Brandon The Human Tank — Intentionally Blank Ep. 251

Brandon Sanderson and Dan Wells discuss Brandon's recent shoulder surgery as well as other medical adventures they have had in there lives.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:04

All right, Dan. I have I don't know if it's exciting news, interesting news, but you wanted to start us.

SPEAKER_01 0:10

I uh we need to start off with a public apology. Oh no, what did we do? You and I have failed our listeners. One of the fun things, and I say that with my tongue firmly in cheek, uh, about this podcast is that I don't know which episode goes up on which week, and I don't know what order they're going out in. And so when people will message me, uh I don't know the context that they are replying from. And so uh this happened last week when all of a sudden out of nowhere I was getting text after text and emails and Discord messages saying, why didn't you say organized crime? Not a clue what they were talking about. Apparently, in an episode that went up recently, uh we talked about whales attacking ships. Yep. As and organized crime. We said organized crime. We missed organized crime. Yeah. Like half the YouTube comments are just calling us out for missing organized crime. So I'm sorry. Uh we've failed you. Or we did it on purpose so that you could come up with the pun and feel like you're a part of the team. They did a good job.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

Organized crime is good.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Yeah, yeah. It's very good. Yep. I had people in the office coming by my door and saying, It was right in front of you. Why didn't you say organized crime? Whatever.

SPEAKER_03 1:37

On a less um, I don't know, controversial slash uh silly topic. Um I got shoulder surgery. Yes, I I didn't do um uh podcast for two weeks. So um yeah. Um it was kind of fun. Well ki how so? I'd never been in the hospital before. Wait, really?

SPEAKER_01 2:00

I mean like you've never been a patient inpatient service. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:05

Like, I mean, I've gone and gotten blood drawn and I've gone and things like that, but I've never like I've never like had a never had surgery, never had anything like that. Like I've gone and had like there was one time where I was having heart murmurs. I went and got that checked out. Uh it turns out I think that uh was nothing. Well, it turns out it was nothing. That was years and years ago. Um heart murmur, no. Heart palpitations. That's what it was. Okay. Um uh so uh turns out that uh was probably sleep apnea. Oh um, yeah, I didn't know that could cause that. And I went in, they had checked it out and said, You seem healthy, people get these sometimes. I'm like, feels kind of weird. Uh, but regardless. Um the um never never gone and gotten surgery before, never had, never had anesthesia like general anesthesia before. It was kind of different.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Like so they they put you under for it.

SPEAKER_03 3:00

Yes, I like different experiences. Yeah, um, I like doing things that uh that I haven't done before. Uh and so like I got a big old shot in my neck, and that was cool. It felt really different. Um and they usually uh they usually give people a medicine, an anti-anxiety medicine, and they say it'll make you it makes you forget uh the next like five, 10 minutes so that you don't have the trauma of having got to see you before surgery? No, for the shot. Okay, specifically for the shot. Uh and my wife's like, he's not gonna need that. And they're like, Are you sure? And I'm like, yeah, I'm I I'm fine. Can I watch? Uh and I'm like, I can't really see it because it went in my neck. Yeah. Um, but you could like feel them looking around for the nerve and things like that. It was really interesting. And um, yeah, uh didn't need any anesthesia for that. Um, and they were quite kind of surprised because I acted a little odd. They don't have um, they don't have people without emotions very often, I think.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

Uh I, in contrast, uh last month had to get a typhoid vaccine because I was going to Thailand.

SPEAKER_03 4:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Uh, and I had to hug their big stuffed animal that they had and think about other things.

