The Confidence to Be Visible

We explore how a seasoned property manager rebuilt confidence through personal branding, peer learning, and smart tech choices. Jenny Lock shares candid lessons on legislation gaps, career resilience, and posting with purpose to become an attraction PM.

• moving from Queensland to Victoria and learning new laws
• managing cancer, career pivots, and returning with purpose
• lifestyle branding photos that boost trust and reach
• sharing wins and case studies without oversharing
• content ideas for PMs that educate and convert
• collaboration over competition and peer-led learning
• tech stacks, demos as training, and refresh cycles
• BDM to PM handovers that match agency models
• burnout warning signs and sustainable boundaries
• building an attraction PM profile with consistent posts

PM COLLECTIVE - GUIDE AND SHAPE AN ENJOYABLE FUTURE

We believe in making industry-leading education and support accessible to everyone. Our community is packed with free resources, expert insights, and innovative training designed to help business owners, property managers, and BDMs thrive.

This podcast is kindly sponsored by Plumbing Bros

This podcast is kindly sponsored by The Associates Co. 

The Associates Co provides fully trained professionals to assist you with scaling your property management department. They are ready to hit the ground running! Once a luxury, VA's are now a staple in every business, whether you are managing 5 properties or 500+

Head over to www.theassociatesco.com

Chapters

• 0:00 Meet Jenny Locke
• 2:47 Career Journey And Cancer Resilience
• 5:11 Moving States And Confusing Legislation
• 8:11 Why PMs Need Professional Branding
• 13:07 Posting Wins And Building Confidence
• 17:47 Content Ideas PMs Can Share
• 21:37 Evolving The PM Role And Culture
• 25:07 Tech Stacks, Demos, And Training
• 31:22 Handover Models And Leasing Choices
• 35:22 Burnout, Return, And Long-Term Goals
• 40:32 Community, Events, And Connection

Transcript

SPEAKER_02: 0:34

All right, today on the PM Collective podcast, I have got someone joining me who I don't know a lot about, but we're gonna find out together. And that is Jenny Locke. So, Jenny, welcome. Thank you. Um everyone. Now, one thing that I haven't explained to you because I didn't want it to sound all like creepy on my messages to you was when I was scrolling on TikTok, I came across a video of yours. And I quite often, when I am looking for podcast guests, I sometimes just scroll through TikTok or Instagram to see who is gonna who jumps out at me in terms of content because it's really interesting. I'm connected to so many people in property management, but when I actively go in to look for a property manager just by scrolling my feed, so not by searching, just by scrolling. It's actually not often that I come across someone and I was on TikTok and I came across your post. And that's why I reached out.

SPEAKER_01: 1:41

How funny, because I've only just recently started TikTok.

SPEAKER_02: 1:45

Okay, weird. Um, and then I and I don't want to sound stalkerish. So then I saw you on TikTok and I reached out and you said yes, you'd love to be a guest. So then I went to LinkedIn and you've got some posts on LinkedIn. So you have no idea what we're going to talk about today, but you trust you you trust me, and we're gonna we're gonna uh do this together. But the first actually, first up, if you can just give a brief intro about, you know, yourself, your career, um, and history and where you are now.

SPEAKER_01: 2:16

Okay, well, I started in Cairns actually. So it was the Queensland PM, started, you know, fell into it. And I started in reception, and then was I was office manager at one point, I was an assistant at another point, and it wasn't long after I started there actually, got diagnosed with stage three cancer. So that was one of the most supportive offices that I worked at. Still love them, still keep in contact as much as I can. But then once I got over my treatment and everything, I needed a change. And my partner, he wanted to come back to Melbourne. So we came to Victoria. Never lived here before, so I had to learn all new legislation, retrain, did that, and then I've yeah, I've been a PM and a senior PM, a team leader, a BDM. But at the moment I'm a senior PM.

SPEAKER_02: 3:13

And has that been which one's been your favorite role? Is it the actual property management or property manager?

SPEAKER_01: 3:21

Yeah, I think I love relationships. I do enjoy the BDM side of things, but I really love building strong relationships.

