Jack Horner: The Rise of the Underground

Dive into part two of our casual conversation with Jack Horner from The Dirt, where we discuss the underground music world up against the mainstream, as well notable bands in the scene, film scores, and the effect word of mouth has on art.

Transcript

Welcome Back To The Fishbowl

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hey there all my fishes in the sea. Thanks for tuning into the fishbowl. I'm your host Sam Fish and today's episode wraps up my conclusion interview with Jack Horner from UK's critically famed psychedelic rock band that are checked out.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

The psychedelia that came out of California is totally different to the mega noise that came out of New York from the early 70s and it or the mid-70s.

Pop Music And Industry Control

SPEAKER_00 4:40

Right, and the same same thing with rap. Like East Coast 90s, 80s and 90s East Coast rap versus 80s and 90s West Coast rap is like totally different. But at the same time, like all the the rap groups and the rap artists, you know, solo guys from the East Coast and the West Coast all kind of had like if you were from the West Coast and you were from the East Coast, you all kind of had like a very similar style with like how you rhymed and and the the the type of you know music you would have essentially going to you know overlapping you rapping. Um it's it's very it's like you can tell the people who are from the east coast, and you can tell the people who are from the west coast. Like the West Coast had a lot of like you could hear like P funk and you know George Clinton, James Brown, you know, like Motown, all all like, you know, the RB and funk, you know, that was big in the the 60s and 70s, and the the East Coast was much more like raw, you know, it was it was more yeah, I don't want it I don't want to say edgy because they were both both were edgy, but it was it was like you there was a distinct sound, and now like I mean rap and and and mainstream rap, let me let me rephrase mainstream rap, just like mainstream rock, just like mainstream country, just like mainstream music in general, is is like not sure if you ever seen that movie, uh, and I I I brought this up in several interviews I've done with musicians to kind of give the idea, but it came out in the early 2000s, uh Josie and the Pussycast. Okay, the basically the the plot it's it's based on a old like 70s cartoon show. And I I'm not sure if it was shown in in the UK or Europe, but it was a uh American, definitely an American like 70s cartoon, and they made it into a live action movie, and the plot of this movie is like you have like the the boy bands, like you know, in sync and backstreet boys, who they were like really doing a play on at the time because they were like the big the big boy bands when it came out. And the idea of this film is that like the record companies whenever like a musician die a musicians die in a plane crash or you know, overdose or you know all mysteriously dying at uh 27, you know, it's it's all kind of been orchestrated by the record companies because they didn't want to comply. So basically there's like and then you have like you know, I think what's his name, Alan. Is it Alan Cumming? I'm gonna I think is was the actor's name. He he plays this this like you know age music agent and basically the the the boy band of the time that they're like currently headlighting, you know, dies in a plane crash. So they they need to find like a new a new like you know pop group that they can you know market to the youth. And they have this whole scene where like they're going through like the the scam of like the the industry where you know it's subliminal messaging. And you know, they they they play the the pop music or whatever and there's you know they overlap it with subliminal messaging and they show like this whole scene and he's giving you know exposition basically, you know, in in the sequence that this is what they do and this is like their the the you know antagonists of the film, and they they show like how there's this group of like essentially zombies, you know, teen teenage zombies that are like listening to this music and you know just like you know you know and then there's like one person who's like supposed to be like a goth girl, you know, and she says, I understand why this is so catchy, you know, and and and you know, Alan Cumming or whatever his name is, he played the agent, is like, Oh really? You d you don't you don't think this is like catchy or anything? She says, No, in fact, I think it sucks. You know, and he says, Oh, really? That's interesting. Will you come with me real quick? I'd love to, you know, get your your full assessment, blah blah blah. She follows him outside, a a black van, you know, pulls up, slides open the door, takes the girl in, puts a black bag over her head, and then she's like, never, you know, never seen again. Right. You know. And the the the whole I the the point is like movies from like the nineties and even you know early two thousands, it's like they they almost were like doing subcontext on like what is actually going on, yeah. You know, with in society. And if you watch Josie and the Pussycats, and you see it's like this is a a goofy, you know, teen, you know, young adult, uh, you know, comedy movie, but then you like look at the subtext and the the plot, and then you look at like you know, people like Taylor Swift and you know, you know, what Beyonce has turned into and before she be when Beyonce was Destiny's child, you know, that's a whole nother thing. But once Beyonce became, you know, Queen B or whatever, you know, it's a whole it's it's like you know, and now she she just she did like some country song, right? You know, and everybody's like Beyonce, country, you know, oh my god, you know, who knew she was so versatile, you know, and but at the same time it's like all those major musicians, it's like it it's it's very clear to me, especially, and I gotta be careful with this, you know, because the Swifties will come after me.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

