In this heartfelt episode, we peel back the layers of uncertainty that often accompanies life's transitions. As we discuss the fear and excitement of shifting from a structured academic world into the unpredictable professional landscape, we invite you to find solace in our stories of mentorship, mental health, and the pursuit of personal fulfillment.
Often, it's the unanticipated job changes that provoke the most profound self-reflection. MJ shares a particularly tumultuous transition, revealing how a promising role led to a struggle with job satisfaction and well-being. We take a closer look at the value of a supportive work environment and the difficult decisions one faces when the desire for professional growth conflicts with personal health. Whether you've faced the daunting prospect of leaving a secure job or you're currently contemplating a career leap, our conversation underscores the importance of courage and self-compassion during these testing times.
In the labyrinth of career and identity transitions, trust in oneself becomes a guiding star. Our final thoughts revolve around navigating the chorus of opinions that can sometimes drown out our inner voice. We share anecdotes that celebrate the transient nature of tough times and the strength we draw from community support. For anyone navigating their own stormy seas of change, let our conversation be your lighthouse, illuminating the path towards aligning your career choices with your deepest joys and values. Join us and become inspired to face life's uncertainties with a renewed sense of hope and resilience.
CareeRise: www.careerrise.org
CareerConfidence: www.mjcareerconfidence.com
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In this heartfelt episode, we peel back the layers of uncertainty that often accompanies life's transitions. As we discuss the fear and excitement of shifting from a structured academic world into the unpredictable professional landscape, we invite you to find solace in our stories of mentorship, mental health, and the pursuit of personal fulfillment.
Often, it's the unanticipated job changes that provoke the most profound self-reflection. MJ shares a particularly tumultuous transition, revealing how a promising role led to a struggle with job satisfaction and well-being. We take a closer look at the value of a supportive work environment and the difficult decisions one faces when the desire for professional growth conflicts with personal health. Whether you've faced the daunting prospect of leaving a secure job or you're currently contemplating a career leap, our conversation underscores the importance of courage and self-compassion during these testing times.
In the labyrinth of career and identity transitions, trust in oneself becomes a guiding star. Our final thoughts revolve around navigating the chorus of opinions that can sometimes drown out our inner voice. We share anecdotes that celebrate the transient nature of tough times and the strength we draw from community support. For anyone navigating their own stormy seas of change, let our conversation be your lighthouse, illuminating the path towards aligning your career choices with your deepest joys and values. Join us and become inspired to face life's uncertainties with a renewed sense of hope and resilience.
CareeRise: www.careerrise.org
CareerConfidence: www.mjcareerconfidence.com
Follow Us on IG!
Follow Us on LinkedIn:
Welcome back to Coffee and Career Hour.
Speaker 2:We are your hosts, Arminay and MJ. We are so glad to be behind the mic today.
Speaker 1:So excited. Finally we're back in person.
Speaker 2:In the same room? I don't think anybody. Well, I don't know if you could tell, but the last two times, last two episodes you've listened to, were not pre-recorded. They were recorded in separate places. Arminay and MJ were separated for quite some time, but now we're in the same room and I'm breathing the same air. She is, and the world has gone back to normal.
Speaker 1:I love it. Yeah, and for anyone wondering why we were separated, I had a baby and I was in my postpartum stage and we were quarantining for the baby cell.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can report he is the cutest human being I've ever laid my eyes on and he's the sweetest, cutest thing.
Speaker 1:Oh my god, I'm sad because he's with his dad, right now we could bring him on the podcast, but then we would be. He has a lot of great advice. Yeah, totally so much wisdom and his short age. Yeah. So, with that said, we are back in full swing, doing this the way it's been done before.
Speaker 2:I'm smiling at you because I want to ask you do you feel back in full swing? I don't think so.
Speaker 1:I do not feel back in full swing, but you know what I think. This is just how it's going to be from now on, because I want my mom.
