Beyond the Bottom Line: Why Your Business is Your Greatest Ministry Base with Darren Shearer

Many leaders talk about their business being a ministry, but very few live it out. Today’s guest, Darren Shearer, has developed a blueprint to help you do exactly that. As the author of "The Christ-Centered Company," Darren outlines 37 biblical business habits that transform how we handle marketing, HR, and accounting.

From a life-changing moment at Barksdale Air Force Base to building a successful publishing house, Darren explains why God is interested in your spreadsheets just as much as your prayers. Tune in to learn how to bridge the gap between your Sunday faith and your Monday morning reality.

Key Takeaways:

➡️ The Base is the Ministry: How a word from God changed Darren’s perspective on his military service and business.

➡️ Strategic Influence: Why Jesus was the world’s greatest marketer.

➡️ Truth with Grace: Navigating the difficult waters of people management and accountability.

Stop compartmentalizing your faith. It’s time to build a thriving company that honors God and blesses the world.

𝐂𝐨𝐧𝐧𝐞𝐜𝐭 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 Darren Shearer👇
 
➡️ LinkedIn (primary): https://www.linkedin.com/in/darren-shearer-44232635/
➡️ Website: https://www.christianbusinessleader.org/
➡️ BOOK: https://www.christianbusinessleader.org/shop/


𝐂𝐨𝐧𝐧𝐞𝐜𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐋𝐢𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐧 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐔𝐧𝐜𝐨𝐦𝐦𝐨𝐧 𝐋𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐞𝐫 𝐏𝐨𝐝𝐜𝐚𝐬𝐭👇:

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Transcript

Workplace Ministry Beyond Talk

SPEAKER_00 0:00

I don't know if it's necessarily an excuse to much as it is confusion is that the only type of ministry there really is or could be in the workplace is the kind you're doing when you're not actually doing your job. You know, when you're talking, having a debate about creation versus evolution or s you know some kind of a a worldview debate. And those are good in a in a sense in the proper context, probably not when you're supposed to be working, but the idea that that's all God is really interested in is the stuff that we're doing when we're not doing our job. I think God is very interested in the way in which we steward the responsibilities and the people God has entrusted to our care there in the workplace more than just knowing that I shared the gospel with that person.

Meet Darren Shear And His Blueprint

SPEAKER_01 1:06

Hey Uncommon Leaders, welcome back. This is the Uncommon Leader Podcast. I'm your host, John Gallagher. Our business is a ministry, is a phrase that many leaders think about on a regular basis. They talk about it, but very few live it out well. I know I'm trying to live that out better in my own life and in my business of growing champions. Today's guest is someone who's developed a blueprint to help leaders live out their faith in business. Darren Shear is an Air Force vet, the founder of Hybridge Books and Media, and the author of several books, including his most recent, The Christ-Centered Company, 37 Biblical Business Habits to Build a Thriving Company that honors God and blesses the world. He's also the host of the Christian Business Leader Podcast. So to say that he's got a lot going on inside of this space and he's a very busy man, I think would be an understatement. But I look forward to learning more about him today inside this conversation. Darren's here. Welcome to the Uncommon Leader Podcast. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_00 1:58

Doing well, John. Happy Good Friday. And it is a good Friday, and we celebrate the that Jesus gave his life for us. There's no more important day than today.

A Childhood Voice That Shaped Calling

SPEAKER_01 2:08

There is no more important day. You're exactly right. And we are recording on Good Friday. So I think the timing of this conversation is really good. And I can't wait to uh just learn a little bit more and have you share your faith and how you live it into your business and into your writing with the listeners of the Uncommon Leader podcast. But I'll start you off with the first request that I always start my first-time guests, and that's to ask you to tell me a story from your childhood that still impacts who you are today as a person or as a leader.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

