body":"not carrying heavy enough piles of pig"},{"startTime":1176.349,"endTime":1179.409,"body":"iron and tell them they're not running"},{"startTime":1176.349,"endTime":1179.409,"body":"up and down the yard fast enough."},{"startTime":1179.439,"endTime":1179.879,"body":"You know what I mean?"},{"startTime":1180.019,"endTime":1181.049,"body":"Like a taskmaster."},{"startTime":1181.199,"endTime":1182.729,"body":"This is a straight task master."},{"startTime":1182.879,"endTime":1187.129,"body":"Like the HR people were one of those"},{"startTime":1182.879,"endTime":1187.129,"body":"people and, and their role was to"},{"startTime":1187.189,"endTime":1191.599,"body":"do manager's bidding to fire people"},{"startTime":1187.189,"endTime":1191.599,"body":"and get rid of 'em and get better"},{"startTime":1191.599,"endTime":1195.189,"body":"people in hey kid, you're not just . I"},{"startTime":1191.599,"endTime":1195.189,"body":"was gonna say, Hey, 12-year-old kid"},{"startTime":1195.189,"endTime":1196.299,"body":"you're not carrying enough pig iron."},{"startTime":1196.314,"endTime":1198.304,"body":"Like , like they, they would do their job."},{"startTime":1198.304,"endTime":1201.744,"body":"I'm sure that like people back, the early"},{"startTime":1198.304,"endTime":1201.744,"body":"19 hundreds would say like, oh, well"},{"startTime":1201.744,"endTime":1203.244,"body":"we're just we're just doing our job."},{"startTime":1203.294,"endTime":1204.454,"body":"Competitively to the market."},{"startTime":1204.454,"endTime":1207.244,"body":"They'd probably would have"},{"startTime":1204.454,"endTime":1207.244,"body":"a volley of excuses as well."},{"startTime":1207.334,"endTime":1208.084,"body":"There's no doubt."},{"startTime":1208.174,"endTime":1210.374,"body":"Why the child labor is not"},{"startTime":1208.174,"endTime":1210.374,"body":"cutting it or whatever."},{"startTime":1210.634,"endTime":1216.344,"body":"Anyway, the point is, is it just, is"},{"startTime":1210.634,"endTime":1216.344,"body":"it a lot of HR serves the executive?"},{"startTime":1216.384,"endTime":1218.444,"body":"They carry out the"},{"startTime":1216.384,"endTime":1218.444,"body":"orders of the executive."},{"startTime":1218.594,"endTime":1219.954,"body":"And they work for the executive."},{"startTime":1220.204,"endTime":1223.124,"body":"And while they're up in the ivory"},{"startTime":1220.204,"endTime":1223.124,"body":"tower, they get all the benefits"},{"startTime":1223.124,"endTime":1224.094,"body":"of being in the ivory tower."},{"startTime":1224.094,"endTime":1228.354,"body":"So why would you, if you, if your"},{"startTime":1224.094,"endTime":1228.354,"body":"job is to live in the ivory tower?"},{"startTime":1228.504,"endTime":1232.824,"body":"Why would you, living in the ivory tower,"},{"startTime":1228.504,"endTime":1232.824,"body":"Spend a second on anyone outside the"},{"startTime":1232.824,"endTime":1236.034,"body":"ivory tower because it could jeopardize"},{"startTime":1232.824,"endTime":1236.034,"body":"your status in the ivory tower."},{"startTime":1236.184,"endTime":1239.774,"body":"That's absolutely correct That's"},{"startTime":1236.184,"endTime":1239.774,"body":"why people don't spend time thinking"},{"startTime":1239.784,"endTime":1243.594,"body":"about those outside and and guess"},{"startTime":1239.784,"endTime":1243.594,"body":"what they hire people just like them."},{"startTime":1243.744,"endTime":1245.894,"body":"Well That's obviously not good."},{"startTime":1246.024,"endTime":1247.494,"body":"No, it certainly is not good."},{"startTime":1247.724,"endTime":1251.444,"body":"You know, I think I think for the"},{"startTime":1247.724,"endTime":1251.444,"body":"most part It is very difficult"},{"startTime":1251.594,"endTime":1253.704,"body":"given equal Everything else, right?"},{"startTime":1253.734,"endTime":1257.734,"body":"Equal qualifications, experience,"},{"startTime":1253.734,"endTime":1257.734,"body":"et cetera, between men and women."},{"startTime":1257.734,"endTime":1262.854,"body":"It's very difficult to to have"},{"startTime":1257.734,"endTime":1262.854,"body":"a, a, a female get the job unless"},{"startTime":1262.854,"endTime":1264.224,"body":"there are other factors at play."