After Thoughts
After Thoughts
After Thoughts: Family Dynamics
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[A.I. Generated] As we shed the shackles of a camera's gaze, our latest podcast session unfolds with a raw authenticity that's both refreshing and revealing. With a nostalgic nod to our initial awkwardness after a break, we uncover the unexpectedly rich tapestry of our conversation. From chuckling over quirky hair tales to exposing the delicate threads of childhood wounds, our dialogue dances between laughter and introspection, offering a rare glimpse into the genuine ebb and flow of our thoughts.
During this heart-to-heart, I found myself confronting an emotional milestone: the recognition of my place on the autism spectrum. This discovery cast a retrospective light on the contours of my younger years, bringing forth a poignant discussion about how my family's well-meaning responses to my unique challenges inadvertently shaped my approach to emotional expression. This segment of our conversation serves as a testament to the profound influence of childhood encounters and the importance of nurturing empathy and understanding in our relationships.
Navigating the tightrope of parenthood and partnership, we candidly share the strains and triumphs of family life. We acknowledge the imperfections that come with raising children and stress the crucial act of making amends swiftly when we falter. Through stories of anxiety, bereavement, and the exhilaration of fathering three spirited boys, we underscore the essentiality of forging open channels of communication. As we offer these personal revelations, we hope that these recorded moments might someday provide our offspring with a deeper comprehension of who we are, leaving a lasting legacy of love and honesty.
Reflecting on a Podcast Recording
Speaker 1This is how podcasting is meant to be right here .
Speaker 2No camera and we're in comfortable chairs lean back .
Speaker 1So much better . Yeah , it is Okay . Well , how do you think that went ?
Speaker 2Ooh , I can lean back , though . Here we go . I think it . You know , honestly , I said we said a lot more than I thought we would you know in general , and just sorry , I'm looking to make sure we're recording Okay , In general and in specific , things like I thought , I don't know , I didn't know what to expect going into this conversation ?
Speaker 1Dude , I didn't either . I felt so rusty because it's been a while since we recorded and , yeah , like in this setup First time in this particular space .
Speaker 2Yeah , that's true . So yeah , but I think it was good . I think it was good , how did you feel about ?
Speaker 1it . Yeah , I had similar things . I didn't know how the conversation was going to go , because I didn't know where it was going to go , necessarily , sure . And with everything I've been going through with like unpacking childhood traumas , right and I think that had to do with my family , like wasn't sure what was going to come up . I think , I got through it mostly okay , but yeah , you only cried once .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah .
Speaker 1No , the I didn't know that , like I didn't anticipate talking about my hair for 20 minutes . No , that's just what happens , I guess .
Speaker 2Man , I feel like we have hair like mine . That's because you do have a good head of hair . I what was I going to say ? I now , I'm distracted by your hair .
Speaker 1Yes , we're still going .
Speaker 2I was going to say I feel like we haven't had a good laugh on a podcast in a while .
Speaker 1That was a good moment .
Speaker 2Once we had it I was like I'm going to have to leave that in the episode . So you're welcome listeners . I don't know what are we doing with these episodes . Are they going on the community ?
Speaker 1You know , man , I don't know . Yeah , they're going on the community .
Speaker 2That was what I couldn't remember , what my original idea was for these . That's what it was . Yeah , they're going on the community , the deep divers .
Speaker 1Yeah yeah , I guess that's what we're going to call it , I . That's what we've been talking about .
Speaker 2Yeah , a new brand . I mean , this is exactly what this is that we're doing right now , diving a little deeper than we already went for the episode , If you want to call this deeper .
Speaker 1I don't know . It'll at least be broader , it's true .
Speaker 2Oh man .
Speaker 1The broad divers .
Speaker 2This is coming out . This is going to be after the high fives episode , so we're also both high right now .
Speaker 1I'm not high . Oh , you're not , no .
Speaker 2Oh , I am One of the sides , but I'm doing dry January right now , so you know it's a dry for alcohol and necessarily being sober , I guess .