SPEAKER_02: 3:30

Yeah. It's it's interesting that you know, if you've been sort of in that position of management, there are definitely some people, obviously, like yourself, that go sort of back into that senior PM role. And one of the ladies that's with me, she did exactly that. She sort of went in and sort of did, you know, the head of department or or more of a staff management, but has come back to the property management because that's where their skill set is, and that's like really that passion. So it's sounds like it's the same with you.

SPEAKER_01: 3:59

Yeah, I yeah, I love helping people. So that's my biggest thing, whether it's a team member or whether it's a renter or an owner, you know. I just love it.

SPEAKER_02: 4:09

And and how good as well, like I love property management from the point of view that it meets lots of different personality types, but also sort of what you've mentioned with moving from state to state, that you've been able to, you know, get a refresher on legislation. But how lucky are we to be in a Korea that you can move around if you wished?

SPEAKER_01: 4:30

Yeah, no, it's great. It'd be even better if we the whole country had the same legislation.

SPEAKER_02: 4:35

But you know what? This is something that I've spoken about before. It drives me nuts why we don't have the same legislation. I mean, it's confusing for our investors that are becoming multiple landlords. I I don't understand why logistically we can't just have the same, the same.

SPEAKER_01: 4:52

Yeah, I don't get it either. Like, you know, like in Queensland when I was up there, it was, you know, eight days in arrears and bang, you're hitting notices to vacate. Here in Victoria, it's it's like 15 days and you're sending out notice to vacates. And, you know, and then people don't understand, landlords don't understand that we can't force tenants in Victoria, or not force, but we can't, yeah, literally, we can't force them to sign another lease agreement after the first one ends. And you know, they don't understand that if they've come from New South Wales or even in Queensland. You know, when when I first started in Queensland, we'd issue a notice to vacate with a lease renewal, and if they didn't sign the lease, well then they moved out. Yeah, you can't do that here.

SPEAKER_02: 5:35

No, no. Um, now I want to talk about the first thing that I loved about your profile, and I think more people should do it, is I love the fact that you went and got some professional branding images. Tell me about what made you go down that road because it's something that I wish all property managers do. I actually agree.

SPEAKER_01: 5:57

I was always too scared to do it. And look, directors don't encourage it either. It's it's all about sales, but I think we are consistently managing the biggest asset that they have, not only landlords, but you know, for owners and directors. Why shouldn't we? Why shouldn't we get professional shots and why shouldn't we be promoting ourselves? Like it's it's gonna help the agency. In fact, I reckon it'll be really good if directors, you know, maybe six months in when probation's finished, said, Great, you finished your probation, we're really happy with everything. Here, we're gonna send you off and get a professional branding photo shoot. Yeah, you know, get some props, do it all, have some fun, do it with someone, do it on your own. I actually did mine with a girlfriend of mine, Callista.

SPEAKER_02: 6:52

Yeah, excellent. Because I find that when people have got the professional branding shots, and when I say professional branding, what I'm referring to is not the headshots, we're talking about more what I would say lifestyle images. So they could be you having a drink, a cup of coffee, or walking somewhere, but definitely photos that have variety, standing up, sitting on a couch, that style. Um, and they they make you feel a lot more comfortable about posting on social media. So it's 100% a benefit to the agency that you're working with, but it just helps when you are, you know, doing oh, there's so many benefits. There's benefits of when you, if you're doing a blog and you're doing a you know, a photo for that, if you needing a to do a post with text over the top, you don't you wouldn't use a headshot. And a lot of people are less likely to want to use a personal photo as well because they try to keep it all separate. So this is the way that you can sort of balance it and and and do it now. When were yours done? November. Okay, excellent. So I I'm assuming that we've got a you've got a plan that we're gonna see more of them because I've seen them all on that one, and um, and we'll talk about that in a minute. But how many, how many photos did you get in your shoot?

