Episode 21: Show Notes
Today's guest is the versatile, forward-thinking, and incredibly talented Cristina Spinei, who is a classical composer and performer. A pianist since the age of nine, she has a Bachelor’s and Master's of Music degree from the Julliard School and has been described as a composer of minimalist music for orchestra, ballet, film, and NFTs. She has been commissioned by Nashville Ballet, New York Choreographic Institute, Pacific Northwest Ballet, and several others. Today, we are lucky to have Cristina on the show to chat about how she got started with releasing her music in the NFT space, talking about how she chose this path and what it means to her to be able to release music in this way, and her top tips for new NFT musicians. She shares how she works with listing and selling, how she feels about the community culture in this world of the arts, some pros and cons of being one of the few classical musicians, and why her spirit animal is a fox! We also talk about the best pizza she's ever had, coding, her top spaces to close, collector's perks, and so much more! Tune in today.
Key Points From This Episode:
● Introductory comments about hardware wallets and the trajectory of being a musician.
● What Cristina thought when she heard about music NFTs and how they fit her work.
● Cristina's thoughts on being a musician and how she chose this path.
● Fostering her interest in coding and why her spirit animal is a fox.
● Her love of pizza, and why her mom's recipe is the best!
● Some great advice Cristina received on always doing your best for others.
● Reflections on the community aspect of artists in the NFT space.
● Advice for new NFT artists on learning about who came before you.
● Cristina asks NorCal’s advice for people just entering this world.
● Hear about her journey with listing and selling.
● Talking about the difficulties of pricing as one of the few classical musicians.
● Her thoughts on being near the beach, her family, and New York.
● Where you can find and listen to her work, and which spaces she has grown to dislike.
● Questions for NorCal on the future of music NFTs, perks, his favorite pieces, and more!
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
Episode 21: Show Notes
Today's guest is the versatile, forward-thinking, and incredibly talented Cristina Spinei, who is a classical composer and performer. A pianist since the age of nine, she has a Bachelor’s and Master's of Music degree from the Julliard School and has been described as a composer of minimalist music for orchestra, ballet, film, and NFTs. She has been commissioned by Nashville Ballet, New York Choreographic Institute, Pacific Northwest Ballet, and several others. Today, we are lucky to have Cristina on the show to chat about how she got started with releasing her music in the NFT space, talking about how she chose this path and what it means to her to be able to release music in this way, and her top tips for new NFT musicians. She shares how she works with listing and selling, how she feels about the community culture in this world of the arts, some pros and cons of being one of the few classical musicians, and why her spirit animal is a fox! We also talk about the best pizza she's ever had, coding, her top spaces to close, collector's perks, and so much more! Tune in today.
Key Points From This Episode:
● Introductory comments about hardware wallets and the trajectory of being a musician.
● What Cristina thought when she heard about music NFTs and how they fit her work.
● Cristina's thoughts on being a musician and how she chose this path.
● Fostering her interest in coding and why her spirit animal is a fox.
● Her love of pizza, and why her mom's recipe is the best!
● Some great advice Cristina received on always doing your best for others.
● Reflections on the community aspect of artists in the NFT space.
● Advice for new NFT artists on learning about who came before you.
● Cristina asks NorCal’s advice for people just entering this world.
● Hear about her journey with listing and selling.
● Talking about the difficulties of pricing as one of the few classical musicians.
● Her thoughts on being near the beach, her family, and New York.
● Where you can find and listen to her work, and which spaces she has grown to dislike.
● Questions for NorCal on the future of music NFTs, perks, his favorite pieces, and more!
Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:
EPISODE 21
[INTRODUCTION]
[0:00:32.3] NORCAL: Hey everyone, welcome to the next episode of NorCal and Shill. Today’s guest is Cristina Spinei. You can find her on Twitter @cristinaspinei. You can find her on Instagram @cristinaspinei. Her website is www.cristinaspinei.com She has been described as a composer of minimalist music for orchestra, ballet, film and NFTs. She’s been a pianist since the age of nine, she has a bachelor’s and masters of music degree from the Julliard School. Her albums are, Music for Dance, Taccota Classics, Ex Voto, Five O’clock Waltz and There I Was.
You can find these on her website, christinaspinei.com/works. She has been commissioned by Nashville Ballet, New York Choreographic Institute, Pacific Northwest Ballet and several others. Everyone, please welcome, Cristina Spinei.
[INTERVIEW]
[0:01:48.4] NORCAL: Hey Cristina, welcome to the podcast, how are you doing today?
[0:01:51.6] CS: Hi, I’m great, thanks so much for having me.
[0:01:54.7] NORCAL: Well, I’m glad you can take some time out of your day and spend it with me, it’s going to be great.
[0:01:59.8] CS: I’m excited about it.
[0:02:02.9] NORCAL: It’ll be fun. How’s the weather over there?
[0:02:05.5] CS: It is a rainy day, which I kind of love because I like to just stay in and work and I’m not tempted to go out. It keeps me honest and working but yeah, I’m here with an endless supply of Icelandic coffee, which my sister just brought me, my sister lives in Iceland.
They have the most beautifully flavored coffees. I don’t know, I don’t normally like flavored coffee but this one is called Christmas blend and the caramel one, it’s amazing. I’m just all setup to work on a Friday.
[0:02:46.5] NORCAL: To the grindstone.