Speaker 1I'm also doing dry January , where I turn the heat on my house and my skin completely dries out .
Speaker 2Yeah , it's finally cold here . Yeah , I don't know , what did you ? Was there anything that you you felt like you wanted to go into and you didn't in that episode ?
Speaker 1Surprisingly , I was really wanting to get into my skincare routine .
Speaker 2No , you were not , that's your mouth , oh my God .
Speaker 1No , I don't have one .
Speaker 2No , I was going to say surprise , I totally set you up for that man .
Speaker 1Surprisingly , I didn't have any , mainly because I didn't know what I was going to say . I intentionally tried to not think too much about what I was going to say for this one .
Speaker 2Yeah .
Speaker 1And just kind of let it be and let stuff come out . There were sometimes when it was so funny because Cody always gives me shit for a house . No-transcript , slow , I talk and put spaces in between , but it's because I'm I am stopping myself from saying um , as much as I can , you don't do a good job , well , I do a better job than if I wasn't doing any job at all .
Speaker 2So you're saying this to people who hear the edited versions . They have no idea what you're talking about , because I always had it .
Speaker 1That's what I'm saying . I had the way that I was talking about it , though , was I was . There were some points where I didn't know what I was going to say . Next , and . I just let words Start coming out until a form like a thought form , because I never know what we're talking about but you know Cody's gonna edit all that out , and so it'll just sound like I'm really intelligent and know what I'm talking about .
Speaker 2Well , in this moment I don't remember you doing it , so I don't know if I'll catch it Maybe .
Speaker 1I'll catch it , the second time .
Speaker 2Yeah , I don't know , I'm not editing like I did before . I'm leaving most of this content in . So , oh , there was a few times you paused for like what felt like seven minutes . I won't make them listen to that . Yeah , I don't know . I'm trying to think if there's anything that I left out because I felt like I didn't do a whole lot of talking in this conversation . But that's standard , it is , yeah , a little bit . There was an episode we did this season somewhere where I talked way like majority of the time I was like , oh my god , what was I even talking about ?
Speaker 1Yeah , I don't remember .
Speaker 2I remember that , though I remember thinking that yeah like wow , cody's talking a lot this time .
Speaker 1Good for him .
Speaker 2Oh , it's the . It's the spectrum episode , I'm sure oh yeah , it's gotta be it .
Speaker 2Yeah , had a lot to say on that one . I was thinking about that , though in you have to make sure this comes out for that episode I was .
Impactful Childhood Moments
Speaker 2I was thinking about that , though a little bit on , in terms of like how that , how that played into my childhood too , because my brother is Also in the spectrum , and then it turns out I am too , and I didn't even realize it , because it was so easy to hide those things and Compartmentalize . Compartmentalize those things in my family Because we were all the same and so it was just easy . Nothing seemed that out of the ordinary , and also I got really good at not expressing those things I could ever express . When things made me uncomfortable , they just did , and so people just knew that I was uncomfortable .
Speaker 2So I was always called like moody . And Now that we're on the episode where it's not public , I want to tell a story that was particularly traumatic and I didn't even realize it was traumatic until I was an adult and was thinking about it . It was like , oh my god , how do I remember this moment so well ? And it was a , it was a scene , and it's kind of , it's kind of fivish the way it all happened . I was young , I was really young , and my parents always thought that I was too emotional or too sensitive and didn't know how to , didn't have a sense of humor , I didn't know how to take things as a joke , maybe because I'm on the spectrum .
Speaker 2And and so it's like I take things too literally and so that would get really upset about it . They're like we were just taken in there . Of course they were really sarcastic , so it's like that type of humor which I have a disdain for in my adult life , hmm . And so you know , and it was like , and so number one time I was crying because I was I mean , I was probably seven or eight , I mean I was young and I was crying and I came in there and I was crying about something that they had said or whatever I don't even know what it was , but they'd upset me and they were like , like , like antagonizing me and stuff , and so it was making it worse and they and I remember they just like kept pushing and pushing and pushing and they said , and they were then they were just laughing at me for crying , like laughing hysterically at me , and then they were just like , oh , and I remember getting so upset , like jumping up and down , stomping , I remember so so vividly .
