Join Jan and her surprise guests as they share their travel experiences, love for climbing, and the exploration of exciting activities in the Northwest.
Subscribe to the Women of the Northwest podcast for inspiring stories and adventures.
Find me on my website: jan-johnson.com
Join Jan and her surprise guests as they share their travel experiences, love for climbing, and the exploration of exciting activities in the Northwest.
Subscribe to the Women of the Northwest podcast for inspiring stories and adventures.
Find me on my website: jan-johnson.com
[00:30] Jan: Hello, friends. Welcome to Women of the Northwest. I'm Jan Johnson, your host, and I have some surprise guests here with me. They were friends of my daughter Emily's, and would you introduce yourself?
[00:42] Se-eun: Hello. This is Se-eun from South Korea. Yeah. I just met Emily when she was in Korea, and finally I got visited their friends. Yeah.
[00:57] Ye Jin: And I am Ye Jin. I'm also from South Korea and one of Emily's friends. And I got to know her last year. Actually, it has been only a year okay. Since I knew her, but I feel really close with her and I'm really happy to be here.
[01:15] Jan: Yeah. Is this your first time to the United States?
[01:20] Se-eun: Not really.
[01:24] Ye-Jin: I actually used to live in the States, and I lived in the States for about eleven years. I kind of moved around a lot with my parents, so I lived in Texas for about six years and then moved to Boston and stayed there for about two and a half years and then moved to Philadelphia.
[01:42] Jan: What were your parents doing?
[01:45] Ye-Jin: Actually, my dad was a student.
[01:47] Jan: Okay.
[01:48] Ye-Jin: He had his master's and doctors and PhD.
[01:53] Jan: Okay.
[01:54] Ye-Jin: Yeah. He had the course here, and now he's a professor in South Korea.
[02:00] Jan: Okay. What does he teach?
[02:01] Ye-Jin: He's at medical school.
[02:04] Jan: Okay. All right. And so that's why your English is very good.
[02:12] Ye-Jin: I finished fourth grade in America and then moved to move back to South Korea when I was eleven.
[02:20] Jan: Okay.
[02:20] Ye-Jin: So it feels like my English just stopped right there and it didn't improve ever since I moved back to Korea because there aren't many opportunities to talk with foreigners in Korea, because when we learn English, we learn English for the exams, to get good grades on the exam. So we don't usually talk with so.
[02:44] Jan: You have better written?
[02:46] Ye-Jin: I think so, but I tried to maintain my English, but I don't know, I feel like I'm bad at both languages now.
[02:58] Jan: So when you were eleven, though, your parents spoke Korean to you, though, and you spoke English every place else at school, right.
[03:09] Ye-Jin: Actually, I spoke English to my parents, too, so I was really good at listening Korean, but I was kind of bad at speaking Korean. So when I moved back to South Korea, I was really bad at Korean. And so I was supposed to go to fourth grade, but my parents wanted me to adapt quickly.
[03:34] Jan: Okay.
[03:34] Ye-Jin: So they made me go to third grade.
[03:37] Jan: Okay.
[03:37] Ye-Jin: So what happened?
[03:39] Jan: Right, because then you had to learn to read, learn to read more, listening.
[03:45] Ye-Jin: To and get used to the culture.
[03:49] Jan: What were some of the things that were difficult to switch over.
[03:54] Ye-Jin: So first of all, we have separate indoor shoes that we have to wear in school so we can't wear our shoes, our sneakers in school. Also the school is really nearby the house. You can just walk okay, walk to school. You don't have to take the school bus.
[04:16] Jan: Well, but the foods were probably you were probably used to foods because your parents still cook.
[04:22] Ye-Jin: Yeah, I love the food because my parents always made me Korean food at home. Well, of course I had American food at school like for lunch.
[04:32] Jan: Yeah. And then what about you, Se-eun? You've been to the United States as well?
[04:36] Se-eun: When I was in student I have chance to stay in Canada for a year. Yes, that's how I have chance to come to America. Actually I did some kind of travel to New York City and actually I wanted to plan to stay only five days in New York and want to go Boston or the other city to look around. But when I visit New York I was really surprised. The scale of city was really big. So it's not enough time. So I wanted to stay more. So I stayed at New York like a month and I came back to Canada. And since then I have really no chance because I got a job. And especially for Korean, if you have a job, it's really hard to get hard to get some long period of.
