What If It Did Work?
What If It Did Work?
Why Modern Leadership Must Multiply People
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If people can quit with two clicks, what actually keeps them following you? We dig into that uncomfortable truth with Reed Nyffler, entrepreneur, leadership strategist, and author of Lead Exponentially, as we challenge the old power-and-title model of management and replace it with something harder: being a leader worth choosing.
We talk about leadership as influence, why servant leadership is the only style that scales, and how modern teams see through empty mission statements faster than ever. Reed breaks down why so many leaders get stuck in linear growth, then offers a simple lens that changes decision-making overnight: stop solving circumstantial complaints and start making structural calls that set direction, standards, and measurable outcomes. We also get real about performance, accountability, and why “everybody gets a ribbon” thinking eventually breaks the leader and the culture.
For entrepreneurs, the operator-to-leader shift becomes practical with a schedule audit and delegation strategy that starts with repetitive hourly tasks, builds training speed, and frees your time for higher-value work. We connect culture to ownership by taking responsibility when things go wrong, placing credit with the people who earned it, and rewarding good judgment even when results miss. We even touch the AI era, self-driving cars, and why stability plus authenticity is now a competitive advantage in leadership development.
If you’re building a business, scaling a team, or trying to become a transformational leader instead of a boss, press play, then subscribe, share this with a friend who leads people, and leave a review with your biggest takeaway.
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Cold Open And Welcome
SPEAKER_00I never told no another my whole life. I've been holding back every time I know my gun so I can do but it's still gonna hear a voice.
SPEAKER_04All right, everybody, another day, another dollar, another one of my favorite episodes of my favorite podcast, because I am biased. What if it did work? Now, welcome back. Where we talk with entrepreneurs, leaders, and people who refuse to play small, instead choose to build something meaningful. Today's guest is someone who has spent his career studying what separates good leaders from truly transformational ones. Joining us today is Reed Niffler and Entrepreneur, leadership tragist, and the author of the powerful book Lead Exponentially. Reed's message is simple but challenging. Most leaders grow on a linear scale. But the leaders who change companies, cultures, and communities learn to lead exponentially. In this episode, we're going to talk about why traditional leadership models are failing, how leaders unintentionally limit the growth of their teams. The mind shaft mindset should require to lead at a higher level. Why leadership is less about control and more about multiplying people. If you're an entrepreneur, a manager, or someone trying to build a team in a culture that actually performs, this conversation is going to challenge the way you think about leadership.
Leadership As Influence
SPEAKER_01How's it going, brother? How's it going, Reed? It's going great, Omar. Thank you for having me. Uh, excited to hopefully uh challenge people to step up their leadership aspir aspirations.
SPEAKER_04Well, I I've always wanted, I I I love this question. And do you believe that anybody can be a leader?
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. I think fundamentally, uh, you know, we're we're making leadership decisions and leader, let's boil leadership down first. Leadership is influence, right? So we're influencing a decision as a leader, we're leading an outcome, a decision towards an outcome, right? So even if you think about that at our earliest stages, right? I remember having my first childborn, and uh, they were influencing my day immediately, right? I mean, they're crying, they're hungry, and they're influencing my day. So there were some elements of early leadership that are redirecting my activity. Then my job was to determine how did I respond to that and lead over time. And so, you know, obviously we progressed through childhood and and and beyond, we can see that we have influence of our friends, right? And and ultimately they look to us as a leader, and that reinforced that in my life and career. That, you know, other friends are like, hey, what should we do today? You know, some basic things. And then ultimately you're like, wait a minute, if I'm gonna choose what we're gonna do, let's make it valuable for all parties. And that's how I began my leadership journey.
SPEAKER_04Now, what first led you though down to that path of studying leadership and organizational growth? What did was it like as a young kid you uh you wanted to be like the class leader, leadership, government, SGA, and all that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, a great question. I think early on, uh whether it was in sports or otherwise, I saw that that you know, it when things are always better when there's a better leader, right? I mean, growing up and and whether the teacher was better, where whether the coach was better, the environment was better for the students or the athletes, right? And so I thought, okay, if I see a difference in how people are making decisions, coach, teacher, you know, I can possibly make decisions that would be even better than that. I mean, I think we are all armchair quarterbacks in our own lives, right? And so we look down and say, hey, these are things I would do better in the same position. And I began to challenge myself to say, okay, what can I do with the influence I have now? And then, you know, that began testing and trying that. And so that was kind of early stage of my career in life, and then graduated college and and began getting in an organization and seeing the impact of that, and then recognizing that you know there were people that were interested in following my leadership. And so the organization continued to grow, and that's led to the organization I have now, and ultimately the book.
SPEAKER_04I'll read, was there ever a moment in your career where when you realized just the traditional leadership model, it was dead or just wasn't enough?
Why Hierarchy No Longer Works
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think ultimately, as you know, you look at leadership, right? I think you know, it's fundamentally the same where you're leading people to an outcome, but the approach you're taking is different, right? And you know, we live in an in a world now where people can choose a lot of things themselves, right? They our life is not necessarily chosen for us. There's not a only a handful of organizations you've worn up for. You can choose what videos you want to watch, you can choose what podcasts you want to listen to. And so you then, with the advent of choice, you have to add value. And so the old leadership model of doing so by hierarchy, I think that's what you're referring to, Omar, where you have to, because I'm the person that's ruling over you, the king or ruler or judge is gone. And so now we have a choice to who we follow. And I think that's what that old that's the new model, right? And so I think we lit we have a generation that's forthcoming that has more autonomy than any generation has ever had before. You can consume anything you want, anywhere you want, at any time. And so uh that means that I will have to choose if it's best for me, and it requires a leader to clarify that. I think we see that in in every area of life, and so um that's the new model that I'm trying to promote here is saying be a leader worth following that people will choose to follow. And lead exponentially teaches you how to be a leader that people want to choose to follow.
SPEAKER_04Wow. Now, is there a person or there if was there an actual event that inspired you to write Lead Expon Exponentially?