SPEAKER_01: 8:15

Oh the literally the photographer took so many, but we just went through she was great. Like she had a studio, we just took props, she took a lot of photos, but we went through and went, nope, nope, nope. And you know, we have done, we have separated some of the shots, and then we've I thought, you know what, I'm gonna celebrate Callista because I love what she's doing. So I'm gonna do a joint, like put a joint one off up without separating us, yeah. And I I swear my LinkedIn has blown up, my socials have all blown up. I'm getting people like coming and wanting to connect with me, and it's it's been a real I don't know, like we should all be doing it.

SPEAKER_02: 9:02

Isn't that incredible? Like that you've actually noticed a difference from using them.

SPEAKER_01: 9:07

Yeah, well, I've just and I've only just started doing it, yeah, and I've had over 40 people asked to connect with me on LinkedIn. Wow, I know, I know. I've had I've had 500 views like on Instagram and Facebook and stuff like that, and I'm like, why haven't we been doing this earlier? Why why have I been so afraid? There's nothing to be scared about.

SPEAKER_02: 9:32

Yeah, no, 100. That's an incredible case study for people to take from this. Now, the now I'm just trying, I'm actually just trying to find a post because I want to just talk about something, and it's it's a little bit where is it? It is a little bit more of a of a funeral post, but you've got it on your profile, so I want to sort of talk about it. And I am I scaring you now? No, I'm an open book. I so I'm just trying to find it so it's the right one. But there was a post and it was something about how you were hesitant to post, but your husband encouraged you to put it online and just you know to be a support to you, to say, you know, Jenny, you should be proud of this, you should be putting this and letting everyone know. So why do we find that, and there are so many people that in a similar boat where they they don't post or share things that are so good? Like I know that you've recently done your was it your diploma that you've recently done? Yeah, fully licensed. So yeah, beautiful. So, you know, why why do people in general, particularly property managers, why why do they feel like why do they hold back from going and and and what was sort of going through your mind with the confidence of putting that online? And I only sort of like I said, say it because I know that your post had said my husband, you know, told me that I should be celebrating it. So can you talk a bit through us through that a lot because so many people are in the same boat?

SPEAKER_01: 11:41

I think you know, like you work hard, you you go and do your license, and that's no small feat. It's actually it's quite full on, and I got it, but I just I don't know, I didn't want to share it. I felt like, oh, who cares? Who'd want to know? Like it's not, you know, I'm putting myself out there. What if people then come back and say, oh, big deal or whatever? But yeah, it was my husband that encouraged me. He said, You should be proud of that. Like you've worked hard to achieve that, and it hasn't like it's been a long time coming. He said, get it up there, like share the news. So I did, and the feedback was just so nice, like really nice, and it gave me confidence, I guess, to start thinking about being a bit more active, you know, on socials and and and doing it again.

SPEAKER_02: 12:32

And I mean, I can promise you no one would have posted and said, Who cares?

SPEAKER_01: 12:37

No, no, but this these are the things that go on in your head, don't they? That you sort of think, oh, no one cares about me. Like, I'm just a property manager. And do you know what I hate that? I hate that I'm just a property manager because it's not just a job, it it really is we're providing the best service because it's the most essential thing. It's it's having someone having a roof over their head, like yeah, you know, it's big, it's massive, and it should be celebrated.

SPEAKER_02: 13:07

Yeah, and the and I want people to hear that because I think that a lot of people also see social media posts and think to themselves, oh, you know, it's easy for them to do it because they've got a nice photo, or it's easy for them to do it because they're more confident than I am. So I do want to celebrate when someone does find it hard to do because you're lucky because you have got your husband who has been a supporter for you. But there are people out there that don't have those supporters at home, so are less likely to do it. So it's sort of like they need to hear these stories to know that that thought is a very normal thought to have, but you can push through it and you will gain more confidence every time that you do it. So I think that that for me was a big takeaway. But it was great that you actually that you actually shared that on the post as well. Like I have to remember to be more vulnerable more often. But you know what? That's that's sort of what what gets noticed as well. And like that, and you know, out of the posts that you've done, that was the one that stuck with me because yeah, and and so just yeah, giving you that feedback that I really love that because I am finding as well on social media the and it takes confidence to do it, but people really are paying for an opinion and for vulnerability and for that personality, because we are in a world where there's so much AI and playing it safe, and it's going to become more obvious, all of that. So the minute that there is someone that does showcase a personal experience, a personal story, or a personal opinion on something, that's going to start standing out a lot more. So I'd love to see more people do it. And I feel like LinkedIn is one of the best platforms to do it because it's a really mature platform, it's respectful, and people do celebrate those things where TikTok not so much. So, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 15:18