Speaker 2:You want your mom. It's a huge transition in your life. It's a new chapter, new book.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, with that said, I'm still the same, arminay. I still love career development and all things career so cute, just clearing the air there.
Speaker 2:But I also have another identity now that is developing with each day, so yeah, I'd be interested to hear later down the line, arminay, about how career development and who you are as a professional also has to do with who you are as a mom and how those two identities intersect.
Speaker 1:Yes, once I become a little bit more of an experienced mom, I think we can tell we're doing great so far, thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you, he's changed, he's happy, he's cute. Thank you very much.
Speaker 1:That's experience and for everyone out there listening. We miss you and we are excited to be here today talking about uncertainty and transitions.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that uncertainty and transitions in your career, those are. I don't like talking about those. Obviously, we're talking about them, so it's a good thing, it's a good practice to talk about or be uncomfortable for some period of time. I mean, we'll get into why I don't like talking about them. But uncertainty and transition lead to major parts I would say highs, lows in your career and your life, depending on where you are and who you are and they're typically significant moments that can impact the way you see something or feel about a certain way or a change that you make as well. So these are huge, huge parts of how they really shape your experience in your career and life.
Speaker 1:They do. Let's tackle uncertainty first, mj. Yeah, what do you feel? When you hear the word oh you all should see MJ's facial expressions. Right now she's already having a panic attack, I think.
Speaker 2:I get massive anxiety when I think about uncertainty, because I'm so atypical where I need plan ABC and then D if none of those work out, I need to know that things are going to be okay. I needed to know that when I was going to see you, at what time I was going to see you, how I was going to see you, all these different things. So the uncertainty of things really freaked me out because I think I grew up in a chaotic household where I grew up seeing two parents and then one day I saw one parent.
Speaker 2:So I never felt like there was a type of routine and there was constant chaos. So there are times where I do feel peace in the chaos because I can control what I can control. But I think it has a lot to do with my childhood and how I grew up in a chaotic home. So I tried to establish a routine for myself that worked and made me feel safe.
Speaker 2:So in my professional life, growing up and being instilled with the ideals and beliefs that your education is going to get you a great job and you should never worry about that, and then getting an education and then having no job freaked the hell out of me. That was a shock because I'm like well then, the American dream is dead. Whatever people say about education isn't true, and it makes me get a massive anxiety because it brings me back to the emotions of like, well, I'm a disappointment because I wasn't able to do it right, like I don't know what's going to happen. I can't really predict, I don't have control over the situation. So every time I hear uncertainty, I think about chaos and I think about the moments in my life where I haven't had a job. Okay, was that what you were expecting?
Speaker 1:No, but it's true, though I think that's something like uncertainty is a shared experience, like I don't think I know anyone who's comfortable with uncertainty Absolutely. You know, maybe it varies like person to person. There's different degrees and levels to how comfortable someone might be, but I don't think I know anyone that's, like, completely comfortable with uncertainty, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, uncertainty and risk, I think, go hand in hand. So people who can like, like proudly, take risks and like just drop everything and go to like I don't know Jamaica for like two weeks, like freak me out. I know I need like a year of mental preparation. I can't just like, I mean, jamaica isn't really a risk. That actually sounds really fun. But you know what I mean.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, drop everything and kind of do something unexpected. But I think someone who does that, they're seeking adventure and there's like other like a adrenaline rush and things like that that play into that factor. But when we're talking about just like generally, like being uncertain about things like where your life is headed, you know, if we think about that, like when I think about that, I'm also somebody who loves to have like discipline and plan things out and as I've gotten a little bit older, I have become more comfortable with uncertainty. My grad program lead taught me this, because the whole grad program was uncertain the entire time, like you know, and it was a counseling program. So our professors were always talking to us about, like just you know, going with the flow and letting things be.
