{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4.24,"endTime":7.16,"body":"Well, welcome onto the show,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4.24,"endTime":7.16,"body":"Dan and Evgeny."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":7.24,"endTime":11.704,"body":"I know Evgeny, I've had you on now a couple"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":7.24,"endTime":11.704,"body":"years ago, it's been a while, so we've got a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":11.712,"endTime":12.968,"body":"lot of things to catch up on."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":13.024,"endTime":17.272,"body":"But I wanted to kick it off just by giving you"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":13.024,"endTime":17.272,"body":"a chance to reintroduce yourselves to the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":17.296,"endTime":17.864,"body":"guests."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":17.992,"endTime":20.808,"body":"Evgeny and then Dan first time on the show."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":20.864,"endTime":23.16,"body":"So I'm excited to learn a little bit more, a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":20.864,"endTime":23.16,"body":"little bit more about you."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":23.2,"endTime":26.7,"body":"So maybe Evgenie, you jump in, quick intro and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":23.2,"endTime":26.7,"body":"then we'll hear a little bit more from Dan."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":27.51,"endTime":31.662,"body":"Hello, I'm Evgeny, the founder of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":27.51,"endTime":31.662,"body":"Simplex Chat."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":31.726,"endTime":37.55,"body":"And Seth indeed recorded a fantastic interview"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":31.726,"endTime":37.55,"body":"two years ago that helped us a lot."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":37.67,"endTime":41.49,"body":"And we'll talk about what changed and whatnot."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":42.23,"endTime":42.686,"body":"Awesome."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":42.718,"endTime":43.694,"body":"Then how about you, Dan?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":43.822,"endTime":45.086,"body":"Welcome onto the show."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":45.238,"endTime":46.51,"body":"Hey, thanks for having me on."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":46.55,"endTime":47.918,"body":"I do appreciate it, man."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":48.054,"endTime":53.662,"body":"First time being here, many time fans, so"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":48.054,"endTime":53.662,"body":"pretty cool to actually be sitting down here"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":53.686,"endTime":54.478,"body":"and chatting with you."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":54.534,"endTime":55.678,"body":"So I'm pretty happy about that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":55.734,"endTime":59.44,"body":"I am the co founder of Flux."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":59.78,"endTime":62.972,"body":"Flux is the world's largest decentralized"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":59.78,"endTime":62.972,"body":"compute network."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":63.076,"endTime":68.044,"body":"The easiest way for everybody to think about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":63.076,"endTime":68.044,"body":"it is anything you can do on AWS or Azure, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":68.052,"endTime":71.708,"body":"can do it on Flux, but you can do it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":68.052,"endTime":71.708,"body":"completely decentralized."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":71.804,"endTime":80.732,"body":"So you think of Flux as being Bitcoin, as"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":71.804,"endTime":80.732,"body":"bitcoin is to finance, we are to data hosting"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":80.876,"endTime":82.684,"body":"and AI and so on and so forth."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":82.732,"endTime":85.204,"body":"So everything we do is open source."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":85.332,"endTime":85.956,"body":"And our."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":86.028,"endTime":88.132,"body":"One of our core tenets obviously is our"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":88.156,"endTime":88.708,"body":"privacy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":88.804,"endTime":90.324,"body":"So it's, it's very poetic."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":90.372,"endTime":92.0,"body":"You're at the opt out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":92.46,"endTime":96.0,"body":"We believe everybody should be able to opt out"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":92.46,"endTime":96.0,"body":"in every way."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":96.3,"endTime":96.708,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":96.764,"endTime":100.548,"body":"Like privacy is massive tenet of human, human"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":100.604,"endTime":101.012,"body":"rights."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":101.116,"endTime":104.08,"body":"So I am a cypher punk at heart."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":104.78,"endTime":112.582,"body":"I have a massive seven foot, the Cypherpunk"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":104.78,"endTime":112.582,"body":"manifesto hanging in my office because it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":112.606,"endTime":113.97,"body":"means a lot to me."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":114.75,"endTime":120.95,"body":"And Flux is really about building technology"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":114.75,"endTime":120.95,"body":"and around technologies that understand that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":120.99,"endTime":123.366,"body":"private centric approach."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":123.518,"endTime":125.222,"body":"And that's how we found Simplex man."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":125.246,"endTime":126.822,"body":"Like it was a super fit."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":126.966,"endTime":130.374,"body":"Yeah, it seems like a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":126.966,"endTime":130.374,"body":"fantastic crossover because I think a lot of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":130.382,"endTime":135.462,"body":"what I talked about with Evgeny on the last"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":130.382,"endTime":135.462,"body":"episode where we kind of intro Simplex to our"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":135.486,"endTime":140.31,"body":"listeners was this idea of data sovereignty"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":135.486,"endTime":140.31,"body":"and how important you actually having control"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":140.35,"endTime":142.754,"body":"of your data is to privacy."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":142.802,"endTime":144.45,"body":"That it's a, it's a key piece there."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":144.57,"endTime":146.274,"body":"And so something like Flux that allows you to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":146.282,"endTime":151.554,"body":"host and store data in a decentralized and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":146.282,"endTime":151.554,"body":"privacy preserving way seems like a, a perfect"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":151.602,"endTime":152.338,"body":"fit there."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":152.474,"endTime":154.402,"body":"So I'm, I'm definitely excited to learn more"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":152.474,"endTime":154.402,"body":"about that."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":154.426,"endTime":158.898,"body":"And it seems like it's been a good collab"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":154.426,"endTime":158.898,"body":"between Simplex and Flux."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":158.994,"endTime":163.666,"body":"But before we dive too much into that collab,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":158.994,"endTime":163.666,"body":"I do want to just give you Evgenie a chance to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":163.738,"endTime":164.242,"body":"update us."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":164.266,"endTime":164.706,"body":"I mean it's."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":164.738,"endTime":165.842,"body":"It's been two years."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":165.946,"endTime":170.21,"body":"Y'all are working like crazy, shipping like"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":165.946,"endTime":170.21,"body":"crazy at Simplex."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":170.37,"endTime":174.782,"body":"There's been so much change in the app over"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":170.37,"endTime":174.782,"body":"those years as I've been using it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":174.886,"endTime":178.638,"body":"And so I'd love to hear from you kind of what"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":174.886,"endTime":178.638,"body":"are the biggest changes or improvements that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":178.694,"endTime":180.942,"body":"you kind of want to highlight over the last"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":178.694,"endTime":180.942,"body":"two years?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":180.966,"endTime":186.142,"body":"I know there's probably too much to get into"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":180.966,"endTime":186.142,"body":"in one podcast, but what are the big"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":186.166,"endTime":189.454,"body":"highlights for you to get people up to speed"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":186.166,"endTime":189.454,"body":"if maybe they haven't used Simplex since the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":189.462,"endTime":190.45,"body":"last episode?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":191.59,"endTime":197.518,"body":"Right. So the whole Simplex network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":191.59,"endTime":197.518,"body":"was built on the idea that people can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":197.574,"endTime":200.52,"body":"communicate without having any kind of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":197.574,"endTime":200.52,"body":"identity."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":200.71,"endTime":204.436,"body":"And it's all built on the idea of anonymous"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":200.71,"endTime":204.436,"body":"connections."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":204.548,"endTime":208.08,"body":"And that obviously creates lots of questions"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":204.548,"endTime":208.08,"body":"how we deliver some basic things."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":208.54,"endTime":214.66,"body":"And we did in Zito last two years ago when we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":208.54,"endTime":214.66,"body":"spoke, we literally had some basic messages"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":214.74,"endTime":219.7,"body":"with replies and files were working horribly"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":214.74,"endTime":219.7,"body":"and everything was working quite badly and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":219.74,"endTime":222.372,"body":"only enthusiasts were surviving it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":222.396,"endTime":227.972,"body":"And we probably had more than 20 times less"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":222.396,"endTime":227.972,"body":"users using the network than we have now, if"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":227.996,"endTime":229.46,"body":"not more than that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":230.88,"endTime":236.088,"body":"And over these two years we added lots of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":230.88,"endTime":236.088,"body":"basic chat functionalities that people expect"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":236.144,"endTime":238.776,"body":"in a communication app without any compromise"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":236.144,"endTime":238.776,"body":"to privacy."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":238.808,"endTime":242.296,"body":"And we added a very decent support for sends"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":238.808,"endTime":242.296,"body":"in files."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":242.488,"endTime":248.664,"body":"So files became from completely unusable two"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":242.488,"endTime":248.664,"body":"years ago to very usable right now."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":248.832,"endTime":256.776,"body":"And with regards to privacy and security of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":248.832,"endTime":256.776,"body":"the network, the two biggest changes that we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":256.928,"endTime":263.028,"body":"did was as in quantum resistant encryption,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":256.928,"endTime":263.028,"body":"it's currently only available in direct"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":263.084,"endTime":267.44,"body":"messages groups or small groups will be added"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":263.084,"endTime":267.44,"body":"this year."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":268.14,"endTime":274.244,"body":"And we edited in a way that's more secure than"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":268.14,"endTime":274.244,"body":"the way signals did at what imessage"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":274.292,"endTime":280.04,"body":"advertises as like level three when every time"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":274.292,"endTime":280.04,"body":"the message direction changes, the key rotate."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":281.42,"endTime":283.844,"body":"And that's really cool."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":283.972,"endTime":286.372,"body":"We have a blog post that explains how end to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":286.396,"endTime":291.474,"body":"end encryption works and how it protects from"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":286.396,"endTime":291.474,"body":"various sources of attack."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":291.562,"endTime":296.786,"body":"And we really tried designing end to end"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":291.562,"endTime":296.786,"body":"encryption in the messaging network to tick"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":296.898,"endTime":301.442,"body":"all the boxes and provide mitigations against"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":296.898,"endTime":301.442,"body":"all possible attacks on the end to end"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":301.466,"endTime":302.274,"body":"encryption."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":302.402,"endTime":306.05,"body":"We may probably share this link somewhere next"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":302.402,"endTime":306.05,"body":"to the podcast."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":306.21,"endTime":312.226,"body":"And another big thing and probably number one"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":306.21,"endTime":312.226,"body":"source of criticism was simple access network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":312.298,"endTime":317.75,"body":"is extremely decentralized and people choose"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":312.298,"endTime":317.75,"body":"which servers they use to receive messages."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":317.89,"endTime":323.022,"body":"And it means that if I connect directly to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":317.89,"endTime":323.022,"body":"your server Seth then it means that your"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":323.046,"endTime":326.078,"body":"server will see my IP address and that's kind"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":323.046,"endTime":326.078,"body":"of suboptimal."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":326.094,"endTime":329.71,"body":"And it was original design of the Simplex"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":326.094,"endTime":329.71,"body":"network to let people choose the servers they"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":329.75,"endTime":330.33,"body":"use."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":330.63,"endTime":335.998,"body":"To some extent it's similar to many other"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":330.63,"endTime":335.998,"body":"communication network design and users"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":336.014,"endTime":340.846,"body":"obviously didn't like it because I can choose"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":336.014,"endTime":340.846,"body":"my server, which means that I can know your IP"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":340.878,"endTime":341.214,"body":"address."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":341.302,"endTime":346.234,"body":"So we added a second layer in message routing"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":341.302,"endTime":346.234,"body":"which was a major technological change to the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":346.242,"endTime":346.458,"body":"network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":346.514,"endTime":348.714,"body":"We managed to roll out with zero disruption to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":348.722,"endTime":349.562,"body":"the users."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":349.706,"endTime":352.042,"body":"And we are currently at a point that like by"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":352.066,"endTime":354.714,"body":"default it's enabled for all users in all"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":352.066,"endTime":354.714,"body":"cases."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":354.802,"endTime":362.282,"body":"Every time the message is sent it traverses"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":354.802,"endTime":362.282,"body":"two servers and that protects senders of the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":362.306,"endTime":368.71,"body":"messages from recipients servers can being"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":362.306,"endTime":368.71,"body":"able to observe their IP address."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":369.09,"endTime":374.302,"body":"And obviously the biggest like thing that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":369.09,"endTime":374.302,"body":"happened end of last year we found Flux and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":374.326,"endTime":381.374,"body":"ourselves, we found each other and we now have"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":374.326,"endTime":381.374,"body":"Flux as a second pre configured operator in"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":381.382,"endTime":381.71,"body":"the app."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":381.75,"endTime":387.79,"body":"So when people install the app they can choose"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":381.75,"endTime":387.79,"body":"to use either of our servers or both of our"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":387.83,"endTime":393.374,"body":"servers, which is even more cool because when"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":387.83,"endTime":393.374,"body":"people want to protect their IP addresses,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":393.422,"endTime":397.934,"body":"like let's say if message traverses two"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":393.422,"endTime":397.934,"body":"servers but both servers are controlled by the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":397.942,"endTime":404.312,"body":"same entity, then obviously those entity can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":397.942,"endTime":404.312,"body":"somehow compromise the security of this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":404.336,"endTime":404.664,"body":"connection."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":404.712,"endTime":408.744,"body":"And if there's two entities and they don't"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":404.712,"endTime":408.744,"body":"exchange data, we don't have access to Flux's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":408.792,"endTime":409.288,"body":"servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":409.384,"endTime":411.464,"body":"Flux doesn't have access to our servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":411.592,"endTime":417.544,"body":"So which means that it becomes much more"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":411.592,"endTime":417.544,"body":"complex and much less likely to compromise the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":417.552,"endTime":418.344,"body":"security of connection."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":418.392,"endTime":423.496,"body":"And now people can choose to use servers of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":418.392,"endTime":423.496,"body":"two different operators inside a single op."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":423.568,"endTime":426.19,"body":"Like, like nowhere else really."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":426.57,"endTime":431.35,"body":"Maybe, maybe like in nostr, but in Nostr it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":426.57,"endTime":431.35,"body":"exists for different reasons."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":431.77,"endTime":433.474,"body":"Yeah, very different"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":431.77,"endTime":433.474,"body":"reasons."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":433.522,"endTime":436.818,"body":"And not, not privacy preserving at all by"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":433.522,"endTime":436.818,"body":"default, unfortunately."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":436.994,"endTime":440.114,"body":"Yeah, I think there's, there's two things I"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":436.994,"endTime":440.114,"body":"want to drill down in there before we jump"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":440.162,"endTime":441.042,"body":"into the Flux thing."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":441.066,"endTime":445.314,"body":"I think the, the quantum resistant encryption"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":441.066,"endTime":445.314,"body":"was a really big step forward."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":445.482,"endTime":451.922,"body":"Especially as it seems like over the last six"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":445.482,"endTime":451.922,"body":"months there's been big a big jump in the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":451.946,"endTime":453.314,"body":"quantum computing space."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":453.402,"endTime":456.066,"body":"Nothing still that can practically attack"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":453.402,"endTime":456.066,"body":"encryption."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":456.098,"endTime":459.602,"body":"Nothing still that can practically break"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":456.098,"endTime":459.602,"body":"normal encryption mechanisms."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":459.666,"endTime":463.378,"body":"But we're seeing more and more progress that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":459.666,"endTime":463.378,"body":"makes it seem like quantum computers are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":463.434,"endTime":464.898,"body":"actually going to be a reality."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":464.994,"endTime":469.186,"body":"And I know a lot of experts within the quantum"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":464.994,"endTime":469.186,"body":"computing space are starting to say like hey"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":469.298,"endTime":474.05,"body":"this is real, it's not just theoretical and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":469.298,"endTime":474.05,"body":"it's getting closer and why that matters with"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":474.09,"endTime":480.03,"body":"messaging, I think just to touch on kind of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":474.09,"endTime":480.03,"body":"the deeper subject is if you send messages and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":480.07,"endTime":484.126,"body":"there's some entity in between that's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":480.07,"endTime":484.126,"body":"intercepting those messages and just storing"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":484.158,"endTime":487.582,"body":"them, even if they can't decrypt them, even if"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":484.158,"endTime":487.582,"body":"they can't view anything about them, they"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":487.606,"endTime":488.734,"body":"could store them forever."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":488.862,"endTime":493.662,"body":"And then if quantum computers do become a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":488.862,"endTime":493.662,"body":"reality, if that encryption method is not"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":493.686,"endTime":497.934,"body":"quantum resistant, then they could trivially"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":493.686,"endTime":497.934,"body":"break those messages and have access to all of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":497.942,"endTime":498.83,"body":"that in the future."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":498.95,"endTime":503.262,"body":"And that's where having quantum resistant"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":498.95,"endTime":503.262,"body":"encryption long before quantum computers are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":503.286,"endTime":508.414,"body":"actually viable is a huge improvement to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":503.286,"endTime":508.414,"body":"ensure that the, the security of your messages"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":508.542,"endTime":513.47,"body":"long term exists, even in the case of an"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":508.542,"endTime":513.47,"body":"adversary intercepting all those messages and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":513.51,"endTime":515.598,"body":"storing them for decryption at some later"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":513.51,"endTime":515.598,"body":"time."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":515.654,"endTime":517.118,"body":"So I think that is a huge step forward."