Stealing, Fear, and the Cross (Part 2) The Eighth Commandment and the Peace Only Jesus Can Restore

This episode is Part 2 of our exploration of the Eighth Commandment — “You shall not steal.”

In this conversation we move beyond possessions and ask a deeper question: what has fear stolen from your life?

When we read Exodus chapter twenty, the Ten Commandments can appear like rigid laws written in stone. But when we come closer, they reveal something much deeper — a map of love guiding the human heart back to God.

Fear often speaks the loudest voice.

Bills increase.

Homes feel colder.

Debt and uncertainty begin to crowd the mind.

In moments like these it becomes easy to bargain with worst-case scenarios and lose the peace God intended for us to live in.

In this episode of Christian Straight Talk, we pause everything and return to the cross. Around Scripture and communion we remember that perfect love drives out fear, and that the cross restores what life has tried to steal.

We speak honestly about shame, anxiety, private struggles, and the quiet battles many people carry alone. Instead of quick motivational answers, we look to the work of the Holy Spirit, who exposes the root of the problem rather than trimming the visible branches.

The command “You shall not steal” reaches far beyond pockets and possessions. It touches the deeper areas of life: time stolen by addiction, peace stolen by anxiety, truth stolen by lies, and joy stolen by fear.

We stand again at Calvary, where two thieves hang beside Jesus. One remains hardened, the other turns his heart toward Christ. Even in the final moments of life, mercy is still possible.

That moment reminds us that no life is too late and no heart is beyond redemption.

Along the way we confront the pressures shaping modern life — rising costs, debt worries, cultural confusion, and religious systems that sometimes place human authority where only Christ belongs. These realities are not ignored, but neither do they receive the final word.

Instead we return again and again to the same place: the cross of Jesus Christ.

Trust is rebuilt through daily repentance, honest prayer, and simple acts of service that move our focus away from ourselves and back toward God. Scripture steadies the mind, and communion restores the soul.

If fear, pressure, or disappointment has tried to

Transcript

Welcome And Exodus Focus

SPEAKER_00 0:24

Good morning, world, wherever you are today. Thank you so much for joining us here at hashtag Christian Straight Talk. May God bless you and strengthen you in the mighty name of Jesus. You might hear I've got a bit of a bunged-up nose. It's not COVID, all is well, been testing for days and days and days. It is just a bug. We've got to get that clear.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

Yeah, the weather's a bit chilly out there, Ben, isn't it? Down here in um in Sunny Swanley, it's minus six degrees, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 0:51

It's really cold. It's really cold across the nation.

SPEAKER_01 0:54

And I've come from Essex where we're in our white shirts and shorts.

SPEAKER_00 0:58

And it's lovely. The sun is out for where you've come from. But good morning, world. Thank you so much for joining us, hashtag Christian Straight Talk. It's great to be just speaking about truths, and we're still in Exodus, we're still in Exodus chapter 20, and we are looking very clearly at um the Ten Commandments, and that has been a tough draw, isn't it? Well, it's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

Absolutely amazing. It's amazing how each one really is interlinked with each other, and um the the overriding thing, Ben, is most definitely, yeah. It's uh a heart issue, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 1:35

It really is, and I've got to be absolutely brutally honest, I tell you what, since we started talking about it, and it's um it really has started to open my heart up, and I I just ri didn't realise how broken I was, and I've come to a point in my life understanding that God needs to heal me. So going all through these these one by one, line after line, and still going back and looking at everything, you know, you don't realise that you've got stuff in your heart in your life that that needs to be dealt with. And when you start studying the Ten Commandments, you start to really feel the love of God and the power of the Holy Spirit, but it's challenging. I've never been so challenged.

Heart Issues Behind The Commandments

SPEAKER_01 2:14

It is uh challenging, you know. I uh uh I I heard a scripture uh come uh the other day, Proverbs um 23, 7 says uh you know, out of the heart a mouth speaks, and it's it does, yeah. Or as a man thinketh in his heart, so is he. Yeah, so so it's all about your heart because out and you know, Jesus does say in the Gospels, out of the heart comes all of this stuff, yeah. The thieving, the debauchery, the drunkenness, all of that stuff. Everything that's connected with the Ten Commandments comes out of your heart, doesn't it? Because everything, yeah, you know, um you might have an idea in your in your head, but your heart will tell you to to have a go. So yeah, and we're still um on the uh we're gonna have a look at it again uh a little bit. We take communion first, we're gonna take communion.