SPEAKER_03 4:16

So the big shot in the neck. The thing about it is the big shock in the net didn't actually work. Oh. Um, I have hereditary resistance to local anesthesias, and this was like a block there injecting it onto the nerve or whatever, so that my arm was supposed to go just like flop, right? Like all the way down the fingers, just nothing. Uh, and they did it, and then they did the general, and general works just fine on us. I don't have any here, but they did the general, and I'd never had that before. Um, I woke up saying, Oh, I need to tell their stories, but I can't remember whose stories I was talking about. Okay. Um, so did you not even have tonsils out as a kid? Nope, no tonsils out, no wisdom teeth. Uh, we've talked about that. I don't have wisdom teeth that exist. Um, but the the shot didn't work. I came out and my hand arm was just fine. And they're like, you can feel your shoulder. I'm like, yeah, it hurts right here, right here, right here. And they're like, we're gonna do another of those. This is supposed to last three days to keep you, get you through the big pain because we don't want to give you uh morphine or oxycot. So they uh they're like, and you didn't mind the shot. And I'm like, no, I don't mind the shot. So they went and gave me another one in my neck. Uh that one didn't work either. Um, but I got just like the little bit uh like the leg loss. I think I feel a tingle. I felt like a little bit of tingle and it did um there, but they were really worried. So then they gave me the oxycotin and that didn't do anything. Um, so they gave me a second oxycotin, and that didn't do anything either.

SPEAKER_01 5:42

It's uh all of the tolerances you raised back when you were a hopeless drug addict.

SPEAKER_03 5:48

Yeah. No, I think that uh heroin wouldn't do anything to me. It might not, because oxycotin is supposed to be more powerful than heroin. I was talking at writing group, and it doesn't seem that it's just me. A lot of people, Oxycottin doesn't do anything. Interesting. Um, but so I'm just like, I I don't I don't need that. So they didn't even give me a prescription for that. Uh and now now what kind of surgery was this?

SPEAKER_01 6:09

Oh yeah, yes.

SPEAKER_03 6:10

You you told me they were gonna have to shave the bone? Shave the bone. They shaved the bone. Um and so they went in and they did um three cuts um and they put a scope in there because what happened is that my shoulder bone was like, they call it technically a bone spur. Uh it was this arm. There said it was settling down uh and it was cutting into the tendon. And if that happens too much, it'll cut through the tendon. Uh and then they have to do like a full rotator cuff, right? And they have to like staple the tendon back in place to your bone. And they're like, that's a terrible recovery. Uh if if we have to do that, then you like can't use your arm for six weeks. Uh and they said, This one you'll have your arm back in a week. Uh and I kind of knew I'm like, a week probably means in a day for me, um, because of you know, uh Brandon things. And so the so Thursday I asked them, can I take it out of the sling? It's fine. Uh and they're like, really? Okay. And so I don't have all motion to that's about as far as you can go. That's as far as I can go. And this one can go all the way up here. Yeah. So I'm gonna have to do physical therapy to not have frozen shoulder.

SPEAKER_01 7:17

I uh had frozen shoulder several years ago. It is not fun. Yeah. Um so yeah. So uh this sounds like it was not a repetitive stress injury.

SPEAKER_03 7:28

No, they don't think it was uh it was signing.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

They think it was just I know that's the first thing that was my everyone thought when they heard this.

SPEAKER_03 7:35

Um I don't know if that exacerbates it or not, but they did. They went in, they shaved off the just a the shoulder blade, like a chunk of the bone, and popped it out uh and then sealed me back up. He actually also it was really um he says it was really um um aggravated, what do you call that? Um inflamed. And so he had to like do some stuff to like uh my wife says he like cauterized it and things to like that was interfering with the motion and whatnot. So inflammation is the most obnoxious thing to me. And I am taking the ibuprofen, like the super ibuprofen they gave me because I figure I need to keep the inflammation down uh and things like that. So but I was uh I was writing by Thursday, I had the surgery on Wednesday, um, and they had uh told me once you get your feeling back in your hands, you'll be able to type it. That's totally fine. And I had my feeling back the first day. So cool. So the doctor was fine. I I checked with the doctor, I was like, all right, if I go back to work, and he's like, Yes. So here's my big code back to work.

SPEAKER_01 8:36

Did they let you keep the piece of the bone?

SPEAKER_03 8:38

No, I didn't ask for it. They never do. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 8:42

Um uh I got way back in you know '93 or four, uh, they let me keep my whip uh tonsils. Okay. Do you still have them? I had them up through college, and when I got married, my wife threw them away because they were grass, repellent at that point in time. Um, I always ask for everything. I had my uh tailbone removed about uh 15, 16 years ago. Uh they wouldn't let me keep it. That would have been a fun one to keep. Yeah, I wish that they'd let me keep that one. I do have a picture of it somewhere. Um we didn't know what was causing pain in the tailbone until they pulled it out, and the doctor was like, oh, see this and this? This is degenerative arthritis. Uh and it so I've been waiting for that to come back in some other part of my body. And recently my knee has been giving me crap for about three or four weeks, so maybe that's a suggestion.