},{"startTime":1264.374,"endTime":1268.694,"body":"Like she knows somebody or the"},{"startTime":1264.374,"endTime":1268.694,"body":"job just happens to have enough."},{"startTime":1268.899,"endTime":1272.919,"body":"people that are females who are going"},{"startTime":1268.899,"endTime":1272.919,"body":"through the interview process, perhaps"},{"startTime":1272.919,"endTime":1275.079,"body":"that can identify with these applicants."},{"startTime":1275.119,"endTime":1277.019,"body":"I can empathize with them, etcetera."},{"startTime":1277.169,"endTime":1281.839,"body":"I mean, the author talks about leading"},{"startTime":1277.169,"endTime":1281.839,"body":"with emotional intelligence, and I"},{"startTime":1281.839,"endTime":1284.439,"body":"agree that men Don't lead with E I."},{"startTime":1284.589,"endTime":1289.009,"body":"Most of the men that are in"},{"startTime":1284.589,"endTime":1289.009,"body":"management aren't even aware of"},{"startTime":1289.049,"endTime":1290.789,"body":"their own like self awareness."},{"startTime":1290.799,"endTime":1292.149,"body":"Then they don't have self awareness."},{"startTime":1292.179,"endTime":1296.765,"body":"They simply are that's again"},{"startTime":1292.179,"endTime":1296.765,"body":"in the Taylorist model."},{"startTime":1296.915,"endTime":1298.425,"body":"Self awareness is not necessary."},{"startTime":1298.765,"endTime":1299.215,"body":"Absolutely."},{"startTime":1299.455,"endTime":1302.145,"body":"All you gotta do is watch a clock,"},{"startTime":1299.455,"endTime":1302.145,"body":"watch the person's performance"},{"startTime":1302.175,"endTime":1303.295,"body":"and then tell them the facts."},{"startTime":1303.295,"endTime":1306.285,"body":"And then you then you can come across"},{"startTime":1303.295,"endTime":1306.285,"body":"to say, Well, I'm telling you the facts."},{"startTime":1306.435,"endTime":1309.325,"body":"The checklist says you should be able"},{"startTime":1306.435,"endTime":1309.325,"body":"to do this in X number of minutes"},{"startTime":1309.325,"endTime":1311.465,"body":"and you did it in more than that."},{"startTime":1311.465,"endTime":1312.725,"body":"So you're wrong."},{"startTime":1312.875,"endTime":1313.785,"body":"I couldn't agree more."},{"startTime":1313.815,"endTime":1316.305,"body":"Taylorism was perfect back in the day."},{"startTime":1316.355,"endTime":1316.635,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1316.655,"endTime":1319.375,"body":"Back in the day when, when, when"},{"startTime":1316.655,"endTime":1319.375,"body":"you could be an industrial agent."},{"startTime":1319.405,"endTime":1320.375,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"startTime":1320.525,"endTime":1324.675,"body":"Yeah, that's that's when you know"},{"startTime":1320.525,"endTime":1324.675,"body":"leadership believed or management rather"},{"startTime":1324.685,"endTime":1328.965,"body":"believed that they knew everything"},{"startTime":1324.685,"endTime":1328.965,"body":"there is to know Yeah, and let the"},{"startTime":1328.965,"endTime":1330.795,"body":"workers just simply carry out orders"},{"startTime":1330.805,"endTime":1335.565,"body":"Putting aside for a minute that HR in this"},{"startTime":1330.805,"endTime":1335.565,"body":"ivory tower that they've constructed for?"},{"startTime":1335.565,"endTime":1342.205,"body":"Is the eventual path for this is we"},{"startTime":1335.565,"endTime":1342.205,"body":"just need a long enough time where all"},{"startTime":1342.205,"endTime":1346.065,"body":"of the companies that are running this"},{"startTime":1342.205,"endTime":1346.065,"body":"Taylor's fashion just kind of wither"},{"startTime":1346.065,"endTime":1348.495,"body":"away and die for that management."},{"startTime":1348.645,"endTime":1350.775,"body":"ethos to kind of go away."},{"startTime":1350.925,"endTime":1352.515,"body":"That's going to be a long tail."},{"startTime":1352.765,"endTime":1353.705,"body":"If we wait for that."