After Thoughts: Commitment

[A.I. Generated] Have you ever felt tethered to goals and commitments, only to find yourself unraveling under the weight of them? That's where I found myself, struggling to keep up with my writing and fitness, teetering on the brink of a depressive episode. Join us as we peel back the layers of commitment and engagement, revealing the raw and often humorous tales that have shaped our understanding. We're cracking open the book on last summer's mysterious event I've been teasing, and we'll dissect the whims of audience engagement that surprised us with an unexpected twist.

With a blend of laughter and eye-opening realizations, we navigate the maze of job-hopping and burnout, and the unexpected impact it has on family dynamics. My journey through different professions, from the high hopes of songwriting to the reality of financial instability, has been a rollercoaster that many of you can relate to. We candidly discuss the dilemma of staying in unsatisfying roles versus the fear of the unknown, and how these professional gambles intertwine with our personal lives.

As we wrap up this episode, we delve into the intricate dance between anxiety, personal growth, and our evolving relationships. Through the stories of our own romantic partnerships, we uncover the profound effects of anxiety medication and self-awareness on our ability to commit. Reflecting on the organic growth of our podcast, we celebrate how sharing these personal narratives has allowed you, our listeners, to grow along with us, creating a tapestry of transformation that is both intimate and universally relatable.

Transcript

Reflections on Commitment and Engagement

Speaker 1 0:02

Are we recording ? We're recording . Okay , do you have all your moods , light settings and screen brightness adjusted ?

Speaker 2 0:10

I think so , yeah , okay , feel good .

Speaker 1 0:13

We just spent like five minutes trying to turn on dark mode so that Cody's screens wouldn't be too bright while we're recording .

Speaker 2 0:20

Yeah .

Speaker 1 0:20

Okay , so anyway , after thoughts .

Speaker 2 0:26

After thoughts .

Speaker 1 0:27

Commitment . I listened to the episode last week but I was traveling and then , right before I got back into town , Cody left and went out of town and then you just got back .

Speaker 2 0:41

And I did not listen to the episode while I was traveling .

Speaker 1 0:44

Yeah , it's been a while for you . I put off listening to this episode as long as I could .

Speaker 1 0:51

I actually did not want to listen to it . Yeah , I anticipated it being my least favorite episode , wow , and I was pleasantly surprised when I listened to it . I think , yeah , either I misremembered the conversation or you edited out the parts that bothered me , but I remember when we got done recording that I didn't really feel like it was very great . And then I and then especially what happened to me like right after that I think the way that I remembered it is I came into the conversation more from a position that I had figured out commitment , oh yeah , and then life taught me a lesson shortly after that . Yeah , and we recorded this . It was either December 2022 or like January 2023 . Like it was that long ago . It was over a year ago , that's right .

Speaker 1 1:59

And so much has happened since then and right after we recorded I you know , with the new year I went on this whole thing where I was like writing every day online and I committed to writing every day for the whole year and then I committed to doing this like 90 day workout thing in February and that lasted until like mid-March . Both of those and so like very clearly did not fully commit to those things . You did not have commitment figured out Exactly , and then like , and then that's when I hit , you know that major depressive episode that happened right before what happened to me last summer and I just realized , like we I have mentioned I've alluded to this event that happened last summer in at least three or four episodes this season , but the episode that I actually talk about , that doesn't come out until , I think , next week or the week after it's great , it's great promo yeah .

Speaker 1 2:59

It's . I'm building it up probably to be more than what it actually is when you listen to it .

Speaker 2 3:05

But I mean we've set the bar pretty low at a couple of points in this season . So I think , it can't be that bad . It's so funny .

Speaker 1 3:12

We . So I'm just looking at the , the stats for like downloads in the first seven days and that's supposed to be like an indicator of success of episodes and like we started off the season super strong with some of our best episodes and then we released high fives .

Speaker 2 3:34

Did we lose people after ?

Speaker 1 3:35

that .

Speaker 2 3:35

He lost everyone .

Speaker 1 3:37

It's like cut in half .

Speaker 2 3:39

For every episode , every episode since then .