Speaker 1:But you know, even so, naturally I'm a person who likes to plan. Like you say, you're atypical, same here. I want to be structured and know, like, what my next move is and how. Everything together, blah, blah, blah. Well buh, life has proven many times that you can plan and plan and there's still going to be things that come out of left field or whether it's a good thing or a bad thing, but there's always going to be things that happen that are unplanned that lead to, like, not knowing what your next step is going to be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think one of the biggest and most recent examples is COVID-19. The pandemic was a huge life changer for many, I know, for you, it impacted you in a significant event in your life. For me, I wasn't able to graduate, yeah, and that took away like my whole master's program of being in person and having like a real experience. And, yeah, that's one of the most recent examples that have impacted a lot of people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's true. I mean, that's on a worldwide scale, right, but let's talk about, like you know, something most of us feel is when you are transitioning from one job to another, or one year maybe, if you're a student, you're graduating and you don't know what your next move is going to be.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. It's funny because I can feel this on a personal level. But when I'm with my students, I feel like I have to be the secure one for them and I have to like hold their uncertainty and their unease and their anxiety and tell them like it's going to be OK.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I mean that I'm not just saying that to make you feel better, because I feel. A lot of the time I was told like, oh, like you're going to be fine, like MJ, mj's smart, she's going to do it, like it's going to be OK, and I felt like people were just tired of hearing me feel uncertain. Right Kept getting told like you're going to be OK and it was more like brushing me off rather than actually like you're going to be OK and things are going to be OK. You know, like I was a different in tone the way you say it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Whereas for our students, you and I have to be that like peace and we have to be that like hey, if you're not graduating with a job, all right, let's figure out a plan and you're that person to help them. But like for us, like the counselor counseled myself, right. Like you can't as hard?
Speaker 1:Oh, it's definitely hard, you know, and sometimes, like I will say this as a counselor when I am holding that space for my students, something in the back of my mind I still think about like, yeah, you say this as a counselor, but if I were in their shoes, I would definitely be feeling the same anxiety that they're feeling because of this uncertainty. So you know and it's not that we're being hypocritical as counselors, it's just that that's our role as a counselor is to hold that space. But on a human level, we understand why a person might be feeling so anxious about that uncertainty.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree, Like I, to the umf degree of agreeing with you. I cannot tell you how many times I tell the students like you're going to be OK, Like things are going to work out, but at the end of the day I don't know that, yeah, I don't know, like, what their life situation looks like, Like for me I would say all the time. Like people like I have bills to pay, I have a family to you know to help support. Like I have school loans to pay back. I have so many other things where I'm like you just stop telling me I'm going to be OK Like things are going to be fine, like you don't know that, and it makes me more stressed.
Speaker 2:So it's not easy thinking about the next steps and not knowing, and I think, especially when you are in a place where you don't enjoy what you're doing anymore and you want to switch jobs or careers, right, that satisfaction and fulfillment is gone and it's empty and you are unsure of what comes next, like where do I go next? What's? Let's say you've been doing this for 10 years, 15 years. You're like OK, what skills do I have? Can I transition? There is a level of uncertainty, because now you may be questioning can I do this? Do I even have the capacity? You know, will this job allow me to have the same flexibility that I may have in what I do now? There's a level of uncertainty with even yourself, right, almost like doubt and some type of insecurity within yourself.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and that happens with, like, if you're graduating from any kind of degree program, or that happens if you're applying to some kind of graduate program or applying to college. Right, like, can I do this? Am I really cut out for this? How is it going to be? How is this going to impact my personal life and many different aspects of your life? So I really can take a toll.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think. Physically, mentally, emotionally, it depends. There's a story behind this one and the uncertainties is why the story came from hell. This episode was born but when I was transitioning from graduate school to full-time job big girl job I was told six weeks before the end of the semester and, mind you, I graduated in December, which is never a good month to graduate for the reasons of holiday. Nobody's looking at emails, there's not a lot of jobs. You're in the middle of the school year. For me wanting to go into education, there was not a lot of option. I was told six weeks before the semester ended. You got six weeks and then you're not going to continue on to the spring because you finished.