SPEAKER_01You know, I think actually Lead Exponentially is my second book. And so the first book, and and it's really, I think one thing about writing a book, and I've I've learned this after writing a couple of books, I have a third one that's coming out in the summer of 2026, is that it really helps you think and galvanize your thoughts, you know, the way you're thinking and how you're thinking, and even helps you understand the topics you've written about even more than you had previously. And so it's really an experience for the author as much as it is for the audience. And so the first book was Transform Through Purpose. And and the reason that I was inspired to write that first book is because I saw leaders that were just living life, they're the default life, as I call it. You wake up in the morning, you wait for your email, your text, or or or any circumstance happening, and that's a default. And I said, if we are truly going to, you know, have an outcome and 20 years from now we want to define what our life is, we have to understand what our purpose is. We are created for purpose on a purpose on purpose. So then once we understand our purpose, we lead organizations through our purpose. Then the second step of that is how do we people will start following us? And so they're gonna follow us, so then we want to lead them and then we want to develop them. And so that's where the leadership came as a second book, saying, Now I know what my purpose is. People understand that, they see that clearly in me. They're gonna follow me. I have a job, I have a responsibility as a leader to help the next individual chosen to follow me to have a better life as a result of following me. Right? If I'm a teacher, I have a student in the class that I have a responsibility to have a better life as a result of it. If I'm a coach, I want to make sure that student or that that athlete is better because they were in my uh response uh scope of responsibility. If I'm an organization leader, which is what I am, I want to make sure all the employees and franchisees in our case are are living a better life as a direct result of uh their interaction here. So that's where the lead exponentially principles came in. It was clear that hey, here's how you develop leaders because I saw what worked in certain uh ways that I was leading people and what didn't work. And then I saw a system or a pattern that can work nearly everywhere to develop people. And the principle of lead exponentially is I'm not just leading people. I'm my thought is, and even in your case, Omar, the thought is I'm thinking to your audience and the people that are reporting or leading, being led by your audience. That's who I'm really trying to impact. I want the lives of your audience members to impact the people that are following them. That's who the audience really is, of the people that are following your audience members. And so that's what lead exponentially is about is how do I invest in leaders to make the environments better for those who they're leading, and your audience members are those potential leaders.
SPEAKER_04Many moons ago, I never wanted to be a leader. I it I just kept on running into all these patterns that man, I can do a better job.
unknownRight.
SPEAKER_04Right. Um I I can I can I can make way better decisions, and and that was like all the way from back in college, I was vice president of my fraternity, but but then like even going through corporate America, it was like I had there wasn't any leaders, there was just mainly bosses, right? And then that's that's when I I'm like, man, I I I know my mom thought this was nirvana, was the way to happiness was to to work for people for a million years, but yeah, that that so I I just find it and I I love your book just based on it was different. Now why do so many leaders though they get stuck just in this linear leadership?
Purpose Turns Into Leadership
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think a lot of times they get stuck because as a leader, we're looking inside instead of outside. So, you know, one of the things I always tell people, and and even as I'm I'm preparing for a podcast, I always study the audience first, then the content. Right? Because the audience, and again, if we look in our lives and and any day we have a conversation with 10 people, you know, if we are saying something to a buddy or a significant other or a parent or a child, and it could be the same information if we tell that same exact story the exact same way to all four of those audiences that are in our lives, is it gonna resonate the same way? No, and I think that's the role as a leader is to understand, okay, who's the audience I'm working with, right? Who's the people I'm directly reporting to, and then how do I communicate that information to them? And then ultimately, how does that uh transform or change their life because of the nature of structure of how I communicated that information? And so I think it's our role as a leader is to understand who are we trying to impact, and then as a result of that, how do we best lead them uh so that we can be most effective? And I think uh, you know, that's the the crux of what we're trying to accomplish in leadership.
SPEAKER_04Now to me to be a good leader, you have to have empathy. Why is it those so many bosses on and it's not just me on a personal level, but a lot of bosses are just me, me, me, me, or complete like you know, it's like to lead, you have to serve and yeah, for sure. You're the furthest thing from from being in service, brother, a lot of times with a lot of these people.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, servant leadership is the heart of leadership, right? I mean, because if a leader believes they are there, and I think you're using the word boss, for those people to serve them, they are a boss, they're not a leader, right? They they believe the people that they're because to serve at their will. That's ultimately a king, I think, right?
SPEAKER_04If we go back to exactly, yeah, just do it because you know what, there's no other jobs out there.
SPEAKER_01That's right, off with their head, you know. I mean, uh they there's just uh recourse that that would happen if they didn't follow. And so I think you're exactly right to serve a leadership. And I am in this role because I serve more people, not because I'm served by more people. And so I think that's absolutely the case, number one. And I think to answer your question, why is there so much selfishness? I think that's what the world is saying.
unknownRight?
SPEAKER_01The world is saying be selfish, right? And it's telling us every which direction, right? I mean, I I laugh at this, but you know, Steve Jobs really got it right because he knew one letter is all that mattered, and that's I put i in front of everything iPhone, iPad, iPod, uh, you know, all of the, you know, yeah, you know, all of the above, put i in front of it because that's all people think about anyway. They can't get past themselves anyway. So might as well put it in the front of the word and then everything will sell. And you know, it became one of the most valuable stocks because he understood how powerful selfishness is. And so I think it we're we're as leaders, you're just a byproduct of society. I mean, the world is saying be selfish, right? And so you have to fight our natural interest of self-interest to serve others, and that's very difficult as a result. And quite frankly, self-interest, or I'm sorry, the interests of others is very broad now, right? It used to be that everybody wanted that, you know, eight to five Monday through Friday, you know, good working job. Now it's very broad. Uh, and I really believe this generation, you know, my generation and our generation, uh assuming we're in a similar generation, we we cared about opportunity. Give me the best opportunity, and I don't care where I live or what I do or you know, what I'm doing. The next generation is I want autonomy, meaning I want to live where I want to live, I want to work the way I want to work, and give me the best opportunity that allows me to do that. And so it's a whole different mindset that approaches that, and that's how we have to adjust our leadership style as a result. And so if I'm setting up this next generation to serve me in that same mindset that I had, then I'm not doing a good job. But if I'm serving the next generation in the mindset they have, then I can be an effective leader for that generation as well.
