Episode 2: National Alliance on Mental Illness

The National Alliance on Mental Illness | Seattle's mission is to address the unmet mental health needs within our community through support, referral, education, and outreach. They are working to create a world where all those impacted by mental illness know they are not alone, and are empowered to live a fulfilling life. 

Jeremiah Bainbridge, Development Manager, joins Miking Change to discuss the stigma around mental illness. A mental health activist, Jeremiah brings a lived experience to the topic and gives listeners a vivid picture of what its like to navigate both the health care system and the justice system with mental illness. 

Transcript

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 0:00

People with a mental illness are 16 times more likely to be shot and killed by a police officer than the average population. So there are a lot of what else people with mental illness that goes untreated often live 20 to 30 years below the average life expectancy. So there are a lot of determinants that mental illness is the origin of it's not a byproduct. It's not a personal weakness. It's nothing like that. It develops and then these negative determinants tend to come.

Jesse: 0:42

Hi Changemaker. My name is Jesse Colman, and you're listening to making change podcasts that puts a microphone to the stories that matter. Today I'm joined by Jeremiah Bainbridge, the development manager for National Alliance of mental illness Seattle NAMI Seattle's mission is to address the unmet mental health needs within the Seattle community through support, referral, education and outreach. Namie envisions a world where all those impacted by mental illness know they are not alone, and are empowered to live a fulfilling life. Jeremiah is a fundraiser and a mental health activists who first joined NAMI Seattle as a board member serving on their philanthropy and Policy Committee. Before joining Namie he was a volunteer grant writer for life designs and a networking assistance for New Leaf New Life in anti recidivism organization supporting formerly incarcerated persons. Hi, Jeremiah, how are you doing today?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 1:38

I'm doing well. Thank you. How are you?

Jesse: 1:41

I'm doing great. You mentioned in your email that you've had some of your own personal experiences with mental illness. Would you mind talking about that?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 1:51

Sure. Shortly after I was a teen, I had a diagnosis of what at the time was major depressive disorder. And then later re diagnosed as having type two bipolar disorder, which is usually long stretches of depression and intermittent episodes of what's called hypomania, where you're not completely unaware of your surroundings, but inhibitions really dropped. I tend to get agitated, things like that. It's led to some pretty serious consequences for me, both with the legal system and with an involuntary hospitalization. So it's really I've been very lucky that I haven't been caught in either the medical or justice system and couldn't seem to get out. But it's given me a lot of insight into exactly kind of how people with mental illness are treated by our institutions. And so that's kind of fueled my desire to be a mental health advocate was my own personal experience through those sorts of predicaments.

Jesse: 3:04

Yeah, and how are people with mental illness treated?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 3:08

And I can tell you that in jail, it is not well, I actually had the guards who were supposed to be watching me for suicide watch, tell me to kill myself. So the jail environment is terrible for people with mental health conditions. They tend to be warehouse together. And it's just not it's not a very good environment for anyone, let alone someone who's experiencing a mental health crisis. And the hospital that I visited that institution largely suffered from a lack of compassion, which I think was brought about by a lack of staff. The psychiatrist only came one day a week social workers were also there I think one day a week and the other times there are a lot of restraints used a lot of threats of restraint so our mental health institutions as I've experienced them have been very very atrocious towards people who have a mental health condition

Jesse: 4:16

Yeah, wow. What What is that experience those experiences like I mean, I I'm just having it blows my mind I have not never gone through something like that. And I myself have have major depressive disorder and and manage my anxiety and and I know how much it's impacted. The people I love and and I'm just wondering, how you manage that and what you you've gone through with that If you're if you're willing to share,

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 5:02

yeah, it's, it was a very difficult thing to manage for some time, there was a lot of anger, a lot of resentment, especially towards the institutions I'd been through. But I was very fortunate in that I have very loving, supportive family and very loving, supportive friends. And they really helped me to kind of validate my feelings without engaging in any destructive behavior. You know, I had psychiatrists telling me, I deserve to be in jail and things like that. So for a little while, the professional world wasn't really my friend. And so it was really my peer group that kind of helped me get along and decide to keep going with life, even though things seemed, seemed really dark for a while.

