The Ode To Joy Podcast
Welcome to "The Ode to Joy Podcast," a thought-provoking and uplifting show dedicated to exploring the transformative power of creativity, self-expression, and the pursuit of joy. Join us as we embark on a journey to discover the hidden depths of the human spirit and the boundless capacity for personal growth and fulfillment.
In each episode, we dive deep into the stories of remarkable individuals who have embraced their internal muse or genius. Through their trials and triumphs, we explore the obstacles they faced in nurturing their muse and the strategies they employed to share their personal genius with the world.
We believe that every person possesses a unique wellspring of creativity, waiting to be tapped into. Our guests share their firsthand experiences, guiding listeners through their own creative journeys, and providing invaluable insights and inspiration along the way.
From artists to entrepreneurs, writers to musicians, and thinkers to dreamers, our diverse range of guests offers a kaleidoscope of perspectives on embracing one's passions and cultivating a life of purpose. We delve into the pivotal moments that sparked their creative awakening, the challenges they encountered, and the profound transformations that occurred when they wholeheartedly embraced their authentic selves.
"The Ode to Joy Podcast" celebrates the joy of self-expression and the extraordinary beauty that unfolds when we dare to follow our creative impulses. Through engaging conversations, we explore the importance of cultivating resilience, overcoming self-doubt, and persisting in the face of adversity.
Whether you seek inspiration for your own creative endeavors, encouragement to embark on a new path, or simply a dose of positivity and upliftment, "The Ode to Joy Podcast" is your go-to destination. Join us as we embark on a voyage of self-discovery, where the pursuit of joy and the celebration of personal genius reign supreme.
Tune in, open your heart, and prepare to be inspired as we uncover the remarkable stories of those who have embraced their internal muse and illuminated the world with their personal genius.
"The Ode to Joy Podcast" is available on all major podcast platforms. Subscribe today and embark on a journey to unleash your creative potential and find your own Ode to Joy.
The Ode To Joy Podcast
A Journey of Self-Love, Spiritual Awakening and Purpose with Ezzie Spencer
Have you ever wondered about the profound impact a simple smile can have on someone's life? Join us on a fascinating journey with Australian author, podcast host, and human rights lawyer, Ezzie Spencer. We start with understanding how she's crafted her existence around her purpose, which has now become her "normal". Ezzie's life has been a rollercoaster of experiences, from her roots in Australia to her life in New York and Los Angeles, and she has a plethora of insights to share.
A pivotal moment in Ezzie's life was her spiritual awakening in 2011. Our conversation delves into the internal struggle she experienced while trying to make sense of her new reality and the path that led to her work with the moon. We also discuss the significance of mentors and teachers in life, and how they can help us navigate our way towards a sense of inner peace. Ezzie shares her journey from working within established systems to focusing on the individual, aided by the moon cycle.
Ezzie doesn't shy away from discussing the more personal aspects of her journey, including her experiences with self-love and self-worth. She shares the invaluable lessons she learned from a teacher about compassion and forgiveness, which she believes are essential for cultivating self-love. She also talks about an unconscious vow she made to stay single and how she used meditation to uncover and overcome this blockage in her life. Ezzie highlights the importance of self-compassion, self-forgiveness, and gratitude in managing tough emotions, which are steps towards cultivating a stronger sense of self-love. This episode promises to leave you with profound insights about life, purpose, and the power of self-love.
Work with Ezzie:
https://www.ezziespencer.com/
IG @ezziespencer
Re.love Podcast
Buy your copy of Elena's book "Grieve Outside the Box"
Follow on IG @elenabox
Welcome to the Ode to Joy podcast, a show where we talk about joy how do we cultivate it, how do we maintain it and what are the things that get in the way. I'm your host, shamanic Deathdula, and comedian Alana Box, bringing you another part of our season two on the show, talking all about our inner muse, or inner genius. Today we are talking with EZ Spencer. Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Ode to Joy podcast. We are coming to you with another episode of our season two on the podcast, which is all about the muse, and today we are bringing on my dear friend, ez Spencer. Welcome, ez.
Speaker 2:So fun to be here.
Speaker 1:It's such a juicy conversation that I'm so excited to get into with you today. So just a little bit of a background about EZ. I mean, there's so much I want to share, but just a background for our listener, who perhaps has just meeting you now for the first time. Ez is originally from Australia, which automatically gives you a bunch of really cool points. By the way, Straight off the bat, I'm a big fan of Australians. Remind me where in Australia are you from?
Speaker 2:I've lived all over, so I'm from Sydney, canberra, melbourne, so Melbourne's the most home-like feeling part of Australia right now. But I've been out of Australia for a while.
Speaker 1:And she's also lived in New York and currently you're in LA, but you're maybe going back to Melbourne and maybe coming back to New York. She's an international chick. Okay, okay, ladies and gentlemen, so originally Australian, automatic, very cool points. She is an author. She's an author of the book called Lunar Abundance, which I believe you were writing when we first met, when we were in Holly.