SPEAKER_04Now, do you think maybe the new generation, it's it's they're just ahead of the game because they're not in an alignment because you know they hear they heard from their parents and their grandparents about the evils of corporate America. Oh my gosh, I cannot stand my boss. I cannot stand this place. You know, they they just see me as a number, and it you know, people I'm I mean, when when people get laid off j just to make numbers or whatnot, it's hard to say, yeah, hey, we we all need to get behind this mission, yeah, for sure.
Serving Others In A Selfish World
SPEAKER_01XYZ corporation. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I I have uh studied information transference over time, right? Just the written language. And now, you know, you used to be able to get the newspaper, it was revolutionary to get the newspaper and get print the paper printed for the next day. So you saw what happened yesterday, so information traveled faster. Then it became the radio and the telephone. And if you were next to a device, you could do it, and but you had to wait till the reporter had the information and upload it. Now, I mean, literally, you know, if there's some world thing happening anywhere in the world, within a matter of seconds, we're aware of it because we all have it on our device with our alerts. And so I think the awareness of this next generation, to your point, we don't have to wait 30 years of a career to realize we climbed the wrong tree. You know what I mean? We can see early on where that's at. And I think that's that's inherently what's happening here. Now that that means at the same time is we got to climb a tree, you know, because sometimes when you can see all the trees, you can't decide which one to climb, so you don't climb any. So I think uh there's two two sides of that coin. One is don't climb the wrong tree. I think we learned that from our parents, which is the comment you're making. Conversely, is climb a tree. I think that's what our parents would say. As a parent, I'm saying, hey, you can pick any tree and just start climbing it. You know, you can make your own if you'd like, go plant your own, you can start your own business, whatever it might be. You know, essentially pick a tree and climb it.
SPEAKER_04Well, you know, ever everybody just loves social media, and everybody will find an excuse. Well, I've got, you know, oh, I I still live at home because, you know, it's the the the price of rent. Or yeah, I I still have plenty of time. Gary V told me I've got plenty of time, or look at Harlan Sanders and look at Ray Kroc, and look at all these people that you know they're they didn't hit their stride and and it's like, well, you don't you you know, you're not a a milkshake maker or seller, and you're not gonna find a band of brothers that have this amazing restaurant concept, or you don't have a secret recipe with 13 spices. So you're right. Let's let's move on. You know, let's let's do something now instead of bitching about well, you know, like yeah, it it's easy to uh just say you know, take a step back and go, well, you know what? I can't do it because you know everything's way more expensive. And it's like, well, that you know, people understand that you know the reason why homes were the what 12,000, 20,000 back in the day a million years ago, was because nobody was making a hundred thousand dollars. It's called inflation. So I I mean, you know, we we grew up in the 80s and 90s, and people were living paycheck to paycheck. So it wasn't like, oh my god, I have you know, I have so much excess money to, you know, I I'm thinking of going to Monte Carlo for the summer.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right. I I think the the the point that is relevant here is that ultimately do something, right? Oh, definitely. Man time flies happening, yeah. And I think that's and and it's even cathartic for us. It's so much better for us if we're actually doing something, right? I mean, you know, we feel better when we do something, and we get a benefit out of that. If we're waiting for something to happen to us, uh, you know, that that's always the worst, right? We we when we can drive and and take the lead, it's there, and that's the essence of leadership. I think the the other comment that you were walking down that path of of saying is this who owns our life, right? Because it's really what we're articulating. If we're making an excuse, the economy or the job market, that owns our life, right? Oh, yeah. And whatever excuse we're interjecting owns us because we're adjusting to that.
SPEAKER_04Well, there's people with with way worse circumstances than whatever obstacle that you're given power or or or for that's exactly you know, oh you know, oh, like waiting, and instead of you're right, we are all leaders instead of leading yourself out of whatever mess you're that's right, you're you're sitting on the sidelines waiting for what, waiting for life to get easier, or waiting for you know, a hero because no one's gonna say there's the trap of comparative living, right?
SPEAKER_01We're trying to compare against someone else. Well, they have this, they got that, they started here, their job is this. Well, that you don't you only know their highlights. Social media is gonna show the highlights. Nobody says, Hey, I worked 27 hours to get this done. They show you the finished project, and you it was a snap, right? I mean, or I stayed up all night to get my homework. Nope, look, I got an A. You know, I mean, whatever it is, I think the social media is only the final highlight, right? Just like an ESPN reel showing you the final highlights of the game, not all the practices that were happening for the decades before they got to that point.
Structural Decisions Beat Preferences
SPEAKER_04Of course, of course, you you you make a valid point because you know, go going back to college, I don't think there was a I don't I don't ever recall. Well, I I graduated without ever owning a computer. Uh so you you know, there was no chat GPT and right, yeah. We could learn the Dewey Decimal system and microfish and all that other obsolete crap. Yeah. Now, what are some common mistakes the leaders make, especially when they're trying to scale and they're trying to grow a team?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think you know, common mistakes are things that the audience, the people want. Right? I think we the common mistake is saying this person's asking for it. And and if we step back and say that doesn't mean that comments or requests aren't valuable, we have to understand if they're circumstantial or structural. Because circumstantial would be I want to sit at this chair. Right? I I should sit at the head of the table. I should be in this role. That's circumstantial. Structural means I need to have chairs, I need to have chairs to sit at the table. That's structural. And so I think common mistakes are leaders are looking at things and making a decision that's circumstantial that would change, right? If I want to face the sun and well, in the morning, the sun will be on a different side, right? So I mean that's circumstantial. So when you're a leader, you don't want to make circumstantial decisions. That's a common mistake. You want to make structural decisions, meaning which direction are we going? So I'll give a tangible example. If you're planning on driving or making a trip and you want to drive, I live in Omaha, Nebraska. And so let's say we want to head west and go to Denver, Colorado. So structurally, what car am I taking? Right. And if everybody, the whole argument is I'm sitting in the front seat and we have no car at all, that doesn't really matter, right? I mean, so many people can still fix it. What snacks are we taking? Well, we never made it. You know, we we never left the garage. But circumstantially, we had all the snacks in the world and we're sitting in the wrong seats. Those are not decisions leaders should be making. That's the late-term decision, right? You bring your own snacks and the last seat is yours, okay? I mean, that's the seats. But I think as leaders, we appeal to them because they're going to complain about the snacks in the seat on that drive. But as a leader, we need to say, here's how we get to Denver, here's the time of day we're leaving, here's how many times we're stopping, here's where we're gonna get our lunch, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So we really, the common mistake is to do their circumstantial, what they're requesting. I want this snack, I want the seat, instead of directional, right? Where are we going? What time are we leaving, and and things of that nature. And so those are the decisions I think that are the common trap.