[0:02:47.8] CS: Yes, always.
[0:02:51.6] NORCAL: Do you have a hardware wallet?
[0:02:53.7] CS: I do. I have a ledger, I need to be better about using it, I don’t so much but after we talk, maybe I’ll re-evaluate some things.
[0:03:07.3] NORCAL: All right.
[0:03:07.7] CS: Yeah, I don’t know how often people transfer things onto their hardware wallets but I think I should be better about it.
[0:03:16.3] NORCAL: Often.
[0:03:17.3] CS: Yeah, is this like a weekly thing for you?
[0:03:19.6] NORCAL: No, you know, actually, I have my hardware wallet hooked up directly to Metamask so I don’t have to transfer it, it just goes directly.
[0:03:28.0] CS: Oh, okay, yeah, I should re-evaluate some things.
[0:03:30.5] NORCAL: It’s a little easier.
[0:03:32.0] CS: That’s a good idea.
[0:03:32.4] NORCAL: I mean, you can transfer once a week, that’s fine, it should be fine.
[0:03:38.0] CS: Yeah, I think if I got into a schedule of doing it, not like, “Oh, I’ll do it tomorrow” because then, it just never gets done and it should probably be done.
[0:03:47.7] NORCAL: Yeah, it should.
[0:03:50.4] CS: Well, this is my inspiration, I have to work at it, so thank you.
[0:03:55.8] NORCAL: What were your first thoughts when you heard about NFTs?
[0:04:00.2] CS: Oh my goodness, when I first heard about NFTs, I thought, this is the beginning of the rest of my career. It was something that I was looking for since I got into music, just the opportunity and the freedom that the NFTs provide an artist to directly reach out to an audience, directly reach out to collectors and not have to go through institutions for approval.
I have had a very – being the classical music world is tricky because there are a lot of grants that you have to apply for, a lot of people that you have to know, what college or University you go to matters. There’s just a lot of things that depend on these institutions. I mean, I knew that going into being a musician and to being a composer but I always thought there was a better way of making my living, rather than –
For a composer, the career trajectory is, you get your undergrad, masters and your doctoral degree and then you’re expected to teach at a conservatory or a university and then you go on sabatical and write a lot of music and get grants and things like this. It’s all very network-y and it’s great for some people but for me, I thought that was a very insular way of looking at music and I always just wanted to bring my music to as many people as possible and not have to rely on other people to get my work played.
I was always looking for ways to kind of be an entrepreneur and reach out to people on my own without having to deal with everything else that goes along with the classical music world. When I heard about NFTs, I’m like, “This is the way forward for me.” I’m really excited that I’m able to just put my work out there and have people respond to it. When I first got into them, it was last summer, it was a little bit difficult for me to find a path as a musician.
I remember my husband, he is not a professional artist but he just released something on Rarible and I’m like, what is this Rarible? Then I dove in and I just looked at every possible artist that I could. I'm like, “Huh, this is interesting, there are a lot of skulls, there’s lot of art with like Ethereum symbols, what is this weird world? This is amazing.” Then I found other platforms, I found Superrare and then I think Nifty Gateway but as far as music went, there was nothing that I could really find, there wasn’t so much.
The first musician that I discovered was Studio Nouveau. They had an album out and I thought, “Wow, these people are amazing, they’re pioneers.” Because it was so hard back then to find a platform to release music and I feel like there really wasn’t an audience for music NFTs too because it was a little bit early. And then, in the fall, I think [RIC 0:07:04] released an EP first or an album and I’m like, “Okay, this is possible.” But I still hadn’t figured out how I was going to release my music.
I decided to reach out to some artists whose work I really respected, and the first one was Vans’s Design and I’m like, “Hey, I really love your work, I think our aesthetic is complementary, do you want to ever put music with your art?” and so that’s how I started to release some music, by collaborating with visual artists. And then, I think it wasn’t until the spring that we had a lot of works and mint songs and all these music, NFT platforms came about. Before, I was just trying to find my way and trying to carve my niche into this crazy new world.
[0:07:53.1] NORCAL: Well, I’m glad you’re trying to figure it out and are figuring it out.
[0:07:58.0] CS: Thanks. It’s funny, looking back, it’s so different in like a year ago, nobody was talking about music NFTs or not a lot of people were. It was a very niche thing.
[0:08:07.8] NORCAL: Yeah, I still feel it’s still undervalued.
[0:08:11.1] CS: Yeah, I think it is. I’m not exactly sure why at the moment, it’s also funny because being in a – I went to school in New York and we were always comparing concert halls to art galleries and museums. We’re like, “How come all these damn people go to museums and art galleries and there are so many people in the concerts. It’s a little bit older and not quite as many people?”
I feel like the same thing with NFTs, it’s like, for the visual art, there’s so many people interested in it and music, it’s taking its time to build. I feel like there are real life parallels going on there.
[0:08:47.3] NORCAL: Yeah. Well, I guess you can’t lounge around and have a drink. In chat, while you're listening to, in a concert hall.
[0:08:55.7] CS: Yeah, no. There were a few spots that were really cool, there was LPR [inaudible 0:09:01.5] that you could – it was like a bar and there were great concerts and Joe’s Pub, places like that, you know? Yeah, you can’t watch the New York Phil with a Rose in hand, it wouldn’t work. They should reconsider this though.
[0:09:18.3] NORCAL: They should.