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":517.174,"endTime":518.686,"body":"I'll definitely add the link in the show notes"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":518.718,"endTime":522.97,"body":"because y'all went really in depth into what"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":518.718,"endTime":522.97,"body":"the approach being taken there is."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":523.67,"endTime":525.774,"body":"And so I think it's a, it's a great read for"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":523.67,"endTime":525.774,"body":"our listeners."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":525.822,"endTime":529.214,"body":"But the second one, obviously, and I'll throw"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":525.822,"endTime":529.214,"body":"this one over to Dan."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":529.342,"endTime":532.862,"body":"I know that y'all have announced this"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":529.342,"endTime":532.862,"body":"partnership where there's a preset list of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":532.886,"endTime":536.45,"body":"servers both from Simplex, as there always"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":532.886,"endTime":536.45,"body":"was, and now from Flux."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":536.79,"endTime":538.738,"body":"And that's a huge step forward because now"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":536.79,"endTime":538.738,"body":"you."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":538.774,"endTime":542.154,"body":"You can make sure that all of your connections"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":538.774,"endTime":542.154,"body":"are not going just to Simplex."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":542.282,"endTime":547.514,"body":"There's one less trust piece in there, and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":542.282,"endTime":547.514,"body":"it's a great way to distribute that trust"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":547.562,"endTime":548.91,"body":"across more operators."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":549.41,"endTime":555.354,"body":"So what does that mean kind of for the end"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":549.41,"endTime":555.354,"body":"user when it comes to reliability or privacy?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":555.482,"endTime":557.674,"body":"And then what made you want to jump in on this"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":555.482,"endTime":557.674,"body":"effort, Dan?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":557.722,"endTime":562.714,"body":"Maybe start with what you wanted to jump in on"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":557.722,"endTime":562.714,"body":"here, why you saw this fit between Flux and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":562.722,"endTime":566.81,"body":"Simplex being powerful, then maybe Evgeny can"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":562.722,"endTime":566.81,"body":"dive into a little bit of what this actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":566.85,"endTime":568.19,"body":"looks like for end users."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":568.75,"endTime":573.91,"body":"No, I had been chasing Giddy for a little"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":568.75,"endTime":573.91,"body":"while and talking back and forth with him"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":573.95,"endTime":580.118,"body":"because simply, any project that works on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":573.95,"endTime":580.118,"body":"privacy as its core tenant is its core focus."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":580.174,"endTime":585.334,"body":"And especially the things that went down with"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":580.174,"endTime":585.334,"body":"Telegram, I feel like I need to be supporting"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":585.382,"endTime":585.942,"body":"and a part of."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":585.966,"endTime":587.878,"body":"And we should all feel like that because"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":587.934,"endTime":589.382,"body":"privacy is a human right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":589.486,"endTime":595.28,"body":"So I feel like we were at the right point in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":589.486,"endTime":595.28,"body":"building our platform out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":595.43,"endTime":600.972,"body":"You know, the, the biggest thing when, when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":595.43,"endTime":600.972,"body":"Gideon and I sat down and talked about it was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":601.156,"endTime":603.8,"body":"we had to explain that we're not a crypto"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":601.156,"endTime":603.8,"body":"project."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":604.18,"endTime":605.708,"body":"And that's a big thing for people."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":605.764,"endTime":607.612,"body":"We're a blockchain project that happens to."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":607.636,"endTime":609.404,"body":"You have a crypto as well."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":609.572,"endTime":612.844,"body":"We don't put a lot of focus on, on the, the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":612.932,"endTime":614.348,"body":"crypto side of the world."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":614.404,"endTime":615.98,"body":"We put it on the blockchain side of the world."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":616.02,"endTime":618.492,"body":"So we work, we look for solid partnerships and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":618.516,"endTime":621.868,"body":"use cases which will extend and advance"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":618.516,"endTime":621.868,"body":"humanity."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":621.964,"endTime":625.054,"body":"And they're the ones we want to get behind"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":621.964,"endTime":625.054,"body":"immediately."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":625.102,"endTime":629.31,"body":"Now the nice thing about it is we have a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":625.102,"endTime":629.31,"body":"massive arsenal of compute resources behind"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":629.35,"endTime":629.79,"body":"our back."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":629.83,"endTime":631.934,"body":"We are the largest decentralized compute"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":631.982,"endTime":635.406,"body":"network in the world, hands down, not even"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":631.982,"endTime":635.406,"body":"close to anyone else."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":635.518,"endTime":640.782,"body":"We have 13,000 decentralized systems"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":635.518,"endTime":640.782,"body":"administrators, node operators all around the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":640.806,"endTime":643.214,"body":"world which run enterprise grade."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":643.342,"endTime":645.63,"body":"So if you, what you're running in a data"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":645.67,"endTime":646.958,"body":"center is what they're running."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":647.054,"endTime":648.862,"body":"And it could run in a data center, it could"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":648.886,"endTime":652.31,"body":"run in their house, it could run in a barn, it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":648.886,"endTime":652.31,"body":"could run anywhere, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":652.35,"endTime":658.214,"body":"That's the glory of decentralization is, is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":652.35,"endTime":658.214,"body":"hey, I have a Raspberry PI that runs on Flux,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":658.262,"endTime":659.35,"body":"which is pretty awesome."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":659.43,"endTime":662.47,"body":"So we wanted to make it highly available,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":662.59,"endTime":667.606,"body":"highly scalable, highly on demand, cheaper,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":662.59,"endTime":667.606,"body":"better, faster, stronger."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":667.638,"endTime":669.254,"body":"And that's exactly what we did with Flux."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":669.302,"endTime":673.09,"body":"So whether it's AI or whether it's you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":674.27,"endTime":679.242,"body":"Simplex or another, another product, you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":674.27,"endTime":679.242,"body":"simply deploy it on Flux."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":679.306,"endTime":687.066,"body":"We, you know, Amazon building aws, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":679.306,"endTime":687.066,"body":"they didn't build AWS as a business model."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":687.178,"endTime":689.418,"body":"They built a delivery model framework."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":689.514,"endTime":691.146,"body":"So they built a framework to deliver"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":691.218,"endTime":696.522,"body":"everything and they had it to have compute"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":691.218,"endTime":696.522,"body":"resources to support those deliverables."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":696.586,"endTime":698.49,"body":"And when they did, they said, hey, we could"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":696.586,"endTime":698.49,"body":"sell this."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":698.53,"endTime":703.802,"body":"Now it's 60% of their revenue, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":698.53,"endTime":703.802,"body":"So it's extortion what these guys are"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":703.826,"endTime":704.51,"body":"charging."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":704.9,"endTime":709.24,"body":"They squash or quash anyone that goes against"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":704.9,"endTime":709.24,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":709.78,"endTime":713.96,"body":"The nice thing about Flux is once it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":709.78,"endTime":713.96,"body":"deployed on Flux, it's forever there."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":714.26,"endTime":715.948,"body":"It is built on the blockchain."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":716.044,"endTime":718.012,"body":"We're an eight year old product that's been up"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":718.036,"endTime":719.676,"body":"and running for eight years."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":719.748,"endTime":721.484,"body":"We've had no downtime."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":721.532,"endTime":725.516,"body":"So how many can AWS claim that the blockchain"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":725.548,"endTime":731.388,"body":"has helped really solidify us as a consistent"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":725.548,"endTime":731.388,"body":"game player against some of these big players."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":731.444,"endTime":738.524,"body":"And we need as a community to take to heart we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":731.444,"endTime":738.524,"body":"have to start doing our marching orders so"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":738.532,"endTime":744.46,"body":"that we're going against these big box massive"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":738.532,"endTime":744.46,"body":"retailers that will extrapolate your data and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":744.5,"endTime":748.444,"body":"they will utilize it and you are nothing more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":744.5,"endTime":748.444,"body":"than a data mine to them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":748.532,"endTime":749.404,"body":"That's all."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":749.572,"endTime":751.612,"body":"And you know, with products like Flux and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":751.636,"endTime":756.556,"body":"Simplex and other ones that are out there, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":751.636,"endTime":756.556,"body":"know, we're, I think we're starting to finally"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":756.588,"endTime":762.55,"body":"put some focus back, back on, you know, for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":756.588,"endTime":762.55,"body":"the people, by the people that's what it comes"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":762.59,"endTime":763.33,"body":"down to."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":763.95,"endTime":767.302,"body":"Yeah, let's, let's dive in a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":763.95,"endTime":767.302,"body":"little bit more actually into how Flux works,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":767.366,"endTime":772.422,"body":"because I think one of the things that's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":767.366,"endTime":772.422,"body":"important when you're using another server."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":772.566,"endTime":776.998,"body":"So like we, we've been using simplex servers"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":772.566,"endTime":776.998,"body":"hosted by the Simplex team, so we know that's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":777.014,"endTime":777.734,"body":"a trusted entity."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":777.782,"endTime":782.086,"body":"But obviously there are advantages to having"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":777.782,"endTime":782.086,"body":"simplex servers run by other entities."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":782.278,"endTime":786.07,"body":"So when a simplex server is actually running"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":782.278,"endTime":786.07,"body":"on the Flux network, what does that actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":786.11,"endTime":786.422,"body":"look like?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":786.446,"endTime":791.432,"body":"Because you said it's decentralized and that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":786.446,"endTime":791.432,"body":"there's like 13,000 node operators out there,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":791.536,"endTime":794.504,"body":"does that mean that anyone can join the Flux"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":791.536,"endTime":794.504,"body":"network?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":794.592,"endTime":799.672,"body":"And the compute load that I put out there,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":794.592,"endTime":799.672,"body":"like running a simplex server could be running"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":799.736,"endTime":801.08,"body":"on anyone's server."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":801.16,"endTime":803.864,"body":"What kind of visibility do they have into"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":801.16,"endTime":803.864,"body":"what's running there?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":803.952,"endTime":807.06,"body":"Like, I think there's a lot to kind of unpack"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":803.952,"endTime":807.06,"body":"here."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":808.0,"endTime":809.7,"body":"Yeah, I wanted to comment on that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":810.48,"endTime":813.4,"body":"I think it's probably fair to say we are not"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":810.48,"endTime":813.4,"body":"that advanced."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":813.48,"endTime":819.93,"body":"We discussed it and one thing that's currently"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":813.48,"endTime":819.93,"body":"lacking in simplex network design is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":819.97,"endTime":820.73,"body":"redundancy."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":820.81,"endTime":821.29,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":821.41,"endTime":829.226,"body":"And highly decentralized future of both Flux"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":821.41,"endTime":829.226,"body":"and Simplex network require server redundancy"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":829.258,"endTime":830.79,"body":"and we didn't develop it yet."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":832.05,"endTime":837.834,"body":"We have plans to massively improve how groups"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":832.05,"endTime":837.834,"body":"work and the redundancy is also in the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":837.842,"endTime":838.266,"body":"roadmap."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":838.298,"endTime":841.114,"body":"But right now we're using the centralized"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":841.162,"endTime":849.344,"body":"infrastructure that Flux itself controls as a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":841.162,"endTime":849.344,"body":"proof of concept and we really looking forward"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":849.432,"endTime":854.06,"body":"when we can use decentralized Flux network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":849.432,"endTime":854.06,"body":"when the capacity is more elastic and we can."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":854.44,"endTime":857.424,"body":"So I hope it makes sense."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":857.472,"endTime":857.68,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":857.72,"endTime":863.344,"body":"So right now we have a small list of pre"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":857.72,"endTime":863.344,"body":"configured servers that cope with traffic"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":863.392,"endTime":866.4,"body":"quite well if people use them."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":866.52,"endTime":869.54,"body":"And that kind of provides privacy protections"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":870.07,"endTime":874.03,"body":"for the end users who can use both ours and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":870.07,"endTime":874.03,"body":"Flex servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":874.11,"endTime":875.742,"body":"And we certainly did discuss that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":875.766,"endTime":878.126,"body":"We do want to use decentralized infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":878.158,"endTime":883.662,"body":"that Flux has and it would dramatically lower"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":878.158,"endTime":883.662,"body":"the costs and improves reliability as well and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":883.686,"endTime":884.45,"body":"scalability."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":884.87,"endTime":889.278,"body":"Okay, so to clarify right"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":884.87,"endTime":889.278,"body":"now the simplex servers run by Flux are run on"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":889.414,"endTime":893.47,"body":"centralized architecture with the long term"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":889.414,"endTime":893.47,"body":"goal being that they run on the decentralized"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":893.55,"endTime":894.628,"body":"Flux network."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.814,"endTime":897.272,"body":"Yeah, sometimes you got to crawl before"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.814,"endTime":897.272,"body":"you run."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":897.376,"endTime":901.512,"body":"And one of the things we learned very early in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":897.376,"endTime":901.512,"body":"our relationship as we started doing our"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":901.536,"endTime":907.192,"body":"discovery is that a lot of, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":901.536,"endTime":907.192,"body":"thing about disruptive technology is this, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":907.216,"endTime":908.82,"body":"got to rebuild everything."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":909.28,"endTime":911.112,"body":"It isn't just lift and shift."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":911.176,"endTime":911.4,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":911.44,"endTime":914.408,"body":"So if it worked in web two, it's not always"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":911.44,"endTime":914.408,"body":"going to work in web three."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":914.464,"endTime":919.656,"body":"And as a matter of Fact, something similar so"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":914.464,"endTime":919.656,"body":"simplistic as two factor authentication, who's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":919.688,"endTime":923.2,"body":"controlled by a third party entity that that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":919.688,"endTime":923.2,"body":"doesn't work right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":923.24,"endTime":925.136,"body":"So you have to build these products out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":925.208,"endTime":927.712,"body":"So we've already kind of built out our MVP and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":927.736,"endTime":933.072,"body":"with arcane coming on Flux, which is our,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":927.736,"endTime":933.072,"body":"basically our full operating system, which is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":933.096,"endTime":937.744,"body":"true end to end encryption, it, this will just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":933.096,"endTime":937.744,"body":"roll naturally right into that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":937.832,"endTime":943.216,"body":"So our goal is to make this as private and as"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":937.832,"endTime":943.216,"body":"decentralized as humanly possible."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":943.368,"endTime":947.712,"body":"I think that that's, that's, that's the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":943.368,"endTime":947.712,"body":"ultimate goal, and I think guinea would agree"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":947.736,"endTime":952.112,"body":"with that, is to, to get it in as many"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":947.736,"endTime":952.112,"body":"people's hands as humanly possible and let"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":952.136,"endTime":954.048,"body":"them control the network as well."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":954.104,"endTime":958.112,"body":"Because it's not all about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":954.104,"endTime":958.112,"body":"centralized entities that are, that are going"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":958.136,"endTime":959.312,"body":"to build these products out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":959.336,"endTime":961.392,"body":"We want the community involved with that so"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":961.416,"endTime":967.06,"body":"that, that means deploying a server on Flux is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":961.416,"endTime":967.06,"body":"going to be huge."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":967.4,"endTime":970.0,"body":"And you know, we're going to continue to keep"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":967.4,"endTime":970.0,"body":"building the."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":970.12,"endTime":974.672,"body":"And as guinea said, redundancy obviously is a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":970.12,"endTime":974.672,"body":"big thing that we have to get in play."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":974.776,"endTime":980.618,"body":"So we're taking the experience that we learned"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":974.776,"endTime":980.618,"body":"from and I can't speak for Giddy, I can speak"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":980.634,"endTime":983.498,"body":"for MUS from, from, from the Telegram debacle."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":983.594,"endTime":986.794,"body":"And we're looking at that and we're working"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":983.594,"endTime":986.794,"body":"from back to forward."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":986.882,"endTime":993.882,"body":"We're looking at where is our exposure, how do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":986.882,"endTime":993.882,"body":"we, how do we keep privacy and anonymity even,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":994.066,"endTime":997.21,"body":"you know, as our four, as our forethought."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":997.29,"endTime":1002.202,"body":"So I think it's good with time, I think you're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":997.29,"endTime":1002.202,"body":"going to see this thing be completely and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1002.226,"endTime":1005.916,"body":"totally decentralized, obviously with some"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1002.226,"endTime":1005.916,"body":"redundancy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1005.948,"endTime":1009.996,"body":"Back over to Web2, I mean, because I'm not a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1005.948,"endTime":1009.996,"body":"maximalist, I don't think everything is Web"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1010.028,"endTime":1011.1,"body":"three and only Web three."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1011.14,"endTime":1015.868,"body":"I think there are some beneficial pieces to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1011.14,"endTime":1015.868,"body":"Web two for particular applications."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1015.964,"endTime":1019.18,"body":"This isn't one that I think falls into that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1015.964,"endTime":1019.18,"body":"category."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1019.26,"endTime":1022.652,"body":"I think the sooner we get it to a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1019.26,"endTime":1022.652,"body":"decentralized platform where it's not"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1022.676,"endTime":1028.652,"body":"controlled by platforms that can basically"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1022.676,"endTime":1028.652,"body":"censor you and remove your application if they"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1028.676,"endTime":1032.744,"body":"don't like you, I think that needs to come"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1028.676,"endTime":1032.744,"body":"sooner than later and I think Giddy would"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1032.752,"endTime":1033.112,"body":"agree with that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1033.136,"endTime":1037.208,"body":"And that definitely is on both of our roadmaps"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1033.136,"endTime":1037.208,"body":"100%."