SPEAKER_00 3:06

So whoever is with us at this moment, let's give them a couple of minutes just to get um some communion ready. So we've got some bread and we've got some uh grape juice here. We're gonna take communion, and we have been feeling, and I've been feeling for a long time, you know, to to come to the cross of Calvary. There's something powerful about the cross of Calvary. And uh I'm starting to be a lot more open about how I am, and and and it's the cross that's giving me freedom. And again, I've got to say, you know, studying and looking and speaking openly about the Ten Commandments, I'm not frightened to say that I've been broken, I'm not frightened to say that I've been lost. I'm not frightened to say that uh my attitudes and and certain areas of my life have been really bad, and uh and it's dealing with past stuff, bringing stuff up and dealing with stuff and asking God to help you in every area of your life, you know. And um there's something so powerful about that makes me makes me chuckle, but chuckle with actual fear, you know. I prayed that prayer, and we all know, and we've been very open, and Simon and that, and the Lord stripped me back.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

When you pray a prayer like that, well you've got to um be prepared for the consequences, ain't you?

SPEAKER_00 4:15

So strip the Lord will strip you back and to have your heart wide open before God, wide open before humanity, to say, I'm really sorry I failed. Help me, please, carry me in prayer. Will you watch over me? Will you will you hold my hand? Will you take me to the cross of Calvary? Will you keep me in this position, you know? Because being open and laying everything out across the table to Christ is is so difficult, isn't it? Because you want to just lay things away, you want to put things away.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

And there'll be things that maybe you ain't even thought of that the law will bring to your attention because all the Holy Spirit will, because and there's something about I've got to tell you, Ben, there's something about just lying down on the floor and saying, Yeah, not my will, but your will be done, I'm not worthy to receive you, and something something about actually just giving it all to Jesus. I think, you know, as much as we we say, and uh you know, you'll hear uh groups and uh ministries say, Oh, you know, you've got to get in a discipleship group or a home group and stuff like that, but some stuff is just between you and God, Ben, isn't it?

Preparing For Communion

SPEAKER_00 5:27

Some stuff, yeah, is very personal between you and God. And I think sometimes a group of people can almost hinder you as well because you might be frightened of saying something in a group of people. Because when you look at the Ten Commandments, when you go all the way through them, that is real strong biblical stuff, and it makes you look at everything, and there are certain stuff that you don't want to share with everybody, as you said, it's just very private between you and God, and and you're trying to deal with life now, you're trying to deal with history, you're trying to deal with the present, you're trying to deal with the future stuff that is around and producing all day long. But coming to the table, coming to the Passover is a time that we're at now. Come into a time of breaking of bread, and and this is a time to lay everything out before the Lord, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 6:13

But 100%, Ben, and and um the thing is what what we'll find is I mean I've been in many men's groups where you know the big issue is uh with a lot of guys is pornography, obviously. And um I've been there when a lot of guys have openly admitted in front of you know they've brought their their their their um their pornography addiction or or their their viewing into into the light. And um and that's that's great, don't get me wrong, but all these things have a root, man. All these things have a root, they start somewhere, and these guys sitting around a table uh they can't tell you where that route was. The only person that can tell you where that route is is the Holy Spirit.

SPEAKER_00 6:58

So we need the Holy Spirit for counsel in every area of our life.

SPEAKER_01 7:04

Forget about these motivational speakers, forget about these motivational talkers, forget about all of that stuff. We've got the greatest thing. The Lord's that's what the Lord left us when Jesus went. He left us with the Holy Spirit, didn't we?