SPEAKER_04And a leader, you're supposed to guide your team to the mission and to succeed. Because a lot of times, too, in this topsy turvy world that we live in, at times it's just, hey, as long as you showed up, right? So you you don't need results. And it's like, uh, where did you learn that from? Sure.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we're measured by our performance. That's that's it, not our words. And our words will only take us so far. And I think, you know, as you look around, careers are very short now, right? I mean, not careers, but duration at jobs, a year to two years. And I re I believe that's gonna accelerate. It's gonna be shorter yet, because as leaders, we gave opportunity for people to develop because we're like, oh, you know what, it took me X number of years before I I learned to step into the role. However, now what we're gonna see is we're gonna quickly realize they aren't capable of even trying. They're not trying. I'll at least as a leader give them if someone's trying hard and growing and learning, I'll give them an uh ability to do that. But if they're not gonna try, I don't have any place for the real world, it's scary, man. Yeah, exactly. It's the top, you gotta do something for sure.
SPEAKER_04Man, you're you're actually keeping score.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right, exactly. Yeah, and not everybody gets a ribbon or a medal.
SPEAKER_04Oh no, man, that there's there's not uh participation, right? We failed to meet all our goals, but everybody tried, and everybody that there was we we had a sense of community and a sense of team, and and that's all that matters.
SPEAKER_01Well, I think you know, here's the reason why, because I think it's important to break that down because it's easy as a participant to say that because the leader's held accountable to the score, right? How many leaders are fired because the team didn't deliver? Right, and so the tea the leader has to hold the team accountable because his job's also in the line. And and I think they default to this king kingship, this kingdom, because they're like, you know what? If everybody dies, I don't have a kingdom anyways. You know, meaning if the organization fails and we don't have enough money because we're not accomplishing our goal, I don't have a job anyways. And so I think that's uh uh you know part of that as well. We have to recognize that there are metrics to measure an employee, and it can't just be kumbaya because the leader won't have a job either, right? Look at how many coaches are fired and leaders are removed because the performance of the organization wasn't up to uh up to the standard.
SPEAKER_04Oh, they're the first ones, man. That's right. They're uh you can't say, well, you know, because of injuries or you know, if the ball bounced this way, or right at weather the elements. No, it it's did you succeed? And there's nothing to me, there's nothing better what comparison when it comes to entrepreneurship is to a manager or a coach when it comes to sports, because at the end, all that matters are the results, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Not everybody had fun and all the other crap, however, and I'm sure you'd agree with this, Omar, the team that is having fun has better results, right? If the team doesn't get along and they're all fighting, so so they can't they can't be mutually exclusive. You have results without a team that gets along. I've seen a lot of teams that have great talent, but they don't get along, and so they don't produce. And I've seen teams with a above-average talent, maybe not the best, but they get along excellent. They're they're a great team, they perform at a higher level. So I think the two go hand in hand. Oh, oh, yeah, definitely. Talent and and teamwork uh are what work together, and that's I think that's what our job as a leader uh is to do.
SPEAKER_04Well, when you you have an amazing leader and everybody is in sync, and and any organization, whether it's sports or whatnot, and the values are there, team is there, everybody has ownership, everybody wants to see the win. Yeah, and if you have to help pick up some slack from someone, someone else, that's just fine. And and and that's what people love to see what with with the underdog or the story about you know how whether it's watching CNBC or watching ESPN from a sports team or a corporation, one that there's harmony, yep, for sure. Absolutely, those are the ones we love to watch, yeah, because it's very rare that you know it's the the Bronx zoo where the like the late 70s Yankees were yeah Reggie Jackson and everybody's fighting, chaos like that, and if if there is success, it's only short-term, anyways, right with the results, there's no long-term results because exactly so much cancer, so much animosity, so much hate going on that you know you it it has to end.
Results Accountability And Team Harmony
SPEAKER_01It does, and I think that leads to how do you build a good team then, right? And I think if we if we do the money ball, the Billy Bean thing, right? I mean, you can really understand that you bring the right people in, then you do process. And I think so many times we can say, okay, I'm gonna find the statistics, and you see a lot of teams fail. This person's great at this, great at that, otherwise. And then we try to force them to be good people, you know. But if you bring in people that have the team first mentality, and you're much better off training them the skills to get in the role, and they have to have the drive and the want-to-right, they got to know what to do and be willing to do it. And I think that's critical for any team member.
SPEAKER_04Well, a leader, too, comes from a place of power, not a place of panic. Like when it comes to expansion or when it comes to replacing the the bad apples or or cutting off the cancer, what usually happens is a lot of bosses or a lot of people wait till they're understaffed and hire uh they lower their standards, they're they're they're hiring because they are in a panic, is they grab a mirror, they put it underneath the person's nose. And if the person breathes, then you know they hire them. Right. And any other time of day, they won't hire this person, but this isn't any this this is you know all hands all hands on deck. And what usually happens is it's the worst case scenario when you hire someone like that, or or you come from a place of hiring like that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you to your point, I mean, panic leadership is uh is never a good leadership disposition. And I think there's a there's something to be said for the emotional stability of the leader, right? Recognizing that, hey, there's going to be ebbs and flows to our days and lives. And whether it's a great day or a bad day, we still are methodically going forward. And I think that's another uh key point about a great leader that leads exponentially, they're doing it consistently. If we look at what we follow, if we look at what we count on, if we look at where we choose to go, it's because it's so consistent and we can expect the same things back. And if the the worst leaders I've worked for are the ones I had no idea what to expect every single day. Their emotions were all over the place, their decisions were all over the place, they're you know, they like you or hate you all over the place. Those are the things that we don't enjoy as a follower for sure.