Yeah, so I grew up as a PK, uh a pastor's kid, and I was one of those rebellious PKs, and I had red hair and I was a PK, so kind of double trouble. And so I I got into a lot of trouble, especially through high school. But my dad would make sure that I was at church, even if that meant sending a deacon to go bang on the door to get me out of bed, so that I would come downstairs and and get in the car and go to church. That's that's what he did. And so I would come into church, you know, still smelling like alcohol from the night before. And I'll never forget there was a sweet lady named Mesheila at our church. And she would, despite knowing or imagining what my night had been like the night before, she would just speak life into me. And she would, she would always say, You ready to preach? You ready to preach? And I'm thinking, Do you know where I was last night? Do you know what I was doing last night? Am I ready to preach? Are you kidding me? And and she would just prophesy over me. And um, fast forward a couple years later, I was at the call, which was an event on 7707 in the Tennessee Titan Stadium, where it was all day fasting and prayer with 80,000 people. And I was leaving the the stadium to go get a drink of water, and this lady reaches out and grabs my arm. And guess who it was? It was Miss Sheila. I hadn't seen her in probably, I don't know, 15 years. Wow. So she just made a profound impact on me, especially with that that statement, that prophetic statement over me. Are you ready to preach? Hey, guess what I did last night, John, for Maundy Thursday? I preached in my church.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Very cool.

SPEAKER_00 4:23

But but you know, I and I think we're here today because most of the preaching that gets done ought not to be just behind pulpits, but it's out in the in the marketplace, in the workplace where we spend most of our time. And that's going to look different than standing behind a pulpit.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

You know, I I love that story. First, the impact of of individuals who they don't just show up in our life as well. We know uh that they're a reason they were there for a reason then, and then seeing them 15 years later in a spot inside of that space was be pretty powerful as well, and so impactful to hear the Monday Thursday service where you're preaching as well. So you probably get to share with her that you're you're ready to preach now, no doubt about it. You touched on something that's really the the foundation, if you will, of our conversation is that living out your faith in business. And we talked about this just a little bit briefly before we hit the record button, that this is not just about as an individual sharing with somebody in the workplace that I'm a Christian and inviting them to church, but looking at our business and changing the way we operate our business because of our faith. So I I look forward to that inside of the conversation now. As you say, you're preacher, but you also are the founder and CEO of a publishing company as well. And so as you, and then you've you've written books that support that in terms of that, but was there a was there a moment for you? So somewhere between walking to church on Sunday morning and the alcohols there, and then today you are living and breathing your faith into your business and practicing these with these habits that we'll talk about later. But was there a moment that you changed over and understood that it was, you know, I need to I need to turn this around?

9/11 And A Life Turned Around

“This Base Is Your Ministry”

SPEAKER_00 6:00

Yeah. Well, actually, it was September the 11th, 2001. I woke up and saw what had happened to our country, and the whole world just looked different to me. I was in a pit of purposelessness and oppression in that moment, but there was a sense of what began as just patriotism that rose up in me. By noon that day, I was at the ROTC commander's office and said, Sir, I'd like to join the Air Force if you'll have me. And I had nothing going for me. And they needed officers because we were going to war. And so I was able to commission as a second lieutenant in 2004, and I got around a lot of godly people. There are a lot of strong Christians in the military, and and particularly was discipled in my local church at my duty station there in Shreeport, Louisiana, Barkshill Air Force Base. Had an incredible church there. And so that was that was my conversion experience in a in a nutshell, but I still kind of assume that doing ministry means you do it kind of behind a pulpit or within a church program. And so I just couldn't wait to get off work so I could go do ministry. I couldn't wait to get off work so I could go do street evangelism, or I could go do um, I could go lead worship at a racetrack chapel, you know, where there's like 13 different countries represented. You know, that was all very, very exciting to me. But what I was missing was the fact that God had called me to be a minister right there in my workplace where I spent most of my waking hours instead of having this mindset that ministry is something that happens somewhere else with some other pedigree. And that's not at all what God had in mind when he said to go make disciples of all nations. And so I'll I'll never forget I was leaving the base this particular day, and then the Lord spoke to my heart and said, This base is your ministry. And that's when everything changed for me.

The Excuses Leaders Hide Behind

SPEAKER_01 8:12

So many times as we listen through that, and even as as leaders, we think about wanting to do that. And, you know, want, at least I've listened to Craig Rochelle, he talks about people change out of inspiration or out of desperation. There's really two reasons they they change. And in the space of what you're talking about, first, you know, at 9-11, I hear that there was an inspiration that led you to change and from a from a patriotism standpoint to uh to serve. But the second side of that inspiration is the word listening for the voice of God to talk to you. So many times as business leaders, we get stuck in that rut. And I'll own this a little bit, even for myself, as I was in in the big company culture for a long time, that, you know, well, all my employees and customers aren't Christians as well. So I really couldn't do that at work, or, you know, I'm not the owner or the president of the business or the boss, so I couldn't do that as well. Those are a couple of the objections. Are there other objections that kind of either you went through individually or what you hear on a regular basis when you talk about these 37 habits we're gonna get to?