Jesse: 5:52

Yeah, right. And so then you you got involved with Namie, Seattle. What's Namie Seattle,

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 6:03

I did. So I started working with Naomi Seattle, which is the National Alliance on Mental Illness and worth a local chapter here in Seattle area in the Ballard neighborhood. And a lot of what we do is to fight stigma of mental illness. And that was very important to me, because I felt like when I was growing up, I didn't get a lot of recognition or was kind of had my symptoms, and my illness kind of dismissed even by close friends and others that I knew. So I knew I kind of wanted to get involved in an advocacy group that would stand up for people who had mental health conditions. And so I first started working with them on an open public policy committee, kind of discussing mental health care law, we largely discussed kind of the nature of involuntary commitment, which is a really complex issue. And later on, in 2018, I joined their board of directors, we heavily recruit people who have experience with mental illness, either through your loved one or through themselves. And so I did that work. And then in 2019, the organization needed the development manager, and I'd been looking to make a career change. And so then I moved from the board to full time employee and I have been working as the development manager since 2019. In February,

Jesse: 7:40

right on, what a time to start. Especially when we're talking about mental illness, you know, like it's, I've heard people describe this past year and a half as they're really three pandemics going on. One being COVID-19. One being a racial reckoning that has been long overdue, and and the other being mental illness, and how it's just exasperated mental health and put pressure on it. So I mean, how, how is what are some of the unmet mental health needs with in our community here in Seattle.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 8:33

So there are quite a few. one complaint that you'll hear from parents and peers, which is another word we use for people with lived experience is that when getting out of a hospital after hospitalization for a mental health crisis, there are no services available or, or the services might take six weeks before they are available, or sometimes even longer. This usually means that someone relapses and winds up right back in the hospital. So this is a huge gap. One of the things we try to do is connect people with like Medicare specific mental health clinics, or try to get them connected to the housing essential needs program or what limited permanent supportive housing we do have in Seattle. Anything we can really do to try to get people services quickly in a continuum. And that's a big thing that we do with our resource line as we try to make sure that people have the services they need when they need them. It's very difficult because we are underserved. But we do our best to be able to do that. Another major need you you mentioned two other things and they're both really connected to mental health. One with the racial reckoning. Something that's become very clear is that mental health conversations are different in different cultures. And also there is a real lack of cultural competence in our medical systems, we've seen that there's still aspects of white supremacy built into our medical system, or white privilege, or other aspects like that. And so you know, when we really look at where mental health support is for this revisiting of trauma that keeps happening, especially in the African American community, we just, we don't have the mental health services that are trustworthy to them, because of previous abuses of the medical system, against African Americans especially. And then lastly, what we see with COVID, especially is evident in the youth community. And one of the other problems we have is just not having enough social workers or therapists in our schools. These are not luxury services, this is something that every school really needs. And I think that this pandemic has really pointed out how essential and necessary having good mental health in schools for young people is.

Jesse: 11:17

Right? Yeah. And you mentioned, you know, white supremacy within our medical system and a lack of trust within the black and African American communities, what what does the mental health system need to do? What kind of reform needs to happen to where we can, you know, pull out white supremacy and have a system that is, is doing what you know, what we really wanted to do, which is, is be a healthy service for for people suffering?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 11:55

Sure, there are two things that come to mind right away. One is we just need to be hiring and supporting the growth and education of more people of color and our medical system. It simply opens up doors, one of the support groups that we are doing in combination with Nami, South King County, is bipoc support group, which gives people a space where race is not something that is a barrier that has to be communicated through, it's just known to be in the room. And that opens up a certain amount of communication. So having providers and support groups that really represent the diverse population we have in Seattle helps a lot. And then another aspect that I think is especially true for both mental illness and the crossover with and addition of African Americans is what we see with a high level of violence that includes people with mental health conditions. And then when you take into account the high level of police violence against the African American community, you have a kind of a double bind, because now, right now, the only real first response that we have is the police for a mental health condition. And for any community that's been traumatized by the police, they're simply not going to use that service. And so that means there's a massive gap in the ability to respond to people with a mental health crisis, because people just won't call. And that's, that's really difficult. It's one of the reasons we need a different approach to decriminalize mental illness and to be able to, you know, get people to feel comfortable to call and know, they'll get a compassionate response if someone's in crisis.