[05:35] Jan: Vacation vacation time?
[05:37] Se-eun: So I made again to come back here. So I've been to California and especially for the Koreans they do wanted to travel such a place, such famous place because they wanted to showing off. I just planned like been to Rocky Mountains in Vancouver and I just got up to the California to see the La and we visit some San Francisco again so it makes me really nice things that I did. The reason why I came back America to visit because of family. She visited last year to see us and climbing. And I had a really nice time. And I made a promise to her that I hope that I want to see your parents and to see them. And I have some information that near the May or June is his father's birthday. So I made a plan to come here before one year before finally made this.
[06:50] Jan: So today you did some exploring in Brownsmead what kind of things did you see that were interesting?
[06:57] Se-eun: It was a four and a half hour drive from Bend, right?
[07:01] Jan: That's a long drive. Yeah. So you saw a lot of things.
[07:04] Ye-Jin: Along the way as we did.
[07:07] Ye-Jin: Well, the view was fantastic. There was like a river view the forest and the sky is so blue today. Yeah. So everything was perfect. Everything was perfect. And I stopped by KFC to get some mashed potatoes.
[07:25] Jan: So you traveled from Bend to get to Browns. How long did that take?
[07:31] Se-eun: It was a four and a half hour drive.
[07:33] Jan: It's a long drive, isn't it?
[07:35] Se-eun: Yes, it was.
[07:35] Jan: But did you notice in Oregon the different types of landscape there's desert in Bend and then it changes to what else did you see?
[07:46] Se-eun: We saw the river. We saw the forest, and the sky was just so blue today, so everything was just perfect. Blue, green. Everything was just so felt so warm.
[07:58] Jan: It's very colorful.
[07:59] Se-eun: Yeah, colorful. And we also saw the Three Sisters.
[08:06] Jan: Oh, yeah. It's so pretty.
[08:09] Se-eun: And Mountain Hood.
[08:10] Jan: Is there still snow on this?
[08:12] Se-eun: Yes, there's still snow on it. And we saw some white. And we stopped by KFCs to get some mashed potatoes because yesterday I was trying to get some mashed potatoes, but it was sold out. Yeah, I definitely had to get that today.
[08:31] Jan: Is that unique to here instead of in Korea?
[08:37] Se-eun: That's not a common so they don't sell mashed potatoes in Korea. Because I love the gravy sauce. Yeah, the gravy. Yeah. I really missed that. It's actually the first time in 15 years, like, being back. So I was, like, craving for mashed potatoes with gravy sauce.
[08:57] Jan: That's funny.
[08:58] Se-eun: I needed to get that.
[08:59] Jan: Yeah.
[09:00] Se-eun: And we also went to the Grange, right?
[09:03] Jan: Oh, yeah. Okay.
[09:05] Se-eun: Actually, it was actually our third Grange we went to about what was that?
[09:13] Jan: Smith Rock.
[09:15] Se-eun: Wait, which.
[09:24] Jan: One?
[09:25] Se-eun: Grange and Smith Rock. Grange.
[09:27] Jan: Oh, okay.
[09:28] Se-eun: It was the Eagle Bakery.
[09:29] Jan: Oh, okay. Right. Yeah.
[09:31] Se-eun: And then today yeah. And we saw the band.
[09:36] Jan: Okay.
[09:37] Se-eun: I don't know.
[09:37] Jan: What the Brownsmead Flats? Were they playing? Yes, I think it's that okay.
[09:43] Se-eun: Emily said with guitars famous in this area. Yeah, they go to, like, every place.
[09:50] Jan: Of different events or Sunday market in different places. Yeah.
[09:54] Se-eun: So we got to see that. We got to listen to their song. And it was really good. Some chili.
[10:00] Jan: Yeah.
[10:01] Se-eun: And that was also really good. And we went to the barn. Yeah. And got to see the barn owls and all the things they threw up.
[10:17] Jan: Sorry, this might be pellets, maybe the pellets. Yes, exactly.
[10:22] Se-eun: That was also a great it's an experience that not every people can have. Yeah, that was also quite a great experience.