[0:09:20.4] CS: You know, in Nashville, we can.
[0:09:21.9] NORCAL: Yeah.
[0:09:24.0] CS: The Nashville Symphony are allowed to bring booze into the hall.
[0:09:25.9] NORCAL: Oh really?
[0:09:27.1] CS: Yeah. They allow drinks, no problem. People should learn from Nashville Symphony.
[0:09:34.4] NORCAL: They should, loosen up a little bit.
[0:09:38.9] CS: Loosen up a little bit, yeah, no, I don’t think so.
[0:09:44.3] NORCAL: I know you’ve been a pianist for… since you were nine but how did you choose this path or what brought you to it?
[0:09:54.5] CS: I kind of always knew that I wanted to be an artist of some kind. I was just always – I’ve always gravitated toward music. I don’t know why, I don’t know, people say music chose them and it sounds a little bit corny but I really feel like it did. I have vivid memories of being three years old and being over my neighbor’s house, they had a Baldwin upright piano. I remember trying to make beautiful sounds on it but being so young, of course, kids are just like bang on the piano and you don’t know what you're doing.
I remember being frustrated, just want this to sound like I know it can sound and it was this huge mystery for me to solve but I was kind of late in starting lessons. Nine is like – it’s kind of late for professional musicians. I was in a very serious ballet school and I thought I wanted to be a ballerina. I loved to dance, I love dancing to Chopin and Mozart and all the beautiful music, Tchaikovsky but I was told that I didn’t have the right body for ballet and if I wanted to continue in the school, maybe I should take jazz.
My mom was like, “You know what? I think you really like the music, in stead of maybe the dance, why don’t you try piano lessons?” So I did and that was it. I knew, when I was nine, that’s it, I’m going to be a professional composer.
[0:11:21.6] NORCAL: Oh shoot.
[0:11:22.7] CS: Yeah, no. I just knew, I knew I wouldn’t be a super professional pianist like performing at Carnegie Hall and everything like this because for that, starting at nine even, you have to practice eight hours a day and I always liked the creative aspect of making my own music so I knew my focus would be on composition and I just wanted to write my own music and I started – I got accepted to the Julliard pre-college program when I was 15.
Every Saturday, I was in New York and I was at Julliard from 10 in the morning until seven at night taking piano lessons and theory and composition and conducting. T hen, my senior year of high school, I also took a conducting apprenticeship with the New York youth symphony so I was in New York on Sunday’s also just learning how to conduct and learning how to read orchestral scores and getting up in front of an orchestra and seeing how to communicate non-vocally to get your musical message across.
Yeah, that was a magical time just being steeped in music and finding other people that had the same passion as me. I feel like I’ve been working at it for the past 20 years.
[0:12:39.9] NORCAL: Yeah, I mean, that’s a lot of dedication.
[0:12:42.9] CS: Yeah, it’s a lot of dedication but it doesn’t feel like a sacrifice, it doesn’t feel like work, it’s just, it’s this goal I’ve always had, making little steps along the way. Meeting little goal posts along the way has been so much fun and I look back and I get to see all of the places I performed and all the people that have played my music and it’s so exciting, so exhilarating.
[0:13:10.0] NORCAL: Yeah. It’s impressive.
[0:13:13.7] CS: Thanks. I wish that I had a little more time for some other hobbies. Like in the beginning of the fall, I was determined that I was going to learn creative coding and so for a good three weeks, I was taking those creative coding, what’s it called? Coding train lessons on YouTube? It’s so good but then I got this big project and I’m like, “Shoot, I can’t do both.” I’m going to get back to it, I really want to understand it.
[0:13:45.1] NORCAL: Well, I think you can for sure.
[0:13:47.2] CS: I’m going to try. It’s a different part of my brain. I’m not so exact. Learning how to code and lines of code, if there’s one tiny little error, if something doesn’t work, I’m not used to thinking that way, so I think that’s good for me.
[0:14:02.3] NORCAL: I mean, well, I’m an outsider looking in but I mean, to some people, I mean, like net notes on a sheet of music is kind of like, “What is going on right there?” Similar to code but –
[0:14:18.9] CS: Yeah. Right, but if I read the wrong note, something will sound a little funky but it will still work, right? The whole thing won’t just not function. You could explain it away like, “Oh yeah, I totally meant to write that chord, it sounds like garbage but I meant that, it’s my artistic expression” you know? Whereas if a line of code is messed up and your line doesn’t look like a line, it’s like, “Wait, you did that wrong.”
[0:14:45.1] NORCAL: Yeah, you get instant results like, “Okay, I need to fix that.”
[0:14:50.3] CS: Yeah. Maybe my goal for 2022, I should really hunker down and get back to it.
[0:14:59.6] NORCAL: If you were an animal, what would you be and why?
[0:15:03.5] CS: Okay, this one is a little tricky for me because – don’t judge, I don’t love animals, I never had a huge affinity for animals, I don’t know why but, I know, it sounds terrible to say, right? You’re supposed to love animals. Sorry, politics.
I think I would be a fox because – well, for a few reasons. A few years ago I went up to Bear Mountain in New York. It’s this beautiful sate park on the Hudson river and they have a section where they have rescued animals and rehabilitated them. I was walking over there and there was this really large cage with this beautiful fox just basking in the sunlight and I’ve never really seen one up close and I got close to it and it winked at me. I thought, “This is like, we’re sharing a secret or something, it feels like it knows me. Okay. I like foxes.”
