{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":0.299,"endTime":1.019,"body":"Hey guys,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1.049,"endTime":3.749,"body":"I have got a big"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1.049,"endTime":3.749,"body":"treat for you today, I am"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3.749,"endTime":7.289,"body":"talking to Ben Hartley from the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3.749,"endTime":7.289,"body":"six figure photography podcast."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":7.559,"endTime":12.029,"body":"And this is a longer episode"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":7.559,"endTime":12.029,"body":"than usual only because we had"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":12.029,"endTime":15.689,"body":"so much good stuff to talk about"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":12.029,"endTime":15.689,"body":"that we finally had to sort of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":15.689,"endTime":19.439,"body":"wind it down. 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Or"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":31.019,"endTime":35.279,"body":"really, if you're listening to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":35.279,"endTime":39.269,"body":"it anytime, but I was fine."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":35.279,"endTime":39.269,"body":"Summer is a particularly good"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":39.269,"endTime":44.369,"body":"time to work on your business. I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":39.269,"endTime":44.369,"body":"wanted to invite you to sign up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":44.399,"endTime":49.499,"body":"for the simple sales masterclass"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":44.399,"endTime":49.499,"body":"that I offer for free over on my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":49.499,"endTime":54.059,"body":"website at this can't be that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":49.499,"endTime":54.059,"body":"hard.com slash simple. If you've"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":54.059,"endTime":56.729,"body":"been listening for any period of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":54.059,"endTime":56.729,"body":"time, you know that the simple"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":56.729,"endTime":61.559,"body":"sale system is the foundation"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":56.729,"endTime":61.559,"body":"that has provided me with the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":61.559,"endTime":65.339,"body":"success that I have achieved and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":61.559,"endTime":65.339,"body":"now is serving hundreds of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":65.339,"endTime":69.929,"body":"photographers around the world."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":65.339,"endTime":69.929,"body":"And it is the sort of thing that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":69.929,"endTime":72.839,"body":"doesn't really necessarily take"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":69.929,"endTime":72.839,"body":"a long time to set up in your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":72.839,"endTime":76.889,"body":"business. But it does take sort"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":72.839,"endTime":76.889,"body":"of a concentrated effort. 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So go sign up and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":114.719,"endTime":119.249,"body":"enjoy today's interview with"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":119.249,"endTime":124.379,"body":"Ben. Welcome to this can't be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":119.249,"endTime":124.379,"body":"that hard. My name is Annemie"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":124.379,"endTime":127.799,"body":"Tonken. And I help photographers"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":124.379,"endTime":127.799,"body":"run profitable, sustainable"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":127.799,"endTime":131.939,"body":"businesses that they love. Each"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":127.799,"endTime":131.939,"body":"week on the podcast, I cover"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":131.939,"endTime":135.689,"body":"simple, actionable strategies"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":131.939,"endTime":135.689,"body":"and systems that photographers"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":135.689,"endTime":139.469,"body":"at every level of experience can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":135.689,"endTime":139.469,"body":"use to earn more money in a more"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":139.469,"endTime":143.189,"body":"sustainable way. Running a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":139.469,"endTime":143.189,"body":"photography business doesn't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":143.189,"endTime":151.139,"body":"have to be that hard. You can do"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":143.189,"endTime":151.139,"body":"it. And I can show you how. Hey,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":151.139,"endTime":154.589,"body":"Ben, it is so great to finally"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":151.139,"endTime":154.589,"body":"have you on this can't be that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":154.589,"endTime":157.649,"body":"hard. I cannot believe it has"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":154.589,"endTime":157.649,"body":"taken us this long to get the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":157.649,"endTime":160.469,"body":"two podcasts together. How are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":157.649,"endTime":160.469,"body":"you today?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":160.59,"endTime":162.45,"body":"I'm doing really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":160.59,"endTime":162.45,"body":"well. Thanks for having me"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":162.45,"endTime":165.45,"body":"automate. This is this is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":162.45,"endTime":165.45,"body":"something that I'm excited"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":165.45,"endTime":169.38,"body":"about. It's like a real treat."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":165.45,"endTime":169.38,"body":"Um, so thank you again, I am in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":169.68,"endTime":172.23,"body":"all of the Facebook groups that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":169.68,"endTime":172.23,"body":"I'm sure your audiences in all"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":172.23,"endTime":175.68,"body":"the integrity groups, probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":172.23,"endTime":175.68,"body":"that you're into. And I'm always"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":175.68,"endTime":179.46,"body":"snooping in those in those"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":175.68,"endTime":179.46,"body":"groups. When people post these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":179.46,"endTime":184.08,"body":"questions like, hey, I've got a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":179.46,"endTime":184.08,"body":"long drive to California. Does"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":184.08,"endTime":186.72,"body":"anybody have any great podcast"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":184.08,"endTime":186.72,"body":"recommendations? And I'm always"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":186.72,"endTime":189.6,"body":"like, Did they say Did they say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":186.72,"endTime":189.6,"body":"the six figure photography"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":189.6,"endTime":192.87,"body":"podcast? Did they say Ben"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":189.6,"endTime":192.87,"body":"Hartley and I keep seeing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":192.87,"endTime":196.26,"body":"automate? This can't be that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":192.87,"endTime":196.26,"body":"hard. I keep seeing your name"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":196.26,"endTime":199.71,"body":"pop up over and over and over."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":196.26,"endTime":199.71,"body":"And so I just I'm excited to be"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":199.71,"endTime":203.13,"body":"here. I know you've got an"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":199.71,"endTime":203.13,"body":"incredible audience, a great"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":203.13,"endTime":206.01,"body":"community around this podcast."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":203.13,"endTime":206.01,"body":"And so thank you for the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":206.01,"endTime":206.67,"body":"opportunity."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":206.94,"endTime":209.07,"body":"Well, I won't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":206.94,"endTime":209.07,"body":"argue with you it is a great"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":209.1,"endTime":214.41,"body":"audience. But I will totally"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":209.1,"endTime":214.41,"body":"second that. Like, I think that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":214.41,"endTime":217.35,"body":"sometimes, I mean, I know I do"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":214.41,"endTime":217.35,"body":"this, I listen to a lot of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":217.35,"endTime":220.5,"body":"podcasts, photography, and not"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":217.35,"endTime":220.5,"body":"photography related. And the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":220.5,"endTime":224.13,"body":"people on the other side of the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":220.5,"endTime":224.13,"body":"microphone really become like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":224.22,"endTime":227.97,"body":"celebrities to me, right. You"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":224.22,"endTime":227.97,"body":"know, if I were to bump into, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":227.97,"endTime":231.9,"body":"don't know, Ira Glass to name"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":227.97,"endTime":231.9,"body":"one that everybody knows. But in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":231.9,"endTime":234.84,"body":"the supermarket, I would be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":231.9,"endTime":234.84,"body":"totally, you know, fangirling."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":235.68,"endTime":239.22,"body":"But at the end of the day, maybe"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":235.68,"endTime":239.22,"body":"Ira Glass is beyond this, but"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":239.22,"endTime":241.47,"body":"I'm totally with you. Like I'm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":239.22,"endTime":241.47,"body":"in those Facebook groups being"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":241.47,"endTime":246.51,"body":"like, do people like my podcast?"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":241.47,"endTime":246.51,"body":"Yeah. So yeah, that is that is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":246.51,"endTime":248.94,"body":"fun. But I've been listening to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":246.51,"endTime":248.94,"body":"you for years. But you know,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":248.94,"endTime":251.49,"body":"you've been around for quite a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":248.94,"endTime":251.49,"body":"bit longer. So when I was"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":251.49,"endTime":255.36,"body":"starting this podcast, you were"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":251.49,"endTime":255.36,"body":"a big inspiration. So yeah, like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":255.36,"endTime":258.0,"body":"I said, I can't believe it's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":255.36,"endTime":258.0,"body":"taken this long. But here we"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":258.0,"endTime":261.81,"body":"are. And I know we're gonna have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":258.0,"endTime":261.81,"body":"a really great conversation that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":261.84,"endTime":266.07,"body":"will be sort of a melding of the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":261.84,"endTime":266.07,"body":"minds today. So before we get"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":266.07,"endTime":268.65,"body":"started, and I have a lot"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":266.07,"endTime":268.65,"body":"written down that I want to pick"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":268.65,"endTime":272.25,"body":"your brain about, but I would"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":268.65,"endTime":272.25,"body":"love for you to just do a brief"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":272.25,"endTime":275.67,"body":"introduction about you know, Ben"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":272.25,"endTime":275.67,"body":"Hartley, the photographer, Ben"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":275.67,"endTime":279.3,"body":"Hartley, the educator, and give"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":275.67,"endTime":279.3,"body":"us kind of a little synopsis of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":279.3,"endTime":280.05,"body":"your story."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":280.229,"endTime":282.479,"body":"Okay, yeah, this is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":280.229,"endTime":282.479,"body":"good. I'll try to get to the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":282.479,"endTime":287.579,"body":"point. Baxter is fine, as long"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":282.479,"endTime":287.579,"body":"as they serve a purpose. I'll"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":287.579,"endTime":290.159,"body":"try to have the super purpose."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":287.579,"endTime":290.159,"body":"I've been a full time wedding"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":290.159,"endTime":295.769,"body":"photographer for 11 years. That"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":290.159,"endTime":295.769,"body":"was not the intention. I studied"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":295.799,"endTime":298.109,"body":"oil painting and school My"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":295.799,"endTime":298.109,"body":"degree is in like two"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":298.109,"endTime":300.149,"body":"dimensional studies, oil"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":298.109,"endTime":300.149,"body":"painting, and the only The"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":300.149,"endTime":305.699,"body":"reason I know anything about a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":300.149,"endTime":305.699,"body":"camera was because I needed it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":305.699,"endTime":308.879,"body":"to produce my oil paintings. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":305.699,"endTime":308.879,"body":"so I studied light and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":308.879,"endTime":314.009,"body":"composition and, and color and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":308.879,"endTime":314.009,"body":"all this stuff. And, and that's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":314.009,"endTime":317.729,"body":"really where the emphasis"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":314.009,"endTime":317.729,"body":"became. Now, again, it wasn't my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":317.729,"endTime":320.459,"body":"idea to become a wedding"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":317.729,"endTime":320.459,"body":"photographer, either somebody"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":320.459,"endTime":325.259,"body":"else that was very important to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":320.459,"endTime":325.259,"body":"me, they kind of like breathe it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":325.259,"endTime":327.599,"body":"into existence, even I mean,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":325.259,"endTime":327.599,"body":"like when someone like speaks"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":327.599,"endTime":330.659,"body":"something, and you're like, oh,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":327.599,"endTime":330.659,"body":"my goodness, this is now real."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":330.899,"endTime":334.799,"body":"And it just said some point"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":330.899,"endTime":334.799,"body":"started with a breath. I think"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":334.799,"endTime":336.809,"body":"it's actually fascinating. When"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":334.799,"endTime":336.809,"body":"I think about it, like the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":336.809,"endTime":340.919,"body":"things that I have in my life,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":336.809,"endTime":340.919,"body":"at some point. They were like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":340.919,"endTime":346.079,"body":"breathe into existence. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":340.919,"endTime":346.079,"body":"my wife, we got married the week"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":346.079,"endTime":350.789,"body":"that she graduated college, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":346.079,"endTime":350.789,"body":"we were like, kind of screwed."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":352.139,"endTime":356.339,"body":"Like, not really screwed, but"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":352.139,"endTime":356.339,"body":"like, so let's kind of like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":356.399,"endTime":359.549,"body":"stack it against me for a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":356.399,"endTime":359.549,"body":"second. So we got married the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":359.549,"endTime":363.449,"body":"week that she graduated. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":359.549,"endTime":363.449,"body":"we had like two layers of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":363.449,"endTime":367.079,"body":"student debt kind of on top of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":363.449,"endTime":367.079,"body":"each other. And again, I was an"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":367.079,"endTime":370.679,"body":"oil painting major in Ohio,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":367.079,"endTime":370.679,"body":"right? Like the money is not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":370.679,"endTime":373.679,"body":"like rolling in right out of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":370.679,"endTime":373.679,"body":"college when you're doing that."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":374.039,"endTime":378.479,"body":"And, and then as well, I was in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":374.039,"endTime":378.479,"body":"full time ministry for a year."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":378.719,"endTime":383.279,"body":"And I love the word it this way."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":378.719,"endTime":383.279,"body":"It turns out that if you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":383.279,"endTime":387.659,"body":"doing ministry, right, it's not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":383.279,"endTime":387.659,"body":"the most lucrative thing. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":388.139,"endTime":392.309,"body":"we were just kind of like trying"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":388.139,"endTime":392.309,"body":"to figure out life and like what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":392.309,"endTime":396.059,"body":"to do and how to make money. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":392.309,"endTime":396.059,"body":"and so we were brainstorming,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":396.059,"endTime":398.009,"body":"and I'm like, Okay, well, I'll"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":396.059,"endTime":398.009,"body":"get a server job and all this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":398.009,"endTime":401.699,"body":"stuff. And then it was Leslie,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":398.009,"endTime":401.699,"body":"who is like, Ben, you love"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":401.729,"endTime":408.239,"body":"people. And you're decent at"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":401.729,"endTime":408.239,"body":"making things look good. Why not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":408.239,"endTime":414.839,"body":"be a wedding photographer. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":408.239,"endTime":414.839,"body":"so there we go. We were like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":414.839,"endTime":419.639,"body":"Alright, we'll be waiting for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":414.839,"endTime":419.639,"body":"divers. And that's kind of where"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":419.639,"endTime":425.159,"body":"the where the, the idea. first"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":419.639,"endTime":425.159,"body":"started. Now, I'm going to share"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":425.159,"endTime":428.489,"body":"that story because it ties in to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":425.159,"endTime":428.489,"body":"the education side of things."