SPEAKER_04Well, too, when when they're that type of behavior, the that person can't master their emotions. This is usually the guy not your aunt Omaha, so let's go years back because Nebraska's loses a lot these days compared to our basketball team's good. Come on. But but you know what? I mean, okay, I'm an LSU grad. So for a whole week when Les Miles was coaching or Nick Sabing, it was oh, the boss is gonna be a dick.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Because you know, places, you know, sometimes we we create our our happiness uh depends on the play of 18 to 22-year-olds, yeah. Stuff like that, though. And be it's funny, but it's true because if a boss lets his emotions, or if he's having a bad day with his wife, or him and his wife, they they you know, they watched a Hallmark movie and they got together because opposites attract and it looks amazing on Hallmark or Lifetime, but in real life it doesn't, and it's chaos at home. So he's gonna bring it to the office, right? And you know, he's he's gonna sacrifice his employees because and and they're gonna know they're like, Oh shit, you know, Jim or John, man, he looks like you know, the old lady ripped into him. Um oh man, just just stay away from him, right? That's a a leader is like, okay, you you want somebody to be even keel no matter what, and someone that if things are going amazing, they're not going all Hollywood living, living up and be like, oh my gosh, guys, you know, we're our company, we're on the the growth path, we're gonna be the next Microsoft, the next Apple, the next NVIDIA, the sky's the limit. Uh or the opposite. You you don't want to be the captain that runs into the Titanic, but you also want to be able to if there's you want to be the captain of a ship that when he's he's prepared for bad weather, right and rocky seas, and he's even killed, whether it's the sun, sunny outside and smooth sailing or there's turbulence.
Stability Authenticity And AI Limits
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I think prepared and also in this is relatable. And I think now, as we're kind of in this AI generation, authenticity is currency, right? If you are for sure human and authentic, it's currency. So, you know, a algorithm to your point is stable. It can it gives you a stable answer every time. You you enter in something in the chat GPT, it's gonna pretty much spit out something that's not gonna be too terribly offensive unless you ask it to be offensive, I suppose. But I mean it's gonna give you the answer let's looking back, and so that's stable, but it's not authentic. So we need stable and authentic. We want that that person that has experience in the storms, but there are also people we can relate to and that we can interact with, and we they're a human that we can interact with. And I think that this generation needs a little bit of both stability and authenticity. And if we can have those two things, you know, the world's our oyster.
SPEAKER_04Well, Reed, we need the human element. We we can't have cyberdyn, we we we can't have the terminator no doing uh I mean there's no there's no emotions, there's no humanness in that. That that's like the oh well, hey, I can't make this decision, let me run the chat GPT, right, and and ask it for the right the right answer, sure. And you're right, there it it technology like that doesn't understand that the real world there's gray area, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean I I use self-driving cars as an example, right? Because there's any number of conditions it can't figure out. I mean, it may work in a flat city in in some markets where there's limited hills and and no uh traffic issues. But I mean, I live in Nebraska, we'll get ice, okay? Put a self-driving car on ice, and then how does it adjust accordingly? And what does it mean? Just pull over the side of the road and stop, and so I think that's the nature of how humans have to make those decisions. So we need to be, we're always have been from the beginning of time when a wheel was created, aided by technology. But the technology is in the hands of the humans, not the humans in the hands of the technology, right? And I think what we're tipping right here is are we gonna let Chat GPT guide and lead our life or whatever the next AI-generated thing is, or are we going to use AI to lead our lives? Right, that's technology aiding humans, or humans being driven by technology, and that's that balance.
SPEAKER_04There's a balance, but it's a slippery slope because I I think most people are choosing the wrong choice. I agree. And speaking of, you're gonna laugh about self-driving cars. I I got into one. Uh, I was with my girlfriend a couple weeks ago, and we're in Atlanta. It Uber, no drive, no, no driver, think talks to you. It looks like one of those GPS cars. There's like everything on top.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I've seen it. It's actually uh it's not Uber, it's uh um Waymo.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, Waymo, Waymo, yeah, and they also do the little robots that people are pushing and and knocking down for food delivery. But but I was like nervous in this thing, yeah. Granted, it only goes through the city, but what happens of self-driving car? I've got a Tesla, I'd never use that function because how about if something happens, yeah, just like in real real world, kid walk runs right across to grab a bar, exactly, or you know, the guy is not paying attention and he swerves right into the car. And and a perfect example was come coming back. We we actually were in a car the second time, and somebody was in the car, and it was trying to make a left-handed turn in Atlanta or in any city, there's gridlock, and you know, sometimes you have to push your way through, yep, while this thing is sitting there waiting and waiting, and everybody knows there's nobody in it, so they're not letting them letting the car right. So it's it's like sitting there just like stuck. Uh I'm sure the person, hopefully, the person's still not stuck in that car, and it's like so that that people is why you know it's it's not as perfect, you know.
SPEAKER_01You you need the imperfection of a human, yeah, in everything, and the intuition, and the intuition, right? The decision making real-time criteria, because to your point, it was probably following all the algorithmic rules of driving. It was maintain your distance, keep your appropriate speed, stop for the appropriate time. But what it lost was the intuition as to when to go. I mean, it didn't know because it couldn't read the driver's eyes. We can look over and nod and know it's our turn to go, right? At a at an instant or something. And what are you gonna nod to at a bot? I mean, I mean, hey, you're not gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_04But also, too, when we're driving, someone's gonna be guilty feel guilty and let the person let you make that that's right, exactly.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's not gonna let the bot feel guilty, right?
