Imagine having a workspace set up with two monitors, a laptop, and a headset, communicating with agents all day long, aiming to help them close deals and achieve success. Welcome Nick Coppola, a Michigan-based broker who plays a pivotal role in a cloud-based company. Nick's typical day is anything but traditional as he juggles chats, emails, phone calls, and texts, all in the bid to support his agents. Backed by a team of support staff including agent service coordinators and settlement specialists, he's redefining what it means to be a broker in the digital age.
Ever wondered how a virtual brokerage operates? With Nick, we explore the exciting dynamics of working in a cloud-based enterprise. Hear about how this platform offers a faster service than conventional brick-and-mortar companies and discover stories of the most unusual phone calls Nick has received. We also delve into the concept of leveraging conversation, and how this platform allows Nick to step in when needed. Nick even shares his thoughts on the potential impact of AI on the future of cloud-based platforms, offering a peek into the future of the industry.
But the job of a broker isn't just about technology. There are unique dynamics that come with being a Michigan real estate broker. Learn about the challenges team leads face in checking their egos and how Nick introduces brokers to clients using the cloud-based platform. Get a glimpse of a possible hybrid real estate model and how common real estate transaction issues are addressed in the virtual world. So gear up for an enlightening conversation into the world of cloud-based brokerages with Nick Coppola and unravel the future of the real estate industry.
If you enjoy our content, please like, subscribe, and share. You can also catch the show LIVE @ facebook.com/freeforallfriday and make sure you stick around after for "the afterburner"
Imagine having a workspace set up with two monitors, a laptop, and a headset, communicating with agents all day long, aiming to help them close deals and achieve success. Welcome Nick Coppola, a Michigan-based broker who plays a pivotal role in a cloud-based company. Nick's typical day is anything but traditional as he juggles chats, emails, phone calls, and texts, all in the bid to support his agents. Backed by a team of support staff including agent service coordinators and settlement specialists, he's redefining what it means to be a broker in the digital age.
Ever wondered how a virtual brokerage operates? With Nick, we explore the exciting dynamics of working in a cloud-based enterprise. Hear about how this platform offers a faster service than conventional brick-and-mortar companies and discover stories of the most unusual phone calls Nick has received. We also delve into the concept of leveraging conversation, and how this platform allows Nick to step in when needed. Nick even shares his thoughts on the potential impact of AI on the future of cloud-based platforms, offering a peek into the future of the industry.
But the job of a broker isn't just about technology. There are unique dynamics that come with being a Michigan real estate broker. Learn about the challenges team leads face in checking their egos and how Nick introduces brokers to clients using the cloud-based platform. Get a glimpse of a possible hybrid real estate model and how common real estate transaction issues are addressed in the virtual world. So gear up for an enlightening conversation into the world of cloud-based brokerages with Nick Coppola and unravel the future of the real estate industry.
If you enjoy our content, please like, subscribe, and share. You can also catch the show LIVE @ facebook.com/freeforallfriday and make sure you stick around after for "the afterburner"
You're listening to the number one live Colin podcast for real estate agents and professionals all around the world. World-class guests, breaking news and you with your host, johnny, awesome and Jimmy, fantastic. You are on free for all Friday.
Speaker 2:Good morning Good morning Good morning, good morning everybody. This is Jimmy Fantastic.
Speaker 3:I am, but a special my creator deposit, deposit energy. I'm clicking way too many buttons at once and, jimmy, let it be known that I will live up my purpose to take free the changes to play to see stuff loose the place of my mediocrity and ask every person I meet why I have good when you can have awesome.
Speaker 2:They're buttons, buttons, buttons. That is Johnny buttons.
Speaker 3:Scrabbling last minute to try to get everything running as as we do normally on the show, but it's an important show for us. That's why I'm going to continue to scramble here, Jimmy, while you introduce our guest, which we are very excited to bring in today.
Speaker 2:Yes, sir. So we have Nick Coppola here, one of our brokers here in the state of Michigan, and we're happy to have you here this morning.
Speaker 4:Jimmy. Thank you, mr Awesome, thank you.
Speaker 3:Oh, mr Awesome, only my, only my Google assistant. That's fun. So we are. We are really excited to have you here, and I have to tell you and I hope that you take this in all like just I'm just going to start off with a banger. I guess I mean this with all due respect. Sure, you are so much cooler looking in person than in your photo. Well, thank you, I'm going to totally take that. Like in your photo. You look like that, totally serious, like I can like win any case broker.
Speaker 4:Yeah, like a broker lawyer, right, yeah, yeah, yeah which is cool.
Speaker 3:I see where they come. But in person, like, like you know, I think I don't know if we actually until the picnic I'm sure that we've spoke one or twice, once, one or twice Look at this guy who can speak for a living but until that picnic I don't think we ever actually like talk, talk. And I was like man, I know everybody thinks that you're so cool, Thank you, yeah, so I had a lot of fun.
Speaker 4:Thank you Appreciate that the picnic was great.
Speaker 3:I don't know if I can talk about that for a quick second. Yeah, it's all.
Speaker 4:free game One of the things with the XP we're trying to do more of is more of those IRL, in real life events, and that picnic is one of those things that we started last year. This was the second annual and it's just a great event, right when the agents get together, like as a community right, where you get to see your fellow agent. You're right, you know. Unfortunately, the one downside to the broker position is is that I don't get to meet. We have 2600 agents. I don't get to meet everybody in person, unfortunately, right, and I wish there was a way that I could. So, when we get to have those events, I love just doing that right, shaking hands, kissing babies.
Speaker 2:Well, you and I had the chance to meet at the regional event. Yes, we did United wholesale and again another EXP Like cool event, right, I mean I thought that that regional event was really cool, having the opportunity to get to reward agents and again get face to face with them and touch with them. So but, like that was one of my questions is as a broker for EXP, what's that Like? I'm the broker for a cloud-based company. Like I'm the broker for a cloud-based company. What is that even? How does that look?
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know it's funny because I do get asked that question and people are always like, well, what do you do all day?
Speaker 2:Right, I say my version of the law. By the way, we're already getting questions.
Speaker 3:And it's kind of the first question. So when you're done, that's we're already hitting on it.
Speaker 4:Yes, what do you do all day? Really not much. I mean, I'm kidding.
