Announcer:
You know what that sounds means: it's time for the Michigan DNR's Wild Talk Podcast. Welcome to the Wild Talk Podcast, where representatives from the DNR's Wildlife Division chew the fat and shoot the scat about all things habitat, feathers, and fur. With insights, interviews, and your questions answered the air, you'll get a better picture of what's happening in the world of wildlife here in the great state of Michigan.

Hannah:
Welcome to Wild Talk. I'm Hannah Schauer. Hosting with me this episode is Rachel [Lightener 00:00:35].

Rachel:
Hi Hannah.

Hannah:
Hello. Today a very exciting interview that we have. We'll be talking with Todd Grischke about the arctic grayling restoration going on in the state. This happens to be a listener-suggested topic. Charles wrote in with the suggestion to talk about the grayling restoration. We really appreciate Charles providing this suggestion for a topic. If you have suggestions, let us know. We'd love to hear from you.

Rachel:
Yes, thank you Charles. This is a really exciting interview for us. We're really looking forward to it. After the interview, we'll be answering your questions from the mail bag. But first, we'll kick things off with what's happening around the state.

Announcer:
Pure Michigan hunt applications are on sale now. If you want your shot at what is considered Michigan's ultimate hunt, pick up a five dollar application or two. There's no limit to the number you can buy. If you're one of the three lucky winners, you'll get a prize package worth thousands, as well as licenses for elk, bears, spring and fall turkey, antlerless deer, and first pick in a managed water fowl area for a reserved hunt. Purchase anywhere hunting licenses are sold or online at michigan.gov/pmh.

Rachel:
Now it's time for some updates on what's going on with the Wildlife Division around the state. Today we're going to start in the north. Hannah, what's going on in the UP?

Hannah:
Staff in the upper peninsula want to remind our listeners that there are still a few days left to apply for the UP Deer Habitat Improvement grants. Keep in mind that applications must be postmarked by March 6. The UP Deer Habitat Improvement Partnership Initiative is a cooperative grant offered by the Wildlife Division now in its 12th year. More than 850,000 dollars in hunter license has been invested in deer habitat improvement projects through this program. Over the last 12 years, almost 100 projects have been completed and thousands of acres of deer habitat have been improved. In addition, project partners have contributed nearly half a million dollars in matching funds, which has helped to grow the program benefits for wildlife.

Hannah:
Groups eligible for these grants include organizations with a formal mission to promote wildlife conservation and/or hunting, such as sportsman clubs, conservation district land conservancies, industrial landowners with more than 10,000 acres, or private land affiliations where two or more unrelated persons jointly 400 or more acres. Grants target projects on land ownerships other than state-owned lands. Private individual, private industrial, school forest, federal conservancy, and other lands are eligible for these grants. The maximum amount of individual grants is 15,000 dollars and the minimum is 2,000 dollars. They do require a 25% match. The projects should produce tangible deer habitat improvements, build long term partnerships between the DNR and the outside organizations, and showcase the project benefits to the public.

Hannah:
Previous projects funded under the initiative have focused on improving winter deer habitat by planting long lived conifer and scarification for conifer regeneration. Summer range deer habitat projects have included planting hard mast oak trees, wildlife orchards, creation of hunter walking trails, rehabilitation of historic wildlife openings, native prairie restoration. All different kinds of projects have been funded with this grant money. Some past grant recipients have also facilitated youth hunting and veteran opportunities on these improved private lands.

Hannah:
If you plan to apply, project applications must be postmarked by Friday, March 6, so coming up very soon. Successful applicants will be notified by Wednesday, April 1. The complete grant application package is available on the DNR website at michigan.gov/dnrgrants.

Rachel:
That sounds like a great program. What an excellent way to spend money.

Hannah:
Yes. There are a lot of great opportunities in addition to the UP grants, but that's the application period that's going on right now. We really want to make sure that people who are interested get their applications in before time runs out.