Also, they’re supposed to be really clever animals, right? I think that I’m always trying to think of a lot of different perspectives for opportunities, a lot of different angles. I am to trying to think of angles and trying to find different paths in a way. I think that goes with fox. Also, I read that in a lot of different cultures, they’re good luck and I like this idea of something that brings other people luck, yeah, I would be a fox.
[0:16:32.2] NORCAL: All right, I like it, it’s good.
[0:16:33.4] CS: Yeah?
[0:16:35.0] NORCAL: Yeah.
[0:16:35.1] CS: I mean, I feel like they kind of have a negative connotation sometimes but there are a lot of positives to them, you know?
[0:16:42.5] NORCAL: Yeah, they could be viewed either way.
[0:16:45.5] CS: Also, they are the symbol for the brave wallet and I mean, not brave, I’m sorry, Metamask so there we go, maybe it’s just because I’m looking at that one every day, I’m like, okay, a fox.
[0:16:54.7] NORCAL: Oh yeah. Hey, it works, it works, we’re going to go with it.
[0:17:01.0] CS: It works, yes.
[0:17:02.3] NORCAL: Do you have a favorite food?
[0:17:04.4] CS: Favorite food, yes, hands down, pizza. I could eat it every day, my favorite is my mom’s. She makes her own dough and her own sauce from tomatoes in her garden, she has a huge garden and it’s always yeah, she makes the best pizza. It has like fresh vegetables from her garden, everything. I swear by it, it’s my diet food, I tell everyone like, “If you want to lose weight, just eat pizza, it works, I swear with those.” Yeah. I mean, Italian food in general but specifically, pizza.
[0:17:39.7] NORCAL: Sounds like –
[0:17:41.5] CS: Sorry, go ahead.
[0:17:42.6] NORCAL: No, I was going to say, it sounds like we need to plan a trip to give some pizza over there.
[0:17:47.6] CS: Yeah, there’s no good places in Nashville. There’s a place called Lock and Table and they have the coal burning oven and they had this one. Okay, generally, I don’t like fruit on a pizza, I’m just going to let you know, no pineapple, I know that was a question in some of the other podcasts, but they had this pizza with grilled peaches and house made bacon and I was skeptical at first. I’m like, “I’m not going to be one of those people to put fruit on their pizza.” It was delicious.
[0:18:19.0] NORCAL: No, I turned into one of those people.
[0:18:21.9] CS: It’s not a pineapple, it’s a peach, that doesn’t count, I don’t know. It’s a vice of mine. My poor husband, he’s like, “We can’t have this every day” but I totally would if let to my own devices.
[0:18:41.7] NORCAL: Oh man, what is the best piece of advice you’ve been given?
[0:18:47.1] CS: The best piece of advice. I think when I was still a student, somebody told me that if you’re giving a performance, whether if it’s for three people at a public school or a thousand people at an illustrious concert hall, give the absolute best that you possibly can. It doesn’t matter who you're performing for, always be respectful of your audience, always try your hardest, no matter what you’re doing, do the best of your ability and I think that’s important because it translates to other things too.
If I’m talking to somebody who is an artist just starting out, I’m going to speak to them the same way that I’m talking to an artist who is famous and has been in the scene for a long time too. It’s just always doing your best for others, always performing your best, just giving 100% as much as you can.
[0:19:46.2] NORCAL: I like that.
[0:19:49.1] CS: That’s my advice.
[0:19:50.3] NORCAL: It’s good advice.
[0:19:51.1] CS: Thank you.
[0:19:53.4] NORCAL: Just got to respect everybody around you, you know? Just because they don’t have a name, doesn’t mean they’re not important.
[0:19:58.6] CS: Absolutely. I found this more – I found such a different community in the NFT space than what I was used to in the classical space and I found that more people kind of act that way, that they have more respect, more interest in other people than what I was used to than before. It’s been a really refreshing change for me, it’s been completely different actually. My mind is kind of blown at how different both worlds are because it’s still the arts, right?
NFTs, I mean, I consider it, it’s the art. We’re still in the arts and you would expect people in the arts to kind of be open-0minded and everything but that’s really not what I found being in the classical space for so many years. To be in the space now, it’s everything that I have ever wanted.
[0:20:52.2] NORCAL: Well good, glad the experience has been good.
[0:20:55.8] CS: It’s been great.
[0:20:56.6] NORCAL: Do you have any advice for new artists coming to the NFT space?
[0:21:02.9] CS: Yeah, I would say, really take your time to learn about the space before you think about releasing something, try to know the technology behind blockchain and behind NFTs, try to learn how everything works, learn about the history of people that have released things three years ago, four years ago. Try to learn who came before you and that way, you’ll be able to add more to it in your own voice.
You know, I see a lot of people just announce themselves, “I’m releasing an NFT.” Okay, well, what does that add? What’s the story behind it, why are you releasing an NFT, why is it important to the community? Really learn about the space and get to know people who are already there. Pay your respects in a way, I guess, I would say and try not to release everything at once. Plan your releases, take your time because I’m sure, now, it’s a very overwhelming for people getting into the space.