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1037.264,"endTime":1044.296,"body":"Then we talking about Telegram, we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1037.264,"endTime":1044.296,"body":"observed an attempt of several Telegram"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1044.328,"endTime":1051.368,"body":"communities to migrate and they all failed at"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1044.328,"endTime":1051.368,"body":"the current stage."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1051.464,"endTime":1051.928,"body":"Not all."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1051.984,"endTime":1053.624,"body":"Some of them, many of them failed because"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1053.712,"endTime":1059.944,"body":"Obviously there are 10,000, 100,000 people"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1053.712,"endTime":1059.944,"body":"Telegram communities and architecture for the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1059.952,"endTime":1064.756,"body":"groups we have right now simply doesn't"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1059.952,"endTime":1064.756,"body":"support the groups of this size."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1064.788,"endTime":1066.244,"body":"And that's our number one priority."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1066.292,"endTime":1068.212,"body":"That's what the whole team is working on right"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1068.236,"endTime":1071.68,"body":"now to make groups of this size work on"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1068.236,"endTime":1071.68,"body":"Simplex Network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1073.82,"endTime":1078.164,"body":"It took us, I should say, completely by"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1073.82,"endTime":1078.164,"body":"surprise some time ago that people actually"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1078.252,"endTime":1080.068,"body":"want to have public groups."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1080.164,"endTime":1084.996,"body":"But if you think about it, privacy is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1085.068,"endTime":1087.514,"body":"critically important for freedom of speech,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1085.068,"endTime":1087.514,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1087.652,"endTime":1094.99,"body":"We cannot really have freedom of speech"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1087.652,"endTime":1094.99,"body":"without privacy and anonymity."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1095.07,"endTime":1104.014,"body":"Because whatever people learned, right,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1095.07,"endTime":1104.014,"body":"whatever they say online, it can come back to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1104.022,"endTime":1104.19,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1104.23,"endTime":1106.222,"body":"It can come with some criticism, it can come"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1106.246,"endTime":1107.102,"body":"with them losing their job."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1107.126,"endTime":1109.662,"body":"They may not say anything illegal, but they've"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1107.126,"endTime":1109.662,"body":"seen plenty."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1109.726,"endTime":1114.222,"body":"A very large number of people losing their"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1109.726,"endTime":1114.222,"body":"jobs, losing their finances simply for"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1114.246,"endTime":1115.438,"body":"expressing their opinions online."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1115.494,"endTime":1116.744,"body":"And it's completely unacceptable."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1116.822,"endTime":1119.08,"body":"That's ultimate attack on freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1119.9,"endTime":1124.644,"body":"We've seen, for example, just a couple days"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1119.9,"endTime":1124.644,"body":"ago, some European politicians saying that,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1124.732,"endTime":1128.804,"body":"oh, we need to have mandatory IDs for"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1124.732,"endTime":1128.804,"body":"participating in social media."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1128.892,"endTime":1132.532,"body":"This is ridiculous, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1128.892,"endTime":1132.532,"body":"We cannot really afford anything like that to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1132.556,"endTime":1132.884,"body":"happen."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1132.972,"endTime":1135.24,"body":"It would be the end of freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1135.58,"endTime":1137.428,"body":"We posted a tweet with a quote."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1137.524,"endTime":1139.972,"body":"Oscar Wilde said, if you want the man to say"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1139.996,"endTime":1141.72,"body":"the truth, give them a mosque."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1142.23,"endTime":1144.65,"body":"And then you will learn what people actually"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1142.23,"endTime":1144.65,"body":"think."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1145.11,"endTime":1147.93,"body":"So that's critically important."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1148.23,"endTime":1151.502,"body":"And the problem with freedom of speech and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1151.526,"endTime":1157.262,"body":"censorship is that what we learned over time,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1151.526,"endTime":1157.262,"body":"that neither centralized models nor federated"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1157.326,"endTime":1160.878,"body":"models like Matrix or Mastodon, they actually"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1157.326,"endTime":1160.878,"body":"can protect freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1160.974,"endTime":1165.694,"body":"Because some people may think that, okay, if"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1160.974,"endTime":1165.694,"body":"you have federated model like Mastodon, then"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1165.702,"endTime":1167.918,"body":"you are more protected and you can move to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1165.702,"endTime":1167.918,"body":"another server."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1167.934,"endTime":1173.264,"body":"But that's not how it works actually in many"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1167.934,"endTime":1173.264,"body":"aspects, the censorship on federated platforms"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1173.312,"endTime":1179.664,"body":"becomes stronger than on centralized platform"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1173.312,"endTime":1179.664,"body":"because for something to be universally"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1179.712,"endTime":1184.016,"body":"accessible now all operators to have to agree"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1179.712,"endTime":1184.016,"body":"that it's a good thing, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1184.088,"endTime":1187.232,"body":"Which is horrible, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1184.088,"endTime":1187.232,"body":"It's like for something to be accessible on"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1187.256,"endTime":1190.288,"body":"Twitter, only Elon Musk has to agree it's a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1187.256,"endTime":1190.288,"body":"good thing, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1190.344,"endTime":1194.32,"body":"If for something to be accessible on Telegram,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1190.344,"endTime":1194.32,"body":"then Telegram owners have to agree on that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1194.36,"endTime":1199.202,"body":"But on Mastodon, if I as a server operator"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1194.36,"endTime":1199.202,"body":"decide that I don't like the policies of the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1199.226,"endTime":1202.594,"body":"server, I can de federate it, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1199.226,"endTime":1202.594,"body":"And I can like stop exchanging content with"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1202.602,"endTime":1202.77,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1202.81,"endTime":1204.43,"body":"It massively disrupts the network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1204.81,"endTime":1210.002,"body":"So the model for decentralization that we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1204.81,"endTime":1210.002,"body":"have, which we are going to be building in"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1210.026,"endTime":1211.586,"body":"Simple X network is completely opposite."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1211.618,"endTime":1214.498,"body":"It's extreme decentralization when for"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1214.554,"endTime":1221.154,"body":"something to be existing as a communication"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1214.554,"endTime":1221.154,"body":"space, at least one operator has to agree with"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1221.162,"endTime":1221.78,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1221.97,"endTime":1228.272,"body":"And for something to be CENSORED all operators"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1221.97,"endTime":1228.272,"body":"would need to want to censor it, which is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1228.296,"endTime":1232.176,"body":"completely opposite, which is closer to the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1228.296,"endTime":1232.176,"body":"model of community."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1232.248,"endTime":1235.52,"body":"Now it's on Twitter, so it's effectively a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1232.248,"endTime":1235.52,"body":"community vote."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1235.6,"endTime":1236.56,"body":"Okay, this is a good thing."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1236.6,"endTime":1237.232,"body":"We want to have it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1237.256,"endTime":1241.104,"body":"Yes, some operators may not like it, which"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1237.256,"endTime":1241.104,"body":"means they won't have this traffic."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1241.232,"endTime":1247.232,"body":"But as long as some operators believe it's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1241.232,"endTime":1247.232,"body":"acceptable wherever they are and it's legal"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1247.296,"endTime":1250.278,"body":"and, and good, then it will exist."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1250.374,"endTime":1255.782,"body":"So we really believe and primary motivation"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1250.374,"endTime":1255.782,"body":"for building Simplex Network was freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1255.806,"endTime":1256.198,"body":"speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1256.294,"endTime":1258.95,"body":"And I see privacy and freedom of speech as two"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1258.99,"endTime":1262.21,"body":"sides of the same coin when one is not"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1258.99,"endTime":1262.21,"body":"possible without another."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1262.91,"endTime":1265.59,"body":"Yeah, very interlocking."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1265.75,"endTime":1268.342,"body":"You know, privacy and freedom of speech, they"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1268.366,"endTime":1269.43,"body":"go hand in hand, I think."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1269.47,"endTime":1271.574,"body":"And that, and that's probably, you know, if"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1271.582,"endTime":1274.614,"body":"you're going to be in the space that you're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1271.582,"endTime":1274.614,"body":"going to be building technology, disruptive"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1274.662,"endTime":1277.59,"body":"technology like this, you have to have those"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1274.662,"endTime":1277.59,"body":"as your core tenants."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1277.75,"endTime":1281.622,"body":"You know, you're, it's, it's fundamental and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1277.75,"endTime":1281.622,"body":"you have to really think about it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1281.806,"endTime":1287.238,"body":"And that means sometimes you really got to go"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1281.806,"endTime":1287.238,"body":"off into the weeds because there's no, there's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1287.254,"endTime":1291.59,"body":"no playbook that's written for this, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1287.254,"endTime":1291.59,"body":"and as a matter of fact, you know, when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1291.63,"endTime":1295.542,"body":"technology, you know, when the Internet first"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1291.63,"endTime":1295.542,"body":"started, people started to focus on some"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1295.566,"endTime":1300.422,"body":"privacy and bringing things in that went by"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1295.566,"endTime":1300.422,"body":"the wayside once they figured out that we were"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1300.446,"endTime":1301.622,"body":"a data goldmind."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1301.686,"endTime":1302.006,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1302.078,"endTime":1305.466,"body":"So now we're working against everything that's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1305.498,"endTime":1310.762,"body":"already been for the past 15, 20 years been"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1305.498,"endTime":1310.762,"body":"built to push centralization."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1310.906,"endTime":1311.354,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1311.442,"endTime":1312.97,"body":"People don't want to take care of their own"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1313.01,"endTime":1315.29,"body":"assets until they have to."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1315.33,"endTime":1316.682,"body":"And I think that's where we're at now."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1316.706,"endTime":1317.802,"body":"And I think that's what, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1317.826,"endTime":1319.594,"body":"cryptocurrencies has brought into the parade."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1319.642,"endTime":1321.37,"body":"People don't want to think about their privacy"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1321.45,"endTime":1322.858,"body":"till it's taken away."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1322.994,"endTime":1323.578,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1323.714,"endTime":1326.33,"body":"Till you see a situation like, you know, what"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1326.37,"endTime":1329.824,"body":"happened with Telegram and so on and so forth,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1326.37,"endTime":1329.824,"body":"forth."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1329.952,"endTime":1336.16,"body":"So I think, you know, as technology continues"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1329.952,"endTime":1336.16,"body":"to iterate, we're going to go back to the old"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1336.28,"endTime":1340.16,"body":"thought process where you think, how do we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1336.28,"endTime":1340.16,"body":"make it decentralized, how do we make it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1340.2,"endTime":1344.672,"body":"private, how do we make it scalable and how do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1340.2,"endTime":1344.672,"body":"we, how do we get this into the hands of the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1344.696,"endTime":1344.88,"body":"people?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1344.92,"endTime":1349.776,"body":"And I think that's really what, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1344.92,"endTime":1349.776,"body":"supplex and, and Flux relationship is starting"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1349.808,"endTime":1350.08,"body":"to do."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1350.12,"endTime":1351.504,"body":"It's starting to get that into the hands of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1351.512,"endTime":1352.22,"body":"the people."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1352.92,"endTime":1358.478,"body":"100 Dan, I think you're explaining it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1352.92,"endTime":1358.478,"body":"better than me, and I kind Of."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1358.614,"endTime":1364.046,"body":"I'm certainly socially awkward to some extent,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1358.614,"endTime":1364.046,"body":"and I really can't explain to what extent."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1364.078,"endTime":1364.606,"body":"I appreciate."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1364.638,"endTime":1365.406,"body":"Yeah, but you're all."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1365.478,"endTime":1367.71,"body":"You're also a **** genius, so I will take"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1367.75,"endTime":1367.95,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1367.99,"endTime":1369.998,"body":"I could be a little bit better with words, but"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1370.054,"endTime":1372.05,"body":"I wish I could code like you, brother."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1374.71,"endTime":1376.27,"body":"Coding is hard indeed."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1376.35,"endTime":1377.342,"body":"It's. It's a lot of work."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1377.366,"endTime":1380.702,"body":"And you're absolutely right that we have to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1377.366,"endTime":1380.702,"body":"rebuild a lot of technology, ground up."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1380.726,"endTime":1386.282,"body":"And I think very few of our users understand"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1380.726,"endTime":1386.282,"body":"the level of complexity and immensity of the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1386.306,"endTime":1386.874,"body":"task."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1387.002,"endTime":1392.35,"body":"When we started it, like, three years ago, I"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1387.002,"endTime":1392.35,"body":"looked to the future being super scared"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1392.77,"endTime":1396.634,"body":"because what we built by now seemed immense"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1392.77,"endTime":1396.634,"body":"and impossible."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1396.682,"endTime":1397.034,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1397.122,"endTime":1399.05,"body":"I'm looking to the future even more scared now"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1399.09,"endTime":1401.114,"body":"because the future seems even better."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1401.202,"endTime":1402.234,"body":"That was terrifying."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1402.282,"endTime":1403.11,"body":"Isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1403.41,"endTime":1404.218,"body":"But here's the thing."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1404.274,"endTime":1406.01,"body":"Guinea, though, and the thing that I think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1406.05,"endTime":1412.12,"body":"really goes well for all of us is the fact"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1406.05,"endTime":1412.12,"body":"that we know that we're in an uphill battle."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1412.54,"endTime":1416.372,"body":"You know, we're going against trillions and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1412.54,"endTime":1416.372,"body":"trillions and trillions and trillions of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1416.396,"endTime":1420.484,"body":"dollars of technology that's been built over"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1416.396,"endTime":1420.484,"body":"the past, you know, 20 plus years."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1420.652,"endTime":1424.596,"body":"So. And here we are, bootstrap a couple guys"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1420.652,"endTime":1424.596,"body":"that are working on, you know, building"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1424.668,"endTime":1426.276,"body":"something to dethrone them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1426.428,"endTime":1428.196,"body":"That's what excites me."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1428.268,"endTime":1430.212,"body":"Every freaking morning I get up and I think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1430.236,"endTime":1430.788,"body":"about that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1430.844,"endTime":1432.58,"body":"Because you can do it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1432.7,"endTime":1433.812,"body":"Government code."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1433.876,"endTime":1434.1,"body":"That."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1434.14,"endTime":1435.508,"body":"That is where we're at, man."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1435.564,"endTime":1437.092,"body":"Like, and that really gets me excited."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1437.156,"endTime":1439.16,"body":"That's what drives me, for sure."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1439.54,"endTime":1442.236,"body":"Yeah. And it's amazing to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1439.54,"endTime":1442.236,"body":"see that things like the."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1442.308,"endTime":1444.476,"body":"The telegram incident."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1444.588,"endTime":1446.892,"body":"The telegram one is such a funny red pill,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1446.956,"endTime":1448.268,"body":"because nothing changed."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1448.364,"endTime":1451.26,"body":"There was no. There was no difference the day"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1451.3,"endTime":1453.74,"body":"Pavel Durov was arrested versus the day"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1451.3,"endTime":1453.74,"body":"before."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1453.86,"endTime":1455.756,"body":"Technically, Telegram was always open."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1455.828,"endTime":1457.66,"body":"Group chats were always censorable."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1457.82,"endTime":1458.7,"body":"User ip."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1458.78,"endTime":1460.524,"body":"All of that was already always revealed to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1460.532,"endTime":1465.156,"body":"Telegram, but it was just that moment where"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1460.532,"endTime":1465.156,"body":"people realized, hey, there's actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1465.228,"endTime":1466.18,"body":"downsides."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1466.34,"endTime":1467.556,"body":"There's actually downsides."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1467.588,"endTime":1469.028,"body":"They're like, wait a minute."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1469.124,"endTime":1470.28,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1471.82,"endTime":1474.148,"body":"What we were being told is, well, it's."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1474.244,"endTime":1475.892,"body":"You know, I always say there's two forms of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1475.916,"endTime":1476.452,"body":"adoption."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1476.516,"endTime":1478.852,"body":"There's by attrition, which is a natural"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1478.916,"endTime":1481.204,"body":"progress of technology, and by."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1481.292,"endTime":1482.452,"body":"By incident."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1482.596,"endTime":1486.948,"body":"So something that's happened that made us all"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1482.596,"endTime":1486.948,"body":"of a sudden consciously aware."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1487.124,"endTime":1489.812,"body":"Twitter files, for example, was a big one,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1487.124,"endTime":1489.812,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1489.916,"endTime":1495.7,"body":"So people knew what the government was doing,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1489.916,"endTime":1495.7,"body":"but sometimes, out of sight, out of mind, when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1495.74,"endTime":1502.66,"body":"they actually saw the magnitude of what they"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1495.74,"endTime":1502.66,"body":"were doing, it was jaw dropping, you know, and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1502.7,"endTime":1504.42,"body":"people were like, I can't Even believe that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1504.46,"endTime":1508.74,"body":"And it really was for the election, the recent"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1504.46,"endTime":1508.74,"body":"election, I think it was the number one"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1508.78,"endTime":1513.284,"body":"driving piece is people want freedom of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1508.78,"endTime":1513.284,"body":"speech, they want privacy, they don't want to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1513.292,"endTime":1514.852,"body":"be told what to do by the government."