Jesse: 13:55

Right. And that really goes into policing and police reform and our approach to policing. I wonder if you have any recommendations there, what we can do to be more when people have like a mental health crisis coming in there. There's not someone with guns drawn.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 14:16

So there are a lot of different models, most of them do still involve law enforcement in some way. And that's kind of a mixed subject. because on one hand, we don't necessarily, you know, you don't need a badge and a gun to respond to 99% of mental health crises. But also police are simply the most likely to encounter someone having a crisis in a public space. So that's kind of the trick is, how do we do this handoff? How do we make sure that police can identify a mental health crisis but then get the right people in place, because police generally don't want to be handling mental health crises either. It's not their primary training. So it's a matter of getting the right tools in the right place. Some models I've seen, we hear about CIT a lot, and Seattle and other places for police, which a lot of people think it stands for crisis intervention training. That's not true. It stands for Crisis Intervention Team. And the essential aspect of this is that police responding have a co responder with them with an equal amount of power, an equal amount of ability to make decisions and who are in charge when it's a medical situation like a mental health crisis, so that they can take over, we've seen different programs that have emphasize this, there's the kahootz program, which is a cop's helping out on the streets. That's in Eugene, Oregon. That involves a homeless response, including a crisis van, a mental health professional, and often as well appear responder, which is someone with lived experience with mental illness who's been trained to try to help this response. And then there's also the lead programs, which are law enforcement assisted diversion. And those are interesting because it does involve police, a social worker, and a mental health professional. And it also involves the legal system, where there can actually be a measure of say someone had 15 arrests last year, because of disorderly conduct property destruction, something like that. And then in the following year, they move down to like two arrests for very minor things that gives the legal system some leeway to be able to say, this is notable improvement, we don't need to pursue these two tiny charges. So there are methods out there that are being tested, most of them still do rely fairly heavily on police in one way or another. But as I said, until we can kind of figure out a way to have a good first response system that doesn't involve police at all, which will involve our dispatch system. That's going to be tricky. One of the exciting things is the 988 number is rolling out, which is going to be your universal number to get a mental health crisis response. And here in Washington State, one of the big things we're pushing for is to have it fully funded so that we can actually divert people to the right to the right help.

Jesse: 17:25

This is in place of 911. If there's like, you know, some unruly behavior or something happening in the streets where it makes people nervous, or what are we?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 17:38

Yeah, so the 988 number should be your universal call for mental health crisis. The problem is, if we don't find the services, then one of the things they're going to do is tell you to go and call 911. We want to avoid that. We want to make sure they have proper resources. So it's going to help was a suicide helpline can get you to getting the right resources for a response. But exactly what it's going to look like depends state to state. And so in Washington, we do have a push for a very robust 988 system that involves much more than just the phones and the operators. So we are really kind of pushing to make sure that we have a good robust mental health response system. But it's a federal law. It was passed, I believe unanimously. So it's a good start, and really differentiating between mental illness and public safety.

Jesse: 18:44

Absolutely, yeah. And so how can people in that are like living in their in, let's say, Washington state because we both live there. Here? How can we encourage the state to put funding behind this looking? What can people do,

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 19:01

you can write your senators, you can also go to the Nami Washington web page. Nami, Washington is the overseeing branch of our organization that helps, especially with policy, and you can read up on what the what their proposals are from there. But the big thing that you can do, especially if you want to advocate for mental health is find out who your state representatives are, and write them and tell them that you want to see a robust response system attached to 988. You should be able to find other groups, Nami Seattle doesn't have a specific letter of support. But there are a lot of great resources out there to learn how to write a letter of support to your senator and or your state representative and just asked for a really robust system.

Jesse: 19:52

Great. That's amazing. I'm really excited for that program. Why do you think there there's this stigma around mental illness.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 20:07

There are so many different answers that are available for that. It can, you know, mental illness has been criminalized, hidden away or otherwise treated with a lot of contempt in Western society for a very long time. But there are some things about it. One is that simply the symptoms of mental illness make people uncomfortable. psychosis is a very, very severe symptom. And it can be scary on the outside, it's terrifying for the person experiencing it as well, in most cases, but some of it's just fear of the unknown. Some of it is Western medicines, desire to cure everything. And mental illness is not something that's really curable, it's treatable. You know, you can live a healthy and productive and fulfilling life with any mental health condition, whether it's depression or schizophrenia, all these things are recoverable. But the fact that we can't really cure it, I think, I think adds some stigma to the scenario because it puts in that idea culturally, that these people don't get better, they are a certain way. And then I think Lastly, it just comes down to some of our modern sense of productivity, you know, the idea that people with mental illness don't produce. There's a certain stigma in our country about about work, and people with mental illness do and can work. 90% of people with severe mental illness want to have a job? It's just a question of whether or not we're actually making a space for them to do so. And I think the fact that we haven't shows that that stigma is still there of not wanting to include people to us closely.