You get Swifties, what you get fifty Swifties on your podcast and show. That's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

You know, the Swifties will come after you. I've been warned, I've been warned. John Paul warned me. He's he's not what you say, they'll come after you. And I and I know this because I there was some I forget the exact uh incident, but basically there was like some some I think it was a football player or something to do with football, you know, because Taylor Swift's uh boyfriend is a football player here in the States, and someone apparently said something negative about Taylor Swift and the f her the guy she's dating with for I I don't I don't follow sports that much. Yeah, so I apologize for the my American listeners who are like, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about with with football, you know. But any anyways, it was like they they act apparently a bunch of Swifties were were going out of their way to leave bad reviews on this this football player's like I think it was his mom or something's like restaurant or some type of small business, and they were literally like just going out of their way to like leave bad reviews to like you know in turn like not attract business.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

You know, that's some feral feral obsessive fan base, but innit?

SPEAKER_00 12:43

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah, you know, I mean that that's insanity, like you know, I mean I'm I'm wondering on my end, is there not like some legal, you know, like violation or something by uh by doing what they did. I mean, I I don't know. I didn't go to I'm not a lawyer, I didn't go to law school, but you know, just like the the craziness of of like that's on my that's like psych that that's like uh psycho fan base stuff.

SPEAKER_01 13:14

Yeah, yeah, it's it's a it's a radical pack mentality, isn't it? That's crackers, yeah. But people will go to that lengths to defend in honor their favourite artist, which I kind of like. I don't know whether I admire that or I think that's a little bit obsessed. That's a little bit nuts, yeah. That's a little bit far, isn't it? It's like exactly, you know. I'm gonna research this. I'm gonna have to research this because the only thing I've seen about Taylor Swift is that the American and Canadian music people that have defended her and Bruce Springsteen from something which came up on my thing, there was a statement because they've been attacked by Mr. Trump or something, but it's like, but to know you've got such a like a flock of Swifties, a flock of mad this is mental. You could write a story or a big sort of like mad mic manga or some mad comic sign about this, couldn't you? Right, right. Yeah, it's very much sin city.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

I mean it brings uh it brings like uh the the Stephen King uh novel and and movie that that came out and uh I guess it was the 80s or early night, like misery. Yeah, the the the idea of like the the obsessive fan.

SPEAKER_01 14:25

Oh the obsessive fan, yeah. You know, that was a creepy film, misery, wasn't it? Whoa.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:32

Kathy Bates literally killed it in that in that yeah, that was an amazing performance.

SPEAKER_00 14:38

That that was mega yeah, and I actually I actually just found this out recently. Apparently, Stephen King was like blown away with Kathy Bates' performance so much with misery that he specifically wrote Dolores Claiborne for her to play.

SPEAKER_03 14:56

Wow.

