The Soulful Leader Podcast
The Soulful Leader Podcast
Could Changing Your Space Rewire Your Habits?
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Your morning route, the layout of a room and even the items on your desk quietly decide who you are each day.
That means they can also help you when you want to change.
This week, Maren & Stephanie dig into the hidden script behind habits and show how small environmental edits, supportive community, and gentle inner work help you change old habits, stick to new ones and achieve the things you want that have been just out of reach.
Instead of forcing goals with sheer willpower, they unpack why we often get pulled back into old patterns after the initial rush of change, and how to interrupt that without shame.
With their normal combination of stories, humor and user-friendly tools, they explore how to flip the script on habits while also transforming doubt and fear, fostering inner respect, and finally getting that thing that has been just out of reach.
Expect practical tools you can use today—room resets that trigger awareness, accountability that reduces decision fatigue, and small rituals to increase both attention and energy.
🙌 If this resonates, hit play, then rearrange one small piece of your life for an upgrade.
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❣️ What’s the first change you’ll make this week?
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In a world where we have everything and it's still not enough, we're often left wondering, is this really it?
Maren:Deep inside, you know there's more to life. You're ready to leave behind the old push your way through and claim the deeper, more meaningful life that's calling you. T
Stephanie:That's what we invite you to explore with us. We're your hosts, Stephanie Allen
Maren:and Maren Oslac.
Maren and Stephanie:And this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie:Yay!
Maren:Welcome to the Soulful Leader Podcast. My name is Maren, and I'm here with Stephanie, and we're talking about habits today. We were just talking before we got on, and one of the things we've talked about is changing up our habit and the way that we've been doing our podcast and making it more conversational and doing it live at some point and some point soon, hopefully. So we didn't talk as much before we jumped on. We decided to jump on and have the conversation with all of you.
Stephanie:Yeah, so I'm thinking, you know, when we talk about habits, so interesting. We don't even, like a habit is something that you just keep doing over and over again and it becomes completely unconscious. You don't even know that you don't know. Which is a good thing, if it's a good thing. Meaning when we think of, hey, we're in a new year, who do I want to be? What do I want to create? You know, how do I want to live this year? Like it doesn't necessarily have to have goals to it, it can be just simply a feeling or a simply being present to the unfolding of who and what you're being called to be, whatever that is. But there's gonna require a certain ritual or a certain habit that's going to set you up for, you know, to allow that to happen. And I was thinking back of like when I was younger and I would return home after like maybe in the summer holiday after university, and I'd come back and I'd live in my parents' home. And for the first week, maybe not even the first week, but maybe the first few days, I felt like an adult. And then after about the third or fourth day, next thing you know, I am like, well, mom, where's my breakfast? Well, mom, where's my, you know, and I've been living on my own. Like, why am I whining? Or, you know, my mother would treat me like an adult for the first two days, and the next thing you know, she's treating me like a kid. Like, we both would get into these old rituals. And Maren, you were just talking about like you're up visiting your mom right now in Canada and you're living in the States, and you're in a new space. And you were just kind of talking, I'd love to hear more about that. Like, how when we do our podcast in your home back in the States versus when you've transitioned and now you're in a place at your mom's house. How's that going? What have you noticed?
Maren:So it it is interesting because my mom renovated a space on her property this past year, and I'm the first person to be staying there. And I was very aware of how different, like it's a new year. There's... I have new ideas for who I have, you know, definitely ideas of who I want to be and things I want to accomplish this year. And I walked into this space and it felt like a blank slate. And I realized how much our spaces hold our habits. So I'm in the space, I wake up and there's this... there's more space. Like it's not, oh, I have to get this done, I have to do that, you know. Like there wasn't the laundry list. I just had openness. And I was like, I can be anyone, I could do anything. And it was such an exciting feeling. And then I took a moment and I thought about when I wake at home wake up at home, there's a prescribed route that my feet take, that my body knows, that I just like you said, a habit is you fall into it. And I don't want to vilify habits because we need them. We can't think of everything that needs to get done all the time. So we rely on habits to live our lives. And I became really aware of making my habits conscious. Like, what if I could choose my habits instead of living a habit because I just live it, because I've gotten used to it, because I don't know, all of the the unconscious things that we do around habits.