Speaker 1:Wow, also, it wasn't even planned for you to graduate in December.
Speaker 2:I still thought I had an extra semester and I was like, oh, I have till May, right, I was chill. But I had six weeks and that week that I found out was the week of Thanksgiving. So, knowing how higher education works, immediately, I went home that day and started applying for jobs. Yeah, I was freaking out. I was cover letters, I think. In that weekend alone I applied for 23 jobs.
Speaker 2:I was so panicked because I immediately was going to be taken out of my internships. No more income. I was going to be done with grad school. So I had no school. I was going to be doing nothing. That was more. My fear was I was going to have this gap and I was going to struggle finding an opportunity.
Speaker 2:For those six weeks I had an interview with Cal State and I had the first round interview and it went really well. Ironically, it was the last day of my job at the school that I was working at with my grad program. And then in between Christmas, right before Christmas, the week right before so it was probably I had the screening interview and then the week after I was called on campus. Mind you, never been on an on-campus interview, didn't know what to expect, never had had a final round interview, wow. So I mean and again, I was a career advisor in graduate school, so I also knew how to prepare. I just had never experienced it myself. So I was like, well, they want me for a second round. Like then, it must be positive, right, like they want me to show me the school. I must be like a candidate right for this role. And then, when I realized that they asked two other people to go. Only one of each position was there.
Speaker 2:So, that gave me the hint to like okay, we're the people they kind of want. So I felt a little bit more comfort but still was on edge of like I don't really know how the stage is going to go.
Speaker 2:And I'm kind of freaked out and, like you know, mj was a baby back then. She wasn't as confident, as knowledgeable and as secure as she is now. So that really freaked me out and, long story short, I ended up getting the job and took it because that was the first job I was offered. Do I look back and regret my decision? Half of me wants to say yes, because what came next was really hard, and the other half of me wants to say I don't regret it because it taught me a lot and allowed me to grow and it got me to where I am today. So six months went by, and right around month two and a half, I started calling my old supervisor, and I was miserable. This is not what I had envisioned. It was a career development opportunity. This is not what I wanted, though. It was not career counseling, it was not working with students. I was miserable.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I fell into an acute depression for several months and I would constantly call my own supervisor sobbing. I was sobbing because I hated waking up in the morning, I hated going to work. I couldn't wait until it was like 4.30 to say like there's 30 more minutes and I'm out of here.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, that is not the MJ that I know.
Speaker 2:And I had boundaries Armin I was like leaving at like 4.59 out the door.
Speaker 2:I didn't want to be there. And of course, you know like it's so funny because I had like a nice routine I would go home and work out. It was like really cool. But like I hated 8 to 5. Hated it, I was miserable, and you know me now. So it's hard. It's even hard to remember myself in that position.
Speaker 2:And I was told the entire time, you know like, look for a job, start looking for a job. And I did, and I did. And I was also told like well, you've only been here for like six months, so it's going to be hard for you to transition. And I, I was like I don't care, and I got to a point where I could not take it anymore. Sure, and I, you know, spoke to my current supervisor and she was amazing. She truly was. She was supportive, she really wanted the best for me. She was awesome. But I just I can't really explain necessarily the like why I felt the way I felt, but she had that thing to do with it. She was really awesome. And I, you know, I said to her very honestly like I I remember I had tears in my eyes too. I was like I, I don't like this and this is not what I expected and I don't think I'm the right person to do this. So I want to put it in my two weeks and I had no job. I had no job lined up and I spoke to before this happened.
