{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1.199,"endTime":3.359,"body":"I was recently"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":1.199,"endTime":3.359,"body":"listening to one of these"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3.389,"endTime":7.049,"body":"internet business guru, people"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":3.389,"endTime":7.049,"body":"talk about sales. And they were"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":7.049,"endTime":11.639,"body":"describing something they called"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":7.049,"endTime":11.639,"body":"a value ladder. The concept of a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":11.639,"endTime":14.639,"body":"value ladder is pretty simple."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":11.639,"endTime":14.639,"body":"It's one of those things that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":14.669,"endTime":18.089,"body":"once you know about it, you can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":14.669,"endTime":18.089,"body":"see it everywhere. Basically,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":18.089,"endTime":21.179,"body":"it's a way to structure your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":18.089,"endTime":21.179,"body":"offers so that they start low"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":21.209,"endTime":25.259,"body":"and increase in price over time"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":21.209,"endTime":25.259,"body":"from that first bit of brand"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":25.259,"endTime":28.469,"body":"awareness where you might be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":25.259,"endTime":28.469,"body":"offering something for free in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":28.469,"endTime":32.879,"body":"exchange for, let's say, their"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":28.469,"endTime":32.879,"body":"email address to a premium"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":32.879,"endTime":36.299,"body":"offer, where they're hiring you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":32.879,"endTime":36.299,"body":"for a full session, or they're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":36.299,"endTime":40.289,"body":"joining your membership or"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":36.299,"endTime":40.289,"body":"whatever. The idea is that this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":40.289,"endTime":43.679,"body":"is an effective way for you to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":40.289,"endTime":43.679,"body":"build trust and maximize the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":43.679,"endTime":48.659,"body":"lifetime value of each customer."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":43.679,"endTime":48.659,"body":"And it's a smart concept that I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":48.659,"endTime":51.719,"body":"wanted to bring to the podcast"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":48.659,"endTime":51.719,"body":"here. But it's also one that I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":51.719,"endTime":54.839,"body":"think can be pretty badly"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":51.719,"endTime":54.839,"body":"mishandled and abused if you're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":54.839,"endTime":59.159,"body":"not going about it, right. So"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":54.839,"endTime":59.159,"body":"today, we're talking about value"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":59.159,"endTime":62.339,"body":"ladders, how to build one in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":59.159,"endTime":62.339,"body":"your business, and how to make"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":62.339,"endTime":67.469,"body":"sure you don't fall off. Welcome"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":62.339,"endTime":67.469,"body":"to this can't be that hard. My"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":67.469,"endTime":70.469,"body":"name is Annemie Tonken. And I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":67.469,"endTime":70.469,"body":"help photographers run"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":70.469,"endTime":74.429,"body":"profitable, sustainable"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":70.469,"endTime":74.429,"body":"businesses that they love. Each"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":74.429,"endTime":77.999,"body":"week on the podcast, I cover"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":74.429,"endTime":77.999,"body":"simple, actionable strategies"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":77.999,"endTime":81.359,"body":"and systems that photographers"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":77.999,"endTime":81.359,"body":"at every level of experience can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":81.359,"endTime":85.679,"body":"use to earn more money in a more"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":81.359,"endTime":85.679,"body":"sustainable way. Running a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":85.679,"endTime":89.249,"body":"photography business doesn't"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":85.679,"endTime":89.249,"body":"have to be that hard, you can do"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":89.249,"endTime":90.959,"body":"it. And I can show you how."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":94.44,"endTime":96.99,"body":"You've heard me talk about the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":94.44,"endTime":96.99,"body":"importance of trust here on the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":96.99,"endTime":100.77,"body":"podcast. In fact, that's the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":96.99,"endTime":100.77,"body":"title of Episode Three, the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":100.77,"endTime":104.49,"body":"importance of trust. But Forgive"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":100.77,"endTime":104.49,"body":"me for talking about it a bit"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":104.49,"endTime":108.0,"body":"more here. And now because it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":104.49,"endTime":108.0,"body":"really can't be overstated."