SPEAKER_00 9:11

Yeah, the um I mean, I I think most of it is just the objection that that's not where this kind of thing is supposed to happen, you know, because we we like having our faith kind of compartmentalized to a Sunday morning where we're gonna talk about God, hopefully, you know, a lot of people can go to church and not even talk about God at all and just talk about, you know, they they they see somebody they hadn't seen all week, and all they're gonna talk about is the football game coming on after after church. Uh and so so especially during the week, most people are not talking about God, but we can still feel comfortable in our churchianity as long as we're going to church on on Sunday morning. And and so I I think that's the one of the biggest excuses that we make is that that's just not where ministry is supposed to happen. Because, you know, when you start talking about God in the workplace or ask uh a coworker if you can pray for them, because they just told you that they just had a loved one pass away or that they're going through a hard time. The natural Christian response is, can I pray for you about that? And I've heard some say, just go ahead and pray for them. Don't even ask them, don't even make it awkward. And I don't know anyone that's not going to allow that. I mean, if you ever try that, as I'm sure you have, John, I would be surprised if you had a moment where they said, No, no, no, I don't want prayer. Don't pray for me. Uh, I'm gonna just carry this on my own.

SPEAKER_01 10:44

No, it's so good. And you're right. I haven't heard a no in that space before. I've had nudges, and again, this is this is where we as growing Christian business leaders need to grow. I've had nudges say you should pray for them right now. Don't even ask them, just go ahead and pray right now. And I'll be the one who actually says no. I'll be the one who faces the fear of the response, knowing that I'm not going to get that response. And if I do get that response, frankly, that that should be okay as well, because we were told it wasn't going to be easy anyway. And so to be able to do that is is so important. You're exactly right. I mean, I think many more times than hearing no, it's my lack of obedience at that point in time to make it happen.

Ministry Through Excellence At Work

SPEAKER_00 11:25

Yeah. I think some other confusion, uh I don't know if it's necessarily an excuse so much as it is confusion, is that the only type of ministry there really is or could be in the workplace is the kind you're doing when you're not actually doing your job. You know, when you're when you're talking, having a debate about creation versus evolution or you know, some kind of a worldview debate. And and those those are those are good in a in a sense in the proper in the proper context, probably not when you're supposed to be working, but the idea that that's all God is really interested in is this stuff that we're doing when we're not doing our job. I think God is very interested in the way in which we steward the responsibilities and the people God has entrusted to our care there in the workplace, more than than just knowing that I shared the gospel with that person. You know, I took them down the Romans road and I I prayed for, I got my spiritual scalp, if you will. I think God is very much interested in the way that we do marketing, the way that we do accounting and and people management and customer care and all of those things, that is the ministry that comes to my mind first and foremost when I think about what ministry looks like in a business setting.

From Marketing Like Jesus To 37 Habits

SPEAKER_01 12:56

So I think about that and that leads right in. So that's you know, if we have these objections, if we have these gaps or barriers that keep us from living that out in our workplace, then you know we need to equip those leaders with the tools they need to be able to do that. Sometimes that happens on Sunday morning, to your point, when you preach and and you're inspired when you leave the door and the energy is there on Sunday morning or Sunday afternoon when you leave. But you walk through that door on Monday morning and it the air just seems to go out. We lose that passion, we lose some of that. And so we need these habits that you talked about. So you mentioned, you know, it really started for you on the base that the base was your place of ministry. And then fast forward to publishing this book with 37 habits. Take me on that journey just a little bit from uh realizing and becoming aware of that to authoring a book uh to impact those Christian business leaders. Where have you been on that journey? And how did you learn that there were 37 habits?

SPEAKER_00 13:59

Yeah, well, there's probably more for sure. In fact, I know there are more because I regret not adding certain ones in there. That's the challenge of a book, right?

SPEAKER_01 14:08

Once it's printed, exactly. And even though this is a publishing company anyway, that's right. Yeah. Like the book is printed now and then it's like out there.