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":428.879,"endTime":431.369,"body":"Because that night, that very"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":428.879,"endTime":431.369,"body":"night that she was like, Hey,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":431.369,"endTime":434.999,"body":"what about this thing? I was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":431.369,"endTime":434.999,"body":"like, okay, maybe you have a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":434.999,"endTime":438.389,"body":"family friend who's in portrait"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":434.999,"endTime":438.389,"body":"photography, a senior portrait"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":438.389,"endTime":441.659,"body":"photographer, maybe I'll connect"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":438.389,"endTime":441.659,"body":"with them. And I'll just pick"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":441.659,"endTime":444.779,"body":"their brain a little bit just to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":441.659,"endTime":444.779,"body":"get an understanding of like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":445.139,"endTime":449.579,"body":"what is this industry? Like? Who"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":445.139,"endTime":449.579,"body":"are these crazy people that are"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":449.579,"endTime":452.969,"body":"photographers and and what are"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":449.579,"endTime":452.969,"body":"they up to? Is this viable is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":452.969,"endTime":455.669,"body":"something that I should actually"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":452.969,"endTime":455.669,"body":"consider not to try to, like get"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":455.669,"endTime":458.429,"body":"trade secrets? Again, I'm not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":455.669,"endTime":458.429,"body":"even at that point. I'm just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":458.429,"endTime":462.479,"body":"Yeah, I'd like I don't know, is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":458.429,"endTime":462.479,"body":"this what I want to do? And so I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":462.479,"endTime":469.769,"body":"called them up. Now. So man,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":462.479,"endTime":469.769,"body":"automate you again, I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":469.769,"endTime":471.569,"body":"you've listened all the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":469.769,"endTime":471.569,"body":"podcasts, and you've been to all"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":471.569,"endTime":474.539,"body":"the conferences, and you read"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":471.569,"endTime":474.539,"body":"all the books, and you probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":474.539,"endTime":476.459,"body":"have business coaches, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":474.539,"endTime":476.459,"body":"mentors and all these things."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":476.639,"endTime":480.959,"body":"And same, and yet to this day,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":476.639,"endTime":480.959,"body":"the words that the photographer"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":480.959,"endTime":483.689,"body":"told me still have been the most"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":480.959,"endTime":483.689,"body":"inspiring thing. They've been"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":483.689,"endTime":487.769,"body":"like the driving force, and I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":483.689,"endTime":487.769,"body":"definitely, at least for the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":487.769,"endTime":490.559,"body":"first, maybe five years of my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":487.769,"endTime":490.559,"body":"career, they were the driving"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":490.559,"endTime":493.469,"body":"force. And so I'm, I'm on the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":490.559,"endTime":493.469,"body":"phone with this photographer."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":494.249,"endTime":497.759,"body":"And I'm pacing back and forth in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":494.249,"endTime":497.759,"body":"my little kitchen. That's what I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":497.759,"endTime":498.659,"body":"do. And I taught that's what"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":498.66,"endTime":501.03,"body":"I do, too. It's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":498.66,"endTime":501.03,"body":"the hardest thing about these"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":501.03,"endTime":505.05,"body":"podcasts is hard to mic that's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":501.03,"endTime":505.05,"body":"right here on my desk."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":505.08,"endTime":507.6,"body":"I know I'm dialed"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":505.08,"endTime":507.6,"body":"in, I'm just gonna sit here on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":507.6,"endTime":511.62,"body":"this now anyhow. And so I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":507.6,"endTime":511.62,"body":"pacing, and I'm expecting to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":511.62,"endTime":517.05,"body":"hear things about liability"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":511.62,"endTime":517.05,"body":"insurance, and maybe get a 70 to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":517.05,"endTime":522.06,"body":"200. And do competitor research."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":517.05,"endTime":522.06,"body":"I don't know what I was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":522.06,"endTime":526.5,"body":"expecting. But what I heard"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":522.06,"endTime":526.5,"body":"instead was Ben, don't do it."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":526.5,"endTime":528.42,"body":"Just because you have a camera"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":526.5,"endTime":528.42,"body":"doesn't mean you can be a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":528.42,"endTime":530.22,"body":"photographer, I get that you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":528.42,"endTime":530.22,"body":"were an art major, I get that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":530.22,"endTime":534.96,"body":"you make oil paintings, but you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":530.22,"endTime":534.96,"body":"can't this like suddenly become"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":534.99,"endTime":538.59,"body":"a photographer. Everyone keeps"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":534.99,"endTime":538.59,"body":"doing that. And it's just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":538.59,"endTime":542.58,"body":"driving the industry down."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":538.59,"endTime":542.58,"body":"Right? You step into this,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":542.61,"endTime":546.78,"body":"you're gonna keep lowering the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":542.61,"endTime":546.78,"body":"industry. And so that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":546.84,"endTime":550.44,"body":"listen, no judgement on the on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":546.84,"endTime":550.44,"body":"the bloke, I'm sure he's coming"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":550.44,"endTime":554.43,"body":"from a certain mindset a certain"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":550.44,"endTime":554.43,"body":"basis. He wasn't trying to be a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":554.43,"endTime":560.01,"body":"dick. He just happened to be"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":554.43,"endTime":560.01,"body":"one. So, but I hung up the phone"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":560.01,"endTime":561.78,"body":"that night, and I was like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":560.01,"endTime":561.78,"body":"babe, we're starting a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":561.78,"endTime":564.0,"body":"photography business, like let's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":561.78,"endTime":564.0,"body":"go"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":564.029,"endTime":565.979,"body":"for no other"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":564.029,"endTime":565.979,"body":"reason than to prove this guy"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":565.979,"endTime":566.339,"body":"wrong."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":567.6,"endTime":570.24,"body":"Like I said, not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":567.6,"endTime":570.24,"body":"necessarily like the best of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":570.24,"endTime":573.0,"body":"intentions behind the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":570.24,"endTime":573.0,"body":"inspiration, but nevertheless I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":573.0,"endTime":577.47,"body":"use it as fuel. And so and so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":573.0,"endTime":577.47,"body":"men, listen to me, we build"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":577.47,"endTime":581.61,"body":"something I hustled, we tested,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":577.47,"endTime":581.61,"body":"we learned we did everything"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":581.61,"endTime":584.46,"body":"possible to try to figure out"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":581.61,"endTime":584.46,"body":"how on earth to get clients and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":584.46,"endTime":587.7,"body":"how to get better at our craft."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":584.46,"endTime":587.7,"body":"I don't think there was a day"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":587.7,"endTime":594.39,"body":"that I was not photographing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":587.7,"endTime":594.39,"body":"something. And, and and so we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":594.39,"endTime":596.52,"body":"really built something quickly"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":594.39,"endTime":596.52,"body":"and it was awesome. It was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":596.52,"endTime":599.4,"body":"great. It was great for for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":596.52,"endTime":599.4,"body":"Leslie and myself and for our"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":599.4,"endTime":604.26,"body":"clients. But in the back of my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":599.4,"endTime":604.26,"body":"mind, the ringing sound of that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":604.26,"endTime":607.23,"body":"photographers voice saying you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":604.26,"endTime":607.23,"body":"will only bring the industry"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":607.23,"endTime":614.19,"body":"down was like, ah, and so the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":607.23,"endTime":614.19,"body":"podcast actually started as a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":614.19,"endTime":617.67,"body":"way for me to bring the industry"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":614.19,"endTime":617.67,"body":"up. Now I started the podcast"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":617.67,"endTime":620.79,"body":"seven years ago. And at that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":617.67,"endTime":620.79,"body":"point, you know, we were doing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":620.79,"endTime":623.43,"body":"six figures, and it was good,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":620.79,"endTime":623.43,"body":"but other people are doing so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":623.43,"endTime":626.37,"body":"many other bigger things. And I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":623.43,"endTime":626.37,"body":"figured, well, how about I just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":626.4,"endTime":630.9,"body":"interview other amazing experts"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":626.4,"endTime":630.9,"body":"and just bring their knowledge"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":630.93,"endTime":634.41,"body":"to, you know, the community. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":630.93,"endTime":634.41,"body":"so I did that for a while. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":634.41,"endTime":637.29,"body":"then, at some point, after doing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":634.41,"endTime":637.29,"body":"that for a few years, I was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":637.29,"endTime":642.39,"body":"like, I think I have something"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":637.29,"endTime":642.39,"body":"to say, yeah. And so now I, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":642.39,"endTime":645.75,"body":"have a mastermind group, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":642.39,"endTime":645.75,"body":"free for photographers, and I'm,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":645.81,"endTime":650.61,"body":"I do free coaching in that every"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":645.81,"endTime":650.61,"body":"week. There's been stretches on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":650.61,"endTime":657.36,"body":"me where I've done free coaching"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":650.61,"endTime":657.36,"body":"every day for years. Three days"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":657.36,"endTime":660.96,"body":"a week, because I got a deal."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":657.36,"endTime":660.96,"body":"Yeah, let's put any that's like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":660.99,"endTime":664.11,"body":"maybe the broad sweeping kind of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":660.99,"endTime":664.11,"body":"points of the journey."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":664.409,"endTime":667.559,"body":"Well, I love"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":664.409,"endTime":667.559,"body":"that. And I hear so much of my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":667.559,"endTime":671.309,"body":"own story, different version of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":667.559,"endTime":671.309,"body":"my own story. And I think that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":671.309,"endTime":675.359,"body":"what I'm hearing from you is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":671.309,"endTime":675.359,"body":"that at heart, you have kind of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":675.359,"endTime":680.219,"body":"that entrepreneurial mind, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":675.359,"endTime":680.219,"body":"have that drive that's like, how"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":680.219,"endTime":683.189,"body":"can we solve this puzzle? How"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":680.219,"endTime":683.189,"body":"can we make this work, and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":683.189,"endTime":686.939,"body":"photography just happened to be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":683.189,"endTime":686.939,"body":"your entry point. And then"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":686.939,"endTime":689.669,"body":"you've sort of followed that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":686.939,"endTime":689.669,"body":"path. Now, I didn't start out to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":689.669,"endTime":693.269,"body":"be an entrepreneur, and I was in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":689.669,"endTime":693.269,"body":"healthcare. But I was very"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":693.269,"endTime":695.579,"body":"quickly hitting a wall where I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":693.269,"endTime":695.579,"body":"was like, This isn't what I want"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":695.579,"endTime":698.339,"body":"to do when I grow up, even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":695.579,"endTime":698.339,"body":"though I'm 30. And I'm, most"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":698.339,"endTime":701.819,"body":"people would say, I'm at that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":698.339,"endTime":701.819,"body":"point, I had two kids, and it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":701.819,"endTime":703.919,"body":"was, you know, the whole thing."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":701.819,"endTime":703.919,"body":"So I thought I was having this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":703.919,"endTime":707.879,"body":"crisis of like, Oh, I better"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":703.919,"endTime":707.879,"body":"figure this out. And it was, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":707.879,"endTime":711.749,"body":"mean, I took photos as a as a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":707.879,"endTime":711.749,"body":"hobby. I enjoyed it. It was fun."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":711.749,"endTime":715.619,"body":"And it that seed was planted in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":711.749,"endTime":715.619,"body":"my head where it was like, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":715.619,"endTime":720.569,"body":"know, there's a career path for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":715.619,"endTime":720.569,"body":"that. No, oh, wait. And then and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":720.569,"endTime":723.839,"body":"then like, the gloves were off,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":720.569,"endTime":723.839,"body":"I was, you know, ready to go."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":723.869,"endTime":729.899,"body":"But similarly, I had somebody"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":723.869,"endTime":729.899,"body":"tell me many years in your Well,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":729.929,"endTime":733.379,"body":"just to give my people probably"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":729.929,"endTime":733.379,"body":"know the story, but I was"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":733.379,"endTime":735.929,"body":"getting divorced. And the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":733.379,"endTime":735.929,"body":"divorce attorney turns to me"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":735.929,"endTime":740.069,"body":"after we were reviewing my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":735.929,"endTime":740.069,"body":"budget. And they were like, so"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":740.069,"endTime":743.309,"body":"are you going to go back to your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":740.069,"endTime":743.309,"body":"other job? And I was like, What?"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":744.899,"endTime":748.079,"body":"How dare you. And I immediately"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":744.899,"endTime":748.079,"body":"was like, I gotta figure this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":748.079,"endTime":751.049,"body":"out and turn this into something"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":748.079,"endTime":751.049,"body":"that scales to take care of my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":751.049,"endTime":756.029,"body":"family. So I sometimes think"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":751.049,"endTime":756.029,"body":"that that challenge can be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":756.029,"endTime":759.929,"body":"leveraged for good It can be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":756.029,"endTime":759.929,"body":"turned into a call to action,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":760.019,"endTime":763.949,"body":"you do a lot of coaching. And so"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":760.019,"endTime":763.949,"body":"I'm curious to know, what you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":763.949,"endTime":769.109,"body":"think stands between most"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":763.949,"endTime":769.109,"body":"photographers and success?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":769.62,"endTime":772.8,"body":"Yeah, their brain,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":769.62,"endTime":772.8,"body":"their mind, the thing between"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":772.8,"endTime":777.51,"body":"their ears, their beliefs, man,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":772.8,"endTime":777.51,"body":"so many photography, y'all know"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":777.51,"endTime":781.62,"body":"what to do? And I end it, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":777.51,"endTime":781.62,"body":"might be thinking, no, I don't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":781.62,"endTime":786.81,"body":"like, well, it's it's all it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":781.62,"endTime":786.81,"body":"man. Yeah, it's it's the beliefs"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":786.81,"endTime":790.17,"body":"that we hold the way that we we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":786.81,"endTime":790.17,"body":"think about ourselves and what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":790.17,"endTime":794.82,"body":"we can do and what we deserve"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":790.17,"endTime":794.82,"body":"and what we don't deserve and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":794.82,"endTime":797.04,"body":"what we think other people"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":794.82,"endTime":797.04,"body":"deserve. It's just like, there's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":797.04,"endTime":804.33,"body":"so many stories that are just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":797.04,"endTime":804.33,"body":"stewing appear, that, that are"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":804.33,"endTime":806.76,"body":"controlling the ship. And so,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":806.909,"endTime":809.669,"body":"yeah, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":806.909,"endTime":809.669,"body":"asked that question, thinking"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":809.669,"endTime":812.489,"body":"that that might be your answer,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":809.669,"endTime":812.489,"body":"knowing you and knowing the way"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":812.489,"endTime":815.909,"body":"that you think, but I also asked"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":812.489,"endTime":815.909,"body":"that question, because we were"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":815.909,"endTime":820.529,"body":"both given this kind of like,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":815.909,"endTime":820.529,"body":"Don't do it, you're screwed,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":820.559,"endTime":825.869,"body":"you're not going to be able to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":820.559,"endTime":825.869,"body":"make it and use that to drive"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":826.289,"endTime":830.099,"body":"potential, you know, success, as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":826.289,"endTime":830.099,"body":"it turns out. And I think a lot"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":830.099,"endTime":834.359,"body":"of photographers here, even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":830.099,"endTime":834.359,"body":"small versions of that kind of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":834.389,"endTime":839.789,"body":"doubt from other people. And"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":834.389,"endTime":839.789,"body":"they, they, like, instead of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":839.969,"endTime":842.789,"body":"pushing that, you know, using"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":839.969,"endTime":842.789,"body":"that to propel themselves, they"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":842.789,"endTime":845.969,"body":"almost hold on to it and let it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":842.789,"endTime":845.969,"body":"sink them like an anchor. And I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":845.969,"endTime":849.089,"body":"think that has a lot to do with"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":845.969,"endTime":849.089,"body":"that mindset. So I'd love to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":849.089,"endTime":853.529,"body":"hear from you a little bit. I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":849.089,"endTime":853.529,"body":"know you do coaching and remind"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":853.529,"endTime":855.689,"body":"me it's called as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":853.529,"endTime":855.689,"body":"transformational coaching."