I feel like I got in at a time where it was a little more calm, so I really had that advantage of being able to study every platform that I possibly could and learn about it, a lot of different artists. Aand now, there’s just so much more that it seems like it would be really hard for an artist now, just getting into it. So really, just take your time, there’s no rush, I don’t think any of this is going anywhere anytime soon, so that would be my advice. What do you usually tell people who are just entering?
[0:22:46.5] NORCAL: Yeah, I think being – planning, being deliberate in your actions, thinking it out and then the other issue is just pricing. It’s hard for me to – I feel there’s a lot of – I’m just going to list it for one eth type thing but unless you have done that kind of value in the outside of the NFT space I think, because it does limit who your collectors are going to be.
[0:23:19.5] CS: That’s true.
[0:23:20.4] NORCAL: Thinking a little bit less, possibly, I’m not saying devalue your work if it is worth that much but if you haven’t sold much before, then definitely consider starting out lower and considering fellow artist as potential collectors or smaller time collectors. Because when you start pricing it up higher, you’re heading for a different league of collectors, I guess. I don’t know how to say that properly.
[0:23:47.0] CS: Right.
[0:23:48.0] NORCAL: It’s just you’re limiting who is going to be interested in your work.
[0:23:55.1] CS: Right and if you’re new, you know, it would be hard for somebody to know who you are and who your backstory is.
[0:24:02.3] NORCAL: Yeah because I mean, it’s a lot different now with either – I don’t even know what is that today like four, 4,100, something like that versus a year ago when something was close to that.
[0:24:17.3] CS: Right, we’re about 600.
[0:24:19.2] NORCAL: One eth, so yeah. I mean, it definitely changes.
[0:24:22.0] CS: It does. It really does, I know I was thinking about it too. I was thinking last December, I think it was around 600 wasn’t it or was it three? No, maybe it was six.
[0:24:33.4] NORCAL: I think it was six.
[0:24:34.3] CS: Yeah, I think it was six. So somebody last year listing something for money. It was like okay, you know? Yeah and I think it also doesn’t help new artist that everything that we read is about this crazy numbers that people have sold things for, right? It builds this expectation that, “Okay, all I have to do is release it and I’ll put it for an either too and people will buy it because that’s the trend” you know?
[0:25:03.5] NORCAL: Yeah.
[0:25:04.1] CS: I wish there were more stories about artists, I don’t know, just doing normal sales but that have a really cool project.
[0:25:13.8] NORCAL: Yeah, I mean, how was your journey been with listing and selling, if you don’t mind?
[0:25:21.1] CS: Yeah, I don’t mind at all. At first, since I was working with visual artist I just kind of went by whatever they said, you know? They have a history, they had a history of price so I just like, “Yeah, okay. Great, I’m just going to go with you because you’re a pro and you know what you’re doing and I’m just objecting space” and you know? I feel like I had built in advice in that way and then –
Well, right releasing something on Async, the prices were kind of, you know, they were recommendations for the platform so that was helpful for me because I wouldn’t have known. I don’t think how to price separate stems for the string quartet. Right now, it would have been hard to know what to do so I was lucky to just get advice from them and they had a history because my wave was the second wave and then on catalog works, I think I just kind of see what the average is or what people are dropping.
I feel like it’s a little harder for me also to price because there’s not – I mean, there are hardly any classical musicians in the space. There’s me, there’s Nicolas Reeves, there’s Elliot Cole and I’ve just on boarded two of my friends who are doing great things on Mint Songs but – oh and of course, Studio Nouveau, they do everything that – they do every genre but it’s right because there’s not a lot of precedent for classical music, you know?
[0:26:45.1] NORCAL: Right. Sorry, you mentioned Mint Songs, what is that?
[0:26:49.1] CS: Mint Songs, yeah, it’s a platform. I think they came out over the summer. I have something on there. They’re on Polygon.
[0:26:57.8] NORCAL: Okay.
[0:26:58.6] CS: They do a really wonderful job. Whenever a friend of mine says they want a Mint in NFT, I send them to Mint Songs because they do a great job of onboarding artists. They set someone up with Maddock, you don’t have to pay gas fees to mint your first song. They have a really supportive community so they’re great. They’re really wonderful especially for musicians just starting out and trying to get their head around what all of this is, yeah.
[0:27:22.5] NORCAL: Okay, good to know. I hadn’t heard of them.
[0:27:25.8] CS: Yeah, I want to say they came out over the summer. There are a lot of music platforms that popped up over the summer. I think there was something like 200.
[0:27:35.2] NORCAL: Oh shoot.
[0:27:36.0] CS: Yeah, I think that’s – it was a crazy number. A lot of smaller ones, they’re really hard to keep track of and I haven’t kept track of many of them but yeah, like I said, a year ago there was none of this or hardly any of this just audio things but it’s really bland. Yeah, so the pricing, it’s been all over the place for me with the visual artist, with the platform. I think I’ve gotten it to a good place now where I’m pretty confident but yeah, it’s tricky. It’s still tricky.
[0:28:11.4] NORCAL: Yeah. Switching gears a little, if you could live or move anywhere, where would you live and why?
[0:28:22.5] CS: This is the question of the year. My husband and I have been talking a lot about this because we both work remotely and so we can work from anywhere basically and we don’t have family here in Nashville, we’re just by ourselves. My family is in Connecticut, his family is in Louisiana and I do miss being on the east coast. As much as I love Nashville, I do miss being close to the water.