[10:34] Jan: And the lambs. You saw the lambs? Yeah.
[10:37] Se-eun: Saw them jumping around, having fun, playing. Yeah. That was also really cute.
[10:43] Jan: So both of you are climbers like, Emily, talk to me a little about climbing.
[10:50] Ye-Jin: I'm not such kind of climber, but I met Emily because of climbing lessons in Korea. That's how we got close to but recently I got some injury climbing twice. Couldn't do much for two years climbing. Only exercise that I could do was swimming. I'm not prepared to swim right now. Climbing, when you do some kind of sports, it's really nice to meet somebody who are not work related. So we can get many inspiration by chatting because they have different job and different area. When I do the climbing when I start climbing I met so many people not only this area, but other from foreign country. So it was really nice experience. I wanted to keep climbing, but it's kind of hard when you take a rest for like two years, then you have to build. Yeah, right.
[12:09] Jan: What kinds of exercises do you need.
[12:12] Se-eun: To do to prepare maybe to the endurance wall doing the endurance wall at the gym is the perfect way to building up your body but the children where I live, there is no such.
[12:28] Jan: A change at all. Okay.
[12:29] Se-eun: It's really hard because I wanted to try keep my bodies to be healthier, not injury anymore.
[12:37] Jan: Right.
[12:38] Se-eun: I prepared for like five months before yes. And also it was not only climbing but also because of I wanted to explore where she lives I saw many Instagram she did many kind of exciting sports like do some kayak and do some skis and the back country ski that I've never heard before like cross country? Yes.
[13:12] Jan: Skiing?
[13:13] Se-eun: Yes. So I wanted to say to her I wanted to do some try because in Korea there is no such mountain that we can mountain such small yeah. So reasonably I wanted to build up my house not only for the climbing but also you have to make more hiking, running and swimming I did kind of things also I did climbing. Of course I knew because of there is a Smith Rock since we're kind of famous through the team and Emily to do experience to Heather so I did a lot of things but mostly I just made a membership climbing gym for preparing.
[14:05] Jan: Yes, so you can get back into it. What about you? Why do you like to climb?
[14:09Ye-Jin: So I've been climbing for four years. And I also had an injury. I tore my ACL while bouldering at a gym. Indoor gym. And I had a break for six months. But I was having so much fun, I loved climbing. I really enjoyed climbing because of the accomplishment of accomplishing every problem. Bouldering. I was really into bouldering but I tore my ACL and had a six month rehab. And then ever since, I was so scared of bouldering. I started lead climbing and lead climbing was like a total different part of climbing and it was so charming because it feels like you have to win yourself.
[14:58] Jan: I don't know if I'm your own competition right.
[15:03] Ye-Jin: You have to fight with yourself.
[15:06] Jan: So describe that not everybody knows what.
[15:09] Ye-Jin: That is like the lead climbing is all about endurance.
[15:12] Jan: Okay.
[15:13] Ye-Jin: Endurance. You have to get above your limits in order to send your project so sending your project once you send your project that's like the best feeling ever.
[15:28] Jan: Yeah.
[15:29] Ye-Jin: So much accomplishment, you feel so proud of yourself and that feeling I think I'm because of that feeling yeah.
[15:40] Jan: And so what do you have to your fingers need to be strong and your toes right.
[15:48] Ye-Jin: You need a whole body training.
[15:50] Jan: Yeah.
[15:50] Ye-Jin: So I usually train at the gym after work on the weekdays and usually go to the mountains and go outdoors on the weekend. So like working out, training during the weekend is all for the weekend.
[16:09] Jan: For the weekend to be ready to send the project. Yeah. Do you just not look down?
[16:18] Ye-Jin: I am afraid of heights. I don't know if non climbers understand this. So when you lead climb, there are bolts, right?
[16:31] Jan: Okay.
[16:31] Ye-Jin: And you have to use a quick draw. So you hang your quick draw to the bolt.
[16:41] Jan: So it's a clip that goes into.
[16:43]Ye-Jin: The bolt and you have to put your rope on the quick draw.
[16:47] Jan: So you're doing one hand holding on the other hand is clipping.
[16:51] Ye-Jin: Clipping.