Stephanie:So, like for example, like I think of hey, you know, I want to... I want to be in better health this year. So that's gonna require some different habits. Like I can't stay the same with the same habits and expect a different result. I'm gonna get the same result, pretty much. It's like baking a cake, you know, you use the same ingredients in the same way that you've always used it, you're going to get the same outcome. So why don't we... why is it that you know we don't relate that to our life? Like, why do we keep kind of efforting and striving and doing the same old habit thinking we're gonna get a different result?
Maren:I think it goes back to what you were saying of it's unconscious, it gets layered so deeply and it literally lives in our homes, in our work environments, in our cars. Like, okay, so here's an example. At home, we have a TV in my kitchen, in our kitchen. And one of the things that I've gotten into the habit of doing is when I'm cooking, I put on the TV so that I have some company in the kitchen, because I'm cooking. And it's lovely until it's not, because then I oftentimes find myself hooked into whatever I'm watching, and I'm done cooking, I'm done cleaning, and I'm just standing there in my kitchen watching the rest of whatever's on. And there's a little voice in the back of my head that says, You've got stuff to do, Maren. Go. And I'm like, Oh, but I'll just finish this. And so it's so layered and so ingrained. And it's interesting because I cooked last night here and there's no TV in my little space. And I didn't have any desire to turn it on because there's no TV. It's a different environment. And that's one of those things where I could choose a different habit. And every time I walk into the kitchen at home, it's so ingrained in me, I just pick up the little remote and I turn it on, and there's not even a thought there.
Stephanie:Yeah, which is what you're saying. Like when you went to this place, all of a sudden you had space.
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:There wasn't the TV, there wasn't the habit that you had, like your footsteps had ingrained in you to do this, then do that. Then it's like, oh, I'm in a new space. I'm different. This is a different place. I can be different. Which I think is why people often like to change jobs or change relationships or move. Or I know when I went to university, when I left home for the first time and I went to university, there was no one else that I knew going to that university at that time. So I had an opportunity to redesign Stephanie.
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:Because no one was going to hold me accountable to who I used to be. I could literally change it. And I so when I think of like sustaining a habit, it's like that's also when we do need people so that we can say, okay, this is the habit I want. So a lot of things, example. A lot of people are giving up drinking right now in the new year, and I'm hearing it, and it's like, you know. And if you surround yourself with other people who have also made that same commitment, or you've told someone why that's important to you, and they're holding you accountable. They're supportive, they're supportive. They can actually hold the container for that new habit to then become a conscious and then move into the unconscious realm that it just becomes the new you. You don't have to think about it or effort it so much. It just becomes natural.
Maren:I love what you're saying because yes, I think that it's a very powerful tool. Moving, changing jobs, getting a new car. Like we don't realize what a powerful tool it is. And when we're unconscious about it, then often times we find ways, not often times... we will find ways to create the same habits to be the same person. Like you were talking about when you went away to school and you came back, and all of a sudden now you're the same person that you were when you left. And you're like, how the frick did that happen?
Stephanie:Yeah, I defaulted back to the old setting.
Maren:Right.
Stephanie:Like, oops, I'm back to factory setting again. Reset. Like, wait, I already put upgrades in that. Where did those upgrades go? They disappeared.
Maren:And we do that to ourselves even in a new environment because when we're in a new environment, everything is unknown and and we're not comfortable in the unknown. So we want to make something familiar. So all of a sudden, the same, the new job after a year, we're having the same problems we had at the old job. We're having the same issues, we're feeling the same feelings, we're still, you know, it's like, wait, I changed jobs because, or in a new city, or in a new relationship, right? It's all rosy and pretty for a while. And then after the first little bit, it goes back to reset, default factory. Right, reset.