Hannah:
Let's jump below the bridge. Rachel, what do we have going on in the lower northern region?

Rachel:
Over in Roscommon County, biologists and staff are scouting out black bear den sites as part of a long-running research project. It's super cool. This awesome project allows us to gather biological information on bears to assist in managing their population. After a den site is located with the potential bear inside, biologists evaluate whether that bear is a good candidate for the project. If so, they'll be fitted with the radio tracking collar so that we can track their movements and reproduction in the following years.

Rachel:
This year there are seven sows with collars. We're current tracking them and locating their den sites. Most of them will get a special visit from DNR staff sometime soon. These bears will likely be fitted for new collars since they're growing. They might need a bigger collar or they might need to be repaired or replaced. Then data will be collected from those bears. Out of those seven, there is one that has newborn cubs this year. That sow has yearling cubs. We'll also collect some information from them as well. Once we've finished fitting those collars, collecting hair and tooth samples, the bears will be put back into their den to resume their long winter slumber.

Hannah:
Very cool. I think it'd be a lot of fun to visit one of those den sites with our staff. You know what else is cool about some of the bears that have the radio collars? Our year in a life of a Michigan black bear education curriculum for middle schoolers has some of this tracking data, so the students can sort of follow the bear's movements around on a map and see where the bears go when they're up and about in the spring and summer months. We do use this data for other fun projects, too.

Rachel:
What an awesome use of data. Not only are you using it for biological scientific decisions, but you're also using them for education and young children. That's amazing.

Rachel:
That's what's going on in northern lower. Hannah, what's going on in the southeast region?

Hannah:
In the southeast waterfall seasons have ended, so our wetland game areas... or wetland wonders... have been quiet as of late. But we are looking forward to seeing lots of folks out at our spring birding tours, which will be held in late March and early April. We'll be telling you more about these great tours later on. For now, we'll just say that they're awesome so don't miss them.

Hannah:
Southeast region staff have been making improvements to some upland hunting areas by removing invasive species like buckthorn, honeysuckle, and autumn olive, and also building brush piles for rabbitat, otherwise known as rabbit habitat but it's way more fun to say rabbitat. The forests and forest edges of southeast Michigan can be great places for hunting small game like rabbits and squirrels, so be sure to head out to a place like the Waterloo State Recreation Area or the La Pier State Game Area for some awesome small game hunting opportunities before your base license expires on the 31st.

Hannah:
Finally, Rachel, how about an update from the southwest region?

Rachel:
It is definitely March in southwest Michigan. It feels like we've had a long winter without a lot of snow. It's just been gray and I'm kind of going stir crazy. If you're anything like me and you're going a bit stir crazy and you need a good excuse to get out to some new areas or learn some cool new stuff, southwest has some cool stuff going on this month.

Rachel:
Over in Macomb County, at the Flat River State Game Area, there's a new path that was just put in on the area to complete the north and south ends of their new turkey tract. If you're not familiar with turkey tracts, they're these areas on public land that have been managed for really awesome turkey hunting opportunities. The turkey tract is well laid out. There's an evident trail that's there. It has a great ease of access, so hunters of all types can get out onto this area. The latest section that was just finished is a path that was craved out to connect the two existing trails. You can go for a longer hike, you can really scout out the area. Spring turkey season doesn't start for a bit but now is the perfect time to get into the woods to scout out your spot and enjoy some time outside. 

Rachel:
The Flat River State Game Area is a beautiful spot. This particular new path takes you through some diverse areas. There's some dry forested high uplands, and then there's some low wetland spots. It opens up to this huge open field with the bench that was just put in that makes for a great opportunity for wildlife watching.

Hannah:
Sounds fantastic.

Rachel:
It is. The wildlife that comes through there is the charismatic wildlife that we really love to watch. There's tons of turkeys and deer and songbirds. It's a great spot. If you want to learn more about this area or visit the Flat River State Game Area, you can find more at the turkey tracts website, which we can link in the show notes.