Delegation Audit For Entrepreneurs
SPEAKER_04Yeah, all they do is see you know a driverless car and somebody and the passenger, they don't care, they'll be like, Yeah, whatever, and keep on going. And the car was stuck there trying to make a a left-handed turn while while you know there's buku traffic, yeah, for sure. Man, now I this is something that I've always as an entrepreneur, uh we this mind shift between an entrepreneur when they move from an operator to a leader. What minds mindset shift does that entrepreneur have to take? That leap of faith per se.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'm gonna give you not only the mindset shift, but the practical way to do that, right? Because I think it's important to understand how to do it, not just to shift your mind. Uh, one, it is when you're working on your business or working in your business to be working on your business. And that's been been there a lot of times. Okay, that makes sense. I've heard that a lot of times, but what does that practically mean? And I think there's times where we have to work in our business. We're just getting started, right? I mean, there's nobody else to, as I say, man the cash register. So someone's got to push that button and man the cash register. And that's how we learn what's best, the best way to serve the customer, right? The best businesses were started by somebody that did all the legwork at the beginning, understood how to build a system that improved that over time, back to your point about Ray Kroc, go look at the founder movie, and then offer that to many other people so that over time they can continue to build and evolve and grow and build their businesses. And so, how do we practically do that? And I think it's it's an evolution. It's not just a one day you're an operator, the next day you're a leader. Uh, I think it's an evolution. And so, what I've done and what I encourage people to do is do an audit of your schedule. Go look at what you did the last two, three, four weeks. And then as you go back and look at the schedule, say, okay, what am I doing every hour? If there's something that you have to do every hour of the day, you need to find someone to do that, or you're gonna be forever doing that. Once you get that handed off, you're saying, okay, now I need to hire somebody to do something I have to do every day. If there's something I have to do every day, am I at the point where I can afford to hand that off? And the principle I give to people is if it becomes here's two reasons, two ways to look at that. If what that hour you're taking back, if there's something more highly productive that you can do for that hour, then then turn it over. If there's not, like you know, sitting around Netflix binging for that hour, then stay, keep doing the job. But if there's nobody else, you don't need to go, you know, but if there's something at work, for example, let's say mopping the floor, right? And that's something you can you have to do every day. And so if you can pay somebody to mop the floor, and then you can engage with customers or get more customers, that's a good exchange exchange for paying someone to mop the floor. But if there's nothing you can do to go get more customers, keep mopping the floor. And so as it goes from then then following that same principle from whatever you're doing hourly, turn hand that off to somebody else, just that hourly task, write a process that they can understand so they can execute it at at least 80% of your capability, right? They're mopping the floor, 80% as good as you can. And then the next time, if it's weekly, if there's something and your business is big enough and you can afford it, then if there's something you have to do weekly, hand that off. And then at some point it becomes a 20% or 30% of your time, something you have to do monthly, hand that off, right? And so that's kind of the principle. Once something is 20 or 30% of your day or week or month, that's where then you hire someone, assuming you can apply those hours to something of greater value. And so that's where you kind of pivot from being an operator to being a leader.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, uh that was like the hardest thing to do, was because in your mindset it's always like, Well, I'm saving money. You don't focus on the money-making activities that by outsourcing something, you can exponentially grow, right? You cannot grow like that if you're sitting around doing all the work.
SPEAKER_01Yep, yeah, and I think also it's our baby, right? So that's the other side of it like I don't want anybody to mess up my you know business or my clients or my relationships or whatever those cases might be. So I'll just do it myself. And if I went and trained somebody, it'll take me 10 times the amount of time. I'd rather just do it myself, right? So that's where really looking at the principle of that. And and the next the first person we're gonna hire needs the routine of something that's hourly. That's why I gave that principle there. If we go tell something that's once a month, they're gonna forget how to do it, we're gonna have to train them again. But if we train them hourly, we can routinely do that. And go look at scaled businesses. You know, fast food's a good example. They're they're hitting the cash register every minute and they learn it so well. I mean, you can see some of these people that are doing the drive-thru windows are wizards, right? They just know what to hit, what burger, what fries, what drinks uh to hit, and everything in the in the and the like. So uh those are uh our key principles.
SPEAKER_03You're back. We're back.
SPEAKER_04So you're talking about um QSRs, uh quick service restaurants.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I think that's you know, one of the things that's super powerful is when a you have that hourly task and you give it to somebody that's a quick service restaurant, and that individual hits the drive-thru window every time. And so they know how to hit the drive-thru kiosk and they become wizards, right? Because they do that repetitive task time and time again, and they know where all the buttons are at, and they become very comfortable. So when you're moving from that operator mindset to a leader, you should look at what's a repetitive task, simplify it, right? I mean, even if you look at that, it their QSRs, it's just a picture, they don't even have to read the word, or you can see a picture of the item and you simplify it, and then you will it'll accelerate your training. And so you can move from operator to leader because you simplify it and accelerate training. And again, a screen on a drive-through uh kiosk is a great example of that. It's super simple, clear, and then the information goes straight to the person that needs to do the work.
SPEAKER_04Impressive. Now, Reed, I'm all about team culture, but how important is culture when it comes to exponential growth?
Culture Ownership Credit And Blame
SPEAKER_01You know, that's the accelerator, right? That's the secret sauce, basically, because you know, people will work, most people go to work for themselves, fundamentally, right? They they want to earn an income, they want to do a job that they want. They don't go work, they they're accepting the payment from you, and technically they work for you, but quite frankly, they're working for themselves. And so when you can see that people are no longer working for themselves, they're working for the team, you will see a dramatic difference in where it goes. And that's where culture lies, right? Is that um do I care around about the people that I'm working with and for? Do I root for them? Do I celebrate them? Am I happy for them? Right? And that's kind of the elements of culture. If you can see people that are excited, that the customer is happy, that their coworkers are happy, uh, that are there, as opposed to just working for themselves, you're gonna begin to see culture. And if those things are not present, it's a matter of saying, what am I doing as a leader that is showing the individuals that this is not uh what we're trying to accomplish, where we're happy for others. And so that's where we can really evaluate that. So culture is really the secret sauce, and you will see the elements of culture if people are truly happy with helping others and seeing others make progress.