Speaker 4:I'm joking, I'm really joking, I don't do anything. Yeah, it's funny because if you could be the fly on the wall, literally, I have a five foot desk with, you know, two monitors and a laptop and a headset like this and my queue is full and I am literally communicating with agents all day long, whether it be on workplace chat in EXP world or email or actual phone calls. So what we've tried to do more of is as cool as EXP world is, and I encourage every EXP agent to use it. We're trying to meet agents where they are, not where we want them to be. So if an agent wants to communicate by phone, we communicate by phone. If they want email, it's email. If it's, you know, text, we can even do that now, which is pretty cool technology that we've added. So what I do all day is literally communicate and help agents Like my number one job function is to help our agents get their deals closed, help them be successful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because that was one of the questions. I'm like, man, I go. So there's 2600 agents here and there's you, christie and Kim right are our three brokers that we can go to. It's funny, even at the event, at the regional event, you guys, is that too like? Just give me a workplace chat. It's probably the fastest response you're going to get 100%, 100%.
Speaker 4:Then you had agents go.
Speaker 2:What's workplace? Chat True.
Speaker 4:Very, very true. They do that a lot. And then, look, I want to give credit to the rest of the staff. Right, there's three brokers, but we also have support staff as well. We have three what we call it, uh, agent service coordinators. We have three contract compliance specialists. We have three transaction settlement specialists. So we can't do it all. And if you think about the traditional brick and mortar broker which I was, prior to coming to EXP, I managed for another company, I had like a hundred and something agents, you're everything when you're that broker, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I mean you do it all, no matter what. You know, somebody has a commission problem, they they're coming to you. There's no toilet paper. They come to you. You know what I mean. I, you know it doesn't matter what it is, they come to you. Hey, there's no toilet paper. I'm like could you tell Susie at the front desk, do I really have to be the guy that has toilet paper? But here it's. It's very divide and conquer and the brokers handle broker specific things right. I may direct you where to go, but it's not Nick specifically handling that that particular task.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you don't need virtual toilet paper.
Speaker 4:No, no, virtual toilet paper.
Speaker 3:Although, although I mean, we do have a pirate ship.
Speaker 4:We do.
Speaker 3:That's the thing we have our first question in, and here's what it is. This is this comes from Carlo. So you're you know, carlo. He says what is your average response time when an agent reaches out to you for Carlo?
Speaker 4:specifically, carlo specifically. I just let it wait, wait, wait wait, wait.
Speaker 4:We try to answer every question within the same day, right, but what I would say to that is in a caveat to to agents is is that try to let us know if it's an emergency, Like we're not mind readers. If you have a closing in two hours and you need me immediately say in the workplace, yeah hey, urgent closing is at two and it's 1145. I need a call in, you know the next 10 seconds kind of thing, and we prioritize those. Think of all of it, like almost like an ER room, Like we triage what becomes the most important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and here's my question back to Carlo how many times do you have to call the broker?
Speaker 4:Oh, I talk to Carlo every day. Don't worry, Carlo. I remember my first week in the business too.
Speaker 3:You'll get over it one day.
Speaker 2:He's actually got over that hump right.
Speaker 3:He said he's still waiting for directions to the picnic last week.
Speaker 4:You know what, I don't remember getting that request.
Speaker 3:Carlo, I think there's a reason that you didn't get them. So you know, jimmy hit on it earlier, and it's one of the one of the crazy things that I guess we all kind of wonder too is so it's a, it's a virtual brokerage, which is not like a traditional right, and so because of that, things happen. I'm trying to think of which way I want to go. There's so many questions I have. What is the let's talking about? People calling in with questions or suggestions, like what's one of the craziest calls that you've fielded so far?
Speaker 4:So I had an agent.
Speaker 2:No names. We'll ask you the name after we're off here.
Speaker 4:So I had this is recently too, it was just a couple months ago had an agent call me and she was very distraught on the phone call and it was an urgent phone call and I'm hey, what's? You know what's going on? And she's like I was just in a house in Detroit with the landlord. You show me the place, we're going to list the property, we go down the basement stairs and as we're going down the basement stairs, one of the tenants is still there and they start yelling at each other. All of a sudden she's like I hear a gunshot and I literally ran up the stairs, ran out, got my car and I called you and I said call 911. Don't call me, call 911. This poor landlord could be bleeding to death right, we don't know for sure, right, Okay, okay, Call 911.
Speaker 4:Call me right back. She calls 911, calls me right back. The landlord got out of there and texted her and said you know I'm fine, I'm down the street. You know I called the police, but that one was kind of shocking, right.
Speaker 3:Like.
Speaker 4:I have to be honest with you. All my years of doing this, like never have I had that type of phone call. She was clearly shaken and she shouldn't be right, and I don't think the guy shot at him. I think he shot to scare him. Yeah, this is what happened, but that's one of the ones, yeah.
Speaker 3:I thought the landlord was calling to be like all right, you're good Come back.
Speaker 4:No, no, no, no, You'd think right.
Speaker 2:I don't know that. My first phone call would be to the broker.
Speaker 4:Sorry, I mean, that's why you asked what was the weirdest phone call. I even sounded shocked. Why are you calling me? What am I going to do?
Speaker 3:I'm virtual, see that Right, right right. I'm sorry I got nothing. Was that the like? Was that the way she had to go to a Starbucks. Log into the world online walk around.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Update this, right yeah update the world 20 minutes later, she got into you with a room.
Speaker 3:That's funny. So how is it working? So you, you know you were saying you came from brick and mortar into a virtual world and we'll talk a little bit about that too. But like, how is it going from that to, you know, sitting in a room with a little avatar and walking around and pirate ships and soccer and basketball, and I mean it's yeah, you know what I'm asking.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no, I know what you're asking. You know it's funny, because If I'm, if I look back on it, and you were to ask me this before I became a broker yeah, xp, I would have laughed at you and said this is stupid, like I'm not doing that. You know what I mean like.
Speaker 4:I don't play video games all day like this is ridiculous. My kid does that, you know. But now that I do it, I realize that the agents can actually get better Service with our platform than they can with brick and mortar. Because, if you think about it, when I was a brick and mortar broker, if I went out to lunch with Jimmy for two hours there was no one to service you, jimmy's pacing down the hallway waiting for me to come back because I'm out to lunch and he has an issue here.