Jesse: 22:10

How can we make spaces in the workplace? What are different, like action steps that companies and organizations can take to help make spaces?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 22:20

Sure, so we do some worksite trainings on making spaces in mental for mental health care. And a lot of it comes from a management level. how you approach someone who's struggling with their mental health is the difference between them opening up and finding solutions versus just making someone feel more bullied. There are three things that the World Health Organization specifically states as detrimental to mental health, whether you have a pre existing condition or not. And oppressive workload is one that hurts your mental health, lack of clear direction, that hurts your mental health and any kind of bullying or mobbing by your co workers or boss, that hurts your mental health. So a lot of what we do is train managers to check in on yourself and your own mental health before addressing someone who's struggling with there's because there is a certain mindset that comes to nonviolent communication and speaking and listening with empathy. And those are skills that really, I think make as much space in the workplace as any, is just being able to know how to have those conversations, and know how to keep it focused on you know, not the employee's failings, but on the employees feelings, and, and making sure that they know that they're valuable, and treating the illness just like you would with a physical wellness, which I think is something we're moving a little closer towards on the society. I don't know if we're there yet. But there's slow improvement, I think.

Jesse: 24:07

I'm curious as to like what has worked for you on your journey. As far as strategies you've taken, it seems like you've been through quite a bit as you manage your bipolar and depression. And I'm curious what strategies that you've taken that have really worked for you and that people could learn from.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 24:35

I found that for me, personal growth is really important. I need to always be learning something even though my mind and body don't want to move in the same way. But you know, after about two years, I have to find a new hobby or new work or new apartment or new something. So that's kind of helpful that stress I think one of the things that's been the biggest help for me, is having friends or family that aren't afraid of anger. Because for a long time, what I went through made me really, really angry. And I needed someone who could just sit there and listen to me scream and yell and just be angry as anything about, you know, angry at my illness angry at the way I've been treated by the police of the hospital. angry at other friends who dismissed my symptoms, just having a chance to be angry and have that anger validated without having it be kind of fed into was really, really important for my journey, just being able to be angry and have that be okay and be understood. And I think that's true of a lot of emotions, just being able to just be sad, and having someone there who doesn't try to fix you. That that is huge to me, someone who can just listen but doesn't try to fix me has been a huge, huge help.

Jesse: 26:09

Yeah, for sure. You know, this summer, we had one of the most decorated gymnast in US history. Smell Biles withdrawal from the files of the Olympics. And she said that she said, we also have to focus on ourselves. Because at the end of the day, we're human too. We have to protect our mind and our body rather than just go out there and do what the world wants us to do. And I think I think so much of like this past year and the pandemic we saw employers pushing us to be like, it's business as usual. Well, we watch in looked outside and saw the world burning. And, and so I guess what, what do you think Simone Biles taught the world about mental health in that moment?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 27:06

I think one of the big things she taught is that there is nothing more important than your own well being. I think it's a cultural change. You know, it's a change away from you have a duty to do X, Y, and Z. And you should sacrifice your body and your mental state and everything else for it. And I see it as a really great expression of an individual who is part of a team was working very hard, but she is prioritized her mental health in a way that I think we're not really used to seeing and you know, good for her for really taking that stand. It's part of how we get to the point of getting mental health on par and with parity to physical health, I think is to say, if you're not doing physically well of course you can't jump across it a gymnastics mat and perform complex Simone Biles style maneuvering, but but I think she really made a great statement that you know, and it it goes along with other things we know about mental illness, people with severe mental health conditions or experiencing severe mental health symptoms are at higher risk for accidents. So, you know, it was a safe decision on her part, it was wise for her to take care of herself. When you see you know, mental health symptoms being to show up early intervention is the number one way to make sure that they don't affect your life in the long term. That's something that we are somehow just now exploring as important aspect of, of recovery for all mental illnesses. But I mean really good for her for coming out with a statement that says, you know, my mental health is the most important thing to me, not entertaining, not being what someone else wants me to be. You know, it's, it's very good for her to be able to say, you know that her mental health is what matters and, and it's okay to step away.