That's true. That that's really true. But I also want to get to the point where I'm actually talking and making videos, you know, whether they're tongue in cheek or whether they're just like information, whatever it may be, or it could be that, oh my gosh, has anyone felt so crappy today because you know, this has happened or that's happened? You know, has anyone else been in that position? I'd love to like inspire just one person, even to make them go, you know what, if she can do it, I can do it. Because let's face it, I'm not some 20-something year old with a fantastic figure and what I'm older, I'm mature, you know, and I think it's harder for our generation to go instead of comparing ourselves, just go, you know what, I'm staying in my lane, you know, everyone else love them, they're beautiful, get it, everything like that, celebrate them, but I can do it too.

SPEAKER_02: 16:18

Yeah, I love that. I love that so much. I also think as well that you know, you and I have been in the industry for a long time. And I think it's really important for that wisdom and that experience to be showcased for younger people who are either new in the industry or getting in the industry as well, and just providing that that safety, I guess, that you know, it is a it is a long-term career, it served you well. You've had a you know great property management life, and you know, these younger people can too as well. So I just think, yeah, showcasing that to the younger ones and yeah, the the older generation, um encouraging the younger one, but the experience and knowledge that that you know that you will have to provide is just it's just so important. And we don't showcase enough in property management. I want to talk about as well, just your thoughts on like BDMs, business owners, they all post, you know, a lot because I see I feel like they've probably got more of a sales y role, they're more driven, there's probably more content in that space. But property managers, including my own team, my property managers do not post. And I don't think it's it's for any other reason, but I just don't think they know what would a property manager post. So would you like to sort of maybe share? I don't know if you've got a plan or not, but a plan of like what you're thinking you might like to start posting this year now that you know you are sort of going down the journey of you know being more active on socials.

SPEAKER_01: 17:59

Yeah. Gosh, was just starting to jot down notes the other night of different ideas. As soon as I pop into my head, I'm now putting them down on like just on my phone, on my notes section, and just it could be a one-liner, and you can turn that into a post really easily. You know, it's not it's not hard. Once you start thinking about might be one little topic, it could be, you know, why don't directors pay for, you know, professional marketing shots for a property manager after after six months? I could turn that into a huge post. You know, it's just it could be, you know, oh, I came across this at a at a property, you know. Has anyone else ever experienced this? And this is this is what I did to resolve the issue, and you know, it resulted in this and this, and you know, whether it worked or whether it didn't work, I think it's really good that people can get to hear that and see that and go, oh gosh, I didn't think of doing that. Because I think property managers need to share that more because so that there doesn't need to be secrets about what works and what doesn't work. We should be all supporting each other and you know, educating people.

SPEAKER_02: 19:18

Yeah, and the case studies is is really great, and especially if you ever have a real curly situation. One curly situation that I've just uh someone called me up about. I didn't really have the exact answer, but it was um what to do if an owner doesn't want to evict a tenant based on you know bad behavior. You know, what responsibility does the strider company have, or what can the strider company do to enforce that to happen? And so I gave a bit of advice and gave a network of where, but it was just a bit of a tricky situation. So for me, like it's not one that I would be able to talk about now because it's it's you know, it's it's something that's relevant, you wouldn't want people to see it, but it's definitely something six months down the track. I could put it in my diary to say provide a case study on this situation that came up. Because that's probably the biggest thing that I'm finding I hear from people is they say to me, if you talk about a situation, what oh if you talk about a situation, aren't you worried that the person or the party to that situation sees your post? So for example, you might have an owner call up and want to, I don't know, reduce fees or something like that, and you do a post about it, and people say, Well, aren't you worried they're gonna see that? The number one, I do it all the time, and I've never had any owners say, Why did you post about that? Number two, I always recommend that it's done just a little bit after and not maybe on the same day. Probably my recommendation, and the third thing I would say is doing a simple swap out of he and she. So it's still the same story. So if it was a male that you spoke to, but you went but you said another thing she said da-da-da, yeah, it sort of throws people off. That would be my three tips, but I don't know if that's something that you know that has you know bothered you in the past or worried you.