Rachel:
If you're looking for something indoors, you should come join us at the Pierce Cedar Creek Institute in Barry County on March 21. March 21 is a Saturday and it's the Barry County Science Festival. It's free and open for everyone to join in. There will be tons of hands-on science experiments and demonstrations, and from what I hear there will be a giant blow-up solar system for visitors to walk through. There's a lot of great activities for people of all ages to go and enjoy and learn something new, hopefully! The Wildlife Division will be there with lots of our partners. If you haven't been to the Pierce Cedar Creek Institute, it's an incredible facility. They do a lot with connecting people to science and the outdoors. I'm really excited to attend the event and hopefully some of you will be, too.

Hannah:
It sounds like another fun.

Rachel:
That's all we have from around the state. Next, we'll be chatting with Todd Grischke.

Announcer:
There are many camping and lodging opportunities available in Michigan state parks. When you choose state park campgrounds, you get more than just a campsite. State parks offer a diverse range of recreational opportunities including hands-on instructional classes, nature programs, places to fish, boat launches, family friendly events, and much more. Reservations can made six months in advance, so why wait? Visit midnrreservations.com, or call 1-800-44-PARKS to make a reservation.

Hannah:
Welcome back to Wild Talk. Today we're joined by Todd Grischke from the Fisheries Division. He's going to tell us more about the arctic grayling. First, Todd, thanks for being here. We're glad to have you.

Todd:
Thanks for having me.

Hannah:
Before we dive into the arctic grayling, can you tell us a bit about your background in fisheries and your current role within the DNR?

Todd:
Sure. I came over to the Department of Natural Resources in 1998. I used to work Michigan United Conservation Clubs for nine years prior to that. Since '98, I've had several different positions within Fisheries Division. I was in the regulatory affairs unit for a while dealing with fishing regulations. I moved into the Lake Heron basin coordinator role for several years. I'm now the assistant chief of the division. It's been an exciting ride.

Hannah:
I bet. It sounds like it. I'm sure all of our listeners are dying to know more about the arctic grayling and what's going on with that particular fish. For some background, tell us about this fish that used to be found in Michigan: it's history in the state and why there's no longer a large population here.

Todd:
Arctic grayling are very unique in that they were native to only two states in the lower 48: Michigan and Montana. For decades, back in the 1800s to the early 1900s, they were popular both commercially and recreationally. What was happening during that time, though, was a lot of the logging practices... which at the time we were essentially cutting many of our forests and using the streams to transport those logs down to mills, where they were processed... that whole process took its toll on our river systems: not just arctic grayling, many species were impacted by that, but arctic grayling especially. It destroyed stream habitats, the river banks... the vegetation was gone, high loads of sediment, and of course lots of logs. In combination with the reintroduction of over native species that were disappearing at the same time and stocking of nonnative fish such as brown trout at that time was high interest. A lot of fish were stocked.

Todd:
In combination with a lot of unregulated fishing during the late 1800s, the logging, and habitat destruction, it essentially wiped out arctic grayling. By 1936, the last arctic grayling was captured in one of our streams. We've considered them extirpated since that time, extirpated meaning that they're not extinct from the landscape... they still exist in Montana and Alaska and other parts of the country... but they're no longer in Michigan. For many different reasons, it's a good opportunity to look at reintroduction.

Hannah:
This is a case with a lot of our threatened or endangered species or other species that have been extirpated: that combination of over-harvest and habitat loss. It definitely sounds like a similar situation with the grayling.

Todd:
Very much so. We have available to us now not just history to tell us what we did wrong and what we can do better, but there's also new technology available through efforts of other states, specifically Montana, that have successful in reintroducing grayling. Technology has caught up. Fish culture has caught up. And of course, interest and moment has caught up for arctic grayling.