Movies We Miss And Cult Finds

SPEAKER_00 14:57

In in a film version, the the film version, you know, because he was so like blown away and impressed with her performance and misery. And you know, rest in peace, James Kahn, you know, what a awesome actor he was. Um I mean, I just watched this morning, it was he was on one of the movie channels, one of my all-time favorite 2000s crime, you know, thriller films, The Way of the Gun. A lot of stars in that. Vinicio Del Toro, Ryan Philippi, James Conn, Juliet Lewis, speaking of Dust Hold On. Yeah, you know, her father late father, Jeffrey Lewis, was in it. Really it's a it's done like I want to say the film that they probably took the most inspiration from was Bush Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. Yeah. It has a very like even the music is like a very like Western, like like a modern day, like Western crime, you know, thriller. Great, great movie. They you know, they they do not pick make crime movies like this anymore. And even when this came out, I could tell it was like a dying, you know, dying breed, dying style. It's a even the the the showdown is even, they mean even at it, it's like a the showdown, just like in Bush Casting, the Sundance Kid, you know, it's like in in you know, the showdown is in like like you know, what is it, a Mexican, like, you know, you know, whorehouse or something. Like it's the same thing in the way of the gun. Oh, that'll be like there's there's the whole this this awesome, awesome showdown at at this this Mexican whorehouse. And it the the the look of it is like so like this is clearly like a a modern day western, you know, it's it's it's a fantastic film and probably my number one favorite Ryan Philippi role, and I think probably one of his most underrated roles from Benicio Del Toro. And there's there's a lot of other stars in it, but great film. I just was like uh they don't they don't play it that often on TV anymore. So like when they when they run it on like a movie channel where it goes to streaming, I'm like, I'm like, this is a blast. This is a blast from the past. This is like this is like high school, you know, for for me. And I'm like, I remember, you know, watching it on Showtime and being like, this, this is a great fucking movie. You know, and and I I also like it's it's kind of hard to find on like like physical media. I I'm not sure if they converted it to Blu-ray or if it's if it's just on D V D.

SPEAKER_01 17:48

Sometimes that's good when films are hard to find, innit? Yes, it gives you that gives that good cult cult backing.

SPEAKER_00 17:54

Exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 17:55

It doesn't become so it's not as disposable, it doesn't come that accessible. So when when things are like that, I think they they get that sort of like little good following that people get behind you and go, Oh, you can't get it on this, you can't get it on that. It's like music, isn't it? It's like oh that hip hop, that hip-hop album that was only out on a C60 tape, or something like that that you could listen to and say, like, oh that you can't get that now, you can only get that on certain grand vinyl, and literally it's out of stock, or people search for it because it's never been put onto Spotify, never been transferred to CD. So yeah, you've got to go look. And when you give when you find it or you find something that you want that's like that, it it it means such a load more. Film scores as well that become iconic, don't they? Exactly. Um and and when the two go together, it it works a treat, and and if it works right, it it becomes so memorable, don't it?

SPEAKER_00 18:43

And so sometimes the the score can outdo the film. I think it can, can't it?

SPEAKER_01 18:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

I mean, I mean, I mean Blade Runner again, the the score, and I and I talked about this with uh John Paul. He was he was talking about how from a musician's perspective, he's he's tried himself and with his band to try and like figure out some of the notes that that they that uh I forget the the the band that uh that did the score, the original Blade Runner, is it Vidja? I'll I'll I'll have to look it up, but um the the it was an actual band that it was in the 80s that there's a couple bands that did scores to movies, like Tangerine Dream did a a couple scores, and I just I can't it starts with a V, I'm pretty sure. Evangelist or something.