},{"startTime":1353.895,"endTime":1358.045,"body":"I think what needs to happen is people"},{"startTime":1353.895,"endTime":1358.045,"body":"need to fully embrace the fact that I"},{"startTime":1358.295,"endTime":1359.535,"body":"can't believe I'm saying this today."},{"startTime":1359.835,"endTime":1364.295,"body":"2023 fully embrace the fact that"},{"startTime":1359.835,"endTime":1364.295,"body":"we're no longer in the industrial age."},{"startTime":1364.445,"endTime":1364.785,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1364.935,"endTime":1368.185,"body":"We are fully squarely in"},{"startTime":1364.935,"endTime":1368.185,"body":"the knowledge based economy."},{"startTime":1368.205,"endTime":1368.495,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1368.495,"endTime":1368.705,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1368.875,"endTime":1373.135,"body":"And so with that being the case, you're"},{"startTime":1368.875,"endTime":1373.135,"body":"no longer comparing a man versus a"},{"startTime":1373.135,"endTime":1377.065,"body":"woman in terms of carrying how much"},{"startTime":1373.135,"endTime":1377.065,"body":"pig iron they can on their backs."},{"startTime":1377.395,"endTime":1379.095,"body":"Now it's just about Up here."},{"startTime":1379.385,"endTime":1379.915,"body":"I mean"},{"startTime":1379.915,"endTime":1384.635,"body":"the effects of the Taylorist style"},{"startTime":1379.915,"endTime":1384.635,"body":"management where you only hire workers"},{"startTime":1384.635,"endTime":1388.275,"body":"who can carry pig iron You know in a"},{"startTime":1384.635,"endTime":1388.275,"body":"certain amount whatever 80 pounds or"},{"startTime":1388.275,"endTime":1391.905,"body":"whatever like You're immediately not"},{"startTime":1388.275,"endTime":1391.905,"body":"gonna hire any women ever So, how would"},{"startTime":1391.905,"endTime":1396.645,"body":"you ever get anyone into management if"},{"startTime":1391.905,"endTime":1396.645,"body":"if you're looking within to promote it"},{"startTime":1396.645,"endTime":1399.565,"body":"like there's a lot of stuff That just"},{"startTime":1396.645,"endTime":1399.565,"body":"doesn't make sense that objectively"},{"startTime":1399.565,"endTime":1403.035,"body":"doesn't make sense if you're building"},{"startTime":1399.565,"endTime":1403.035,"body":"your organization off of this concept"},{"startTime":1403.185,"endTime":1407.085,"body":"that that worked in a previous age"},{"startTime":1403.185,"endTime":1407.085,"body":"Arguably doesn't really work today."},{"startTime":1407.085,"endTime":1410.545,"body":"I say arguably because I feel that's"},{"startTime":1407.085,"endTime":1410.545,"body":"where this article should have gone."},{"startTime":1410.545,"endTime":1413.075,"body":"It should have gone into depth"},{"startTime":1410.545,"endTime":1413.075,"body":"of you're trying to get together"},{"startTime":1413.075,"endTime":1416.415,"body":"a bunch of teams that are doing"},{"startTime":1413.075,"endTime":1416.415,"body":"things that nobody's done before."},{"startTime":1416.565,"endTime":1420.215,"body":"And it's not like you have one"},{"startTime":1416.565,"endTime":1420.215,"body":"specific way to do everything."},{"startTime":1420.425,"endTime":1421.535,"body":"And if you do all that."},{"startTime":1421.685,"endTime":1424.185,"body":"In the order it's written,"},{"startTime":1421.685,"endTime":1424.185,"body":"you will be successful."},{"startTime":1424.335,"endTime":1429.555,"body":"In fact, in fact, it is precisely the"},{"startTime":1424.335,"endTime":1429.555,"body":"opposite of if you have a checklist and"},{"startTime":1429.555,"endTime":1432.625,"body":"you just run down the checklist from"},{"startTime":1429.555,"endTime":1432.625,"body":"top to bottom without changing anything,"},{"startTime":1432.775,"endTime":1437.855,"body":"most likely will be a failure and then"},{"startTime":1432.775,"endTime":1437.855,"body":"how do you handle that failure that"},{"startTime":1437.985,"endTime":1439.735,"body":"tells me a lot about your personality."},{"startTime":1439.855,"endTime":1441.315,"body":"It tells me a lot about"},{"startTime":1439.855,"endTime":1441.315,"body":"your leadership skills."