Jesse: 29:22

Yeah, and just a reminder for for any critics out there that Simone Biles powered through kidney stones to get some of those medals that she's earned. And so there's, there's no one in the world who I can think of that's quite as tough as Simone Biles. And so I think I for me, I wonder, just in my own personal journey. When do I know that it's time to push and when do I know? It's time to be like okay, I need to I need to withdraw.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 30:00

So part of growth is, you know, struggling painful. And honestly, I can tell you from my own experience, treatment was painful, it involves changing your whole sense of self. You know, especially if you go years and years with really low self esteem and irritation, it's not a comfortable experience to be able to make those changes. So that's an example of pushing. That brings you better mental health. When I went back to college, after I had had some many troubles, you know, I was working full time and taking classes part time, and there was a definite push there, but I kind of felt driven. The thing that really I think is good to look out for is your body, the human body will tell you, when your stress levels are high, lack of sleep, is something that I don't feel I need a medical degree to point out is, is a problem, you know, generally, like the first things to look at is, are you still maintaining roughly the schedule that you did before? Are you eating well, or at least eating and Are you sleeping. So those are some basic things to look at in terms of your stress level where you might feel pushed, but if the rest of your routine isn't starting to come apart, then you know, you might just be pushing. The other aspect is, you know, if you, if you're pushing like, really, really hard, you might have a limit or a wall. So what's pushing at one time might, might be struggling with your mental health at a later time. And, you know, we are not an ideal world. But if you have the ability and option, if you're ever in doubt, schedule a meeting with a therapist or a mental health professional, it like if you have a rash that won't go away, you go to the doctor, if you have mental health symptoms that aren't going away, also go to the doctor, it's very important that we stop thinking about mental health as something that's that secondary. You know, there certainly are levels of pushing yourself where you'll feel tired, but you know, you might still feel a sense of satisfaction. If you start feeling very defeatist and symptoms like that, then, you know, sometimes that's normal. But if you're ever in question as to whether or not you're doing yourself harm by how hard you're pushing, check in with a mental health professional, sometimes they can give you recommendations that will help you push through a difficult time. You know, there's nothing, there's never anything wrong with going to therapy.

Jesse: 32:59

Amen. Amen to that. I think a big reason I started this podcast is because of the mental health journey I've been on this past year, and starting with counseling in January, and just unable to really work work some stuff out huge fan of therapy, and I would recommend it to anyone, even if you're not in crisis, just the power of therapy and how how it's good to have someone who's just there to listen. And

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 33:34

and again, as we talked about cross culturally, you know, that person you talk to, you might be a priest or an elder. There are a number of different people, it doesn't necessarily, you know, I in Western culture, I highly, you know, tend to recommend therapists because they're what we go to, but anyone who's really well trusted by you to be able to speak about your feelings and your emotions. You know, those are also options too. So you don't have to feel like you just have to go with a western medicine solution.

Jesse: 34:09

I appreciate that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, so how is his name his work? We're really working to challenge some of those stigmas and the assumptions around and stereotypes around mental illness.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 34:27

Sure, so we are probably primarily in education, mental health education organization. And the way we do our education is largely through the voices of people with lived experience and mental illness. So for example, we send a lot of students or a lot of presenters to the Seattle Public Schools. These tend to be younger people, usually and they're either just graduating from high school, no Older than 30. And they talk to school kids about their experiences with mental health conditions when they were in mostly High School, sometimes Middle School, the middle school students have the sweetest comments there. I swear that's the right age to reach. Because they seem to still be very open to the disk.