Speaker 2:This conversation happened. I spoke to a mentor, but the week before, and spoke to my old supervisor the week before and said this is what I'm thinking like, what are your thoughts? And one both of them supported me and they said you know. One said it's going to be really hard looking for a job without a job. Yeah, like you, leaving in the middle of nowhere is not good. You're going to have to come up with, like a you know, like you want to think about how you want to play that often in an interview. And then the other person said you know, I will, I support you fully and I will be your recommender, no matter what. And both were supportive. One was just, you know, thinking more like analytically right About the situation, and I completely understand Because now you know, that's helped me think in my skills and I left. And I left and I didn't know what was going to happen. Yeah, four weeks before, I left officially in. My last day was June 10th. I actually had seven.
Speaker 2:I had 17 interviews, wow With multiple well, there was one university in particular that I had a lot of interviews for, clearly, I was being passed around that's a whole other podcast episode. But I was being passed around because they wanted to hire their students. So I was told that I was going to be a student. So I was told multiple times we weren't expecting someone like you to apply and we, you know, we really want to keep you.
Speaker 2:So here's this person that's hiring go interview for them and I was being tossed around in that school which is cool because it was nice to feel wanted, yeah, nice to feel skilled, and I was getting to find around interviews and nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing. And when I quit my job, and it was my last day, I had two, three interviews scheduled. One was a screening, second one was a presentation, and this is the first time I'd ever done a presentation interview. And then the third interview I had was the final round at UCLA. Wow, did the first one? Knocked it out of the park. That was Monday, I remember. Then this was the first week I didn't have a job, right, mj, last day was on Friday. Monday she had her interview, knocked it out of the park. It went so well. I knew I knew it had gone well.
Speaker 2:Tuesday, when in person to the other university, did the presentation, the whole three hour interview, that was okay. I answered all their questions. It wasn't really a job that I wanted to do, but I needed income. I didn't care. That was like okay, like I was like yeah, like whatever. Wednesday I got to meet you for the first time on zoom, yeah, so it wasn't, it wasn't the true in person meeting, but I went to UCLA and did my four hour interview and was called three hours later and was offered the job.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I spent multiple weeks of uncertainty because I knew I wasn't attached to the job and mentally I had already. I was not like the job that I had. I didn't want, so I had left it when, immediately the moment, I started thinking about, it.
Speaker 2:There was no connection. So I really felt uncertain the entire time because I didn't know what's going to happen and I kept doing the job for the sake of having one and having pay, rather than because I wanted to do it. And for me, that freaked me out because I knew the moment I said I don't have a job anymore, I don't have income, I don't have skills, I don't have experience. I have six months of full time experience. Who's going to hire? Who's going to want to hire a new grad with that experience? And I knew I knew I had a lot to bring to the table but I couldn't speak for my resume. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but it sounds like this. So there's two times that that happened. The first time was when you were graduating and all of a sudden, when six weeks, you had to like figure out what was coming next, and then so you took the first job that came your way.
Speaker 2:Which I don't recommend.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then it happened again with when you decided to leave that job.
Speaker 2:And I didn't know. I didn't know UCLA. Oh, and, mind you, the day I got offered the UCLA position, the Monday interview, I had skipped the second round and offered me the position. Nice, so I got offered two jobs in one day and not, and I didn't expect that, yeah, I really, I honestly I've told you this, armine, you know this about me. I did not think I was like I was so nervous for UCLA's position. I was like freaking out. Yeah, I didn't think I had done well. I didn't think it was. I know I know I did well, my bad. I didn't think I was going to do well because it was also, you know, like the way it was scheduled and it's very intimidating for me.
Speaker 2:Somebody who's never really navigated that process before to now.
Speaker 1:Sure, sure. So having had that, those uncertain moments where then you had to make a decision about taking that job and then leaving that job, what would you say to our listeners about how to navigate that kind of uncertainty?
Speaker 2:I would say one. You're going to get a lot of different opinions. Listen to what yours is saying, and that's something I wasn't doing. I love that and I'm learning to do that. Now. I'm really learning to listen to what MJ says first, and I kept hearing what everybody else's opinion was and what everybody else thought, and I ultimately listened to me, which is why I left the job.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I knew what was best for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I could not continue anymore. So, one, listen to what's best for you. Two, when you're in those moments, lean on your community, lean on the people who are there to catch you. When you feel like you're on three, on one leg, you know, or like on the three-legged stool, and that's what I did, I leaned into those people and they caught me right, like they were there. They're like we got your back, You're going to be okay.