Speaker 4:What happens is is it if Nick is in that platform and I'm on a call, I can click myself off? That lets Christie know, or Kim know, or the CCS is no, or anybody else know. Hey, I need to step in. So it literally gives you a much faster response time to the agent. Then it would if I was a brick and mortar, because, again, I'm doing everything at brick and mortar, so I I can't be everywhere and I can't do everything. It allows for. That leverage conversation is really what it does. So it it it creates a situation which I would have never thought of before I got there. How do I leverage myself as a broker?
Speaker 2:Hmm, I don't know if that makes sense, yeah, it does and it because you're right, it in the brick and mortar, like if you think you said, if you're out, you're out, like yeah, if you go on vacation, I don't know, there's yeah.
Speaker 4:I mean I might have another broker at one of the other offices, kind of fill in for me or somebody I don't know who that guy, but you don't know that guy, yeah, so you don't care about him, right?
Speaker 2:and then I'm really stuck. So, and one of the things I do I do want to like I Appreciate what you guys do is like when we get the email on Thursday, friday, that as your broker on call this weekend is yeah, right, or Christie or whoever's gonna be a call, so we get that email like, alright, here's your person for the weekend. If you're paying attention to your email, Well, yeah, and that's a whole thing.
Speaker 4:It's hard when you think about it, right, Like how do we communicate with 2600 agents? Yeah, right, and there's only so many channels, if you think about it right. Email workplace you know those kind of things, you know, maybe. You know maybe a text message system which they're checking on and stuff like that. But even that could get a little old to the agents might not like that. So you're right about that. But I would encourage all the agents that listen. You know, check workplace you know, keep that app on your phone. I know it sounds silly, but honestly we communicate a lot of stuff on there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you see my going.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean we do. So, let me, let me go back. Yeah, let me go back a second, just because one of the stigmas that that does exist around the brokerage is the virtual world place, and you even admitted yourself, like before, you're a broker. If you were looking at this, you'd be like, well, this is silly, this little place, right? Yeah, so like. But once you get in it, you started realizing, okay, it's still. I mean, it still might be a little silly. There's a pirate ship, right?
Speaker 4:Which is fun.
Speaker 3:But it's also something that I never, I never thought about before. The functionality behind it, oh outweighs, and the benefits outweighs other people's Stigmas about it. I guess, what would you say to somebody that still thinks that it's a silly little broker with a video game attached to it?
Speaker 4:You know it's. We get asked this question quite often and I will tell you that our people that are Recruiting and attracting agents and bringing them into the platform the best ones at it a Curt Shewell of the world, a go-go Bethke, you know, I mean people like this that are actually bringing a lot of people into our brokerage. They literally leverage that and bring them in for a tour. I can't tell you how many times she wells brought somebody in just to Introduce them to the brokers, like hey, man, I just want to show you how easy it is to get a hold of your broker. See what we did right here. You know, like we just came in here, I pulled the ticket, nick pulled us back here we're sitting here with a broker and it took, oh, all of about 60 seconds that I didn't even 180 seconds or whatever it is.
Speaker 4:So I that's what I would say to people. I'd say you're not realizing the tool, that you have to be able to leverage that tool in a different way.
Speaker 3:What, what? Oh man, I didn't even. I've never even thought about that. So so people are just like, hey, let me introduce myself to you, pull a ticket and you're just available Whenever, what, so, what? Okay, so what's the most Unutilized other than that? Because that's got to be what's the most unutilized thing that you think. That happens with exp and exp world.
Speaker 4:So there's probably two things that I would say that could be utilized more, and one is the world, just in general. But if you want to be more specific about that, look, if you have an accounting problem with you know your AR account or commissions or whatever you can literally pop into the world and go directly to accounting. You're not calling, you're not sitting on hold, you're not sending an email, you're not doing those things.
Speaker 4:You're not driving out of the you're not driving out of the office or any of that stuff. You literally can do that. They pull up your account, look at everything. So the menu system. You have to explore it. It's like all pieces of software, your phone, a computer program, whatever it is. You've got to look at everything, click on everything. You're not gonna break it right. So go to all the different places. Yeah, the pirate ship is cool and that's fun, but also go into the auditorium. The other thing that is widely Unutilized is the exp University.
Speaker 4:I mean we have so many successful agents that teach so much content it literally is almost overwhelming. But I would tell you I mean, if you're not expanding your knowledge, you're missing out. I mean we have people not just in Michigan but all over the country that you can literally access their content and what they're teaching. You want to know how to do a great open house? Believe me, it's there. You want to know how to geographically farm? Believe me when I tell you it's there, you just have to reach out and ask for it a little bit. Hmm.
Speaker 3:That's awesome. That's All right, I want to jump into. I want to jump into some of this because our whole audience is not exp. Yeah so I do have a but but fascinating being part of it not not again the pull the ticket to introduce the broker. It's something I would have never thought about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I mean working as close as I did with Kurt for so long. Yeah, I know that.
Speaker 3:I got a share. I'm gonna share my partnership story, though you want can I share. Can I share a story with you without getting in trouble? Okay, so Exp when it first launched didn't have the greatest security measures, right. So almost anybody could get an exp account and log in and he's sweating, he's already. So the two things that I did that were really fun. Now it's kw at the time, right, yeah. And so again we're all like what is this?
Speaker 3:And I remember logging in and I'm looking around and the first thing I saw was that that ship right. So I swim out to the ship and I know it sounds ridiculous to anybody, that's not exp, but I swim out to the ship and I get on and there's like 16 people on this thing and Somebody likes and I don't know who it was. I apologize if this is you, but but I get on there. And the guy that was talking I just went and stood next to him, right, I'm totally trolling this place and and I just remember he stopped talking and he's like Hi, johnny. And I was like hey, it's like this is a private meeting. And I said, no, this is a pirate ship. All right, everybody, let's go back to our room and I watched all these little people jump off the ship, swim away from it and then disappear.
Speaker 3:And then we went back and here's here's one of my I guess one of my questions I had written down here, and this goes back to my Keller Williams days. So it's 2016. I'm big into KW. Gary is on the stage. He tells us that we're no longer a training company, we're gonna be a technology company.