Jesse: 35:21

Can you think of any comments that kinda Oh, one

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 35:25

was because of because of this talk. Now I know what to do if a friend is sad or hurting, like, stuff like that, just really stuff from these 1112. Yeah. Or however, however middle school aged kids are. But things like that. Then we do another version called the American voice, which is for adults to adults. So a lot of times they'll speak at businesses or offices for King County or the city of Seattle. One of the things that I really like the most about this program is we also bring these people in to speak at inpatient hospitals, or do it remotely right now, still, just because of the precautions, but it's really great, because there's nothing else that really replicates that in an inpatient psychiatric setting of someone who can come in and say, I have been exactly where you're sitting. Now, I am able to live independently. I've been in the hospital this many years, like having the chance for inpatients to see it earnestly and right there. And, you know, ask questions of those presenters is a really amazing experience. And so we do that, that tends to fight what we call self stigma, there's this effect called the Y try effect, which is, if I have a mental illness, and people with mental illness are less competent, than I'm not competent to have a job, if I'm not competent to have a job, I'm not competent to live independently. And it can kind of just keep falling step by step all the way down. And I think these presenters really helped to challenge that kind of self self stigma that can that can be just as harmful as external stigma. And then last, let's see, what else do we have, we educate families, a lot of Nami is populations, families, who have adult children with severe mental illness like schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder, type one, bipolar disorder, a lot of the psychosis disorders, these are some of the hardest to treat, they have pretty severe symptoms, which can be managed, you know, I don't, I don't want to, in any way separate these people out, but we don't have good care or coverage for them. And so a lot of parents come to learn about their children's condition, how to support them, what resources to get. And then lastly, we just do regular support groups. for people of all types, we have bipoc support group, and LGBTQ support group. A lot of bipolar support groups, just general family support groups. And what I like about our groups is that they're all walk in and they're all low barrier. It is preferred you do not come in extremely drunk or high. But that will not necessarily get you kicked out unless you are disruptive to the group. You know, we generally ask that people show up sober but wherever you are, whether you have a diagnosis, that's official, we're not you're welcome to walk in and see if that group might be right for you.

Jesse: 39:01

Wow. Yeah, I think man, mental health just in mental illness impacts so many facets of our site, as society, as you mentioned, you know, bipoc communities, policing, our healthcare system. I mean, the list really goes on, I could talk to you all day, about these different issues. What has been the greatest lesson for you from your work?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 39:34

You know, there are a few big lessons. One is just the power of people who have experience with mental illness, whether that's personally or through a family member, just how powerful that advocacy is, and how strongly people will stand up for themselves or their or their loved one. Just being a To see that level of compassion for the self, and for others, in spite of all the challenges they've met with mental illness, I think is, is something that's really inspiring. I love when we get good reviews from support groups, someone wrote recently that a support group literally saved their wives. And that's when I know we're doing good work. You know, my job involves doing a lot of fundraising. And, and one of the hardest things I deal with, but that's still the most amazing is that sometimes we will get memorials, for people who have died by suicide. And just seeing the amount of generosity of people who have gone through so much loss, and the kindness that comes out, is something that both inspires me and breaks my heart at the same time. But but just there's in the face of like loss and difficulty and such misunderstood struggles, the the amount of hope and generosity and mutual support that comes out of that this community is something that just really blows me away every time.

Jesse: 41:20

That's powerful. So if you were, if you were to have a microphone that could broadcast to the world, what message would you give it?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 41:35

I think, I would say the recovery is possible for absolutely everyone. And there are no exceptions. I think that, you know, mental illness can put you in trouble with the law can get you medically committed. But I think that the one message I would really say is, there's so much power and compassion. And you know, just doing the work of constantly trying to manage mental illness is so difficult. And so I really want everyone to know, recovery is possible. And it's very hard. If you think about what a person with severe mental illness has to go through, they have to take all their medications on time, they have to be very careful about what they eat, they have to exercise, they can't smoke, they can't drink, they can't use any drugs, like this idea of like pure living is almost essential for people with with a severe mental health condition. So I think just that recovery is possible, and that there needs to be some patients, it is very, very hard to be able to live a life that will help manage all your symptoms. If you have severe symptoms, even treatment resistant depression, it takes a lot of time. It is a hard condition to recover from, because everything that's supposed to work doesn't so but it's still always possible. So I guess that's maybe more for the people who are struggling than for the rest of the world. But I think there's

Jesse: 43:25

quite quite a few of the world that are so and I think it's one of those things, it's definitely under under reported because of the stigma that you're working on challenging. So well. Is there any anything I haven't asked you that, that you want to make sure people hear?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 43:47

I can take this chance to maybe straighten up some misconceptions. One of the things we're talking about a lot in Seattle is the homelessness crisis. And you know, about 30% of the population that is on housed has a severe mental illness. And I want people to remember that it's not housing that creates a severe lack of housing the creates a severe mental illness, people with severe mental illness are vulnerable to losing their housing and eviction. So I'd really like to make sure people understand the direction that this travels, and not try to just look at the problem and say, Oh, well, only this many people have severe mental illness. And we don't know what to do with them. They're kind of on humans, those people all had homes and families at some point in their lives. So I think it's very important just to emphasize that this is a process where people are vulnerable, and then they wind up in circumstances that are exactly what you would expect from that vulnerability. The same thing is True. People with mental illness are 16 times more likely to be shot and killed by a police officer than the average population. So there are a lot of what else people with mental illness that goes untreated often live 20 to 30 years below the average life expectancy. So there are a lot of determinants that mental illness is the origin of it's not a byproduct, it's not a personal weakness, it's nothing like that. It develops and then these negative determinants tend to come.