SPEAKER_00 7:18

Yeah, and and I think now is a time for all of us, all of us, all believers, to be really saying, Lord, as we look at the Ten Commandments, Lord, we need the Holy Spirit to to take any roots out, excuse me, take any roots out that are that are deep, that are hurting, roots of years ago, and say, Lord, we need counsel, we need the Holy Spirit, we need the counsel of God, the counsel of the Holy Spirit, we need the counsel of of our King. We need a saviour. I'm I'm really sorry, I'm interrupting you there, Simon. I really need Jesus like never before.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

That's unusual, but no, but it's the truth. We need the Jesus, we need a cross, we need what he's done for us on the cross. And and do you know what, then, we need to lift Jesus up to the Father, don't we? Because what he's done, we He's done everything for us, isn't he?

SPEAKER_00 8:09

Yeah, Jesus has done everything. The cross has wiped everything out our present, our future, our history, everything. Christ has wiped everything out, and all these conversations that are deep and really personal and opening up wounds, and the worm we talk, it's opening up my past right up to now. Everything's being opened up to me, and it feels like God is really stripping me back and dealing with me and opening me up, you know, to to so much more to leave it at the cross.

Private Struggles And The Holy Spirit’s Counsel

SPEAKER_01 8:42

To leave it at the cross and and to be healed at the cross. This is the thing, because you know, yes, if we open up and we can get rid of stuff that you quite rightly said that you know, a lot of this stuff is deep rooted from our very early age, from from our youth from when we were children. So when this stuff comes out, it's dangerous if we don't heal it at the cross, we don't heal it with with the look with the Lord, you know, that the God will heal it. Because, you know, um I I'll ask this question to many of you listening. Have you ever asked God who he thinks you are? And and the thing is a lot of us don't. No. Uh, because a lot of us maybe are a little bit weary of wary really of what God's gonna say. But listen, he made you, he loves you. He's not gonna say God loves us, he's not gonna say you're rubbish, he's gonna he's gonna say you are an amazing, you're fearfully and wonderfully made. Uh but he's gonna also point out things that he really don't want you doing that he, you know, you you you probab we all probably do. Uh, and that is the conviction of the Holy Spirit. And when that happens, yeah, and the thing is, when that happens, if we don't bring it to the cross, bit Bring it to the cross. If we don't bring it to the cross, when the Holy Spirit's convicted of things, if we don't bring it before the Lord, put it in a black rubbish bag, just tip it before the cross and say, Father, forgive me of this stuff. Jesus, forgive me. If we don't do that, then we will, as the scripture says, we will turn return to keep going, and keep going back. So we get going back. And what happens then is Ben, we our our our consciences get hardened, they get seared, and pretty soon we're doing stuff and we're making excuses, and we're making excuses while we're doing this stuff. So what we need to do is on a daily basis, this is what Jesus meant when he said, Pick up your cross and follow me. Come on, Jesus. Thank you, Holy Spirit. On a daily basis, we need to be coming towards the cross and we need to be convicted of stuff. And even as we speak, you know, things might come into your head and whatever, but you know, there and then, it doesn't matter where you are, you don't have to um be in a uh a nice quiet room. You can be driving, you can be you can be out on uh you could be in company and and the Holy Spirit will catch you. Yeah, just you know, you might have verbally told an exaggeration, or you might have told this or that or the other, the Holy Spirit catches you, you've got to Father forgive me. Father, forgive me. That's the question. That's the question. And then of course with that comes repentance, which is turning away from that stuff. We need to turn turn away from stuff that we we are constantly involved in. And these Ten Commandments, Ben, as we've said, right from the very beginning.

SPEAKER_00 11:44

Really, really bring us to a point.

SPEAKER_01 11:46

Bring us to a point. And if you you break one of these, you break them all, don't you?