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":108.75,"endTime":112.62,"body":"having a hard time booking new"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":108.75,"endTime":112.62,"body":"clients do a trust audit, or"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":112.62,"endTime":115.71,"body":"your brand and your voice and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":112.62,"endTime":115.71,"body":"your messaging and your pricing"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":115.71,"endTime":119.34,"body":"all consistent with one another."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":115.71,"endTime":119.34,"body":"If the answer is no, you're not"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":119.34,"endTime":121.92,"body":"giving someone a reason to trust"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":119.34,"endTime":121.92,"body":"you with their important"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":121.92,"endTime":125.88,"body":"memories and their money. If"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":121.92,"endTime":125.88,"body":"you're getting lots of pushback"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":125.88,"endTime":129.51,"body":"from the clients who do hire"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":125.88,"endTime":129.51,"body":"you, you know, if they're trying"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":129.51,"endTime":133.38,"body":"to art direct or change your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":129.51,"endTime":133.38,"body":"policies, it's also time to do a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":133.38,"endTime":136.56,"body":"trust audit. Maybe you're not"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":133.38,"endTime":136.56,"body":"communicating the process or"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":136.56,"endTime":141.18,"body":"your own confidence in a way"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":136.56,"endTime":141.18,"body":"that inspires them to trust you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":141.18,"endTime":145.08,"body":"and trust your process. Now, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":141.18,"endTime":145.08,"body":"know that this can be a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":145.08,"endTime":147.81,"body":"frustrating answer to your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":145.08,"endTime":147.81,"body":"business questions because no"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":147.81,"endTime":151.17,"body":"one gets to build trust in a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":147.81,"endTime":151.17,"body":"day, right? Even though you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":151.17,"endTime":155.19,"body":"can't truly solve the trust"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":151.17,"endTime":155.19,"body":"issue quickly. Sometimes a trust"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":155.19,"endTime":158.46,"body":"audit will uncover some gaping"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":155.19,"endTime":158.46,"body":"holes or issues that you can"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":158.46,"endTime":163.05,"body":"solve or at least, you know,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":158.46,"endTime":163.05,"body":"begin to mitigate quickly. The"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":163.05,"endTime":166.32,"body":"other solution, which needs to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":163.05,"endTime":166.32,"body":"be something that you do in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":166.32,"endTime":171.54,"body":"addition to not, in lieu of the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":166.32,"endTime":171.54,"body":"other stuff, is to build"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":171.54,"endTime":174.12,"body":"yourself a value ladder, which"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":171.54,"endTime":174.12,"body":"is a way of giving your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":174.12,"endTime":178.11,"body":"potential clients a path to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":174.12,"endTime":178.11,"body":"trusting you that doesn't just"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":178.11,"endTime":183.57,"body":"rely on time. If the only thing"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":178.11,"endTime":183.57,"body":"that you offer is a super high"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":183.57,"endTime":187.05,"body":"end session, like the full"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":183.57,"endTime":187.05,"body":"shebang, then you can pretty"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":187.05,"endTime":190.5,"body":"much assume that most people are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":187.05,"endTime":190.5,"body":"going to need to interact with"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":190.5,"endTime":194.58,"body":"your brand a lot before they're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":190.5,"endTime":194.58,"body":"willing to hire you. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":195.18,"endTime":199.02,"body":"yes, maybe if they have a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":195.18,"endTime":199.02,"body":"referral from a friend or they"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":199.17,"endTime":203.76,"body":"read 105 star reviews on Google"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":199.17,"endTime":203.76,"body":"about you, maybe then they'd be"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":203.76,"endTime":207.45,"body":"willing to take that big leap"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":203.76,"endTime":207.45,"body":"right off the bat. But again,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":207.63,"endTime":212.28,"body":"where's that social proof coming"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":207.63,"endTime":212.28,"body":"from? It takes time. On the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":212.28,"endTime":216.39,"body":"other hand, that first rung of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":212.28,"endTime":216.39,"body":"the value ladder is a way of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":216.39,"endTime":220.29,"body":"getting your foot in the door."