Speaker 2:We're going to help you navigate. And the third one is know that you, no matter how you feel in this moment, this will also pass. Yeah, because you feel your shittiest in this moment. And I did. Yeah, I went through like when my fiance and my mom talk about the way in which I behaved for those couple months. I was a different person. I had no light, no magic sprinkles, like it was so sad because I felt like a part of me died.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was the way my mom and my fiance explained. It is very sad to see me transform and have so much passion for the field when I was a grad student to go into this job and hate my life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it goes to show how much a job can really take a toll on a person. Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Like.
Speaker 1:I can't imagine you without the magic sprinkles, especially in this field. But you know and it was it was a job related to your field. It's not like it was something out of that field either, but it just wasn't the right environment. So, but it sounds like because of the fear of not having a job, you took that first job that came your way, yeah, but. But you know, all that all brought you to be here in this moment today and whatever lessons that it taught you. So we're grateful that you're here, all of us, the listeners and myself. But with that said, I mean I would say that I kind of did the same thing when it came to going to grad school, except, thankfully, the grad program ended up being a good fit for me. But it was the same thing of like when I was graduating from undergrad, like what is next? Nobody's going to hire me. So it was out of the fear of like I'm not going to be hired because I don't know what skills I have.
Speaker 1:Coming out of an undergrad program in psychology, I felt so insecure about going into the world of work that I applied to grad programs and we've talked about this in a previous episode. Where you don't want to do that you don't want to take. You don't want to go to graduate school because you don't know what to do. You don't want to take a job just because you're afraid you're not going to get a better job right or the right fit. We've talked about these things, but I want to reiterate like that uncertainty could really lead people to make hash decisions. Yeah, that maybe don't end up being the best, like in the case of your job that made making you like essentially, you had depression for a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I will say too, like I've heard so many like students, like college students, tell me like I chose this major because I wanted to do X, y and Z and now I hated it and I don't know what to do and I'm going to graduate Like there's some type of pressure that you have to do some type of thing because you don't know.
Speaker 2:There's a level of uncertainty of I don't know. So I'm just going to do this thing and now I hate it and now I'm stuck with the choices I have. So, honestly, like I mean and as a college student it's a little bit different like you're, you still have community, you have support, you have counselors like Arminay and I to go to and to help you navigate, but as an adult, you really don't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and if you ask your you know, ask your friends and family and such for support. A lot of times, like it goes back to the advice you gave of listen to what you want to do, because people are going to give their opinion. Like I know someone in my family who for years after her undergrad she wanted to. She was trying to figure out what kind of grad program to go to. She kept going back and forth between nursing and social work and a few other programs and eventually she landed on social work and she's now a social worker and loves it.
Speaker 1:But she was telling me that when she was deciding which program to apply to, it took her so long to finally choose the program because her family and friends would always make comments about the program and what their ideas about nursing versus social work were and people were like leading her towards nursing when she that wasn't really the right fit for her and she needed a while to figure out what was the right fit for her. You know, so the thing is too. It's like, yes, lean into your support system but listen to your voice. But I think that's really hard to do when you don't know yourself well enough.
Speaker 2:I agree, I didn't know myself well enough. I was lost, I was confused, I was depressed, I was not. I was like I just want to be happy. Yeah, that's all I wanted. Yeah, I didn't care what the hell I did. At that point, I was regretting all my decisions and when I think I've mentioned this before like I was offered an opportunity to stay at that institution that I graduated from, but I turned it down three times. I turned down assistant director job three times.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Because of other circumstances that happened and that was an uncertainty, because I'm like, wow, mj, you're letting go of a full-time job that's right in front of you, that you didn't even like, apply for or ask for, and you're choosing to go out and struggle.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So somebody on the outside is going to look at you and be like what's wrong with you? Why are you making this decision Right? Like people would love to have opportunities where they didn't even apply to the job and they're being, you know, asked three times but you knew what was best for you and you're a piece of mind to do that.