},{"startTime":1441.605,"endTime":1444.645,"body":"Like the management is a"},{"startTime":1441.605,"endTime":1444.645,"body":"very minimal part of that."},{"startTime":1444.795,"endTime":1445.065,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":1445.155,"endTime":1446.645,"body":"You know, yeah, I agree."},{"startTime":1446.665,"endTime":1449.395,"body":"And the demonstration"},{"startTime":1446.665,"endTime":1449.395,"body":"of that is going to be."},{"startTime":1449.545,"endTime":1452.095,"body":"Basically borne out by the"},{"startTime":1449.545,"endTime":1452.095,"body":"fact that you're either leading"},{"startTime":1452.095,"endTime":1453.595,"body":"with EI or you're not, right?"},{"startTime":1453.625,"endTime":1456.105,"body":"I mean, can you set,"},{"startTime":1453.625,"endTime":1456.105,"body":"can you empower teams?"},{"startTime":1456.145,"endTime":1458.935,"body":"Can you lead people as"},{"startTime":1456.145,"endTime":1458.935,"body":"opposed to direct people?"},{"startTime":1459.285,"endTime":1462.015,"body":"Are you focused purely"},{"startTime":1459.285,"endTime":1462.015,"body":"on efficiency, right?"},{"startTime":1462.015,"endTime":1465.115,"body":"Which is what the Taylorist"},{"startTime":1462.015,"endTime":1465.115,"body":"model, Tayloristic model was."},{"startTime":1465.265,"endTime":1468.425,"body":"Or are you looking"},{"startTime":1465.265,"endTime":1468.425,"body":"at , making teams effective."},{"startTime":1468.575,"endTime":1468.945,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1469.095,"endTime":1471.635,"body":"he points out that female"},{"startTime":1469.095,"endTime":1471.635,"body":"managers are more likely to,"},{"startTime":1471.695,"endTime":1473.235,"body":"to have all these attributes."},{"startTime":1473.575,"endTime":1477.195,"body":"Male managers are, are, by"},{"startTime":1473.575,"endTime":1477.195,"body":"comparison, again, in his article,"},{"startTime":1477.205,"endTime":1480.385,"body":"which, again, doesn't really"},{"startTime":1477.205,"endTime":1480.385,"body":"have a lot of stats to give me."},{"startTime":1480.695,"endTime":1484.935,"body":"But male managers are Statistically,"},{"startTime":1480.695,"endTime":1484.935,"body":"less likely to bond or connect with"},{"startTime":1484.935,"endTime":1488.255,"body":"their subordinates, and they're"},{"startTime":1484.935,"endTime":1488.255,"body":"relatively more inept at rewarding"},{"startTime":1488.255,"endTime":1490.315,"body":"them for their actual performance."},{"startTime":1490.465,"endTime":1492.355,"body":"I could argue with that one,"},{"startTime":1490.465,"endTime":1492.355,"body":"because again, he doesn't really"},{"startTime":1492.355,"endTime":1493.575,"body":"give me any stats for that."},{"startTime":1493.835,"endTime":1497.875,"body":"The result is a pathological system"},{"startTime":1493.835,"endTime":1497.875,"body":"that rewards men for their incompetence,"},{"startTime":1498.025,"endTime":1502.895,"body":"while punishing women for their"},{"startTime":1498.025,"endTime":1502.895,"body":"competence to everyone's detriment."},{"startTime":1503.045,"endTime":1505.855,"body":"His conclusion here it's,"},{"startTime":1503.045,"endTime":1505.855,"body":"it's more rewarding."},{"startTime":1505.855,"endTime":1511.825,"body":"People's confidence when you hire them"},{"startTime":1505.855,"endTime":1511.825,"body":"and then not having great systems to"},{"startTime":1511.825,"endTime":1516.965,"body":"track leadership, ability and performance,"},{"startTime":1511.825,"endTime":1516.965,"body":"not management ability and performance."},{"startTime":1517.115,"endTime":1518.005,"body":"Yeah, I agree with that."},{"startTime":1518.005,"endTime":1522.615,"body":"I also think that while I generally"},{"startTime":1518.005,"endTime":1522.615,"body":"I agree with the sentiments"},{"startTime":1522.615,"endTime":1525.525,"body":"that he's putting out here,"},{"startTime":1522.615,"endTime":1525.525,"body":"there are exceptions, right?"},{"startTime":1525.845,"endTime":1527.565,"body":"I've had many, many."