Stephanie:That's right. You know, one of the things that I used to work in Arizona, I worked with one of my teachers, John Barnes, and I practiced myofascial release there in, you know, in his clinic. And one of the things that I was responsible for was looking after new people coming in and creating a change. So they had to learn how to break old habits because that the original habits were is what was facilitating the pain in their life and in their body. And so we were identifying new patterns and new ways of being. And so they had to practice it. Now, here's what would happen, though, after a couple of weeks of practicing it, they return home, just like I did at university, returned home, and you go back to the factory reset again. And that it takes a lot of work to be able to hold it and to change it. It is not easy. And so we would recommend at that time that you know, come back, have an update, or well, here's what I would say now, now knowing, you know, 20, 30 years later, I'd say we have to do the internal work. And what that means is that "who was I then" was often a conditioned self, programmed. Sometimes it's even survival. It's even like I had to adapt in order to survive. And I don't just mean survive physically, I mean mentally, emotionally, all those levels. And then when you can have space, when you make a shift, you change locations or you set a new intention or goal, you can say, okay, what then is the new habit that needs to be put in place? Who will I then need to be? And almost inside myself, I almost have to mentor, well, I do, I have to create space inside myself to then mentor myself when I want to default back to the factory setting. I have to say, well, wait a minute, that's old Stephanie. That's factory setting. What is the the upgrade? What is the new operating system that I now need to implement in order to keep doing? And here's what also I'll look, I'll do is I'll look outside myself to find out who else is being that or who else can help to support me to do that.
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:Because we can't do it alone, actually.
Maren:No...
Stephanie:You know, people will hold us back, but people also bring us up too. So find the ones who will bring you up and where they are and what they're doing.
Maren:I love that you brought that up. It makes me think of AA. Because there's a habit, right?
Stephanie:Right.
Maren:It's a habit. And it's... whether it's and I'm not just talking about alcoholics, but any type of addiction comes from a habit, whether it's something that you put into place or society put into place for you, it actually doesn't matter because it was installed as an operating system in your body. And in order to change the operating system, you actually have to you know, like pull back the covers, look at what's installed, and then change it. And that doesn't happen by ourselves. There's a lot of work you have to do by yourself on your own. And you do need that outer support of a group of people, a coach, a mentor, friends, whatever that looks like, to help you. Because, you know, we assume that when we want to change, we, you know, we make the change, we feel the difference, and then we're like, good, done. Check that, yeah, like the the whole check the box thing. And then we slip a little bit, which is going to happen because change doesn't happen once, change happens as a process. And so when you check that box and you're like, oh, I got that. Yes, you've got that for right now, and it's something to celebrate. And just know that you will slip a little bit. Probably everybody's maybe feeling a little bit of that right now, you know, as we're moving a little bit past brand new New Year, or maybe I slipped a little bit. And often times that leads to throwing in the towel. I mean, like, well, you know what? Summer's coming, I'll deal with it then. Or sometimes we're really wanting to throw in the towel, I'll deal with that next year. Right?
Stephanie:Yeah, and we do need to, we can't do it. We're... I don't say we can't do it, I don't think we're we're supposed to do it by ourselves.
Maren:I don't so
Stephanie:I think that's the whole ...
Maren:We're literally not designed to do it by ourselves.
Stephanie:We're social beings. And we do get influenced, whether it be negative or positive, from those around us. And I've heard many times people say, well, I can't find support, I can't find anybody. And you know, sometimes you might say... well, I live in a rural place, there's somebody around. Well, I'm not just talking about someone in your physical location, you know, our imagination is also an environment. So as little children, you can make up people in your own self, like doing that. But why I'm saying that is that as you change the internal belief system around that, all of a sudden the external shows up. You, you know. So here's an example. You say, oh, I can't find anybody. I can't find anybody to help me. There's no one there, no one, no one can do what I need to have done. That is also a habit. That's a habit in doubt that you are literally addicted to doubt and fear, probably, because what would happen if you actually someone did help you? You would change. And there's a part of you that is not too happy about that because it really likes the old habits that are making them feel really comfortable. Yeah. So challenging that internal environment is really important and say, well, what if that wasn't true?
Maren:Byron Katie has got great work around this. So if you're somebody out there who's going, well, you know, I can't find any support, first of all, you reach out to us. Second of all, there's a ton of people, including Byron Katie's work called The Work. And it's free. It's free. And it asks that question of, is it true? Is it true? Or is it just a conditioned response to keep us safe? And when I say to keep us safe, there's a part of us that thinks that we will be safe if we stay the same. It truly does not keep us safe. It's not, it has nothing to do with true safety. It's a fear-based program that says if you change, we will die. And that part of you is right because that part of you will die.
Stephanie:Yeah.
Maren:And the rest of you will be free to choose the habits that support you and where you want to go. So there are wonderful people out there.