Speaker 1:Is that right, yeah? 2016. 2016. She's also the host of a podcast called ReLove, and this is also something that I'm super excited to talk to you about, about just sort of like your path of really how you've come into your work, but as you started out as a human rights lawyer, so she is a smart chick, my friend. She has a PhD. Is it a PhD in therapeutic jurisprudence? Is that right, yeah?
Speaker 2:It's a mouthful, but I thought I was going to be a mental health law professor. That was where I was tracking before everything changed.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, I mean that's even fascinating in and of itself. But then you've also worked. So you were working as a lawyer specifically with women who had been subjected to abuse, is that right? Yeah, yeah, I mean so many fascinating avenues that you've been down, that you're going down and I'm just so excited to dive into it with you today. But I had to before we, like before we really really dive in. I had to just say it.
Speaker 1:I love telling my guests how I've met my, how I have met, or when I tell my listeners how I have met my guests. So Ezi and I met when I was living in Bali. She was working on her book. I had gone there, you know, basically like three months after my father had passed.
Speaker 1:I was in this really weird raw moment where it was actually the best place for me to be was in Ubud, which was really a place for healing, and I met Ezi and she was just this amazing woman. I don't even remember where he met, but it might have been an ecstatic dance, something like this, the Sunday ecstatic dance in Ubud and she told me she was working on her book and I was really inspired, and so I told you when we reconnected recently at an event in New York that you are one of the biggest, you know, sort of inspirations and my personal muse as someone who I look up to that. When I saw you were writing a book it just sort of dawned on me as I was ready. You know, I started writing it when I was in Bali and then I was like, well, as he can do it, like I can do it, why not? And yeah, so you're a big inspiration to me, ezi.
Speaker 2:I love that story so much. It blew my mind when you told me that, because we just have no idea the impact that we have on other people. Like you know the positive impact that we have on other people when we're simply just living our purpose.
Speaker 1:So amazing, Thank you for sharing that with me. Yeah, huge, huge, and it's really true. I mean you could, you could touch somebody's life just by walking down the street and smiling at them at like the most perfect moment, just when they need it, and you really never know. So that's like a little, a little gem I've been carrying with me. So, speaking of living in your purpose, we're getting to the topic of the day, which is all about the muse, our inner genius, our inner daemon, which I just love. As young puts, it is our inner daemon and and it's all about living your purpose. So I'm sort of curious for you when we bring to mind the idea of living your purpose, you know, walking from this space of embodying and bringing out your inner muse, like what comes to mind. What does it feel like in your body when you, when you think of this sort of concept of the inner muse?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it feels very alive. I have to say I'm very blessed, lucky and grateful to say it also feels like quite normal Now for me, because of the decisions that I've made, which have been difficult decisions over the years. At first it felt incredibly counterintuitive to live from this place, but now, happily, I have designed a life where this is just my normal, this is my set point, which is absolutely, you know, an incredible privilege. And so, yeah, I feel alive. I feel just truly, having this conversation, like my palms are lit up, I've got tingles all through my body. I feel really connected, you know, with my heart, with my womb. You know it feels really delicious and embodied, but it feels like there's a lot of levity, a lot of relaxation, a lot of joy.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, yes. I mean that's what we all want. Right Is is to be living every day as if you know we're really walking from this place of power and allowing our gifts to come out. So I want to take it back. Let's take it back. Take it back to where we all began. So you were a lawyer and then was there like a specific. So here's the question. I guess I have multiple questions like when you went into that and, as you said, you had a certain idea of like where it would go. When you went into that, like, was there a certain moment? How do I say, when you went into it, did you feel like, okay, this is 100%, this is my interview, like this is the thing I need to follow, or was it something that you sort of like had this idea of? Like this is who I should be? Like, where was your internal muse guiding you in that direction when you went into that kind of?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it's a great question and I think there's so many layers to it. It just felt very natural to go to law school, and I would say that when I discovered domestic violence and sexual assault which is the area of the law that I specialized in that felt incredibly alive, I felt incredibly passionate about that and I threw myself into that work. So, yes, to answer your question, full inner muse activation, so much so that I went on to do the PhD therapeutic jurisprudence for women who've been subjected to sexual assault, and the context of interpersonal violence and relationships. So, basically, toxic relationships and therapeutic jurisprudence it's all about the law as healing. So little did I know, though, when I started my PhD on the law as healing. It was going to be a catalyst for a completely different career, which was actually more focused on the healing, but yes, I do feel like I was, for many years, really living my purpose in the law. It was a necessary lily pad, if you will, to then open up into what it is.
Speaker 1:I spent the last decade doing Isn't that so interesting that's why I love having these conversations is to talk about how one thing led to another. And when you first embarked on your career, how would you have known that this is where it would have led? I mean, it's really fascinating, wow, okay. So was there like when did you know that this was where you wanted to kind of go from working in law into diving more into the healing aspect of it? Was there a specific moment? Was there something like was there an aha moment, or did it slowly develop?
Speaker 2:I mean, oh look, that was a dramatic moment. The 15th of March 2011 was the day that my life changed, so there was a moment Wow. Having said that, I also do think it's a bothant. I think it was evolving underneath the surface for many years, but then, when it cracked open, it cracked open and it was like there's my life before the 15th of March 2011. That was my life since that point Wow.