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":216.39,"endTime":220.29,"body":"It's saying, hey, trust me with"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":220.29,"endTime":224.19,"body":"just this small thing, your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":220.29,"endTime":224.19,"body":"email address, or your time for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":224.19,"endTime":228.18,"body":"a phone call or a low cost"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":224.19,"endTime":228.18,"body":"session of some sort. And then"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":228.21,"endTime":231.15,"body":"all you need to do is show up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":228.21,"endTime":231.15,"body":"and knock that opportunity out"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":231.15,"endTime":236.13,"body":"of the park. In fact, let's get"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":231.15,"endTime":236.13,"body":"meta and talk about this podcast"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":236.13,"endTime":239.7,"body":"for a minute. Yes, I love"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":236.13,"endTime":239.7,"body":"teaching and I love helping"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":239.7,"endTime":244.47,"body":"photographers succeed. But also"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":239.7,"endTime":244.47,"body":"Yes, I run a business and I sell"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":244.47,"endTime":248.88,"body":"things and I need to make money"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":244.47,"endTime":248.88,"body":"to support my family. This"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":248.88,"endTime":253.68,"body":"podcast is one of the ways that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":248.88,"endTime":253.68,"body":"I build trust, it is a free rung"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":253.71,"endTime":258.0,"body":"on my own value ladder. So I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":253.71,"endTime":258.0,"body":"show up every week and I deliver"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":258.0,"endTime":261.27,"body":"value and I hope that some of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":258.0,"endTime":261.27,"body":"you will go on to climb the next"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":261.27,"endTime":264.45,"body":"rung, which is to trade in your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":261.27,"endTime":264.45,"body":"email address for my free simple"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":264.45,"endTime":268.83,"body":"sales masterclass. My goal on"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":264.45,"endTime":268.83,"body":"the low rungs of this particular"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":268.83,"endTime":272.61,"body":"value ladder is that you think"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":268.83,"endTime":272.61,"body":"to yourself, if she's delivering"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":272.61,"endTime":276.48,"body":"this stuff for free, or just for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":272.61,"endTime":276.48,"body":"giving her my email address."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":276.69,"endTime":282.06,"body":"Imagine how great her paid stuff"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":276.69,"endTime":282.06,"body":"must be. And it is. Because the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":282.06,"endTime":285.9,"body":"important thing about building a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":282.06,"endTime":285.9,"body":"ladder is that you start with a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":285.9,"endTime":290.01,"body":"very sturdy first step and then"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":285.9,"endTime":290.01,"body":"make each higher rung even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":290.01,"endTime":294.06,"body":"sturdier than the one before it."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":290.01,"endTime":294.06,"body":"That sturdy first step is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":294.06,"endTime":298.59,"body":"crucial. You need to show up as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":294.06,"endTime":298.59,"body":"your best self in whatever form"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":298.62,"endTime":302.04,"body":"that is, even if it's free."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":298.62,"endTime":302.04,"body":"Free. Or if it's such a crazy"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":302.04,"endTime":305.82,"body":"value that you sometimes wonder"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":302.04,"endTime":305.82,"body":"if it's worth your time, as long"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":305.82,"endTime":308.67,"body":"as you're being intentional"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":305.82,"endTime":308.67,"body":"about how you're choosing to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":308.67,"endTime":313.47,"body":"give that value, like, not just"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":308.67,"endTime":313.47,"body":"taking random unpaid gigs,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":313.47,"endTime":316.89,"body":"because someone's going to give"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":313.47,"endTime":316.89,"body":"you photo credit. As long as"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":316.89,"endTime":319.29,"body":"you're giving that value to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":316.89,"endTime":319.29,"body":"people who might be willing to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":319.29,"endTime":322.65,"body":"climb higher on your ladder,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":319.29,"endTime":322.65,"body":"your efforts will eventually pay"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":322.65,"endTime":326.73,"body":"off, but they won't pay off. If"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":322.65,"endTime":326.73,"body":"you half assed the first rung,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":327.21,"endTime":330.3,"body":"no one will take another step up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":327.21,"endTime":330.3,"body":"a ladder, if they don't believe"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":330.33,"endTime":334.8,"body":"it's strong enough to hold them."