SPEAKER_00 11:50

They're all broken. And then I've never ever really studied them like this before. I've never really gone into the depth of them, never really looked at them. But by by going into the depth of everyone, line after line, looking at it, studying it, reading it, praying over it, you realise how powerful they are. Now that might sound a little bit strange to say, but the churches and were not not been preaching and teaching on them. So that's affected the schools, that's affected the climate of life, it's affected absolutely everything, in it. So the Ten Commandments are such a steadfast place to be that will pull everyone into some form of check. Because when you look at the checklist, the checklist of the Ten Commandments, they all inter they're all interwoven, they all move together. That you can't separate one without the other. They all gel together, although they might be in line by line on their own, but they actually are joined together. So they all move together. So every one is as important as the other one. Totally.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

And and as we know, as Jesus said in uh you know in the Bible, he said that when they asked him what is the greatest commandment, he said, Love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind. And then he said, Love your neighbour as yourself. And then it's interesting, Ben, because he said, On these two, all the others hang. Everything everything hangs out.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

Love the Lord thy God with all your heart.

SPEAKER_01 13:16

So if you d if you're loving the Lord your God with all your heart, you will automatically love your neighbour as yourself, and you will automatically not get involved in all this other stuff, you know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:28

Because you're But it's a journey though, isn't it? It's a every one of us is on a long Christian journey, a long walk with the Father. And as we want him more and as we move more, as we ask God to help us more, as we look more, as we study more, as we come to the cross more, as we God opens us up, and then suddenly we go, God please, I want you more. So you're on a continuous journey of always going for a repentance, always going to the cross, always worshiping differently. You know, I'm I'm on a very, very different journey at this moment, and uh I thank God for the journey that He's put me on right now. A journey of repentance, a journey of coming to the cross, a journey of looking back in my history, dealing with situations, looking at myself and saying, Lord, I don't like what I see, but I've put a concrete lid on it for so long. But now is the time we're gonna come to the table. We're gonna come to the table, and this is a great time.

SPEAKER_01 14:25

If you're in uh and Ben, I've been on a uh not as I don't think it's quite as drastic a journey as what you're describing there, but certainly I've I've the Lord has been exposing things that in in my own life where you know you know you've got to sort them out. They know they've got to be sorted. And and you know, we're talking about this time of year people will be making resolutions for the new year. Well, we don't need to make resolutions because Ten Commandments ain't resolutions. They are what they say they are, they are commandments, certainly. They are, yeah, yeah, yeah. They commandments. So so this is our this is wherever you are, um you know, if and and and wherever you are, um as we uh come to take uh uh the the bread and wine, you know, this is a time that in my lifetime and it's it's unprecedented. It's the with with the way that people are feeling. Now if you if you I I see I see fellow believers who uh who are in trouble with you know with uh depression, with worry and worry, anxiousness. And so if you've not got a Lord in your life, it must be even you can't I can't imagine what it'd be like not to have Christ in your life. And and and mate, it's gonna get harder because we know that uh people's there's only so much money in in the in your bank account and and Christmas coming, uh people are spending life mad, but there comes a time there's no free lunches. They gotta you have to pay off that credit card at some point or live in a mountain of debt.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

It's like yeah, debt debt is so frightening, isn't it? Financial financial struggles is so worrying.

Daily Repentance And Soft Hearts

SPEAKER_01 16:12

And you know, here we are right in the middle of a cold snap in, you know, in the UK, yeah. And really they've ramped up the energy prices uh stupidly, two or three times of what we were paying before. Um, and there are people sitting at home in their coats and in the layers of clothes that because they're frightened about the heating pills. And all this stuff mounts up, then, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_00 16:36

Yeah, because it starts to fear. I can't spend no money, I can't turn the heating on, I can't put the boiler on. So fear is an enormous thing at this moment. When you go back in the Bible and you study fear, we've done a lot of talking about fear and a lot of looking at that. Fear drives you to think different, to act different, to do strange things and to fear is is a dangerous thing to live in, isn't it? But I don't think we realise how long society has been living in fear.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

Well, we've been in fear, aren't we, since the first lockdown? We've been in fear for those years, and then and then we're taken out and and we're we've been shown all sorts of other stuff. So they you know the the world is thrown stuff on top, on top, on top. And you know, Ben, for a Christian, fear is really a problem. Yeah. Because fear amounts to unbelief, doesn't it? Yeah. Because if you know your Bible, you know, the Bible says trust in the Lord your God with all your heart. Proverbs three. And and and so if if you're living in fear, then it's kind of on on it's it's unbelief, really. So so the Lord doesn't want you to live in fear, he wants you to trust him, and the and you might be saying that there, well, it's easy for you to say that, you know, I've got this, that, and the other coming in. But we need to put a hope somewhere, don't we?