Speaker 1:Wow, I have full body chills. Can you take us into this day?
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. So you know, on the there's actually a couple of levels of telling the story, because on one level of telling the story, what happened on the 15th of March is that I had a home invasion, which is never pleasant, like no one wants. A home invasion Probably is not going to change the course of your life, unless what happened the night before. So I had been very deep in a meditation practice for a number of years. I've been working with the moon cycle. I've been really connecting with my femininity, with my intuition. I was meditating for several hours a day in the lead up to this. But what happened the night before the home invasion is that, lying in bed, fully awake, I had a full vision of what was going to happen the next day, and so it wasn't a dream. I was awake, but I saw what was going to happen the next day and so so much so I took steps the following day in order to avoid it. But you know, of course it happened and when it rolled out it was happening in slow motion because I was literally just seeing the vision I had the night before. So obviously no one wants a home invasion Like that. Sucked, that bit, sucked. No-transcript.
Speaker 2:The piece that really shook me to my core was the fact that reality was not the way that, as a lawyer, I had been trained to understand that reality was. So I have been trained to see that time is linear, like things happen in front of your eyes. When they happen, they are observable. There are facts, like I was deeply in not just the law but also in academia I was doing my PhD at the time and so it was like an I mean, ontological kind of like shock collapse on me at that point in time. It took me about six months to like fully calibrate inside of it because, effectively, what had happened is that, like the time space continuum broke for me and from there I was blown wide open. Like my circuits were just completely and absolutely.
Speaker 2:Like I could see things in people, I could see energy, I had visions. It activated all of these like magical powers, I suppose. But again, like this is 2011. So you don't have the experience now where you go onto the internet or you go on Instagram. Instagram wasn't even really a thing in 2011, you know. So people were sharing about magic, at least not in my world, in my sphere, and so it was extremely disorienting for me and it led to a lot of internal struggle. You know which we can get to in terms of the obstacles that I encountered, because I didn't really know how to make sense of what started on that day and what just continued to happen in terms of the way that I could just see things in people and see things in myself and see things in life that I couldn't see before that day.
Speaker 1:So much to unpack there. Oh, my god, I mean how fascinating I mean this experience that you had. I mean it's so interesting that you can really take it back to this very specific day. I definitely relate into that in that sense of mine. I call it when we like pop the top off, and so I always say like, yeah, back when my top was totally popped off. You know, you know I could narrow it down to like a specific day, but really it is this kind of like unfolding of everything opening up after that. That then you have to make sense of Because it's a very fine line, as you say, when you break that time space continuum where you go okay, so reality is not reality in the way that I've always understood reality to behave the laws, literally the laws of how things are supposed to go, how matter is formed, how matter is held together, how we interact with people, how we see people, how we are perceived, and so when you take all of those laws away and you don't necessarily have someone who can kind of hold your hand through it and be like listen, you're not crazy, sweetheart, like these, the gifts are just coming through, and that it can be very terrifying, I mean, I'll say for myself, but I'm also curious, like because, as you said, when this all happened for you you know, I mean mine when I, when I had my top popped off, it was 2012.
Speaker 1:So a year later and it was, you know, it was harder to find like I remember having to dig up old sort of like Stanislaw Graf articles or, you know, youtube videos, like anything, and I found out about, like, what we call spiritual emergence or a spiritual crisis, or you could say awakening, or you know, I had to really do my own research and I would, you know, take out these books from the library just to kind of put together the clues, because I knew that what was coming through was certainly something that was a gift.
Speaker 1:If only I could just keep the top on enough to make sense of it all. So I'm curious to hear for you, like, how was that process for you? And then, is that what then led you? Like, at what point, then, did it lead you into your work with the moon, your work in birthing your book? Like, at what point did you were you able to put it together and be like, okay, cool, like? These are the parts of how I can synthesize this and begin to serve it up as a service, like as a gift to the world.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great question, you know.
Speaker 2:I mean, the experience was horrible for me and I totally relate to what it is that you just shared, when you had your experience in 2012, where you're like looking for resources to try to make sense of it, because it was horrible, it was not enjoyable for me, and part of that was because I was fighting it mentally, yeah, and part of that struggle was that, you know, there was my my, my, my, my logical, rational brain that was finding myself and what was actually a true experience that I was having. So the internal discord was actually the real piece of discomfort for about, well, I'm going to say six months, you know, for it took me about six months to recalibrate, but I'll be totally honest, like it probably took me many, many, many, many, many years to find a sense of internal peace and coherence with that internal discord. I feel like that has actually been the story from 2011 through to 2023, quite honestly. But having said that, there were, of course, many other steps along the way, and so one of it is one of those steps, of course is that I had been connected with the moon ever since I was a little girl. I had been working with the moon in my personal practice already prior to March 2011. I'd already been talking about it and sharing about it in terms of what I was learning about working with the moon cycle, connecting with my own rhythms, cycles, my own sense of myself and my femininity, my feeling, and so, after the 15th of March 2011, I just started talking about it more and I would say what happened very organically is that I became magnetic, like people just started to come to me to ask how can I work with you? Now I was still doing my PhD, you know, my PhD in 2013. So it's like I graduated and so forth.
