The Life Challenges Podcast
Modern-day issues from a Biblical perspective.
The Life Challenges Podcast
Revisiting: Exploring the Spirit of Christmas
Enjoy this previously published episode. We will be back with a fresh new episode next week.
In this episode, Bob, Christa, and Jeff trace how the “spirit of Christmas” drifted from the incarnation to vague goodwill and why anchoring the season in Christ brings joy that endures grief, illness, and change. We share practical ways to teach the story, shape honest traditions, and keep Scripture central at home.
• Cultural sentiment versus the biblical message
• Why the incarnation offends and frees
• Angels’ announcement as the core of joy
• Traditions that teach across seasons and cultures
• Santa, honesty, and building trust with kids
• Advent habits that keep Christ central
• Grief, illness, and celebrating with real hope
• How secular frames distort life and family choices
• Recalibrating foundations beneath the festivities
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The ministry of Christian Life Resources promotes the sanctity of life and reaches hearts with the Gospel. We invite you to learn more about the work we're doing: https://christianliferesources.com/
On today's episode.
SPEAKER_00:It is possible to celebrate Christmas with having lost a loved one. It is possible to celebrate Christmas if you've never had children. It is possible to celebrate Christmas if you're dealing with a cancer diagnosis. It's possible to celebrate Christmas if you're dealing with a loss, with a heartache, with disappointment. Why? Because it never was about those things of this world.
SPEAKER_02:Welcome to the Life Challenges Podcast from Christian Life Resources. People today face many opportunities and struggles when it comes to issues of life and death, marriage and family, health and science. We're here to bring a fresh biblical perspective to these issues and more. Join us now for Life Challenges.
SPEAKER_01:Hi, and welcome back. I'm Christa Potratz, and I'm here today with Pastors Bob Fleischman and Jeff Samelson. And today we are going to do a special episode with this timing of the year. We are going to talk about the spirit of Christmas. I did a quick Google search on the spirit of Christmas and a board book came up. And the I feel like the description for the board book actually probably k does formulate what the secular theme of the spirit of Christmas is. The description of the board book said, bells jingle, sleds dash through the snow, trees are topped with sparkling stars, and children everywhere dream of candy canes and presents. But the best gift of all, the most magical gift of the season, is when we spend Christmas with those we love. And I feel like that is probably what many people think of when they hear this idea of the spirit of Christmas. So, Jeff, when we hear this idea of the spirit of Christmas, where did this come from?
SPEAKER_03:I haven't seen any or on when the term fa first came into use, but I I as I think about it, I I think I'd assign the blame for it in two different kinds of situations. One would be actually within the church, that there would be preachers who uh maybe it's outright unbelief, maybe it's ignorance, maybe it's timidness, were unwilling to preach the full truth about Christmas. That they they found the incarnation of Jesus, the Son of God, in human flesh as something that too too far or too offensive or something, didn't want to talk about sin and grace because that you know that just didn't seem right for the occasion or whatever, didn't want to offend the visitors. And so they they ended up substituting pious platitudes about, oh, but isn't it wonderful that you know we've this message of of peace and goodwill and the brotherhood of man and and all these kinds of things, and it was fairly easy sermon to preach, nobody's gonna complain about it, and uh it's comfortable, and it just would perpetuate in in that way. And I'd say the other uh place to pin the blame would be on actually unbelieving writers, uh producers, advertisers, composers, etc., who really wanted to take advantage of the Christmas season, the occasion, but who either were unwilling to take advantage of the uh or make use of the true message of Christmas, or they just didn't know what the true message was, and they proceeded anyway. We mentioned the terms of spirits of Christmas, Charles Dickens. You think back to a Christmas carol, that's a quintessential Christmas story. Where is Christ in it? Just not there, and from what we know of Dickens' life, you know, there's there's not much evidence that he thought of that he behaved in any way as as a Christian. Beautiful, beautiful Christmas song, O Holy Night. If you take a close look at that, you'll see that there are lots of really wonderful words in it, but there's not really much theology. And uh I remember hearing somebody tell me that the the guy who wrote it basically wrote it to uh pay off a debt.