},{"startTime":1527.715,"endTime":1532.915,"body":"Managers and leaders that have been women"},{"startTime":1527.715,"endTime":1532.915,"body":"and they've all been great except for one."},{"startTime":1533.065,"endTime":1535.535,"body":"I'll change the name to protect"},{"startTime":1533.065,"endTime":1535.535,"body":"the innocent They're not"},{"startTime":1535.535,"endTime":1537.205,"body":"innocent, they're very guilty."},{"startTime":1537.215,"endTime":1540.605,"body":"Yeah, her name's not evident but"},{"startTime":1537.215,"endTime":1540.605,"body":"anyway, so there are exceptions."},{"startTime":1540.755,"endTime":1541.945,"body":"The flip side of it is true."},{"startTime":1541.945,"endTime":1546.885,"body":"Also, there are some men that just"},{"startTime":1541.945,"endTime":1546.885,"body":"have that charismatic personality that"},{"startTime":1546.935,"endTime":1553.415,"body":"basically initially and very quickly"},{"startTime":1546.935,"endTime":1553.415,"body":"bond with their teams and carry out"},{"startTime":1553.425,"endTime":1555.405,"body":"that, that comradeship from day one."},{"startTime":1555.555,"endTime":1558.615,"body":"There aren't too many, but there are"},{"startTime":1555.555,"endTime":1558.615,"body":"some so I think we need to make sure"},{"startTime":1558.615,"endTime":1562.525,"body":"we don't kind of just yeah, sweep"},{"startTime":1558.615,"endTime":1562.525,"body":"everything with one broad brush stroke."},{"startTime":1562.565,"endTime":1566.765,"body":"Yeah, again, that's why I say at the"},{"startTime":1562.565,"endTime":1566.765,"body":"end of his article, I, I kind of the"},{"startTime":1566.795,"endTime":1571.245,"body":"takeaway, the last sentence takeaway in"},{"startTime":1566.795,"endTime":1571.245,"body":"the article I don't know if I can really"},{"startTime":1571.315,"endTime":1574.885,"body":"agree I need to see some studies I need"},{"startTime":1571.315,"endTime":1574.885,"body":"to see some numbers here because I can't"},{"startTime":1574.895,"endTime":1580.425,"body":"just blanket agree with this because"},{"startTime":1574.895,"endTime":1580.425,"body":"again my god if somebody The evil version"},{"startTime":1580.455,"endTime":1584.585,"body":"of someone reading this is to say oh,"},{"startTime":1580.455,"endTime":1584.585,"body":"I need to get more women in management."},{"startTime":1584.795,"endTime":1586.105,"body":"That's cool Let me just have them."},{"startTime":1586.255,"endTime":1591.685,"body":"Let me just have them learn and practice"},{"startTime":1586.255,"endTime":1591.685,"body":"the same narcissistic, psychopathic,"},{"startTime":1591.695,"endTime":1596.875,"body":"histrionic, Machiavellian traits  and"},{"startTime":1591.695,"endTime":1596.875,"body":"now, now I've just kind of carbon copied"},{"startTime":1596.875,"endTime":1600.415,"body":"this management template that I was"},{"startTime":1596.875,"endTime":1600.415,"body":"describing earlier where they're just"},{"startTime":1600.415,"endTime":1602.015,"body":"checking what you're doing on the list."},{"startTime":1602.065,"endTime":1603.595,"body":"And then looking at the"},{"startTime":1602.065,"endTime":1603.595,"body":"employees that are like."},{"startTime":1603.745,"endTime":1607.545,"body":"The lowest 10 percent of performers"},{"startTime":1603.745,"endTime":1607.545,"body":"carrying pig iron from the train back."},{"startTime":1607.545,"endTime":1610.385,"body":"And they just like every year we"},{"startTime":1607.545,"endTime":1610.385,"body":"just cut those 10 percent because"},{"startTime":1610.465,"endTime":1613.675,"body":"it's, it's, it's less money to just"},{"startTime":1610.465,"endTime":1613.675,"body":"cut those 10 percent where we might"},{"startTime":1613.675,"endTime":1617.595,"body":"get one top performer out of the new"},{"startTime":1613.675,"endTime":1617.595,"body":"batch of 10 percent that we hired."},{"startTime":1617.815,"endTime":1621.015,"body":"So like there's some questionable"},{"startTime":1617.815,"endTime":1621.015,"body":"morals happening and."