Speaker 2:So for years I was thinking I would continue along that career track. I still really wanted to belong, and that's actually a really important piece because I feel like that sense of wanting to belong in the establishment, you know, with people who I felt were clever and important, and I also don't want to put too fine a point on that piece because the rest of it's also true like people who are doing really important work in the world, and I'm still a huge proponent of structural change. Now I work more with the inner realms and the individual, but you know, I don't want to diminish, you know, the work that is done by incredibly intelligent people, but I was, I suppose, myself. It wasn't really an easy fit for me in that world anymore, but the piece for me that led to that internal discomfort, that discord, was that I continue to try to fit in. I continue to try to belong when I was really in myself, like opening up to the next stage of my own evolution. So, anyway, bringing it back, so I spoke about the Moon Cycle by the time I finished my PhD in 2013.
Speaker 2:I had a thriving business, a global coaching business so this is again in the early days of Instagram and Facebook, so I was just sharing on these social media platforms. I had a blog. I was sharing, I had an online program and I had hundreds and hundreds of clients who came into a group program, into one on one work with me. And this is really about working with the Moon Cycle to find joy and peace and purpose. I developed a practical lunar abundance which, of course, led to the book which I was writing in 2016, which was published, you know, in Australia 2017 and New York in 2018. And then that's what had me come to the US in 2018.
Speaker 2:But you know, I don't know. I mean it was really. There were so many parts of this journey, but it was really when I met an amazing I mean I want to say teacher, coach, facilitator, guide, shaman, witch doctor I mean he could easily have all of those titles and you know it still wouldn't encompass his spirit. But I met the right person for me to work with, to really break through to, to find that sense of internal peace and coherence. And that's been a huge part of the journey of making peace with what happened but also where I am now, but also where it is that I am going in the future.
Speaker 1:I think that's a really important piece, especially when we talk about the music is the role of the mentor and the teacher, and I think it's also interesting how, at different points in our lives, there's different roles of mentors and teachers that come in and thank goodness we find the ones at the right. What they say, you know.
Speaker 2:When the student is ready.
Speaker 1:The teacher comes. So I imagine that must have been really helpful for you at that time to sort of make sense of what you were going through. And then also to how do I say it? Like I said, it's like we all need that. I think we need a hand to hold when we're going through these experiences because, especially if we're operating in, I want to say, like the normal world, the real world, where we have our careers, we have the ways that we interact, and going through an experience like this, like I said, it breaks all of the rules and so you have to kind of relearn literally how to be a quote unquote normal human in every day life. Because it sort of feels like you're, like is my skin suit on right? Like, am I okay? It's awkward man, it's really awkward. So I'd love to hear more specifically about, like, what types of tools did this teacher help you hone for yourself? Like, what were those sort of gifts that you were given by this teacher?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it's such a good question and it's like I will distill it down to and this may sound cliched, but you know I will distill it down to love.
Speaker 2:You know this teacher taught me compassion and forgiveness and you know there's so much that sits underneath those terms. But I feel like you know, in part remembering that my first career was around working with women who had been in abusive relationships, and so there was a lot of work that I needed to do inside of myself, you know, inside of you know many, many lifetimes, if you will to disentangle disempowerment dynamics. And so I would say that the greatest gift you know that I had from this teacher was actually a relational one, in the sense of like, piece by piece, like going through and passing out and untangling all of my own. You know old stories and distortions about people from the past doing deep work around family and releasing family. You know present and departed family, and I feel like really coming to that beautiful place of compassion and forgiveness then opened, you know, me up to then be able to create healthy love, which is where I went into with real love. That's what I did at Delina.
Speaker 1:What a perfect segue. Tell us more, tell me more, tell me more. It's very cool, because that's the thing too, that's the name of the game here is like really learning how to lean into these places, where the next kind of iteration of our work comes out, and I love that you followed that. So can you tell us a bit about, about real love?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it's.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I feel like it's really interesting because if Lunar Abundance was about self knowledge and personal power in agency, if that was the real lesson there, then I'd say the real lesson in real love is about self worth.
Speaker 2:So understanding not just that you are deserving of love because of course we all are, we have intrinsic value, because we exist, like we are all loveable, we all are worthy of love but really deeply knowing it, like on a cellular level, like actually feeling it in your body that you are worthy of love, rather than a great first step, which is the positive self talk and the affirmations like huge fan of that, and going from that mental level, that intellectual understanding, into the full open knowing of that is really what allows you to be open and available for love, because you have that sense of self love and wholeness inside of yourself first and foremost, which then means that you can receive that love from someone else you know and you can co-create healthy partnership, and so that's really the core medicine, if you will, inside of real love.
Speaker 2:It's like taking these ideas of self love and deserving us out of our mind, like no longer taking it from the neck up, but really having us live and breathe and know that and then navigate the world, the world of love and dating and relationships, yes, but also the world, large, from that place, of self love, self worth and wholeness.