SPEAKER_03 9:43

What? Lunges. Lunges. Lunges. Um if you do, at least for me, um, knees never never hurt if I'm properly doing lunges every week.

SPEAKER_01 9:53

Okay. So well, I'll start doing lunges. Yeah. Um, because I'm pretty sure that's what it is. I suspect it is weak muscles in the leg that are not holding the knee in place properly. Yeah. Um lunges is a better solution than mine, which is just get a little floating thing, like job of the hut.

SPEAKER_03 10:12

Yeah. Um they don't have those yet.

SPEAKER_01 10:14

No. But or like the Baron Harkonnen anti-grab things. Okay, so anyway. Um here here's the segue. Not that we need segues on this show. Uh my niece started giving me crap when I was in Thailand.

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

I want to tell you about Thailand. I want to hear about Thailand because you went to visit one of our mutual friends. Yes. I did ask her. She's she was being very private about everything, but I asked if I could uh say this on the show, and she said yes. It was our mutual friend Piper Drake, fantastic author, uh, very good friend. Uh we we have stayed at each other's houses all the time. Um she and I wanted to do a writing retreat, and then she uh also uh decided to get married. And so I f we just lumped those together and I flew over there. Uh the wedding was in Krabi, which is down southern Thailand, kind of toward uh Malaysia, and then flew back up to uh Bangkok for the retreat. So in total, the it it was uh direct flight from Salt Lake to Incheon in Seoul. That was 13 hours. Incheon in Seoul. Okay, Incheon and Incheon. It's the Seoul airport. Um 13 hours, uh-huh. Four-hour layover in Korea, um incredible airport, and then what was it? I want to say it was six hours to Bangkok, and then a seven-hour layover before we could fly down to Craby, which was only like an hour. It was super short.

SPEAKER_03 12:00

Yeah, but that that's why I've never been to Thailand.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Yeah, it is so far away from everything. Just flying to Bangkok wasn't as bad. That layover was the worst. Anyway, um, on that second leg from Korea to Bangkok, um, I passed out, which I've never done on a plane before. Um, but I was getting really nauseated and leaned forward uh to try to, you know, put my head as far down as I could in the nasty little airplane seats. And then the next thing I knew, I had like two flight attendants and my wife, and they were taking my pulse and doing all this. And Don said, You passed out, and I said, No, I didn't. I just leaned forward. Apparently, I was out for a good 20, 30 seconds. I spent most of that flight laying on the floor, um kind of in the middle by one of the exit doors, yeah, where there's some open space next to one of the kitchens. Um, and my blood pressure was shockingly low. I can't remember the numbers for it, but it was well below healthy.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:12

Um, and I laid there for about two hours until uh it was back up to normal, and then I went back to my seat, lasted about 15 minutes, and they made me go lie down again. So Wow. Do you know what it was? It might have been our best theory right now is that I had taken uh my sleeping pills, trazodone, uh-huh, uh, and something about that triggered it. I mean, don't have no muscle relaxant, so there could be something there. Um I haven't had that reaction to it before, so maybe not. Uh but that's my best.

SPEAKER_03 13:52

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I shouldn't mention, like, I if there are any new listeners here, they might be like, Brandon's bragging about being macho and not feeling pain. Uh I'm not macho. I've just um I have just have a very weird biology. Because, and I can tell you, I I pass out if I give blood. Oh, really? Uh yeah. Um, and it's um it's not a like woo like seeing blood, but if I give blood, in fact, uh it happened to me the first time when I was like 18, 19 going to college. They're like the first time they they took blood. Uh they took blood and they said, you know, go go fill the cup. And I passed out in the uh bathroom.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 14:33

Um and um after that I'm like, they're like, you maybe shouldn't give blood. And so I never you know gave blood except for doctor things. Um, but like one time when I was uh newly uh married, I dropped a knife and cut my toe and I didn't know. And I was still working and I passed out then too.