SPEAKER_04 19:33

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 19:33

I can't remember, but he was basically saying that from a musician's like perspective, trying to figure out how they hit some of the notes, like in in in Blade Runner for the scores, like he would he would say to me, It's like oh yeah, yeah, I see how they I finally figured it out. Okay you know, and in the point being that you know the the score for that film was not just like putting some notes together and making a a score, it was actually just like the the film, the score was an artistic masterpiece. The Shining with Jack Nicholson. That film is probably my example of how the score actually outdoes the actual film. Because honestly, I don't think the movie would be as scary as you know it is without the the intensity of the score whoever did it for Kubrick. And and I say that actually about all of Kubrick's films, especially Clockwork Orange and Full Metal Jacket, which you know I was apparently the only one to know this in in film school. My my my teacher who you know has has a lot of credits to his name was asking us some trivia one time about you know full metal jacket, and he was like, does anybody know where the the the final you know climax scene where they're they're you know in the ruins and dealing with the the sniper was shot. And I I said London. And he was like, How did you know that? And I said, Well well, I I I I've seen every Kubrick film that that he's done uh prior to his death, plus I watched the commentary on it and and I don't know, here's some more trivia for you. The helicopter that, you know, was used Info Metal Jack is actually Kubrick's helicopter. And they just painted it green, uh you know, to use for the film. 'Cause if you look at what the helicopter is, it's n no Vietnam, you know, American military force uses that kind of helicopter, you know, especially in during the Vietnam War. So my my teacher was like, huh, I didn't know that. Oh well, there we go. Yeah. But yeah, I mean I I I could I'm like literally a movie and music encyclopedia. So and it's great when the two then come together then in it. Yes. Yes. And that that's where like I always love talking about movies and music, especially with actors and musicians, because you know getting what what their taste is, you know, how they view like music and film and how you know the two definitely coincide together. And not just with scores, but I've actually gotten a lot of artists just from hearing you know their music in in film. Two of the the big ones that have become to you know two of my all-time favorite bands really of not just from the 90s but really of all time is on the subject of psych and shoe gays and all that the dandy warholes and the Brian Jonestown massacre.

Where New Rock Movements Live

SPEAKER_01 23:04

Yeah some good sounds there in it we were only listening to Dandy's the other day but we saw him in UK a couple of months ago they were playing with the black angels who I really like yes they're another great band. Yeah that that that was a good sort of like um double header when we when we saw them on on tour. So yeah some there's some good music going around isn't there and uh it's it's really good to embrace it and see what's happening.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

Definitely I mean the the it's it's crazy because like the the general areas that I I see like the major musical movements kind of like going on is the whole Ireland Glasgow Scotland yeah the K area but also like in the EU with like France Germany Sweden you know there there's a lot of I just want to give a shout out spiders and blues pills you know the the those girls and their their bands are phenomenal they they remind me of like you know David Bowie and you know T Rex and and and like you know like that that era and style of like lamb rock you know and then the UK and and Scotland area and and some of France is like you know really I can see a lot of a lot of the the huge like you know shoe gaze and dream pop and like neo psychedella you know type type movement and same can kind of go for Australia and New Zealand. They have a huge psych rock scene and also alternative rock scene and then at the same time I see like really three like different rock movements going on right now. One is like the the the shoe gays and you know psychedilla you know movement. The other is like I don't know how what the right word is like retro kind of 60s 70s revival kind of happening in the same areas and then the other movement and some of it is going on in in the US with this as well but it's it's actually become so prominent that it showed up in my Spotify as like an actual genre that's that new genre that's been created called new wave grunge and it's like at the end of grunge we had post grunge yeah which is like nickelback and creed and yeah yeah it's not it's like it's like grunge lost its way after that didn't it was like yeah yeah most the demise of nirvana and um guard and I've been changed it's kind of lost yeah it kind of lost its way then yeah this the pumpkins it all all all lost its way and just very much like what I always compared the the the 90s to the 60s you know because all the the heroes you know were were either dead by you know well what like 70s 71 or the the last remaining ones were kind of gone by the 80s you know and the same thing happened in the 90s with all the the musical you know renaissance like like heroes you know starting with cobain you know then lane staley then you know losing Cornell a couple years ago Chester as well right right you know that that the most recent one you know so it's like it's it's like literally you know you know like all the the major you know heroes from you know the the the whole grunge movement they either all died or you know slowly passed away over the years and like the the groups just kind of broke up it's like you know what what are the doors without Jim Morrison you know uh there is no doors without there is no doors exactly they tried they tried it and I do love Ian asbury and whatever going on but there's no cult there's no cult without an Ian I Ian asbury right however Ian asbury is not the front man of the doors is he so there is no doors without Jim Morrison it's exactly exactly and it's um an another another band shout out I want to I want to give on the subject of the doors because this band is like the closest I think we're ever going to get to the reincarnation of the doors they're called Birth of Joy.

SPEAKER_01 27:46

Okay.