SPEAKER_00:You know, he and he was an unbeliever.
SPEAKER_03:And there are all sorts of examples of that. I'm themeing of a white Christmas written by a secular Jew, Irving Berlin. It's yeah, we I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. I'm not saying that we shouldn't like these songs and and stories and things like that, but they don't have the true message of Christmas in them, and so it's a s they substitute this idea that, well, what Christmas is really all about is peace and love and goodwill and being nice to each other and family and warmth, and it's a comfortable, uh happy kind of thing, and who's gonna object to it?
SPEAKER_01:Just with Christians as well, is this idea that okay, God is love, and so when we're talking about loving the family or loving other people, there's this well, yeah, it's it's because God loved us. Um, but it it doesn't really go that deep for for many people.
SPEAKER_00:One of the things I always wrestled with in parish ministry was children's devotion. We did it where we had the children's devotion just before the pre-sermon hymn. So I would I would get down there with the kids and and I would I would do all sorts of kind of playful things and and they were engaged. I mean we would talk about all sorts of fun things, things they can identify with. And then the moment you get to the meat of it, they would glass over. And that's kind of when we talk about the spirit of Christmas, I d that's kind of what I always view it as kind of like the sweet part of the children's devotion that never wants to quite get around to the meat of it because it's just you know, society just it isn't palatable for the rest of society. I I always think whenever I think of Christmas, I always think of what C. S. Lewis wrote when he said, if you find yourself longing for something that that's not of this world, it's because you weren't made for this world. Christmas Christmas is almost kind of like that where there is peace, where we do get along and everything, and of course you never truly appreciate that or realize that until you're in heaven. So this is sometimes the Christmas season, the spirit of Christmas, is as close as some people might get, really. And it's it's a sad reality. And I think it's I think it's a challenge for the church uh to connect it spiritually. Because you do get absorbed. Every year you're decorating the church, you're you're doing it you're working on the children's service and all those kinds of things, but it becomes disconnected sometimes with the message, and yet it's part of the tradition.
SPEAKER_01:Right. The word tradition too does really come into play here because I feel like a lot of the things that we do are steeped in tradition, and so we tend to do them, and then as a Christian too, you always do want the the focus to be on what Christmas is all about to us, which is the baby coming and God coming into the world. But you we we tend to just also hang on to a bunch of other things too. And so then for us as Christians, there is really there's this emphasis on Jesus, but then we're also latching on to other things. Uh I mean, what would you kind of say to somebody that really wants to focus on what the true spirit of Christmas is, but but still is in our our world, our culture.
SPEAKER_03:We can take a clue from from the angels in Bethlehem, really. What what did they say to to the uh uh the shepherds? Behold, I I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people tonight in the town of David. A Savior has been born to you. He is Christ the Lord. Well, if we're talking about joy, if we're talking about good feelings, right there we have everything that we need. A Savior from sin. That that's what came to us, was given to us at at Christmas. Someone who came miraculously, wonderfully, graciously, mercifully, to a world full of sinners, came to take away their sin and through his gift and through his gift of righteousness, to uh not just remove the sin, but but to give us the perfection that we need so that then we can live forever in heaven, which is the place of perfect joy and and and wonder and and and love. Wow, that's that's that's reason for joy. But it's also you know that he's come for me, for you, for us, and and this is joy for the entire world. This this is not gospel, that's just for these certain people, uh not just for the you know God's favorites, not just for the the people who do better things or have a better family background, you know, for the entire world. And can even just add joy to the fact that this is evidence, Christ's coming at Christmas, evidence that God remembered us. That the promises and prophecies that He had m made and given throughout the Old Testament, He came through on all of them. I mean, that's the kind of God we have, one that can be counted on for everything. I mean, if we keep these things in mind, then we remember, well, this this is what it's really all about. It doesn't mean you know we begrudge our unbelieving neighbors for enjoying the season, um, but it means that we've got just that much more and that much deeper, that much more profound a reason uh to be celebrating.