Speaker 3:Now, right, we go back after family reunion and we lost our first agent to exp and I remember the office was like what is this thing that's happening? Right, this is right before I got my login for it. And so we look everything up and I remember, like one of the one of like computer nerd guys, the accountant dude sat down and kind of was like all right, and he tore the whole structure apart and he said this model is not sustainable. And then he went to go and show us why. And to this day, I know that there's a lot of people out there still that don't believe that this model is sustainable. So I guess one of my questions would be like what do you say to that that person out there that doesn't really look in deep enough or thinks, for whatever reason, that this model is unsustainable.
Speaker 4:You know it's funny because I've heard that comment before. You know we've had that comment before. We probably don't get it as much as maybe you know someone who's agent attracting you know, on the broker floor we're more transactional based. But if you think about the history and the evolution of real estate and again look at, I'll be 33 years in September, right, that's how long I've been doing this. And when I first got in it in 90, remax was the new thing and Remax was in town and they were, like you know, recruiting the top tier agents and creating these offices that were set up like law firms, right, each agent paid a thousand bucks a month and rent and they shared an admin. Well, that's a law firm type setup, right, they share a paralegal together or whatever it is.
Speaker 4:And everybody said Remax won't last. That model's unsustainable. You know, thousand bucks a month from 20 agents, there's only 20 grand a month. Nobody's gonna make any money. Blah, blah, blah, blah. Guess what, guys? Even today, Remax is still around. I mean, it's still a model that's working in certain markets and different things like that.
Speaker 4:So I guess what I would say is anytime that you have something that's new and innovative and you know that's different from the norm, right, because it is different from the norm, right. I mean I think back even when Keller first got and I was a Keller guy for 15 years. Right, oh, it's unsustainable. You can't do a 70, 30 split with a cap, like no one will make any money. And same thing was said about Keller.
Speaker 4:Honestly, I take it with a grain of salt and that's what I do. I tell people those stories because those stories are history that prove that that just isn't true, because there's always gonna be a new model. There'll be another new model, believe it or not. That will spin off from EXP and people will say that's not sustainable. But when we talk about different brokerages it's never one size fits all. I mean, you probably still have friends at Keller and they love Keller and they'll probably never leave Keller. I still have friends that are at Remax that they'll never leave Remax, no matter how many times I tell them about Keller. They're just indoctrinated into that system and they're loyal to it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've got some friends at Keller and there's like, unless Keller actually goes completely out of business, that's the only way they're leaving 100% that's what I mean 100%.
Speaker 4:That's the only way they're getting out of it. Yep, yep. But I would say this to you we have to do a better job, right, and we do a great job. But I'm just saying, if we can't, if there's people out there that are saying to us, hey look, this isn't sustainable, then we're not conveying the model correctly, right, we have to do a better job of explaining how the model works and show them that it is, and we are doing that, our actions are showing that, but maybe we need to verbalize it a little bit more.
Speaker 3:Very interesting. That's good from a leadership's perspective, looking down and saying, all right, well, maybe it's our issue. Not the fact that other people are just making stuff up.
Speaker 4:You gotta coach up right, and that's part of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, so you've been a state broker with Michigan for how many years now?
Speaker 4:So it'll be two years. In November I came to EXP Okay.
Speaker 2:And so one of my questions is what were your initial thoughts and what are they not Like? What were your thoughts coming over and then did that? Is that what's in your mind still now, or has it changed?
Speaker 4:Sure, you know. It's funny because you only know what you know, right. You only know what you know Coming over. You know I'd been a broker in a brick and mortar location. I had been a productivity coach with KW. I'd been a mentor, I was on the ALC and I did all these things. I asked me to be team leader one time. I turned it down. I was too busy selling and I just had my daughter and so it was all those kind of things.
Speaker 4:But you think you're ready for the job, right? And when I went from Keller to another company and became a managing broker for them, I'm ready for the job. The truth of the matter was, is that I wasn't really totally ready for the job, right? You're learning as you go because you don't know what you don't know. You think you have the right skill set. So you always revert back to basics, which is am I good, you know? Am I emotionally intelligent? Do I make logical, pragmatic decisions, right? Do I know the baseline of what needs to happen? And then can I build on it from there and I tell agencies all the time you're never gonna know everything. Just focus on knowing the basics. If you've got those three basic qualities in it, then what's going to happen is is that you'll make logical, rational decisions that'll be prudent for your business and that's really what would have happened there.
Speaker 4:So, to answer your question, what I thought and now where I am, I wasn't ready. I mean, I thought I was. Did I have the experience on paper? Yeah, I'd been 30 years in the business, right, so of course it looks like I got it. I did hundreds of transactions, I did all these different positions. I just tried to draw on every little piece. But I'm thankful because if I and this might sound braggadocious, but I'm not trying to say that there's only three brokers in the state of Michigan at this particular moment in time that say that they've managed 2,600 agents, and I'm one of them, that's it. No one else has done it. The largest KW office isn't even close.
Speaker 2:Right right.
Speaker 4:So when I think about that, that's pretty awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it is cool. And again, 2,600 people is a lot of people. And as a team leader, it was like when we had the picnic over the last weekend. That was the first time I met Christie face to face, so it's kind of cool. But as a team leader, I always tried to filter this and then when you and I talked, you're like dude, why are you doing all that? Just call me yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Do you think that that's a? I have a theory about that and I just want to know if this is right, Because I talked to team leaders and large teams all over the state and for me they utilize their broker way different than we do here in Michigan. But Michigan, especially our area here in this area that we're in, always seem to be like odd, because you have more Megas in a short period of space than anywhere else and, of course, everybody has an office, which is weird because every other exp location, like they, don't do that. So do you think that that this is a Michigan thing where they don't utilize the broker as much? Like I know, teams don't even know who the broker is. They never reach out because they always go to the team. They're treating the team as if they're the broker and instead of leveraging the actual broker which would, by the way, especially if you're working with me, relieve a lot of stress you should totally do that.
Speaker 2:Well, we're going to make sure Nick contacted. It's out to our team that.
Speaker 3:I like the amount of times I tell agents that are doing teams you're not the broker. Leverage the actual broker for a lot of these questions. Yeah, You're not the broker, but yeah, do you think that this is a unique Michigan problem?