[16:51] Jan: Oh, that sounds so scary.
[16:55] Ye-Jin: It might be good and it might be not good, but you have to hold on to it if you don't want to have a big fall, if you don't want to whip, which you don't want. So once the bolt is kind of lower than your can I say that? Lower from your belly or if it sound like where your toe is, where your feet are, it gets really scary and you have to overcome that fear and while overcoming that fear and once you get to the top and clip on the anchor, you get so relieved and feel like I'm safe and I'm alive. Thank God.
[17:43] Jan: That sounds petrifying. I'm afraid both of we have experienced injury, so it seems like really dangerous, but it's not really. There's much more sports here and because if you are enough to know how to do it, it's really safe.
[18:06] Jan: Okay, but when you're at a climbing gym, you just have the little plastic things that you're right, but those aren't clips. And how do you transfer from doing that to learning?
[18:21] Se-eun: Have you ever been to any gym? Rock climbing gym? Yeah, there is some certain kind of sports we can diversify.
[18:33] Jan: Okay.
[18:34] Se-eun: We called it lead gym. And we do have reed climbing and watering. So there is an endurance wall. And especially when you get to some high big climbing gym, there is a lead section we can practice. How can we clip in?
[18:53] Jan: Okay. Did Emily show you the little climbing wall in the barn.
[19:06] Se-eun: Already? What's in so good? Yes.
[19:13] Se-eun: It was my first time seeing the wall mini gym.
[19:18] Jan: Yeah, it was her tiny home.
[19:23] Ye-Jin: And I did some pull ups there. I tried some pull ups.
[19:28] Jan: Yeah. Okay. What kind of things do you think are the biggest cultural things between here and Korea? Like, what are things in Korea? Do you see women having more autonomy or ability to work what they want to? Or is there pressure to be married and take care of your husbands? Or what kind of cultural things are there like that?
[19:59] Se-eun: There is a superwoman right but there is pomenda. Korea is kind of conservative society because we compare with the western society. Our country has recently industrialized. So it comes it seems like following after some who goes first. And because of the agricultural society, men works to earn the money. And normally the women do the house job and we didn't make the money. That's how we treat it. Like women should be something. There is much things that we should do, right? But all of a sudden, Korea, we have quickly got some industrialized I don't know how to say that's how women started to working too. But still we do have house jobs and they want us to do all of all can juggle everything.
[21:19] Jan: And then when you have kids yes.
[21:22] Jan: So it seems to be like not only Korea, but all countries. Seems like the people doesn't want to go get married and doesn't want to have any kids.
[21:34] Jan: Yeah, that does seem to me more common too. I think even in the United States, that people are not even thinking about settling down with a partner until they're in their 30s even. And maybe a lot of them not.
[21:51] Se-eun: Having children, especially Korea, like you might know, the educational problem is really big issue because they only kids to dig it good. I mean, Korea is such a small country. We don't have such resources.
[22:12] Jan: Resources?
[22:13] Se-eun: Yeah, resources compared with the others. So we have to earn from our knowledge to earn the money. So we supposed to be smart. So we have to study hard to get a degree and to get a good job like some zones.
[22:31] Jan: But don't you think that's kind of typical of more Asian countries? I think Japan is like that as well.
[22:44] Se-eun: Yes, especially Korean. They do really do. Because of not only recently, but from the Josan or the before Josan dynasty or before they do have some how can I say yuku.
[23:04] Jan: Like a tradition.
[23:07] Se-eun: We've got influenced by China, okay. And they have such a good we supposed to be nice for people like for the parents and other to be our job is to study well. So because of many reasons that we could happen what it happens now. That's why they wanted to study really hard. Even nowadays, my mother's generation, they have many siblings, at least like five or six. My mom has seven siblings. But when it turns 1980, we have some slogan we better make baby. Less than two babies.
[23:56] Jan: Like China did.
[23:57] Se-eun: Yes. So all of a sudden, the population of the decrease, decrease and we have only few children to get to be what to be?
[24:10] Jan: Is there like in China? I don't know whether it's still the same in China or not, but that boys were more important than girls. Is that the same in Korea?
[24:21] Se-eun: Because as I told you, we got influenced by China. The same kind of similar thoughts.