SPEAKER_04Amen, man. Amen. think I would have never been an entrepreneur if if quote unquote leaders could just see that. And it it's pretty simple, man. It's not calculus by by any stretch. Now Reed, what are some practical ways leaders can build a culture of ownership?
Spotting Leaders Who Want Growth
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and so I think um the thing that destroys it is right success uh has a million fathers and failure is an orphan. Right? Meaning that if there's a mistake no one is to blame right if it's success everyone gets credit and the leader is the one that tries to take the most. I think as a leader you do the exact opposite you accept blame for any mistake and apply credit to the those who specifically contributed value that you can uh highlight. Okay. And that builds culture. So as an example right I remember a decision that an employee made that was terrible right and I I was like I would have never trained them to do this. It's not the training manual to you know proverbially light the building on fire. You know I didn't tell them to light the building on fire. I didn't give them the matches I didn't give them the the tank of gas and I didn't tell them to light it on fire while you were inside of it. And yet that happened. But I can say here's what I did take responsibility for I said I am sorry that I anyone I allowed anyone and I didn't identify that they were going to even have this mental instability to make this decision. And so I'm taking responsibility that this organization would even someone who consider working for this organization that would do that. Right. And then the second thing I would do is I'm going to own the outcome from here. I'm going to investigate the situation I am going to appropriately address it and I'm going to protect you as an employee that they did this to in that same vein. Right. Instead of saying that's them they had a psychological issue whatever the case might be right so I think the first thing is I took ownership even it would have been easy for me to blame the person that did it because it would have been clear and obvious and what happened in that moment was that person's like now I know who to follow right do I follow the complaints do I follow the blame do I call the police what in that principle right there it said is this guy is going to own what he can own and I will follow him. And this is a super important thing to understand because if we're the leader and something bad happens and they don't know who to follow things get worse. Right? If you're lost and let's use a simple example and you are looking out uh you know so I uh I live in a an area where there's an acreage that I have and and one night it was like 1030 at night driving in my neighborhood there was this car in our backyard literally driving in our our backyard and I went back there and I was like what is going on and I went back and found this guy was an 85 year old man who did not have a cell phone or a GPS and he was completely confused as to where he was he was literally driving in my backyard and he had nobody to give him directions how to get out of there. Right? And so then I realized he didn't have a GPS that was leading him right we would not have followed there's a little river in my back he could have been in the river right and so we need that GPS to get us back on track. But if we're completely lost like him he's just orienting the sun was down by that point right he had no way to orient so that's I think is the leader we need to be well he was he was panicking too man of course he was and every leader would in that situation for sure. Yeah and so I think in that case my point is take ownership and they know who to follow and once you get them to follow now things get better. Because if you're placing blame or not taking blame then they're going to find who to blame and then they're going to follow the person that takes ownership of that blame. They're going to get the attention so a leadership principle in that instance how to build culture is take responsibility for mistakes because they know who to follow not because of your fault because they know who to follow then the second part to build culture that's important is recognize those who contributed the way andor the direction that you want them to so you don't want to contribute like for example I'll use a sports analogy because it's easy to follow easily you can win a game by taking a full court shot and a go in that's happened many times before and we celebrate that gets celebrated on ESPN and all but that's not a good shot by anybody's measure right I mean a three court a three quarter court shot is a very low probability shot right conversely you can get a wide open layup and miss it right and it could be for the winning game thing that's a high probability shot the shot you would want any coach would want and it wouldn't go in. And if we're celebrating the three quarter court shot and we're giving them a hard time about missing the layup then we're going to tell them go take more three quarter court shots. You know he won so he gets all the praise instead as a leader what we want to say is hey we don't want it to come down to a three quarter court shot we could have done a lot of things before that to win the game so it didn't have to come down to that and we're thankful that we still made that shot it was super lucky. I'm not going to recognize their award but conversely we're going to say hey we had the right shot on the layup and we just missed it. We we won it hey I encourage it it took a lot to get open he was right there he makes those every day in practice he's doing the absolute best he can he just happened to miss it this time right I'm not going to bench him for that or anything else right yet that is how leadership principle is we recognize things not they were emotionally high but they were good sound decisions even if they didn't go the right way we want to recognize a good decision that didn't go the right way versus a bad decision that went the right way and something else too that I loved is with leadership development because a lot of companies a lot of leaders have this weird thing that they're in scarcity that they believe that if they train these people to become amazing leaders that they're going to leave right so why why why am I going to create leaders because they'll leave me and it's like well they're going to leave you regardless so at least let's let's have great rock stars working for you some heavy hitters some home run hitters for the time being maybe maybe they don't have that ambition maybe they're just happy you know and and you know throw throw them you know the one minute manager maybe show them a some praise right instead of having that scarcity now how do how would you identify a potential leader inside an organization yeah so I think um first of all it's character right because if you look at leaders that failed right and we can go throughout history is because something within their character right they either made a bad decision the wrong moment that's going to be exposed at some point so you want to make sure that they are consistent like we've been talking about number one. Number two is and and probably more notably after you've gone through that first hurdle is desire to grow. And I'm talking personally right not financially because financially if we want to grow our income we need to grow ourselves right I mean I mean I remember getting my first job and in in Nebraska at the time is$4.25 an hour and that was minimum wage. So if I'm providing$4.25 an hour worth of work I for the rest of my life that's what I should be paid. But I realized okay how can I provide more value to the person that employs me and what do I need to do to do that right and so uh one of my first jobs I was at a um uh a local buffet and so it was to take all the dirty plates you know and go back and wash them and then what I realized was hmm the buffet runner the person that brought the food out got paid 25 cents an hour more well I can take the food out there and what were they doing? They were inspecting and wiping the cloud okay so I started doing that. And then eventually like wait a minute uh there's people that are hosts that are seating people and they get paid a quarter an hour more. So if I can talk to people and walk them to their table instead of just walking and bringing food out I can get paid a little bit more. So I had to learn that skill to talk to people and walk into the table and mark it off and give to the waiter and interact with them right then it was like wait a minute these waiters are getting some tips and so each time I was learning a skill that I could otherwise apply later and I think that's the next thing that I'm looking for is are you willing to learn something a new skill to try something new to be of more value? And that's the leaders I want to develop right the ones that will progress along the way that are learning new tips tips and techniques to be uh a progressive leader. And so that's how you choose who you're going to develop those who have the curiosity and ability to learn more because otherwise you're wasting your time I think if we're developing leaders that and and or if we have the desire to develop leaders and those people don't want to be developed you're wasting your time amen now being a leader is like going to the gym being a leader is like being an entrepreneur.