SPEAKER_00 14:15

Yeah, that's right. But there are updated, there's an updated version fourth forthcoming. But so in around 2011-12, it occurred to me living in I was living in New York City at the time, that that Jesus is has been the most effective influencer in all of history. And and you might use the term marketer, and marketing, as I define it, is strategic influence. So it's not just kind of accidental influence, it's deliberate, strategic. And that's what Jesus, that's what the example that he set. And so writing to and from work and business school on the subway in New York City for about a year, on my phone, I wrote a draft for a book called Marketing Like Jesus. And I just dug into all of the books on marketing I could find. And I did a deep dive into the gospels, particularly during that year, and just kind of drew out some some of those strategies that Jesus seemed to be using in his life and ministry. Because I just I so wanted to see a more of a connection between my work in business and the work of the work of God, the work of Christ. And I really saw that in the four gospels. And and so the the book that came much later, The Christ Center Company, which I released about three years ago, so about nine years or so later, is it kind of has a similar style, except it encompasses not just marketing principles and practices, but the habits of the entire company from, like I said, marketing, customer care, risk management, corporate giving, business law, which are, you know, all the different aspects, and also looking at the whole of scripture and not only the four gospels in that.

Building A Personal Brand That Trusts

Treat People Like Jesus Receives It

SPEAKER_01 16:11

And common leaders, hope you're enjoying the episode so far. I believe in doing business with people you like and trust and not just a company name. That's why a strong personal brand is essential, whether you're an entrepreneur or a leader within a company. Brand Builders Group, the folks who have been helping me refine my own personal brand, are offering a free consultation call with one of their expert brand strategists. They'll help you identify your uniqueness, craft a compelling story, and develop a step-by-step plan to elevate your impact. So head on over to CoachJongGallagher.com slash BBG, as in brand builders group, schedule your free call and take the first step toward building a personal brand that gets you noticed for all the right reasons. That's CoachJon Gallagher.com slash BBG. Now, let's get back to the episode. So I think I love that I love that journey going through it. Um it's broken out into seven sections, and you talk about that the different, even the different sections of a business. Like if you listed the 37 habits and didn't tell someone it was the title of the book, Christ-Centered Company, it would align with those habits that successful companies may need to have. You're exactly right. Development of core values, a purpose and mission and all by the, you know, hire correctly. And, you know, I don't know all the all the titles of the chapters, but very much the habits of successful companies. But you blend in the spiritual side of what was said by the best influencer in the world, and that we're looking ultimately to fulfill that mission, which was to make disciples of all nations and and not really a question, it becomes really powerful. I think about this in the in the face of your business, Darren. So let's let's talk about how those habits impact because it it's like it feels chicken or egg-ish. You started a company and then you probably developed some of these habits, or vice versa. But how do you live out some of these habits in your business, there, the publishing company?

Honest Sales And Publishing Without Hype

SPEAKER_00 17:57

Yeah, that that's a great question. The the first habit has to do with recognizing that Jesus is on the receiving end of everything that happens in and through the company. Because if you've done it to the least of these, you've done it to him. If you haven't done it the least the least of these, you haven't done it to him. Uh Colossians 3.23 says, whatever you do, do it with all your heart as working for the Lord, not for men, because it's the Lord Christ you serve. So Jesus is ultimately on the receiving end of everything that happens in and through the company. And so I made it, I just make a deliberate recognition that every team member that I get to work with, every client, every customer is the way that I treat them, the way that I interact with them, the way that I present information to them that that they need to know. You know, I'm thinking specifically about, you know, bringing new new customers on board and selling them on your services. A lot of times it's easy to want to kind of have an unbalanced scale of information asymmetry where I know something about this transaction that you don't know, and that gives me an advantage in the in the sales situation. And most of us would prefer it to be that way if we're on if we're the salesman. You know, of course, now the internet makes it much harder, much I think it just brings more balance to that. But that, I mean, that that's that's really the main part of it. And then from there, what does it look like to treat my team members as Christ? What does it look like to treat my my prospective customers as Christ, my current customers as Christ? So that you know, that was just one example about the um in in my my industry, which is author services. So authors pay us a fee, we publish their book, we also get a small percentage of the royalties. There is a lot of smoke and mirrors that goes on in because publishing a book, John, you you know this is a very emotional experience. And so people have very high hopes, you know, in in most cases, and they might think, well, I heard this company said they're gonna make me a bestseller. I should go with that company. They don't even know what your book is about, and they're telling you that, right? Because what they're doing is they're they're actually deceiving prospective customers who think they know what a best selling book is. They're thinking New York Times bestseller, Wall Street Journal bestseller. And what they actually mean is we're gonna make your book a bestseller for one hour in one of 16,000 different subcategories on Amazon for a very for one version of that of that type of book, whether it's an ebook or or a paperback or audiobook. And so, you know, that that's just some of the stuff that we just don't don't do. I mean, my books have hit number one in categories. I don't call myself a best-selling author because I know what I mean by that. Or at least I know what I want people to think I mean by that. And you know, and and we've had authors that want to put a little badge like that on their on the front cover of their book of their book and just say and just say best-selling best-selling book. And I say, well, we can do that, but we're gonna need to add a few more adjectives here to explain what we mean when we say best-selling author, in what, in what category, on what platform, and so on. And um, some authors they get offended by that, but but that's okay because I'm trying to sleep good at night. I'm trying to sleep good at night, knowing that the way that I interact with our prospective customers, with our current customers, I'm gonna tell you, um, I'm gonna tell you the truth about your book. I'm gonna tell you the truth about our relationship. I'm gonna tell you. The truth about what we are and are not going to do for you as a company, because the way that I present that information to you is as though I am presenting it to Christ. And, you know, Ananias Sapphira, they weren't just lying to the apostles and to the church. Peter says, you are actually lying to God because God is on the receiving end. So true.