SPEAKER_01: 21:18

I definitely wouldn't talk about anything as it's happening. I think you know that's not really giving out the vibe that you want because it could be still emotional as well. You wanna you wanna just be able to talk to people just like you and I are talking, but in words or maybe it's a video or whatever. So it's relaxed, it's comfortable, you feel confident, you're not gonna say the wrong thing, and you're just yeah, gonna share information, really.

SPEAKER_02: 21:50

Yeah, that that will help information that will help someone else in a similar position. Can we have a quick chat about your your current role in property management and how you how your thoughts or how you see it evolving in the future, the property management role? Or are you a property manager that loves to hold on to traditional methods? Just some thoughts and opinions around that.

SPEAKER_01: 22:18

Yeah, I actually like change. I I embrace change, you know, whether it be a new platform or a new program, I want to go and learn about it. And I, you know, if it's gonna be a benefit, gonna make things easier, you know, I'm all for it. And I actually think our industry has been going through a lot of changes, and I I feel like, well, I feel very aligned to like be posting more and doing all that sort of stuff and becoming a more of a voice and encouraging people. I love collaboration over competition, and I'm actually embracing that even more, and I think that's how we need to be the industry, it needs to change and grow in that way, rather than going, oh, this is mine, I don't want to share. And and what if they take one of our properties or anything like that? Like, you know, I think if someone is a better fit in the end for someone else, why would you want to hang on to that? Or yeah, I just think there's a whole shift happening.

SPEAKER_02: 23:20

I call it peer-led learning, and I am very much an advocate on on on um the peer-to-peer learning. And peer-to-peer learning is done through this podcast where it is learning from other people in the same space. It's also learned through. Have you been to one of the coffee convos yet? No, I haven't.

SPEAKER_01: 23:41

Yeah, well, I'm probably I'm on the like northern western side of of Melbourne. And I know that they've been probably more so on the other, but I can well, maybe you could start one for me if you'd like to be the host.

SPEAKER_02: 23:55

We'll uh chat later about that. So the but through coffee conversations, I find that peer-to-peer learning is really relevant in that space. And what I feel is a bit of a well, maybe not a trend, but I think it should be a trend, is more of those intimate groups because personally, like with the coffee catch-ups, there's sometimes there might be, you know, three people or five people, sometimes there's 20 people. I have always got the most value when it's a smaller group of five. Five people for me is like ideal because it's enough intimacy to have really good conversations. It can be about products, it can be about reviews, it can be about case studies. And you really get to share and get support when that group size is generally under that 10, I'm finding. And I feel like we just learn so much from, like you said, from each other. So peer-to-peer learning, it costs you nothing, and it's a free option. So definitely for property managers listening that don't maybe have support from their business owner with regards to a training budget, or maybe their office doesn't do training. And it's uh no disrespect to them. There's just some agencies that don't. And I was one of those agencies for many, many years as well. But I also think that property managers should take responsibility for their own personal development, just like you've gone and got your photos done and invested in that. And then but going to coffee convos, listening to podcasts, it costs you nothing to do those, and you can learn so much, which is going to be a direct benefit for your business. So people should definitely get out of the headspace of, oh, well, my company doesn't do it. Because there is opportunities out there.

SPEAKER_01: 25:44

Yeah. Well, you know what? And I probably used to be in that headspace, you know, a few years ago, where I thought, you know, your employer should be doing this and that. And I've totally changed my whole way of thinking in the last year, especially in the last probably five months, where I think, you know what, I need to take responsibility. You know, I've booked myself into some training that's external to work, you know, taking an annual leave day for it. I've paid for it myself. More PMs, I reckon, should be doing it. If you don't invest in yourself, you can't give back to your employer either, as well, I don't think.