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":330.33,"endTime":334.8,"body":"And if you lead them up a ladder"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":334.8,"endTime":338.67,"body":"that gets weak at the top, if"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":334.8,"endTime":338.67,"body":"you're higher paid offers are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":338.67,"endTime":342.99,"body":"actually less good than your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":338.67,"endTime":342.99,"body":"free or lower paid offers, your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":342.99,"endTime":347.22,"body":"business will never last. So the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":342.99,"endTime":347.22,"body":"first rule of not falling off"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":347.22,"endTime":351.06,"body":"the value ladder is creating a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":347.22,"endTime":351.06,"body":"ladder that's strong every step"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":351.06,"endTime":354.69,"body":"of the way. But I'm guessing"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":351.06,"endTime":354.69,"body":"that most of you already know"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":354.69,"endTime":357.78,"body":"that. And if you have any kind"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":354.69,"endTime":357.78,"body":"of ladder in place, you're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":357.78,"endTime":361.98,"body":"probably already delivering at"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":357.78,"endTime":361.98,"body":"every level, where you're more"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":361.98,"endTime":366.12,"body":"likely falling off is kind of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":361.98,"endTime":366.12,"body":"the reverse issue. And this"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":366.12,"endTime":369.81,"body":"one's a little bit trickier."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":366.12,"endTime":369.81,"body":"This is where you are so"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":369.81,"endTime":373.11,"body":"concerned with impressing your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":369.81,"endTime":373.11,"body":"clients with that first rung"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":373.26,"endTime":377.58,"body":"that they never bothered to step"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":373.26,"endTime":377.58,"body":"up the ladder at all. This is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":377.58,"endTime":380.64,"body":"the photographer who is doing 30"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":377.58,"endTime":380.64,"body":"minute mini sessions and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":380.64,"endTime":383.7,"body":"delivering all the images for a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":380.64,"endTime":383.7,"body":"quarter of the price of a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":383.7,"endTime":387.0,"body":"regular session, then wondering"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":383.7,"endTime":387.0,"body":"why no one's ever booking a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":387.0,"endTime":391.29,"body":"regular session, or the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":387.0,"endTime":391.29,"body":"photographer shooting full"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":391.29,"endTime":394.77,"body":"sessions at rates that they know"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":391.29,"endTime":394.77,"body":"aren't profitable. and hoping"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":394.77,"endTime":397.35,"body":"that I don't know they'll"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":394.77,"endTime":397.35,"body":"magically wake up one day"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":397.35,"endTime":401.34,"body":"feeling confident enough to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":397.35,"endTime":401.34,"body":"raise their prices. The issue"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":401.34,"endTime":405.57,"body":"here is the value part of the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":401.34,"endTime":405.57,"body":"ladder. Because although each"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":405.57,"endTime":409.59,"body":"step has to be sturdy, it also"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":405.57,"endTime":409.59,"body":"has to deliver the right amount"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":409.59,"endTime":413.37,"body":"of value higher than the lower"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":409.59,"endTime":413.37,"body":"rungs and lower than the higher"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":413.37,"endTime":416.01,"body":"rungs. Let's use my own"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":413.37,"endTime":416.01,"body":"photography business as an"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":416.01,"endTime":419.43,"body":"example. Now that I've been in"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":416.01,"endTime":419.43,"body":"business for 11 years, and I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":419.43,"endTime":422.13,"body":"have good SEO and lots of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":419.43,"endTime":422.13,"body":"referral work and brand"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":422.13,"endTime":424.8,"body":"recognition, and all the other"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":422.13,"endTime":424.8,"body":"stuff that really only comes"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":424.8,"endTime":429.45,"body":"with time. I don't have tons of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":424.8,"endTime":429.45,"body":"lower rung offers, but I still"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":429.45,"endTime":433.53,"body":"do periodically put them out"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":429.45,"endTime":433.53,"body":"there. And these days, typically"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":433.53,"endTime":438.48,"body":"that's in the form of an auction"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":433.53,"endTime":438.48,"body":"donation. Now, I'm pretty choosy"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":438.48,"endTime":441.3,"body":"about the auctions that I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":438.48,"endTime":441.3,"body":"contribute to. They're typically"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":441.33,"endTime":444.87,"body":"local schools