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":855.719,"endTime":858.809,"body":"transformational coaching. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":855.719,"endTime":858.809,"body":"And I'm curious to hear just a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":858.809,"endTime":862.769,"body":"little bit about like, what the,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":858.809,"endTime":862.769,"body":"and we don't have to get too,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":862.829,"endTime":866.669,"body":"too into it. But like, what the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":862.829,"endTime":866.669,"body":"push is there? Are you is that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":866.669,"endTime":871.319,"body":"transformation, sort of helping"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":866.669,"endTime":871.319,"body":"people get past their own"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":871.319,"endTime":872.999,"body":"mindset and mindset blocks?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":873.36,"endTime":876.99,"body":"Absolutely. There's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":873.36,"endTime":876.99,"body":"a really great quote, I forget,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":877.05,"endTime":879.36,"body":"I don't know who says that, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":877.05,"endTime":879.36,"body":"I'll probably botch it right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":879.36,"endTime":886.2,"body":"now. But the idea is that change"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":879.36,"endTime":886.2,"body":"can happen instantly. Like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":886.68,"endTime":888.72,"body":"transformation can happen"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":886.68,"endTime":888.72,"body":"instantly. This is a really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":888.72,"endTime":890.22,"body":"powerful thing about"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":888.72,"endTime":890.22,"body":"transformational coaching. It"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":890.22,"endTime":892.53,"body":"can happen in innocent it's just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":890.22,"endTime":892.53,"body":"the decision to transform. It's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":892.53,"endTime":895.56,"body":"a decision to change that can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":892.53,"endTime":895.56,"body":"sometimes take a lifetime."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":896.22,"endTime":901.23,"body":"There's nothing magic about it."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":896.22,"endTime":901.23,"body":"There's no there's no whoo In"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":901.23,"endTime":903.93,"body":"what I do, or in any"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":901.23,"endTime":903.93,"body":"transmission coach, in my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":903.93,"endTime":909.45,"body":"opinion, I think it's just the,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":903.93,"endTime":909.45,"body":"what I try to do is, is just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":910.05,"endTime":914.04,"body":"stand with people like to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":910.05,"endTime":914.04,"body":"actually commit myself to what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":914.04,"endTime":918.96,"body":"they say they want, and to just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":914.04,"endTime":918.96,"body":"have their back, and to hold"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":918.96,"endTime":922.02,"body":"them accountable to what they"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":918.96,"endTime":922.02,"body":"say that they want. And then to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":922.02,"endTime":925.65,"body":"just get really curious about"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":922.02,"endTime":925.65,"body":"everything that's showing up in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":925.65,"endTime":928.56,"body":"their life, all the results that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":925.65,"endTime":928.56,"body":"they're getting, just get really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":928.56,"endTime":932.67,"body":"curious about that. And so,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":928.56,"endTime":932.67,"body":"maybe even on that note, if your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":932.67,"endTime":936.21,"body":"response, as you heard my story,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":932.67,"endTime":936.21,"body":"if your response to your own"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":936.21,"endTime":939.9,"body":"brain was like that, I would"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":936.21,"endTime":939.9,"body":"have been out, I would have been"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":939.9,"endTime":942.33,"body":"like not I would have been like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":939.9,"endTime":942.33,"body":"Well, I'm not doing this, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":942.33,"endTime":944.88,"body":"would have felt really defeated,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":942.33,"endTime":944.88,"body":"that would have put me into, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":944.88,"endTime":950.07,"body":"know, a spiral. I just get"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":944.88,"endTime":950.07,"body":"really curious about, about"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":950.07,"endTime":952.8,"body":"that, about why that might be"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":950.07,"endTime":952.8,"body":"and what emotions are connected"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":952.8,"endTime":956.76,"body":"to that and what needs aren't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":952.8,"endTime":956.76,"body":"being mad. And just, again, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":956.76,"endTime":961.5,"body":"think curiosity is like really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":956.76,"endTime":961.5,"body":"the key to beginning to reverse"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":961.5,"endTime":964.44,"body":"engineer the results that we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":961.5,"endTime":964.44,"body":"getting in our life."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":965.1,"endTime":967.98,"body":"Do you happen to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":965.1,"endTime":967.98,"body":"be a TED lasso fan? I know I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":967.98,"endTime":975.03,"body":"love Ted. That line be curious,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":967.98,"endTime":975.03,"body":"not judgmental, has become like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":975.12,"endTime":978.45,"body":"sacrosanct. In my household, we"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":975.12,"endTime":978.45,"body":"say that all the time, my kids"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":978.45,"endTime":981.39,"body":"are older, I have an 11 and 15"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":978.45,"endTime":981.39,"body":"year old so there's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":981.39,"endTime":986.76,"body":"judgmental, you know, happening"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":981.39,"endTime":986.76,"body":"at times. And we we lean on Ted"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":986.82,"endTime":989.94,"body":"as our as our guide for that. So"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":986.82,"endTime":989.94,"body":"I love that you bring up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":989.94,"endTime":995.1,"body":"curiosity, I think it is one of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":989.94,"endTime":995.1,"body":"the most underrated qualities in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":995.13,"endTime":999.09,"body":"human beings, but in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":995.13,"endTime":999.09,"body":"entrepreneurs in particular,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":999.12,"endTime":1002.75,"body":"keeping your eyes open and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":999.12,"endTime":1002.75,"body":"staying curious about what"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1002.75,"endTime":1005.99,"body":"people are talking about what"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1002.75,"endTime":1005.99,"body":"people are looking for, what the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1005.99,"endTime":1008.66,"body":"subtext is of you know, when"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1005.99,"endTime":1008.66,"body":"they call you and say I want"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1008.66,"endTime":1011.54,"body":"pictures like what are they"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1008.66,"endTime":1011.54,"body":"really want from you, and being"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1011.54,"endTime":1015.23,"body":"able to meet them there is one"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1011.54,"endTime":1015.23,"body":"of the absolute keys to success"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1015.23,"endTime":1017.33,"body":"so well, and even to not be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1015.23,"endTime":1017.33,"body":"judgment. I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1017.329,"endTime":1019.669,"body":"love what you said"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1017.329,"endTime":1019.669,"body":"with Ted last quote, because I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1019.669,"endTime":1023.779,"body":"think a lot of us, not only do"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1019.669,"endTime":1023.779,"body":"we think to ourselves, maybe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1023.779,"endTime":1026.329,"body":"like that's not how I would"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1023.779,"endTime":1026.329,"body":"responded, I would uh, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1026.359,"endTime":1029.449,"body":"I would have really just put me"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1026.359,"endTime":1029.449,"body":"in a bad place. And then the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1029.449,"endTime":1032.989,"body":"very next step is we judge"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1029.449,"endTime":1032.989,"body":"ourselves for feeling that way."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1033.139,"endTime":1036.109,"body":"Yeah, well, I'm not like that."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1033.139,"endTime":1036.109,"body":"And I'm a piece of shit, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1036.109,"endTime":1039.049,"body":"whatever it is, I'm not a real"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1036.109,"endTime":1039.049,"body":"entrepreneur I'll never make and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1039.049,"endTime":1041.629,"body":"so then the judgment comes in."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1039.049,"endTime":1041.629,"body":"And instead of like, what if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1041.629,"endTime":1044.659,"body":"that wasn't bad? Like, what if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1041.629,"endTime":1044.659,"body":"it wasn't bad that that was your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1044.659,"endTime":1047.359,"body":"response like that the innate"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1044.659,"endTime":1047.359,"body":"response you had was one of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1047.359,"endTime":1051.049,"body":"like, Oh, I can't do this. What"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1047.359,"endTime":1051.049,"body":"if we got curious about where"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1051.049,"endTime":1054.829,"body":"that comes from? And what maybe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1051.049,"endTime":1054.829,"body":"is going on and why that exists?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1054.859,"endTime":1056.959,"body":"Maybe it's not bad that it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1054.859,"endTime":1056.959,"body":"exists. Maybe it served a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1056.959,"endTime":1059.989,"body":"purpose at some point, let's say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1056.959,"endTime":1059.989,"body":"curious about what purpose that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1059.989,"endTime":1062.479,"body":"could have served. And it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1059.989,"endTime":1062.479,"body":"interesting when we can start to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1062.479,"endTime":1065.539,"body":"like resolve those things like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1062.479,"endTime":1065.539,"body":"Oh, that's not bad. That was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1065.539,"endTime":1068.629,"body":"actually helping me for some"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1065.539,"endTime":1068.629,"body":"reason. I wonder if it's still"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1068.629,"endTime":1072.259,"body":"helping me, we can start to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1068.629,"endTime":1072.259,"body":"like, take control of it, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1072.259,"endTime":1075.259,"body":"know, have more control over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1072.259,"endTime":1075.259,"body":"those biases than they have over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1075.259,"endTime":1078.979,"body":"us. And so anyhow, man, now"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1075.259,"endTime":1078.979,"body":"we're off to the races here."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1081.29,"endTime":1084.14,"body":"But it's true."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1081.29,"endTime":1084.14,"body":"And even the awareness that that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1084.14,"endTime":1088.1,"body":"is your instinct is to respond"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1084.14,"endTime":1088.1,"body":"in a particular way. Because"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1088.16,"endTime":1090.95,"body":"you're absolutely right."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1088.16,"endTime":1090.95,"body":"Sometimes those things service"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1090.98,"endTime":1095.51,"body":"and sometimes they don't. So as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1090.98,"endTime":1095.51,"body":"we start to notice them, and be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1095.51,"endTime":1101.54,"body":"aware of them, that really gives"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1095.51,"endTime":1101.54,"body":"us control over what's going on"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1101.57,"endTime":1104.3,"body":"and how our reactions are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1101.57,"endTime":1104.3,"body":"serving us or not."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1104.42,"endTime":1107.0,"body":"Yeah, but real"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1104.42,"endTime":1107.0,"body":"quick stick Connect. This is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1107.0,"endTime":1109.13,"body":"where we're going today. By the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1107.0,"endTime":1109.13,"body":"way, this is really important,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1109.16,"endTime":1113.03,"body":"because there's this great"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1109.16,"endTime":1113.03,"body":"Voltaire quote, he says, judge a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1113.03,"endTime":1116.6,"body":"man by his questions, not as"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1113.03,"endTime":1116.6,"body":"answers. And that's kind of what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1116.6,"endTime":1118.61,"body":"we're talking about when we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1116.6,"endTime":1118.61,"body":"talking about getting curious"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1118.61,"endTime":1121.73,"body":"and and the transmission side of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1118.61,"endTime":1121.73,"body":"things. And we're just talking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1121.73,"endTime":1124.97,"body":"about question asking, and even"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1121.73,"endTime":1124.97,"body":"today, we're going to talk about"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1124.97,"endTime":1129.35,"body":"getting clients and, and some"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1124.97,"endTime":1129.35,"body":"different strategies behind it."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1129.62,"endTime":1134.0,"body":"But the area that I want to get"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1129.62,"endTime":1134.0,"body":"to today is less of here's the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1134.0,"endTime":1137.03,"body":"answer for you. This is like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1134.0,"endTime":1137.03,"body":"exactly what to do step by step"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1137.03,"endTime":1140.57,"body":"and all that stuff. But I'd"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1137.03,"endTime":1140.57,"body":"rather ask some questions and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1140.57,"endTime":1144.17,"body":"invite even the audience into"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1140.57,"endTime":1144.17,"body":"asking themselves some questions"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1144.29,"endTime":1147.35,"body":"when it comes to their marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1144.29,"endTime":1147.35,"body":"strategies. Because man, y'all"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1147.35,"endTime":1151.4,"body":"are brilliant. You your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1147.35,"endTime":1151.4,"body":"listeners have so many ideas"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1151.58,"endTime":1154.94,"body":"that I haven't even like come up"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1151.58,"endTime":1154.94,"body":"with. I've never thought of I've"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1154.94,"endTime":1157.67,"body":"never considered the possibility"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1154.94,"endTime":1157.67,"body":"Not only that, but like you've"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1157.67,"endTime":1161.21,"body":"got people who are doing like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1157.67,"endTime":1161.21,"body":"you probably doing pet"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1161.21,"endTime":1165.98,"body":"photography. You've got like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1161.21,"endTime":1165.98,"body":"boudoir photographers, equine,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1165.98,"endTime":1172.67,"body":"f1, how do you get the horse or"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1165.98,"endTime":1172.67,"body":"I wrestled, got all these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1172.67,"endTime":1177.29,"body":"different niches that they're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1172.67,"endTime":1177.29,"body":"going to have different ways to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1177.29,"endTime":1180.47,"body":"get clients. And so rather than"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1177.29,"endTime":1180.47,"body":"me trying to give, here's the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1180.47,"endTime":1183.41,"body":"one thing to always get clients,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1180.47,"endTime":1183.41,"body":"I'd rather give you guys"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1183.41,"endTime":1186.71,"body":"questions to ask and this maybe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1183.41,"endTime":1186.71,"body":"just ties back to the Curiosity"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1186.71,"endTime":1189.95,"body":"thing. And the question asking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1186.71,"endTime":1189.95,"body":"kind of side of stuff. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1189.95,"endTime":1191.45,"body":"just to try to connect some dots"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1189.95,"endTime":1191.45,"body":"here,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1191.48,"endTime":1194.06,"body":"no, and I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1191.48,"endTime":1194.06,"body":"appreciate that you're doing"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1194.06,"endTime":1197.78,"body":"that out loud in my head. These"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1194.06,"endTime":1197.78,"body":"things are all super connected."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1198.08,"endTime":1200.87,"body":"So I'm glad that you put words"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1198.08,"endTime":1200.87,"body":"to that. For other people who"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1200.87,"endTime":1206.06,"body":"may think that I am off on a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1200.87,"endTime":1206.06,"body":"tangent way down the road. But"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1206.06,"endTime":1208.88,"body":"let's let's dive into that we're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1206.06,"endTime":1208.88,"body":"here. Let's go ahead and start"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1208.88,"endTime":1214.28,"body":"talking a little bit about the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1208.88,"endTime":1214.28,"body":"ever present puzzle that is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1214.28,"endTime":1218.12,"body":"marketing. You teach a class on"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1214.28,"endTime":1218.12,"body":"marketing. And we're going to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1218.12,"endTime":1221.24,"body":"talk about that a little bit."