[24:28] Jan: So with your generation, do you feel like you can change some of that ideas.
[24:39] Ye-Jin: I think it's changing these days, men are trying to do some more housework and women are trying to work more, be more professional of their work. Yeah. So I think it's changing little by little. Yeah, but with having kids and having a family. Well, to say something about myself, something about me, I actually don't want to.
[25:12] Jan: Have kids because.
[25:16] Ye-Jin: There are so many things to do. I think I'm still very young, first of all. And I really love climbing. I love to try new things. But I feel like once I have.
[25:31] Jan: A kid, some of that will stop.
[25:33] Ye-Jin: Yeah, some of that will stop. And I have to only look for it. I have to pay more attention so I won't be able to live my life.
[25:44] Jan: I think Emily is the same way.
[25:47] Se-eun: And frankly speaking, I think almost the same reason. Because of the money problem?
[25:55] Jan: Well, the money, yeah.
[25:57] Se-eun: Because as I told you, like education. In Korea, they wanted to teach their children so well. So once one of my job was working at the academy who are it was kind of English book reading academy. They are only six or seven year old kids even got any school yet and they started to study English.
[26:29] Jan: And do you have to like do small kids they have to test to be able to get into school, into a certain school.
[26:37] Se-eun: Some private school is so much famous. They do the lottery and then a.
[26:42] Jan: Lot of pressure for that as well. Yeah.
[26:45] Se-eun: And also not only English, but also they wanted to get well educated. Not only study, but also physically. Do you have time schedule? Like every 1 hour they have to go another academy they spend if it.
[27:01] Jan: Is once busy, busy, busy, busy spend the money.
[27:04] Se-eun: Yeah, you can tell because I cannot tell how much every day the person got money. But normally like four to $5,100. We made up months, but we pay more like more than $5,000 for one kid. If you have two kids yeah, then you do it.
[27:33] Jan: Then it's expensive. Really?
[27:35] Se-eun: Even though one of my friends experience they do have certain goals that raising our kids to be like really? They wanted to just hang out with the friends at the playground. But when you bring your kids to playground, there was no kids to hang around with. Because that's a very big difference. Huge difference. It's not the common thing. But I would like to talk about a little highly eager to educated people in a bad way. They wanted to make some groups privately. If their parents think in that way, they kids learn kind of things.
[28:22] Jan: Right.
[28:22] Se-eun: And even in the school they just compare which brand you wearing and what your parents drive, what kind of car do they drive, which part of city do you leave. And it's really competitive kinds of really got stressed. But if you don't have kids and no married. You have fully spend your money. Not only money, but the time.
[28:53] Jan: Right. And then you can come to the United States. Yeah. Well, that is really interesting. Okay, I think we are coming to the end of our time. Anything else you would like to share?
[29:10] Ye-Jin: So she talked about the education like going to academies after school. That was quite a culture shock for me. Well, like in the space you usually hang out with your friends after school, go to the playground or go to the pool in the summer. But when I moved to Korea, when I moved back to South Korea, my mom made me go to these academies like math, even English because I have to take the exams.
[29:41] Jan: Right.
[29:42] Ye-Jin: And math, Korean and what else? Science academy. So after school I have to go right to the academy. I can't stop by my house and.
[29:55] Se-eun: Then even have no time to having dinner. Nice dinner.
[29:58] Ye-Jin: You don't have time to how set.
[30:00] Jan: It is and then you get up and do it all over again. That's just like that too much. It's too much.
[30:09] Se-eun: In order to adapt to the Korean culture and the education, you have to do that.
[30:15] Jan: We had a girl that was a Japanese exchange in college. She lived with me for a year and she still lives in the States now and married, lives in the Bay Area. But she had two boys and then she had triplets. But I'm watching all these things she does with her kids on I mean the weekends is always Japanese school and then they have a music camp and they're excelling and going all over the United States in their music things and swim team and this it's like wow. Yeah. And expensive. Yeah, it's a lot of pressure.
[30:58] Se-eun: I wanted to tell more like not only Korea because I don't want someone who listened this podcast get not in wrong way.
I wanted to just show what happens. But not only in Korea but also Japan, as you're told. And recently, the China is open to the abroad to go outside easily.