SPEAKER_01 14:53

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 14:54

Um I didn't even see how much blood did you lose? None, like tiny bits. Wow, but uh it's like I have a uh they call it a vasovagal response or something. Like a sudden, even slight drop in blood pressure will knock me out, unless I finally found a um a phlebotomist who told me, Oh, yeah, when they like scrub your arm with the the little wipe, take that from them and sniff it like a smelling salt. And I did that, and I ever since then I haven't passed out. That's great. Interesting. I've been careful not to like if I give blood, I'll be like, I'll probably pass out, let me lie down. And if I'm lying down, I might not, uh, and things like that. But I finally had one that said, no, no, just do this, and I did it, and it worked. Worked, no problem.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

Yeah, I always warn when I uh get a shot or when I do a blood test, which I I just did last week. I always warn them, I have passed out before. Yep, it doesn't happen every time, but it might. Yep. Um Have I told you my worst passing out in a doctor's office story? No. So um I at some point had horrible pain in my uh left hand and and arm and um went to an insta care, which was my first mistake. The doctor said, Oh, that is um what's what's the injury that you get in your carpal tunnel? Carpal tunnel. He said it was carpal tunnel. It very clearly was not the nerve, it's the the ulnar nerve, not the carpal nerve. Um, but I didn't know that at the time. And so he just said, Oh, you're a writer? Carpal tunnel. And so I wore a brace for a couple of months that just made it worse.

SPEAKER_03 16:37

I think I remember that. You were yeah, you weren't in Germany or anything. I wasn't in Germany yet.

SPEAKER_01 16:42

Um and it just got worse and worse, and the and the brace wasn't helping because that wasn't the problem. Uh, so I ended up going to a sports medicine doctor and they told me I was gonna get these specific tests. One of them was a nerve conductivity test. And uh my mom has MS, she's had every test under the sun, and she said, Oh, nerve conductivity, call me when you get out. And I'm like, Okay, cool. Um, I did not realize that nerve conductivity tests they put electrodes on the palm of your hand and a needle in your shoulder and electrify it. Okay. Uh, and so I already don't do well with needles. Right. Um, so they were doing this test and it just freaked me out. I absolutely passed out, fell on the floor off of their table. While you're being electrified. While I was being electrified by the doctor, yeah. Um they managed to catch me. I didn't get like head trauma or anything. Yeah. Uh, but then they said, test is over, we're done. And so I got back in the car and I called my mom and said, Hey, so I just got out of that test. And she laughed and laughed and laughed. She's like, How was it? How'd you do with an electrified needle in your arm? My mom is very dark humor. Anyway.

SPEAKER_03 17:58

I that's not that embarrassing. I thought you were gonna tell, like, when I went to get my shoulder surgery, I was in where they're gonna put the big shot in my neck, and um a nurse walked in, a young nurse, and she looked and she went, and then she held up her clipboard and hid her face from me. And she's like, I didn't read the name. Um and um it was funny because everybody else was kind of prepared, and those who didn't know who I was had heard from the other, but she hadn't, and she about collapsed. Uh and I'm not sure that's fantastic. Yeah, if that if I should be embarrassed by that, but then she sat and chatted with my wife um about loving my books while I was getting needles stuck in my in my neck. In your neck. So right.

SPEAKER_02 18:42

If I can interrupt, I have a follow-up on what Brandon just said, actually. Okay. Funny enough. Um, so Brandon, you went to the eye doctor the other day. Yes, as you might remember. Um, turns out uh not only did you go to an eye doctor for like a conglomerate of uh someone I'm working in a DD group with, they got so far to me that this person walked up angrily at DD, was like, Donald, how could you not tell me that Brandon was doing eye uh appointments at this place? And somehow she knew that I was the connection. She had never brought up that I worked here or anything. You you had influenced my DD group just by seeing an eye doctor. Uh thanks for that.