Speaker 2And they Later said you know , you just had no sense humor was trying to like beat it into you .
Speaker 2Hmm , I don't know if that's exactly the words they said , but it was something like that it was something really forceful and I just kind of was I'd always just kind of stuck with me . They left it at that for years and years and years . And when I was an adult and I was thinking about it , I was like this moment has stuck with me my entire life and has caused Just that one moment , caused me to never want to talk about my feelings again , never want to express myself . Like it was that impactful to me that I was like , well , I guess it's not okay , I'm just gonna get laughed at and made fun of if I ever expressed my emotions , so shit . And so that was something that definitely came up in the conversation , that I wasn't necessarily comfortable saying to the entire world . But we'll say to our community and we just gotta make sure my parents don't somehow figure out how to join . I Mean , we've talked to them about this moment , to you . We control .
Speaker 1We control the the gates family's not allowed .
Speaker 2But you know it really stuck with me and it's and that's I definitely don't want to be . That you know , despite how silly , I have thought about emotions in my life , probably from that moment and from others , and so you know it's funny how , like , looking back on it , how much I was so and I still all give this way to some degree , but in different ways . But I get would get so annoyed and just like Put off by other people's emotions and it's just like and I would do exactly what my parents said to me , like I would not , I wouldn't like gaslight them necessarily or like make them feel stupid for having emotions . But I mean , surely I did that to some people . I'm sure that it's like X's , and you know people I date when I was kids and stuff . I made them feel dumb for having emotions and being upset about something and just like , well , that's just irrational and Unrealistic . I don't know why you're feeling this way and it's so , but if I didn't understand it , then their emotions didn't matter , you know .
Speaker 2And so I like to think that I've grown from that and I'm better about it , at least Very quickly realizing how wrong I am in the situation and by feeling that way and trying to Manage that a bit more , but A bit more but , um , but that definitely , that's definitely stuck with me a lot in a way that I don't want to be that , don't ever want to do that , and my parents would never do that like they're horrified at the thought of the fact that not only did it happen Because they didn't even remember it , of course , but that I remembered it so well , yeah , and so you know , it's like having that conversation with my mom about you're not a bad mom and you guys aren't bad parents , but everybody does bad things sometimes and it's just a matter of like trying to mediate those bad things and hopefully be Is aware of it as you can , but everybody has a bad day and so it's like you know or they do it with the best of intentions , Sure , and don't realize how it's coming across .
Speaker 2Yeah right yeah , and I think , a lot of stuff that my parents said . I can say that they probably did with the best intentions . You know they loved us and wanted to have the best life and all the things .
The Impact of Family Dynamics
Speaker 2But you know everybody carries with them their own Shit that causes you to react in a way that does do damage to other people , because we don't , we don't remember what it's like to be Like nothing .
Speaker 2Yet yeah you're just being molded , you're a sponge , you know , yeah , and like , everything will affect you and you're entirely dependent on Other people for survival . Yeah , what , even like you know , it's your kids ages now . It's like they're . They're dependent on your survival , but they're starting to also be independent and do things on their own .
Speaker 2And so they have their own personalities , but they're still Looking to you as the sole source of truth yeah , your capital T truth to them , and so it's like everything you do carries an insane amount of weight , and I just I think that that's it's always . That's a dangerous place for anybody to be , any human being , because we all screw up , we all do things and say things that we don't mean or don't want to , whenever we're Frustrated or tired or we have our own shit going on , because we're also humans and so you know yeah , you know , I heard Thinking along those lines .