or preschools"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":441.33,"endTime":444.87,"body":"where my Bluebird clients send"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":444.87,"endTime":448.47,"body":"their kids. And I'm very"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":444.87,"endTime":448.47,"body":"intentional about the offers"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":448.47,"endTime":452.43,"body":"that I make at those auctions, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":448.47,"endTime":452.43,"body":"have to tell you, I see a lot of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":452.43,"endTime":457.59,"body":"photographer offers at auctions"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":452.43,"endTime":457.59,"body":"where they are giving away full"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":457.59,"endTime":462.57,"body":"sessions. And I always kind of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":457.59,"endTime":462.57,"body":"cringe. The truth is that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":462.6,"endTime":466.14,"body":"whereas you can find a good"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":462.6,"endTime":466.14,"body":"client at an auction, I have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":466.14,"endTime":470.07,"body":"found many over the years, when"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":466.14,"endTime":470.07,"body":"you put a full session with all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":470.07,"endTime":473.13,"body":"the files and all that sort of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":470.07,"endTime":473.13,"body":"stuff out there as an all in one"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":473.13,"endTime":477.6,"body":"package, you will often end up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":473.13,"endTime":477.6,"body":"with a client who first of all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":477.6,"endTime":481.44,"body":"may not be a good fit for you to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":477.6,"endTime":481.44,"body":"begin with. But second of all,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":481.95,"endTime":486.9,"body":"probably paid a fraction of what"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":481.95,"endTime":486.9,"body":"you typically charge to win the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":486.9,"endTime":490.65,"body":"item that you put in the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":486.9,"endTime":490.65,"body":"auction. And then later when"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":490.65,"endTime":494.25,"body":"they find out what it normally"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":490.65,"endTime":494.25,"body":"costs to hire you. They just"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":494.25,"endTime":497.13,"body":"kind of disappear. So you get"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":494.25,"endTime":497.13,"body":"that one session with them."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":497.76,"endTime":501.18,"body":"Let's say they paid $200 for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":497.76,"endTime":501.18,"body":"that. And you'd typically charge"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":501.21,"endTime":505.71,"body":"$1,000. There, the value is kind"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":501.21,"endTime":505.71,"body":"of set in their mind, even"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":505.71,"endTime":508.68,"body":"though that's not fair. It's at"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":505.71,"endTime":508.68,"body":"an auction. That's the way it"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":508.68,"endTime":513.6,"body":"works. What I do instead, is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":508.68,"endTime":513.6,"body":"that I offer a three hour group"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":513.6,"endTime":517.02,"body":"photography class that I call"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":513.6,"endTime":517.02,"body":"cameras and cocktails. And I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":517.02,"endTime":520.77,"body":"created this class years ago, I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":517.02,"endTime":520.77,"body":"write up the auction item as a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":520.77,"endTime":525.27,"body":"fun and useful alternative to a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":520.77,"endTime":525.27,"body":"moms night out and I go to the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":525.27,"endTime":528.93,"body":"hosts home and teach six to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":525.27,"endTime":528.93,"body":"eight friends how to take better"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":528.93,"endTime":532.2,"body":"pictures of their kids. They"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":528.93,"endTime":532.2,"body":"invite their friends over who"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":532.2,"endTime":536.43,"body":"are typically other moms,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":532.2,"endTime":536.43,"body":"because they are sort of pre"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":536.43,"endTime":539.94,"body":"qualified as an auction"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":536.43,"endTime":539.94,"body":"attendee. Their friends are"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":539.94,"endTime":543.69,"body":"typically kind of pre qualified."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":539.94,"endTime":543.69,"body":"The class took me a long time to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":543.69,"endTime":547.62,"body":"put together It is very high"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":543.69,"endTime":547.62,"body":"quality. It's full of great"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":547.62,"endTime":552.45,"body":"information, and I show up a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":547.62,"endTime":552.45,"body":"bottle of wine in hand and 100%"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":552.48,"endTime":557.13,"body":"ready to represent my brand."