Truth And Grace In People Decisions

SPEAKER_01 22:24

So true. So good. You know, you think about this, Darren, and even in the aspect of some of the sections that you talked about and how those who desire to be Christ-centered companies, one of the, to me, one of the biggest roadblocks often is in conversation I have with them is the people management side. You talk about that inside the book for sure in terms of hiring and the hiring process that goes along with it, and demoting. And too many times I'll hear a leader say, well, if we're a you know a Christ-centered company, we can't possibly terminate any employees because we care about all of them. Is that true? Can they not uh demote? Can they not remove employees from the company?

SPEAKER_00 23:00

Yeah, no, I don't think that's uh that's that's right at all. I mean, and there there are some principles and and we can't take one parable and make a whole theology about it, but there there are certain themes that come up again and again. You know, for example, in the parable of the talents, one was they were each one was entrusted according to his own ability. So there's a difference in the way that God, not that one person is better than the other, but there is more or less ability among different workers. And so we're going to entrust different levels of of resources to those to those people. The there are qualifications for different positions. You know, I'm thinking about for appointing elders and deacons, and and there's a very long list of criteria qualifications. If you don't have those qualifications, or you did when you first were appointed to the position, and now you don't have that qualification anymore. Um, it stands to reason that you are no longer fit for that, for that job, you know, and that's that's that's from a from a biblical perspective. So granted, what we're called to do in business is to make disciples, right? And that that presupposes that not everybody is there yet. That presupposes that I'm not there yet, that none of us are have reached the level of discipleship that we need to reach yet during our life on this on this earth. And where is that discipleship primarily going to happen if it's going to happen? Primarily in the workplace, where there's accountability, where there's where the the stakes are are higher because you know your your paycheck is on the line, your promotability is on the line, you know, all of those things, they they really raise the stakes of accountability for a discipleship relationship. Not that you want to manipulate people, you know, for spiritual, for spiritual and call it for spiritual reasons, but we need to we need to give second chances to people. I mean, people that otherwise, and and I've interviewed a lot of people who who um who have companies that specialize in hiring second chance employment. And and and they're they're able to develop those people into the leaders, into the people that God, God called them to be. So, yes, there is the the aspect of we need to give, we need to reward people that are faithful stewards. But at the same time, when somebody screws up, that doesn't mean we just kick them to the curb, you know, because there is a I mean, the way that Jesus restores Peter after he didn't deserve to get restored, but he did it anyway.

Giving Starts With Your Own Household

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Absolutely. You're exactly right. And I think about that, and I I because I often I believe that our responsibility as Christ-centered leaders is actually higher in the space of recognizing that we must deliver truth to those individuals if they're not living up to that standard that we've created as an organization, but that we're required to do that with grace. And I think about that if it's all truth and no grace, then we're just coming across as bullies, and and folks certainly are not going to listen to that and and do very well. But truth delivered with grace uh is one of those things that that we I believe we were called to do as well. And again, 37 habits, seven sections, we can't possibly go through all of them. I look at the time already. I can't believe how fast our time has gone. One of the sections I did want to talk about as well was at the end, and and that's philanthropy as well. So philanthropy in a Christ-centered business is different than uh the traditional, you know, would be a corporate social responsibility from a philanthropy standpoint. How do you how do you talk about that inside the book?