Art Prices And The Underground

SPEAKER_00 27:46

I believe they're from France originally I'll have that I figured my list them yeah they they have they're they're kind of older now they they were like the 2010s but uh they have quite a few albums and some like I think one or two live albums and I mean they have this one song it's been a while since I listened to them but it it really reminded me of like I think Waiting for the Sun and some like other like like there's one song in particular I'll I'll I'll I'll look it up and I'll I'll I'll send you a link. Yeah please send me in because and they and they perform it live too and the live version you know again like we were talking about the beginning of the interview some bands you know are better studios some you can't contain the the the the energy and this band is like they're they're great studio they're even better live oh that's cool and I just remember the one song it's just I can't think of it because it's been a while since I listened to them and I listened to like so much so much music you know you you gotta go back and like dig you know but it it it just like it it completely in in in encompassed and incarnated the doors and and and this the singer also I'm not sure what his name is but I mean they have like an organist and you know like just everything that like the made up the doors like the the in the singer like you know it's like hearing Morrison reincarnated. Yeah it's like literally I mean it's like he sounds exactly like Morrison the whole sound of the band sounds like the doors so just want to on the subject of music and yeah let's give that a go then EU music and UK and all that I had had to bring that band up another one that I I really admire is called the wolf not hurt them they're also somewhere I forget exactly where they're from but definitely uh EU and they have a very like the whole uh like retro you know classic rock kind of revival sound they're really good too but the the closest that we have to someone like that in the States I just did an interview with his his name is Jossi Hughes and the band is called jossy it's it's spelled weird though it's like G Y S I or something he is basically the American version of blues pills and spiders and like you know the the glam rock and he even the whole show and how he dresses performing live and everything is very like Bowie in fact if I could sum him three bands that kind of like sum up his music it would be Bowie T-Rex mixed with like Jet Yeah and he just apparently did guitar helped out on guitar with Alice Cooper's like latest single for his upcoming album that's like the first album with like the original Alice Cooper lineup from like the the 60s and 70s so he's definitely like you know moving up in the uh the the the music rock you know rock legend you know scene you know but Alice Cooper is another another you know hit him and in and Sabbath yeah they keep going don't they longevity yeah yeah you know there's there's some film that's that I always found this funny because I'm like eh it's kind of true. I forget what movie it was but they they said something like British rockers don't die you know it's it's the right it's the American ones that that all die you know early the the the British ones just keep you know somehow are able to survive all the the drug and alcohol and uh just the the tick cold you know and I'm like the only exception to the case the only two exceptions to the case that I can think of is like John Bonham and Keith Moon you know you know but but if you look at like the rest of like all the the the old you know rockers from uh from that era I mean Jesus looking mc Jagger and and Keith Richards is like they're they're like the walking dead yeah give the young kids a go come on lads you've had your day give the young kids this there's loads of 18 20 30 year 20 odd year old kids out there waiting for the break I'm not even asking for my share because I'm posting anyway but give the kids a go give give one of the kids a go come on right right right yeah it's like uh I always just I was like that that is really funny because it's like just look at Ozzy you know yeah I I did have the pleasure of meeting his son Jack you know who was like on uh the Osborne's and the the show that was like on MTV and everything but was by the way he is a talk about like being humble and down to earth and totally unaffected by nepotism and his father's and you know parents' money you know he he came to like Pittsburgh's big uh like Comic Con convention and you know like most of it's it's kind of turned into over the last I want to say two years really that like the people that they book it's like you're if you want an autograph and a selfie not to mention like the for admission and everything you know to the event you're looking at like spending a hundred dollars of US money easy almost almost as like a a standard thing now to for like an autograph and a selfie combo or something. Some of it is like for some of these people it's it's just an autograph and a a photograph only if you're spending a hundred dollars which is insane.

SPEAKER_01 34:21

Things have got crazy these days aren't they it's like we I thought our art was supposed to be accessible to everybody exactly and this is where it should be shouldn't it like a film an art a picture it's music should be open and accessible to everybody whatever class you are but the the the the art to get in like everything and we talked about division the arts are getting divisive and it's it's becoming a survey the elite can the elite can afford whether it be a ticket for a big venue or who can't and it's it's not good when it gets like that because we should keep prices even for big stars as we want to call them they're right affordable because someone's making a lot of money somewhere and that should be passed down and percolated down to everybody shouldn't it?