I love being on beaches and I love being on the water but I think I would say Connecticut just to be close to my family and to be close to New York too. It has to be close to New York. I love – I would have to sell a lot more NFTs with this but I love Greenwich, Connecticut. They have great beaches and you’re half hour from New York City, so I think that would be my ideal place but it is a reach.
[0:29:19.7] NORCAL: In time.
[0:29:21.7] CS: Yeah, in time. Who knows? I mean, yeah I’m just thankful that I have the flexibility where I can entertain those options like if I wanted to pick up and move, I could and I think that’s kind of a nice place to be in. I’m not really tied down to any place, so that’s nice. It’s funny, I’ve gotten to travel a lot with concerts and recordings and things and whenever I go to a different country, I entertain the thought.
I’m like, “Could I live here?” It’s so beautiful to visit a place, right? But then, to think about putting down roots is another thing. Yeah, I think just for the convenience factor being in the States is the place to be, you know?
[0:30:06.5] NORCAL: Yeah, I’m with you on that. It is nice to visit other places but I do like living in the States.
[0:30:13.4] CS: Yeah, I feel like we’re spoiled here.
[0:30:16.3] NORCAL: A little bit.
[0:30:17.3] CS: Yeah, that I love being able to grab one, just think about it like, “Oh, I could see myself living here” you know? Just for fun, it would never happen but it’s a fun thing to think.
[0:30:27.8] NORCAL: Do you have any questions for me?
[0:30:29.7] CS: Yes, I have many, can I ask you more than one? Okay, do you think we talked a little about music NFTs and visual NFTs? Do you think that interest in music NFTs will reach the same level as visual art?
[0:30:44.1] NORCAL: Yes, I think it can. I think, I was thinking about this last night a little bit because I guess the hard part currently for the music is like it’s not using Spotify or Pandora or something. You can’t just be like, “Oh, let me load up my music that I bought” it’s not so simple right now. It would be awesome if there was something like, “Oh, let me just log into this app that will play my music” that you’ve bought. If there was some way to fix that or make it easier, that would be awesome.
[0:31:23.2] CS: Yeah, like the – what is that? The infinite objects?
[0:31:28.0] NORCAL: Oh yeah.
[0:31:28.8] CS: But for music.
[0:31:29.6] NORCAL: Those are cool.
[0:31:30.6] CS: Yeah, so you could hear your music NFT.
[0:31:33.7] NORCAL: But I mean, I think something like, I don’t know, an app. I don’t know, some way to easily just play it in your car or something.
[0:31:44.3] CS: Maybe somebody listening will develop it.
[0:31:47.4] NORCAL: Maybe, hopefully.
[0:31:48.3] CS: That would be fantastic. What if the musician also sends you like the down – no, but yeah, what would you do with the filed download and no one has iPods? You can’t load it.
[0:32:03.8] NORCAL: I know. Yeah, so you can download it, I mean –
[0:32:09.1] CS: Actually that would be funny.
[0:32:10.2] NORCAL: I have not downloaded any music to my phone in a little while. I guess, I could.
[0:32:16.6] CS: That would be so funny.
[0:32:18.1] NORCAL: Instead of iTunes.
[0:32:19.0] CS: Your NFT comes with an iPod, yeah, retro.
[0:32:23.6] NORCAL: Hey, it could be a thing now.
[0:32:26.0] CS: It could be a thing or a tape.
[0:32:26.0] NORCAL: A tape, oh man.
[0:32:29.4] CS: I still have a cassette player.
[0:32:31.1] NORCAL: What?
[0:32:31.6] CS: I do, I don’t use it but I still have it.
[0:32:35.8] NORCAL: I have a mini-disk player somewhere.
[0:32:39.1] CS: Oh, wow. I forgot about those. I used to use one to record music for my composition last time. It was bright green, oh, it’s probably somewhere. It’s probably at my parents’ house still, I’m sure.
[0:32:53.0] NORCAL: Retro.
[0:32:54.0] CS: Okay, so I could send you a mini disk of my music NFT.
[0:32:59.8] NORCAL: Perfect.
[0:33:00.6] CS: Cutting-edge technology right here.
[0:33:03.2] NORCAL: Yeah, I don’t know, I was trying to think about that because I mean, no one downloads music to listen to it. They just log into their accounts, that’s already logged in on their phone and listen to usually what’s recommended or what they were listening to the other day.
[0:33:20.6] CS: Right, some playlist and they don’t even know who the artist is because it’s just like that, one after the other, right? I mean, there’s Audius, right?
[0:33:30.5] NORCAL: I have to try that one.
[0:33:31.1] CS: Yeah, you haven’t tried Audius?
[0:33:32.7] NORCAL: No.
[0:33:34.1] CS: Try it. Again, it’s not the same but maybe a step in the right direction I think.
[0:33:39.4] NORCAL: Where is, your work on any of those music platforms?
[0:33:43.1] CS: Yeah, I have my work on Audius. I have stuff on Spotify too. I don’t intend on putting anything new on Spotify really. I just feel like I am so done with all of the web two things. I don’t really close on Instagram anymore, rarely on Facebook and I don’t really see the need to – I mean, I know people say it’s good to keep putting things on Spotify because you just get people to listen to your music, right?