SPEAKER_02: 26:22

Yeah, 100%. So the in the last 12 months with oh, are you? I mean, are you happy to share your tech stack at work? Like what products you your company uses? Well, we're just changing. We're about to change. Are you allowed to announce what you're changing to? I don't know. Well, you don't have to say if you don't want to say, but maybe just t tell us about the other ones then.

SPEAKER_01: 26:49

I'm my favorite's property me. Yeah. It I love it. It's a no-brainer. Yeah, but that's not what I'm using at the moment, and that's not what we're moving to. So it's exciting. It is exciting. Apparently, this is a real game changer. So that's probably given away enough clues as to what it might be.

SPEAKER_02: 27:11

Yes, I know what one it will be. Excellent. And I always say to everyone, you have to give it three months. You have to give product any new product three months before you whinge too much about it because there's always time of uh where it becomes a bit frustrating, change of um product. So that that will no doubt happen, but I'm sure it'll be for the better. What about any other software that you would use in terms of maintenance or inspections and CRMs and things like that?

SPEAKER_01: 27:39

I'm a big inspection express girl. I do love it. I find it so user-friendly and everything like that. I I would love to use Tarpe. I haven't used that one yet, but I've used in the past, I've used something years ago in Queensland. I was in a very forward-thinking office there, and they used what's called maintenance manager back then. I don't know if you've yeah, yeah. Loved it, it was great. It it was yeah, it showed you exactly where everything was at. You had pie charts and everything, it was very visually appealing, and there was never any issues. Like you would you were you would aim to be green on everything. Um I think things like that, when your tech stack does that and supports you really well, it makes your job so much easier. When it's hard to find, like if you've got a tech stack that it's hard to find, where am I at with routines for the month, or where am I at with my maintenance? If it's not easy to find and if it's not visually appealing, things can drop off.

SPEAKER_02: 28:43

Yeah, yeah. What about your your like for inspections for not inspections, like for home opens and applications? What are you using?

SPEAKER_01: 28:55

Oh, I love IRA. Yeah, I don't think you can go past it for like your inspections, uploading, you know, all of that sort of thing. It's just got so many great elements to it.

SPEAKER_02: 29:07

Yeah. Yeah, excellent. No, it's it's good. I I find that I just love hearing what people are using in case you're using something that you know I haven't heard of before, or just to find out what people's tech stack is. I I heard something a while ago, and I don't know how accurate it is, but that people should should or people do change softwares every five years, which surprised me because I was like, I couldn't think of anything worse than changing products every five years. I don't plan to, but I thought that was interesting. Um what I do recommend property managers to do or agencies to do, though, is to always know what's available. And I am someone that will always say yes to a demo, even if I know there is no chance in hell that I'm ever going to be changing over. But I think it's really important to know what is available so that if at any stage you do have a pain point in your business, you know exactly who to call and you know exactly what other features are available out there should you need to consider a change. I think a lot of people don't do that enough. So if that's something that people can take away, I would love to see them say yes to demos. And I am pretty like honest up front, I will say to someone, listen, I don't have any intention of changing. However, I'd be very open to still doing a demo with you to see, you know, what features it has. And then it just makes it clear they're not the people are still very happy to do a demo for you, but you're not leading them down the garden path either. So that's something that I would love to see more people do as well.

SPEAKER_01: 30:39

Yeah, no, I I actually agree because it's like training, but on tech.

unknown: 30:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 30:46

Why wouldn't why wouldn't you do a demo?