[31:24] Jan: Right? Okay.
[31:25] Se-eun: Yeah. Compared before. So they also did the same things. That's why one of the reasons many immigrants from Korea to America to raise their children to be success. So every parents who are immigrants from Korea to United States, they do have a really nice job, but they gave up and to do some chores in here and money, get the money to make their children to study more. And they wanted to be their parents want their children to be some kind.
[32:09] Jan: Of lawyer, real professional.
[32:14] Se-eun: That's not only the Korean thing, but also the Asian who are lately industrialized people. They want it to be like earn some money. Because we only think about the money. If you do have a lot of money, you can live like better life. But I see many friends in my IG we do have more experience to go abroad and meet many friends and how it differences between Korea and other friends who are living in America or the other European people. And we do realize that how they live. And it's kind of getting changing. So near my friends who has kids, they couldn't do much change, but they knew they do have.
[33:08] Jan: Right. They're starting to think that way about what's possible.
[33:12] Se-eun: Right. So it's going to be changed. But the thing we couldn't change at all because of the size of our country. We have small population compared with the other country and we have such small land compared with others. So still we have to make money to get house, right? If you wanted to live in Seoul, you have to make money for less of your life to make that such expense.
[33:44] Jan: But that's the way it is in the United States. Big cities particularly are just so expensive to live in.
[33:52] Se-eun: The people started thinking in a different way. Just live once, enjoy your life. So that's why one of the reason we don't want to get married and we don't want have kids and we want to do more like this and.
[34:12] Jan: Find out more things and broaden your perspective. I don't want listeners to think that everything in Korea is bad. It's not all bad. There's nothing. No, this is just a different type of a lifestyle.
[34:30] Se-eun: I think I know everyone nowadays, the Kpop, because of Kpop, they know story to interested in Korea culture, right. They know about all the good things and lots of lots of K drama problems here. And in my opinion, since I have experience abroad such big country, I realized that I do like reading books, especially some nobles and do you know Game of Thrones?
[35:01] Jan: Yeah.
[35:01] Se-eun: Yes. Not because of the book. If you see some drama, there is such big scale that we couldn't think of when I visit here. And I realized how do they think like that much big. It's kind of experience I would love to have if my niece or I don't have child. So if I have chance to talk with another younger generation to go explore to other countries.
[35:36] Jan: That's what your advice would be? Exploring other countries?
[35:40] Se-eun: Yeah, it might be different because of the size.
[35:43] Jan: Yeah.
[35:44] Ye-Jin: I love living in Korea. In South Korea. It's safe.
[35:50] Jan: The transportation is wonderful, is wonderful.
[35:54] Ye-Jin: And you can go anywhere within like 3 hours, three hour drive. You can go anywhere in South Korea.
[36:02] Jan: And you can't always say places in the United States are safe. Right.
[36:08] Ye-Jin: I would rather stay Korea even though if I have chance to living in America because of not only the things, but I think when I getting older, I feel like my neighbor is really important than the other environment. So I wanted to be together who I used to communicate.
[36:33] Jan: Yeah. And I think too, my perception is that Asians are more careful to take care of elderly.
[36:42] Se-eun: Yeah. We called it Chong. Yes, we couldn't explain you should feel the way but we couldn't make you feeling in a short period have to leave and you can get some idea what Zhang is.
[37:00] Jan: Yeah, and that's better. And when I was in Korea, I didn't see any homeless or beggars or anyone. That was surprising to me.
[37:13] Se-eun: I guess compared with the other country, our welfare system is quite good so far. So far we have so much money on pension and actually that might be a little problem because the population is getting degrees but we most pay for the tax and health insurance and health insurance but many people getting pension right.
[37:45] Se-eun: But the smaller if it's a smaller population then they aren't paying for the older people.
[37:52] Ye-Jin: That is so far we will see later, maybe the other countries too.
[38:01] Jan: Well, thank you for sharing everything. This has been really fun.
[38:05] Se-eun: Thank you for having me.
[38:11] Jan: If you enjoyed this or any other of my podcast episodes it would be amazing if you would take a few minutes to leave a review so others can find it. You transcripts are available on my website@janjohnson.com. Please join me again next week.