Speaker 1:I think about another time where I've been really uncertain when I had my first full-time big girl job. It was a contract position and it was every year, so they had to renew every year and I think for the first two, three years it was kind of like, okay, yeah, they're going to renew the position for because we knew that the position was needed. But I remember it was the third year and there was a lot of changes in leadership and things like that and we weren't sure if the position was going to be renewed and I was so anxious during that time. I literally remember running across the office going to my supervisor because she needed to sign the form and I needed to get it to the dean and all of that.
Speaker 1:But I was so worried because at that point I already had a mortgage and I had big girl responsibilities and I was like, if I don't get this, if this position doesn't get renewed, I at least need to have like a name to know in advance, like six months in advance, so I could look for a job. Otherwise I have a freaking mortgage. Like what am I gonna do? So I remember that, the anxiety that that had caused me. Typically I'm Someone who says like it's okay if it's a contract position. Like when I first took to position I was totally comfortable with it being contract. And I remember my co-worker, who then became a friend, she, she was telling me she's like you took a big risk like taking a contract position, like I wouldn't feel comfortable not knowing if this is a permanent job.
Speaker 1:And I was like well, at that time I didn't have big girl responsibilities for me it was like I just graduated my master's program and this is you know I'm applying to jobs in the field that this was a job in the field, full-time, and you know it's okay. Thankfully, at the time I was like living at home, so I wasn't too worried about my finances. So that worked out and I was like I'll just take the contract position, see what happens in a couple years. But then two years, three years later, I had a bigger responsibilities and my whole perspective on that. Yeah, now my cat shifted.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, I honestly like. That's why I yes, I don't believe like it makes me nervous Contract positions Well, this one, this one, that that I have now is contract. Mm-hmm and when I took it I was like I just need a job. I should job. Yeah, I love what we do. Thank God, it's all worked out, it was. It was just insane, like I feel. Like I've never been able to make like a calm choice.
Speaker 2:I feel like all of my choices have been like out of the spur of the moment or rushed into something when that leads me into the transition, and like where the transition for me is that stop sign and Figuring out how to navigate and transition smoothly into a place where I've had to rush into.
Speaker 1:Oh wow. Yeah, that sounds so stressful. Do you see what I want? To take a deep breath right now.
Speaker 2:Do you see what I mean, though, by like the chaos? I feel like it's it's always constant chaos with me, and, and, and I and you know me like I'm such a con like well, I mean, I don't know about calm, but Well, you're structured and organized and like you try to make sure like everything is really well thought out.
Speaker 2:So when stuff happens like that, like I have no choice but to make a rest decision. So I mean, even this job, it was like a godsend. I remember like crying, it was a whole thing, and then, like transitioning to it, I like took a gulp Because I'm like great. I said yes to this Big girl title, assistant director in higher education. You know like yeah, it's, it's a low, lower level title, but it's a big girl title for someone who's literally had six months of full-time experience, mm-hmm. And I remember thinking like can I do this? Sure, and Did I make the right decision? Should I've gone with the other position? That was like Easy, like quote-unquote, easier, right, or like would have been in a different field. And I remember Like that transition period was so hard for me because I was like can others tell that this was like rushed for me, even though I know how I felt and even though I know my situation?
Speaker 2:Can you guys tell cuz it was you guys? Can you guys tell what I was going through and like what, that it was hard, it was not easy to be and it is it's. I find myself always being like the younger one, the newer one, you know, and and it's hard of being this person and feeling like, not like looking like I have it all together, when internally I don't feel like I have it all together. But everybody's like no, like you're doing great, you're doing fine. And I don't feel that way because everything happens chaotically.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I Mean I'm being on the outside, of MJ. I know that you do definitely seem like you have it all together, but I can resonate with that feeling of on the inside it feels chaotic. You don't know what's next. You don't know like. How did this all happen? Right Six months ago, I was in a different place.