SPEAKER_02: 30:48

Yeah. One of my friends who's a business owner, I remember her telling me this, and she also asks the tech companies of products that she's already got in-house, but she will often ask them to do another demo for her, as if she was a prospecting client, so that she can stay up to date with how they're demoing to other agencies to make sure that she is up to date with all the features available and using it to capacity. And I thought to myself, that is such a great idea to go and do another product update or demo on your tech stack you've already got, just to double check it all. Yeah, no, I actually think that makes good sense. It does. I know, I know. People just don't do that. So that would be definitely, yeah, something to consider and a good way as well for people to use that for their staff meetings. So it's it's you know, if you're stuck with ideas for staff meetings, then then yeah, then getting a refresher on the products is good. It's it's it's a a space where I feel like when you have a team and your team's using, let's just use property me, for example. Your team's using property me, and then you know, you've got a new person that starts, and then that training happens in-house, and you know, you train the neck that person into how to use it, and then over time, you know, and you leave it, another person comes on, and what happens is all that training of property me, for example, is all being handed down, and things get missed and not taught correctly, and it's a little bit like Chinese whispers, you know what I mean? But with training, and so that's why those refreshers are quite important for your existing staff, so yeah, that when new people start, they're being given up-to-date information.

SPEAKER_01: 32:40

Yeah, exactly. And even like clicking on their little alerts, we're going, oh, this is updated, go in and and you know, have a look and have a play, and this is what it does. Like, how many times do we just go, oh yeah, whatever, I'm too busy and click butt through it, and then someone else says, Oh, have you done this? And no, what's that?

SPEAKER_02: 33:02

Yeah, no, absolutely. And to finish off, last question for you what, if you have any, are your sort of personal or professional goals for the next six months? Do you have anything that you're working on?

SPEAKER_01: 33:14

Or yes, I do. I think one of I guess one of my goals is I want to become an attraction property manager for wherever I'm working, like currently, that'd be great. I don't want to be the BDM. Happily hand it all over to the BDM to get everything signed up and and whatever, but you know, people get to like no, trust me, and then yeah, it just helps support the business that are paying my wages, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 33:46

So why that and not the front-facing BDM? You've sort of said that in a way that you love managing the properties that would love to still people to want you to manage them, but pass it on.

SPEAKER_01: 34:00

Well, I don't mind someone else, you know, bringing the business in, signing them up, getting them all set up, and then me running with it, you know, once once we've got a tenant or I'm the one that's actually helping finding them a tenant, sorry, renter now. Um too old school, you know, and I'm and then I get to nurture them and bring them on because we do have a dedicated, you know, BDM in that space. I'm not about treading on anyone's toes. I'm happy to share the love. Yeah. Um, you know, and yeah, then they get to I might get to work with them or I may not. It depends where they are situated because the agency that I work for is property management focused. It's huge.

SPEAKER_02: 34:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 34:43

So we've each got different areas that we work on. So if someone likes my post, I may not be able to look after them. You know, it may be someone else that I can introduce them to in the team that isn't on socials that I know is just as good a property manager as one I am.

SPEAKER_02: 35:00

Yeah, excellent. What was I gonna ask in regards to that? The oh, what what is sorry, last this will be the last question? What is your BDM handover process in your office? How does the handover work and when when does a property manager get involved in that?

SPEAKER_01: 35:15

I guess it depends on what they're working on. So they can do be doing really big projects and we don't get them until they're leased. Okay. So they do all of that, and then we get them handed over once they're leased and and run with it then. If it's a smaller, you know, just a house or something somewhere else. I'm a bit hands-on. So I've got a couple that have been bought into the business near where I live, and I'm like, I'll do the opens. I'm happy to speak to the owner if you're happy for me too, and I just run with it. So yeah, it's it's a little bit different depending, yeah, what area it's in.

SPEAKER_02: 35:56

Yeah, okay. So so sometimes the BDM does the leasing, and sometimes you would do the leasing.

SPEAKER_01: 36:02

With the big projects, yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 36:04

Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that that I think I what I've found from asking that question to you know lots of people is that every single way generally works and it works for that agency. And I haven't seen any clear comparison to a good handover versus a not so good handover. Uh, every handover's been good, it's just whatever works for the agency. But I think there's also other factors as well. Like, I mean, if there's a lot of properties available for for rent, it's really hard for a BDM to be doing all the leasing. And then, but there's also like with our office, there's a lot of trust that there's so there would have to be a lot of trust with putting tenants in on behalf of a property manager as well, because I know that my team, they love doing their own leasing, and we don't even have a leasing consultant for that reason. They they like to know exactly who's going in, meet with them beforehand, do the home opens. So that's what works for us.