Speaker 1:And your work has been actually very helpful for me and just following you, you share so many beautiful tips and resources on your Instagram which we will link in the show notes to your listener. But I think it really comes back down to, as you said, like owning that self love on a cellular level, so that when I'm walking through the streets it doesn't matter who is in my life, who's out of my life. It's that forgiveness piece which I also want to hear so much about too, but it's like I can own and love myself, every single part of myself, the beautiful, glamorous version of me, and the version of me that you know is curled up on the couch in a black hoodie, eating cheese doodles. You know we love her too. We love all versions of me because she that me, is worthy of love on all levels.
Speaker 1:And that's like a big piece that I think I took with me is also just like honing that sense of self, the worth, but then also just being like girl, like you're awesome and we're good on our own and like we can have a great time on our own, and then from that space being able to find love, from that sort of like filled up cup space and I really took a lot of that and learned a lot of that from you. Something just keeps coming to me and because I do really want to take it into this next chapter of where your work is moving, but I really just it's not even a fully formed question, but I love talking about forgiveness and I'd love to hear your thoughts on how forgiveness plays in to this work with real love, of how you can, even if you're not in relationship, or maybe specifically, if you're not in relationship, how can we work with forgiveness to then be ready, perhaps, to receive love on?
Speaker 1:the other end of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's such a it's such a great question. I'll tell you what the breakthrough was for me on this because, like I shared, you know, my, my teacher, my guide, taught me compassion and forgiveness, but I feel like the piece which really activated and opened inside of myself was self-compassion and self-forgiveness first, and so you know the I mean, and it's it's an interesting thing because this is where I end up going with my work after this. But I found it through real love. It was born through real love, which is that I came to a place where a relationship which had always alluded me like healthy relationship had been one of my own personal pain points. That's why I devoted myself, I think professionally, you know to relationship and to relationship dynamics, for you know what has actually been a couple of decades, you know an amazing relationship now, but it had definitely alluded me.
Speaker 2:And then it came very close to me when I was working, you know, with this teacher, and one thing that really hit me was just how awful I felt when I came close to what it is that I said that I wanted, and again, that made no sense to my conscious mind, because I've been saying I was craving that sense of self-full partnership, like that was what I was so actively putting out into the universe and working towards. And then I came so close to it that it touched me and that was where I absolutely fell apart, to the point where I can remember, like one day, like lying on the grass, like feeling like this might be you know the end because I felt so awful, like it was the only time I felt so angry at the teacher like you know, he's led me down this garden path like everything just felt awful. And then I said to myself, like what is going on? Like actually what's going on? This makes no sense, because I am closer to what it is that I said that I wanted than I ever have been, ever before. And that was where I discovered the unconscious vows and the splinters which we'll get to, you know.
Speaker 2:But that was where I really needed to go a layer deeper inside of myself on the compassion and the forgiveness piece, like to bring it back to your question and that was where I realized the missing piece of the jigsaw for me was that I was not feeling compassion and forgiveness for myself.
Speaker 2:I was feeling it for all of these other people, which was beautiful, but I wasn't directing it inwards inside of myself, and that was actually my breakthrough, like that was my medicine is to stop beating myself up for decisions that I've made in the past, relationships that I had got into where I wasn't treated as I knew I deserved to be treated, relationships that I didn't believe, when I knew I should have left.
Speaker 2:There was so much self-recrimination and self-flagellating, you know, literally whipping myself still, so much anger directed inwards, so much guilt and shame, and it was the balm of self-compassion, self-forgiveness and I'd add into that gratitude. You know this is the core formula which I now work with the unconscious vows, but this is the core piece self-compassion, self-forgiveness and gratitude for all the things that I've done right and really deeply again on a cellular level, anchoring into that, knowing that I hadn't done anything wrong, like it wasn't my fault that I'd made decisions that I had made because of imprinting that I had had or tools that I hadn't been taught, which, of course, you know, as an adult I was able to acquire and learn myself, you know. So, in terms of the forgiveness piece, self-forgiveness was like the point where absolutely everything blasted open for me in terms of self-love, of course, and in terms of, like, actual romantic relationship, yes, but just in terms of self-love.
Speaker 1:So much soul food just in everything that you've shared, and I see myself coming back and listening to this again because there's just so much to take that from that. Thank you, Wow, Mm-hmm. And so you talk about using your specific pain point to follow where you bring your work out, which I feel like is also a big theme in, like, let's bring out the internal muse is like what hurts. And I remember when I first started doing comedy, somebody said to me you have to talk about your pain, and I was like nobody wants to hear that. I was like no, that's not as gross. They're like no, you have to talk about it.
Speaker 1:And I think following our pain points I think can be one of the biggest, I think, catalysts of how we bring out our inner muse. So I'm interested to hear, then, from this work if you could bring us into this next stage of your work, the unconscious boughs. Yeah, it's so good, I love it. I mean because it's so amazing to see how you've just allowed yourself to follow. Okay, so I started here and then this happened, and then it's like I always talk about going downriver, just putting yourself in the stream and allowing yourself to float downriver. So it feels very organic in the way that you've spoken about how this new, you know, chapter of your work is coming out. So, yes, can you give us an idea of where we go from here down the river into unconscious bound?