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1218.12,"endTime":1221.24,"body":"But I love the approach that you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1221.24,"endTime":1225.29,"body":"take, which really is comes from"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1221.24,"endTime":1225.29,"body":"a position of curiosity. Talk a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1225.29,"endTime":1226.13,"body":"little bit more about that."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1226.37,"endTime":1230.21,"body":"Yeah. So let's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1226.37,"endTime":1230.21,"body":"first kind of address the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1230.21,"endTime":1234.74,"body":"problem that we have. And like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1230.21,"endTime":1234.74,"body":"the big problem is like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1234.77,"endTime":1239.51,"body":"we need money. We need clients."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1234.77,"endTime":1239.51,"body":"We need people who are hiring us"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1239.51,"endTime":1244.73,"body":"for our products and our"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1239.51,"endTime":1244.73,"body":"services. This is like the the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1244.76,"endTime":1248.66,"body":"big question that everybody has,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1244.76,"endTime":1248.66,"body":"like, I bet if I could, if I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1248.66,"endTime":1251.81,"body":"could, this is this would be a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1248.66,"endTime":1251.81,"body":"terrifying thing for your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1251.81,"endTime":1254.0,"body":"audience to imagine right now."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1251.81,"endTime":1254.0,"body":"But if I could see your Google"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1254.0,"endTime":1258.44,"body":"search history, okay, I will get"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1254.0,"endTime":1258.44,"body":"past all the other stuff. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1258.44,"endTime":1262.61,"body":"then I'm sure somewhere in there"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1258.44,"endTime":1262.61,"body":"is how do I get clients how to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1262.61,"endTime":1265.4,"body":"market my photography business,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1262.61,"endTime":1265.4,"body":"how to run Facebook ads, how to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1265.43,"endTime":1269.78,"body":"do whatever it is, right? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1265.43,"endTime":1269.78,"body":"Oh, man, my heart. This is like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1269.78,"endTime":1271.58,"body":"oh, my goodness, wait,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1271.61,"endTime":1272.21,"body":"hold on,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1272.81,"endTime":1276.26,"body":"clear my cache,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1272.81,"endTime":1276.26,"body":"clear my cache. And so what we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1276.26,"endTime":1280.1,"body":"need is we as we're, as we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1276.26,"endTime":1280.1,"body":"thinking about our marketing,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1281.3,"endTime":1284.84,"body":"man, where we have so many hats,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1281.3,"endTime":1284.84,"body":"don't we, we're like the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1284.84,"endTime":1287.87,"body":"photographer with a copywriter."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1284.84,"endTime":1287.87,"body":"We're a web designer, we're the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1287.9,"endTime":1291.89,"body":"editor, we're the receptionist,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1287.9,"endTime":1291.89,"body":"with a salesperson, we're all"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1291.89,"endTime":1294.8,"body":"these things. And we've somehow"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1291.89,"endTime":1294.8,"body":"got to figure out how to market"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1294.8,"endTime":1299.45,"body":"our business. And so what we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1294.8,"endTime":1299.45,"body":"need is we need for our time to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1299.45,"endTime":1302.84,"body":"go farther, right? Like, if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1299.45,"endTime":1302.84,"body":"we're going to spend time on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1302.84,"endTime":1305.3,"body":"something to get new clients in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1302.84,"endTime":1305.3,"body":"the door, we need that time to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1305.3,"endTime":1308.3,"body":"go farther. But we also need our"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1305.3,"endTime":1308.3,"body":"marketing dollars to go farther,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1308.3,"endTime":1312.74,"body":"because I don't know if you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1308.3,"endTime":1312.74,"body":"like me, but like, especially"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1312.74,"endTime":1315.41,"body":"when I just started off like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1312.74,"endTime":1315.41,"body":"Man, I'm trying to figure out"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1315.41,"endTime":1317.9,"body":"how to afford new equipment, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1315.41,"endTime":1317.9,"body":"trying to figure out how to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1317.9,"endTime":1322.4,"body":"afford all this software,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1317.9,"endTime":1322.4,"body":"contracts all of these things."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1322.58,"endTime":1324.68,"body":"And then on top of it, I've got"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1322.58,"endTime":1324.68,"body":"to figure out how to make my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1324.68,"endTime":1331.46,"body":"marketing dollars actually work"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1324.68,"endTime":1331.46,"body":"for me. And so chain reaction"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1331.46,"endTime":1337.04,"body":"marketing is kind of like the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1331.46,"endTime":1337.04,"body":"the the term that I would use to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1337.04,"endTime":1340.43,"body":"describe what we're going to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1337.04,"endTime":1340.43,"body":"talk about today. And this is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1340.46,"endTime":1342.95,"body":"this is something that you can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1340.46,"endTime":1342.95,"body":"use to make your dollars go"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1342.95,"endTime":1346.43,"body":"farther to make your time go"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1342.95,"endTime":1346.43,"body":"farther to really supercharge"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1346.49,"endTime":1352.79,"body":"any current marketing strategy"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1346.49,"endTime":1352.79,"body":"that you already have. Okay. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1352.79,"endTime":1359.96,"body":"so feel free to stop interrupt"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1352.79,"endTime":1359.96,"body":"me at any point, surely. But so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1359.96,"endTime":1361.85,"body":"what is chain reaction"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1359.96,"endTime":1361.85,"body":"marketing? Well, I think to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1361.88,"endTime":1366.02,"body":"start, let's start by, can I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1361.88,"endTime":1366.02,"body":"share my number one rule of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1366.02,"endTime":1371.24,"body":"marketing? This is my, this is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1366.02,"endTime":1371.24,"body":"my number one rule. Okay. I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1371.24,"endTime":1375.17,"body":"not gonna wait for you to give"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1371.24,"endTime":1375.17,"body":"me permission to say no, just I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1375.17,"endTime":1377.6,"body":"just knew I saw the look in your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1375.17,"endTime":1377.6,"body":"eye. Like she's gonna tell me"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1377.6,"endTime":1382.64,"body":"No. Okay, so Ben's number one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1377.6,"endTime":1382.64,"body":"rule of marketing? Is this, if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1383.03,"endTime":1389.03,"body":"the marketing effort is one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1383.03,"endTime":1389.03,"body":"dimensional, okay, if and I'll"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1389.03,"endTime":1391.34,"body":"explain what I even mean by"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1389.03,"endTime":1391.34,"body":"that, if the marketing effort is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1391.34,"endTime":1395.09,"body":"one dimensional, it's either"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1391.34,"endTime":1395.09,"body":"inefficient, and you shouldn't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1395.09,"endTime":1400.58,"body":"do it more far more likely, it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1395.09,"endTime":1400.58,"body":"just hasn't been thoroughly"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1400.58,"endTime":1404.21,"body":"thought through. Okay. So when I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1400.58,"endTime":1404.21,"body":"say the marketing effort, being"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1404.21,"endTime":1408.53,"body":"one dimensional, a one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1404.21,"endTime":1408.53,"body":"dimensional marketing effort,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1408.53,"endTime":1413.18,"body":"like imagine just like a book"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1408.53,"endTime":1413.18,"body":"that's like sitting upright, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1413.18,"endTime":1416.42,"body":"you topple the book over, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1413.18,"endTime":1416.42,"body":"it's like a one dimensional a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1416.42,"endTime":1420.26,"body":"unilateral move. I coach"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1416.42,"endTime":1420.26,"body":"photographers, I've been doing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1420.26,"endTime":1423.35,"body":"it for seven years. And, and the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1420.26,"endTime":1423.35,"body":"thing I keep hearing is like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1423.35,"endTime":1426.77,"body":"you're doing the right things"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1423.35,"endTime":1426.77,"body":"you're doing so much. It's like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1426.8,"endTime":1430.52,"body":"bad. I'm doing Facebook ads, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1426.8,"endTime":1430.52,"body":"I'm doing reels. And I'm doing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1430.52,"endTime":1434.09,"body":"Tick tock, and I got SEO going."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1430.52,"endTime":1434.09,"body":"And I'm posting blogs. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1435.47,"endTime":1438.41,"body":"again, all of the things yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1435.47,"endTime":1438.41,"body":"you're doing to market business."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1438.41,"endTime":1444.89,"body":"I've got vendor relationships,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1438.41,"endTime":1444.89,"body":"and word of mouth. And as I tend"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1444.89,"endTime":1449.06,"body":"to get behind the curtain, a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1444.89,"endTime":1449.06,"body":"little bit of the business, what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1449.06,"endTime":1452.39,"body":"I keep noticing over and over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1449.06,"endTime":1452.39,"body":"and over is so many of these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1452.39,"endTime":1455.21,"body":"marketing efforts are one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1452.39,"endTime":1455.21,"body":"dimensional, meaning they're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1455.21,"endTime":1458.84,"body":"like disconnected. It's like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1455.21,"endTime":1458.84,"body":"well, I'm going to do a bridal"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1458.84,"endTime":1461.69,"body":"show here. And then I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1458.84,"endTime":1461.69,"body":"build relationships with vendors"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1461.72,"endTime":1464.48,"body":"here. And I'm going to run"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1461.72,"endTime":1464.48,"body":"Facebook ads here. And if you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1464.48,"endTime":1467.96,"body":"can kind of visualize this, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1464.48,"endTime":1467.96,"body":"like a whole bunch of dominoes"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1468.08,"endTime":1472.49,"body":"that are like separated, just a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1468.08,"endTime":1472.49,"body":"little bit too much yet. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1472.49,"endTime":1475.55,"body":"when one falls over, it's just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1472.49,"endTime":1475.55,"body":"kind of like a quiet little"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1476.12,"endTime":1480.56,"body":"kink. And then, and then we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1476.12,"endTime":1480.56,"body":"panicked because we need to do"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1480.56,"endTime":1484.13,"body":"more. And so we'd knock over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1480.56,"endTime":1484.13,"body":"another one Tink, and then we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1484.13,"endTime":1486.29,"body":"panicked because we're out of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1484.13,"endTime":1486.29,"body":"time, and so we knock over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1486.29,"endTime":1490.34,"body":"another one. And what I want to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1486.29,"endTime":1490.34,"body":"see happen and what I tend to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1490.34,"endTime":1493.97,"body":"work with photographers is how"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1490.34,"endTime":1493.97,"body":"do we link these marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1493.97,"endTime":1498.53,"body":"efforts together to create a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1493.97,"endTime":1498.53,"body":"chain reaction and the best"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1498.53,"endTime":1504.65,"body":"visual I can give for you is one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1498.53,"endTime":1504.65,"body":"that's like, I'd love to go back"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1504.65,"endTime":1508.19,"body":"in time to see the first example"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1504.65,"endTime":1508.19,"body":"of this ever given. But I see it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1508.19,"endTime":1512.51,"body":"happen in comedies and in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1508.19,"endTime":1512.51,"body":"cartoons a lot. And so I'm going"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1512.51,"endTime":1516.71,"body":"to set the scene here, the the,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1512.51,"endTime":1516.71,"body":"the, the kind of comedic"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1516.71,"endTime":1522.56,"body":"character, they walk into a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1516.71,"endTime":1522.56,"body":"museum. And it cuts to a shot of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1522.56,"endTime":1526.79,"body":"like all of these, like super"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1522.56,"endTime":1526.79,"body":"rare fragile artifacts in the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1526.79,"endTime":1530.15,"body":"museum. And in the center of the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1526.79,"endTime":1530.15,"body":"museum is like a Tyrannosaurus"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1530.15,"endTime":1534.2,"body":"Rex. bone structure, right. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1530.15,"endTime":1534.2,"body":"you already know where this is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1534.2,"endTime":1538.79,"body":"going. Yeah, and they're kind of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1534.2,"endTime":1538.79,"body":"like clumsy. And they like trip,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1538.85,"endTime":1541.07,"body":"and they almost fall into the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1538.85,"endTime":1541.07,"body":"dinosaur bone. But then they"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1541.07,"endTime":1545.03,"body":"catch themselves. But then out"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1541.07,"endTime":1545.03,"body":"of their pocket, like a penny"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1545.03,"endTime":1548.9,"body":"falls, and then the penny rolls,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1545.03,"endTime":1548.9,"body":"and it knocks over a cup. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1548.9,"endTime":1551.69,"body":"then a cup knocks over a book."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1548.9,"endTime":1551.69,"body":"And then the book knocks over a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1551.69,"endTime":1554.15,"body":"vase. And then the vase knocks"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1551.69,"endTime":1554.15,"body":"over a pillar, and then the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1554.15,"endTime":1557.6,"body":"pillar max over a suit of armor,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1554.15,"endTime":1557.6,"body":"and then the suit of armor, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1557.6,"endTime":1559.76,"body":"get this, you know, and then"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1557.6,"endTime":1559.76,"body":"boom, boom, boom, and it keeps"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1559.76,"endTime":1564.02,"body":"toppling, and eventually, the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1559.76,"endTime":1564.02,"body":"suit of armor, you know, knocks"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1564.02,"endTime":1566.96,"body":"into the train of source racks,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1564.02,"endTime":1566.96,"body":"and the whole thing comes"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1566.96,"endTime":1571.25,"body":"tumbling down. That love it,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1566.96,"endTime":1571.25,"body":"what you want to have happen"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1571.64,"endTime":1574.52,"body":"with your marketing, that would"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1571.64,"endTime":1574.52,"body":"be chain reaction marketing. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1574.52,"endTime":1579.17,"body":"what happens is, it is an"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1574.52,"endTime":1579.17,"body":"exponential thing. It's it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1579.2,"endTime":1582.38,"body":"this, that little Penny"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1579.2,"endTime":1582.38,"body":"eventually knocks over the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1582.38,"endTime":1585.38,"body":"traders arthrex essentially,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1582.38,"endTime":1585.38,"body":"it's a transfer of energy. But"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1585.38,"endTime":1590.09,"body":"it's that toppling effect. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1585.38,"endTime":1590.09,"body":"so if we can do that, then our"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1590.09,"endTime":1592.07,"body":"money is going to go so much"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1590.09,"endTime":1592.07,"body":"further in our time is going to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1592.07,"endTime":1593.69,"body":"go so much further. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1592.07,"endTime":1593.69,"body":"eventually we're going to hit"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1593.69,"endTime":1597.05,"body":"this kind of like critical mass"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1593.69,"endTime":1597.05,"body":"with our marketing, where when"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1597.05,"endTime":1600.5,"body":"the train of source Rex falls,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1597.05,"endTime":1600.5,"body":"what that looks like in your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1600.5,"endTime":1605.03,"body":"business is like, Man, you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1600.5,"endTime":1605.03,"body":"booked out, not only are you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1605.03,"endTime":1608.75,"body":"booked out, but you're booked"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1605.03,"endTime":1608.75,"body":"out at like, the top, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1608.75,"endTime":1612.89,"body":"for me, and I get that there's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1608.75,"endTime":1612.89,"body":"waiting for divers, who are you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1613.1,"endTime":1616.49,"body":"at is such a higher level. For"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1613.1,"endTime":1616.49,"body":"me, that's like our average"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1616.49,"endTime":1620.57,"body":"before we do print sales is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1616.49,"endTime":1620.57,"body":"9400, then we do another 3000"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1620.57,"endTime":1626.06,"body":"with print on top of it. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1620.57,"endTime":1626.06,"body":"it 12,400 is where I want to be"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1626.06,"endTime":1630.89,"body":"booked out your 2022 by the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1626.06,"endTime":1630.89,"body":"dinosaurs fallen and I'm in a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1630.89,"endTime":1634.67,"body":"great position, right? I'm going"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1630.89,"endTime":1634.67,"body":"to stop talking."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1634.82,"endTime":1637.55,"body":"No, I and I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1634.82,"endTime":1637.55,"body":"didn't interrupt you, because I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1637.55,"endTime":1640.37,"body":"was completely following where"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1637.55,"endTime":1640.37,"body":"you were going. And it's that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1640.37,"endTime":1645.32,"body":"it's such, that's such a great"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1640.37,"endTime":1645.32,"body":"way to explain it. Because, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1645.32,"endTime":1648.38,"body":"know, it's like being in first"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1645.32,"endTime":1648.38,"body":"gear on a bicycle, it's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1648.38,"endTime":1651.41,"body":"important, you have to do that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1648.38,"endTime":1651.41,"body":"first little bit of work. But"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1651.41,"endTime":1655.94,"body":"the idea is that eventually"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1651.41,"endTime":1655.94,"body":"you're able to change gears and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1655.94,"endTime":1660.29,"body":"not do that much work to go that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1655.94,"endTime":1660.29,"body":"far and change gears of the gas."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1660.29,"endTime":1665.24,"body":"So it's a similar kind of thing."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1660.29,"endTime":1665.24,"body":"So I absolutely love all of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1665.24,"endTime":1670.79,"body":"that. But my question to you. So"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1665.24,"endTime":1670.79,"body":"how do you get there? How do you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1670.79,"endTime":1675.38,"body":"go from all the little dominoes"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1670.79,"endTime":1675.38,"body":"separated on the table? Just to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1675.47,"endTime":1677.96,"body":"a little bit too far that you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1675.47,"endTime":1677.96,"body":"know, they're not knocking each"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1677.96,"endTime":1682.79,"body":"other down? What questions are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1677.96,"endTime":1682.79,"body":"you asking what curious thought"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1682.79,"endTime":1687.53,"body":"process? Are you following to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1682.79,"endTime":1687.53,"body":"design a domino effect that will"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1687.53,"endTime":1688.58,"body":"serve your business?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1688.61,"endTime":1691.22,"body":"Yeah, well, even on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1688.61,"endTime":1691.22,"body":"that note, I want to first"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1691.22,"endTime":1695.9,"body":"encourage your listeners right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1691.22,"endTime":1695.9,"body":"now that like my guesses, like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1695.93,"endTime":1698.45,"body":"all the things that they're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1695.93,"endTime":1698.45,"body":"doing, they probably don't need"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1698.45,"endTime":1701.66,"body":"to make like that big of an"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1698.45,"endTime":1701.66,"body":"adjustment, like you're already"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1701.66,"endTime":1706.01,"body":"doing so much work. And if we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1701.66,"endTime":1706.01,"body":"can just adjust a couple things,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1706.01,"endTime":1707.81,"body":"if we could just dial it in a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1706.01,"endTime":1707.81,"body":"little bit more, if we could"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1707.81,"endTime":1711.41,"body":"just think it through a little"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1707.81,"endTime":1711.41,"body":"bit more thoroughly, then that's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1711.41,"endTime":1716.54,"body":"all it takes. I think a lot of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1711.41,"endTime":1716.54,"body":"times, probably marketers,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1717.32,"endTime":1722.24,"body":"photography educators have"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1717.32,"endTime":1722.24,"body":"gotten you to buy in or believe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1722.45,"endTime":1725.81,"body":"that there is some secret Juju"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1722.45,"endTime":1725.81,"body":"that you need to do this thing."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1725.81,"endTime":1728.9,"body":"And when you do it, it's gonna"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1725.81,"endTime":1728.9,"body":"be the domino that's gonna knock"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1728.9,"endTime":1731.81,"body":"over the Tyrannosaurus Rex and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1728.9,"endTime":1731.81,"body":"all your problems will be fixed."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1732.08,"endTime":1735.32,"body":"In all reality, you're probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1732.08,"endTime":1735.32,"body":"doing pretty much all the right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1735.44,"endTime":1737.54,"body":"air quotes all the right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1735.44,"endTime":1737.54,"body":"marketing efforts. It's just we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1737.54,"endTime":1740.3,"body":"just need to adjust how you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1737.54,"endTime":1740.3,"body":"showing up in them, and how you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1740.3,"endTime":1741.86,"body":"can connect them. Does that make"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1740.3,"endTime":1741.86,"body":"sense?"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1741.92,"endTime":1744.17,"body":"It makes total"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1741.92,"endTime":1744.17,"body":"sense. And I want to just pause"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1744.17,"endTime":1746.48,"body":"and underline something that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1744.17,"endTime":1746.48,"body":"you're saying. Because one of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1746.48,"endTime":1749.51,"body":"the mistakes when it comes to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1746.48,"endTime":1749.51,"body":"marketing that I see a lot of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1749.57,"endTime":1752.33,"body":"photographers make and that like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1749.57,"endTime":1752.33,"body":"I'll raise my hand I have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1752.33,"endTime":1756.29,"body":"totally made before. It feels"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1752.33,"endTime":1756.29,"body":"like something isn't working, or"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1756.29,"endTime":1759.74,"body":"I'm not getting the results that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1756.29,"endTime":1759.74,"body":"I want. So instead of tweaking,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1759.77,"endTime":1762.5,"body":"I just like wipe the table clean"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1759.77,"endTime":1762.5,"body":"and start over with new"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1762.5,"endTime":1766.34,"body":"dominoes. And what you're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1762.5,"endTime":1766.34,"body":"pointing out about making small"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1766.34,"endTime":1770.18,"body":"adjustments and really"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1766.34,"endTime":1770.18,"body":"questioning what, okay, how can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1770.18,"endTime":1773.12,"body":"I move this just a little bit so"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1770.18,"endTime":1773.12,"body":"that you're not doing all that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1773.12,"endTime":1777.86,"body":"work over and over. And starting"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1773.12,"endTime":1777.86,"body":"from scratch. I think that that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1777.86,"endTime":1780.74,"body":"is a really important thing"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1777.86,"endTime":1780.74,"body":"because we do have very limited"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1780.74,"endTime":1786.32,"body":"time resources as usually"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1780.74,"endTime":1786.32,"body":"solopreneurs and wearing all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1786.32,"endTime":1792.53,"body":"these hats that it is it is an"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1786.32,"endTime":1792.53,"body":"extreme waste of our resources"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1792.53,"endTime":1797.51,"body":"and our energy to try and like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1792.53,"endTime":1797.51,"body":"start, build and then restart"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1797.51,"endTime":1800.0,"body":"and rebuild over and over again."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1797.51,"endTime":1800.0,"body":"But it's something you see all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1800.0,"endTime":1800.57,"body":"All the time,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1801.2,"endTime":1805.46,"body":"and it tends to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1801.2,"endTime":1805.46,"body":"leave photographers a little"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1805.46,"endTime":1809.15,"body":"bit. How do I put this? I'm not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1805.46,"endTime":1809.15,"body":"sure what the right word is."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1809.36,"endTime":1813.05,"body":"Maybe you can help me find the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1809.36,"endTime":1813.05,"body":"word that's not like bitter."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1813.05,"endTime":1816.11,"body":"It's not resentful. It's like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1813.05,"endTime":1816.11,"body":"um, they've almost they've made"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1816.11,"endTime":1817.94,"body":"up their mind about certain"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1816.11,"endTime":1817.94,"body":"things. Yeah, there's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1818.12,"endTime":1819.35,"body":"a fatalism"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1818.12,"endTime":1819.35,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1819.53,"endTime":1821.93,"body":"Yes, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1819.53,"endTime":1821.93,"body":"well, so you know, out coach"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1821.93,"endTime":1826.04,"body":"divers not be like, Well, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1821.93,"endTime":1826.04,"body":"so let's talk about this thing,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1826.07,"endTime":1830.21,"body":"x. And they'll be like, oh, I've"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1826.07,"endTime":1830.21,"body":"already done x. x didn't work,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1830.21,"endTime":1833.33,"body":"work. Work. I'm like, well,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1830.21,"endTime":1833.33,"body":"maybe it's because you messed it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1833.33,"endTime":1838.16,"body":"up. We were like, well, and I've"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1833.33,"endTime":1838.16,"body":"seen this all the time. Again,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1838.16,"endTime":1841.55,"body":"wedding photographer here with"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1838.16,"endTime":1841.55,"body":"bridal shows, I've man bridal"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1841.55,"endTime":1844.28,"body":"shows have gotten such a bad rap"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1841.55,"endTime":1844.28,"body":"for just being like, well,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1844.28,"endTime":1847.67,"body":"that's only where a budget"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1844.28,"endTime":1847.67,"body":"brides are. A, that's where your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1847.7,"endTime":1850.1,"body":"new photographers are, it's a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1847.7,"endTime":1850.1,"body":"waste of time, it's a waste of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1850.1,"endTime":1852.8,"body":"money, your ideal client can't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1850.1,"endTime":1852.8,"body":"be found there. They're not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1852.8,"endTime":1856.55,"body":"there. And so there's this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1852.8,"endTime":1856.55,"body":"narrative that kind of goes on."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1856.94,"endTime":1860.63,"body":"And I've discovered, I believe,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1856.94,"endTime":1860.63,"body":"I believe that by the way, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1860.63,"endTime":1865.4,"body":"have believed that I should say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1860.63,"endTime":1865.4,"body":"in the past, until I started to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1865.4,"endTime":1868.55,"body":"consider what else could be just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1865.4,"endTime":1868.55,"body":"as true if not more true, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1868.55,"endTime":1873.89,"body":"what if I was just doing them"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1868.55,"endTime":1873.89,"body":"wrong? I was like, What if it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1873.89,"endTime":1878.18,"body":"was my fault. And I've changed"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1873.89,"endTime":1878.18,"body":"the way that we do browsers now."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1878.18,"endTime":1882.17,"body":"And now, my average I expect"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1878.18,"endTime":1882.17,"body":"anytime I do a show is to walk"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1882.17,"endTime":1886.19,"body":"away with about 70,000 in sales,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1882.17,"endTime":1886.19,"body":"with amazing clients. And it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1886.19,"endTime":1892.04,"body":"very possible. It's, it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1886.19,"endTime":1892.04,"body":"the kind of a tangible idea of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1892.04,"endTime":1896.18,"body":"how we try something, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1892.04,"endTime":1896.18,"body":"work. And so we file it away as"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1896.21,"endTime":1902.21,"body":"mitt. And then what happens is,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1896.21,"endTime":1902.21,"body":"you know, we do that over and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1902.21,"endTime":1906.14,"body":"over, and eventually, we're just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1902.21,"endTime":1906.14,"body":"kind of like, and I feel so it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1906.14,"endTime":1908.21,"body":"such a sad thing to me, when I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1906.14,"endTime":1908.21,"body":"see a photographer who just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1908.21,"endTime":1910.4,"body":"says, No, I've done everything"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1908.21,"endTime":1910.4,"body":"and it didn't work, I'm giving"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1910.4,"endTime":1914.93,"body":"up. And they they just throw in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1910.4,"endTime":1914.93,"body":"the towel. Man again, just to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1914.93,"endTime":1917.54,"body":"encourage them. It's not a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1914.93,"endTime":1917.54,"body":"groundbreaking thing. It's not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1917.54,"endTime":1920.42,"body":"like this thing is gonna"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1917.54,"endTime":1920.42,"body":"completely blow your mind. It"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1920.42,"endTime":1926.48,"body":"never is. Truly, it's always the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1920.42,"endTime":1926.48,"body":"subtleties. Anyhow. So okay, so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1926.48,"endTime":1927.95,"body":"let's talk about this. Let's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1926.48,"endTime":1927.95,"body":"talk about some of these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1927.95,"endTime":1932.12,"body":"questions. I think the biggest"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1927.95,"endTime":1932.12,"body":"question that and and probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1932.12,"endTime":1934.4,"body":"the biggest thing is we want to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1932.12,"endTime":1934.4,"body":"make sure that we're knocking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1934.4,"endTime":1938.42,"body":"over the right, dinosaur bones."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1934.4,"endTime":1938.42,"body":"I keep using this analogy."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1938.45,"endTime":1941.24,"body":"That's good. I like it. Because"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1938.45,"endTime":1941.24,"body":"the other thing that I tend to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1941.24,"endTime":1945.35,"body":"coach for divers with is they've"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1941.24,"endTime":1945.35,"body":"knocked over this giant set of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1945.35,"endTime":1948.56,"body":"dinosaur bones. It just wasn't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1945.35,"endTime":1948.56,"body":"the trainer source Rex. It was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1948.56,"endTime":1951.38,"body":"like a Brachiosaurus. I don't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1948.56,"endTime":1951.38,"body":"even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1953.42,"endTime":1956.87,"body":"knew what it was"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1953.42,"endTime":1956.87,"body":"like these five dinosaurs. And"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1956.87,"endTime":1959.03,"body":"now there's like a million and I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1956.87,"endTime":1959.03,"body":"don't know, anyway, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1959.06,"endTime":1961.52,"body":"it's cool. It's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1959.06,"endTime":1961.52,"body":"like Triceratops T rex anyhow,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1961.7,"endTime":1964.28,"body":"so but they've knocked over the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1961.7,"endTime":1964.28,"body":"wrong dinosaur bone. Now they're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1964.28,"endTime":1967.31,"body":"looking at their life. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1964.28,"endTime":1967.31,"body":"they're like, they've built this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1967.31,"endTime":1971.06,"body":"business that now is a prison"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1967.31,"endTime":1971.06,"body":"because they were just going for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1971.06,"endTime":1973.37,"body":"more clients and more this and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1971.06,"endTime":1973.37,"body":"more that. And they never"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1973.37,"endTime":1978.02,"body":"stopped to consider like, what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1973.37,"endTime":1978.02,"body":"am I building? What is this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1978.02,"endTime":1980.69,"body":"actually moving me towards? I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1978.02,"endTime":1980.69,"body":"want to be traveling, I don't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1980.69,"endTime":1983.39,"body":"want to be doing weddings. I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1980.69,"endTime":1983.39,"body":"don't want to be stuck in Ohio."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1983.42,"endTime":1986.21,"body":"I want to be going around the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1983.42,"endTime":1986.21,"body":"world and doing other things."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1986.87,"endTime":1991.31,"body":"Yeah. And so I think the first"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1986.87,"endTime":1991.31,"body":"question that that you should"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1991.31,"endTime":1996.86,"body":"ask yourself is, how can I use"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1991.31,"endTime":1996.86,"body":"this marketing strategy?