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":552.48,"endTime":557.13,"body":"Everyone in attendance gets prep"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":557.16,"endTime":561.06,"body":"emails ahead of time they get"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":557.16,"endTime":561.06,"body":"goodie bags at the end, and I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":561.06,"endTime":563.31,"body":"send out a follow up"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":561.06,"endTime":563.31,"body":"questionnaire asking for"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":563.31,"endTime":565.98,"body":"feedback and all that sort of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":563.31,"endTime":565.98,"body":"thing. So they all have my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":565.98,"endTime":570.06,"body":"contact information. They all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":565.98,"endTime":570.06,"body":"get to know me for three hours."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":570.27,"endTime":574.41,"body":"And I actually go so far as to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":570.27,"endTime":574.41,"body":"offer additional email support"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":574.41,"endTime":577.74,"body":"for any questions they may have"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":574.41,"endTime":577.74,"body":"down the road. Every once in a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":577.74,"endTime":580.8,"body":"while I get an email about it,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":577.74,"endTime":580.8,"body":"no big deal. It's usually Hey,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":580.8,"endTime":582.69,"body":"I'm thinking of upgrading my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":580.8,"endTime":582.69,"body":"camera, what would you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":582.69,"endTime":587.94,"body":"recommend? The point is they"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":582.69,"endTime":587.94,"body":"feel very taken care of, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":587.94,"endTime":592.83,"body":"not trying to actively sell to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":587.94,"endTime":592.83,"body":"them. What I am trying to do is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":592.83,"endTime":597.6,"body":"intentionally showcase the next"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":592.83,"endTime":597.6,"body":"step up the ladder. So all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":597.6,"endTime":600.72,"body":"throughout this three hour"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":597.6,"endTime":600.72,"body":"presentation I You know,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":600.75,"endTime":604.35,"body":"referencing the work that I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":600.75,"endTime":604.35,"body":"typically do, I'm showcasing my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":604.35,"endTime":608.1,"body":"best work when I'm showing them"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":604.35,"endTime":608.1,"body":"examples of various concepts"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":608.1,"endTime":612.27,"body":"that I'm teaching. And without"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":608.1,"endTime":612.27,"body":"being pushy, I am inviting them"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":612.27,"endTime":616.29,"body":"to take that next step. One of"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":612.27,"endTime":616.29,"body":"the items that I put in the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":616.29,"endTime":620.04,"body":"goodie bag that everyone gets is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":616.29,"endTime":620.04,"body":"a gift certificate for $50 off a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":620.04,"endTime":625.38,"body":"session fee, if they book me"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":620.04,"endTime":625.38,"body":"within a year. And it was a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":625.38,"endTime":628.44,"body":"while ago that I last tabulated"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":625.38,"endTime":628.44,"body":"this, but I want to say that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":628.44,"endTime":632.04,"body":"something like 60% of the people"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":628.44,"endTime":632.04,"body":"who have attended those cameras"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":632.04,"endTime":635.01,"body":"and cocktails, classes over the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":632.04,"endTime":635.01,"body":"years have gone on to hire me at"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":635.01,"endTime":636.12,"body":"some point down the road."},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":637.5,"endTime":641.01,"body":"And the rest of my ladder, you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":637.5,"endTime":641.01,"body":"kind of already know about my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":641.01,"endTime":644.49,"body":"standard sessions are relatively"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":641.01,"endTime":644.49,"body":"expensive for my area, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":644.49,"endTime":648.84,"body":"actually creating kind of a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":644.49,"endTime":648.84,"body":"small value ladder inside my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":648.84,"endTime":652.44,"body":"offer. Because with simple"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":648.84,"endTime":652.44,"body":"sales, they start by paying that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":652.44,"endTime":656.16,"body":"smaller session fee, and then"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":652.44,"endTime":656.16,"body":"purchasing a collection only"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":656.16,"endTime":658.8,"body":"once they've had the chance to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":656.16,"endTime":658.8,"body":"see the results of the session,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":658.86,"endTime":663.18,"body":"right. And then the final rung"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":658.86,"endTime":663.18,"body":"on my ladder, once they come"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":663.18,"endTime":667.32,"body":"through a session is inviting"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":663.18,"endTime":667.32,"body":"them into the