SPEAKER_00 26:46

Yeah, one of the principles or the or the habits that stands out to me from that particular section is the the issue of if you don't take care of your own household, you're worse than a unbeliever. That's what Jesus, that's what the Bible says. So, what does that mean for a business? Well, a biblical from a biblical standpoint, a household is more than just the nuclear family of mom, dad, and the kids. It also includes so Abraham went to war, you know, with 315 men who were born in his household because they were they were employees, essentially. And and so I mean, I think of not that not that they live in my house, but those who are part of our little team are part of I think of them as family. I think of them as part of my household in that in that sense. And so if there's a if there's a need and they're that they express to me and their paycheck is not sufficient to cover that need, you know, for example, one of our team members had their dog had to have surgery, and most people don't carry pet insurance. And so that was something that we were able to step in and help out with. There are a lot of other companies that do this on a much bigger scale. And and the way that I've seen it work the best, especially for larger companies, is that they have a team of people who work in the company that administer this employee giving fund. And so if uh an employee has a need like uh, you know, their funeral expenses or a car repair or you know, something like that that comes up, then their fellow team members will rally around, they'll assess the need, and then they'll take up a collection, and then the company will match whatever money is raised from that employee, employee collection. And that just sounds like, for a lot of reasons, uh like the most effective way to to go about it. Because then it's not a matter of, well, I guess my boss likes this person better because they got they were given more, and I wasn't given very much. But when you leave it to your team members, they can decide which ones are worthy and which ones aren't as worthy.

SPEAKER_01 29:05

Like that. Absolutely. I think there's so much good information in your book about this topic, about taking care of employees who have needs, about paying people properly, and certainly about the the act of tithing as well, as a as a business owner and as a as a leader.

SPEAKER_00 29:19

Because the tendency is to want to just when we think about corporate giving, it immediately goes out of the company and not back into the company to the to the people who have needs that their paychecks are not sufficient to to meet. So that's why I think the Bible one of the reasons the Bible says if you don't take care of your own household, you're worse than unbelievers. So we have to look in the house first before we start patting ourselves on the back about all of the great charitable giving. Cause that because that can feel good, especially when you get a seat at the you know, up front for the the fundraising banquet and you know, those kinds of things.

The Second Mile Service Mindset

SPEAKER_01 29:57

So good. Tell me about the second mile concept.

SPEAKER_00 29:59

Yeah. So most companies are not going the first mile. And you know, the the obvious example would be in the fast food industry, where you pull up to the window and you pull up to the intercom and you don't even hear from anybody for like the first couple minutes. The the first mile would be I hear from them as soon as I pull up. The second mile would be like Chick-fil-A, they actually walk toward your car as you're pulling into the drive-thru. So I don't really know of a better example or more familiar one than that experience of just this army of and certainly that costs money, and you're gonna pay more when you maybe a little more, not comparatively more than going to the place across the street, which still is gonna have high prices. But part of the reason why they have to have high prices is because they're not doing the volume that Chick-fil-A. That's right.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

They're not. I mean, they don't see two lanes going through that are backed up to the road every time, like a Chick-fil-A. I'm just amazed by Chick-fil-A's no matter where I go and the number of cars that sit in that line. And you're right, they walk up to you and really take care of you, and certainly, you know, the experience is different, and that's a great example. There's nothing to do with the case.

SPEAKER_00 31:10

And that's what and that's what Jesus said to do. You know, when in in context, they were being required to carry the packs of the Roman soldiers against their will, and and and it and for a mile. And and Jesus said, do it two miles, just just go the go the extra mile. Because I mean, how disarming is that? The first mile, they know that you did that because just because you had to. You take it the second mile, you're gonna that's gonna change the whole dynamic of the relationship and the conversation. Like, why did you why did you take that? Why did you go that second mile?