Speaker 1 3:42

It's slowly been climbing back up . But the weird thing is and I wonder if it's just it's just like for the first seven days , because after that week , downloads started to pick up on that episode and I looked at Spotify , and high fives is actually the most downloaded , like in the last 30 days , or something , Wow , which is unexpected .

Speaker 2 4:05

Yeah , so I don't know you said high fives is the most downloaded . Yeah , it's like 30 days on Spotify . Well , it's funny because they're all talking about it in the community too . Yeah , I saw . Did you see that comment I commented on today ? Oh no , I haven't been in there today . If you're watching , or watching , if you're listening , then I'm about to talk about that whole comment . But this dude totally calls us out and was like why the hell did you go off about for 20 minutes about Marvel ? So I got in there .

Speaker 1 4:32

Do you know , cody ?

Speaker 2 4:33

Yeah , I basically got in there and he explained it a very short thing .

Speaker 2 4:37

It's like I have yeah , I have three things in my life that I can talk nonstop about . It's like my three pillars of conversation and no-transcript , and that's one of them , and so I was like you know , not only am I obsessive about it and can get very easily lost in that , when I get lost in conversation , or parentheses , and also high Um , but the I also , as I said , I was like I also have Asperger's and parentheses spoiler alert for a future episode Um , and so all of that plays into the fact that if I , whenever I feel lost in a conversation , which , for that episode , was about two hours , then I I revert to one of my three pillars of communication , which is going to be either all things comics , mostly Marvel and mostly on screen , um , but definitely comics of all sorts uh , conversations , that's one , and all statistics behind it in the industry , like that's that's where I really like nerd out , um . And the other one is all things cinema , and then the third is all things music .

Speaker 2 5:44

I can talk about any of those three things nonstop , like to the point where you're like either you need , you want to die , or you want to kill me .

Speaker 1 5:52

So I mean , it's not a bad strategy to have pillars that you can come back to Um yeah , really . I think , I think the key is is being able to read the read the room .

Speaker 2 6:02

Yeah , so yeah that's the problem is that my three pillars are not very applicable to most people at most times and so like it is a great idea to have like things you can always come back to , especially as a five and like small talk conversations . But my problem is is those come out . I don't choose to go to those pillars , they choose me in the moment . You know , it's like all of a sudden I'm like oh my God , it's like that comic book and that guy . And then it's like I'm gone and 30 minutes later people are looking at me with like bloodshot eyes and like dead faces . Uh , it's , it's . It's something I'm working on .

Speaker 1 6:34

Oh yeah , I have not . I am behind on community . I've been so on the last , the last three , four weeks of my job have been just hell .

Speaker 2 6:46

And so .

Speaker 1 6:48

I really last couple of months and and so , like I am behind on a lot of different stuff , um , I need to catch up on on conversations and stuff in there .

Navigating Job Commitment and Family Priorities

Speaker 1 6:57

But , uh , this episode , the commitment episode uh , I thought it was really funny because one of the things that we started off talking about was how you would just got a new job again , yeah , and then you've already moved on to a different job since we had that conversation .

Speaker 2 7:17

Right , yeah , and that's because this was recorded essentially a season ago , in terms of both literal seasons , figurative seasons and seasons in the show in terms of length of time . And so , like I it was do , it was do yeah , cause I get a new job every season .

Speaker 2 7:33

So you're you're accelerating the pace , because this time we did one season , but you've had two jobs in this season , right , yeah , I had to add a series of bad luck with jobs , which that I mean it kind of in in some ways plays into this conversation , I think , cause I was thinking about it and I was just thinking about how , like I don't know , I'm just in a place which I know you can relate to in your own way , Um , where I just feel like anytime that I have like my buckets and they all start to kind of like leak into each other in my life , then my compartmentalization just like starts to bleed together . I get really overwhelmed and get really nihilistic and spiral out of control really quickly . And so that's kind of like where I've been feeling lately , I think , and for various reasons , and but one of them is , like you know , doing I really loved doing Febby Riders and writing a song a day for a month and all that , but like it turned out that that was like kind of the last straw in that regard is where it's like I was fine for the month for the most part because I can , I can , I can press on for a while before I'm like burned out and I can , and I don't even realize it . I'm just like , yeah , we're just trucking along and yeah , I'm really busy , but I'm not that stressed out and I'm fine , and then , like two months later , I have like a week's of depression . So it's like , oh , maybe I was actually feeling it , um , and so , uh , just suppressing and so , um , I think that that's kind of like where I'm feeling now .