membership. So"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":667.35,"endTime":669.96,"body":"those of you who have taken"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":667.35,"endTime":669.96,"body":"revenue on repeat know that my"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":669.96,"endTime":673.74,"body":"members actually pay less than"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":669.96,"endTime":673.74,"body":"my first time clients when"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":673.74,"endTime":676.95,"body":"they're going through the simple"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":673.74,"endTime":676.95,"body":"sale system. But rest assured"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":676.98,"endTime":682.68,"body":"that is still a higher rung on"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":676.98,"endTime":682.68,"body":"the ladder. Why? Because they're"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":682.68,"endTime":686.58,"body":"signing up to pay that amount"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":682.68,"endTime":686.58,"body":"over and over and over year"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":686.58,"endTime":691.74,"body":"after year. So their lifetime"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":686.58,"endTime":691.74,"body":"value to me is quite a bit"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":691.74,"endTime":694.86,"body":"higher. And although I'm not"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":691.74,"endTime":694.86,"body":"making as much money all at"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":694.86,"endTime":698.82,"body":"once, I am trading a little bit"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":694.86,"endTime":698.82,"body":"of money in the short term for a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":698.82,"endTime":702.03,"body":"ton of stability and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":698.82,"endTime":702.03,"body":"predictability, which is"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":702.03,"endTime":706.29,"body":"extremely valuable to me as a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":702.03,"endTime":706.29,"body":"business owner. And giving them"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":706.29,"endTime":709.68,"body":"that price break, along with all"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":706.29,"endTime":709.68,"body":"the other perks my members get"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":709.86,"endTime":713.04,"body":"is my way of encouraging them to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":709.86,"endTime":713.04,"body":"take that next step up the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":713.04,"endTime":718.38,"body":"ladder and make that next"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":713.04,"endTime":718.38,"body":"commitment. So this week, I want"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":718.38,"endTime":721.71,"body":"you to think about what you"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":718.38,"endTime":721.71,"body":"offer your clients in terms of a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":721.71,"endTime":725.52,"body":"value ladder. Do you have a way"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":721.71,"endTime":725.52,"body":"for people to take a small step"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":725.52,"endTime":729.27,"body":"with you before they have to"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":725.52,"endTime":729.27,"body":"dive in headfirst? If you do,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":729.33,"endTime":732.42,"body":"are you ensuring that your"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":729.33,"endTime":732.42,"body":"ladder is strong throughout and"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":732.42,"endTime":735.99,"body":"that each of your rungs is built"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":732.42,"endTime":735.99,"body":"to encourage someone to take"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":735.99,"endTime":739.11,"body":"that next step up? If you've got"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":735.99,"endTime":739.11,"body":"a value ladder that's working"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":739.11,"endTime":742.32,"body":"really well for you, I would"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":739.11,"endTime":742.32,"body":"love for you to DM me or send me"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":742.32,"endTime":747.09,"body":"an email about it. I would love"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":742.32,"endTime":747.09,"body":"to feature your story to Well,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":747.12,"endTime":749.52,"body":"that's it for this week's"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":747.12,"endTime":749.52,"body":"episode of this can't be that"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":749.52,"endTime":753.45,"body":"hard. I'll be back Same time,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":749.52,"endTime":753.45,"body":"same place next week. In the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":753.45,"endTime":756.51,"body":"meantime, you can find more"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":753.45,"endTime":756.51,"body":"information about this episode"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":756.54,"endTime":760.05,"body":"along with all the relevant"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":756.54,"endTime":760.05,"body":"links notes and downloads at"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":760.05,"endTime":763.74,"body":"this can't be that hard comm"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":760.05,"endTime":763.74,"body":"slash learn. If you like the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":763.74,"endTime":767.31,"body":"podcast, be sure to hit the"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":763.74,"endTime":767.31,"body":"subscribe button. Even better,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":767.46,"endTime":771.12,"body":"share the love by leaving a"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":767.46,"endTime":771.12,"body":"review on iTunes. And as always,"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":771.3,"endTime":774.84,"body":"thanks so much for joining me. I"},{"speaker":"Annemie Tonken","startTime":771.3,"endTime":774.84,"body":"hope you have a fantastic week."}]}