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure, what I found, like after that day, when I was like I am in the depths of despair and you know I'm laughing now only like with a huge amount of, like you know, sweetness for that moment where I guess I feel like I'd hit I just you know what, you know, I'd hit that, that darkest before the dawn moment. And sometimes we think that when we hit that moment, oh my gosh, we're way back at the beginning, when in fact we might be even further back than we were before we began, which is how I felt on that day. But the trick is, of course, we're just like one step away from the ultimate you know destination, for whatever that particular you know mission is all about. And so for me, from there, you know, I went back into a deep meditation, actually, you know, and as in, like, I walked back to my home and I sat in the hot tub that I happened to have at that particular time and I meditated and you know what I discovered was two things. One is that I found I actually had an unconscious vow, which was a conscious decision that I had made, to stay single in order to not feel like what it was, that I was feeling that sense of despair, right Like, and that was the splinter, which I'll get to in a moment. That's the second thing. But I realized I had an unconscious vow. So I had made at one point a decision to just stay single, even though I was now saying consciously that I wanted to be in relationship. I can say that for years, but unconsciously, because I made a decision that I put it in my unconscious. No, no, no, as a bit of a workaround, it's actually much better to be on your own. Okay, so that was the first thing. And so bringing that unconscious vow up to the surface is what I did in the meditation in the hot tub after that experience. Oh, okay, great, I can see. Now you know what is actually going on.
Speaker 2:And then, by definition, once you bring something from the unconscious into the conscious, it's no longer unconscious. So it's then conscious and you can decide whether or not you want to work with it. So I was like no, I don't want to work with that anymore. I want to undo that vow. Right, I actually want to be open and available for love. That's the first piece. The second piece then is well, what's the vow really protecting against? And you're never going to make a decision like that, unless you are to your point in pain, like you're going to make a decision like that to say, single in my case. You know you can have unconscious vows in any area. You know that's what I'm moving into now. It's just the university of it, but you're only ever going to make a decision to protect yourself if there's something to protect against. So what's that? You know?
Speaker 2:And here is where we find the splinters. And now the splinters are like splinters in the soul. This is like what I see when I work with people. I see three channels. I see the power channel, the love channel and the peace channel, and I can see where people are splintered. And when I say I see it, I see it with my eyes, you know, which have been blasted open. I've learned how to work with it in a much more targeted way than I did back in 2011.
Speaker 2:But I can see where people are splintered, meaning when they've had difficult experiences, either in this lifetime or predating this lifetime. And usually, by the way, it is predating this lifetime, which is why it is so confusing when we discover like these impediments or these disruptions, I suppose, to the flow, like why is love not flowing? Was my question for inquiry for myself. And then, in discovering that splinter for myself, this love splinter, then turning that compassion, forgiveness back to myself, so really practicing self compassion, self forgiveness on a deep felt level. And then gratitude is a way to magnetize the splinter out. And I just found this, like through trial and error and working with these tools inside of myself, once I took it out it was like it was gone and for me the splinter was actually splintering my sense of self worth. I didn't feel like I was worthy of receiving love. I just didn't feel that it wasn't anything that was me.
Speaker 2:In fact, once we take a splinter out, once we take the vow out or once you undo the vow because the vow is something, an internal thing that we've done the splinter is not internal. The splinter is something that has happened to us or to our ancestors or to our soul and a past life, if your belief system extends to that. Once we take that out, we just return to our true state, and our true state is always going to be one of personal power, self love, wholeness and inner peace, like that's just what our true state is. And so coming back to that true state simply is just going to allow the energy to flow and it's simply going to restore what is already true, which is that a deep knowing that we are, for example, worthy of love.
Speaker 2:Or, for example, if the splinter and vow is in the power channel, for example, if there's some sort of impediment to purpose or prosperity, that we are powerful beings, we are creators. And in the peace channel, when there's going to be some sort of disturbance to a sense of internal coherence, it's going to ultimately result in that sense of inner balance and harmony. That's ultimately what happens. We have all of those three channels open, it's going to be coherent, and so that's what the unconscious vow and the splinter work is. It was born from the real love experience and I did it for years with my real love clients, like just in the area of love. And then they started graduating and getting into relationships and like being open in their true state of love and being like now can we do? Like money, can we do money solutions, can we do these? And I was like, well, okay, we'll give it a go.
Speaker 1:You know why not, why not?
Speaker 2:And I really have found something which, at least in my experience today, has been pretty universal in terms of meeting anybody you know, of any gender, of any challenge that they feel stuck or resistant. It's obviously like it is not therapy I'm not like treating trauma, of course not Like this is a process to really open up into greater expansion and growth, like it's for seasoned spiritual seekers who have tried a lot of different things and haven't been able to get to the root of what is going on, but who are, you know, have an internal architecture that supports, like a deep exploration and a really ready date to drop in and have an embodied experience of self compassion, self forgiveness and gratitude Cause that's the three part formula that magnetizes out these impediments that are not ours and returns us to our true state of flow.