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1996.86,"endTime":2000.19,"body":"Whatever it is, right? So right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":1996.86,"endTime":2000.19,"body":"now, let's imagine you probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2000.19,"endTime":2002.2,"body":"need clients, you're thinking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2000.19,"endTime":2002.2,"body":"about something to do, you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2002.2,"endTime":2004.84,"body":"going to spend some time or"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2002.2,"endTime":2004.84,"body":"money on it, whatever that is."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2005.44,"endTime":2009.4,"body":"Maybe it's meeting with vendors"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2005.44,"endTime":2009.4,"body":"to give them vouchers for your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2009.4,"endTime":2016.3,"body":"business. Maybe it is a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2009.4,"endTime":2016.3,"body":"community. Not a raffle, but a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2016.3,"endTime":2023.29,"body":"fundraiser. So how can I use"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2016.3,"endTime":2023.29,"body":"that to move my business closer"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2023.68,"endTime":2029.11,"body":"to the vision that I have for my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2023.68,"endTime":2029.11,"body":"life? Because if you don't ask"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2029.11,"endTime":2031.0,"body":"that you're going to find"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2029.11,"endTime":2031.0,"body":"yourself face to face with a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2031.0,"endTime":2036.25,"body":"business coach being like, Hey,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2031.0,"endTime":2036.25,"body":"I, I want to start photographing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2036.25,"endTime":2039.43,"body":"elopements. And my whole year is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2036.25,"endTime":2039.43,"body":"booked out here in Ohio or"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2039.43,"endTime":2042.67,"body":"whatever the or whatever the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2039.43,"endTime":2042.67,"body":"thing is. And so then you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2042.67,"endTime":2046.24,"body":"trying to like, move against the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2042.67,"endTime":2046.24,"body":"grain. But what if we were to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2046.24,"endTime":2049.09,"body":"just like, keep moving ourselves"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2046.24,"endTime":2049.09,"body":"closer and closer to what we"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2049.09,"endTime":2051.76,"body":"actually want? Right? And it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2049.09,"endTime":2051.76,"body":"such a basic question, isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2052.24,"endTime":2055.27,"body":"But if we actually stopped to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2052.24,"endTime":2055.27,"body":"consider these Facebook ads, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2055.27,"endTime":2058.18,"body":"about to run. Alright, so I want"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2055.27,"endTime":2058.18,"body":"to get some more wedding clients"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2058.18,"endTime":2061.42,"body":"for 2022. And I'm going to run"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2058.18,"endTime":2061.42,"body":"some Facebook ads, and maybe I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2061.42,"endTime":2065.05,"body":"going to do a giveaway. How can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2061.42,"endTime":2065.05,"body":"I use this giveaway? By the way?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2065.05,"endTime":2067.99,"body":"I'm just making up examples."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2065.05,"endTime":2067.99,"body":"These aren't like whether or not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2067.99,"endTime":2069.85,"body":"you believe in giveaways, that's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2067.99,"endTime":2069.85,"body":"fine. How can I use this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2069.85,"endTime":2074.62,"body":"giveaway? To get wedding clients"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2069.85,"endTime":2074.62,"body":"in 2022? How can I use this to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2074.62,"endTime":2077.32,"body":"move me closer to the vision"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2074.62,"endTime":2077.32,"body":"that I have for my business in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2077.32,"endTime":2080.74,"body":"my life? Well, it probably need"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2077.32,"endTime":2080.74,"body":"to figure out what your vision"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2080.74,"endTime":2083.44,"body":"is for your business in your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2080.74,"endTime":2083.44,"body":"life. And I think that probably"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2083.44,"endTime":2085.9,"body":"be the very first thing before"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2083.44,"endTime":2085.9,"body":"you do any marketing effort. Try"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2085.9,"endTime":2088.12,"body":"to figure out what what are you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2085.9,"endTime":2088.12,"body":"trying to build? What is the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2088.12,"endTime":2090.58,"body":"life that you're trying to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2088.12,"endTime":2090.58,"body":"design for yourself? Because"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2090.58,"endTime":2094.78,"body":"man, you can design your life. I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2090.58,"endTime":2094.78,"body":"don't think you realize that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2094.78,"endTime":2097.78,"body":"because you're so concerned"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2094.78,"endTime":2097.78,"body":"about getting clients that the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2097.78,"endTime":2100.0,"body":"scarcity is just driving you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2097.78,"endTime":2100.0,"body":"towards I need more clients."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2103.51,"body":"need more money? But pause?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2103.51,"body":"Because before you want more"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2103.51,"endTime":2106.27,"body":"clients more money, let's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2103.51,"endTime":2106.27,"body":"consider what is the life that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2106.27,"endTime":2108.46,"body":"you want to build? What is this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2106.27,"endTime":2108.46,"body":"thing that you want to design?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2108.55,"endTime":2113.17,"body":"I've made that mistake already,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2108.55,"endTime":2113.17,"body":"probably three times. Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2113.17,"endTime":2115.78,"body":"just like woke up one day, and I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2113.17,"endTime":2115.78,"body":"was like, shit."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2117.67,"endTime":2120.97,"body":"Well, I'm always"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2117.67,"endTime":2120.97,"body":"impressed when I mean, I am now"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2121.09,"endTime":2124.96,"body":"in my early 40s. And I feel like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2121.09,"endTime":2124.96,"body":"it has taken me close to this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2124.96,"endTime":2128.47,"body":"long to get to a place where I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2124.96,"endTime":2128.47,"body":"really have a handle on that."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2128.47,"endTime":2132.4,"body":"That's the point. Whereas for so"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2128.47,"endTime":2132.4,"body":"long, I was doing a lot of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2132.4,"endTime":2137.32,"body":"things well, but they weren't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2132.4,"endTime":2137.32,"body":"necessarily serving me or my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2137.32,"endTime":2142.09,"body":"goals. It was just kind of like"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2137.32,"endTime":2142.09,"body":"checking the boxes. So I 100%"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2142.09,"endTime":2146.47,"body":"agree with you that if you start"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2142.09,"endTime":2146.47,"body":"with your why start with what's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2146.47,"endTime":2148.84,"body":"the goal here? What are we"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2146.47,"endTime":2148.84,"body":"actually trying to get to and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2148.84,"endTime":2152.38,"body":"that not only can be different"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2148.84,"endTime":2152.38,"body":"for different people, it should"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2152.38,"endTime":2155.77,"body":"be different for different"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2152.38,"endTime":2155.77,"body":"people, like you're living your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2155.77,"endTime":2158.98,"body":"best life. It's not me living my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2155.77,"endTime":2158.98,"body":"best life. Right? We have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2158.98,"endTime":2161.74,"body":"different visions for that,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2158.98,"endTime":2161.74,"body":"probably out of I guess, I don't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2161.74,"endTime":2165.88,"body":"know, we could talk about it."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2161.74,"endTime":2165.88,"body":"But that, you know, the there"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2165.88,"endTime":2169.45,"body":"are as many goals out there as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2165.88,"endTime":2169.45,"body":"there are people and so you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2169.45,"endTime":2171.88,"body":"know, it's really easy to look"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2169.45,"endTime":2171.88,"body":"around and see other some"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2171.91,"endTime":2175.03,"body":"somebody else's version of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2171.91,"endTime":2175.03,"body":"success and start walking toward"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2175.03,"endTime":2178.15,"body":"that mountain. And like, you may"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2175.03,"endTime":2178.15,"body":"find yourself halfway there"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2178.15,"endTime":2183.13,"body":"being like, Ah, this isn't, I'm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2178.15,"endTime":2183.13,"body":"getting no joy from this. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2183.28,"endTime":2187.69,"body":"yeah. And it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2183.28,"endTime":2187.69,"body":"becomes, it becomes far more"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2187.75,"endTime":2191.65,"body":"motivating for for myself, I'll"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2187.75,"endTime":2191.65,"body":"just speak to myself here right"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2191.65,"endTime":2195.85,"body":"now, I'm far more motivated,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2191.65,"endTime":2195.85,"body":"with my choices and my actions"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2195.85,"endTime":2199.72,"body":"and my determination, when it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2195.85,"endTime":2199.72,"body":"not just money behind the seat."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2199.93,"endTime":2205.18,"body":"100%, right, when the goal isn't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2199.93,"endTime":2205.18,"body":"more money, but the goal is how"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2205.18,"endTime":2209.92,"body":"do I figure out a way to take my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2205.18,"endTime":2209.92,"body":"daughter to school and drop her"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2209.92,"endTime":2212.26,"body":"off every day, just so I can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2209.92,"endTime":2212.26,"body":"spend that little bit of time"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2212.26,"endTime":2214.84,"body":"with her in the morning and just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2212.26,"endTime":2214.84,"body":"ask her some questions and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2214.84,"endTime":2217.87,"body":"connect with her. Yeah, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2214.84,"endTime":2217.87,"body":"what if that were the goal? Not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2217.9,"endTime":2220.45,"body":"necessarily more money? Or what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2217.9,"endTime":2220.45,"body":"if the goal I mean, man, for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2220.45,"endTime":2223.0,"body":"some people that goal? What if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2220.45,"endTime":2223.0,"body":"the goal is like to leave a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2223.0,"endTime":2226.03,"body":"toxic relationship or to step"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2223.0,"endTime":2226.03,"body":"away from something? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2226.06,"endTime":2228.85,"body":"And I think what"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2226.06,"endTime":2228.85,"body":"people lose sight of is the fact"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2228.85,"endTime":2232.09,"body":"that money is not the goal."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2228.85,"endTime":2232.09,"body":"Those things are the goal. Money"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2232.09,"endTime":2236.29,"body":"is just like, the oil in the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2232.09,"endTime":2236.29,"body":"gears, right? It just helps."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2236.65,"endTime":2241.09,"body":"Often, sometimes it defeats"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2236.65,"endTime":2241.09,"body":"that, but oftentimes, that's the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2241.09,"endTime":2244.72,"body":"means to achieve certain things."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2241.09,"endTime":2244.72,"body":"If you have to work three jobs,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2244.93,"endTime":2246.82,"body":"you may not be able to take your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2244.93,"endTime":2246.82,"body":"daughter to school in the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2246.82,"endTime":2249.76,"body":"morning, because you're already"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2246.82,"endTime":2249.76,"body":"at work. So yeah, it is it is a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2249.76,"endTime":2252.58,"body":"means to an end, it shouldn't be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2249.76,"endTime":2252.58,"body":"the end itself."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2252.7,"endTime":2255.46,"body":"Yep. The goal say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2252.7,"endTime":2255.46,"body":"no. What if I just wanted to say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2255.46,"endTime":2258.64,"body":"no, for once in my life, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2255.46,"endTime":2258.64,"body":"when someone contacts me, I was"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2258.64,"endTime":2260.44,"body":"like, No, I don't need that. I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2258.64,"endTime":2260.44,"body":"don't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2260.44,"endTime":2264.4,"body":"need so much not"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2260.44,"endTime":2264.4,"body":"interested. So what are some of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2264.4,"endTime":2265.33,"body":"the other questions?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2265.36,"endTime":2269.14,"body":"Okay, yeah, sorry."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2265.36,"endTime":2269.14,"body":"Okay. So Other questions? I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2269.14,"endTime":2272.62,"body":"think one of the first ones that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2269.14,"endTime":2272.62,"body":"I'm always asked myself is,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2272.77,"endTime":2278.77,"body":"listen, we are a, we are in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2272.77,"endTime":2278.77,"body":"local service business, right?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2278.95,"endTime":2282.07,"body":"Like, this is what we do, we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2278.95,"endTime":2282.07,"body":"in our local market. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2282.07,"endTime":2284.47,"body":"because of that, the more that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2282.07,"endTime":2284.47,"body":"we you can get connected with"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2284.47,"endTime":2287.68,"body":"your local industry, your local"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2284.47,"endTime":2287.68,"body":"community, the better, the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2287.68,"endTime":2290.38,"body":"absolute better. And I think"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2287.68,"endTime":2290.38,"body":"we've discovered that and after"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2290.38,"endTime":2293.92,"body":"2020, that we aren't an island"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2290.38,"endTime":2293.92,"body":"that like I've seen the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2293.92,"endTime":2298.42,"body":"businesses that have survived"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2293.92,"endTime":2298.42,"body":"this thing. A lot of them, they"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2298.42,"endTime":2301.63,"body":"supported each other, they came"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2298.42,"endTime":2301.63,"body":"together to support each other."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2301.63,"endTime":2304.57,"body":"And so who else can I partner"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2301.63,"endTime":2304.57,"body":"with? What other business? What"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2304.57,"endTime":2308.11,"body":"other individual can i partner"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2304.57,"endTime":2308.11,"body":"with? In this marketing effort?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2308.23,"endTime":2310.33,"body":"Is there any possible way I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2308.23,"endTime":2310.33,"body":"could partner with someone to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2310.33,"endTime":2314.29,"body":"make it a success? How can I do"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2310.33,"endTime":2314.29,"body":"that? Right? And if you spend"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2314.32,"endTime":2318.82,"body":"five to 10 minutes, just really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2314.32,"endTime":2318.82,"body":"thinking about that man, who can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2318.82,"endTime":2321.55,"body":"i partner with this? Who are the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2318.82,"endTime":2321.55,"body":"relationships that I already"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2321.55,"endTime":2325.27,"body":"have that I can bring into this?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2321.55,"endTime":2325.27,"body":"But also, man, I don't have any"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2325.27,"endTime":2327.67,"body":"relationships? What if you just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2325.27,"endTime":2327.67,"body":"started and you're like, man, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2327.67,"endTime":2331.24,"body":"don't know nobody? Perfect? How"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2327.67,"endTime":2331.24,"body":"could you use this marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2331.24,"endTime":2335.98,"body":"effort to introduce and to start"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2331.24,"endTime":2335.98,"body":"new relationships, right to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2335.98,"endTime":2339.76,"body":"bring into this? I think that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2335.98,"endTime":2339.76,"body":"can be a really powerful"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2339.76,"endTime":2343.39,"body":"question that question alone, if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2339.76,"endTime":2343.39,"body":"you were to do every single"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2343.39,"endTime":2346.93,"body":"marketing effort, with a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2343.39,"endTime":2346.93,"body":"partnership with a relationship"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2346.93,"endTime":2350.62,"body":"in a meaningful and intentional"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2346.93,"endTime":2350.62,"body":"way, already, your effort is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2350.62,"endTime":2354.31,"body":"going to be exponentially"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2350.62,"endTime":2354.31,"body":"multiplied. Yeah. And the really"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2354.31,"endTime":2356.98,"body":"cool thing about that, too, is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2354.31,"endTime":2356.98,"body":"like when the marketing effort"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2356.98,"endTime":2361.36,"body":"is done, when it's over when"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2356.98,"endTime":2361.36,"body":"it's expired, or whatever it is,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2361.42,"endTime":2364.69,"body":"that relationship continues,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2361.42,"endTime":2364.69,"body":"right? And that relationship"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2364.69,"endTime":2369.04,"body":"continues to serve you continues"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2364.69,"endTime":2369.04,"body":"to serve them. This sometimes"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2369.04,"endTime":2372.19,"body":"can go hand in hand with that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2369.04,"endTime":2372.19,"body":"last question, but I always also"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2372.19,"endTime":2377.65,"body":"am trying to ask myself, okay,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2372.19,"endTime":2377.65,"body":"how can I move this marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2377.77,"endTime":2383.38,"body":"effort out from behind my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2377.77,"endTime":2383.38,"body":"screen? Okay, so maybe I'm doing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2384.04,"endTime":2388.81,"body":"some sort of Instagram contest,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2384.04,"endTime":2388.81,"body":"and I'm trying to gain a bunch"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2388.81,"endTime":2391.57,"body":"of followers. Or maybe I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2388.81,"endTime":2391.57,"body":"trying to build a Facebook"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2391.57,"endTime":2394.39,"body":"group, you know, and I'm doing a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2391.57,"endTime":2394.39,"body":"giveaway with that or some sort"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2394.39,"endTime":2398.59,"body":"of contest. Is there any way"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2394.39,"endTime":2398.59,"body":"that I could move even that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2398.59,"endTime":2401.71,"body":"effort out from behind screen."