Speaker 2 8:57

But one of the things that I've realized through this kind of process of self reflection in the last few days and just kind of like letting myself feel all the things , is like , um , part of that is like I feel like for me , like , if we just take the idea of jobs , commitment for me has to be and this bleeds into the rest of my life too Um , I have to be , I have to be , I have to feel like I have a place there , I have to have like some type of purpose and even more so to like get down to like the root of it . I think it's like I as a five , as my personality , as my type of person I am in general , I need to feel needed there , to care about it . If I don't have that , then I no longer care . Like , if I don't feel like I have a place there or like I , I bring something special to the table , then I want to .

Speaker 2 9:47

I start emotionally and mentally just checking out , I start pulling away , and which I do in all things and in all relationships and in all things in my life , and so , uh , I've started to fix it , at least for the most part , in other areas of my life , but with jobs , I don't value a day job at all , like I don't value , and in fact , I despise it , and so like , yeah , you resent the fact that it's even necessary , exactly , and so , and that somebody else gets to benefit off of me working , like I want that , I want to benefit , and so , um , the idea of a company in general is awful and I just want to work for myself , and so I think I , I don't have a , I don't have a very high bar in terms of wanting to be committed to a job , and so it's really easy for me to be like , fuck this , I'm done , um , and but the job that I had during this episode , uh , the commitment episode , is one that was one of the worst jobs I've ever had , uh , objectively .

Speaker 2 10:43

And so , um , it didn't . It wasn't emotionally . I checked out a long time before that . Yeah , I was just looking for something else , so , yeah , yeah , I .

Speaker 1 10:53

I think that the the only thing really that changed for me in terms of jobs is that I started having kids , and so the stakes are higher , right , and I'm sure it makes it worse in so many ways it can .

Speaker 1 11:08

Yeah , I think it can , because then it feels like it's easier to feel trapped . Yeah , um , but on the other hand , it also helps , uh , kind of give us a sense of purpose . Sure , because even if I don't enjoy my job , I can tell myself that I'm doing this to provide for my family and it's just temporary and it's true . Like I can , I can you know , I won't , it won't always be this way , and and I can kind of keep moving forward . That's said , I almost quit my job last week .

Speaker 1 11:43

So , and , like it , mostly worked itself out . But , yeah , I'd gotten pretty frustrated and Was ready , to Ready to move on , but at the same time I didn't have anything to move on to , and so it was you know , so they Thankfully thankfully , I decided to sleep on it and woke up feeling differently about it the next day .

Speaker 2 12:04

Yeah , which I mean . We were supposed to record this episode last week , so it would have been a very different conversation .

Speaker 1 12:11

That's true , had we done that , I think .

Speaker 2 12:12

And so that's kind of an interesting thing to think about , because , yeah , it would have been very different . Because I think now I feel like my trip to see my family this past weekend and and Just and and the in the prep to get get ready for that in my , in my day job , and I was also pushing myself really hard to have an acoustic version of my most recent single done , like , done , done , so I could submit it to distributing and I didn't really get that done on Friday , so then I had to like hang on to it . I just finished it this morning and so I've been working on that and doing that and then my , my actual , my day job now is Becoming more demanding . Like I've had all week long I've had to be going to all of my accounts and basically like , for those who don't remember , I'm an alcohol distributor , sales rep , so like I have a lot of accounts and I rarely do I have to do like a lot of the bigger distributor things is like Having to sell things that like put me , you know , being like a normal salesperson and being pushed to do sell things you don't really want to sell or care about , and it's like sometimes put you in awkward positions with con , with converse , with people in conversation and and when they don't want it .

Speaker 2 13:20

So but that ever , occasionally have to do this thing and this supplier is making us have all new menu placements with printed menus as proof from the restaurants and so one .