Walk-Up Songs And Leading With Joy

SPEAKER_01 31:48

I love I love that scene in the chosen. I know so many folks can debate whether or not it's good or not, but they did so well with that second mile concept in the chosen. This has been fun. I love the comment. I want to honor your time as well. I want to ask you a fun question. You know, you get a chance to speak on podcasts like this all the time, uh, which is really cool. You host your own podcast and bring others on to talk about this concept of the Christian business leader. You probably get a chance to speak on stages and certainly in front of your employees. It's baseball season. My pirates have their home opener tonight and you know, talk about having to have faith. Uh, it's been somewhat of 35 years or whatever it is since we've really had anything to cheer about as pirate fans. But uh the individual players, as they're coming up, they have a walk-up song uh that comes up. What would be your walk-up song, Darren, when you're going up to speak or you're getting ready to host a podcast and they get you inspired and ready to go? What's your what's your song?

unknown 32:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:42

I saw where your guy came out and and and it hit the news that I think he came out to blind by corn, which really got the place place rocking. That that would be a cool one to call it.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

Well, they're calling the new guy up tonight. He just came out on Twitter today and said his walk-up song is going to be Nobody by Casting Krauts, which I'm like, wow, you don't hear that. You just don't hear those things very often. I mean, it's gonna be really cool, but so yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:05

You have one wow. Um walk-up song. You know, I I guess if if I'm thinking realistically in uh sports and I don't know. I mean, I I won't back down for Tom Petty. That that comes to mind.

Keep The Main Thing The Main Thing

SPEAKER_01 33:18

All right, Tom Petty. That's all right. Yeah, good stuff right there. If it gets you going, that's what it takes sometimes, you know, to get you going. I mean, I wouldn't be a journey guy all the way around. I mean, certainly Country Roads follows me everywhere I go, being from West Virginia, too. So whatever it takes to get us going, no doubt about it. This has been a phenomenal conversation. I actually hope we get a chance to do it again, Darren. I want to ask you the traditional last question, give you the last word. It's gonna be two parts to it. One is very important, and that's how do folks get in touch with you. So let me know that here in just a minute. But I'm gonna give you a billboard. You can put that billboard anywhere you want to. What's the message you're gonna put on that billboard for the listeners here or those that, you know, you come in contact with on a regular basis, and why do you put that message there?

SPEAKER_00 33:57

I yeah, I was I think it was even this morning or last night I was I was thinking about this, you know, like what is the what do you want on your tombstone? Mm-hmm is the way I'm kind of thinking about this this question. And I think I think what I would like to have is something to the effect of realize a man who knew what was most important in life, you know, who and and live that way, you know, something something to that effect of because there's so many distractions in life and there's so many ways to major on the minors and but to just to just have the right priorities in life, you know, of course that of course that differs for for everybody, but I think seek first the kingdom. Yeah, the main the main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing, and that there you go, that is the kingdom of God. So seek first the kingdom.

How To Connect And Next Steps

SPEAKER_01 34:49

Very good. Thank you so much, Darren. It's been great. How do how do folks get in touch with you? Where where do you want to go and find you?

SPEAKER_00 34:54

Yeah, well, everybody can go subscribe to the Christian Business Leader Podcast. The book, The Christ Center Company, is on Amazon, and you can also go to Christian Businessleader.org and get some of our resources there. If you're interested in publishing a book, go to hybridgebooks.com, check out what we offer, and then uh contact us through the website. Excellent.

SPEAKER_01 35:16

That's so good. I want and I want to call something out because I I'm getting ready to do this myself. I saw it as I was looking at your website today. You've got a you've got a free assessment out there that organizations can use of how well they do these habits uh in the as a Christ centered company, which I think is a great uh assessment tool for folks to get a uh really good snapshot of where they are today and then ask themselves what could be different about what that is. So I'll put a link to that in there as well so we can get folks uh going your direction. Darren, this has been great. Uh I love being able to do this on Good Friday. We got some great celebrating to do here on Sunday coming up when the tomb is empty again. It's gonna be the great day. I've appreciated our conversation today and appreciate you. Wish you the best going forward, okay?

SPEAKER_00 35:57

Thank you for what you do, John. It's been a pleasure.

Share The Episode And Leave A Review

SPEAKER_01 35:59

Another great conversation on the Uncommon Leader podcast. I know, folks, that you heard that as you think about how you're trying to live your faith into your business. Uh, we look at it every day. And Darren's book uh that's out right now. I would encourage you to get a copy of that book uh and take a walk through that with regards to those 37 habits that he talked about to help you assess uh where you are on that journey. You probably heard something in there that somebody else needs to hear as well. Why don't you go ahead and share this episode with someone so we can get in the hands of even more uncommon leaders just like you? And if you get a chance, drop us a five star review if you haven't already on the platform that you listen to. Until next time, go and grow champions.