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2398.59,"endTime":2401.71,"body":"How can I do that? Is that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2401.71,"endTime":2405.76,"body":"possible? Yeah, can I do? And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2401.71,"endTime":2405.76,"body":"when I say out from behind the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2405.76,"endTime":2409.78,"body":"screen, maybe and I know with"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2405.76,"endTime":2409.78,"body":"COVID times, I think we're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2409.78,"endTime":2412.39,"body":"starting to move past that,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2409.78,"endTime":2412.39,"body":"where people are meeting in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2412.39,"endTime":2414.67,"body":"person a bit more, depending on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2412.39,"endTime":2414.67,"body":"what, where you're at in the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2414.67,"endTime":2418.24,"body":"country. Yeah, but maybe I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2414.67,"endTime":2418.24,"body":"should say past it, but like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2418.24,"endTime":2422.32,"body":"we're starting to see a little"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2418.24,"endTime":2422.32,"body":"bit of light. Maybe when I say"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2422.32,"endTime":2425.83,"body":"move out from behind the screen,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2422.32,"endTime":2425.83,"body":"maybe it just means at the very"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2425.83,"endTime":2430.06,"body":"least, like showing up, like air"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2425.83,"endTime":2430.06,"body":"quotes in person. Like, where"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2430.06,"endTime":2433.69,"body":"are you? You're like, right now,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2430.06,"endTime":2433.69,"body":"actually, I feel like in a way,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2433.72,"endTime":2436.03,"body":"where it's close to in person is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2433.72,"endTime":2436.03,"body":"we're gonna get right now on it."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2436.03,"endTime":2438.97,"body":"Yeah. Like, I'm seeing you on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2436.03,"endTime":2438.97,"body":"screen. We're connecting in this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2438.97,"endTime":2441.82,"body":"way. And it's different than"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2438.97,"endTime":2441.82,"body":"just an email. And it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2441.82,"endTime":2447.07,"body":"different than just a DM. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2441.82,"endTime":2447.07,"body":"how could you do that for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2447.1,"endTime":2449.98,"body":"anything that you're doing, get"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2447.1,"endTime":2449.98,"body":"out from behind the screen and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2449.98,"endTime":2453.49,"body":"get more in person? And maybe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2449.98,"endTime":2453.49,"body":"that means a phone call? Maybe"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2453.49,"endTime":2456.61,"body":"that means a voice message?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2453.49,"endTime":2456.61,"body":"Maybe that means a video"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2456.61,"endTime":2458.77,"body":"message? Okay,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2458.98,"endTime":2461.35,"body":"well, I'm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2458.98,"endTime":2461.35,"body":"thinking about opportunities"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2461.38,"endTime":2464.74,"body":"that are going to I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2461.38,"endTime":2464.74,"body":"think that that can go hand in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2464.74,"endTime":2469.0,"body":"hand with like, differentiating"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2464.74,"endTime":2469.0,"body":"yourself, right? Because so many"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2469.03,"endTime":2472.3,"body":"photographers specifically, but"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2469.03,"endTime":2472.3,"body":"just business people in general"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2472.3,"endTime":2476.17,"body":"service providers, small service"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2472.3,"endTime":2476.17,"body":"providers, we do we get really"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2476.17,"endTime":2479.2,"body":"comfortable behind the screen,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2476.17,"endTime":2479.2,"body":"right? It's very easy to like,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2479.2,"endTime":2481.84,"body":"put your pretty picture up on"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2479.2,"endTime":2481.84,"body":"Instagram and then respond to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2481.84,"endTime":2485.53,"body":"the comments that come in. It's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2481.84,"endTime":2485.53,"body":"very passive. When somebody dm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2485.59,"endTime":2488.89,"body":"you and you respond to them with"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2485.59,"endTime":2488.89,"body":"an even something as simple as a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2488.89,"endTime":2491.47,"body":"voice message where you're, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2488.89,"endTime":2491.47,"body":"know, leaving them audio"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2491.47,"endTime":2494.59,"body":"instead. Like that's different."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2491.47,"endTime":2494.59,"body":"It registers that different as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2494.59,"endTime":2498.04,"body":"different and it humanizes you."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2494.59,"endTime":2498.04,"body":"And I think that that human"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2498.04,"endTime":2501.07,"body":"connection has always been super"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2498.04,"endTime":2501.07,"body":"important, but has never been"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2501.07,"endTime":2504.7,"body":"more important than now because"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2501.07,"endTime":2504.7,"body":"it's harder to achieve."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2505.06,"endTime":2508.69,"body":"Yeah, I think the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2505.06,"endTime":2508.69,"body":"core behind that is like, for"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2508.69,"endTime":2513.34,"body":"anyone who's like, Yeah, but"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2508.69,"endTime":2513.34,"body":"that's scary. I'm like, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2513.34,"endTime":2514.75,"body":"that's why it's valuable."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2514.78,"endTime":2517.33,"body":"Yeah. It's why"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2514.78,"endTime":2517.33,"body":"it helps you stand out to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2517.51,"endTime":2519.94,"body":"Yes, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2517.51,"endTime":2519.94,"body":"you're Yeah, it's scary. It's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2519.94,"endTime":2522.67,"body":"like you're gonna need to be"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2519.94,"endTime":2522.67,"body":"vulnerable, which is exactly why"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2522.67,"endTime":2525.4,"body":"it is valuable. It's because"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2522.67,"endTime":2525.4,"body":"it's vulnerable. It's It's It's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2525.4,"endTime":2530.41,"body":"connection, it's opening"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2525.4,"endTime":2530.41,"body":"yourself up. And when you get to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2530.41,"endTime":2536.05,"body":"do that with people, and they"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2530.41,"endTime":2536.05,"body":"see that that is received as"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2536.08,"endTime":2538.96,"body":"value, there's no man Oh, now"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2536.08,"endTime":2538.96,"body":"we're going off into a value"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2538.96,"endTime":2542.05,"body":"conversation. I won't I won't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2538.96,"endTime":2542.05,"body":"derail this, by the way, but"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2542.05,"endTime":2544.6,"body":"like everyone's to know like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2542.05,"endTime":2544.6,"body":"how do I provide more value? How"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2544.6,"endTime":2548.86,"body":"do I raise my prices? Like, what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2544.6,"endTime":2548.86,"body":"is this thing called value? And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2548.86,"endTime":2555.76,"body":"I think we need to consider the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2548.86,"endTime":2555.76,"body":"outside pretty much we need to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2555.76,"endTime":2559.03,"body":"consider all the other"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2555.76,"endTime":2559.03,"body":"possibilities outside of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2559.03,"endTime":2562.57,"body":"functional value. Photographers"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2559.03,"endTime":2562.57,"body":"love functional value, well, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2562.57,"endTime":2564.91,"body":"gonna get it to them faster, and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2562.57,"endTime":2564.91,"body":"they're gonna get more images."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2565.18,"endTime":2568.63,"body":"But what about the intrinsic"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2565.18,"endTime":2568.63,"body":"value? What about esteem and"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2568.63,"endTime":2571.45,"body":"love and belonging? And we can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2568.63,"endTime":2571.45,"body":"go into Maslow's hierarchy of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2571.45,"endTime":2577.42,"body":"needs here. But to keep me on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2571.45,"endTime":2577.42,"body":"track, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2577.45,"endTime":2581.02,"body":"know, that's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2577.45,"endTime":2581.02,"body":"okay. Yeah, and I think that it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2581.02,"endTime":2585.16,"body":"is, back to your point about"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2581.02,"endTime":2585.16,"body":"vulnerability, how in the world"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2585.16,"endTime":2593.08,"body":"can we expect someone to fork"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2585.16,"endTime":2593.08,"body":"over $12,000 and, you know, nine"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2593.08,"endTime":2596.86,"body":"hours of time on their wedding"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2593.08,"endTime":2596.86,"body":"day spent in a room with their"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2596.86,"endTime":2601.39,"body":"new spouse and you like, that's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2596.86,"endTime":2601.39,"body":"a ton of vulnerability on their"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2601.39,"endTime":2605.02,"body":"part. If we're not willing to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2601.39,"endTime":2605.02,"body":"make a phone call, like, how can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2605.02,"endTime":2609.01,"body":"we ask that of them? Yeah, so I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2605.02,"endTime":2609.01,"body":"100%. Yeah, and just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2609.01,"endTime":2612.1,"body":"as much for boudoir"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2609.01,"endTime":2612.1,"body":"photographers, these incredibly"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2612.1,"endTime":2615.46,"body":"intimate moments, incredibly"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2612.1,"endTime":2615.46,"body":"vulnerable, newborn"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2615.46,"endTime":2620.11,"body":"photographers that you have a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2615.46,"endTime":2620.11,"body":"very small window of time that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2620.11,"endTime":2622.63,"body":"you're gonna be delivering this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2620.11,"endTime":2622.63,"body":"eat, man, even even when it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2622.66,"endTime":2625.6,"body":"getting into like larger family"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2622.66,"endTime":2625.6,"body":"photography. It's like hell, if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2625.6,"endTime":2628.96,"body":"I'm going to try to wrangle my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2625.6,"endTime":2628.96,"body":"three kids to like, go to some"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2628.96,"endTime":2633.13,"body":"damn park for 20 minutes, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2628.96,"endTime":2633.13,"body":"like, even that, and you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2633.31,"endTime":2634.9,"body":"gonna see all the chaos ensue."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2636.34,"endTime":2639.1,"body":"And even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2636.34,"endTime":2639.1,"body":"something as simple as that most"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2639.1,"endTime":2643.69,"body":"of our clients don't feel 100%"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2639.1,"endTime":2643.69,"body":"confident in their ability to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2643.69,"endTime":2648.58,"body":"look great on camera. So they're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2643.69,"endTime":2648.58,"body":"trusting you to give them these"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2648.58,"endTime":2651.7,"body":"images that they're hoping for."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2648.58,"endTime":2651.7,"body":"They're hiring you without being"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2651.7,"endTime":2654.88,"body":"able to see the the outcome"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2651.7,"endTime":2654.88,"body":"until after the fact. So you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2654.88,"endTime":2657.79,"body":"know, there's even a level of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2654.88,"endTime":2657.79,"body":"vulnerability there. I think"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2657.79,"endTime":2661.24,"body":"that we because we do it all the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2657.79,"endTime":2661.24,"body":"time. Because we are making"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2661.24,"endTime":2663.43,"body":"photos all the time. Of course,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2661.24,"endTime":2663.43,"body":"it's important to get on the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2663.43,"endTime":2665.59,"body":"other side of the camera"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2663.43,"endTime":2665.59,"body":"sometimes to remind yourself of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2665.59,"endTime":2669.31,"body":"what that feels like. But even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2665.59,"endTime":2669.31,"body":"still just remembering how hard"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2669.31,"endTime":2673.39,"body":"it is for some people to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2669.31,"endTime":2673.39,"body":"conceive of having their photos"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2673.39,"endTime":2674.71,"body":"made even if they want to."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2674.92,"endTime":2678.61,"body":"Yeah, so yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2674.92,"endTime":2678.61,"body":"when, you know, I get three"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2678.61,"endTime":2683.44,"body":"little ones here. And when it"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2678.61,"endTime":2683.44,"body":"comes or it came time for us to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2683.47,"endTime":2686.8,"body":"we were looking for, like a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2683.47,"endTime":2686.8,"body":"nanny for a period of time, even"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2686.8,"endTime":2691.69,"body":"a babysitter. Like I'm not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2686.8,"endTime":2691.69,"body":"having to watch my kids unless"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2691.69,"endTime":2696.04,"body":"we can connect over the phone or"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2691.69,"endTime":2696.04,"body":"in person. It's not it's not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2696.04,"endTime":2700.0,"body":"happening. There's no there's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2696.04,"endTime":2700.0,"body":"nothing. There's no possible"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2700.0,"endTime":2702.43,"body":"message that you can ever send"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2700.0,"endTime":2702.43,"body":"me that it's gonna say, yeah, go"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2702.43,"endTime":2708.49,"body":"take care of my three souls over"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2702.43,"endTime":2708.49,"body":"here. Like, and then some way"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2708.49,"endTime":2711.55,"body":"that's like just another analogy"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2708.49,"endTime":2711.55,"body":"of just like where people are at"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2711.55,"endTime":2714.46,"body":"even with their, with these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2711.55,"endTime":2714.46,"body":"moments that they're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2715.36,"endTime":2718.09,"body":"This is awesome."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2715.36,"endTime":2718.09,"body":"So let's recap. This first"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2718.09,"endTime":2721.0,"body":"question is really like what's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2718.09,"endTime":2721.0,"body":"the goal? What is my tyrant"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2721.03,"endTime":2724.06,"body":"Tyrannosaurus Rex? I can't do"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2721.03,"endTime":2724.06,"body":"it. What's my vision for my life"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2724.06,"endTime":2729.61,"body":"vision? What would be success in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2724.06,"endTime":2729.61,"body":"my book number two is how is my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2729.61,"endTime":2733.63,"body":"marketing effort going to lead"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2729.61,"endTime":2733.63,"body":"me to that? Yes for us like,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2733.63,"endTime":2738.7,"body":"let's map out the.to dot? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2733.63,"endTime":2738.7,"body":"And that third one is how can I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2738.7,"endTime":2740.44,"body":"get out from behind my screen?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2740.469,"endTime":2743.589,"body":"So before that? Is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2740.469,"endTime":2743.589,"body":"there anybody else? Is there any"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2743.589,"endTime":2746.229,"body":"other business that I can"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2743.589,"endTime":2746.229,"body":"partner with? Right to make this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2746.229,"endTime":2749.109,"body":"successful? I love it, how can I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2746.229,"endTime":2749.109,"body":"do this not alone? How can I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2749.109,"endTime":2751.149,"body":"make sure that when I go to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2749.109,"endTime":2751.149,"body":"launch this thing when this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2751.149,"endTime":2754.479,"body":"giveaway happens, that it's not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2751.149,"endTime":2754.479,"body":"just me on the internet talking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2754.479,"endTime":2754.809,"body":"about it."