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1514.956,"endTime":1518.9,"body":"You know, and I think that, you know, we are"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1514.956,"endTime":1518.9,"body":"evangelists of that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1518.94,"endTime":1521.092,"body":"We need to get out there and get the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1518.94,"endTime":1521.092,"body":"technology."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1521.196,"endTime":1525.668,"body":"And here's the other thing too, which really"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1521.196,"endTime":1525.668,"body":"is, is somewhat hard, is building these"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1525.724,"endTime":1532.74,"body":"technologies so they look and they feel like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1525.724,"endTime":1532.74,"body":"what Web2 was in a new Web3 world because, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1532.78,"endTime":1538.42,"body":"know, they've spent billions of dollars on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1532.78,"endTime":1538.42,"body":"user interfaces, real nice and sexy and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1538.46,"endTime":1538.98,"body":"packaged."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1539.06,"endTime":1541.188,"body":"They, you know, it's, it's the drug dealer"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1539.06,"endTime":1541.188,"body":"effect."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1541.244,"endTime":1545.452,"body":"You know, your bank gets you in there, they"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1541.244,"endTime":1545.452,"body":"give you a nice application so you could do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1545.476,"endTime":1546.124,"body":"web banking."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1546.172,"endTime":1547.948,"body":"You never have to worry about your money, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1547.964,"endTime":1548.38,"body":"always there."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1548.42,"endTime":1550.092,"body":"But guess what, it's not your money."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1550.196,"endTime":1552.204,"body":"It's not your money, you know, and it's the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1552.212,"endTime":1553.148,"body":"same way with your data."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1553.204,"endTime":1555.66,"body":"And by the way, your data is just as valuable."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1555.82,"endTime":1561.836,"body":"There's a there, you know, you should be able"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1555.82,"endTime":1561.836,"body":"to be incentivized even for the data you're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1561.868,"endTime":1562.524,"body":"providing."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1562.652,"endTime":1565.052,"body":"You should be able to opt out by default."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1565.116,"endTime":1567.676,"body":"Like you should not be in a program."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1567.828,"endTime":1573.89,"body":"AI is the next big thing, you know, as it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1567.828,"endTime":1573.89,"body":"continues to be a data magnet."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1573.97,"endTime":1579.362,"body":"So I think the one advantage that we have is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1573.97,"endTime":1579.362,"body":"that we know that they're going to continue to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1579.386,"endTime":1581.07,"body":"keep pivoting the dis."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1581.45,"endTime":1585.634,"body":"They want to disrupt the disruptors because we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1581.45,"endTime":1585.634,"body":"came to disrupt them and now they want to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1585.642,"endTime":1586.21,"body":"disrupt us."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1586.25,"endTime":1589.762,"body":"You see this back and forth and I think, but"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1589.786,"endTime":1595.57,"body":"we're, we are much more nimble and much more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1589.786,"endTime":1595.57,"body":"flexible and you know, go back to that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1595.61,"endTime":1597.27,"body":"cypherpunk manifesto."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1599.31,"endTime":1602.47,"body":"I think those guys would be real happy to see"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1599.31,"endTime":1602.47,"body":"where we're at right now."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1602.59,"endTime":1608.31,"body":"You know, I think that we've picked up the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1602.59,"endTime":1608.31,"body":"battle and ran with it and you know, I'd love"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1608.35,"endTime":1612.49,"body":"to see every application that we're using"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1608.35,"endTime":1612.49,"body":"private and decentralized."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1612.83,"endTime":1613.654,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1613.702,"endTime":1615.382,"body":"And it's one of the things that's so"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1615.406,"endTime":1619.622,"body":"refreshing about actually building things in"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1615.406,"endTime":1619.622,"body":"the space is that when people wake up, when"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1619.646,"endTime":1623.974,"body":"they have these incidents that show people"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1619.646,"endTime":1623.974,"body":"that the things they've been using, even if"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1623.982,"endTime":1626.538,"body":"they haven't changed, have been broken all"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1623.982,"endTime":1626.538,"body":"along."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1626.674,"endTime":1630.17,"body":"And that the benefits that they've been"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1626.674,"endTime":1630.17,"body":"reaping by selling their data have"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1630.21,"endTime":1631.098,"body":"consequences."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1631.274,"endTime":1633.402,"body":"And so it's beautiful that we're actually able"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1633.426,"endTime":1635.002,"body":"to build this stuff, improve it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1635.106,"endTime":1636.522,"body":"And that's why I'm so excited about things"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1636.546,"endTime":1641.21,"body":"like Simplex improving about Things like Flux"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1636.546,"endTime":1641.21,"body":"providing services to Simplex because it means"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1641.25,"endTime":1645.322,"body":"that when those people wake up, they have"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1641.25,"endTime":1645.322,"body":"tools that they can actually turn to that are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1645.346,"endTime":1649.946,"body":"actually useful, that are intuitive, that are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1645.346,"endTime":1649.946,"body":"easy to use, and that makes that transition"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1650.058,"endTime":1653.786,"body":"actually happen instead of what happens when"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1650.058,"endTime":1653.786,"body":"there's not good tools, which is people"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1653.858,"endTime":1658.788,"body":"realize the problem, they try the solution and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1653.858,"endTime":1658.788,"body":"they go, it's too difficult, it's not worth"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1658.804,"endTime":1659.172,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1659.276,"endTime":1662.996,"body":"I'm just going to suffer the consequences of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1659.276,"endTime":1662.996,"body":"using Telegram or something like that."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1663.148,"endTime":1667.284,"body":"And so that's why I'm so excited that things"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1663.148,"endTime":1667.284,"body":"like Simplex exist and are improving so that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1667.292,"endTime":1671.012,"body":"it's getting easier and easier every day for"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1667.292,"endTime":1671.012,"body":"people who wake up to actually switch to a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1671.036,"endTime":1674.44,"body":"tool that protects their privacy and cares"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":1671.036,"endTime":1674.44,"body":"about their freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1675.02,"endTime":1677.396,"body":"I was going to say Seth, to your"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1675.02,"endTime":1677.396,"body":"comment."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1677.468,"endTime":1677.796,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1677.868,"endTime":1680.036,"body":"So Flux doesn't provide a service to us,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1680.108,"endTime":1680.484,"body":"really."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1680.572,"endTime":1683.188,"body":"Flux provides the service to our users."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1683.284,"endTime":1683.636,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1683.708,"endTime":1685.156,"body":"So, and that's, I think it's very important"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1685.228,"endTime":1686.488,"body":"distinction here."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1686.684,"endTime":1693.424,"body":"And because we do not see what we do as a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1686.684,"endTime":1693.424,"body":"company, as a service at all."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1693.592,"endTime":1699.248,"body":"Architecture of the network is such that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1693.592,"endTime":1699.248,"body":"whoever runs the server is much closer to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1699.304,"endTime":1700.944,"body":"website hosting provider."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1701.072,"endTime":1706.064,"body":"It's just when you choose where you host your"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1701.072,"endTime":1706.064,"body":"website, you choose your hosting provider"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1706.112,"endTime":1706.98,"body":"wholesale."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1707.64,"endTime":1709.504,"body":"You have to decide."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1709.552,"endTime":1711.104,"body":"And it's very costly to migrate."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1711.152,"endTime":1714.772,"body":"And if your hosting provider decides to kill"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1711.152,"endTime":1714.772,"body":"your website, they can do it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1714.936,"endTime":1717.404,"body":"They know you, they know that the website"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1714.936,"endTime":1717.404,"body":"exists."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1717.452,"endTime":1720.684,"body":"And it's very much dependent on the hosting"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1717.452,"endTime":1720.684,"body":"provider."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1720.812,"endTime":1724.716,"body":"What servers in Simplex network provide is not"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1720.812,"endTime":1724.716,"body":"a service."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1724.788,"endTime":1730.076,"body":"It's a piece of little pieces of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1724.788,"endTime":1730.076,"body":"infrastructure, such as message delivery pipe"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1730.188,"endTime":1733.804,"body":"or a chunk of file stored on the servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1733.932,"endTime":1738.492,"body":"So it's almost like buying your infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1733.932,"endTime":1738.492,"body":"or getting your infrastructure."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1738.556,"endTime":1740.332,"body":"Currently it's all free piecemeal."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1740.396,"endTime":1740.812,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1740.916,"endTime":1745.508,"body":"And the advantage of that, that is that you"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1740.916,"endTime":1745.508,"body":"can get operator redundancy is that you are"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1745.564,"endTime":1747.86,"body":"less dependent on any particular operator."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1748.02,"endTime":1754.852,"body":"And while it's not the case there, we see"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1748.02,"endTime":1754.852,"body":"operators as completely disposable and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1754.876,"endTime":1756.68,"body":"replaceable and redundant."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1757.02,"endTime":1763.796,"body":"It's effectively a server, a hosting provider"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1757.02,"endTime":1763.796,"body":"with zero lock in which you purchase as like,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1763.948,"endTime":1765.716,"body":"as electricity from the network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1765.868,"endTime":1768.1,"body":"Like in the same way you can get"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1768.22,"endTime":1773.352,"body":"infrastructure capacity from Simplex network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1768.22,"endTime":1773.352,"body":"and have the same control and ownership as"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1773.376,"endTime":1774.728,"body":"people have over their own website."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1774.784,"endTime":1779.864,"body":"Because if you use Telegram or Facebook or any"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1774.784,"endTime":1779.864,"body":"other service, I think what's very important,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1779.952,"endTime":1786.52,"body":"you don't own your content anymore, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1779.952,"endTime":1786.52,"body":"So you grant irrevocable license and the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1786.56,"endTime":1789.704,"body":"second somebody shares your content, you can't"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1786.56,"endTime":1789.704,"body":"even revoke it anymore."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1789.752,"endTime":1793.54,"body":"It's no longer yours, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1789.752,"endTime":1793.54,"body":"That's the terms of service."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1794.08,"endTime":1800.312,"body":"And if they decide to censor you, you can be"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1794.08,"endTime":1800.312,"body":"censored in a nanosecond simply because"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1800.496,"endTime":1802.504,"body":"government cries too loudly."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1802.552,"endTime":1805.512,"body":"As Mark Zuckerberg recently said, imagine"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1805.576,"endTime":1810.232,"body":"somebody cries at you and you suddenly destroy"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1805.576,"endTime":1810.232,"body":"the livelihood of millions of people and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1810.336,"endTime":1811.08,"body":"whatever."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1811.24,"endTime":1813.112,"body":"So that's just not acceptable."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1813.176,"endTime":1818.552,"body":"We want a model when operators understand if"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1818.576,"endTime":1821.288,"body":"they don't respect their users, they will"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1818.576,"endTime":1821.288,"body":"simply be out of business."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1821.344,"endTime":1821.512,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1821.536,"endTime":1823.416,"body":"Nobody will buy infrastructure that suddenly"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1823.448,"endTime":1826.5,"body":"disappears simply because somebody cries too"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1823.448,"endTime":1826.5,"body":"much."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1827.97,"endTime":1829.29,"body":"And that's very important."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1829.33,"endTime":1831.594,"body":"So fundamentally we provide infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1831.642,"endTime":1835.114,"body":"facilities, but we don't provide a service to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1831.642,"endTime":1835.114,"body":"people who use the network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1835.202,"endTime":1837.082,"body":"They construct the service themselves."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1837.146,"endTime":1839.034,"body":"They fully control the servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1839.082,"endTime":1841.146,"body":"And that's what's so exciting about this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1839.082,"endTime":1841.146,"body":"network model."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1841.178,"endTime":1842.51,"body":"It's much closer."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1843.25,"endTime":1848.25,"body":"I think my closest analogy to what we're"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1843.25,"endTime":1848.25,"body":"building is the future of the web the way Tim"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1848.29,"endTime":1854.802,"body":"Berners Lee was seeing it with micropayments"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1848.29,"endTime":1854.802,"body":"with updates that users can make in the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1854.826,"endTime":1859.698,"body":"network with full control of the network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1854.826,"endTime":1859.698,"body":"without serial operators having as much"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1859.754,"endTime":1863.31,"body":"influence on the network as they have in any"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":1859.754,"endTime":1863.31,"body":"other network."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1864.01,"endTime":1865.954,"body":"Yeah, and I, I, I would just want to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1864.01,"endTime":1865.954,"body":"expand."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1866.002,"endTime":1868.45,"body":"And now I remembered what I was going to say"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1866.002,"endTime":1868.45,"body":"and it was so good."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1868.49,"endTime":1869.506,"body":"I'm glad I did."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1869.658,"endTime":1872.434,"body":"What products did Google does Google sell?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1872.602,"endTime":1875.906,"body":"And I'm not talking Android or anything like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1872.602,"endTime":1875.906,"body":"that, that's a separate, separate arm."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1875.938,"endTime":1879.07,"body":"But what is the product that Google sells?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1875.938,"endTime":1879.07,"body":"You?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1879.21,"endTime":1882.294,"body":"If you don't know what the product is, you are"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1879.21,"endTime":1882.294,"body":"the product."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1882.382,"endTime":1882.63,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1882.67,"endTime":1884.758,"body":"You know, people are just hand handing over"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1884.814,"endTime":1890.214,"body":"their data freely and they gave us a, a pretty"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1884.814,"endTime":1890.214,"body":"search engine and some free email and all of a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1890.222,"endTime":1891.83,"body":"sudden we're giving them all the data."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1891.95,"endTime":1897.158,"body":"And you know what, what changed my focus on,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1891.95,"endTime":1897.158,"body":"on privacy was I worked for the world's large,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1897.214,"endTime":1900.87,"body":"well, one of the world's largest healthcare"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1897.214,"endTime":1900.87,"body":"organizations in the C suite."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1901.03,"endTime":1906.39,"body":"And you know, I started to watch our patient"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1901.03,"endTime":1906.39,"body":"data get migrated to Google and Google was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1906.43,"endTime":1908.464,"body":"starting to utilize that patient data."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1908.582,"endTime":1910.38,"body":"I felt that was the dirtiest thing ever."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1910.42,"endTime":1911.58,"body":"And I had to get out of that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1911.62,"endTime":1913.804,"body":"Like, I could not deal with any of that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1913.892,"endTime":1914.38,"body":"Why?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1914.5,"endTime":1917.34,"body":"Because the patients didn't know their data"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1914.5,"endTime":1917.34,"body":"was being used."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1917.38,"endTime":1919.02,"body":"And we're not talking like a few things."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1919.06,"endTime":1922.028,"body":"We're talking about your entire health catalog"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1922.124,"endTime":1927.548,"body":"from the time you were born till now is being"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1922.124,"endTime":1927.548,"body":"extrapolated and utilized by Google and other"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1927.604,"endTime":1928.268,"body":"platforms."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1928.364,"endTime":1930.092,"body":"That just blows my mind."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1930.196,"endTime":1933.34,"body":"So we have to make a stand somewhere and we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1933.38,"endTime":1937.92,"body":"have to start putting the focus back on that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1933.38,"endTime":1937.92,"body":"privacy piece and data anonymity."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1938.25,"endTime":1942.754,"body":"You know, I, I think what we're going to see"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1938.25,"endTime":1942.754,"body":"in the Future is we are starting to get it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1942.842,"endTime":1944.69,"body":"educated every generation."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1944.77,"endTime":1948.194,"body":"We move further on, there's a more focused on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1948.282,"endTime":1952.274,"body":"privacy, which is totally bizarre because we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1948.282,"endTime":1952.274,"body":"look at these kids, they've got Facebook,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1952.362,"endTime":1955.666,"body":"Snapchat, Instagram, Twitter, whatever, okay?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1955.698,"endTime":1956.85,"body":"They put everything out there."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1956.89,"endTime":1958.594,"body":"I ate this for lunch, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1958.682,"endTime":1960.19,"body":"So everybody, check it out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1960.97,"endTime":1965.004,"body":"They're finally starting to figure out they're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1960.97,"endTime":1965.004,"body":"watching the debacle with TikTok."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1965.052,"endTime":1968.652,"body":"They're watching all these different things,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1965.052,"endTime":1968.652,"body":"and they're saying, you know, I think that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1968.676,"endTime":1973.148,"body":"we're kind of almost like cattle to these"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1968.676,"endTime":1973.148,"body":"guys, and we need to start really thinking"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1973.164,"endTime":1973.66,"body":"about that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1973.7,"endTime":1977.948,"body":"My son, who's, you know, I'd love for him to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1973.7,"endTime":1977.948,"body":"be a privacy advocate, he."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1978.004,"endTime":1979.932,"body":"He just goes 100 degrees the other way."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1979.956,"endTime":1980.492,"body":"You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1980.516,"endTime":1983.212,"body":"He's got his stuff out there and everything"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1980.516,"endTime":1983.212,"body":"else."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1983.356,"endTime":1986.636,"body":"He finally reached out to me one day and he"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1983.356,"endTime":1986.636,"body":"says, hey, how do I clean up my stuff?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1986.668,"endTime":1989.948,"body":"So not everything's on the Internet and I got"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1986.668,"endTime":1989.948,"body":"to get, get away from this stuff."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1990.044,"endTime":1995.388,"body":"So I think we're starting to see these younger"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1990.044,"endTime":1995.388,"body":"generations because it's a problem for them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1995.524,"endTime":1996.028,"body":"It is."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1996.084,"endTime":1997.74,"body":"It is a major challenge for them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1997.78,"endTime":2001.98,"body":"They're starting to see it and these pivotal"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1997.78,"endTime":2001.98,"body":"little things that are popping up, like the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2002.02,"endTime":2003.292,"body":"battle for TikTok."