SPEAKER_01:So how do we as Christians then keep that focus when there are all of these external elements?
SPEAKER_00:When we had New Beginnings, uh our home for mothers in Denver, well, New Beginnings, wherever it's been for the last 30 years, has always been a challenge in that oftentimes the mothers who come to New Beginnings, their idea of Jesus is kind of more this kind of a symbol of sacrifice and kindness and goodness. And so Christmas really comes into it, and I intentionally asked the staff to help use Christmas and Easter to establish some strong traditions because sometimes the traditions have a way of of healing family wounds. Somebody's kind of on the outs with the family, but if we always come together for Thanksgiving or Christmas, then it'll bring it back. So I said that's important. But we have trouble kind of getting them calibrated, just the way Jeff was explaining it. How do you get them focused on what the biblical story is at Christmas? One of the last years that we were in Denver, Heidi Westland was our home manager, and we had Heidi on on the podcast once. She did this great uh great thing. She set up her phone and she recorded this whole experience. All these gifts were sent to Denver so that these mothers can open up gifts on Christmas. And before the they did that, she's sitting cross-legged on the floor and she says, The first thing we're going to do is read the Luke account. And they were all attentive. It was I mean, it was incredible. And I still remember the one mother, Heidi gets to the end of it, and the one mother goes, I have never heard that. And and it's incredible, you know, because we we take it for granted. And and that's the the point I want to make, is that we take for granted that people know the Christ of Christmas, but they don't. They they they they know that that's the word, but they don't they don't know it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. You would have to be very far removed to just not be able to see a picture of baby Jesus in the manger and think of some sort of like Christmas ties to it. Really, anybody can see that and kind of know that, okay, that's the Christian Christmas story or something. But yeah, like how you said, Bob, I mean, I think so many of us as Christians have heard that Luke account over and over, maybe a couple times each year, and just don't realize that so many other people don't know that that story. How how do we stay focused and maybe m keep that Luke account fresh in our minds every year?
SPEAKER_03:I'd say we've mentioned tradition already. There can be good positive traditions in this sense. Unfortunately, you know, a lot of churches, for you know, in many cases completely legitimate reasons, have gotten away from the traditional children's Christmas program. But that was a really wonderful tool for teaching children, and of course their parents also who helped them with memorization, key verses from Scripture, straight from Scripture, that told the Christmas story. Things that would get imprinted in their brains. It's a wonderful thing. Uh, in the absence of that, well, okay, what what stories are you reading to your kids at night or elsewhere in the day? Well, don't make it just stories about Santa Claus and reindeer. Read on read the Christmas story to them. I mean, there are all sorts of different options there. Things like uh Advent calendars. It's not just about a new piece of candy coming out every week. Use this as an opportunity to teach what this is all about. Uh there are extra opportunities to worship throughout Advent and Christmas. Make those a priority. That these are things that, okay, this is what's important for us as a family because this is an important message. That's something that we want to remember.
SPEAKER_01:I guess uh just a question kind of going off of that too. Is it okay to do both or kind of all of it? To have baby Jesus and Santa, or just being able to just do all of it. What would you say to somebody starting a family, wanting to hone in on some traditions for for their family?
SPEAKER_03:I'm speaking for myself here. Um I I don't want anyone to come back and say, well, well, Christian Life Resources says this. No, no, this is this is me speaking for myself. Um I was never comfortable with the idea of teaching children something that later on they would learn was was was not the truth. I I didn't want to be complicit in that. Because you know, I was afraid, well, what what else then are they going to say? Oh, well, if they they didn't tell me the truth about that, then well, what else have they been? I I just didn't want to be a part of that. But I figured that the message of uh of Santa Claus and everything was something that whether I taught it or not, they were going to learn. But if I wasn't the one actually doing it, then fine. And so that meant that I didn't have to have a war on Santa or anything like that. We didn't have to explicitly say he can't be present in our home or anything like that. So what the kids picked up from the culture, from their friends or whatever, yeah, that was that was fine. But it wasn't something they were hearing from us. It worked well for our family, I would say. I don't know, maybe you should ask my grown children what they think about it or whatever. But I thought it worked pretty well. And it it helped make sure that the kids knew, okay, this is the real Christmas message.