},{"startTime":1621.165,"endTime":1624.825,"body":"Men learning to play that game versus"},{"startTime":1621.165,"endTime":1624.825,"body":"women learning to play that game."},{"startTime":1624.975,"endTime":1626.215,"body":"Like, that's not the issue."},{"startTime":1626.215,"endTime":1628.805,"body":"It's like like, oh, we need to"},{"startTime":1626.215,"endTime":1628.805,"body":"teach more people how to play this"},{"startTime":1629.025,"endTime":1631.505,"body":"psychopathic Machiavellian game."},{"startTime":1631.565,"endTime":1633.085,"body":"That's not what we're saying here."},{"startTime":1633.095,"endTime":1634.035,"body":"Like, that's the problem."},{"startTime":1634.185,"endTime":1635.035,"body":"That's very true."},{"startTime":1635.035,"endTime":1639.075,"body":"And on that front, I think there"},{"startTime":1635.035,"endTime":1639.075,"body":"may well be cases out there"},{"startTime":1639.075,"endTime":1641.235,"body":"of women doing exactly that."},{"startTime":1641.275,"endTime":1646.175,"body":"Emulating their male counterparts in these"},{"startTime":1641.275,"endTime":1646.175,"body":"kinds of Personality disorders, right?"},{"startTime":1646.325,"endTime":1651.655,"body":"And yeah, what applies to men, in terms"},{"startTime":1646.325,"endTime":1651.655,"body":"of, it gets them to the top, but it also"},{"startTime":1651.875,"endTime":1653.685,"body":"ultimately is the reason why they fail."},{"startTime":1653.875,"endTime":1655.125,"body":"It's going to apply to women too."},{"startTime":1655.315,"endTime":1659.91,"body":"I mean, one of the links from this"},{"startTime":1655.315,"endTime":1659.91,"body":"article to another related article."},{"startTime":1660.01,"endTime":1664.04,"body":"was about women changing their self"},{"startTime":1660.01,"endTime":1664.04,"body":"image you know, when, when confronted"},{"startTime":1664.04,"endTime":1667.86,"body":"with the reality of the situation when"},{"startTime":1664.04,"endTime":1667.86,"body":"the reality of the situation here is"},{"startTime":1668.14,"endTime":1672.83,"body":"the men that are willing to, to, to"},{"startTime":1668.14,"endTime":1672.83,"body":"put on a big show or be histrionic or"},{"startTime":1672.83,"endTime":1676.73,"body":"to be Machiavellian or whatever the,"},{"startTime":1672.83,"endTime":1676.73,"body":"the message that you're hearing here"},{"startTime":1676.73,"endTime":1681.29,"body":"is like, Oh, it's my I'm not getting"},{"startTime":1676.73,"endTime":1681.29,"body":"promoted because I can't do these things."},{"startTime":1681.44,"endTime":1684.2,"body":"I need to be more like them"},{"startTime":1681.44,"endTime":1684.2,"body":"and start doing these things."},{"startTime":1684.2,"endTime":1687.44,"body":"Like, that's a bad, it's a bad message."},{"startTime":1687.53,"endTime":1691.36,"body":"It's a bad message, but also a bad message"},{"startTime":1687.53,"endTime":1691.36,"body":"with potential straight to the top."},{"startTime":1691.51,"endTime":1693.51,"body":"And then straight to the bottom."},{"startTime":1693.66,"endTime":1695.19,"body":"So yes, yeah, right."},{"startTime":1695.34,"endTime":1696.84,"body":"But at least you're on the roller coaster."},{"startTime":1696.84,"endTime":1698.53,"body":"That's like, that's how"},{"startTime":1696.84,"endTime":1698.53,"body":"some people look at it."},{"startTime":1698.53,"endTime":1700.63,"body":"It's like, yeah, but"},{"startTime":1698.53,"endTime":1700.63,"body":"I'm straight to the top."},{"startTime":1700.64,"endTime":1703.08,"body":"And then I'll just go move"},{"startTime":1700.64,"endTime":1703.08,"body":"and be CEO of another company."},{"startTime":1703.425,"endTime":1706.975,"body":"Or whatever cheap operations of another,"},{"startTime":1703.425,"endTime":1706.975,"body":"whatever director of another company."},{"startTime":1707.145,"endTime":1707.645,"body":"It doesn't matter."},{"startTime":1707.645,"endTime":1708.075,"body":"It doesn't matter."},{"startTime":1708.295,"endTime":1712.965,"body":"I'm sure at some point the stakes get too"},{"startTime":1708.295,"endTime":1712.965,"body":"small to change your whole personality"},{"startTime":1712.965,"endTime":1716.105,"body":"for, but some of these people, again,"},{"startTime":1712.965,"endTime":1716.105,"body":"if they really have narcissistic traits"},{"startTime":1716.105,"endTime":1718.165,"body":"or whatever, like they won't notice."