SPEAKER_04You have to do the work on a consistent basis and you have to do it you have to show up at times when you don't want to do that. Now Reed what daily habits can make someone that they can do that make them a stronger leader.
SPEAKER_01Yeah I think first and foremost is think about who you're here to serve first. I think a lot of people are saying in the end I want to get the resolution on the back end I want this outcome instead of what's the first step for that right so anytime I build a business anytime I develop a product I'm saying how does the most amount of consumers win the most right and there's any number of products that are out there that oriented around it and there's really three that I think about that all can dovetail and work together. Think of Apple Steve Jobs designed the Apple phone to make it super simple for a five year old to use right it was a touch screen and he he thought around the user experience first. And he is a multi his family now is a multi-billionaire because he made it super simple that anyone could use it and gave it to schools to use it. Okay. And then the second thing you did is you made a user experience for Chipotle another example. They designed it around that you could walk in pick the ingredients of the burrito you want or the or the wrap you want or the uh bowl you want or whatever you want pick the ingredients and they're all healthy right there in and you infuse the user make the user experience so good for the masses and then the third is Uber Eats make it super simple that this is driven to you and it's designed around the user that the food is delivered right there. Now you can go right now on your Apple iPhone and some of you are probably hungry and doing it yourselves to order Apple on your Apple phone you order a Chipotle or Uber Eats right and why do all three of those work together? Because they're designed with a user experience. So for me it's designed with a user experience first and say if that works then I'm gonna get naturally people that are going to want to do it. I don't have to convince them it's something they want to do and if they want to do now I'm I'm I'm managing the flood instead of creating it right and so uh we want to we want to do that. And so I think the first thing to do if you're in any organization and understand how does the frontline the simplest interaction work the best and then build up from there instead of saying what do I really want with my life and working our way down and so that's what I would say to answer your question. Perfect. Reed that leadership trait that matters most yeah I think consistency right character of course but then consistency. And uh you know we we need to be consistent because that's where we know where to find that leader right if we look past in the back we know exactly where they're at and and what they do. And so I think consistency is a critical trait. In your opinion what's the biggest myth about leadership? You know that it's uh fun or easy I think um I think it's it's a responsibility um and I think we can enjoy the the most gratifying part for me because I don't want to say it's not fun the most gratifying part for me is seeing the development of others. And if you as a leader don't care about that you're not inclined to be a leader.
unknownRight?
Daily Habits Myths And First Steps
Books Website And Closing Thanks
SPEAKER_01You're doing it for all the wrong reasons. And I think that's a big myth. And the other thing is this oh that'd be easy. His job's easy you know that's the easiest thing in the world. No it's not because you're managing so many dynamics right and and as you get up here I think that's where people get burnt out and beat up because they think it's easy and they aren't ready for the work. And so I think those are the two myths about leadership is that it's fun and easy and I think those are myths. One habit every leader should develop yeah one habit every leader should develop is a constant aspiration for growth right progress progress progress be be better every day than you were yesterday as Michael Jordan said I'm not here to beat that man across from the thing I've already beat him. I'm here to beat myself from yesterday because that guy was really good you know and that's really what we want to do is beat the the person we were yesterday make progress every day perfect and read if someone just wanted to start leading exponentially in their own personal life or business what's the first step they should take tomorrow morning yeah the first step is ultimately to recognize okay where would I be leading them exponentially if you haven't done that already and then identifying those leaders who can lead others so as a first step as a leader is we want to lead our teams but then eventually to lead exponentially you got to develop leaders that multiply the leaders right we really want multiplication instead of addition in this case and so we want to find the people that are capable of multiplying right I mean in sports there's coaching trees and the people that multiplied are the ones that follow the the big coaching trees that went into multiple different teams eras and eras later because they went through the coaching tree that's leading exponentially read the man the myth the legend the author of lead exponentially now where can people not only buy this book but your first book yeah it's on Amazon so you can go to Amazon or any place you buy your book there's an audio version and a digital version of course in the actual physical book which is always my preference uh and you can go to Amazon and it's transform through purpose is the first one uh the second one is lead exponentially and then read niffler you can uh look that up and search it on Amazon and and find it even today and read how do people find you and can they hire you to uh or do you coach like one-on-one or do you do group sessions or all the above? Yeah I mean I am uh typically just uh providing content for them to consume I don't want to charge them for the development um and uh however they can find me at readniffler.com r-e-e-d-n-y-f-f e-l-e r dot com and there's some content there that they can absorb and of course I'll reply to the emails if they choose to email me um and obviously if they have any like phone calls I can have a phone call with them and kind of coach them through some items at times as well because I of course want them to be better leaders as well and I know their teams will be better because they're a better leader.
SPEAKER_04Reed thank you for the time thank you for the opportunity of just listening and picking your brain thank you for the digital copy of the book. Man where was this book 20 years ago because it took me a long time when it to go from an operator to being that leader. So thank you man and you're in service just the simple fact that you're like hey I want you want to see more leaders out there than bosses stuff.
SPEAKER_01Thank you for everything brother. Thanks Elmore thank you for having me and uh hope that your audience can benefit from our conversation