SPEAKER_01:It's interesting. I I think too, just the way that I was raised. And I I mean I just kind of asked too, just because I know that there are different ways of doing it and different families are gonna do different things too. My husband grew up in a home where they didn't do Santa and for a lot of the reasons that you mentioned, Jeff. I grew up in a home of a Wells pastor who had me probably believing in Santa until I was in in middle school at least. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, very, very elaborate things went out in my house to to have me keep believing. But I mean, at the same time, there was also just this emphasis on the the birth of Jesus too. And so there was both, but I feel like in our family too, there was the separation of this is, and as we got older too, then you kind of realize, okay, this was the stuff that quote unquote, you know, gives it that uh, I don't want to say like magical feel at Christmas, but that there was that kind of part of it. But then as you got older, then you realized, okay, this is the stuff that really sticks. And this is the stuff that is gonna make Christmas special every year going on. And I think too, you know, a lot of times people think, oh yeah, Christmas is is all for the kids, or it's just more special for kids. And as I've gotten older and I really appreciate like my Advent devotions too, I realize, well, Christmas is really for me too. And how just that emphasis on on what it really means, and that it isn't just a holiday for kids, and that it really it isn't just about these magical things, but it's about the the Savior coming for for each one of us.
SPEAKER_00:Well, and I've never encountered anyone that I have felt uh was psychologically or even spiritually damaged from any kind of childlike conviction about Santa Claus. I I tend to be more like Jeff, you know, in other words, it presented a logical problem for me that, yeah, you can trust me, you can trust me. Oh yeah, I remember when I told you about that, well that I wasn't telling you the truth. So I probably sighed that way a little bit. But really, when I think about it, I you know, I've never really it isn't like I've been in hours of counseling with members who really thought there was Santa Claus. You know, they they they kind of caught it kind of what you were saying, Chris. So you kind of you catch on after a while and so forth. What what it comes down to is kind of like what it comes down to everything that we deal with here at CLR, New Beginnings and so forth, and that is I think a lot of this has to be bookended by the context that Christ has in your home. If Christ is only a weekend visitor when you're in church or just a passing word that you might say during the the table prayer, then I think it presents a different problem. And the problem wasn't that you you allowed somebody to believe in Santa Claus, the problem was that you never had them focused right in the first place. And that's I'm really wrestling right now just personally with how as an individual, how as a a family, how is a church body, you get everybody recalibrated that Christ is central to your life. One of the things I I'm real big on is consistency, you know, that in other words we've got strong traditions in the United States, family gatherings being one of them. Very big deal for the Fleischmans. We've got 'em, you know, everything's scheduled. It's if the airlines could be as disciplined as we were, life would be so much better. But it's very important, it's very important to be here and so forth. But I I do wrestle with, you know, in another culture, in another place, what it would be like. What's what's Christmas like when your parents are gone? What it's Christmas like if you've never were married and had no children. We need to establish a Christmas tradition that that is enduring through various cultures and and various people. And and Santa Claus doesn't do it. My favorite stories I always like to tell at Christmas time is what do you do? About the ungrateful grandchild, the one who never writes you a thank you note, the one who who never says thank you, the one who who says, Oh, you gave me clothes, that kind of thing. What do you do about that? So all of a sudden you stop giving. Well, you have now bought into secular Christmas. I mean, it's um but when you have a spiritual Christmas, you recognize that Christ gave despite the fact that we tell him we're not going to sin and then we sin.