Speaker 1I heard something on a podcast or something earlier this week or last week and they were talking about parenting and they said the goal is not to be perfect , because that's impossible , right ? So don't try to be perfect , try to repair as quickly as possible . Yeah , and that's another thing that we and Amy taught me this , I think , intuitively much earlier on . I don't think I , I don't think I gave it the credit or the weight that it was due , but I learned and I've been doing my best to foster this environment of like , even if I lose my cool Cuz , you know , I still have in anxiety and I'm realizing more and more how much anxiety that I have had and do have and how it shows up , and I didn't recognize it as anxiety . And and then I'm also processing a lot of grief and trauma and so I'm emotionally raw a lot of the time . And and then I've got three young boys and they are loud and they are rambunctious and they are fighting constantly , yeah , and they are pranking me constantly and you deserve that .
Speaker 1Yeah , I know they're asking me you know million questions and and all the stuff and and , and . I love them more than anything . And Sometimes I feel like I'm losing my mind because I cannot , I can't even like like experience a moment , because I'm so filled with anxiety and and and sometimes I snap and and Before . What I would end up doing was you know when I was early on and parenting ?
Speaker 1I would shame myself and things like that , and that doesn't help anyone and so instead I go right to repairing and , you know , I apologize , I say I shouldn't have done that and I I try to express like how I was feeling in that moment and and acknowledge how they were feeling in that moment , you know , and and repair the , that rift and and do it as soon as I can , and I can tell that that's made a big impact and it takes a lot of the pressure off too , a lot of the weight , realizing that there is a mechanism like you , even if you do damage , like there is there , there are ways to heal , yeah , and and so you can minimize , significantly minimize any damage you might do unintentionally . Yeah , if you are diligent about repairing that , yeah .
Speaker 2Yeah , I think that's definitely the best way to do it . I mean , that's that's that's a good approach to have in all things in life really . I've learned , the quicker that I can acknowledge that I did something wrong and I reacted in a way that I shouldn't have and just Apologize . I mean the same thing in any relationship . I think , that you have in your life . It's just and it also makes you feel better and it help everybody just moves past it all .
Speaker 1It doesn't like yeah , I have time to get into that deeper core memory , you know yeah , yeah , the other tricky thing in family dynamics is prioritizing , especially when you're kids , are young , prioritizing your relationship with your significant other .
Speaker 1That's been a huge battle and our oldest he , like I said , he had trouble sleeping , which means that he also has to have someone laying in the bed with him to fall asleep initially , and he doesn't fall asleep until nine , sometimes 10 o'clock , and that is challenging because that means that , like Amy and I don't get any time together alone .
Speaker 1Until that time , and prior to this week , most of the time we were not eating dinner with the kids because they were fixing them each a different meal pretty much , and so we end up like just ordering Uber Eats at nine o'clock because we're so exhausted , and then we just veg out in front of the TV and eat and eat and then go to bed like not really connecting , and so then that kind of takes a toll , and so it's important to remember all of the parts of the family and acknowledge that , and one of the things that I did , I post this in the community , actually the video that I went through and did some of these exercises on just reflecting on 2023 and looking ahead to 2024 and what I want , basically what I want to be celebrating at the end of 2024 .
Speaker 1Yeah , but first I did the exercise where I went through nine different aspects of my life and kind of rated them one to 10 and going to put them in the wheel and colored them in at the level that they were to kind of give a visual of where those levels are and one of them was romance .
Speaker 1So , like my relationship with Amy was at a seven , which is or maybe , yeah , it was a seven or an eight , which is huge , because that we've gone through a lot and these last six months have been super healing for us as well , and so I was . That was like learning . Number one in this was like I feel really good about where our relationship is going and that's an amazing feeling and I feel like we have dug down to the bottom of everything and have rebuilt a new foundation and it feels fantastic .
Speaker 1And so you know there's .
Speaker 1I didn't think that it was possible to do that , though , like for , a long time and then I also didn't realize how close I was to it and I just had to accept it as a possibility and let go of things I was holding onto . And then it just like the pieces just fell into place . And you know , the challenge in a family is , like I said , is balancing those different relationships , but also like we let our kids see that we prioritize each other and we also prioritize ourselves Right and being as open as we can with our kids age appropriate , obviously , but just about , like how we're feeling what we're going through .