That’s the point of everything or one of the points of anything anyway. But I just feel, I don’t know, disgusted by them, so I’m like, “No, I’m not adding my music” you know? Out of spite maybe, maybe it’s spiteful but yeah, I still have things out on Spotify and I still upload more things for Audius. I haven’t really updated it in maybe two months, so I have some things I can add.
[0:34:31.1] NORCAL: Right, I am going to go check it out.
[0:34:33.7] CS: Yeah, I have to be careful too because a lot of the music that I have recorded either somebody else has paid for it, like dance companies or you know, it’s tricky who owns the masters with a few things. I have to be careful when I upload a few things to Audius, yeah that will be a fun conversation. Hi Nashville Ballet, I’m uploading to this web free platform. Do I have your permission? I don’t know what’s that going to be like, that should be fun.
Yeah but on the same topic of music NFTs, do you, as a collector of music NFTs, do you expect like anything in addition to the NFT or like perks? Do you think they’re a good thing, a bad thing, a different?
[0:35:22.5] NORCAL: I want a pressed record on my wall.
[0:35:24.7] CS: Press, oh, that’s – I mean, yeah, people have done it. Do you know how hard it is to get a record right now? It’s like six months.
[0:35:33.9] NORCAL: Oh really?
[0:35:35.0] CS: Yeah, everything is backed up. Yeah, I looked into this actually. I was thinking of getting some records pressed by the catalog works releases and I couldn't get anything until April and I was looking in November. Okay, so it was more than six months. They are so backed up like supply chain issues, demand, you name it, it’s really hard. The best quote I got or the fastest one was actually a company in Barcelona.
Yeah, it’s really tricky, you really have to plan like a year in advance to get a record, but it’s fun.
[0:36:14.0] NORCAL: Really, I don’t know. I don’t know, some sign sheet music, I have no idea.
[0:36:17.8] CS: Yeah, sign sheet, it’s a good idea. I think in the New Year I’m going to start putting collector’s names on program. You know, if you have been to a concert or a performance and it says “commissioned by” or “sponsored by” and they have the person’s name in italics, I think it would be fun to put collector’s names on the programs and give them credit. One, because I think it’s cool to give credit and two, because I think it would be hilarious on like New York Philharmonic program to have this work owned by Antagonist Forever or NorCal Guy. You know, people are going to be like, “What?”
[0:37:04.4] NORCAL: Oh man, yeah, the names that would be on the bottom of that are going to be awesome.
[0:37:09.4] CS: That’s mainly why I would do that. People have no idea what’s going on, so I think I’m going to put that, institute it in the new year, or from now basically. Because it takes a while to put that in the program, so anytime Whirl is performed in concert, owned by NorCal Guy, you’ll be on the program. I think it’s fun.
[0:37:37.0] NORCAL: Yeah, I think it would be cool to be able to attend a – like if I have to be in the area or see that and go to it, it would be cool to attend it as a bonus.
[0:37:46.2] CS: Yeah, I tried to do that. Actually, it worked in New York, I just performed with Parson Stamps at the Joyous Theater and I got to meet Studio Nouveau because they’re here in New York and so you know, I say if a collector is in an area for a concert, you know they’re always invited to my performances, and yeah, I think it’s a fun thing to do. I guess it would be tricky for anonymous members but you know, they could slip into the theater and slip out unnoticed, you know?
[0:38:23.7] NORCAL: True. I know Async was like, “Hey, this is being performed over here in Austria. If you’re able to go, you have tickets to go.” And I was like, I can’t just leave right now but awesome.
[0:38:41.3] CS: If you happen to be around, you know, people move around a lot. You never know where they are when – yeah, I have to think of a way like a notification way for people to maybe opt in like if they want to know when a live performance is happening, maybe that would be the best route because I am not always like, “Come to this concert. Come to this concert” you know? It might be a better system, yeah.
I think it’s fun to be able to add those perks though, it’s something that wouldn’t be possible in normal life so, it’s cool. It’s cool to offer this perks to people.
[0:39:16.0] NORCAL: Yeah. Well, I look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
[0:39:18.3] CS: Yeah, I feel like now things are starting to like the persons for performance went offline now that things are starting to get back to kind of normal with performances, so yeah. Oh, I have one more question for you. Okay, I wanted to know what work was the most emotionally – like what work gave you the biggest emotional reaction?
[0:39:43.7] NORCAL: Well man, that’s hard. That’s hard to say, I don’t know if I have. I feel like I have to look through my collection and see what hits me again but I will say because I am sitting on a table recording this, I don’t have my computer or anything here but I do have on the wall in front me that I get to stare at is a picture from Matt Scoville and two pictures from Eric Rubens or three actually, so I get those ones sitting and recording this podcast and that’s been nice. I put those up like two weeks ago, three weeks ago.
[0:40:25.1] CS: Oh beautiful.
[0:40:26.3] NORCAL: Those are nice to look at and while I’m just chilling here but man, emotional.
[0:40:32.6] CS: Yeah, if anything just struck you like when you saw it.
[0:40:35.4] NORCAL: I’m going to say your music, I don’t even know how I stumbled across it but on Whirl, I just loved it. I don’t know, I just saw it. I felt like I was like I need to be a part of this or help Cristina along if buying this helps her get further along and this is awesome.
[0:40:56.5] CS: Oh, thank you. Was that your first? No, you had to had other things through Async right?
[0:41:03.0] NORCAL: Yeah, I had, I mean I had other stuff through Async not very much but I had a few things through them but I just don’t remember how I stumbled across yours unless I was just happen to randomly click on it going through their music stuff.