SPEAKER_03 19:24

Filmed me trying on new glasses. That'll go up on the channel. I don't know when that'll go up. That's fine. Eventually. Eventually. Because well, you it can't be too much eventually, because I can't use my new glasses until it's that's gone up. Because we have we do we're gonna do a reveal. Okay. So I so the glasses which are ready as of this week, I can't go do pick up until you guys post the video. So I will talk to Octavia.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

When you were trying them on, did you walk back and forth like a model and pose for the camera and do the blue steel face?

SPEAKER_03 19:58

I didn't do blue steel, but I did pose for the camera. Okay. We uh basically we went in and we we brought all of the the people who know fashion. So it was my wife, my executive assistant, and Octavia. Okay. Um, Janie would have been there, except Janie had something. Uh, this is my sister who is uh very fashionable. Yeah, and so I said to them, I'm just going to wear the ones you pick. Um, I don't see myself, you do. So they went and got a whole bucket of ones and they'll stood around and watched me try them on. And then they eventually picked the ones that they want me to have as my new look. So that's wonderful. We filmed all that. So that video has to go up because otherwise I'll put them on and take, like, uh do a weekly update, and people will know before the video goes up which ones they picked. Good point.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

I will I will make sure that happens.

SPEAKER_03 20:49

Yeah. Uh, I also wanted to give a PSA. Okay. Oh, um, a little PSA about my arm. So I would I noticed something was wrong with my arm because like I would lift myself up out of a chair or something like that, and I would get a very spike of pain. Right. Um, and though I have a unique relationship with pain, pain's job is to tell me something's wrong with my body. And so I pay attention to it, right? Um and so I'm like, I hope that that's not something that is getting worse. So I went to the uh my general practitioner and he said, hmm, well, I'll send you to a physical therapist. It's probably you pulled something. And I did physical therapy a little bit and it made it worse.

SPEAKER_01 21:31

Oh.

SPEAKER_03 21:32

And when I stopped the physical therapy, it's it got less worse. Uh, and for a little while it was just livable. And I'm like, well, we'll just see if it heals. When it didn't, after about a year, and it was getting worse again. I said, I should go see a specialist. And I went to the specialist, um, and they are a bunch of sports uh medicine people. And I saw the physician's assistant, and she's like, Oh yeah, this is really obviously really obvious what this is. We'll get an MRI just to be sure, but it's probably this thing. And I had gotten an MRI, and the GP wasn't able to read what was in it. Um, and she said, let's should get another one to see if it's gotten worse, or things like that. Uh, because we got her the previous MRI. So we went and did another MRI, and that one was even better. They they knew what to look for because they had told them. And she's like, Yep, this is it. And the doctor looked at it and said, Yep, this is it. Um, and he said, if we pulled a hundred people off the street and we did MRIs of them, he said, the majority of them would have had some of this happening, just not enough that it's worth surgery, uh, because it's a natural thing that happens in bodies. Um, and he said, Um, you know, it it we he said, I did three of these yesterday uh that day. It's just really common uh for people, but I think it must be something hard for GPs to spot. So there could be, like, I am not a physician, I don't want to be giving medical advice. Um, but there could be people out here like, hey, wait, I went through that same thing. Uh a specialist might um be able to look at it and uh it'd be the most obvious thing in the world to them because it's their focus. Uh and the like three days after my surgery, it it was already better. Like I would already trade it for uh what I was living with before. Um and so, and then right now, like you know, yes, I'm stiff, but before, if I went like that, it was super painful. Now it's just stiff. Now it just stops, right? Now it just stops, and I can, you know, and like this is we're one week later. Uh, we're recording this on Friday, so uh in nine days later.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

Uh and nine days later, like there's some little aches that I assume will go away because you know, my bone was shaved, but man, it's so much better. So that's awesome. Wow. Ask to see a specialist. Yes. Um, and if there's something like this for you, it might be worth having them have you have an MRI and checking to see if maybe you've got a strange part of your body slicing into another strange part of your body.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Okay, I know we're almost at time, but I still have more crazy travel stuff. Oh, more. Okay, we get we can handle some more crazy travel stuff. Good part of the travel is that passing out on a plane means they force you to take a wheelchair.

SPEAKER_03 24:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

And that was the best. I want to fly with a wheelchair every single time now.