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2003.436,"endTime":2004.924,"body":"There should be no battle."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2005.052,"endTime":2006.252,"body":"There should be no battle."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2006.316,"endTime":2009.708,"body":"The government should have no sway in the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2006.316,"endTime":2009.708,"body":"applications we use."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2009.764,"endTime":2015.308,"body":"Whether I disdain and with a capital D,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2009.764,"endTime":2015.308,"body":"TikTok, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2015.364,"endTime":2021.88,"body":"As a platform, I will 100%, a hundred percent"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2015.364,"endTime":2021.88,"body":"stand behind their ability to have that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2021.92,"endTime":2022.968,"body":"application running."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2023.064,"endTime":2024.888,"body":"And for the first time, when you start taking"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2024.944,"endTime":2027.768,"body":"things away like that and people start really"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2024.944,"endTime":2027.768,"body":"looking at it again."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2027.824,"endTime":2029.7,"body":"Adoption by incident, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2030.08,"endTime":2033.752,"body":"We're starting to see this newfound desire or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2030.08,"endTime":2033.752,"body":"demand."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2033.856,"endTime":2038.792,"body":"The number one thing I get asked questions on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2033.856,"endTime":2038.792,"body":"is not about because flux is in AI, we're in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2038.816,"endTime":2040.264,"body":"Web3, we're in Cloud compute."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2040.312,"endTime":2042.824,"body":"We've got the world's biggest decentralized"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2040.312,"endTime":2042.824,"body":"network."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2042.912,"endTime":2046.618,"body":"The number one question I get is this my data"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2042.912,"endTime":2046.618,"body":"safe?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2046.794,"endTime":2048.938,"body":"Is my data private?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2046.794,"endTime":2048.938,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2048.994,"endTime":2049.418,"body":"These are."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2049.474,"endTime":2050.026,"body":"These are."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2050.098,"endTime":2050.73,"body":"These are."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2050.85,"endTime":2052.458,"body":"Because these are fundamentals, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2052.514,"endTime":2055.242,"body":"People are starting to get to those"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2052.514,"endTime":2055.242,"body":"fundamentals."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2055.386,"endTime":2060.842,"body":"So I think the easiest way to really kind of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2055.386,"endTime":2060.842,"body":"beat some of these big players, build a better"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2060.866,"endTime":2061.578,"body":"mousetrap."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2061.674,"endTime":2063.35,"body":"That's exactly what we're doing."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2063.73,"endTime":2064.506,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2064.538,"endTime":2065.05,"body":"Agreed."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2065.13,"endTime":2069.45,"body":"I think as these tools improve, it just gets"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2065.13,"endTime":2069.45,"body":"easier and easier for people to move to them"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2069.49,"endTime":2072.234,"body":"when they wake up and they realize that need"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2069.49,"endTime":2072.234,"body":"for privacy because it is happening."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2072.282,"endTime":2078.102,"body":"I think it's easy to see the privacy issues in"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2072.282,"endTime":2078.102,"body":"the world and kind of get caught up in how"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2078.126,"endTime":2082.07,"body":"Many bad things are happening, but I feel like"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2078.126,"endTime":2082.07,"body":"especially over the last four or five years,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2082.11,"endTime":2086.262,"body":"we've seen just massive growth in the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2082.11,"endTime":2086.262,"body":"community of people who actually want to take"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2086.286,"endTime":2087.574,"body":"their privacy seriously."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2087.702,"endTime":2088.934,"body":"So that's been really encouraging."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2088.982,"endTime":2091.27,"body":"And I want to kind of pivot us back a little"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2091.31,"endTime":2098.086,"body":"bit to this server architecture, this setup,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2091.31,"endTime":2098.086,"body":"and just talk about kind of what are the plans"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2098.118,"endTime":2100.406,"body":"for how you'll get more operators on the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2098.118,"endTime":2100.406,"body":"network?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2100.478,"endTime":2104.262,"body":"Is there any kind of monetization plan?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2100.478,"endTime":2104.262,"body":"I know you have a document that you've put out"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2104.286,"endTime":2109.202,"body":"that has some details there, Evgeny, but kind"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2104.286,"endTime":2109.202,"body":"of where do you see the next steps for the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2109.226,"endTime":2111.71,"body":"operators on the network and how that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2109.226,"endTime":2111.71,"body":"function's going?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2113.45,"endTime":2117.474,"body":"Somebody has to pay the bills, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2113.45,"endTime":2117.474,"body":"It all goes to a very simple thing."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2117.562,"endTime":2122.722,"body":"So we are fortunate to have fantastic"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2117.562,"endTime":2122.722,"body":"investors that support our journey and we are"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2122.746,"endTime":2124.002,"body":"fortunate to have flux."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2124.066,"endTime":2129.762,"body":"But ultimately, currently the network spends"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2124.066,"endTime":2129.762,"body":"more money than it produces, even though it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2129.786,"endTime":2130.914,"body":"reduces the value."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2131.082,"endTime":2134.864,"body":"So for anything to be sustainable, it has to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2134.872,"endTime":2140.016,"body":"make profit, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2134.872,"endTime":2140.016,"body":"So people have a lot of like ideas,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2140.128,"endTime":2143.168,"body":"particularly in the privacy community, that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2140.128,"endTime":2143.168,"body":"nonprofit is a good thing."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2143.224,"endTime":2148.176,"body":"But reality is nonprofits also have to make"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2143.224,"endTime":2148.176,"body":"profit to survive, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2148.248,"endTime":2152.768,"body":"The only advantage that it gives them is the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2148.248,"endTime":2152.768,"body":"fact that they don't, don't they pay any tax"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2152.824,"endTime":2156.416,"body":"on profit, but they get at the expense of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2152.824,"endTime":2156.416,"body":"additional regulation."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2156.608,"endTime":2161.152,"body":"And in any case, if they spend more money than"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2156.608,"endTime":2161.152,"body":"they receive from their sponsors, they would"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2161.176,"endTime":2162.604,"body":"be out of business as well."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2162.792,"endTime":2166.484,"body":"So the model that we see is based on the idea"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2166.532,"endTime":2173.332,"body":"that we need to somehow have users pay money"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2166.532,"endTime":2173.332,"body":"to the operators of the servers for the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2173.356,"endTime":2174.788,"body":"services they consume."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2174.884,"endTime":2177.188,"body":"And traditionally it doesn't mean that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2174.884,"endTime":2177.188,"body":"everybody has to pay."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2177.244,"endTime":2179.684,"body":"It doesn't mean there has to be no free tier."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2179.732,"endTime":2181.732,"body":"There may be some basic free tier, there may"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2181.756,"endTime":2187.556,"body":"be some ability to use the network at some"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2181.756,"endTime":2187.556,"body":"acceptable quality level without paying"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2187.588,"endTime":2188.36,"body":"anything."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2188.87,"endTime":2194.622,"body":"But ultimately the end users of the network"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2188.87,"endTime":2194.622,"body":"either pay for the usage of the network one"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2194.646,"endTime":2199.118,"body":"way or another or their data is going to be"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2194.646,"endTime":2199.118,"body":"sold."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2199.214,"endTime":2202.094,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2199.214,"endTime":2202.094,"body":"And there is no other alternative and nobody"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2202.142,"endTime":2203.198,"body":"wants their data sold."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2203.294,"endTime":2209.21,"body":"The problem with payments is that people don't"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2203.294,"endTime":2209.21,"body":"like the idea that when they pay something"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2209.51,"endTime":2214.206,"body":"that they somehow have their identity"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2209.51,"endTime":2214.206,"body":"attached."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2214.238,"endTime":2218.248,"body":"Because we live in a world and it's almost"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2214.238,"endTime":2218.248,"body":"impossible to pay money without kyc, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2218.304,"endTime":2222.792,"body":"So there are some privacy preserving"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2218.304,"endTime":2222.792,"body":"cryptocurrencies, but they struggle with"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2222.816,"endTime":2227.624,"body":"adoption and many people don't use them."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2227.712,"endTime":2230.456,"body":"And in majority of blockchains are traceable,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2230.488,"endTime":2231.352,"body":"et cetera, et cetera."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2231.416,"endTime":2234.328,"body":"So how do we break the line here and how we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2234.384,"endTime":2238.696,"body":"avoid being yet one more cryptocurrency"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2234.384,"endTime":2238.696,"body":"because we don't want to be a cryptocurrency."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2238.728,"endTime":2240.54,"body":"We want to be focused on communication."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2241.04,"endTime":2249.168,"body":"So we have a concept design that allows to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2241.04,"endTime":2249.168,"body":"effectively purchase and give to the operators"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2249.264,"endTime":2252.34,"body":"of the network a digital equivalent of the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2249.264,"endTime":2252.34,"body":"gift card."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2253.32,"endTime":2258.272,"body":"A gift card is something that's not money,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2253.32,"endTime":2258.272,"body":"that can be used as an arbitrary form of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2258.296,"endTime":2263.184,"body":"payment, that can only be used to buy"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2258.296,"endTime":2263.184,"body":"infrastructure primitives like these little"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2263.272,"endTime":2268.62,"body":"pipes to transfer messages or chunks of files"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2263.272,"endTime":2268.62,"body":"being uploaded for some period of time."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2269.16,"endTime":2276.898,"body":"And what's important that when I pay money"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2269.16,"endTime":2276.898,"body":"it's impossible to connect to me consuming"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2276.914,"endTime":2278.61,"body":"these infrastructure primitives."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2278.77,"endTime":2281.714,"body":"So we obviously it requires both a lot of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2281.722,"endTime":2283.842,"body":"technical development and legal research."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2283.946,"endTime":2286.882,"body":"But ultimately gift cards are legal."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2286.946,"endTime":2291.25,"body":"Consuming digital services without KYC is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2291.29,"endTime":2299.302,"body":"still legal and we have to fight for it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2291.29,"endTime":2299.302,"body":"remaining legal and providing that that we can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2299.326,"endTime":2300.63,"body":"operate with this environment."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2300.75,"endTime":2304.902,"body":"And it looks like the United States at least"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2300.75,"endTime":2304.902,"body":"moves to the territory when digital assets are"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2304.926,"endTime":2308.534,"body":"supported and privacy and supported and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2304.926,"endTime":2308.534,"body":"technology development is supported."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2308.662,"endTime":2313.158,"body":"So this seems completely viable future when it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2308.662,"endTime":2313.158,"body":"can pay for the service."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2313.294,"endTime":2319.606,"body":"But the only thing that is known is how much"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2313.294,"endTime":2319.606,"body":"money I spent."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2319.718,"endTime":2322.87,"body":"And even this knowledge is decentralized"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2319.718,"endTime":2322.87,"body":"across multiple operators."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2322.95,"endTime":2329.172,"body":"Because if, if operators sell me those gift"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2322.95,"endTime":2329.172,"body":"certificates then even if they know my"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2329.196,"endTime":2334.532,"body":"identity as somebody who pays a, they don't"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2329.196,"endTime":2334.532,"body":"know how much those gift certificates are"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2334.556,"endTime":2337.12,"body":"purchased in total and they don't know how I"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2334.556,"endTime":2337.12,"body":"spent it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2337.5,"endTime":2343.044,"body":"It's all based on advanced cryptography,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2337.5,"endTime":2343.044,"body":"similar to how zero knowledge proofs work."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2343.212,"endTime":2350.276,"body":"And the fact that you consume the service can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2343.212,"endTime":2350.276,"body":"be completely decoupled, can be completely"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2350.308,"endTime":2353.364,"body":"decoupled from the fact of purchase of this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2350.308,"endTime":2353.364,"body":"certificate."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2353.412,"endTime":2358.706,"body":"When I was explaining this vision to our like"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2353.412,"endTime":2358.706,"body":"advisor, he said oh, this is like Visa."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2358.738,"endTime":2360.114,"body":"This is what Visa does with banks."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2360.162,"endTime":2362.098,"body":"And we kind of since that point we started"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2362.154,"endTime":2363.394,"body":"calling it Visa of telecom."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2363.442,"endTime":2371.33,"body":"So effectively it's a partnership between"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2363.442,"endTime":2371.33,"body":"multiple infrastructure operators that can all"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2371.37,"endTime":2377.57,"body":"participate under certain rules and can issue"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2371.37,"endTime":2377.57,"body":"those certificates and also accept those"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2377.61,"endTime":2382.8,"body":"certificates in exchange for infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2377.61,"endTime":2382.8,"body":"services."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2383.26,"endTime":2388.276,"body":"All records it on single internal blockchain"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2383.26,"endTime":2388.276,"body":"but without it becoming a cryptocurrency."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2388.308,"endTime":2389.508,"body":"So that's our vision."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2389.604,"endTime":2391.844,"body":"And then if think about how it can evolve"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2391.892,"endTime":2392.196,"body":"further."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2392.268,"endTime":2395.14,"body":"Obviously having this accounts in primitive"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2395.22,"endTime":2402.884,"body":"that allows you to buy those let's say"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2395.22,"endTime":2402.884,"body":"infrastructure vouchers or gift certificates"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2403.012,"endTime":2406.644,"body":"and then use them that can also be used for"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2403.012,"endTime":2406.644,"body":"all sorts of other digital goods."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2406.692,"endTime":2412.35,"body":"You can buy subscriptions to content channels,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2406.692,"endTime":2412.35,"body":"you can buy digital goods, you can buy any"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2412.39,"endTime":2415.294,"body":"other digital services that don't require kyc."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2415.342,"endTime":2417.422,"body":"Because today for example, Amazon knows what I"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2417.446,"endTime":2418.57,"body":"read, what I watch."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2418.87,"endTime":2423.774,"body":"If I use Amazon to Buy digital goods, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2418.87,"endTime":2423.774,"body":"And if you look, there is really very little"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2423.942,"endTime":2430.622,"body":"opportunity to buy digital goods and services"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2423.942,"endTime":2430.622,"body":"without some intermediary knowing your full"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2430.646,"endTime":2430.974,"body":"history."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2431.062,"endTime":2434.23,"body":"And this knowledge is used to abuse you,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2431.062,"endTime":2434.23,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2434.27,"endTime":2438.502,"body":"It's used for discriminatory pricing, it's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2434.27,"endTime":2438.502,"body":"used for manipulative advertising, it's used"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2438.526,"endTime":2443.366,"body":"for all the bad things, allowing to build a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2438.526,"endTime":2443.366,"body":"very detailed profile about you."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2443.438,"endTime":2448.902,"body":"So what we see is a vision of the network that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2443.438,"endTime":2448.902,"body":"allows to both provide a communication fabric"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2449.046,"endTime":2457.414,"body":"for any communication, but also can be used to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2449.046,"endTime":2457.414,"body":"purchase any digital goods and services in a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2457.422,"endTime":2458.95,"body":"way that preserve your anonymity."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2459.03,"endTime":2465.048,"body":"So creators, content creators, producers of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2459.03,"endTime":2465.048,"body":"those goods and services get paid without"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2465.104,"endTime":2465.976,"body":"knowing who you are."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2466.048,"endTime":2467.992,"body":"They know how much they sold, they don't know"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2468.016,"endTime":2469.144,"body":"how many people bought it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2469.232,"endTime":2475.784,"body":"I think it's really, really important to allow"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2469.232,"endTime":2475.784,"body":"such kind of the same level of privacy in a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2475.792,"endTime":2476.536,"body":"digital space."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2476.608,"endTime":2479.64,"body":"We had an old retail bookstore, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2479.68,"endTime":2482.744,"body":"Like if I buy the book off the bookshelf,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2479.68,"endTime":2482.744,"body":"nobody knows what I'm reading."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2482.792,"endTime":2488.86,"body":"I kind of like this situation, right, when"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2482.792,"endTime":2488.86,"body":"nobody can consolidate the knowledge about"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2488.98,"endTime":2490.94,"body":"what I am reading throughout my life."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2491.06,"endTime":2491.436,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2491.508,"endTime":2495.34,"body":"Today we live in a world and every website you"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2491.508,"endTime":2495.34,"body":"watch can be recorded, every movie you watch,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2495.38,"endTime":2496.44,"body":"every book you read."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2497.06,"endTime":2502.684,"body":"I think we can build a future which will"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2497.06,"endTime":2502.684,"body":"restore the same level of privacy that we had"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2502.852,"endTime":2505.548,"body":"before the Internet, but with the Internet."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2505.644,"endTime":2507.884,"body":"And that's ultimately the vision for multiple"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2507.932,"endTime":2511.516,"body":"operators in the network and for commercial"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2507.932,"endTime":2511.516,"body":"model in this network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2511.588,"endTime":2514.76,"body":"So think like Visa of telecom."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2515.1,"endTime":2518.08,"body":"That's how we call this vision for the future."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2518.38,"endTime":2520.388,"body":"And thankfully cryptography"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2518.38,"endTime":2520.388,"body":"is there already."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2520.444,"endTime":2524.18,"body":"I mean, this is a concept that people have"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2520.444,"endTime":2524.18,"body":"been solving for a while."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2524.22,"endTime":2529.476,"body":"I know, like I just did an episode with Vlad"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2524.22,"endTime":2529.476,"body":"from Cocky who are a privacy preserving search"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2529.508,"endTime":2533.492,"body":"engine and they had basically the same problem"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2529.508,"endTime":2533.492,"body":"where they wanted users to be able to pay and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2533.516,"endTime":2538.692,"body":"then be authenticated for searches, but not"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2533.516,"endTime":2538.692,"body":"reveal which searches are happening with which"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2538.716,"endTime":2540.886,"body":"account and with which payment method."