Jesse: 45:34

Yeah, and I think about the homeless homelessness, experiencing homelessness, could create mental illness as well.

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 45:44

trauma, it creates Yeah, it is losing one's home. There was one study that said, the only thing more traumatizing is losing the loss of a limb, or paralysis. Because it completely changes everything about your day to day routine. So when you get away from just severe mental illness, and you look at things like trauma as a mental health condition, which we should, then you're talking about pretty much the whole population at that point, which is why we can't really expect to just build some houses and throw some people in there, it may require some support some time with a social worker, and it will vary based on the individual, but some help to react limit is definitely useful and should be expected.

Jesse: 46:42

Yeah. What do you think we could do as a culture? I think about our culture, too, and, you know, the advent of technology, exacerbating, you know, different levels of anxiety and depression and, um, I just think like, what can we as a culture to, to help prevent mental illness and maybe not severe mental illnesses that are, are genetic, but mental illnesses, that that can happen because of trauma because of environment, environmental cues, things like that? Well, I

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 47:23

think we look at Simone Biles, and we just acknowledge that there are times when it's okay to step away. And it's also, it's so difficult. I had a friend who is an attorney, he told me he didn't know how anyone could maneuver through this world if they weren't a lawyer. And that seems to become very true for a lot of mental health issues, especially when it involves the workplace insurance agencies, trying to make sure you have parity in your mental health care. So it's difficult and honestly, stepping away can just be taking the time to get the resources that you need put together. Because as I said before, the the people who are trying to get resources from the hospital when they're getting out and it's taking six weeks, it's not going much faster for people aren't in hospital either. So it's just really difficult. But culturally, I really think I think it's time you we have a very production based society. But I think that even if you keep on that level, when you look globally, mental illness cost the global economy over a trillion dollars every year. And taking better care of the mental health of staff and employees is a way to offset. So I don't think anyone has a good formula on mental health versus productivity and like a nice bell curve or anything like that, but but what we do know is that there's a lot of money lost largely because of depression and anxiety as much as anything else. Those are probably the two leading determinants. And we just have to kind of acknowledge that we're hurting ourselves. And this goal of like, unlimited growth and productivity is being hurt just as much by are refusing to acknowledge the problem. So I think, you know, with with this culture where we're so productivity driven, a good place to start might be to simply say, we are costing ourselves a lot of money and draining a lot of people and putting a lot of people out of work. And it's doing us no good, it's costing costing money instead of making it so even from a productivity standpoint, you It doesn't make sense to neglect when mental health of your staff or employees.

Jesse: 50:04

Absolutely. Well, any final thoughts?

Jeremiah Bainbridge: 50:11

I don't think so. The only real final thought I would have is I always encourage people to one great way to follow up on what's happening in the legislature is to check our our parent organization, Nami, Washington's bill tracker. And I highly encourage people to write and right into their state representatives. We can do a lot here in Washington, you know, mental health tends to vary by state. And so here in Washington, like, just keep writing those letters that you want compassionate mental health services, you know, don't don't worry about a permanent supportive housing unit somehow, you know, harming your neighborhoods, property values are so don't don't buy into that sort of thing. Like, I live on first Hill, I have three permanent supportive housing units near me. They're all great neighbors, I have no problem with any of them. They're all wonderful people. So just you know, don't give into the misconception.

Jesse: 51:32

Thank you, Jeremiah, for being our guests this week. Thank you to everyone that National Alliance on Mental Illness for your work to remind those most impacted by mental health challenges that they are not alone, and for empowering them to live fulfilling lives. This has been another episode of miking change. I hope you've enjoyed listening to it as much as I've enjoyed making it. Don't forget to hit that subscribe button. And join me again next week as we work to put a microphone to the stories that matter.