SPEAKER_00 35:04

Exactly that that's that's that's what I say because you're you that's exactly what you said you're essentially saying this is for the elite and this is for the the the lower you know the middle class which is almost being you know evaporated from what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

I think that also gives the the underground a place to thrive doesn't it it can live if if if if the underground the people that are less affordable can can find an accessible art then it it means the underground and the subcultures can grow in their own little places and microcosms and and and survive and and exist alongside it in a totally different world.

SPEAKER_00 35:46

I completely agree with that and that's also kind of like my mission you know through talking to you and Sean Paul and just all all the the bands that I really not just like and love and dig you know the the music but it's like I kind of feel it's like my mission to help the underground you know because if my mark if I left this world and my mark was like through different celebrities and you know different like you know levels of celebrities that I interview you know and and I can say you know you need to check out this band or there's this band you know that I I know you know that that if you like this music you would really like you know this band. And if if it can be like like I guess if I could be you know the the main person responsible for like bringing you know bands like yourself and John Paul with Helicon and you know Stanley Belton with black market karma and you know all just all the bands that like are the underground into essentially the mainstream like I I feel like you know I mean I remember growing up in the 90s and you know when it was just a plethora of of different types of music. I mean it wasn't just grunge it wasn't just rap you know the there was all sorts of different you know kinds of music going on and it was all like you know it was like a beautiful time it was like you know the it was like we were more united as like culture and society and countries and people you know and it seems like since that ended you know it's good we've got facilitators don't we?

SPEAKER_01 37:45

We've got like you're like you said you're a facilitator you you you you're sharing and bringing different genres and different people together in different sides of this big ocean that we've got right and I and I think that's that's it's great because without we we're taking it back to the old school style of oh have you heard of these? Have you heard of them? Have you heard of those and and word of mouth is is is to me it's one of the best things to do. It's like um here's your suggestion not on Spotify but in person. And if someone suggest your band in person that means they've got some heart and emotion into it haven't they so right I I think there's there's an element of well well if he's listen to them and he says they're good I'm gonna have to give them a listen not just because an algorithm has said that but a person has said that so there's an element of like well there's got to be an element of truth in it. So exactly if there's an element of passion and honesty then there's an element of truth which means if this person who I know likes a lot of bands is saying have a listen then I'm gonna go have a listen. I always write stuff down that people are saying it right I'm gonna go have a look at that and I always will because you you've got to go find it because if someone's saying well you've named this band, this band this band that are good now you've mentioned them well I don't know them but I've known the other ones then if they're in that sort of stable and platform then it's got to be good.

SPEAKER_00 38:54

And that that's again where back to like Fuzz phase Jason Shaw um like Nesbid with uh little cloud records and you know I'm hoping some of our stuff will go to him because sister nine who were signed to the they work with little clouds a little bit I think so so that'll be good if it if it gets them they're based in Portland aren't they? Yeah yeah I I'm actually friends with here we go speak of the the fucking devil you know he shall appear uh I I'm I'm friends with Mike on on Facebook and on on X or you know Twitter whatever the hell it is you know I I I will I'll shoot him a message and say I just interviewed you know you guys and he should definitely check you out. Good you know the that's the very least I can do and hopefully the rest falls into yeah hopefully the music will be the battering ram that it'll still be that's what it's about at the end of the day in it right right and and you know if I can connect you to someone or you can connect me to someone through you know mutual talking and just getting to know me and being like well you like this and I I know these people you know like like for instance I just did a big interview with the president of Scheckter guitars and his name is Michael Saravolo and he's been in multiple bands the band that I was interviewing him in relation to the interview was called Beauty and Chaos. They've had like close to like I think 20 or 30 like different band members on in the course of like them actually making music and some of these artists consist of like Marilyn Manson Trent Reznor Tyler Bates Ice T Body County and you know during our interview he was apparently like totally unaware that there's all these like really like rock is not dead you know it's thriving and living thriving and living you just got just living in the underground it's there ready to resurrect and no exactly just gonna know where to look and I essentially told him not only is rock not dead not only is it alive and thriving but there's like three like major like rock movements going on right now which we just discussed and kicking and screaming. Exactly and I I told him that and I gave him a list of some bands to check out and he at the end of the interview like almost a I think it was actually over two hours which is where we're headed now.