Speaker 2 13:31

It's hard to do that anyway . It's hard for me to go into an account and be like you know I , can you please , please , just do this for me , like , just do this as a favor , like , and so I've been having to kind of take that like strut , strattle the line of like I need this as a favor , but also like I also only want you to do it if it works for your menu and I'm like I'm not just taking advantage of you know , be you being willing to do me a favor , because I also need that relationship afterwards and so , and people I think have appreciated that , but it's been this constant push of me Having to do this and go through this and it's and know I've been just going through a lot of knows because it's also mid-season Restaurants don't print until summer Menu for summer you know , and so they're like yeah , I mean , I consider it in like a month so , and I was like why I need this favor by Tuesday ?

Speaker 2 14:22

And so it's been , if that's been like emotionally draining and also kind of making me hate it , and so I've been feeling drained non-stop , and so can they like fake print it , you know yes okay , no , this is behind it's , it's behind the community , right these ?

Speaker 1 14:41

yeah okay .

Speaker 2 14:43

So yeah , we do that , but or we have done that . My , my predecessor in my job , definitely made all , all fake menus , as you can imagine , as you know who that is .

Speaker 2 14:58

And so , yeah , it's been . It's been hard cuz like they wanted to be like more legit . I mean , I mean my boss was like , do you know to how to do what he did ? You know , I was like a hundred percent , yeah , I could do that , but they've apparently been checking because they found out that some of our menus were out of date because he had been sending in my boss had been sending me news or like a lot older and but this I don't know why , it's a thing like don't , don't treat us like we're children . Yeah , we're trying to get your stuff and so . So that's been draining on me and so like I'm in a particularly like low and kind of negative place right now . Yeah , whereas last week I would have been probably a lot more upbeat and optimistic because I was suppressing all of my real feelings .

Speaker 1 15:39

Yeah , I mean , I think we have similar triggers here , because the thing that really started to get me frustrated one of the one of the main things , one one was incompetence , which we talked about before , yeah , and , and then I had to Let someone go on my team and then take over his work , so I'm like basically doing two jobs , but it's not two jobs in the sense that like it's twice the work , it's more like three times the work because , like the cognitive load of trying to switch between being like the executor of things versus the you know more strategic person .

Speaker 1 16:18

It's very taxing , yeah , and so there's a lot of pressure right now , but it's the it's that I wanted , like I was trying to work to where , like I Was putting systems and things in place where my job would be easier and take less from me so that I could give more to this . Yeah , right , that was what I was working on . Yeah , and I was , and I was heading in that direction and it felt really good and I was , I was being really energized by it and I was like yes , this , like one , this makes it easier to stay in my job , where I'm at , for a while , because , sure , you know , I can , I can maintain that energy , and if I'm not being energized by my job , at least I'm being energized outside my job . And then , and then I still have feeds into .

Speaker 2 17:01

Yeah , yeah , cycle .

Speaker 1 17:03

But now it's like it's so draining , mm-hmm , that it's hard to not start resenting that , yeah , and and then I start to get cynical about it and and the challenge is like Currently there's no plan for that to change anytime soon , and so I don't know how long I'm gonna be able to keep this up right and and that at least that's a story in my head . I talked to my therapist about this is like there's a story in my head of like I Feel like the job is asking more of me than I have to give and I don't know how long I'll be able to Continue at this pace . Yeah , and I Could . Just I feel like shutting down , and so I'm trying to work through all that so that I , you know , whenever I do end up leaving , it'll be my timing in my terms , yeah , but rather than you know , rage , quitting or you know , or anything like that , because I don't want to do that again , like I don't .

Speaker 1 18:05

I don't want to quit without some kind of Backup plan ? Yeah , for sure , something else to move on to , and so , yeah , it's just been , yeah , it's been really challenging .

Speaker 2 18:15

Yeah , yeah , I've been there and I guess that's kind of what I'm starting to feel

Navigating Job Changes and Burnout

Speaker 2 18:20

now . It's like I don't even mind my job 99% of the time , like it's it really has been like so much less Stress and emotionally taxing work , and so that's been very nice . But then you have there's always weeks or days where it's like a lot all at once and you're like why is all this happening ? Why are we doing all these events and all these supplier reps are coming to town at the same time . Then my whole normal day is wrecked and I have to figure out how to make up for that . And then , of course , afterwards we I have something like this going on , or you know , I'm playing a show or whatever , and so like , yeah , I think it can be a lot all at once , and that's when I get overwhelmed and get kind of cynical about All things . But generally most of the time it's not that bad , but still I just I don't know , I just feel like disconnecting .