SPEAKER_03:One of the blessings of my my life is I've I've spent a total of four Christmases when I was much younger outside the country, places where uh the weather was very different and the culture was very different. And it was really helpful in in you know precisely what you're talking about, the separating what is the essence of Christmas, the the message what what we want to have is the you know our our our personal Christian traditions here and such from all the other trappings that are more cultural. I I spent two Christmases in in Singapore. I mean, the whole idea of of snow, although it was funny because for many Singaporeans, their idea of Christmas, which was completely imported, included snow as like the perfect element for Christmas, which was a very sad statement about a whole bunch of things, but it just helps focus you when you realize, well, okay, what are we celebrating here? Okay, we're we're celebrating the birth of Christ. That's that's the essential thing here. And uh it's not everybody can have that experience, but you can imagine that experience. What would it be like for you if you were someplace completely different? How would you make sure that what you, what your family was, was observing was really what Christmas is all about.
SPEAKER_00:There's a great commercial on television right now. Um I think it's is it progressive insurance or something where where they show the boy and he and he gets a box and it has you know progressive insurance on it, and he's opening it up. He's all excited, this is what I got, and everything. And his brother, okay, you know, Tommy, what did what did you get? I got this dumb bike and he kicks the bike. I get such a uh a kick out of that because that's oftentimes what's become my my parents will tell the story about when I was a kid, a little kid, uh long, long time ago, that um uh I wanted an electric football game and they gave me a bike and I was crushed. I wanted so I think of that every time I see that crazy commercial, but but it it shows how where the recalibration is needed. I I just want to say something else about the traditions. I think there's a lot of biblical roots to it. I mean uh uh the the way the Old Testament practices of the sacrifice and so forth, their traditions. When I was um I was in Los Angeles and I went to uh the restaurant that uh Stephen Spielberg's mother ran, and she was Jewish, and they had all the Jewish the Hanukkahs and um menor candles, all that kind of stuff uh was going on. And and uh she sat down and I I remember questioning her about all these practices and what they mean, and and you could see her eyes light up as she would recall the strong traditions and she would talk about what her family would do and so forth. I think there's great value in traditions, and I think we need to create more of them, you know, around the country, you know, around the year, I mean, to have more traditions. But we we still need to kind of get back to what it's all about because what what do you do what what's Christmas going to be like this year in Ukraine? Uh but the traditions, it kind of forces you to get back to what it's all about.
SPEAKER_01:For me this year, too, just having recently lost my father, I was talking to a a friend of mine and just talking about like how this Christmas will be different and how it'll be seemingly hard. And yeah, my dad, he really he loved Christmas and so got a lot of I always say a lot of fingerprints all over my Christmas memories. So he just filled them up. But I was saying to her, I said, you know, really I'm just trying to focus on what Christmas is all about this year, and which I should do every year. I I do, but but I have gotten for the first time a devotion that I'm reading every single day during Advent. And I feel that that is really does really help me too, like to to be in God's word specifically with with verses that are focused on Christmas and and Jesus coming. And kind of like, you know, you were saying, Bob, too. I mean, yeah, when when things are different, when traditions and maybe seemingly make you sad and you just kind of can't do them, what do you do? And so just really kind of focusing on on God's word and that that true meaning of Christmas. Um, something too.
SPEAKER_00:In the case of your dad, your dad also is the one who taught you the true meaning of Christmas. So when you see his fingerprints all over your Christmas traditions, that has to be there too. You know, and you know, that's kind of you know what I've always tried to emphasize is that that the tradition becomes bad when it becomes detached. And when you when you have the tradition attached for what is right to what is right, if we could take our Christmas traditions and tie them to a focus you know that is Christ-centric.
SPEAKER_01:So uh with the this idea of the spirit of Christmas, what are implications then for life and family issues?