Speaker 4:I do. I know now from being involved with EXP and you talked about the differences of when I started versus now. This kind of goes back to that. You know I'm now exposed to brokers in other states, right, because we have meetings and we talk about different things and we mastermind different things. And so you're correct, it's here, one of the things that's really hard for team leads and I'm not picking on any particular team lead, right, I'm just saying it in general is and Kurt Shewell talks about this, I've heard him say this in different things You've got to check your ego at the door, and they have a really, really, really hard time checking the ego at the door and letting me play broker, because that's my job and you play team lead because they want to project themselves as everything to everyone, and it's almost like a knock on them if they can't answer the question, right, so they'd rather give bad advice than pass them over to somebody else, and I view it as like a you know, like a doctor, right.
Speaker 4:You go for a physical and you tell them, hey, my arm hurts this, that, whatever he doesn't chop your arm off right there and say, yep, I'll fix you right now. Well, we need to see a specialist. Let's send you for x-rays, let's do this, let's do that, right, and you're perfectly fine with that. And that doctor, he's a generalist, he's getting you to the right person, that specialist, right, and that's really what it's about. So when you need the broker for certain things, that's where we come in, as the specialist on certain topics.
Speaker 2:Mm yeah.
Speaker 4:So if I had a wish, I wish the team leads would check the egos at the door.
Speaker 2:So here's what I'll promise you. Johnny and I have checked the egos and everybody on our team is gonna call you.
Speaker 3:Please, please, go ahead and queue up the question there, jimmy.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So the question from Carlo again is how was it that Nick first became exposed to EXP, and what was it that actually made him want to try the concept?
Speaker 4:Great question. You know, it's pretty funny because when you look at your career and you do it a long time, you start looking at like, hey, what is the next phase? Not that I didn't enjoy selling as much and things like that, but it got a little stale sometimes. Right, you do it for 25 plus years and that's how I got into the managing broker role to begin with back in 2018. And then I was approached to manage another company another model quote unquote like an EXP that wanted to open in the state of Michigan and they were looking for a managing broker. And so they I wasn't the only person they approached, so I don't want to make it sound like Nick was so special I ended up on some recruiters radar because they needed to open the state and they said, hey, look, you know we need to do this, are you interested?
Speaker 4:So I did open the state for that brokerage. I was the designated managing broker for that brokerage. I spent about 90 days there and realized that it was an absolute train wreck. Right, they were trying to rip off the EXP model, tweak some things, but they had Nothing in place and Nick was just running around with his hair on fire. Not much of it, but what I had was on fire and I Was really struggling with the decision that I had made and I ended up talking to a friend of mine who's a broker down in South Carolina. He's a friend and a buddy and we talk every Friday morning at at 7 am. We didn't do it today because of this, sorry.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no, is he watching right now?
Speaker 4:Yeah, he told me he was going to. So Rick is a great guy and he's. He started out as accountability partner. Obviously, we became friends and we've been talking for four or five years every Friday and so I was talking to him about it. I go, man, I'm just, I'm struggling. I'm just, you know, I took this and I'm regretting my decision. And and he was like you know, you just go back and sell like what's the big deal? You know, like just go become an agent or look for another managing broker gig and stuff like that. And then, and somebody else that I know down in Florida said hey, have you thought about checking out exp? I mean, you'd probably be a great managing broker for exp and I think they're hiring another managing broker in Michigan.
Speaker 4:Oh, and so that was the, the connection and and this person wasn't even with exp at the at the time. Right, actually, I brought it meant after right, which is kind of funny, that it's awful circle stuff, right, the way it goes around, but it it's kind of funny. So that's how the the dots connected it's. I got exposed to a model that was a rip-off. What Kershi well says it all time once you see it, you can't unsee it, yeah, saw the value in it and said, man, I really need to be with the best player that has this type of not model, not the copycat right.
Speaker 3:You're not gonna tell through the copycat is no.
Speaker 2:Oh, but that's like again. That's what we're seeing too, though right Is, there's more than exp. Oh yeah, cloud-based broker goes, so that it's gonna happen and it is, and Everybody's gonna say, well, mines the best, mines the, but it's gonna happen. Of course, we know ours is the best, but yeah well, you know.
Speaker 3:What's interesting, though, is is it is For some, for some people. I'm gonna play the devil's advocate and go back to the beginning of the show, which I think Nick Was very smart about saying right, just like Keller came along was a model, and remax came around there. The other thing that's interesting is now the old dogs. They're all switching their models to try to keep up hundred percent, and are they? I don't know? I'm not getting into that discussion. You feel free if you want to. You can, though, at 313 644 for all, but it is interesting to watch how everybody's kind of running after the cloud-based model now, well, still trying to be brick-and-mortar, but at some point in time, like it's gonna be the Amazon Walmart thing, like it's gonna happen to everybody. I'm gonna get to that in a second, but before we do, kind of going off of this question about how you got exposed to exp and in your life, I wrote this down. I thought this was an interesting question, so I wrote this down. If your life was an analogy, what would it be? Mmm?
Speaker 4:That's a good one. Wow, if my, not, if my life was an analogy, whoo Well, I I'm gonna answer this, but I gotta actually think about it. But I will tell you this funny story while I'm kind of thinking about it just to stall.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I just told Jimmy this. The other day I was on a boat with a group of friends and we were talking about one famous person that you would trade places with if you could. Yes, okay, yeah, yeah, and you're gonna. You're gonna love who I picked, because I love who I picked. I Would trade places with Jimmy Buffett. Yeah, he's the greatest guy ever. He sings about booze, cheeseburgers, women, flip-flops, the sand beaches. I mean, like margaritas, margaritas, who has a cooler life than him?
Speaker 4:So there's that piece, if you want to know my analogy for life. It would be that. But in terms of a quote, wow, you know I I've always loved the very, very simple quote with with Henry Ford If you think you can or you think you can't, you're right. I've always loved that quote. You know, I was a guy that never really thought I couldn't.
Speaker 4:Hmm you know, I always think I can. I don't know if that's true, but I'm also not afraid to just try. You know, I don't. I Don't. Failure doesn't totally get me down and and, quite honestly, one of the times that it really did was that three months Stent, where I I jumped ship, opened the state of Michigan for that brokerage and thought, man, what did I do? Like I had a cool life, you know what I mean. Like I'm, you know my wife's, like you should be on the boat more. Like why are you stressing out over this stuff? You know that he kind of thing, the other genius of a cloud-based brokerage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you could totally be on the boat.