Speaker 1 19:05

Yeah , I get it , it also .

Speaker 2 19:08

But I haven't like rage quit . Yeah , I've never done that .

Speaker 1 19:11

Yeah , I'm trying . I I guess I technically haven't rage quit so much as I have just , like Impulsive , given up quit , yeah , yeah , sure , yeah , maybe apathetic , yeah , apathetic , quitting . Yeah , normally I I'm trying to think I tend to not make decisions in that state , Like if I'm feeling rage . It's a signal to me that I need to back away and gather myself before I make any decisions , especially now that I have people depending on me . So yeah , I guess technically I don't . I've never raged quite either , but I have one to two points .

Speaker 2 19:56

Yeah , definitely I tend to stay places a little . At least , I used to stay places longer than I should , but it was mostly out of fear of change and having to find something else . Even if it's a bad rhythm , it's still a rhythm , right , it's like you get used to it .

Speaker 1 20:15

It's on cost fallacy that we talked about .

Speaker 2 20:17

Exactly , yeah , a little bit . So I've definitely experienced a lot of that and trying to make something work longer than it could . But the last job I had , I knew I needed to get out and I was happy that I did that , on my terms for sure .

Speaker 1 20:33

Yeah , I think in the episode I mentioned that I had just hit the two-year mark at the job and that I'd never made it to the three-year market at any job . And then I made it to the three-year mark at this job and that's when everything really started to go down . You're like , oh , this is what it's like . I'm never doing this again .

Speaker 2 20:58

I mean the two-year rhythm of having jobs for you has worked out in your favor . That's true , yeah , so at least there's that . I've switched jobs and it feels like it's a lateral either lateral move or just a horizontal . I just jump to another part in the same and I just can't get past that threshold , and so that's frustrating for sure . I would mind changing jobs every two years if the next job is always like a step forward .

Speaker 1 21:22

Yeah , I mean , I guess technically , yes , it was mostly a step . It was the least of step forward in terms of salary every time until I quit to start my own business , and then I was poor for like three years .

Speaker 2 21:38

Yeah right .

Speaker 1 21:40

Well , no , that's not true . I mean , that's not truly not the entire time . I did pretty well there in the middle , until 20 , 20 .

Exploring Anxiety and Relationships Evolution

Speaker 1 21:49

But , yeah , I was thinking more about this , though , and trying to get more towards the root of , like , what are the things that pull me back from staying committed to something , or like that ? Yeah , I wanted to try to force me or pull me away from commitment . Yeah , and realizing more and more , as I have become more aware of my own anxiety , that anxiety is actually usually at the root of any commitment issues that I have . Like you know , at times , it's been hard for me to commit to an eagram five , and when I got down to that , it's like I had deep anxieties about something that was either going on between us or something that was going on in my life , and so it made me not want to commit to things .

Speaker 2 22:43

Oh , for sure .

Speaker 1 22:43

Definitely yeah .

Speaker 2 22:44

Yeah , I'm the same way .

Speaker 1 22:46

Yeah , and so I think that that's been a good learning of mine , because then I can actually address a root cause and not just always feel like I can't commit to anything Right .

Speaker 2 22:59

Yeah , definitely that's true . Yeah , I'm definitely the same way . It does get to be tied to like . I guess relationships are hard in that way because you don't . I have to kind of you take you , take out the aspect of what I said earlier about where I feel like , if I need to feel like needed , I don't necessarily I don't want to be needed in relationships .

Speaker 1 23:23

Yeah , it's like the opposite yeah .