Speaker 1:My goodness, eze, I am so happy that you are in my life, that I know you. I have blown away how freaking gorgeous. And here's the thing I love knowing you now and hearing this now, because it's such a treat to hear this coming from you at this time when you've really honed your skills Like you've really I love that you spoke about how, in the beginning, you could see all of these things within people. But when the gifts first turn on I was just talking about this with a friend the other day it's like when the gifts first turn on, it's like a faucet or like a radio station tuned to literally like every single station. So it takes time for you know, each of us who've gone through this to sort of fine tune it, literally be able to kind of hone it, gather it in, find it so that it can be tuned to a specific station, so that you can actually really really get the full message of what that is.
Speaker 1:And I love how, I love this work that you're doing because it gives people actual practical steps to work through these things. Because I think there's one thing to sort of be aware Perhaps somewhat of you know our unconscious vows. I think all of us have them, I think, also to give. I mean I love, and then, of course, it makes so much sense like not only from love, but then moving it into money, career, you know, anything we can really bring it into. And I love that you're giving people tools To you know if they're ready for it, which I think it takes a lot of self awareness.
Speaker 1:Like you said, it is for the season spiritual seekers like okay, cool, like I'm aware that this is here and I want to work through it and I want to be able to get to the other side of it, because I love that you call it a splinter, because it's literally like the tweezers out right, like it makes so much, make so much sense. Thank you, and I'm so glad that you were able to listen as you went through this process to allow all of this to come out of you in such a beautiful way. And it's so interesting because for each person that this happens to, when the gifts get turned on, it's like we all kind of find our own path. You know our own kind of very special way of serving and I think, your ability to logically sort of put things together and connect ideas and then be able to communicate them with words in a very logical, clear way. It's truly beautiful, and I'm so yeah.
Speaker 2:Thank you for that beautiful reflection. I'm just so happy that it resonates and I feel like, with this practice, it just I feel like it's, it is magic actually, and I feel like to close the loop on what was open in 2011 like what was open for me was magic and I was like whoa, you know the internal Wrestle and discord was like how do I make magic fit in what other people are going to find palatable or comprehensible?
Speaker 2:you know, I'm so like really Relaxing over the years with that and just speaking from my heart, but from a place of, if this resonates, awesome. You know. If it doesn't, this obviously isn't the practice for you. But please always go inside, listen to your own intuition, your own knowing, a pay attention to what Is true for you. You know there's something that feels incredibly like respectful and empowering and also just really fun with that. You know you'll get to decide for ourselves what's going to support us at any given time and I believe that we're going to be pulled into or, in our case, like Re-pulled into each other's fields at a moment where there is resonance, where there's some kind of mutual, mutual gift, mutual lifting 100%. Yeah 100%.
Speaker 1:I love it, I really do. And it's so interesting to because, as you said, it's like a lot of internal struggle. I find it's almost like going through a spiritual puberty where it's like we're having weird little hairs growing out of places, like I don't know what to do with this, and then it takes time To learn how to like okay, let's brush the hair and this is how we take care of ourselves, and then we're able to then make sense of it all and bring it out into the world. But it takes it's an awkward bit of bit of wrestling to do.
Speaker 2:It really isn't. It's gonna kick up so much stuff, isn't it like? I just want to kind of your brief anecdote about a conversation I had yesterday with a beautiful therapist who Was wanting to speak with me to see whether she could refer her single clients to me. You know, for the dating work which I still do, I still help women find love. You know I'm moving more and more into this work in terms of the unconscious house and splinters.
Speaker 2:But yes, you know, sometimes I still get people saying can I refer people to your real program? You know it's such a beautiful comprehensive program around really establishing needs and values, boundaries and all of those kind of things you know. And she said to me what do you do like as if someone comes to you and they're not resonating with your spiritual language or your magical language and you know? So interesting for me to check in with myself on that, because in the past I would have said well, I'll figure out, you know what it is that they need and see whether I can create an offering which will meet them. And there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 2:I think that you know, really responding to the person in front of you can be a beautiful, you know thing to do as well, but I stop myself because I was like you know what it's like if someone isn't Really very spiritual, magical, and I come into, want to work with me, then the best thing for me to do is make a referral or recommendation to somebody else who's really gonna meet them where they're at. And so I think that's probably the biggest marker of where you know you sort of get to your beautiful point when you brush your hair and then you put on your outfits and when you're really ready to stand and look at yourself in the mirror before you go out and say, hey, this is me and this is, this is who I am and this is what I offer and these are the people that I serve.
Speaker 1:And I know that if someone comes and there's not like a perfect fit or a resonance, is nothing wrong, you know, but it's just that there's probably going to be someone else who's gonna support that person more at this time that is such a huge piece and I talk about that a lot with my fellow female entrepreneurs and sort of the wellness and spirituality Fear space, because I think there is that sort of inherent want to meet everybody where they're at and, like you said, serve them okay.
Speaker 1:Well, if you don't like it, like this, like let me. Or watering it down, right, I talk about sometimes I try to give people what they're able to digest I'm gonna say at the level there, at, but what they're ready for, you know in a sense, and at the same time, and then if they're ready, like alright, let's go full blast. Like alright, let's go full blast. And I don't try to baby anyone at the same time, but like the reality is the work that I do, you know, from an outside perspective, if you were to just pure in through my little windows here where I do my sessions, like it's pretty weird, freaky stuff, it's loud, you know there's it gets crazy, right, and that's not going to be for everybody. And I think it's that big sort of like people pleasing aspect of maybe us as women, as well as to be like oh well, let me just change my. Let me just like oh, should I put on a different outfit.