Speaker 2:I was about to say, tell me into your transition to motherhood, because, well, I mean, I know that's a whole other episode, but I want to hear about that. Because tell me about that transition where, internally, I keep telling you you, you look amazing, your baby, you didn't even look like you that well One. You don't look like you had a baby, which is not, would not batter or a bad thing to say, I don't. I mean, then, the most, the best way possible, and you're so amazing at being a mom. But tell me about that transition to being being a mom.
Speaker 1:That's huge. Yeah, uncertainty to the max, like we're talking about job and career uncertainty. This is like life.
Speaker 2:Identity.
Speaker 1:You know we will have another episode on this where we'll get a little bit more in depth, but just just to talk about it a little bit. You know the advice you gave to our listeners about. You know You're gonna have a lot of different opinions From people around you, so do what works for you. I've gotten that advice from a mom friend and I think it's one of the best advice you can you can get as a mom, as a new mom, because there really is a lot of opinions and everyone's well meaning right the grandparents, the aunts, the, the friends. Everybody is like oh, this is what I did, this is what worked for my kid, etc. Etc.
Speaker 1:And like, as a new mom one, you're leaning into this new identity, figuring out what it even means to be a mom to you, right? And on top of that, you have to now like figure out what, what's right for your baby, and you don't understand your baby yet. You're learning each other's language. So, and on top of that, there's like a lot of anxiety around being a mom and trying to. You Want to do everything right. There's so much information on the internet.
Speaker 1:Honestly, that saying of like ignorance is bliss sometimes, like in this case, I think it's it really Holds to be true, because the more you know about things that could go wrong, the more anxiety it gives you. Then you get into that Warm hole of like looking things up online to make sure you're doing things right. You're on top of that. You're like sleep deprived right. You're trying to learn what this new role actually how it fits into your life. Yeah, there's no job description. There is no job description. So Clearly I'm going in a cycle here talking about all the different things I'm feeling. So you can see that, like, this is the biggest uncertainty of my life, probably, I think, ever that it's going to be right because this is a whole new identity and I'm still navigating. I'm only two months into motherhood, so still learning what it means to be a mom for me. But yes, my mom was telling me today she's like you're a great mom. My husband tells me that.
Speaker 2:You're telling me that you are.
Speaker 1:I don't know how I feel yet. I hope I'm a great mom, but I'm trying to figure that identity out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would say I think this goes to speak no matter whether that be identity or opportunity that you're trying to transition into, there's a challenge, no matter what it is, whether you're used to it or whether you're not used to it, whether it's familiar is what I'm trying to say. Whether it's familiar or not familiar, there's going to be a challenging period to get to adjust to, just to what that is. But honestly, I want to leave you with those three messages, tips, call them, whatever you need to for you is when you're feeling uncertain and transition uncertain in the moment and the anxiety, and whether that leads to transition or non-transition, or staying wherever you are lean into who lean in. Listen to your voice, let your opinion and let your sayings, your voice, be the loudest for you. Lean into your community and do what's best for you, because only you know what that's like and only you are going to end up wherever you're going to end up.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and to do that, I would just say it's important to know yourself Absolutely. And we're just ironic because, as we're going through life, we're figuring out who we are and recreating who we are.
Speaker 1:So it's not like you figure out who you are and then you can clearly make all these decisions. It's not simple like that. With each decision, with each challenge, there's going to be a new discovery of who you are and learning more about yourself. But I guess what that leaves us with is continue to reflect on and use those skills to reflect on yourself and reflect on your values and essentially, who you are right now, in this moment, and what you need to be able to move past this challenge or uncertain time. Life is always uncertain.