Hannah:
Speaking of the interest, why is the DNR attempting to restore this native species right now? What interest has there been that has peaked this resurgence and interest in the arctic grayling?

Todd:
I mentioned the technology piece. I also mentioned some of that interest. I think that a lot of pieces are coming together at the same time. Montana wanted to reintroduce arctic grayling into several of their streams. They're now looking at a full decade of success. They utilize what's called RSIs, or remote site incubators. They're five gallon buckets that are placed in streams that allow arctic grayling eggs to be placed in them. As those eggs hatch, the young fry spill over into the stream environment, then they're imprinted where they're hatched and they grow into adults in that location. That has been very successful because it's a naturally reproducing stock over time.

Todd:
That technology is what we're looking at. We watching them being successful for several years and thought, "It's about time for us to explore that here in Michigan." At the same time... going back to 2010 through 2013... Michigan Tech University and Little River Band of Ottawa Indians did some research on stream habitat in the upper Manistee. The upper Manistee was one of the many steams in the lower peninsula that had arctic grayling. They did that stream evaluation with the intent of evaluating whether or not that habitat is still conducive to arctic grayling.

Todd:
That was 2013 when that was published. In 2014, 2015, we started looking at a collaboration with them for arctic grayling rehabilitation. That turned into a foundational partnership between the state of Michigan and the Little River Band of Ottawa Indians, which was formalized in 2016. Since then, the partnership has grown to more than 45 individuals, universities, agencies, cities, foundations, corporations. Many people now have focused on this effort and build a lot of momentum for reintroduction. The technology is there. The timing was right. The momentum culturally... it's a very important fish culturally and historically. Everything kind of came together and away we go.

Hannah:
There we go. I know we want to hear more about the partners but I'm really curious: you mentioned these buckets for the eggs and you wanted the fry to imprint. Is that because the arctic grayling is a migratory species? Does it move about the river and come back to the same place to spawn?

Todd:
That's a great questions. A lot of our salmonids... chinook, steel head, brown trout... are migratory. They move into our streams, our tributaries, at some point in their lifecycle, but then they move back out to the Great Lakes. In this case, what's important about imprinting for arctic grayling... which are not necessarily migratory to the Great Lakes... they do migrate within river systems for different parts of their lifecycle. What's important about the imprinting is that when we stock fish that are raised in a hatchery system, they don't necessarily home in on the location that they're stocked unless they're stocked at the exact time that their body is imprinting. If they're stocked after that, they have no real concept of that's home.

Todd:
With arctic grayling, the whole concept is that we're not moving into this reintroduction effort thinking it's a stocking event every year. We're going into this trying to establish a self-reproducing population. For them to imprint in that location is critical because they will use that as their home base. The eggs that they produce as adults... the fry... will also be imprinted in that stream. We're hoping to kickstart this by utilizing those RSIs... those buckets... and that technology, but at some point we're hopeful that the fish themselves are able to take off on their own and establish themselves in the stream.

Hannah:
How interesting.

Rachel:
It sounds like the locations of the imprints and the RSIs is really important. Are you doing those releases in the areas where grayling were traditionally found? Or are you moving into new areas?

Todd:
In the action plan... which is really the strategic plan for this whole effort and that document was produced after that foundational partnership took place in 2016 and then took about a year for us to put together... we identify that one of our goals is to reestablish arctic grayling in those areas where they were historically found. That doesn't mean that every single stream that held grayling is going to be able to contain grayling. It's just that we want to focus on the streams that we know historically held arctic grayling and give us the best chance of success. A lot of the upfront work that we're doing right now is looking at that stream habitat and evaluating it to see what the current conditions are: what is the temperature regime? The flow? The substrate? The competition with other species? What does that look like today and is that still a location that would work for arctic grayling, considering it's much different than it was back in the late 1800s?

Todd:
Our initial attempts are going to focus on just a few streams. Over time, we may see that grow, but it will most likely never reach the number that historically held arctic grayling. It probably won't be that many overall just because our river systems have changed so much.