Speaker 3:They wouldn't know, because you're wearing pants in the world. I'm wearing pants.
Speaker 2:In the world.
Speaker 4:You know I love that quote. I don't know if that's answering your question a hundred percent but that's the one that I resonate with constantly, and it's not some profound Tony Robbins quote or anything like that, it's just and I'm a huge Henry Ford fan. I thought the guy was just Wiredly brilliant. You know, I read biographies on him and stuff like that. I just just a smart sob, you know.
Speaker 3:If you really think about it, you know what's the one thing that you admire most about them?
Speaker 4:tenacity and and that's why I love that particular quote like he, he did not back down from Anything, it didn't matter what it was, he had tenacity.
Speaker 2:I mean, he just didn't back down and I think it's funny because the creation of the assembly line right, like we've, we've put that in so many pieces of business now percent, like even in real estate, all right, like all right, we got your salesperson, they got transaction coordinator, then you got your closing coordinator, then you got you know what I mean. So it's like all these people are taking care of their specific things because it's that back to that leverage Bees. Hundred percent, it's back to leverage Bees. How can I get more time back in my day? The Austin Chevron? How can I get more time back in my day? What am I leveraging my time for my money? 100% right, and I think that's one of the biggest things and we see it so many places now and I even in, like I said, in real estate.
Speaker 4:I would agree a hundred percent. I mean, when you think about what he did and I know we're getting sidetracked here with that but it is the leverage piece, because People always go, oh he invented the automobile. No, he didn't. He could have cared less about inventing the automobile. He let some guy in France do that, or Germany or wherever it was. He invented the assembly line, which was far more, a Much greater invention than the automobile was. So he really invented the best piece, because his piece now is integrated into everyday life in a million different things that we do, so that you asked me why I'm a fan of his. Because of that right.
Speaker 2:Well, it goes back to what we were talking about, too with brokerages right, there's always gonna be the copycat, sure, and there's gonna be somebody that comes along and says my idea is better, 100%, and and again we're seeing it with cloud based, there's other cloud based companies. Now it's coming, it's it's coming down the line, and I think one of the things that Kurt leans on this you know, talks about this all the time too is like the. The cloud based companies are where everybody's going.
Speaker 2:Couldn't agree right like that's just technology, that's where we're going, I mean, with the advancements in AI and all the things that are happening in our world right now. It's like well, how are you not just doing everything on your computer, johnny? You do. That's Johnny's like. Why doesn't everybody's do everything on their computer?
Speaker 3:when. So I used to work for the blue circle company, right, who I believe is one of the three that you're talking about, and I remember when I, when I started there, there was I hate paperwork, so being cloud based for me is like the best thing ever and I was always against it. Back then, you used to be able to get that green certification, and the only reason I even went to get that was so that I could go to my broker and be like, hey, as I'm green certified and so I can't really do paper, but I have a tablet. At the time, people could sign directly on right, like I'd rather do that.
Speaker 3:And this is a time when, you know, it's like 2010, 2011 we had two computers in our office. We had just gotten Wi-Fi right for all the agents, because they were always behind time. Yeah, and so it was. It was something. And so come me coming in there and finding that designation as an excuse because paperwork and you know it's really fun, because technology. You know real estate agents we have. We have a lot of similarities and when you group us all together, paperwork and keeping track where everything is is one of the things that we don't do the best, we're correct.
Speaker 3:So if we can do that virtually, where we can submit stuff and it's just always there, it really it really helps and that was something that I learned on really early on. But you, I got a really interesting question for you based on what you just answered from Jimmy there about About us being cloud-based. Do you see any of these big brick and like can you see a day where Keller Williams says you know what? We're going all cloud-based, or any of these other big guys, or do you think they're stuck in their ways?
Speaker 4:you know One of the things. It's funny because I actually had this conversation Similar with somebody else and they asked me hey, like where do you think this is going? Like, what's your opinion? I don't think it's a hundred percent one way or the other. And we touched on this earlier because you said, hey, we're in southeastern Michigan and you know we have all these offices. Yeah, so even though we're a virtual cloud-based brokerage, we have team leads that are like I need brick and mortar, I need an office, I need an office. I Ultimately see this. This is Nick's opinion.
Speaker 2:Let me preface it by saying that you are the master of your own opinion.
Speaker 4:Yes, I am the man. I'm a legend in my own mind.
Speaker 4:So I am definitely like so my opinion is is that it's somewhere in the middle, because, again, remember, it's not one size fits all. So the beauty of our particular model is is that we allow for that 100% cloud base. If you want to work off your boat, we could care less, go right ahead. But if you also have the the stones to open up a brick and mortar shop somewhere, we're gonna work with you to do that as well. So I think there's a middle ground there. I don't think it's gonna be a hundred percent one way or a hundred percent the other way, because you've got Human personality is involved in it, right, and not everybody is gonna feel as comfortable Just cloud based, or not everyone is gonna feel as comfortable Just brick and mortar base, and I think it's one of the things that it allows us to do is, again, we keep talking about leverage. It keeps coming up. It keeps coming up EXP. That model allows us to do both, and that's I said earlier too.
Speaker 4:We're gonna meet agents where they are. You want to communicate by phone? I'll call you. You want to do workplace chat? Great. You want to send me an email? No problem. And you want to come into the world and be an avatar with me. Great love to have you there. Right, if you want to go to the pirate ship will go. So that's that. Hopefully that answers your question. I think it's gonna be a combination of both.
Speaker 3:Do you think that there's any of the big? Well, I mean, we are the big now, but do you think that there's any moves that one of the big, you know brick and mortars could make when if they, if they brought this piece on that, it would be like oh, oh, or are we too far ahead?
Speaker 4:the only. Again, merely an opinion.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I'm saying, yeah, the only one that I personally see in my opinion that that it potentially could make that kind of a shift a little bit is Keller.
Speaker 4:Yeah just just because of their size and scope, and if you think about what I'm proposing and saying that it's gonna be a hybrid of both, I Think that they've got that brick and mortar network set up, yeah, so if they could overlay it with some sort of virtual platform, they may have a shot right to. I don't, I don't think they're gonna stop us. Quote unquote. That's not what I'm saying. They would have a shot to compete because you still have a large contingency of people. And look, 15 years at Keller. I have an affinity for that.