},{"startTime":1718.315,"endTime":1722.465,"body":"That's the, that's the sad part is"},{"startTime":1718.315,"endTime":1722.465,"body":"once you get to that level through"},{"startTime":1722.465,"endTime":1725.805,"body":"this channel that we just talked"},{"startTime":1722.465,"endTime":1725.805,"body":"about, it's going to be so hard for"},{"startTime":1725.805,"endTime":1727.645,"body":"you to change because you've already."},{"startTime":1727.795,"endTime":1731.285,"body":"Started to see the, the"},{"startTime":1727.795,"endTime":1731.285,"body":"fruits of doing that, right?"},{"startTime":1731.325,"endTime":1734.555,"body":"And then you're going to not change, even"},{"startTime":1731.325,"endTime":1734.555,"body":"though that's going to be your downfall."},{"startTime":1734.555,"endTime":1735.275,"body":"And yeah, you're right."},{"startTime":1735.275,"endTime":1738.755,"body":"You just take a few of your, your"},{"startTime":1735.275,"endTime":1738.755,"body":"closest friends with you and move to"},{"startTime":1738.755,"endTime":1740.695,"body":"another company and do it all over again."},{"startTime":1740.845,"endTime":1741.825,"body":"It's interesting that this."},{"startTime":1742.165,"endTime":1745.615,"body":"article was listed under"},{"startTime":1742.165,"endTime":1745.615,"body":"workplace discrimination."},{"startTime":1745.635,"endTime":1746.045,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1746.095,"endTime":1746.385,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1746.385,"endTime":1747.725,"body":"You touched on that at the beginning."},{"startTime":1747.985,"endTime":1750.145,"body":"I don't, I don't know if it"},{"startTime":1747.985,"endTime":1750.145,"body":"made it into the end of the pie."},{"startTime":1750.145,"endTime":1751.935,"body":"I don't know if it made it into the"},{"startTime":1750.145,"endTime":1751.935,"body":"beginning of the podcast or not,"},{"startTime":1751.935,"endTime":1756.455,"body":"but workplace discrimination it's"},{"startTime":1751.935,"endTime":1756.455,"body":"like, it's not really discrimination."},{"startTime":1756.465,"endTime":1758.195,"body":"Like it, let me think"},{"startTime":1756.465,"endTime":1758.195,"body":"about this for a second."},{"startTime":1758.195,"endTime":1760.945,"body":"Cause it could be, it could be"},{"startTime":1758.195,"endTime":1760.945,"body":"interpreted as a bold statement."},{"startTime":1760.945,"endTime":1762.765,"body":"I'm not really trying to make"},{"startTime":1760.945,"endTime":1762.765,"body":"a bold statement about this."},{"startTime":1762.915,"endTime":1765.345,"body":"It's not really workplace discrimination."},{"startTime":1765.68,"endTime":1769.87,"body":"That your workplace is filled"},{"startTime":1765.68,"endTime":1769.87,"body":"with a bunch of assholes."},{"startTime":1769.87,"endTime":1774.09,"body":"That your workplace is filled"},{"startTime":1769.87,"endTime":1774.09,"body":"with incompetent managers."},{"startTime":1774.24,"endTime":1776.2,"body":"That's, is that discrimination?"},{"startTime":1776.35,"endTime":1778.82,"body":"It can lead to discrimination"},{"startTime":1776.35,"endTime":1778.82,"body":"once you get there."},{"startTime":1778.97,"endTime":1783.59,"body":"But to your point your your organizational"},{"startTime":1778.97,"endTime":1783.59,"body":"culture basically is rewarding people"},{"startTime":1783.59,"endTime":1786.07,"body":"that have those four disorders, right?"},{"startTime":1786.39,"endTime":1789.42,"body":"And then through that, yes,"},{"startTime":1786.39,"endTime":1789.42,"body":"it can lead to discrimination."},{"startTime":1789.57,"endTime":1791.82,"body":"Because you're not going to get a"},{"startTime":1789.57,"endTime":1791.82,"body":"whole lot of women being promoted."},{"startTime":1791.97,"endTime":1793.59,"body":"No to management or leadership."