Speaker 2 23:24

So like it takes a different place there , but I'm sure it's still communicating something that I just haven't really quite , you know , uncovered but but I think it's kind of all coming from a similar place and definitely comes from anxiety for sure , like that's . But anxiety drives a huge , you know , the majority of my , of my life . In many ways I'm on lots of anxiety meds and so now it's like I probably still have the anxiety , but sometimes it's a little bit masked by not feeling the fullest part of it , which makes me feel like I'm dying , and so my body doesn't really have that opportunity to shut down the same way .

Speaker 1 24:03

Interesting .

Speaker 2 24:04

But yeah , but it's . I'm a little more like level headed in that way , so sometimes it's hard for me to be like , oh , this is anxiety that I'm feeling that's actually causing and driving a lot of that , because I've it doesn't feel the same to me , because anxiety before was like show stopping , like everything has to stop , yeah , and now it's like just more subtle . It's more like yeah , like a little troll is slowly squeezing my throat and trying to choke me out Like I feel like that pressure is right here , troll .

Speaker 1 24:31

I was trying to think of the least you know .

Speaker 2 24:33

Sometimes your brain tells you like , careful , going down that road you might say something offensive . You know I went for the least , the least offensive thing .

Speaker 1 24:42

That's something that's not real , you know . Yeah , the other thing about this episode is that you know , amy and I went through one of the toughest times right after that too , and then and then everything that happened with me last summer and since then and going through therapy and all this stuff we're by far the best we've ever been Right , and that's a . Listening to this episode reminded me that I want to go back and do a part two to the relationships episode and the being with the five episode , and then for relationships , we definitely have to include Sam . I can't believe we did a relationships episode without Sam .

Speaker 2 25:26

I agree with you . Yeah , I think I wanted to , but it like didn't work or something at the time .

Speaker 1 25:31

Actually , I do remember that now .

Speaker 2 25:32

Yeah , because I was like we have to do it with Sam , and then we didn't know , it's all right , maybe , maybe she was .

Speaker 1 25:37

That's when she had her second baby and I don't know Things are you know life . But Amy and I . You know so much has changed since that conversation we had with Amy and Madison .

Speaker 2 25:51

Yeah .

Speaker 1 25:52

And , like you guys are married now , amy and I have been , like you know , went down to the depths and built back up and , uh , I , I , I need to go back and actually listen to the episode , but my recollection of it there were so many things in there that I was just sort of coping and I I know that we could have like a really good conversation around that , because I've learned so much about myself and about Amy and our relationship and and and everything since then that I think would be a really good conversation . So we need to do that Now .

Speaker 2 26:30

Yeah , that'd be cool , and if we brought Sam , we could bring Sam's partner and he could get the opposite perspective . I don't know if I want to do that .

Speaker 1 26:38

That's too much , that's too many people .

Speaker 2 26:42

It'd be , it'd be cool to have a like a female five with like a , you know , a male like husband or something .

Speaker 1 26:47

No , I mean I , I agree with that . I just mean in terms of like having a single conversation .

Speaker 2 26:51

Oh , no for sure . Yeah , the logistics of it get really complicated . Yeah , and not five-ish . None of us would like that .

Speaker 1 26:59

Four is max .

Speaker 2 27:02

Yeah , no , I I've thought that for sure there's . There's definitely old episodes we need to probably go back and revisit , because it'll be . If I saw that in a book , I would love that you read for a chapter in the beginning and then by the end you realize it like gives you an idea of how much time has gone past between those two points , and so it kind of gives an interesting story arc where you it's like you're learning all these things and we're going over all these topics , but then you drop back down on the ground and like kind of in a similar place , I mean , I'm so grateful that we started doing this , because we're creating like snapshots in our lives , yeah , and and and .

Speaker 1 27:35

so it's how it's like very beneficial for us because we can see how far we've come . But it also we're doing it in a very public way where , like people can follow along with us and kind of go on that path and and go through that growth with us and sharing the pains and the joys and then maybe like it helps them feel more supported in there and then maybe also kind of gives them some shortcuts that don't have to go through some of the same stuff .

Speaker 2 28:03

I hope , yeah , I hope so . God , I'd love for people to just . I would love for there to be a reason why I've done stupid shit . If they help other people , that'd be great . Yeah , no for sure I think that would be . I do . I do love that . I love that we have that whole you know timeline for ourselves

Podcast Preview and Reflection on Progress

Speaker 2 28:23

and for everybody else .