Stephanie:Absolutely. So challenge everything inside yourself. Challenge those habits, the habit of doubt, the habit of fear. You know, create a new habit that would actually uplift you and inspire you. Like, you know, what if I could? You know, that that is a habit of being. Someone said to me once, well, Stephanie, you're always positive. I'm like, you realize I've literally practiced making that a habit. Because in my internal world, and this is still true now, in my internal world, there is still a lot of myself inside that is feeling hopeless and helpless and doubtful and fearful. But my habit is that I go in and I work with those parts so that they don't rule and ruin my life. I help them, I help, I help be present to them. I can't ignore them because they will literally rip out the carpet underneath my feet. So I pay attention to them. So maybe
Maren:and I challenge them.. That's powerful...
Stephanie:And I find people who will keep me accountable so that when I am in that hopeless and helpless and doubtful and fearful place, I can reach out and go, oh my God, I'm in a hot mess. I need some help. Can you help me up with a perspective? And why I say that is that sometimes our... the part of us that is reaching over help is a victim part, meaning it's coming from a place of doubt and fear of like nobody can really help me, but I'm gonna ask you anyway because I'm supposed to ask you, because that's what I'm supposed to do is ask for help, but you can't really help me anyway. And I really don't want your help because if you tell me what I'm gonna do, I'm gonna hate you for it. That's not helpful.
Maren:Right.
Stephanie:Versus saying, I'm stuck, and I know I need to change, and I know there's a part of me that's really afraid of it. And can you just help me with like listening or providing me this space or a perspective that I'm not seeing? And then you've got to be open enough to receive it. Doesn't mean you have to believe it, but to receive it as interesting creation.
Maren:One of the ways that I know for myself that I'm not listening and that the part of me that doesn't really want help that just wants to feel justified, "but I did ask for help. Poor me." Right? The way I know that I'm in that part of me is when somebody offers me something. And I do the 'Yeah, but'
Stephanie:oh yeah... the 'Yeah, but'!
Maren:The 'Yeah but'... yeah, but I have all the reasons why what they've offered me won't work. Oh I've tried that, I've called this person, I've done that. Like when I'm in that...
Stephanie:...that's the 'Little Chucklehead Yeah, but'. You can call that. That's the 'Little Chucklehead Yeah, but'. Give them names.
Maren:Give them names. And because that part of you is not interested in actually changing, so it's gonna get defensive and it's gonna have all the reasons why this person, what they had to share, won't work. And they won't work because the 'Yeah, but Chucklehead' is the one that's listening, and that's the part of you that's not actually interested in changing.
Stephanie:Exactly! It's putting their hands up and pushing it away. It's like, yeah...
Maren:and then you can feel good about yourself because I did ask for help and they didn't, they couldn't help me. And oh, poor me.
Stephanie:Oh, I've so been there. I have so been there.
Maren:Oh God yes! The reason I know it so well is because that's...
Stephanie:right, o h yeah.
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:Yeah.
Maren:So first challenge yourself, right? Second, and I, this is something that's really up for me right now in this brand new blank slate. And I think it's up for you too, Stephanie. So I'm gonna share this and you'll understand why. Change your environment. Make it uncomfortable. Like put your desk in a different place and so you'll have to trip over it. Like literally change up your environment. And the reason I say that, Stephanie, you're gonna get this, is because I got on a call with her about two days ago and she's like, I rearranged my entire room. It's amazing, and and everything changed for her.