SPEAKER_01: 37:07

Yeah, but it's it's really individual, isn't it? Like I mean, I've done it from lots of different ways. So I just adapt wherever I'm working, I just adapt and and run with it. It's not my business, it's their business. It's worked really well for them, and yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 37:24

Yeah, amazing. I so delighted to have met you online and now sort of in person or yes, still online. And I really, really do look forward to seeing all your posts and and what you do with your social media. I am now a fan of Jenny. So I'll be making sure that I like all your posts every time I see them. So I really appreciate you, you know, sharing your your experience, but also your you know, the vulnerability as well that you've had and and what you're sort of working towards. I just think it's just so so important for people to hear because there are so many people just like yourself that you know, making a decision of where they're going in their career. Am I going to start posting online? How am I going to do it? And how's my support network? So it's just it's really um refreshing to hear. So I appreciate you jumping on today and having a chat.

SPEAKER_01: 38:15

Something I didn't tell you, Ashley, is I actually nearly completely left the career. Nearly left. I left for stepped out for a few months. So yeah, when I came back in around September-ish, I was too scared to jump into an office. So I just wanted to temp. Well, where I was temping, I ended up staying.

SPEAKER_02: 38:37

So was that only recently then? So like last September. Yeah. And okay, and then was that was that like was it burnout? What what was the stepping out for?

SPEAKER_01: 38:49

I was in Yeah, probably burnout, to be honest. I just yeah, thought I just can't do this anymore. Walked away. Four months later I went, I'm coming back. I miss it. I miss the relationships because the role that I stepped into it was completely different. And yeah, I really miss the relationships that you get in property management.

SPEAKER_02: 39:14

I hear that story. I hear that story so often, but not generally from people that have left, like you know, left and I don't know whether you went into a different sort of role or career or not then, but people that have actually changed careers, but then always come back.

SPEAKER_01: 39:31

Yeah, no, uh this is this is what I love doing. I love being with people. That's why, like, yeah, I'm quite happy being a property manager, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 39:42

Yeah, so good. Well, I really look forward to seeing your content and everything that you do, and um, all the best for 2026. And I'm sure I'll I'll actually be seeing you anyway, won't I, in um in Melbourne? So I look forward to um something like that. I I have got so much travel for the next three months or February to August nearly of the year. Still not sure how I'm gonna do it with the kids, but I'll figure that out later. But yeah, no, I look forward to catching up with you then. And there was someone else, Pat Pat Mears as well. I think he's coming, I think he's coming to the Melbourne one. And it's funny, he emailed me the other day and he do you know Pat from Rubik's, such a cool guy. And he emailed me the other day and he said, Ash, just so you know, I'll I'll finally get to see you in person in in Melbourne. And I was like, Are you kidding me? Have we not met before he's in person? He's like, no, and it's so weird because I feel like I have You know them. I I feel like I know him absolutely, and I'm I'm I swear to God we have met before, but he says we haven't. And that is a classic example as well of social media and how I feel so connected to have had met him, and we haven't.

SPEAKER_01: 40:53

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_02: 40:55

That's a feeling we want everyone to have, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01: 40:57

Yeah. I actually had that feeling myself. Just towards the end of last year, I was made finalist at PMP Awards night. And I got to meet some people that I have known on social media for a while. And I ended up sitting on other on my table and I was like, oh, this is just so cool. Like finally get to meet face to face, and yet I feel like I already know you.

SPEAKER_02: 41:19

Yeah, absolutely. It's great. That's um my favorite thing about Instagram and LinkedIn and all of that. So I look very much forward to um seeing you in February. Thank you so much for sharing your story with us today. And um anytime you feel like there's a topic you'd like to talk about on the podcast, feel free to hit me up and I'd love to have you on again.

SPEAKER_01: 41:40

All right, beautiful. Thanks so much, thank you. All right, see ya.