Speaker 1You know one thing that it can be kind of hard sometimes , just because of the nature of where I've come from . But , amy , you know , she'll find herself crying , grieving her mom , and she doesn't try to hide it , and which says a lot , like she feels safe enough to do that in the environment we've created . But also , like the kids see that and they can see that it's okay to feel these things and it's okay to express them in . However , they need to come out , as long as you're not hurting anybody . You know , yeah , and that it's important to do those things and to not just trap them in your bodies and let them fester , but actually let them move through your body and release them back into the ether . You know .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah , for sure . Yeah , that's what I was gonna
Parenting Reflections and Conversations
Speaker 2say . It's like you know you can do everything gets to be a teachable moment because they're just absorbing anyway and so you can show that the things you need , because I feel like people just sacrifice those things . It's so easy to be married and have kids and your relationship becomes utilitarian as providers and you forget about each other in that way .
Speaker 1I mean , that's hard to do without kids , it's easy to do with that kids , yeah , and then you end up suffering in isolation and silence , right , yeah .
Speaker 2Two ships passing in the night , as the many songs and poetry says .
Speaker 1And then your kids grow up not ever seeing any of that and thinking everything is okay until one day it isn't Right , you know .
Speaker 2Yeah , but they just don't see what's happening . They well , they get used to it . I feel like it's so easy . I was thinking about that when you're thinking about like kid childhood . It's like how easily we regulate the way that people act like people's actions and emotions and we , as children , regulate them . We're like oh , this is normal , this is what normal looks like .
Speaker 2So we don't know anything else , Right but because we don't know that it's not normal . But the adults do , they get divorced and then the kids are like , why did this happen ? We were such a happy family this whole time , Everybody existed in the way that I thought it was normal . And so I think about that a lot , about how we . I just feel like it's the regulation that they miss it . They miss that you guys weren't getting along . There are the two parents weren't talking and they were just passing each other and not really acknowledging it because they were still doing things for the kids .
Speaker 2So it isn't like they weren't present all of a sudden . I mean , I'm sure children that , especially older children in their teens or whatever they can take care of themselves , and then they see that their parents don't ever talk to each other , and then they don't even talk to them either because it's easy not to . And so I think older children see that and often like , oh yeah , I guess it makes sense why you guys are beginning to divorce , but young children don't have that ability to see that part of your relationship as abnormal .
Speaker 2So they don't know why , and that's why they're so wrecked by it .
Speaker 1Maybe yeah , yeah , there's something to be said for letting your kids get to know you as a person more you know and not just a parent . Yeah , and I'm learning this in bits and pieces and like , for example , my oldest he this was a month or two ago like he asked me something along the lines of like what I was going to be doing at work today , which kind of caught me off guard because , you know , I wouldn't ever think to explain to him what I'm doing at work .
Speaker 1Like I don't often even explain it to Amy or anyone else because , like I just glaze over , no one really understands what I do for a living most of the time .
Speaker 2Sure .
Speaker 1And and so you know , I just didn't even think about it and so . So then I had to go through the process of trying , cause I've given I was Trying to translate . Well , yeah , take , take what like actually answer his question and do it in a way that a seven year old can understand .
Speaker 2Right , exactly .
Speaker 1Yeah , and so I went through that whole process , thinking through , and , and you know , I think it was like I was . I basically was helping the whole company define and rally around a strategy and put in a new communication framework in place and a new tool to track all of that , and then like rolling it out across the entire company and all this stuff , and so I'm , like you know , explaining to him this is what I've been working on , but trying to do it in that way , and and and he said something like wow , well , good luck .
Speaker 2That kind of sounds like he was like I wanted way less information . It kind of sounds like he's over-explanatory .
Speaker 1No , no , no , no , no , no , no , no . Actually it was . It was really sweet , because he's never . He had never wished me luck for anything before , oh , okay . And and it caught me off guard and like sort of just filled me with joy and I like I get like giggles and give him a hug and , just like you know , thank him . And and then that meant something to him .