Speaker 4:I learned a ton in the Keller system. I crafted my skill set in the Keller system, like, I'm so glad that I went there when I did, because it gave me a skill set that, honestly, I wouldn't have if I didn't. If that makes sense. So they're the ones I think could do it. The problem they have, though, is is that they can't emulate our stock unless they decided to go public, and Gary's got too big of an ego for that. I don't know if they could emulate any revenue share, because it's profit share model.
Speaker 3:I mean, that's a completely different Well, then with the brokers, what are you doing?
Speaker 4:They're all franchisees, yeah so I don't know how they could pull that off. The only part they could pull off is here's a virtual world that you could get into. Potentially, That'd take a lot of money and we're way ahead of them.
Speaker 2:Well, that, and then the KW command is working so well.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, it's beautiful.
Speaker 2:But you know, the funny thing is, all three of us were at Keller at some point and we were all productivity coaches. Yeah, yeah, funny, but no, and again it's, again it's. There's a I think to your point, there's a model for everybody, 100%. You know what I mean. And Keller's stuff is fantastic. I mean they're training material, but now, diana, and those moves are all being made too right. So you know the K cause. Johnny, you were a KW maps coach.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I mean their stuff is great, it's.
Speaker 3:I had access to the yeah, the entire catalog. But you know it's it's it's it's different because you know I've told people this a lot. You know I was also like you. We could family reunions, like you know I was. There's no way that I never leave, leave Keller Williams, and it was because of the camaraderie that you had, the, the friendships that you had with one another, the coworkers, and we'd go out and celebrate. But it's really interesting and I don't know.
Speaker 3:I don't know exactly how EXP pulled this off, but it went from the camaraderie of friendships and coworkers to EXP, as we're family and it really does. And people say that at Keller too, and I get that. They're in their niches and some of them might feel like that, but for the majority of everybody I've never talked to a switched over to here we all resonate with that it's just a completely different. It's just a completely different feeling. You know, like going to family reunion is really cool and it's, it's good for instant and, like I said, it's like you're hanging out. You go into a party with a bunch of friends and you know you guys are out of that. You know, go into the club and watching Gary play bass, which is fun, really is fun.
Speaker 3:However, you go to an EXP event or even one of the private events that, like, brent Grove puts on, or even like the picnic where you get a chance to you know, see Justin Ford, and you get a hug from these guys and it's like a wow, it's been a while but we missed you. And like it's, it's real family feel, like the family barbecue that you're going to and it's even. It's it's a little bit like not as produced either. You know which I even I even like like it. Like I said, it's more a family barbecue, backyard, all, let's all get together and bring our own stuff, and I don't know. It's just a different feel.
Speaker 4:Well, truth of the matter is on the picnic. It really was okay. Hey, us brokers and teams sitting down and saying what do we do for the picnic, you know okay? Well, blah, blah, blah. And the taco truck that's one of our agents.
Speaker 2:Oh, no kidding. Yeah, that was great, by the way. Yeah, fantastic.
Speaker 4:Ricardo is one of our agents out of the Lansing area. I mean, we hired him because he's one of our agents. That's exactly what we said. We go well, hey, agents aren't just agents. A lot of times they have other businesses and they do other things and their husband does something or their wife does something. Who can we get? Well, we figured out that Ricardo had a taco truck and we were like hey, do you want to do this? You know, I mean, and we're going to pay you. Like, we didn't ask for freebie and none of that, he got paid for doing it. But that's what we tried to do, so it wasn't like some big produce, right, right, you know what I mean? It was just supposed to be to get people together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was it Now next year. So you know for next year. Now you know, randy owns ice cream trucks.
Speaker 4:That I heard, so he's on. It's so funny. You told me that I'm like next year we're getting Randy involved. We need an ice cream truck.
Speaker 3:You know I just want to throw this out. Yeah, Because I know you probably heard this too, but somebody's got to own a bar.
Speaker 4:Yeah, somebody has to own a bar. If you own a bar and you're an agent with EXP, call me. They weren't putting a lot on you.
Speaker 2:All our agents are going to call you your bar owners.
Speaker 4:You guys ever seen the show? Hi, I met your mother.
Speaker 3:I saw a clip online once, but it wasn't the real show. It was a lady fell forward. Did you see this as a meme on on on line? This lady falls forward and goes to. There's a guy standing in front of her and she goes to try to grab herself because she's falling over and she pulls his pants completely down and he falls backwards into a pool and then at the end of it it says this is how you explain it. Got it, got it.
Speaker 4:That's the only version I've ever seen. The only reason I brought it up is there's an episode that that they're drunk and they're at the bar and they're like we should open a bar, and I think every drunk guy has said that.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, yeah we should open a bar.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean. That's what it reminded me of.
Speaker 3:That's funny. Al jumps in, he says that you're, you are always there, of course. His signature Al, always with.
Speaker 4:Al ways, you're always there.
Speaker 3:When you need them. Great broker for our brokerage. Thank you.
Speaker 4:Al.
Speaker 3:Let me open this up and ask an industry wide question. Sure, what do you think are some of the biggest challenges that real estate agents are going to be facing in the next couple of years?
Speaker 4:That's a great question. The best way for me to answer that question is to tell you the majority of the issues that we see on the broker team, because I can actually pinpoint it down to about three different issues. And here's what I would say to agents If you can find a way to become more proficient at certain things, your life gets easier. Here's what they are, and we do training on this constantly. I can recite the speech. I've been saying it for 25 plus years in my sleep. My wife calls me a broken record. My kids can recite this.
Speaker 4:Okay, one you've got to do a better job of explaining earnest money deposits to people. Okay, interesting, because here's the thing, guys EMD disputes are between a buyer and a seller and there's only three ways to get the thing released Successful closing, fully ratified mutual release, interpedence of a court. I don't care how many times you call the broker, I can do nothing for you and you can do nothing as an agent. So if you do a better job of explaining that upfront to a seller and a buyer, I don't care what side of the equation you're on. Okay, that's number one. You've got to do a better job with that.