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2540.998,"endTime":2545.046,"body":"So they're doing something very similar in"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2540.998,"endTime":2545.046,"body":"that you essentially pay and you get these"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2545.118,"endTime":2549.222,"body":"credits that are cryptographically unlinked"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2545.118,"endTime":2549.222,"body":"from the payment that you made."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2549.326,"endTime":2553.606,"body":"And whenever you go and you redeem them, the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2549.326,"endTime":2553.606,"body":"operator has no idea who you are."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2553.678,"endTime":2556.47,"body":"They just know that these credits are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2553.678,"endTime":2556.47,"body":"legitimate, they know that they are actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2556.51,"endTime":2560.006,"body":"issued by them and they let you pay for that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2556.51,"endTime":2560.006,"body":"service without doing anything else."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2560.038,"endTime":2564.79,"body":"It's very similar to the concept of ecash,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2560.038,"endTime":2564.79,"body":"which I know has existed for a good 30, 40"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2564.83,"endTime":2569.254,"body":"years at this point, but definitely something"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2564.83,"endTime":2569.254,"body":"that's solvable, which I'm thankful for and I"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2569.262,"endTime":2574.744,"body":"think is a really fascinating next step for"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2569.262,"endTime":2574.744,"body":"the infrastructure side I think you need to."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2574.752,"endTime":2577.18,"body":"Call it Byzantine gift cards."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2578.4,"endTime":2579.672,"body":"Yeah, possibly, yeah."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2579.736,"endTime":2581.432,"body":"But I think, I think what's important when you"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2581.456,"endTime":2588.504,"body":"try to develop something is to think less"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2581.456,"endTime":2588.504,"body":"about underlying technology and more about"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2588.592,"endTime":2589.224,"body":"user experience."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2589.312,"endTime":2591.704,"body":"I think the successful and widely adopted"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2591.752,"endTime":2596.264,"body":"technology innovations that we use today have"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2591.752,"endTime":2596.264,"body":"been all heavily focused on how users"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2596.312,"endTime":2599.94,"body":"experience technology and less focused on"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2596.312,"endTime":2599.94,"body":"what's the underlying technology."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2600.27,"endTime":2606.694,"body":"And with Blockchain it was clearly technology"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2600.27,"endTime":2606.694,"body":"driven more than it was user experience"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2606.782,"endTime":2607.142,"body":"driven."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2607.206,"endTime":2609.782,"body":"And I think we need to now somehow connect the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2609.806,"endTime":2614.61,"body":"level of privacy that we know possible with"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2609.806,"endTime":2614.61,"body":"the user experience that people want."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2615.15,"endTime":2616.326,"body":"And that's obviously a challenge."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2616.358,"endTime":2618.07,"body":"And this has been the challenge number one."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2618.11,"endTime":2618.31,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2618.35,"endTime":2621.126,"body":"So how do you replicate the user experience"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2621.198,"endTime":2623.734,"body":"that usually requires centralization, without"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2621.198,"endTime":2623.734,"body":"centralization?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2623.782,"endTime":2628.544,"body":"How do you replicate things that require some"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2623.782,"endTime":2628.544,"body":"privacy compromises without privacy"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2628.592,"endTime":2629.152,"body":"compromises?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2629.216,"endTime":2629.82,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2630.28,"endTime":2632.8,"body":"These are all solvable problem if you think"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2630.28,"endTime":2632.8,"body":"hard enough."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2632.84,"endTime":2634.34,"body":"But they are hard problems."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2635.0,"endTime":2636.208,"body":"Yeah, absolutely not."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2636.264,"endTime":2637.632,"body":"Not trivial to solve."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2637.776,"endTime":2641.504,"body":"But that's a big topic that I've been focusing"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2637.776,"endTime":2641.504,"body":"on more and more, is that the user experience"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2641.592,"endTime":2644.304,"body":"is so much more vital than how the underlying"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2641.592,"endTime":2644.304,"body":"tech works."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2644.352,"endTime":2646.128,"body":"Like the underlying tech needs to be good."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2646.184,"endTime":2649.408,"body":"And a lot of the privacy preserving technology"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2649.544,"endTime":2654.112,"body":"actually makes better user experience possible"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2649.544,"endTime":2654.112,"body":"because there's so much less that an operator"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2654.176,"endTime":2655.68,"body":"can do with data, that sort of thing."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2655.72,"endTime":2660.652,"body":"But that is a huge piece and one thing that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2655.72,"endTime":2660.652,"body":"goes so far into when people have that wake up"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2660.676,"endTime":2665.148,"body":"moment by incident like you've been saying,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2660.676,"endTime":2665.148,"body":"Dan, if the user experience is there, if it's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2665.164,"endTime":2668.956,"body":"not this massive hurdle, they're going to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2665.164,"endTime":2668.956,"body":"convert over and use these privacy preserving"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2668.988,"endTime":2670.24,"body":"tools much more readily."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.66,"endTime":2677.82,"body":"Yeah, I think we win and we win, win it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.66,"endTime":2677.82,"body":"all when we can have it as a, as a secondary"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2677.9,"endTime":2682.412,"body":"thought, like my wife goes to the atm, she"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2677.9,"endTime":2682.412,"body":"puts her card in, she puts her pin in, she"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2682.436,"endTime":2684.798,"body":"takes her cash, her card receipt and she"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2682.436,"endTime":2684.798,"body":"leaves."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2684.884,"endTime":2687.754,"body":"She doesn't give a, about any, sorry I said s"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2684.884,"endTime":2687.754,"body":"word."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2687.802,"endTime":2694.266,"body":"So she doesn't care about any of the things"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2687.802,"endTime":2694.266,"body":"that happen behind, you know, the doors there,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2694.338,"endTime":2696.362,"body":"the massive infrastructure that runs out."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2696.386,"endTime":2697.642,"body":"She just wants to use it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2697.746,"endTime":2699.546,"body":"So when we get to the point where we've built"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2699.578,"endTime":2703.754,"body":"the user interface to feel just like what"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2699.578,"endTime":2703.754,"body":"everybody else has had, that creature"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2703.802,"endTime":2704.33,"body":"comforts."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2704.41,"endTime":2710.304,"body":"And because here's, here's the thing, you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2704.41,"endTime":2710.304,"body":"make the most amazing technologically advanced"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2710.402,"endTime":2715.252,"body":"product out there and if they come to use it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2710.402,"endTime":2715.252,"body":"and they can't figure it out or it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2715.316,"endTime":2717.988,"body":"cumbersome, they will not come back."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2718.124,"endTime":2719.284,"body":"They will not come back."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2719.372,"endTime":2721.764,"body":"So you, the experience that they need to get"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2721.932,"endTime":2724.804,"body":"from the initial outset is one that they I've."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2724.852,"endTime":2725.86,"body":"I know what this is."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2725.9,"endTime":2726.788,"body":"I've used this."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2726.844,"endTime":2728.02,"body":"It feels the same."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2728.14,"endTime":2730.052,"body":"And I think that's, especially with what"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2730.076,"endTime":2737.402,"body":"Simplex is doing and, and what Flux is doing,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2730.076,"endTime":2737.402,"body":"is we've put a ton, I mean, a ton of focus on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2737.426,"endTime":2738.682,"body":"the user interface."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2738.826,"endTime":2747.05,"body":"It flows like, you know, it flows like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2738.826,"endTime":2747.05,"body":"Telegram, it feels like signal, it feels like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2747.09,"endTime":2747.69,"body":"these pieces."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2747.77,"endTime":2750.106,"body":"And eventually no one will ever think about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2750.178,"endTime":2751.946,"body":"the privacy piece in the back of it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2752.018,"endTime":2753.658,"body":"We've already thought about that for you."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2753.714,"endTime":2754.074,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2754.162,"endTime":2757.29,"body":"And then you can figure out how to monetize"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2754.162,"endTime":2757.29,"body":"that on your side."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2757.41,"endTime":2761.914,"body":"So, I mean, I, I think we're definitely at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2757.41,"endTime":2761.914,"body":"the, at the point where I think our biggest"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2761.962,"endTime":2767.198,"body":"success piece is we've built some amazing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2761.962,"endTime":2767.198,"body":"technologies, whether it's in cryptography or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2767.254,"endTime":2774.574,"body":"blockchain or whatever it is, but now we have"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2767.254,"endTime":2774.574,"body":"to apply them and make them useful, otherwise"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2774.622,"endTime":2777.85,"body":"we're not going to get where we want, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2774.622,"endTime":2777.85,"body":"know, long term."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2778.31,"endTime":2779.55,"body":"Definitely. Agreed."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2779.71,"endTime":2782.222,"body":"Well, the last main topic that I have for"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2782.246,"endTime":2787.214,"body":"y'all, and this one goes, goes back to Evgeny,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2782.246,"endTime":2787.214,"body":"is another hot topic lately in the Simplex"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2787.262,"endTime":2790.958,"body":"world, and one that you mentioned you want to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2787.262,"endTime":2790.958,"body":"talk about, is this idea of privacy preserving"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2791.054,"endTime":2792.222,"body":"content, moderation."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2792.366,"endTime":2796.094,"body":"And I'm really curious what you actually mean"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2792.366,"endTime":2796.094,"body":"by this, because."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":2796.262,"endTime":2797.13,"body":"Go ahead."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2797.59,"endTime":2798.33,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2799.27,"endTime":2806.062,"body":"I think the world is split in many camps when"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2799.27,"endTime":2806.062,"body":"it comes to freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2806.206,"endTime":2813.134,"body":"So many people call, for example, Elon Musk,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2806.206,"endTime":2813.134,"body":"freedom of speech apologist, but he's not."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2813.302,"endTime":2818.394,"body":"He understands that there are boundaries of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2813.302,"endTime":2818.394,"body":"acceptable behaviors and there are boundaries"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2818.542,"endTime":2822.178,"body":"that everybody universally agrees that are not"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2818.542,"endTime":2822.178,"body":"acceptable."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2822.274,"endTime":2822.818,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2822.954,"endTime":2828.898,"body":"And we have seen, for example, in several last"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2828.954,"endTime":2834.93,"body":"year, ongoing attempts in the European Union"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2828.954,"endTime":2834.93,"body":"to introduce the legislation that would"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2834.97,"endTime":2840.15,"body":"mandate scanning of end to end encrypted"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2834.97,"endTime":2840.15,"body":"communications."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2840.49,"endTime":2846.416,"body":"And it all have been happening under the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2840.49,"endTime":2846.416,"body":"guise, oh, we need to combat the distribution"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2846.448,"endTime":2848.896,"body":"of child sexual abuse materials."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2849.088,"endTime":2853.44,"body":"I 100% agree that this is not something we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2853.48,"endTime":2859.232,"body":"want to have within freedom of speech, but it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2853.48,"endTime":2859.232,"body":"doesn't mean that we want to compromise"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2859.296,"endTime":2861.536,"body":"privacy or security of communication."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2861.728,"endTime":2867.744,"body":"I actually made a talk at one of the German"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2861.728,"endTime":2867.744,"body":"governmental agencies about that because the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2867.752,"endTime":2871.312,"body":"problem is created predominantly by big tech,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2867.752,"endTime":2871.312,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2871.336,"endTime":2872.972,"body":"So, for example, take Facebook."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2873.076,"endTime":2875.1,"body":"Allegedly, according to the criminal cases"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2875.14,"endTime":2880.492,"body":"against Meta in multiple states, they knew"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2875.14,"endTime":2880.492,"body":"about the problem for years and they refused"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2880.556,"endTime":2883.036,"body":"to do anything about those problems for years."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2883.188,"endTime":2887.356,"body":"And they got to the situation when it's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2883.188,"endTime":2887.356,"body":"completely epidemic, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2887.428,"endTime":2889.08,"body":"When it's out of control."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2890.98,"endTime":2895.5,"body":"And then Facebook and Google and many other"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2890.98,"endTime":2895.5,"body":"big tech companies sponsored nonprofit"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2895.58,"endTime":2900.06,"body":"organizations that went out and started to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2895.58,"endTime":2900.06,"body":"lobby European governments for introducing"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2900.22,"endTime":2904.532,"body":"mandatory scanning to prevent the same problem"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2900.22,"endTime":2904.532,"body":"that they failed to prevent in the first"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2904.556,"endTime":2906.356,"body":"place, which is ridiculous, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2906.508,"endTime":2913.12,"body":"So a lot of what is unacceptable, even within"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2906.508,"endTime":2913.12,"body":"the free speech, happens in public space."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2913.66,"endTime":2917.636,"body":"And it's not about privacy, it's about"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2913.66,"endTime":2917.636,"body":"political will, it's about technological will."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2917.708,"endTime":2921.588,"body":"It's about the willingness to reduce the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2917.708,"endTime":2921.588,"body":"revenue ultimately, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2921.644,"endTime":2923.88,"body":"Because every traffic creates revenue."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2924.3,"endTime":2929.604,"body":"Illegal distribution of child sexual abuse"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2924.3,"endTime":2929.604,"body":"materials creates revenue for the big tech"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2929.652,"endTime":2930.196,"body":"companies."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2930.348,"endTime":2933.872,"body":"So they for some reason are reluctant."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2934.016,"endTime":2937.776,"body":"And generally, if you talk about freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2934.016,"endTime":2937.776,"body":"speech, Seth, imagine we're having podcasts"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2937.808,"endTime":2940.384,"body":"now and this is our private space."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2940.472,"endTime":2944.224,"body":"Imagine anybody joins to listen in, but then"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2940.472,"endTime":2944.224,"body":"they suddenly just say, oh, we have freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2944.232,"endTime":2945.024,"body":"speech, we can talk."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2945.112,"endTime":2948.128,"body":"Or you're giving a lecture, and then hundred"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2948.184,"endTime":2953.104,"body":"people barge in and start shouting that they"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2948.184,"endTime":2953.104,"body":"disagree with you."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2953.192,"endTime":2954.624,"body":"This is not about freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2954.672,"endTime":2956.832,"body":"The problem with absolute freedom of speech in"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2956.856,"endTime":2964.662,"body":"all spaces is that it kills the freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2956.856,"endTime":2964.662,"body":"speech because it suddenly becomes that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2964.686,"endTime":2967.57,"body":"whoever has the strongest voice is right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2967.87,"endTime":2973.974,"body":"And we've seen the same with huge censorship"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2967.87,"endTime":2973.974,"body":"machine in the United States and some elements"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2974.022,"endTime":2974.982,"body":"of that in Europe."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2975.086,"endTime":2978.214,"body":"Then whoever has the strongest voice is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2978.302,"endTime":2981.942,"body":"defining what is allowed under free speech"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2978.302,"endTime":2981.942,"body":"protection and what is not allowed under free"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2981.966,"endTime":2983.05,"body":"speech protection."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2983.95,"endTime":2991.778,"body":"So obviously going about our initiative, we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2983.95,"endTime":2991.778,"body":"did observe some distribution of child sexual"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2991.794,"endTime":2993.154,"body":"abuse materials on our network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2993.242,"endTime":2996.258,"body":"And whenever users report it, we remove those"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":2996.314,"endTime":2999.986,"body":"groups and files very promptly."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3000.018,"endTime":3001.666,"body":"We have a technology that does it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3001.818,"endTime":3003.346,"body":"And people say, how is it even possible?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3003.418,"endTime":3008.322,"body":"Because in people's minds, if you have end to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3003.418,"endTime":3008.322,"body":"end encrypted communication, then nobody can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3008.346,"endTime":3009.026,"body":"look into it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3009.098,"endTime":3016.412,"body":"And the trade off is either you can't censor"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3009.098,"endTime":3016.412,"body":"it and you shouldn't, or if you can and you"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3016.436,"endTime":3017.5,"body":"would, then you kind of."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3017.54,"endTime":3018.78,"body":"But that's not exactly right, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3018.82,"endTime":3022.94,"body":"So imagine like for example, on our platform,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3018.82,"endTime":3022.94,"body":"people can create public groups, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3022.98,"endTime":3024.72,"body":"Anybody can join those groups."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3025.78,"endTime":3030.876,"body":"The expectation of privacy for public groups"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3025.78,"endTime":3030.876,"body":"is very different, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3030.948,"endTime":3033.72,"body":"So you cannot have expectation of privacy of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3030.948,"endTime":3033.72,"body":"the content."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3034.02,"endTime":3039.092,"body":"It is, it is public, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3034.02,"endTime":3039.092,"body":"But what you can still have is expectation of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3039.116,"endTime":3042.884,"body":"privacy of your participation in this group,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3039.116,"endTime":3042.884,"body":"which is critically important for freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3042.892,"endTime":3043.588,"body":"speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3043.764,"endTime":3049.06,"body":"So what we published the blog post recently"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3043.764,"endTime":3049.06,"body":"titled Privacy Preserving Content."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3049.1,"endTime":3050.644,"body":"Moderation is exactly about that."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3050.732,"endTime":3053.284,"body":"How can we moderate content that's already"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3053.372,"endTime":3060.612,"body":"public without any scanning client or server"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3053.372,"endTime":3060.612,"body":"side, without any compromise or privacy and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3060.636,"endTime":3062.396,"body":"how we can prevent the distribution?