Tours Bands To Watch Next

SPEAKER_01 41:40

We're headed now yeah and I'm gonna have to cut it I'm gonna have to cut it off soon because it's like quarter past five here yeah yeah I got you and I've got an appointment yeah okay I got it I'm believable. Okay in that case uh I'll sum it up and just say yeah you know he was like I I I I put belief back in him and he he's a major you know like veteran actual rock star like you know in the States you know musician so if I can do that just just by talking to someone like that and he said you know in turn he would put me in touch with anyone who he's friends with which opens doors to Marilyn Manson nine inch nails iced tea body count you know exactly but the the point is like if I can do that to spread the word and like you said word of mouth you know and have a movement essentially be like you know happen because of me I would leave this earth being happy not saying I want to have it happen anytime soon it's all happening though in it it's all happening just chatting over the phone with waves going over the the Atlantic it's happening already right it is man we've already got mutual friends in John Paul and little clouds everything's connected everything's symbiotic everything works together and as long as we're working together everything works don't it exactly exactly and on that note I have two closer questions for you oh I know you you were you were just in Japan doing some touring I wanted to see if you if you had any your could plug any upcoming projects slash tours to promote and then the final question what three bands slash guests would you recommend to come on the show? Ooh wow okay so yeah we've got like I think we've got about 30 gigs coming up in the UK starting with festivals this weekend at a strummerom records punk festival and then we go all the way through Southern UK tour, loads of psychedelic festivals then we release our album and then we take that on about 25 dates around the UK and we're going to do seven dates in Japan at the end of the year. Once that's concluded we're gonna take a break write a bit of new stuff and then we're gonna kick on into 2026. So we've got loads going on this year in the UK Three bands that I can give you, and I'm gonna have to give you three that you've not heard of, which I'm gonna have to delve in. I'm gonna have to give Delve into something that psychedelic band. We're bringing them over to play with us. They're coming over, but they're gonna do a gig with us, and we're playing with them in Osaka, and it's a band that's Japanese from Osaka called Hiboshibra, and they're on riot season records in the UK. Same label as African Mother Temple that we played with not quite recently. So Hiboshibra will be one, and that's a Japanese band. In the UK, I'm gonna give you a band that we just played with the other day called Cherry Full's Club, which is from Leeds, and they supported us in Manchester the other day. And they're a European band. I'm gonna try and get away from Full's Club and give you another band that you might not have heard of, which is French, and I'm gonna say Jesus French. I'm just trying to think of Full Club. Let's go within one UK, one Europe, one Japanese, which is where we might never have heard of. But I will throw you a rat at all the band from the UK that if you're liking that irish resurgence of all the phone with new words and psychic industrial sound in the UK. There is a lot of mega scene going on here at the moment. And and it's really good. You'll also like blood worm from Nottingham, which is a really good family friendly as well.

SPEAKER_00 45:36

Awesome, awesome. Already I'm like I gotta check those. Please, please, please show me a message on Facebook or email or something with a list of other ones uh that you whenever they come to mind or whatever.

SPEAKER_01 45:56

Yeah, there's all different how we made it in Manchester the battery farm. Very visceral, very industrial.

SPEAKER_00 46:03

Awesome, awesome. I I will I cannot wait to check out all those ones and whoever else you would recommend and all that. Um very excited. It was a pleasure having you come take a swim in the fish pool.

SPEAKER_01 46:18

Thank you very much. Love that.

SPEAKER_00 46:20

I thought the amateur was just right.

SPEAKER_01 46:22

That was beautiful, mate. Love you to do that win.

SPEAKER_00 46:27

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 46:31

Alright. Alright, brother.

Merch Early Access And Support

SPEAKER_00 46:36

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SPEAKER_03 47:49

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