Speaker 4:Number two is that you have to do a better job explaining buyer agency, because with the DOJ ruling guess what guys? You're not getting the commission from the seller anymore. You have got to get on board with that. If you need training on that, maybe take ABR. Get ABR certified. If you're going to play in the buyer agency game, you got to be able to show your worth and your value and be able to get them to understand that they're paying you, the commission. That is going to change. We're already seeing it and it's coming and you fast forward. A year or two later it's going to be even more so Very interesting.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 4:The next one I would say to you is is that you've got occupancy issues, damage deposits, things like that. And here's what I would say to all agents, and I say it constantly right, Stop drafting language, Stop. This is what happens with agents. They grab a blank addendum and the first thing they do is start writing, and I'm here to tell you. You write like crap. Okay, Use AI.
Speaker 4:An occupancy addendum isn't just buyer agency. Buyer agrees to give seller 60 days worth of free occupancy. You've covered nothing in there. You've put your seller at risk. You've put your buyer at risk. Who's paying in case there's a fire? The insurance? Who's holding the insurance? Is there a damage deposit? How does it get released? What's a holdover provision? If the seller tells you to pound sand and doesn't get out in 60 days, it's and guess what? We as brokers, again buyer seller dispute, right, we can do nothing to help you get that released. And here's the last piece of it that agents need to understand that they really, truly don't. I don't care if you have the best lawyer on the planet drafting the best contract on the planet. The only enforcement mechanism for a contract is the court system. Doesn't matter, because I have agents come in all the time. Well, you know what? Next time, I want an addendum that locks down this and locks down that and, da-da-da-da-da, I want to write a better. Okay, great. How do you enforce it?
Speaker 2:You gotta record.
Speaker 4:What's the enforcement mechanism? Yeah, and even arbitration has to be agreed to, right, by all parties. You can't have one party agree to arbitration and the other party tells you to go pound sand. You have no binding arbitration clause at that point, right? And this is contract law stuff, right? So what I'm trying to say to agencies is stop drafting. And here's why you're creating a defensible position for yourself when you don't draft.
Speaker 4:Because if you're deposed in a lawsuit at some point in time and you pulled out an occupancy addendum that was written by your board and a lawyer says did you draft this document? No, sir, I did not. Oh, you didn't prepare this document? No, I filled in the blanks. But look at the bottom it says you know, michigan Association of Realtors or Greater Metropolitan Association of Realtors, get away from blank addendums. Your first go to should be a document with blanks that you fill in and then, if you have to draft something from scratch, come and see the brokers. Don't just do it. Add lib, yeah, on the fly, because you're bad at it, right? It's like oh, I'm not an attorney, but I play one on Thursday night on television. Really, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3:Like yeah, I just got off of the pirate ship. I'm going to try.
Speaker 2:I think that the big thing is the knowing, the importance of your broker. And again I think to Johnny's point, to like in this area, in our metropolitan area, like your team leader is not your broker, correct, you know what I mean? And I think that so many agents get used to that that, well, I'm just going to go see my team leader. And then, and then to your point too, nick, is the team leaders like oh, just write this in an addendum. And the team leader writes the addendum and then makes it even worse because then the team leaders are right in the addendum 100%, that's, I'll tell you.
Speaker 3:I that is a surprise. Those those things that you just pointed out, nowhere near where I thought you're going to go?
Speaker 4:Where did you think I was going?
Speaker 3:to. I had no clue but to go down the addendum route, cause I'll tell you. I'll tell you right now, my favorite addendum is the blank addendum, not because I write good, but cause I write crazy stuff in there. That's where I write the lawn care thing, or one time staying glass, or the you shouldn't. I had my mom sign a blank addendum stating that she shouldn't use me as her agent because I wanted to make sure that a family came down later on which happened and said why forced her to buy that. I was like no, I'm telling you not to use me, and by using me you're stupid and I like the one time you got to call your mom an idiot and she still used me.
Speaker 3:So when, when I was accused of that, I pulled that out and I uh-uh, there's like three paragraphs of how not to use me and she was choosing to herself. But that's that's a very interesting so. So you think that that's going to be one of the continue to be an issue going forward, and the other thing is the DOJ thing in the next couple of years that's going to be a huge shoot. We should we got to read, we should redo the show, jimmy, johnny we talked about that two years ago.
Speaker 3:Two, two, three years ago.
Speaker 4:I'll make this offer right. I'm inviting myself, but if you guys would love to do another episode, we could come back and just circle around that. You could probably spend a whole hour.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I'll be honest with you guys. Yeah, and if you, guys want me to.
Speaker 4:I'm totally it.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, 100%, 100%. So let me ask you this, cause we only got a few minutes left and I want to jump this in on the end. So off the same question what do you think is going to be the biggest challenges coming up for EXP as a brokerage in the future?
Speaker 4:So I think what's going to be a little more of a challenge for us going forward is is that we're continuing to grow right, and as you continue to grow, you have some growing pains and that takes patience and unfortunately, sometimes in our industry let's face it, agents, brokers, whoever we don't always have the most patience right. Let's be honest, we have the patience of a nat. That's what we have. Welcome to real estate.
Speaker 4:Yeah, welcome to real estate. So I think that is going to continue to be a challenge for us. We need all of us to have a little more patience with this stuff. We're building this thing as we're growing. We're changing things constantly and that's one of the things I love about EXP they're not stuck with. Well, we've always done it this way, so we're always going to do it this way. You're familiar with a brokerage that did that. Right, they won't change anything because they've always done it this way. When EXP doesn't do that, they allow us to make these changes on the fly and say, look, there's a better way, this really isn't working, can we try something else? And they're willing to do those shifts. But with those shifts comes uncomfortableness sometimes right, and people get a little upset with that. So if we can smooth out those bumps, I think that might be a challenge for us and a broker team I can tell you. Sometimes that's a challenge for us, but it's not something we can't work around.
Speaker 3:I love it. I love it. That's great. That's again somewhere different than where I thought we were going to go, but it's a perfect way to end the show. It is so, hey, at the end of the day, your broker's your broker, call your broker. And number two, especially if you own a bar, call this broker. Those are, those are our two closing points. Hey, everybody, thank you for listening. We do an afterburn afterwards. I keep seeing you. Well, look at your clock. Are you going to stick?
Speaker 3:around Cool so again, if you're listening to us after the fact, make sure you join us live afterwards. There's always an afterburner. It's live only streaming Facebook and on YouTube, soon to be Twitch so keep us stay tuned for that. Jimmy, you've been fantastic. Johnny, you've been awesome. Thank you very much to our guests and we'll talk to all of you next Friday.