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2755.229,"endTime":2758.049,"body":"And you know"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2755.229,"endTime":2758.049,"body":"that those don't always have to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2758.049,"endTime":2761.499,"body":"be I feel like we sort of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2758.049,"endTime":2761.499,"body":"touched on maybe other"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2761.499,"endTime":2763.989,"body":"businesses or you know, vendor"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2761.499,"endTime":2763.989,"body":"partners, things like that."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2763.989,"endTime":2767.349,"body":"Those can also be your former"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2763.989,"endTime":2767.349,"body":"clients, or your current"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2767.379,"endTime":2770.739,"body":"clients, your you know, your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2767.379,"endTime":2770.739,"body":"roster of people who have worked"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2770.739,"endTime":2774.579,"body":"with you. So those are all such"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2770.739,"endTime":2774.579,"body":"great questions. And they really"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2774.579,"endTime":2779.349,"body":"are the foundation of good"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2774.579,"endTime":2779.349,"body":"marketing. I think people want a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2779.349,"endTime":2783.069,"body":"magic solution to like all of a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2779.349,"endTime":2783.069,"body":"sudden have great clients"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2783.069,"endTime":2785.679,"body":"showing up in their inbox all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2783.069,"endTime":2785.679,"body":"the time. And the truth of the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2785.679,"endTime":2790.689,"body":"matter is, it's not, but it can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2785.679,"endTime":2790.689,"body":"be done in an efficient way if"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2790.689,"endTime":2794.049,"body":"you're strategic about it. So"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2790.689,"endTime":2794.049,"body":"those questions are, are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2794.049,"endTime":2794.499,"body":"awesome."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2794.619,"endTime":2796.089,"body":"And there's a bunch"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2794.619,"endTime":2796.089,"body":"more questions. I don't know if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2796.089,"endTime":2798.999,"body":"we have time for today. But I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2796.089,"endTime":2798.999,"body":"just wanted to also encourage,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2799.299,"endTime":2804.879,"body":"again, your audience right now"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2799.299,"endTime":2804.879,"body":"that like, You're brilliant. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2804.909,"endTime":2808.539,"body":"it's, it makes sense, by the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2804.909,"endTime":2808.539,"body":"way, if you haven't, like gone"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2808.539,"endTime":2810.459,"body":"through, and just taking the"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2808.539,"endTime":2810.459,"body":"time to answer some of these"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2810.459,"endTime":2813.069,"body":"things. Because, again, you're"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2810.459,"endTime":2813.069,"body":"being pulled in so many"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2813.069,"endTime":2816.009,"body":"directions, your time is so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2813.069,"endTime":2816.009,"body":"limited. And it almost feels"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2816.009,"endTime":2820.299,"body":"like to just even do a giveaway"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2816.009,"endTime":2820.299,"body":"at all feels like a huge amount"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2820.299,"endTime":2822.999,"body":"of effort, or whatever that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2820.299,"endTime":2822.999,"body":"marketing effort is to run a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2822.999,"endTime":2826.209,"body":"facebook at all feels like oh my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2822.999,"endTime":2826.209,"body":"goodness, I did that thing. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2826.209,"endTime":2828.909,"body":"you almost want to wash your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2826.209,"endTime":2828.909,"body":"hands clean of it. Right? It"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2828.909,"endTime":2832.539,"body":"makes sense that you feel that"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2828.909,"endTime":2832.539,"body":"way. It's just my plea and my"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2832.539,"endTime":2836.229,"body":"invitation to to just even if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2832.539,"endTime":2836.229,"body":"you just blocked off on a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2836.229,"endTime":2840.219,"body":"calendar, you start your morning"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2836.229,"endTime":2840.219,"body":"off this 30 minutes and to start"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2840.219,"endTime":2843.189,"body":"just answer these questions. If"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2840.219,"endTime":2843.189,"body":"you can just brainstorm and try"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2843.189,"endTime":2845.139,"body":"to answer these questions, even"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2843.189,"endTime":2845.139,"body":"just the few that we've done"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2845.139,"endTime":2850.989,"body":"today. It'll make that effort so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2845.139,"endTime":2850.989,"body":"much stronger. Okay. That's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2850.989,"endTime":2854.679,"body":"awesome. So I'm gonna, what is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2850.989,"endTime":2854.679,"body":"I'm gonna give you one more, one"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2854.679,"endTime":2857.739,"body":"more question. And it's it's a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2854.679,"endTime":2857.739,"body":"it's another one that so yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2857.739,"endTime":2863.499,"body":"of course. So, SEO, Search"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2857.739,"endTime":2863.499,"body":"Engine Optimization ranking"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2863.499,"endTime":2867.609,"body":"organically on Google is also"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2863.499,"endTime":2867.609,"body":"one of those things that like, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2867.609,"endTime":2871.959,"body":"feel like as a creative I myself"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2867.609,"endTime":2871.959,"body":"have have like, over complicated"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2871.959,"endTime":2875.829,"body":"it. I've, I've like kind of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2871.959,"endTime":2875.829,"body":"catastrophize the whole thing."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2875.979,"endTime":2878.919,"body":"Until someday I'm like, Okay,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2875.979,"endTime":2878.919,"body":"I'm gonna do SEO, and then I go"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2878.919,"endTime":2882.549,"body":"and hire somebody for way too"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2878.919,"endTime":2882.549,"body":"much money. And then I don't"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2882.549,"endTime":2886.119,"body":"know if any way to relate to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2882.549,"endTime":2886.119,"body":"this, this kind of story. But"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2886.659,"endTime":2891.909,"body":"SEO is a long term game. And if"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2886.659,"endTime":2891.909,"body":"you could just simply ask"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2891.909,"endTime":2894.699,"body":"yourself, whatever marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2891.909,"endTime":2894.699,"body":"effort you're going to do this"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2894.699,"endTime":2898.599,"body":"week or this month, how can I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2894.699,"endTime":2898.599,"body":"leverage this? For my long term"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2898.599,"endTime":2903.039,"body":"Seo? Is there some way that I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2898.599,"endTime":2903.039,"body":"could make sure that I optimize"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2903.039,"endTime":2906.519,"body":"this in a way that allows me to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2903.039,"endTime":2906.519,"body":"show up on Google, maybe not"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2906.519,"endTime":2909.429,"body":"today, maybe not next week, but"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2906.519,"endTime":2909.429,"body":"it's going to be another little"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2909.429,"endTime":2914.199,"body":"stone? It's another chip away?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2909.429,"endTime":2914.199,"body":"And so that's just another one?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2914.259,"endTime":2917.589,"body":"How can you turn literally, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2914.259,"endTime":2917.589,"body":"could turn anything that you do"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2917.589,"endTime":2922.839,"body":"into a blog post? So yeah, just"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2917.589,"endTime":2922.839,"body":"to document that is you How"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2922.839,"endTime":2925.419,"body":"could you How could you leverage"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2922.839,"endTime":2925.419,"body":"this for for long term Seo?"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2925.509,"endTime":2928.269,"body":"Okay. Well, there's a series"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2925.509,"endTime":2928.269,"body":"more questions, but we'll have"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2928.269,"endTime":2929.649,"body":"to talk again. Okay. Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":2929.65,"endTime":2930.4,"body":"guess we'll just have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2930.4,"endTime":2932.56,"body":"to do this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2930.4,"endTime":2932.56,"body":"again, that would be great. I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2932.62,"endTime":2936.19,"body":"know, I feel like you are you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2932.62,"endTime":2936.19,"body":"one of those people out there in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2936.19,"endTime":2940.78,"body":"the industry, who has not only"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2936.19,"endTime":2940.78,"body":"really cracked a lot of these"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2940.81,"endTime":2944.14,"body":"mysteries in your own business,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2940.81,"endTime":2944.14,"body":"but you've taken the time to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2944.17,"endTime":2947.53,"body":"kind of put them together in a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2944.17,"endTime":2947.53,"body":"way that is able to be shared."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2947.77,"endTime":2951.4,"body":"And so I just want to close by"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2947.77,"endTime":2951.4,"body":"saying thank you for that."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2951.4,"endTime":2955.15,"body":"Because I do think that our"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2951.4,"endTime":2955.15,"body":"industry, the sweet little"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2955.15,"endTime":2958.33,"body":"industry that it is, needs,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2955.15,"endTime":2958.33,"body":"needs all of the support that it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2958.33,"endTime":2961.48,"body":"can get. And so I love having"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2958.33,"endTime":2961.48,"body":"you out there in the world"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2961.51,"endTime":2964.81,"body":"giving it Ben tell people where"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2961.51,"endTime":2964.81,"body":"they can find you and where they"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2964.81,"endTime":2967.75,"body":"can find out more information"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":2964.81,"endTime":2967.75,"body":"about your your new class."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2967.87,"endTime":2972.43,"body":"Yeah. So if you'd"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2967.87,"endTime":2972.43,"body":"like to just learn more from me,"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2972.43,"endTime":2977.05,"body":"and you're still skeptical, come"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2972.43,"endTime":2977.05,"body":"and join my mastermind group."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2977.08,"endTime":2980.41,"body":"It's a Facebook group. If you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2977.08,"endTime":2980.41,"body":"just go to Ben Hartley comm Ford"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2980.41,"endTime":2985.54,"body":"slash mastermind, Ben Hartley"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2980.41,"endTime":2985.54,"body":"comm h AR t le y. Ford slash"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2985.54,"endTime":2989.89,"body":"mastermind. There's 17,000"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2985.54,"endTime":2989.89,"body":"photographers there. Every"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2989.89,"endTime":2994.15,"body":"Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday at"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2989.89,"endTime":2994.15,"body":"3pm PST, I do free coaching in"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2994.15,"endTime":2996.61,"body":"that group. And pretty much I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2994.15,"endTime":2996.61,"body":"always just talking about like"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2996.61,"endTime":2998.74,"body":"whatever's on my mind as I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2996.61,"endTime":2998.74,"body":"growing my own business. I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2998.74,"endTime":3001.29,"body":"like, Hey, this is what I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":2998.74,"endTime":3001.29,"body":"working on. Just a way for me to"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3001.29,"endTime":3004.08,"body":"show up for the community so"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3001.29,"endTime":3004.08,"body":"they can see somebody else out"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3004.08,"endTime":3009.15,"body":"there is is working. And so you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3004.08,"endTime":3009.15,"body":"can do. And that'll give you a"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3009.15,"endTime":3011.64,"body":"little bit more exposure to me."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3009.15,"endTime":3011.64,"body":"But the course that I have is"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3011.64,"endTime":3016.35,"body":"called book solid. And what book"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3011.64,"endTime":3016.35,"body":"solid is, is it's the playbook."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3016.35,"endTime":3020.73,"body":"It's kind of like, it goes"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3016.35,"endTime":3020.73,"body":"beyond just these questions. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3020.76,"endTime":3025.38,"body":"it really then shows"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3020.76,"endTime":3025.38,"body":"photographers how to take all of"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3025.38,"endTime":3029.91,"body":"the things and link them all"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3025.38,"endTime":3029.91,"body":"together. And it is it's a 12"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3029.91,"endTime":3032.7,"body":"month content calendar for your"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3029.91,"endTime":3032.7,"body":"marketing. So like, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3032.7,"endTime":3038.19,"body":"literally it's kind of big. It's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3032.7,"endTime":3038.19,"body":"like, hey, it's July, what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3038.19,"endTime":3040.65,"body":"should I be doing to get more"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3038.19,"endTime":3040.65,"body":"clients? And how do I make sure"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3040.65,"endTime":3044.16,"body":"that as I'm doing this, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3040.65,"endTime":3044.16,"body":"benefiting the other marketing"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3044.16,"endTime":3047.61,"body":"efforts that I have, right. And"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3044.16,"endTime":3047.61,"body":"so at any point, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3047.61,"endTime":3050.37,"body":"just I remember being a diver"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3047.61,"endTime":3050.37,"body":"and being like, I know I need"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3050.37,"endTime":3052.38,"body":"clients, but I just don't know"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3050.37,"endTime":3052.38,"body":"what to do. I feel like I need"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3052.38,"endTime":3057.06,"body":"to do everything. But But what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3052.38,"endTime":3057.06,"body":"is it? Yeah, and so this is kind"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3057.06,"endTime":3060.18,"body":"of like the full layout of what"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3057.06,"endTime":3060.18,"body":"that is. So it's called book"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3060.18,"endTime":3063.87,"body":"solid. If you go to Ben Hartley"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3060.18,"endTime":3063.87,"body":"comm forward slash booked, you"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3063.87,"endTime":3065.76,"body":"can learn more about the course"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3063.87,"endTime":3065.76,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3066.03,"endTime":3068.49,"body":"Awesome. Well, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3066.03,"endTime":3068.49,"body":"will obviously have all of that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3068.49,"endTime":3071.13,"body":"linked in the show notes as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3068.49,"endTime":3071.13,"body":"well. But then it has been a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3071.13,"endTime":3074.94,"body":"pleasure and I look forward to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3071.13,"endTime":3074.94,"body":"round two sometime in the near"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3075.15,"endTime":3077.67,"body":"future. We'll have to continue"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3075.15,"endTime":3077.67,"body":"the conversation."},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3077.73,"endTime":3080.46,"body":"Lovely. Yeah. And I"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3077.73,"endTime":3080.46,"body":"can't wait to have you over on"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3080.46,"endTime":3083.73,"body":"the six figure photography"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3080.46,"endTime":3083.73,"body":"podcast and excited to discover"},{"speaker":"Ben Hartley","startTime":3083.73,"endTime":3084.84,"body":"what we chat about there."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3084.99,"endTime":3087.0,"body":"Love it. Okay,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3084.99,"endTime":3087.0,"body":"well, good. I'm looking forward"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3087.0,"endTime":3089.94,"body":"to it as well. I hope you have a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3087.0,"endTime":3089.94,"body":"great day. Thank you and me."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":3090.0,"endTime":3090.81,"body":"Alright, bye."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3091.68,"endTime":3093.96,"body":"Well, that's it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3091.68,"endTime":3093.96,"body":"for this week's episode of this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3093.96,"endTime":3097.71,"body":"can't be that hard. I'll be back"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3093.96,"endTime":3097.71,"body":"Same time, same place next week."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3098.22,"endTime":3100.95,"body":"In the meantime, you can find"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3098.22,"endTime":3100.95,"body":"more information about this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3100.95,"endTime":3103.86,"body":"episode along with all the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3100.95,"endTime":3103.86,"body":"relevant links, notes and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3103.86,"endTime":3108.39,"body":"downloads at this can't be that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3103.86,"endTime":3108.39,"body":"hard comm slash learn. If you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3108.39,"endTime":3111.84,"body":"like the podcast, be sure to hit"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3108.39,"endTime":3111.84,"body":"the subscribe button. Even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3111.84,"endTime":3115.5,"body":"better, share the love by"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3111.84,"endTime":3115.5,"body":"leaving a review on iTunes. And"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3115.5,"endTime":3118.74,"body":"as always, thanks so much for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3115.5,"endTime":3118.74,"body":"joining me. I hope you have a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3118.74,"endTime":3119.82,"body":"fantastic week."}]}