SPEAKER_00:Well, I g again I think the implication is that when you create this context that the things of God are of most most value. Think back, and you the reason you're celebrating Christmas in the first place is it's the traditional celebration of God's greatest gift of all time. Okay, and so God brings you that gift through the sacrament, through baptism. He brings you the gift through the gift of life. When you venerate the things of God ahead of all other concerns, you find that you you're venerating God, you're venerating others, and it becomes a cherishing of life, of God's gift of life, and of the things of God, God's gift of family. It is possible. It is possible to celebrate Christmas with having lost a loved one. It is possible to celebrate Christmas if you've never had children. It is possible to celebrate Christmas if you're dealing with a cancer diagnosis. It's possible to celebrate Christmas if you're dealing with a loss, with a heartache, with disappointment. Why? Because it never was about those things of this world. Because of the gift of Christmas, uh life life even in death continues forever. You know, sometimes, you know, going through a heartache or hardship uh over this time of year might be an incredible opportunity to find out that it always was about Christ in the first place. And that sometimes we just drift and now we get brought back.
SPEAKER_03:If we're looking at the spirit of Christmas in that secular sense, that is devoid of the true Christian message of Christmas, what you end up with is is is good feelings without any truth or really any principles or or any deeper meaning behind them. And that's that's precisely the kind of thing that results in wrong thoughts about life and family issues, that that people are just like, okay, well, what really matters is feeling good. You know, who cares about what's beneath it? Um, you know, this is all that matters. And I'm not trying to draw a straight line between, you know, bad celebrations of Christmas and you know all the things that are wrong in our society, but they are of a piece, they are related. It's it's this same idea that we elevate the good feelings, we don't talk about anything that's going to disturb those, and uh we do whatever we can to continue the good feelings. And we we don't worry so much about listening to God's authority or you know, the truth behind this or that or anything like that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you know, in a sense, Christmas could someone could argue that it represents everything that we're against. I mean, the idea is this this incredible focus on you know making life in this world the best it could possibly be. You know, it's the highest commerce time of the year. People, I mean, we're about as materialistic as you can possibly get, you know, this time of year. It's kind of like when when people when I hear people come after me and you know they're anti-Santa Claus, anti-Christmas, you're vener, you're creating idols, all that kind of stuff. There is a problem with getting two pendulums swinging the other way. And that is the mistake, that's kind of like, you know, the problem with the with a rich man is not that he's rich, it's how he uses his riches and and how he feels about his riches. If it's, you know, I got them and not that they're blessings from God. The problem at Christmas is not the Santa Claus and the Christmas tree and the lights and the presents and everything. It's what under what what's the foundation under which all of that resides? And if we fail in that foundation, we're gonna fail in other areas. Like Jeff pointed out, you know, the then all of a sudden when life lacks the happiness and lacks this splendor and lacks the pleasure that we really you know have a pinnacle of at Christmas time, um, then all of a sudden maybe life isn't worth living. You know, and of course you're gonna have trouble defending that with scripture, which is why, you know, society really, you know, the devil of the world in your flesh is constantly working at you to squeeze out the Christ of Christmas, to squeeze out spirituality. And um if you're gonna talk about the spirit of Christmas, um make sure it's it's rooted in something that's truthful, which is scripture.
SPEAKER_01:Well, thank you both for this discussion today on the spirit of Christmas, and uh we uh thank all of our listeners too for joining us today, and uh hope that you are having a wonderful holiday season filled with the true meaning of Christmas. Thanks. Bye.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you for joining us for this episode of the Life Challenges Podcast from Christian Life Resources. Please consider subscribing to this podcast, giving us a review wherever you access it, and sharing it with friends. We're sure you have questions on today's topic or other life issues. Our goal is to help you through these tough topics, and we want you to know we're here to help. You can submit your questions as well as comments or suggestions for future episodes at lifechallenges.us or email us at podcast at Christian Life Resources.com. In addition to the podcasts, we include other valuable information at lifechallenges.us, so be sure to check it out. For more about our parent organization, please visit Christian Life Resources.com. May God give you wisdom, love, strength, and peace in Christ for every life challenge.