SPEAKER_03 24:30

See, that's why I said I enjoyed the surgery because everyone treated me so nice. It was great. Everybody's great.

SPEAKER_01 24:35

Uh I got wheeled around all through the Korean airport and you know, fast passed through customs. It was fantastic. Anyway, uh, we went down to Krabi, we went to the wedding, it was incredible and wonderful. Went back up to Bangkok, and I went to go uh get the Airbnb open. That because we were doing a writing retreat, we had several people coming in uh from all over the place. Uh, we got there and there was a chain across the door. Inside. No, across the the gate out in front. And there was uh a piece of paper there all in Thai, and I got my little Google thing out uh to translate it for me. Um apparently the guy who was renting the Airbnb to us was himself a renter and had not paid his rent to the owner in three months. So the owner had the cops come and chain it closed until the guy paid his rent. And so the guy had friends and and some other cop friends who came and cut through the chain for him to open it up and we thought, well, maybe we can go in now. And then the owner found out and he shut off all the utilities. So there was no water, electricity, anything in the house. Uh so we had about twelve people who'd flown in from US and Canada and China and all over the place uh for this writing retreat. We had nowhere to put them. And so Piper and I were just on our phones scrolling through Airbnb and Verbo and everything else we could find, and eventually, very late at night, found one guy with a house big enough to hold everybody who was willing to let us in that day.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

But yeah, that was that was a I assumed you got your money back from the criminals.

SPEAKER_01 26:30

Full refund. Uh-huh. Uh we uh, you know, Airbnb was on our side the whole way, gave gave us everything.

SPEAKER_03 26:37

Well, good for them. Yeah. Because I was gonna be like, this is the Airbnb risk. Like, yeah. It does happen with hotels too. Like you show up and they're overbooked and things, but it seems like there's a statistically larger likelihood of your air Airbnb having something weird about it.

SPEAKER_01 26:54

Yeah. So it's good that they took care of you. When we we went to the uh the Wyoming for the rodeo over the summer, and we talked about that on the show. Yeah, you got me a shirt. Um, which you never wear.

SPEAKER_03 27:06

I've tried, thought about wearing it several times, and then I realized I have to do other public appearances, and I do not want to be wearing that shirt during any sort of public appearance. I've actually got it out and said, Oh, I can wear it today, and then remembered there was something else I was filming. So I probably actually could have worn it today because this is the only public thing I'm doing today. Uh so we'll see. We'll see if I can if I can remember to wear it when I don't have to film anything else. But I'm not gonna do my weekly update in a sexy cowgirl shirt.

SPEAKER_01 27:38

They will love it. Uh-huh. Your audience will love it. Yeah. Anyway, the reason I'm bringing up Frontier Days is we had months in advance booked an Airbnb for it because we were taking a ton of our kids and some in-laws and things. And then a week before, uh, the owner contacted us and said, Hey, I forgot that this was listed. I'm actually living in it. You can't stay there. And so we had to scramble last minute again. It wasn't day of uh like in Bangkok, but anyway. Uh Bangkok was amazing. I had crazy travel stories there. My knee hurt the whole time. But it's still amazing. I've heard Bangkok is fantastic. It was it was wonderful. And like my seven-hour layover in the airport was overnight. It was like one until seven. Were you able to get like a little hotel? Do they have no they didn't have one of those? That does not sound great. We had to no, it was miserable the whole time. But everything's open all night. Like even in JFK, yeah, everything shuts down at night. Uh, Bangkok Airport was open, all the food places were open. Some of the best food I had in Thailand was in that airport. Um, everything I ate was incredible. It was just wonderful. Well, great. Yeah. So anyway, everyone go to Thailand. Number one uh destination for medical tourism. Is it more than Turkey? Uh yeah, it surpassed it. Okay. Um, and the hospitals there are insanely nice. We went uh with Piper to an appointment, and it was like there was a concierge at the front. It was nicer than a lot of hotels I've stayed in.

SPEAKER_03 29:16

To come home with hair.

SPEAKER_01 29:18

Get a bunch of hair plugged. No, I got I got my tailbone reattached. How's that been?