Speaker 1 28:23

Yeah , I've been needing to record like a podcast preview . You know how they have .

Speaker 2 28:31

Oh yeah , like a trailer .

Speaker 1 28:32

Yeah , and one of the things I was going to do was basically just talk about that . Like you know , we started this three years ago and we've like this is basically a documentation of our journey as fives .

Speaker 2 28:49

And so , yeah , it's no longer the original pitch .

Speaker 1 28:51

Right , we started with the show because it's become so much more .

Speaker 2 28:54

That's . That's cool . I love that .

Speaker 1 28:55

And so , like what I , what I want to say is like go back to the beginning and start at episode one , and then you can go on that journey with us , yeah , and and you know , maybe maybe where you are isn't where we are in some of those places , but you can see the progression and then come alongside of us and I think that that like I don't know anything else out there that kind of does that .

Speaker 2 29:17

No , definitely not . Yeah , because originally it was supposed to be like these topical conversations which you can it's like you can have two different experiences in that right , because it can be topical . You can't just keep doing them however you want to . But there are . We talk about our lives so much , and and the further we've gotten into the story , the more we've talked about present life versus past life . Yeah , that's a good point , and so I think that that's where it's like . Now the show has caught up with our lives , and so that's a big part of it .

Speaker 2 29:41

So the beginning is easy to jump around to you because we're always talking about past things , not present . So I feel like it's easier to jump around and I think that in our heads we kind of thought that was how it should be , to be topical like that . But and it maybe was a little bit more freeing in terms of top topic , like topics of conversations . But it got super is like , once it caught up with this , we had to figure out a different way of of making the show almost Well .

Speaker 1 30:05

I think , actually what ? When I came into season one , I had this map in my head of okay , these are all the lessons I've learned over the last five or six years here are the things I want to talk about .

Speaker 1 30:20

And then we got through pretty much all of that in season one , and then I was like when I got to season two , I was like shit , what do we talk about ? And that's when I realized that it's a much better strategy for us to kind of look at and I think this is also the advantage of doing seasons , so that we have breaks in between for stuff to actually happen but it's looking at what we have going on in our lives and and like seeing what topics actually lend themselves to those conversations , and so that's why we can have a broader and it's like this we're trying to be topical but also like follow a narrative in some sense , because we're having a broader conversation about a topic , but the topic is essentially a frame to then talk about what's going on with us in a way , and so we can kind of zoom in and zoom out as we need to . It's a useful vehicle for that .

Speaker 1 31:13

Yeah , that's true , just definitely nice little and we sort of stumbled into this , but I think that like it works really well for what we're doing and I enjoy it .

Speaker 2 31:23

Yeah , yeah , for sure , it's weird and I , at this point I'm starting to like these , these conversations , more than real conversations . Same Everybody wants these conversations more than the real ones , the upfront ones , the public ones , and it's funny because I mean , like a lot of people in the community say they prefer this format . Yeah , interesting to me , they would rather listen to us like fully like free flowing , very minimal editing , like yeah , I'm no editing .

Speaker 1 31:52

There's no editing at all . The thing I'm trying to figure out is , I guess , how all this fits in with the whole model , because this is actually really what we originally had in mind when we were doing after hours yeah , as we were going to talk about the episodes that came out and stuff like that and then after hours turned into honestly , it just turned into a an excuse for Cody and I to hang out and talk . Yeah , but then like just do it in with the community doing live stream .

Speaker 2 32:26

A lot of little made content yeah .

Speaker 1 32:28

Which I do miss that . We need to get back into that to some degree , because I do like , if the community wants to be a part of the conversation , I did , I did like doing that , but I do , I also , but that's its own sort of thing versus this , which is just me and you Clearing like a raw , unedited conversation , yeah , and we still we're using a frame of like hey , that this is the episode , but then sure , but then there's not . The thing that I like about it is that we can kind of use it as a tether , but we can explore lots of stuff and just let the conversation go . Versus like , when we know we're coming into one for the main podcast , we try to keep it as on topic as we can , because that's that saves us work from editing later .