Rachel:
Out of curiosity, traditionally where grayling found? Are they a regionally based fish? Are they usually only found in the northern lower peninsula of Michigan or the upper peninsula?

Todd:
That's a great question. A lot of people think that they were throughout the state, including the upper peninsula. For most of our work, we've found that they were concentrated in the northern part of the lower peninsula, so north of the Muskegon River up around the tip into the Au Sable, for example. Some of your well known rivers... the Au Sable, the Maple, the Jordan, the Manistee, the Boardman... are all high quality trout streams that historically supported large populations of arctic grayling. In fact, the Au Sable River has a town... Grayling... that was named after the fish. There were so many fish in these rivers. In fact, it was the dominant salmonid.

Todd:
The northern part of the lower peninsula is where these we found mostly. Although one of the last fish that was captured was in the Otter River in the west end of upper peninsula, we believe that fish was there most likely due to a stocking event and not a natural population.

Rachel:
I was going to ask if it was a chicken or egg type of conversation when it comes to naming the grayling: if the city came first or if the city was names after the fish. I'm glad you touched on that.

Rachel:
Just to bring it back to talk about some of the other organizations and partners in this process, it seems like there's a lot of people invested in this restoration project. Could you highlight what our role is and some of those partners that have helping the restoration?

Todd:
Yes. It is large. In fact, it's almost overwhelming, the amount of support that we've received on this project. 45 partners in anything is amazing. Many of those partners have been instrumental in helping us with fundraising, with some of the research on the streams, the RSI work, which is being done by the Little River Band of Ottawa Indians, but the fundraising component... which we haven't touched on yet... is a big piece of this puzzle. We set out to do this reintroduction initiative recognizing that is was going to be an expensive venture but also recognizing that we could not do it ourselves. In fact, we've put 250,000 dollars towards the effort as a department, but we're relying solely on outside contributions to make this work. 

Todd:
Our fundraising goal is 1.2 million and we've raised about 700,000 dollars so far. A lot of that is in the form of big donations. Consumers Energy Foundation was a big up front contributor for some of the stream work. The Wanger Foundation has contributed several hundred thousand dollars to both the stream work as well as research that's being done at Michigan State University. A PhD student... Nicole Watson... is doing some work at Michigan State to help look at an address competition between arctic grayling and the fish that are in our streams now, including brook trout and brown trout.

Todd:
Those partners are helping in a lot of different ways. Going into 2020 now, looking at stream work and stream evaluations, Little River Band is there. Little Traverse Bay of Odawa Indians is going to be helping us. University of Michigan is helping us. Grand Valley State University... You can see this is spilling over into a lot of different areas, a lot of different interest groups, organizations, coming together for a common cause. It's exciting and also critical to success.

Rachel:
With the restoration specifics, when we talk about reintroducing a wildlife species to an area often we make modifications to the habitat. What are some of the specific types of work we're doing in Michigan? Can we modify watersheds and river streams? Or is it mostly these remote site incubators we're placing?

Todd:
We're not heading into this to modify the habitat to accommodate arctic grayling. We're seeing if the habitats that have been modified as a result of our human induced-changes... whether that's dams, culverts, roadways, reintroduction or stocking of other species... all of these things and changes to the landscape have made the streams that historically held arctic grayling much different. We're evaluating and measuring that and we're saying, "Are they still viable streams for arctic grayling?" No changes, necessarily. We're just hoping that there are stretches or reaches of streams that are still capable of supporting arctic grayling through their entire lifecycle.

Todd:
What fry and small fish need in the stream is much different from what adults need. Adults are going to need to move to find food or other resources... temperature or whatever it may be... some time in their lifecycle. We need to find those streams or areas that can support that entire life history of arctic grayling. That is critical because of this reliance on self-sustaining populations. We're not going to be rely on hatcheries. Although we're relying on them to kickstart the program, we're not relying on them long term. At two of our facilities, we're going to maintain arctic grayling brood stock. That means we're going to be holding adults over time and we're going to be taking eggs and milt from those adults and taking those eggs and putting them into the streams to start the program.