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3062.548,"endTime":3065.88,"body":"And it ultimately is very simple, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3066.34,"endTime":3073.1,"body":"If we as a user, if our technology, if our"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3066.34,"endTime":3073.1,"body":"automated bot as a user can join a group, then"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3073.14,"endTime":3077.756,"body":"obviously it knows, okay, which servers are"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3073.14,"endTime":3077.756,"body":"used by this group, which files are uploaded,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3077.868,"endTime":3082.812,"body":"where they are uploaded, and obviously the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3077.868,"endTime":3082.812,"body":"group, this technology that is Bought have an"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3082.836,"endTime":3084.844,"body":"access to those servers, can then remove them."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3084.932,"endTime":3088.332,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3084.932,"endTime":3088.332,"body":"So we don't know and they can't know and it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3088.356,"endTime":3091.386,"body":"would be privacy violation and it's even"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3088.356,"endTime":3091.386,"body":"illegal."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3091.418,"endTime":3091.61,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3091.65,"endTime":3094.09,"body":"Because European Convention of Human Rights,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3094.13,"endTime":3096.49,"body":"for example, protects privacy as a basic"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3094.13,"endTime":3096.49,"body":"right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3096.61,"endTime":3102.026,"body":"So the whole idea is that we have to scan"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3096.61,"endTime":3102.026,"body":"everything to prevent abuse is ridiculous and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3102.098,"endTime":3102.778,"body":"illegal."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3102.874,"endTime":3106.362,"body":"But if we see something that is abuse,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3106.426,"endTime":3110.41,"body":"whatever we define as abuse, and we believe"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3106.426,"endTime":3110.41,"body":"that we do not want to participate in"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3110.45,"endTime":3117.364,"body":"distribution of those materials, I think our"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3110.45,"endTime":3117.364,"body":"right as operators of the service is to refuse"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3117.412,"endTime":3117.62,"body":"right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3117.66,"endTime":3122.772,"body":"And we see it happening in Feziverse and we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3117.66,"endTime":3122.772,"body":"see it happening in centralized platform."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3122.836,"endTime":3126.068,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3122.836,"endTime":3126.068,"body":"All operators define the boundary what's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3126.084,"endTime":3130.48,"body":"acceptable and what's not acceptable behavior"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3126.084,"endTime":3130.48,"body":"in this network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3131.18,"endTime":3137.572,"body":"And as I said before though, what's really"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3131.18,"endTime":3137.572,"body":"important about our destination is that if we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3137.676,"endTime":3141.444,"body":"get to the point when every single group,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3137.676,"endTime":3141.444,"body":"every single conversation depends on multiple"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3141.492,"endTime":3146.954,"body":"operators, then for something to be censored,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3141.492,"endTime":3146.954,"body":"all operators have to decide, okay, this is a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3146.962,"endTime":3148.33,"body":"bad thing, we want to remove it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3148.37,"endTime":3150.026,"body":"And only then it will be censored."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3150.138,"endTime":3152.906,"body":"And if some operators decide, okay, I disagree"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3152.938,"endTime":3156.698,"body":"with this opinion, so therefore I want to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3152.938,"endTime":3156.698,"body":"censor it, it would have completely zero"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3156.754,"endTime":3157.626,"body":"effect, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3157.698,"endTime":3162.554,"body":"Because some other operators, I may disagree."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3162.682,"endTime":3164.842,"body":"I think Winston Churchill who said that I may"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3164.866,"endTime":3168.032,"body":"disagree with your opinion, but I will fight"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3164.866,"endTime":3168.032,"body":"for your right to express it."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3168.186,"endTime":3170.756,"body":"And that's pretty much where I stand on"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3168.186,"endTime":3170.756,"body":"freedom of speech."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3170.788,"endTime":3175.092,"body":"There are lots of opinions I disagree with,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3170.788,"endTime":3175.092,"body":"but they have to be heard, they have to be"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3175.116,"endTime":3177.364,"body":"said, they have to be discussed, they have to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3175.116,"endTime":3177.364,"body":"be debated."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3177.412,"endTime":3181.252,"body":"And that's the only way to protect freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3177.412,"endTime":3181.252,"body":"speech and the only way it can be possible."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3181.356,"endTime":3187.012,"body":"If on the one hand, each communication"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3181.356,"endTime":3187.012,"body":"operator can decide what communication they"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3187.036,"endTime":3192.82,"body":"want and don't want to provide, but on another"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3187.036,"endTime":3192.82,"body":"hand, none of the user depends just on one"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3192.86,"endTime":3193.38,"body":"operator."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3193.46,"endTime":3196.996,"body":"Because we historically built communication"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3193.46,"endTime":3196.996,"body":"network when our operator is our everything."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3197.068,"endTime":3202.9,"body":"If this operator, the platforms we lost, we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3197.068,"endTime":3202.9,"body":"lost communication, we lost friends, we lost"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3202.94,"endTime":3204.132,"body":"connection, we lost our business."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3204.236,"endTime":3205.876,"body":"And that's the situation we need to change."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3205.948,"endTime":3210.692,"body":"We need to balance those scales and make it so"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3210.716,"endTime":3216.1,"body":"that each user of the network depends on"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3210.716,"endTime":3216.1,"body":"multiple operators, and not just on one, and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3216.14,"endTime":3221.236,"body":"depends in such a way that only collective"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3216.14,"endTime":3221.236,"body":"action can result in censorship."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3221.268,"endTime":3225.364,"body":"And in this case, yes, we can then prevent"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3221.268,"endTime":3225.364,"body":"distribution of child sexual abuse materials."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3225.412,"endTime":3233.288,"body":"But whatever mistakes any operator can make in"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3225.412,"endTime":3233.288,"body":"any other limitations would have zero effect"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3233.424,"endTime":3236.088,"body":"because they will be compensated by other."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3236.144,"endTime":3239.416,"body":"I hope it makes sense what I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3236.144,"endTime":3239.416,"body":"explain, but please ask questions."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3239.528,"endTime":3242.38,"body":"Yeah, let me kind of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3239.528,"endTime":3242.38,"body":"summarize."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3243.68,"endTime":3246.184,"body":"Yeah, go on."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3246.352,"endTime":3249.784,"body":"I was just going to say, let"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3246.352,"endTime":3249.784,"body":"me just kind of summarize what I heard to make"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3249.792,"endTime":3250.92,"body":"sure that we're on the same page."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3251.0,"endTime":3252.6,"body":"And I think it makes total sense to me."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3252.64,"endTime":3256.762,"body":"So basically, I mean, if you're in a public"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3252.64,"endTime":3256.762,"body":"group chat, obviously like you mentioned, the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3256.786,"endTime":3261.514,"body":"content is public, and thus if all of that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3256.786,"endTime":3261.514,"body":"content lives on servers controlled by a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3261.522,"endTime":3264.394,"body":"single entity, that content can be moderated."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3264.522,"endTime":3268.73,"body":"And that just technologically makes sense, and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3264.522,"endTime":3268.73,"body":"I think logically makes sense that that is"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3268.77,"endTime":3275.754,"body":"possible and in a way is right, because data"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3268.77,"endTime":3275.754,"body":"sovereignty doesn't go only one way."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3275.842,"endTime":3279.178,"body":"It doesn't mean that just the end user should"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3275.842,"endTime":3279.178,"body":"have data sovereignty and have control over"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3279.234,"endTime":3283.566,"body":"their data, but also the person actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3279.234,"endTime":3283.566,"body":"providing the service, the infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3283.598,"endTime":3288.302,"body":"operator, should also have the right to be"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3283.598,"endTime":3288.302,"body":"able to decide what data is served that they"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3288.326,"endTime":3289.902,"body":"have visibility into, obviously."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3289.966,"endTime":3292.494,"body":"And so they would have visibility into public"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3289.966,"endTime":3292.494,"body":"group chats."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3292.622,"endTime":3294.91,"body":"They could moderate that as they see fit."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3294.99,"endTime":3296.51,"body":"But like you mentioned, there's protection"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3296.59,"endTime":3301.966,"body":"against an abuse of that power because if"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3296.59,"endTime":3301.966,"body":"you're using multiple server or servers"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3301.998,"endTime":3306.638,"body":"operated by multiple entities, or you're"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3301.998,"endTime":3306.638,"body":"hosting your own relay server, you have"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3306.694,"endTime":3311.152,"body":"protection against censorship, especially"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3306.694,"endTime":3311.152,"body":"censorship that is illegitimate because they"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3311.176,"endTime":3314.864,"body":"can't remove data from your servers or they"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3311.176,"endTime":3314.864,"body":"can't remove data from servers that are not"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3314.952,"endTime":3315.92,"body":"within their control."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3316.04,"endTime":3317.472,"body":"So I think that totally makes sense."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3317.536,"endTime":3319.648,"body":"And then obviously, just to clarify, private"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3319.704,"endTime":3324.448,"body":"chats, there's no ability to moderate because"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3319.704,"endTime":3324.448,"body":"there's no technical visibility into what's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3324.464,"endTime":3326.336,"body":"happening in that private chat."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3326.448,"endTime":3328.176,"body":"So there's nothing that could be done there."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3328.328,"endTime":3330.528,"body":"But in public group chats, obviously there,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3330.584,"endTime":3334.528,"body":"there can be visibility because that content"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3330.584,"endTime":3334.528,"body":"is public by choice of the people actually"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3334.584,"endTime":3335.544,"body":"participating."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3335.712,"endTime":3340.872,"body":"And so if all of that data lives on one set of"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3335.712,"endTime":3340.872,"body":"servers that are hosted by one entity, then"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3340.896,"endTime":3342.184,"body":"it's trivial to moderate."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3342.232,"endTime":3344.552,"body":"Or if all of the operators of the servers that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3344.576,"endTime":3348.92,"body":"that group chat exists on agree on that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3344.576,"endTime":3348.92,"body":"moderation policy, they can still do it there,"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3348.96,"endTime":3350.216,"body":"which I think just makes sense."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3350.248,"endTime":3355.848,"body":"And I think there's this hard line where"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3350.248,"endTime":3355.848,"body":"people feel like we have to have total freedom"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3355.864,"endTime":3356.264,"body":"of speech."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3356.312,"endTime":3358.824,"body":"But just like you said, that actually destroys"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3358.872,"endTime":3364.19,"body":"freedom of speech if you allow things that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3358.872,"endTime":3364.19,"body":"simply should not exist on a place that you"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3364.23,"endTime":3365.102,"body":"have control."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3365.286,"endTime":3370.542,"body":"But that's again, the kind of balance that's"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3365.286,"endTime":3370.542,"body":"being struck here is ultimately the user has"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3370.566,"endTime":3374.302,"body":"control over what servers are used, the group"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3370.566,"endTime":3374.302,"body":"operators have control over what servers are"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3374.326,"endTime":3374.75,"body":"used."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3374.87,"endTime":3380.302,"body":"And so there, there can be balance while still"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3374.87,"endTime":3380.302,"body":"allowing moderation of clearly illegal and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3380.326,"endTime":3384.25,"body":"unethical data from people servers when you"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3380.326,"endTime":3384.25,"body":"have control over them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3385.11,"endTime":3389.71,"body":"Yeah, all I was going to, all I was going"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3385.11,"endTime":3389.71,"body":"to add to that is the fact that just because"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3389.75,"endTime":3393.514,"body":"it's private and decentralized, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3389.75,"endTime":3393.514,"body":"mean it's jealous."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3393.562,"endTime":3398.474,"body":"I mean, we have to remember that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3393.562,"endTime":3398.474,"body":"there is, I am a freedom of speech maximalist,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3398.522,"endTime":3400.106,"body":"but, but I agree with Guinea."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3400.138,"endTime":3402.826,"body":"I, I mean, obviously there's content that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3400.138,"endTime":3402.826,"body":"should be nowhere."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3402.938,"endTime":3403.45,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3403.57,"endTime":3406.17,"body":"I think that's, that's a, that's a human right"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3406.21,"endTime":3411.098,"body":"as well, to not be exposed or, you know, have"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3406.21,"endTime":3411.098,"body":"things like that done, especially to our young"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3411.154,"endTime":3413.786,"body":"children, you know, which is terrible."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3413.978,"endTime":3416.17,"body":"But, but they're nefarious people out there."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3416.21,"endTime":3419.508,"body":"And, but you cannot build technology for the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3419.564,"endTime":3420.868,"body":"less than 1%."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3421.004,"endTime":3423.524,"body":"You have to build technology for the masses."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3423.652,"endTime":3429.252,"body":"And 99.9% of the folks that are using these"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3423.652,"endTime":3429.252,"body":"platforms, they're using them for every day"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3429.276,"endTime":3430.76,"body":"and just want privacy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3431.18,"endTime":3435.284,"body":"You know, in the States, we have, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3431.18,"endTime":3435.284,"body":"big arguments about guns."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3435.412,"endTime":3440.484,"body":"You know, you know, like they say, well, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3435.412,"endTime":3440.484,"body":"know, people kill each other with guns, so we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3440.492,"endTime":3441.396,"body":"need to outlaw guns."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3441.428,"endTime":3444.59,"body":"Well, then you have to outlaw spoons because"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3441.428,"endTime":3444.59,"body":"they make people fat."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3444.7,"endTime":3445.13,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3445.21,"endTime":3447.05,"body":"You know, you could go through the list of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3447.09,"endTime":3453.45,"body":"things, those items by themselves and the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3447.09,"endTime":3453.45,"body":"majority of the people that utilize them does"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3453.49,"endTime":3461.882,"body":"not constitute banning something or, or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3453.49,"endTime":3461.882,"body":"censoring something for the, for the less than"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3461.906,"endTime":3462.762,"body":"1%."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3462.946,"endTime":3467.162,"body":"So in my, my view, I, I think, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3462.946,"endTime":3467.162,"body":"governments are definitely going to have a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3467.186,"endTime":3467.93,"body":"challenge on their hand."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3467.97,"endTime":3469.674,"body":"They're going to have to become more proactive"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3469.722,"endTime":3470.946,"body":"rather than reactive."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3471.098,"endTime":3474.674,"body":"At the point right now, they're unbelievably"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3471.098,"endTime":3474.674,"body":"reactive."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3474.722,"endTime":3477.042,"body":"They go and they serve subpoenas across the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3474.722,"endTime":3477.042,"body":"board."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3477.146,"endTime":3480.39,"body":"They need to start thinking outside the box,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3477.146,"endTime":3480.39,"body":"fundamentally."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3481.05,"endTime":3486.194,"body":"So, you know, but, but my, my goal is to build"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3481.05,"endTime":3486.194,"body":"it for the masses because I'm protecting the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3486.202,"endTime":3492.194,"body":"masses and then deal with the folks that are"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3486.202,"endTime":3492.194,"body":"nefarious along the way."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3492.282,"endTime":3494.562,"body":"So, yes, I do agree with what guinea was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3492.282,"endTime":3494.562,"body":"saying."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3494.586,"endTime":3497.51,"body":"I think that that's a perfect, perfect"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3494.586,"endTime":3497.51,"body":"explanation."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3498.42,"endTime":3499.484,"body":"Yeah. And that's critical."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3499.532,"endTime":3503.324,"body":"I think whoever advocates for unabridged"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3503.372,"endTime":3508.732,"body":"freedoms have to understand that freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3503.372,"endTime":3508.732,"body":"individuals should end precisely where the"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3508.756,"endTime":3511.068,"body":"freedom of another individual starts."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3511.244,"endTime":3514.252,"body":"And the second you say, okay, my freedom of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3514.276,"endTime":3517.468,"body":"unlimited, I can do whatever the hell I want,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3514.276,"endTime":3517.468,"body":"okay, then it means you can kill people,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3517.524,"endTime":3518.12,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3518.58,"endTime":3519.916,"body":"You can steal, you can, whatever."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3519.948,"endTime":3521.132,"body":"It's like, what is the boundary of this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3521.156,"endTime":3522.588,"body":"behavior?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3521.156,"endTime":3522.588,"body":"The boundary is very simple."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3522.684,"endTime":3529.986,"body":"So freedom should stop when another person's"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3522.684,"endTime":3529.986,"body":"freedom starts and it's a conflict,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3530.018,"endTime":3534.13,"body":"inevitably, it requires some management, it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3530.018,"endTime":3534.13,"body":"requires some discussion of the boundaries, it"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3534.17,"endTime":3535.874,"body":"requires some consent."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3536.002,"endTime":3536.626,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3536.778,"endTime":3541.554,"body":"So in the same way as users have to give"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3541.642,"endTime":3546.786,"body":"consent about what happens to their data There"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3541.642,"endTime":3546.786,"body":"should be at least limited ability for server"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3546.818,"endTime":3551.714,"body":"operators to have consent and rules and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3546.818,"endTime":3551.714,"body":"limitations about what may happen on operator"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3551.762,"endTime":3552.312,"body":"servers."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3552.426,"endTime":3556.572,"body":"And the approach that I found has absolutely"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3552.426,"endTime":3556.572,"body":"zero compromises."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3556.716,"endTime":3565.372,"body":"And we hope that it will be analyzed and used"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3556.716,"endTime":3565.372,"body":"by whatever politicians that really want to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3565.396,"endTime":3568.332,"body":"solve the problem of child sexual abuse"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3565.396,"endTime":3568.332,"body":"online."