[0:41:18.1] CS: Maybe, they did a pretty good job about featuring each artist separately like through Twitter and through different interview things [inaudible 0:41:25.5] whatever it was, I’m grateful to you for that, thank you.
[0:41:31.4] NORCAL: Yeah. Well, I mean, that’s I guess the other thing is I feel in this might be not ever justified but I feel like, I don’t know, classical type music could get lost for some reason and like this digital world because you got, you know, it’s like a physical music that you have to have violins, pianos, cellos, all of the instruments to play it but we’re all going digital remote.
[0:42:03.1] CS: Yeah but I think that is a nice contrast too, right?
[0:42:06.0] NORCAL: Yeah, I mean, I don’t know. I guess, I don’t know, it’s probably unjustified but I just like, “Oh, I don’t want to lose that music.”
[0:42:18.4] CS: Yeah, I think the more people start to enter the space that play cello or violin, the more digital it will be. It’s always that way, right? Music that doesn’t have words, the easier to kind of get lost because we gravitate toward a message or towards words so it’s a little bit easier to connect with and if the music doesn’t, kind of open and you have your own interpretation to what it means, maybe you have to listen a little bit more carefully.
It takes a little more time, right? That’s the drawback that it does take a little bit more time but if people have a little time and the mood strikes them or the piece, then you know, it’s a big benefit.
[0:42:57.6] NORCAL: Yeah. Well, any other questions?
[0:43:02.1] CS: Oh, are you a musician? Do you play an instrument at all? I know, I am just curious.
[0:43:06.6] NORCAL: Man, I have not played in years.
[0:43:10.0] CS: What did you play? Guitar?
[0:43:11.5] NORCAL: No.
[0:43:12.7] CS: No?
[0:43:13.9] NORCAL: I played some piano, it took like four or five years of piano and I played saxophone in high school.
[0:43:20.5] CS: Wow, okay, so you could read notes and everything.
[0:43:23.5] NORCAL: I could. I mean, I’m sure it would be hard to do a refresher on that.
[0:43:30.3] CS: Yeah, once you know it, it’s just really to get back.
[0:43:36.6] NORCAL: Yeah.
[0:43:37.0] CS: I’m sure and all of your spare time, you know?
[0:43:40.1] NORCAL: Well, I have a funny thing. I did piano for several years when I was younger and then I wanted to do it again after high school a couple of years in the college side. My parents got me like a keyboard so I could practice in my room and whatnot and I still have it but I haven’t played it. But I got it out because my daughter loves music, so she will just go over there and bang on it or make some sort of rhythm and changing like the instruments to what, I have no idea and I think she can run it better than me at this point but yeah, she loves it.
[0:44:21.4] CS: That’s cute. How old is she?
[0:44:23.3] NORCAL: She turns three next week.
[0:44:24.8] CS: Three is the age to get them in piano lessons.
[0:44:30.7] NORCAL: Yeah.
[0:44:32.0] CS: I wish I started when I was three.
[0:44:34.3] NORCAL: I mean, I just – I guess, I just – I mean she does love it. I don’t know, I feel – yeah, I guess we’re just trying to figure out when the best time is to get started because I don’t want her to feel like – to hate it because I felt like that was kind of me when I was learning. I just was like, “I just want to go play. I don’t want to do this” but then maybe I didn’t love it as much as my daughter does, so I don’t know.
[0:45:00.3] CS: Like five is actually a decent age to start piano but yeah, that’s important to keep the love of it and you know, to play around because it’s fun or it should be fun I think.
[0:45:14.1] NORCAL: Yeah, for sure.
[0:45:16.2] CS: Yeah.
[0:45:18.0] NORCAL: Do you have any shoutouts?
[0:45:20.2] CS: Shoutouts, yes, all of the visual artists that I’ve worked with that were so wonderful and just like taking me under their wing and accepting me and collaborating with me, and Vans Design was the first artist I worked with, Barterium who produces. I don’t know how, every time he releases something that I see it’s more breathtaking than the last thing he released. I don’t know how he does it, he’s a magician. And James Fox, macro photographer was also a magician, have you seen his photos?
[0:45:57.8] NORCAL: No, I’m going to go and look it up though.
[0:45:59.4] CS: Oh my goodness, he just creates – oh, you have actually. He did the art for Whirl.
[0:46:04.8] NORCAL: Oh okay, yeah.
[0:46:06.6] CS: Yeah, he takes photos of pigments and just these tiny, tiny, tiny little micro worlds, it’s incredible. Yeah and [inaudible: Jod Dane 0:46:16], who is an incredible 3D artist and then of course, Studio Noeveau who was like my inspiration kind of in keeping with this and getting into music NFTs and making it work. I think I just covered everyone.
[0:46:35.2] NORCAL: Perfect.
[0:46:36.1] CS: If there’s someone I missed, I’m sorry.
[0:46:40.1] NORCAL: Well Cristina, thank you so much for coming on the show today. I really appreciate it.
[0:46:44.0] CS: Thank you for having me, this was fun.
[0:46:46.0] NORCAL: We’ll have to do it again.
[0:46:47.3] CS: Yeah.
[0:46:48.2] NORCAL: All right, have a good day. Bye.
[0:46:50.3] CS: All right, you too. Bye.
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