Todd:
In order for that to happen, one of our partners is actually the Alaska Fish and Game Department. About two years ago we decided that the best place to get that foundational genetic stock was from Alaska: the Chena River. The reason we did that is that that population is 100% natural. It's never been stocked. It's as genetically diverse as possible in the wild. We thought drawing from that to take our brood stock source of wood would be the best thing. Starting in 2019, we took the first eggs from the Chena River with the help of Alaska Fish and Game, transported them back. They were reared at Michigan State University as part of Nicole's project that I mentioned. Then we transferred them to one our facilities and they're now in quarantine. Those fish are going to be moved up to Marquette, one of our other fish production facilities. Then coming in 2020 is the next batch of brood stock to reinvigorate that genetics into our brood stocks.

Rachel:
That's a long ways for fish to travel.

Hannah:
Yes, it is.

Rachel:
I guess my last question is what's the end goal here? You mentioned that you have a management plan. What would you consider restored? Are you looking for a specific population number or a certain amount of streams that have a viable population?

Todd:
The answer to that is yes. There's a lot of goals in this project and there's not really an ultimate end game here because evaluating or defining success is up your perspective. Naturally sustaining populations of arctic grayling is the goal. We do want this program to be self-supporting. But does that mean one stream? Five streams? 20 streams? That's undefined. Some people define success as being able for anglers to go out and capture arctic grayling as part of our complex of fish that we can fish for now. That would be a fantastic outcome and goal, but it's not necessarily the only way to measure success. Along the way, we're finding in this that incremental success is really what we need to stay focused on. Getting the brood stock established is a success story. Getting the money raised so that we could install ultraviolet equipment at Odin that allowed us to bring the eggs in from Alaska and raise them was a huge success and milestone. Utilizing the RSI technology in Michigan will be a success because it hasn't been done yet. That remains to be seen. Taking the eggs from a mature arctic grayling and putting them into the streams is going to be a measure of success.

Todd:
You're getting my point here that's there's all of these different steps. One thing that we have stressed through this whole effort is that it's truly a marathon not a sprint. This is not a two year project. This is potentially a 10, 15, or even a 20 year project. It has to be measured with that concept in mind as opposed to, "We're going to be done with this shortly." A lot of things can define success and we're really excited that we're still at this point where we're feeling like the momentum is till building and we're starting to recognize some success in the program.

Rachel:
If there were some groups or individuals who wanted to learn more or potentially donate to you guys, is there website they can go to to learn more?

Todd:
There is. It's migrayling.org. We maintain that website with our partnerships, with some of the research activities that we've been doing. A description of this program... We also have a fiduciary: the [Potaski 00:34:54] Harbor Springs Area Community Foundation. They have willingly stepped up and said, "Yes, we will serve as the fiduciary." They're a 501c3. Peep individuals, organizations, corporations can donate directly to them and they're helping to administer the monies. Of course, the Michigan Department of Natural Resources can take direct gifts and we have received direct gifts to support the Michigan arctic grayling initiative, but the best way to learn about it is to get to that migrayling.org site. There are links available to both the Potaski Harbor Springs Area Community Foundation as well as information on how to donate directly to this effort.

Hannah:
Perfect. We'll be sure to include a link to that website in our show notes for folks as well.

Rachel:
Thank so much, Todd, for joining us today and providing all that awesome information on this valuable project. We appreciate your time.

Todd:
No problem. Thanks for having me.

Rachel:
Stick around. Next up we'll be answering your questions from the mail bag.