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3568.436,"endTime":3571.98,"body":"Because the way they see today is effectively"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3568.436,"endTime":3571.98,"body":"compromise everybody's privacy."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3572.06,"endTime":3575.148,"body":"It's like UK government, sorry for political"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3572.06,"endTime":3575.148,"body":"tutorial."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3575.164,"endTime":3580.348,"body":"They literally discussing okay, let's require"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3575.164,"endTime":3580.348,"body":"idea when we sell knives on Amazon because"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3580.404,"endTime":3581.036,"body":"knives can."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3581.108,"endTime":3581.628,"body":"It's not a joke."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3581.644,"endTime":3582.636,"body":"It just said spoon."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3582.748,"endTime":3585.88,"body":"We have exactly that with knives, which is"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3582.748,"endTime":3585.88,"body":"ridiculous, right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3586.18,"endTime":3590.3,"body":"How about we do something that actually works"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3586.18,"endTime":3590.3,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3590.34,"endTime":3594.38,"body":"Rather than something that compromises"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3590.34,"endTime":3594.38,"body":"everybody's privacy and converts our world"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3594.5,"endTime":3595.964,"body":"into a really nightmare."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3596.012,"endTime":3600.892,"body":"And it wouldn't even work because the problem"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3596.012,"endTime":3600.892,"body":"is that criminals will always file away."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3601.076,"endTime":3602.092,"body":"So you have to."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3602.196,"endTime":3603.596,"body":"Dan is absolutely right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3603.748,"endTime":3604.3,"body":"You're right."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3604.34,"endTime":3606.364,"body":"We have to develop technology for majority of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3606.372,"endTime":3613.088,"body":"the users finds in the right balance and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3606.372,"endTime":3613.088,"body":"protecting this majority of the users from any"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3613.144,"endTime":3614.336,"body":"nefarious activities."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3614.448,"endTime":3621.152,"body":"And we already hear for example, you may say"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3614.448,"endTime":3621.152,"body":"okay, online enthusiasts and techno geeks and"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3621.176,"endTime":3624.432,"body":"cyberfunks would use Simplex Network at this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3621.176,"endTime":3624.432,"body":"stage."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3624.496,"endTime":3629.312,"body":"But we hear a lot from family users who say,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3624.496,"endTime":3629.312,"body":"okay, we like the fact that nobody can"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3629.336,"endTime":3630.816,"body":"approach our children on this network."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3630.888,"endTime":3632.096,"body":"It's much safer than WhatsApp."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3632.128,"endTime":3633.6,"body":"It's much safer than Telegram."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3633.68,"endTime":3638.9,"body":"We can have communication with our kids, we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3633.68,"endTime":3638.9,"body":"can share family photos and nobody can reach"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3638.94,"endTime":3640.68,"body":"out to them and say hello."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3641.18,"endTime":3644.42,"body":"And that's not something that any other"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3641.18,"endTime":3644.42,"body":"platform can provide."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3644.54,"endTime":3651.284,"body":"But at the same time, it doesn't mean that we"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3644.54,"endTime":3651.284,"body":"have to say that public spaces do not require"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3651.332,"endTime":3653.204,"body":"protection from nefarious activities."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3653.332,"endTime":3654.676,"body":"So that's all hard balances."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3654.788,"endTime":3656.82,"body":"And it's really important that there is a way"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3656.86,"endTime":3662.74,"body":"to achieve safety in digital spaces without"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3656.86,"endTime":3662.74,"body":"any compromises to privacy and security, which"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3662.78,"endTime":3668.19,"body":"is what we hear in various warrant proposals"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3662.78,"endTime":3668.19,"body":"in European Union."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3668.27,"endTime":3673.214,"body":"I really hope that this will stop that this"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3668.27,"endTime":3673.214,"body":"whole idea that we can solve the problem by"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3673.302,"endTime":3674.542,"body":"client side scanning."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3674.606,"endTime":3675.214,"body":"No, we can't."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3675.262,"endTime":3675.694,"body":"We won't."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3675.742,"endTime":3677.33,"body":"We will only make it worse."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3677.91,"endTime":3679.502,"body":"Yeah, no, I definitely"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3677.91,"endTime":3679.502,"body":"agree."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3679.606,"endTime":3684.382,"body":"I love that concept of build for the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3679.606,"endTime":3684.382,"body":"legitimate users and then find intuitive"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3684.446,"endTime":3688.33,"body":"solutions for the minority that are causing"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3684.446,"endTime":3688.33,"body":"issues."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3689.03,"endTime":3690.446,"body":"And I think that definitely makes sense."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3690.478,"endTime":3692.814,"body":"I know it is a hot topic and one that sparks a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3692.822,"endTime":3693.246,"body":"lot of debate."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3693.278,"endTime":3695.402,"body":"I'll be sure to put the blog post in the show"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3695.426,"endTime":3699.402,"body":"notes as well so people can read more about"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3695.426,"endTime":3699.402,"body":"the the background of where you're coming from"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3699.426,"endTime":3701.61,"body":"and how technically this will, this will work."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3701.73,"endTime":3705.082,"body":"But it's Definitely one that I'm, I'm thankful"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3701.73,"endTime":3705.082,"body":"you're willing to talk about and talk through"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3705.106,"endTime":3707.594,"body":"and actually just have open and honest"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3705.106,"endTime":3707.594,"body":"discussion about."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3707.762,"endTime":3710.554,"body":"It can be a little heated both ways sometimes."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3710.682,"endTime":3712.042,"body":"So I think this is really helpful."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3712.106,"endTime":3714.81,"body":"But I know we're a little over the hour mark."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3714.85,"endTime":3718.922,"body":"Y'all are very, very busy, busy guys, so I"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3714.85,"endTime":3718.922,"body":"don't want to keep you too long, but I just"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3718.946,"endTime":3722.426,"body":"want to wrap up by giving you each a chance to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3718.946,"endTime":3722.426,"body":"talk about kind of what are you most excited"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3722.538,"endTime":3725.024,"body":"about with Simplex moving forward?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3725.112,"endTime":3729.312,"body":"Next things on your roadmap or concepts that"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3725.112,"endTime":3729.312,"body":"you're excited to push out and then the same"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3729.336,"endTime":3729.6,"body":"for you."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3729.64,"endTime":3731.584,"body":"Dan, I'll let you wrap up with telling us a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3731.592,"endTime":3733.296,"body":"little bit more about what you have planned"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3731.592,"endTime":3733.296,"body":"with Flux."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3733.328,"endTime":3735.1,"body":"But Evgeny, why don't you kick us off?"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3735.96,"endTime":3741.152,"body":"Well, our biggest and exciting"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3735.96,"endTime":3741.152,"body":"development right now is large groups that"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3741.176,"endTime":3741.648,"body":"will work."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3741.704,"endTime":3745.952,"body":"We've seen some influx, sorry for the pun of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3745.976,"endTime":3751.248,"body":"the users on Telegram who were trying to see"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3745.976,"endTime":3751.248,"body":"if they can host their communities on Simplex"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3751.344,"endTime":3752.768,"body":"and it's really exciting to see."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3752.824,"endTime":3758.046,"body":"And we have some groups that several thousands"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3752.824,"endTime":3758.046,"body":"of users and we know how badly they work"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3758.118,"endTime":3763.534,"body":"because currently groups are fully"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3758.118,"endTime":3763.534,"body":"decentralized and every time you send a"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3763.542,"endTime":3767.598,"body":"message to a group, your client effectively"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3763.542,"endTime":3767.598,"body":"has to send it to every group member, which"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3767.654,"endTime":3770.254,"body":"works up to hundreds of members."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3770.422,"endTime":3773.93,"body":"And it starts working really, really badly"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3770.422,"endTime":3773.93,"body":"when there are thousands of members."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3774.79,"endTime":3780.53,"body":"And we're developing the approach when there"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3774.79,"endTime":3780.53,"body":"will be some high power participants"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3781.35,"endTime":3785.902,"body":"specifically for public groups that will"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3781.35,"endTime":3785.902,"body":"provide privacy and actually would improve"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3786.006,"endTime":3791.262,"body":"privacy comparing with the current group"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3786.006,"endTime":3791.262,"body":"design by rebroadcasting messages to all"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3791.366,"endTime":3792.97,"body":"members in the group."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3793.27,"endTime":3799.582,"body":"So it's a lot of technologies development,"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3793.27,"endTime":3799.582,"body":"it's really, really deep and large problem."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3799.686,"endTime":3805.582,"body":"So we hope that in several months we will have"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3799.686,"endTime":3805.582,"body":"all current groups migrated to this new"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3805.606,"endTime":3810.8,"body":"technology and they will be able to scale to"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3805.606,"endTime":3810.8,"body":"tens and thousands, hundreds of thousands of"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3810.84,"endTime":3811.328,"body":"members."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3811.464,"endTime":3814.86,"body":"So that's literally our number one priority"},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":3811.464,"endTime":3814.86,"body":"for this year."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3815.32,"endTime":3818.64,"body":"Yeah, I love that because"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3815.32,"endTime":3818.64,"body":"I've always been fascinated by how much"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3818.68,"endTime":3822.736,"body":"interest there is in using a privacy"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3818.68,"endTime":3822.736,"body":"preserving platform for public group chats"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3822.848,"endTime":3826.464,"body":"because I think there's a lot of, I don't"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3822.848,"endTime":3826.464,"body":"know, it's just an interesting idea to me and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3826.472,"endTime":3827.872,"body":"I see a lot of people who love it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3827.896,"endTime":3831.936,"body":"But like you mentioned, even if the content is"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3827.896,"endTime":3831.936,"body":"public, the details about your participation"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3832.048,"endTime":3836.208,"body":"metadata being private is still a huge win"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3832.048,"endTime":3836.208,"body":"even for public group chats."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3836.304,"endTime":3839.452,"body":"So I think that is something that not only"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3836.304,"endTime":3839.452,"body":"people just want."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3839.556,"endTime":3843.532,"body":"So if it exists within the messenger, you'll"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3839.556,"endTime":3843.532,"body":"have drastically more users who are willing to"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3843.556,"endTime":3846.124,"body":"Also use it for just individual private"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3843.556,"endTime":3846.124,"body":"messaging and other things."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3846.212,"endTime":3852.236,"body":"But it's also a use case that fits very well"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3846.212,"endTime":3852.236,"body":"once y'all can iron out the architecture"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3852.268,"endTime":3852.46,"body":"issues."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3852.5,"endTime":3855.404,"body":"Because, you know, like you said, the current"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3852.5,"endTime":3855.404,"body":"architecture is not ideal for huge groups."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3855.452,"endTime":3859.116,"body":"But I'm excited to see how y'all, y'all do"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3855.452,"endTime":3859.116,"body":"solve that problem in the future."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3859.268,"endTime":3860.172,"body":"Um, but then how about you."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3860.196,"endTime":3862.124,"body":"But you, Dan, what's, what's coming up next"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3860.196,"endTime":3862.124,"body":"for Flux?"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3862.172,"endTime":3863.72,"body":"What do you want people to be aware of?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3864.59,"endTime":3867.462,"body":"So we have a big meeting coming February"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3864.59,"endTime":3867.462,"body":"1st."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3867.646,"endTime":3872.822,"body":"We are continuing to develop our, our Flux AI"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3867.646,"endTime":3872.822,"body":"product which is completely open source and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3872.846,"endTime":3878.502,"body":"decentralized and private by the way, so you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3872.846,"endTime":3878.502,"body":"get to keep your own data, you don't have to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3878.526,"endTime":3881.99,"body":"opt out on chat GPT and still get, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3878.526,"endTime":3881.99,"body":"data siphon from you."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3882.03,"endTime":3884.15,"body":"We don't collect anything, not squat."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3884.23,"endTime":3888.022,"body":"We use training models that are open source as"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3888.046,"endTime":3888.23,"body":"well."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3888.27,"endTime":3891.056,"body":"Our algorithm will be published, so we're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3891.088,"endTime":3893.104,"body":"highly transparent, so we're going to work on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3891.088,"endTime":3893.104,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3893.192,"endTime":3898.976,"body":"But that goes hand in hand with what we're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3893.192,"endTime":3898.976,"body":"doing with Simplex, which is we're working to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3899.128,"endTime":3904.72,"body":"make it so that every flux node operator,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3899.128,"endTime":3904.72,"body":"13,000 nodes across the world, can deploy the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3904.76,"endTime":3907.216,"body":"application and it has massive redundancy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3907.328,"endTime":3912.752,"body":"So helping guinea with redundancy on, on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3907.328,"endTime":3912.752,"body":"Simplex is huge for us and we finally have the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3912.776,"endTime":3915.922,"body":"capability to do, do that with the release of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3912.776,"endTime":3915.922,"body":"Arcane."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3916.056,"endTime":3921.582,"body":"So I think the big thing for us is our, our"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3916.056,"endTime":3921.582,"body":"roadmap is really around fine tuning and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3921.606,"endTime":3925.358,"body":"honing the products because the products were"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3921.606,"endTime":3925.358,"body":"all created, they're here, they're here today."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3925.494,"endTime":3929.534,"body":"Whether you're launching front ends, back"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3925.494,"endTime":3929.534,"body":"ends, game servers, all in a decentralized"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3929.582,"endTime":3934.302,"body":"manner, all ran globally, it all runs today."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3934.406,"endTime":3936.702,"body":"It's, it's getting that user interface tweak"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3936.766,"endTime":3940.158,"body":"so that we can really go, to go to go to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3936.766,"endTime":3940.158,"body":"massive market with it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3940.214,"endTime":3943.76,"body":"So we're already getting a ton of interest"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3940.214,"endTime":3943.76,"body":"from, from Web2."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3944.54,"endTime":3950.052,"body":"When I say our legacy technology, as I like to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3944.54,"endTime":3950.052,"body":"call them, they want to understand moving"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3950.116,"endTime":3954.436,"body":"forward how they're already in kind of save my"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3950.116,"endTime":3954.436,"body":"*** mode."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3954.628,"endTime":3959.22,"body":"They understand that there is going to be an"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3954.628,"endTime":3959.22,"body":"exodus, a mass exodus from their technology"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3959.34,"endTime":3965.236,"body":"platforms because people are becoming more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3959.34,"endTime":3965.236,"body":"aware of, of their privacy and how they're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3965.268,"endTime":3967.0,"body":"being utilized as assets."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3968.23,"endTime":3973.774,"body":"So I think Flux is going to continue to keep"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3968.23,"endTime":3973.774,"body":"doing that, supporting projects like Simplex"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3973.902,"endTime":3977.966,"body":"that is hands down doing something nobody's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3973.902,"endTime":3977.966,"body":"done before."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3978.118,"endTime":3981.758,"body":"Super proud to help them and continue to keep"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3978.118,"endTime":3981.758,"body":"building with them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3981.894,"endTime":3984.446,"body":"But we're going to really focus in on those"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3981.894,"endTime":3984.446,"body":"things."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3984.518,"endTime":3987.45,"body":"Privacy, decentralization and security."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3988.07,"endTime":3988.67,"body":"I love it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3988.71,"endTime":3989.374,"body":"I love it."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3989.462,"endTime":3991.166,"body":"It's definitely very aligned here."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3991.238,"endTime":3993.086,"body":"So thankful for you guys."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3993.198,"endTime":3997.87,"body":"Grateful for the work that you're doing on"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3993.198,"endTime":3997.87,"body":"making privacy tools actually usable and"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":3997.91,"endTime":4000.416,"body":"useful and decentralized."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4000.528,"endTime":4004.224,"body":"I think it's a, it's a fantastic effort and I"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4000.528,"endTime":4004.224,"body":"know Simplex is one of my favorite tools out"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4004.232,"endTime":4007.184,"body":"there, so I'm always glad to be able to talk a"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4004.232,"endTime":4007.184,"body":"little bit more about that too."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4007.272,"endTime":4009.2,"body":"So thank you so much for jumping on again."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4009.32,"endTime":4010.304,"body":"Great to meet you, Dan."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4010.352,"endTime":4012.16,"body":"Thank you so much for your contributions"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4010.352,"endTime":4012.16,"body":"today."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4012.28,"endTime":4015.712,"body":"Definitely have to have you back on in the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4012.28,"endTime":4015.712,"body":"future and definitely have you back on as well"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4015.736,"endTime":4018.384,"body":"of getting in the future as y'all keep"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4015.736,"endTime":4018.384,"body":"building Simplex like crazy."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4018.432,"endTime":4019.696,"body":"So thankful for you guys."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4019.728,"endTime":4021.18,"body":"Hope you have a great rest of your day."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":4021.48,"endTime":4022.0,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Evgeny","startTime":4022.04,"endTime":4024.22,"body":"Thank you so much, Seth for having us."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4033.01,"endTime":4036.234,"body":"Thanks for listening and I"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4033.01,"endTime":4036.234,"body":"hope you enjoyed this episode of Opt Out."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4036.322,"endTime":4039.082,"body":"If you did, please take a moment and subscribe"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4036.322,"endTime":4039.082,"body":"to the podcast."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4039.146,"endTime":4043.402,"body":"Or if you're already subscribed, share it with"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4039.146,"endTime":4043.402,"body":"one friend or family member this week."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4043.586,"endTime":4047.93,"body":"As always, you can check out the link to the"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4043.586,"endTime":4047.93,"body":"guest content and contact info, as well as"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4047.97,"endTime":4050.522,"body":"links to all of the tools we discussed in"},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4047.97,"endTime":4050.522,"body":"today's episode."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4050.666,"endTime":4052.01,"body":"Now get out there and opt out."},{"speaker":"Seth For Privacy","startTime":4052.05,"endTime":4052.202,"body":"This."}]}