Speaker 2 33:18

Yeah , that's me , me , yeah , that's definitely true , and we've gotten a way better about that , because the first season it was like we just kind of let loose . It's true , I have more of my my like live editing mode on when I'm talking in that episode , in those episodes , because it's yeah , it's a little bit more , um , not curated , but kind of like it's more organized , it's a little bit more filtered just because we've sort of adapted to Knowing that we're gonna have to edit it , so we're more conscious of what we're saying and yeah

Speaker 1 33:49

and we've also developed the skill of being able to do that in real time , whereas in season one we had to take that pressure off in order for us to just sit down and do the thing . But then , once we started to get comfortable and confident in what we were doing , then we uh , you know , we're able to develop that skill more and and it's weird because it's like I don't I mean , I don't , I don't like it's still very authentic . It's not like we're no , you know , putting up a front or trying to play a character or anything like that . It's just more like we . There's more intention behind it .

Speaker 2 34:24

Yeah , versus we show up knowing what we're talking about , rather than just hanging out . Yeah yeah for sure .

Speaker 2 34:30

It's also why I'll eat a gummy for this , but I won't for that , right ? Yeah , it's something I don't think we really talked about . Since the high episode , we got really high on purpose , but I'm kind of high all the time , like at least when we're doing these , like not all the time in my daily life , like you know that's how you made it Sound , though I'm high more than more than I've ever been , but like in a more controlled sense , and it makes me . It definitely . It makes it easier to talk , it makes it easier , but as long as I don't have to think too hard , you know .

Speaker 2 35:07

I can't have a lot of things going on . Cpu needs to be real low and so then I can operate fine . But outside of that it would be it would be rough if we were like having a real intense , serious conversation Right now . I would be like Checking out probably a little bit , but anyway .

Speaker 1 35:25

Yeah , I did jot down some notes and I want to see if I made through it , through all of them . Hold on one second . Oh , there was one part of I'm that analogy that I gave in the episode about like the rowboat and stuff . Oh yeah , I think that one one of the reasons why I Didn't like the conversation afterwards . I didn't feel like I explained that very well or well , I normally do .

Speaker 2 35:56

I was literally about to be like I don't even . I remember not knowing what the hell you were talking about , and then just moved on from it .

Speaker 1 36:01

Yeah , yeah , I , I , I didn't . Don't think I knew in the editing either . Yeah , one of the things about that , though , is the point that I was trying to to get across was that when you when you don't have the shore in your periphery to go back to , even though you're doing the same amount of work , it completely changes how hard that work is .

Speaker 1 36:33

Yeah and , and that's when , when I experienced this , there's there was a very clear Delineation between when I'm fully committed versus not , and when I am not fully committed , I'm essentially always looking for Other things to that will do the work for me , where , like I , you know , I'll information overload .

Speaker 1 37:05

so , rather than actually doing things , I'll just like watch tutorials and how to do stuff like forever yeah yeah , and I'm telling myself , oh , this is gonna make it go faster , but really I am , I'm just spinning my wheels , I'm not actually going anywhere . And then , you know , or like I'll , I'll spend hours evaluating which tool to use for the job , right and , and that's just another form of procrastination . And and I noticed that when I am , when I am fully committed , I'm already moving and If there's something I need to know , then I'll look it up kind of in real time , rather than try to prepare for all the things I need to know ahead of time . And if there's a tool that I come across that helps me , then great , but I'm not relying on that for me to get to my destination . I'm , or I'm not relying on , like , a person to coach me to get to my destination . If I come across those things that can give me there faster than awesome , but it's not my like , like it either way , I'm getting there .

Speaker 1 38:11

Mm-hmm , right , and that's what I was trying to get across with the whole swimming versus rowboat thing , but I just it was poor execution on that part for sure .

Speaker 2 38:20

Yeah , yeah , that makes a lot more sense and I agree with that for sure . I'm the same same way , definitely I .

Speaker 1 38:28

Think . That's all I gotta say .

Speaker 2 38:30

Okay , works how are you right now ? I'm pretty high , I'm like we're done sweet .

Speaker 1 38:42

All right , thanks everybody see you later .

Speaker 2 38:44

See you next time .