Announcer:
It's that time of year again: coyote breeding season. Don't be surprised if you see more coyote activity during the next couple of months. Coyotes are found statewide and can survive just about anywhere. Coyotes can become comfortable living near people particularly if there food sources available. Remove attractants like trash bins, bird feeders, and pet foods. Take advantage of a coyote's natural fear of humans and scare them off if you see them. Remember, coyotes can be good neighbors to have because they eat plenty of rodents.

Rachel:
Welcome back. Now it's time for us to answer your questions from our mail bag. Adam wrote in asking when the 2020 hunting and fishing licenses would be available for purchase. The 2020 license year has started as of March 1. Now you can purchase your new licenses such as your base hunting license, your fishing license, and whatever else you might need for this year. If you've purchased any licenses or permits already, you may have noticed that the DNR has moved to a new more advanced system for selling hunting and fishing licenses, applications, and ORV and [inaudible 00:37:21] permits online or at retail agents locations state wide. This new system went live in mid-February and replaces the old 26 year old system, allowing us to upgrade license sales technology and provide new equipment to license retailers. If you've used this system or you plan to soon, we hope that you have an easy time buying your new hunting and fishing licenses and then have a good time using them here in 2020.

Rachel:
You can purchase your Michigan licenses online at michigan.gov/dnrlicenses.

Hannah:
I think the new system comes with some additional features for folks as they're purchasing licenses. It should make the whole buying process a bit easier and more streamlined for you.

Rachel:
Excellent. Get into the woods and waters faster.

Hannah:
Absolutely.

Hannah:
I've got a question from Amber who wrote in asking about the removal of a bat colony in her attic. If you've found a bat in the living quarters of your home, or it may have come into physical contact with a person or pet, you need to be sure to contact your county health department right away to determine if the bat needs to be submitted for disease testing. This is because it's possible for bats, like all mammals, to carry rabies. You should never try to touch or handle a bat without adequate protection because there's no way to tell just by looking at it if it's sick or not.

Hannah:
Additional information about rabies and what to do with a bat in your living quarters... or that you may have come into contact with... can be found at michigan.gov/rabies. If you just need assistance removing a bat or a bat colony from your home or building... in this case, if they're just in your attic and haven't gotten into your living quarters at all... you can contact a wildlife damage and nuisance control permitee to remove any bats. These companies and organizations are permitted by the DNR to utilize a variety of control measures... both lethal and nonlethal techniques... to remove bats, including those large colonies of multiple bats from homes or buildings. Those are the folks that can assist in that regard. But for any bats that have been found in the living quarters of your home and/or may have come into physical contact with a person or pet, you'll want to get in touch with your county health department to determine if that bat needs to be submitted to them for disease. It's better to be safe in that regard.

Rachel:
Thank you. It's very helpful information. I feel like you get bats in your house every once in a while and you need to know this stuff.

Hannah:
I've had a few in my house in the past. Luckily they didn't come into contact with us and we were able to open the door or the window and wait for them to find their way out, but certainly it's better to be safe than sorry if you're not sure.

Hannah:
If got one final question here. Jacob says he's interested in hunting on HAP lands and wonders if they can be used for small game hunting. HAP lands... or the Hunter Access Program properties... are private lands that are open to public hunting. What happens is the land owner who signs up to open their private property to public hunters will designate what type of game may be hunted on their property. Many properties are open for small game hunting. You can find a current listing of all the Hunter Access Program lands and what hunt type they're open to by visiting michigan.gov/hap. Please remember when visiting HAP lands to register at the property headquarters before hunting on the property. Then you'll know if there are any permits available that day for that property, because there's a limited amount each day and it's first come first serve. You'll want to keep that in mind. Additional information about each property and what they're open to and additional HAP hunting land rules and information can be found at michigan.gov/hap.

Hannah:
As we zip this segment to a close, remember: if you have questions about wildlife or hunting, you can call 517-284-WILD, email us at dnr-wildlife@michigan.gov, or stop by one of our offices. Your question could be featured on the next mail bag.