},{"startTime":1793.86,"endTime":1798.03,"body":"I mean, or, or you probably won't"},{"startTime":1793.86,"endTime":1798.03,"body":"get those types of people, women or"},{"startTime":1798.03,"endTime":1800.07,"body":"men, the majority, probably women."},{"startTime":1800.22,"endTime":1803.97,"body":"You probably won't get those type of"},{"startTime":1800.22,"endTime":1803.97,"body":"people staying at your organization."},{"startTime":1803.97,"endTime":1804.36,"body":"That's right."},{"startTime":1804.42,"endTime":1809.16,"body":"For a good amount of time and, and thereby"},{"startTime":1804.42,"endTime":1809.16,"body":"leading to the, the, the, the boys club"},{"startTime":1809.21,"endTime":1813.35,"body":"that is your c-suite or whatever, or your"},{"startTime":1809.21,"endTime":1813.35,"body":"director pool or whatever, whatever it"},{"startTime":1813.35,"endTime":1817.405,"body":"is so I, so I can totally see it, but it"},{"startTime":1813.35,"endTime":1817.405,"body":"is like, it's so, I guess it's, it's not."},{"startTime":1817.555,"endTime":1821.655,"body":"Intentional discrimination, I"},{"startTime":1817.555,"endTime":1821.655,"body":"guess it doesn't sound good."},{"startTime":1821.805,"endTime":1822.085,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":1822.085,"endTime":1823.375,"body":"It's not intentional discrimination."},{"startTime":1823.375,"endTime":1825.195,"body":"We're just all incompetent."},{"startTime":1825.345,"endTime":1826.205,"body":"That's exactly it."},{"startTime":1826.295,"endTime":1828.785,"body":"I think that's a perfect"},{"startTime":1826.295,"endTime":1828.785,"body":"fitting end to this broadcast."},{"startTime":1828.795,"endTime":1829.995,"body":"Well, that makes me feel better."},{"startTime":1830.005,"endTime":1831.105,"body":"We are just incompetent."},{"startTime":1831.255,"endTime":1832.475,"body":"Well, that makes me feel better."},{"startTime":1832.475,"endTime":1837.375,"body":"So to wrap up, if you've ever worked"},{"startTime":1832.475,"endTime":1837.375,"body":"for an incompetent quote leader,"},{"startTime":1837.495,"endTime":1838.895,"body":"I'm really going to say manager."},{"startTime":1838.895,"endTime":1840.325,"body":"I don't, I don't manager."},{"startTime":1840.415,"endTime":1843.595,"body":"No such thing as someone who thought"},{"startTime":1840.415,"endTime":1843.595,"body":"themselves a leader, but we're"},{"startTime":1843.605,"endTime":1845.215,"body":"really just an incompetent manager."},{"startTime":1845.335,"endTime":1845.655,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1845.735,"endTime":1847.415,"body":"I throw that comment down."},{"startTime":1847.415,"endTime":1848.125,"body":"I'd love to hear it."},{"startTime":1848.155,"endTime":1852.225,"body":"I have a bunch, I'm going to go throw"},{"startTime":1848.155,"endTime":1852.225,"body":"a dozen comments down as soon as"},{"startTime":1852.225,"endTime":1854.495,"body":"this podcast is over, because I have."},{"startTime":1854.775,"endTime":1859.685,"body":"A ton of examples of people by name and"},{"startTime":1854.775,"endTime":1859.685,"body":"be, I can, I can listen by behavior."},{"startTime":1859.835,"endTime":1860.005,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1860.005,"endTime":1861.365,"body":"You wouldn't even have"},{"startTime":1860.005,"endTime":1861.365,"body":"mentioned their name."},{"startTime":1861.385,"endTime":1862.425,"body":"It would be too close."},{"startTime":1862.455,"endTime":1863.945,"body":"I couldn't, it'd be too"},{"startTime":1862.455,"endTime":1863.945,"body":"close to our working."},{"startTime":1863.945,"endTime":1864.945,"body":"I'd be skirting."},{"startTime":1865.095,"endTime":1868.215,"body":"A working agreement, no,"},{"startTime":1865.095,"endTime":1868.215,"body":"no, we don't do that here."},{"startTime":1868.365,"endTime":1871.795,"body":"Let us know though down, down in"},{"startTime":1868.365,"endTime":1871.795,"body":"the comments below, you can change"},{"startTime":1871.795,"endTime":1875.625,"body":"the names to protect the guilty and"},{"startTime":1871.795,"endTime":1875.625,"body":"don't forget to subscribe and like,"}]}