Speaker 1:Like you, like my hair and a different whatever it is right Like oh, I can be this for this, it can be this for you, which also goes into relationships like it just goes into so many of these. How do you want me? It's like nah, like we're not playing that anymore.
Speaker 2:I feel like it's so kind and loving, respect and respectful to everybody involved to just be so fully real about you know, how you do your best work and what it looks like at the outset, so that everyone can make an informed decision like Do we want to step into this container and have this experience? Does it feel aligned? And if not, that's okay. It doesn't mean that there's anything else. It's not a match or not a match for now.
Speaker 2:There's something like I think I agree is so much of the you know, letting go of the chameleon, letting go of the people pleasing, letting go of the performer in there, and it's also like letting go of scarcity and coming into a true abundance mindset, which is that you know there's more than enough. You know, truly, you know there's more than enough and I totally want to acknowledge. You know I'm saying that from a position of privilege, right, you know, I'm living in los angeles, white woman. You know, with plenty of education, plenty of privilege, you know, but it's, it is a really liberating thing. You know, to know and trust that right people are going to be drawn to you at the right time yeah, 100%, it's a big lesson.
Speaker 1:It's a big, big, big lesson, and it's when I continue to move through and it's so refreshing. It's why I love to have these kind of conversations with women like you, where we can sort of show each other hey, girl like I go through it too, we're all pushing through it, we're all working through it. And as we see one woman do it, it's like okay, as I saw you wrote your book out. If, as you can do it, I can do it right. It's like that's where we're here to be, I think, also living examples for other women.
Speaker 1:And as we continue to walk down these paths of, yeah, walking in our purpose, even when it's awkward, even when we go through these weird little spiritual puberty is whatever it is, it's like okay, how can I, how can I? Sort of I love how you've spoken so much, even into this conversation of sort of like literally having your ear tuned to the earth or tuned to the moon, or you're really in this conversation where you're able to listen and follow. And, yeah, there might be those struggles where you're like, ah, this is weird. You know, I have to break through all of these, all of this conditioning, all of what society tells me I should do, to just allow yourself to, yeah, get into that stream. What an honor, what an honor to be in your presence.
Speaker 2:It's very, very, very much like my honor to get to be in this conversation and get to be talking about my work like this with you. Thank you so much for your beautiful questions in the space that you open and hold. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, absolutely. What a gift. So let's wrap it up there, because, my gosh, I just can't wait, because I know there's. Okay, let's hear it. Is there a book coming? What's next for you? How can people work with you? Let us know.
Speaker 2:Yes, so I have People want to know. Yes, I have written another book. I've written a book about the unconscious vows and the splinters, so that is in the pipeline For now. I mean, you know, we all know how long books take.
Speaker 2:That may be another year or two until it sees the light of day, but it is coming. So esicspensercom day and time. So esicspensercom is where you can find out the information about the one-on-one sessions. So I currently do these splinter removal sessions, which are, quite honestly, like life changing, for the right person at the right time. If you're really coming up against the edge of a challenge that you cannot seem to move through, and if what I'm saying about the unconscious vows and the splinters is resonating, go over to esicspensercom and check out more information about that one-on-one service. And then something else that's coming down the pipeline is a training program for that, and so this is something which I wasn't planning on doing right away, but I think the last eight people that I've taken splinters out have asked me how they can then learn the method so that they can do it with themselves and with their friends and family and clients.
Speaker 2:So you know that's something definitely to look out for as well, and reach out to me as esicspenser on Instagram, and so just reach out and say that you're interested and we can have a chat and I'll let you know as that training program develops.
Speaker 1:Perfect. I will link everything in the show notes so, my dear listener, definitely have a look, give her a follow. She shares a lot of really juicy information. I mean, if this conversation is even like a hint of what she has to offer. I mean, there's a lot there and I highly recommend checking out Aziz's website and her podcast, Relove. We got all the links. We got all the links for you. Go check them out. And such a gift. I'm just excited for everything and thank you so much for sharing your journey and I'm really happy that we were able to connect in this way and I got to hear about how you came to this space and into this place in your life. So thank you.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, you're so welcome. It's such a pleasure. Thank you for inviting me on. Like I said, you hold beautiful space and I really appreciate the questions and getting the chance to share a little bit about what's moving through me. So thank you.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you and keep on letting it move through you. We're excited to see where you go. There's always something next down the river of life Little song I made up, goodness gracious. Well, my dear listener, thank you so much for tuning in. I hope that you too, like I have have received some really juicy wisdom. And thank you as he. Once again, thank you to our listener. This has been another episode of the Ode to Joy podcast. What an absolute joy that conversation was. Dear listener, did you love it as much as I did? Because I loved it. And if you loved it as much as I did, why not? While you're here, go ahead, hit the subscribe button, do yourself a favor. And then why not do me a favor? Throw in a review, throw us a couple of stars. Let's spread a little bit of love today. Okay, listen, I love you so much and I'll talk to you again very soon.