Announcer:
Do you know that Michigan lies where the Atlantic and Mississippi flyways intersect? This brings over 340 species birds to Michigan each year. Follow MI Birds on Facebook to learn more about our feathered friends, year round guided bird walks, stewardship events, and community science opportunities near you. MI Birds is an education and outreach program created by Audubon Great Lakes and the Michigan DNR. Search MI Birds on Facebook. That's M-I Birds.

Rachel:
March is usually when cabin fever reaches its peak in our great state. Folks are looking for ways to get outside and enjoy the beginning signs of spring in Michigan.

Hannah:
Definitely.

Rachel:
I mentioned it earlier and it's so true. I feel like I'm going stir crazy. It won't be too long and we'll be hearing spring peepers and chorus frogs and plenty of bird song.

Hannah:
It will fabulous. I love the spring frog calls. Those are probably my favorite part of spring. In addition to frogs, nothing says spring like the calls of red wing blackbirds and sandhill cranes. As I mentioned earlier, some great places to hear those sounds are Michigan's wetland wonders. Michigan's wetland wonders include the seven premiere managed waterfall hunt areas in the state. Those are Fennville Farm Unit at the [Alagan 00:43:18] State Game Area, the Fish Point State Wildlife Area, the Saint Claire Flat State Wildlife Area on Harsen's Island, Muskegon County Waste Water Facility, Nayanquing Point State Wildlife Area, Point [Mueleyay 00:43:31] State Game Area, and the Shiawassee River State Game area.

Rachel:
The highlights of these birding tours may include diving and dabbling ducks in full breeding plumage, trumpeter and [tundris 00:43:42] swans, osprey, bald eagles, sandhill cranes, and so much more. The tours will be led by a wildlife biologist, MI Bird staff, and volunteers from Ducks Unlimited and local Audubon groups. The tours may include a sneak peak driving tour into refuge areas that are normally closed, so this seems pretty exclusive and awesome.

Hannah:
Definitely. It's pretty cool to be able to caravan around these areas that are usually closed to vehicle traffic, especially at some of the larger state game areas like Shiawassee River and Point Mueleyay.

Rachel:
Bird tours will be held in late March and early April. All these tours will begin at 9:00 AM except for Maple River, who like to get a bit of an earlier start at 8:00 AM. Fish Point, Fennville Farm, and Maple River will all be hosting their tours on March 28, which is a Saturday, so book it on your calendars.

Hannah:
On Saturday, April 4, Nayanquing Point, Point Mueleyay, and Harsen's Island will have their tours. Shiawassee River will host theirs on Sunday, April 5, and then Muskegon Waste Water on Saturday, April 11.

Rachel:
Muskegon Waste Water is actually a great place to see northern shovelers and ruddy ducks in huge numbers in the spring. Like, thousands and thousands of birds. It's like a floating feather bat. It's really unique.

Rachel:
Most tours will meet at the state game area's headquarters building. Please dress for the weather and bring your binoculars or spotting scopes if you have them just in case you want to spot something from a long range.

Hannah:
And don't forget your boots as well. The ground might be a bit muddy being as it's spring. We'll include a link to our show notes with more information about our spring birding tours, so be sure to check that out if you're interested in coming on one of these adventures with us.

Rachel:
We would really encourage you to visit and like the MI Birds Facebook page as well, which also has information about these birding tours as well as awesome information about Michigan's diverse and exciting bird life.

Hannah:
We really can't wait for spring, if you hadn't noticed. And we cannot wait to see you at one of these wetland wonders.

Rachel:
That wraps up another month. We'll see you back here in April for another episode of the Wild Talk Podcast. Thank you for tuning in.

Hannah:
We'll see you then.

Announcer:
This has been the Wild Talk Podcast, your monthly podcast airing the first of each month and offering insights into the world of wildlife across the state of Michigan. You can reach the Wildlife Division at 517-284-9453, or dnr-wildlife@michigan.gov.