Stephanie:Yeah, because originally, originally my computer crashed. And I'll tell you, I have capacity in a lot of areas to be positive and to be upbeat and to totally work through some really difficult situations. But if you give me a technical issue, I am like a three-year-old having a temper tantrum. Like I just, I just don't know what to do. I can't find help. I try to reach out. I was being that chucklehead. That part of me that was total chucklehead, ' Yeah, but' And finally I just laid it all down and I called Maren and I said, I need perspective on this. And you were lovely. In fact, I actually even said, you know, you're gonna hate me for saying... this is what Maren said to me. She goes, you're gonna hate me for saying this, but congratulations, you're on the edge and you're ready for a breakthrough. And I'm like, yeah, now I really do want to eat my own words that I ever even told you that. But here's what happened: I changed my office and I did some work internally. What I mean by that is I had to really... I took in what Maren told me and didn't get defensive and said, yeah, I need to look at that. And I had I journaled a little bit. I talked to those parts, and I say parts because we have parts of us, and I don't mean arm and leg parts. I'm talking chucklehead parts. There's parts of us that are that are whining and complaining, there's parts of us that are positive and happy, there's parts of us that are sad and scared. There's all these parts, so it's like a whole family inside there that having a freaking bonfire and party half the time. You gotta go and get them because they're making a mess in your space internally. So I did that. I had some talks with some chuckleheads and what it was, and one, you know, one evening, all of a sudden I just got the inspiration. I'm like, I'm gonna move everything around. It's not working for me. Nothing is working for me. I'm gonna move it around. I moved it around and I'm scared to death, by the way. My computer wasn't really charging. I was scared, so I haven't even moved it. I so I literally rearranged the entire room without ever touching my computer. I put it on the floor and I moved around it. I danced around it. And then I, once everything was in its right place, I put it back up onto the stand. And not only did it work, it upgraded. Like it must have needed an upgrade. And I don't know what happened in the outer world that made that happen, but I know what happened in my internal world. And I said, my God, I must be in a different universe because now everything is working, not only working, it's actually new and improved on my on my laptop. And this was like two weeks ago that my my, you know, that this has been going on. So it wasn't like, oh, it was an update and it happened overnight. No, it didn't. I had to change the internal chuckle heads in order to live. And isn't that true? Don't you feel that sometimes you live in a different world?
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:Like you have a different, you have a different reality than someone else. You're like, oh my God, you live in a different universe than I do. You know, I'm sure lots of people there's lots of the evidence in that in the world right now. If you take a look outside, you'll see lots of people living in different realities. Or what you know, what how you see it and how they see it is completely different. And you know what? It's okay.
Maren:That's also going on inside of us. There's a part of us that can see it one way, there's another part of us that can see it another way.
Stephanie:And if we can hold center with that inside ourselves, to not burn, cut, or poison the chuckleheads inside, but to go and get to know them because sometimes the best chuckleheads inside ourselves become the best allies for us when they make peace, when you make peace with them, is what I'm saying. They actually will upgrade your life.
Maren:Yeah.
Stephanie:And then when we have chuckleheads outside of us in our neighborhoods and in our systems and in our world, we can go, wow, I gotta go in and look at my chucklehead again because there's a chucklehead outside. No, what I'm saying is that you actually will have more space and more, you will have more space, meaning you will be able to protect your peace. And you won't get knocked off center so easily. You'll have more resiliency, you'll have more and more capacity for the challenges and the difficulty of your life without having to react. You'll be able to respond just like we talked about our last podcast: the ability to respond, you'll have energy.
Maren:Exactly. I can't I can't say it better than that.
Stephanie:So what do you think, Marin? Do you think people should look after their chuckleheads this week?
Maren:I think so. And one of the reasons that I mentioned like rearranging your furniture is because when, because I'm in this brand new space, right? It's making me be aware. And I'm saying yes to being aware. So when you rearrange your space, it, it forces an awareness, it opens the door, it opens the space, and so now when the chuckleheads show up, it's a little bit more obvious. You don't automatically go into the old habit because you've moved things in your environment. So it's a both and, there's the outer and there's the inner, and you can work the inner and change the outer, you can change the outer, which gives you an invitation to the inner. So you can play with your chuckleheads this week and challenge them and be open and maybe rearrange some furniture.
Stephanie:Yeah, or maybe not, it's up to you and allow yourself to become aware, don't be afraid of it. Yeah, because awareness actually gives you choice and it gives you freedom and it gives you energy, and it literally lifts you up above the muck and the mire. It's huge, it's a wonderful place to be. So we are often broadcast that it, you know, ignorance is bliss and it's not. So embrace the chuckleheads this week and next, and you know, throw them a party, get to know them, invite them in, let them, but don't let them, don't let them wreck your internal environment. You have the power to control that internal environment.
Maren:And we would love to hear about your chuckleheads, is you're hearing about ours. So join us at our Facebook group or in our LinkedIn group, both of them at Soulful Leaders, or leave us a note on our YouTube channel, which is also Soulful Leaders. We'll see you all in two weeks on the Soulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie:And that wraps up another episode of the Soulful Leader Podcast with your hosts, Stephanie Allen and Maren Oslac.
Maren:Thank you for listening. If you'd like to dive deeper, head over to our website at www.thesoulfulleaderpodcast.com.
Stephanie:Until next time...