Speaker 1And so now , when he , you know , I go into my office and and he gives me a hug and a kiss , and then he was like you know , have a great day , be nice to everyone . Good luck , and I just like Be nice to everyone . Yeah , that's basically . He tells me to be nice to my coworkers because I'm always telling him to be nice to his brothers .
Speaker 2It's good advice . Yeah , that's really funny . Yeah , it's . It's yeah , I mean not having kids myself . It's fun to watch your kids grow up , I guess , and see that , and also we get to have deep conversations about your strategy behind being parents . So it's fun to see that like act it out and also how it impacts them compared to how , like you know , because we're talking about our own own life too .
Speaker 1I wonder if my kids will ever listen to these .
Speaker 2If they're smart , they would . It's what an easy way to get to know your dad in a way that he would have never told you .
Speaker 1I was honestly thinking about that exact same thought earlier , though in this conversation .
Speaker 2I was thinking about wondering if your kids would ever listen to this .
Speaker 1I want to call them out , but I don't want to say their names , I know .
Speaker 2Yeah , they'll know . If they're old enough to listen to this , they'll know .
Speaker 1So I've , because I've talked , I've talked a lot about them , yeah , and this might be a fun experiment . Okay , I'll just . I'll just talk to them as if they're listening , but I have no idea when , at what age , they might listen to this , yeah , so .
Speaker 2Call them by the first letter .
Speaker 1So so , yes , there you go . Well , first , I want to say I don't know how I've come across in this podcast , but I hope that you've gotten to know me and understand me a little better , and I think one of the greatest gifts that I've experienced in recording these is being able to document my journey of growth and healing , and it's been a wild ride and it's only gonna get better from here . And I just wanna say that being a dad has been the greatest joy of my life and it's been my most challenging and most rewarding experience and I love it and I love all of you , my three sons and I don't know what . If we have a fourth , then that's not gonna work .
Speaker 2Yeah , please , don't have a fourth .
Speaker 1So anyway , rather than address them individually , I would just say that my kids are amazing and I wouldn't give them up for anything . I wouldn't trade them for anything . That's a weird thing to say , If you think about it , like where is that ? For I wouldn't give them up for anything . Or maybe I'm just it's a little too late and I've been talking for too long for me to start making coherences . I mean I ruined the great dad moment .
Speaker 2Yeah .
Speaker 1I think we just moved past it .
Speaker 2Honestly , I was thinking , if you think about it , though , how often you've talked about , like your strategies , about parenting and what you want to instill in them and all of these things . If they ever listen to this podcast , they're gonna have all that information anyway , so they're gonna know how much you care .
Speaker 1Yeah , that's true .
Speaker 2They have no idea I love you too if you're listening . They have no idea if I love them in this podcast . Yeah , will .
Speaker 1Yeah , anything else to talk about ? I don't think so . We need to do some more of these , though We've got some left , so we gotta figure that out . They don't need to know that . Well , they do now .
Speaker 2It's not after thoughts right after the episode . For some of these it'd be after , after , after , after thoughts .
Speaker 1No , we listen to them like we go back and listen to them and then meet and record so . I do need a refresher because , like we said , it's been a year in between Some of them yeah .
Speaker 2Yeah , because we had this idea like halfway through . Yes , we have a bunch of them in the beginning and honestly that could be fun to go back and listen . We can just mention that in the episode we're going back and listen after like a year .
Speaker 1Oh , or do you want to go back and listen to other seasons ?
Speaker 2That'd be a good like in between season projects . Oh yeah , we could possibly do that . That could be fun After season . What is this for ? What are we doing ?
Speaker 1Hold on . I thought for the fifth season we might go back and like to some of the more downloaded episodes and kind of do part twos and like how we've changed , since we've talked about how that original conversation we're strategizing in real time here , yeah probably should stop recording .
Speaker 2Yeah , I should probably stop recording at this point , All right well , that's a wrap , all right . Oh , God , take it up . I just realized you were . Just the recording button was too far away . Anyway , yeah , we'll see you next episode .
Speaker 1Bye , bye , bye .