SPEAKER_00 17:58

So we we've got to really encourage one another. We've got to encourage your brother, your sister, you know, you you know, you you've you've got to really lift one another up because society and culture is really bruised. So imagine what it's like not to have Jesus, but then also when you've got him and you know that you've got him and you know that your Redeemer lives, and another another really big thing, I think sometimes, when you know that you've got Christ and you have them fearful times as well, that can be worse by not having him because you're just living by the way of the world. But when you live by faith and you've lived by faith and you're holding on to Jesus, and then something happens and fear comes in, I think it can be almost like a double hitter, as in crash. Wow, hang on a moment. I'm supposed to be this believer, I'm supposed to be this son and daughter of the living God. I've I've been angry and frustrated, I've done this, I've done that, I've not believed as I should have believed, I haven't got into this position correctly with God, I've I haven't forgiven, I haven't done this, I haven't done that. So there's there's two sides to you, isn't there, that can be rubbing up the the wrong the wrong use of you.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Yeah, yeah. And you know, we've done um our second book coming out is all on fear, isn't it? You know, so when that when that comes around when that comes out the door. Yeah, but the the big problem for me with fear, it's an inward driver, so so it's all about you and what you're going through and and your fears. I I get it you know constantly on uh on the social media, please please play for me, I'm anxious, please play for me, I'm I'm I'm fearful. Well, here's the thing if if you go out and you do something for someone else, um mate, the look on their face when you see a smile, when you see that that they're being blessed, that takes away that takes away that fear, and you're you're not thinking about yourself anymore. No, that's it. Because you're thinking about so you know, like what you're doing here in the church, when you see these people come in, you know, haven't got a pot, but they're they're going out with smiles on their faces because they've got bags full of food, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:11

That cheers your whole spirit up, doesn't it? You know, and I think what's really important, these Ten Commandments are opening up the whole word of God so clearly and so powerfully. It speaks about so much all these Ten Commandments, you know. That beautiful scripture in the New Testament says perfect love drives out all fear. Jesus, Jesus' love will drive out all fear. So if you are fearful today and worried today, as we come to the table, perfect love drives out all fear. So I think we're at this point we're gonna break bread and we're gonna take of this cup. If you are fearful, let's bring all our fears and our worries to the cross of Calvary. Let's lay everything at the cross. Wherever you are today, let's lay everything at the cross. I know I've been saying it a lot lately, but how do we do that? I think the only way we do that is by speaking to Jesus and to and talk to him.

Fear, Finances, And Trusting God

SPEAKER_01 21:02

Yeah, totally. And and you know, Ben, um fear is a massive tool of the enemy. Fear and doubt is a huge tool of the enemy, and it it's running like wildfire at the moment. So so you're right, let's let's uh take communion and and let's bring that stuff to the cross, and where the cross will build us up. So uh where the cross was was meant to defeat, it's a victory, in it. So we're we're we're gonna build each other up with encourage one another. Yeah, that's that's what we've got to do as as Christians. You know, you it you there may it may be winter outside, but you know, i in your heart, let's encourage each other. Let your light shine. Let your light shine in it.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

I think we've got to get into that position where the scripture says, let your light shine. Come on, church, brothers and sisters, as we come to the table. Let's just pray. Father, we thank you for the power of the blood of Jesus. Father, we We thank you for this great opportunity to break bread, to take of this cup. Lord, we pray that you will move powerfully, Lord, and freely in our hearts and our minds. Lord, that you do a great work within us, Lord, that the love of Christ will be over us, Lord, always and forever in Jesus' name. But Lord, I bring myself to the cross. I bring myself to the cross of Calvary. Lord, I bring myself to this place, Lord. Lord, I'm broken, but I know you're healing me. Lord, I'm lost, but I know that you have found me. Lord, I'm fearful, but I know I'm going to be free in the name of Jesus. So Lord, I think and I bring everything to you. So right now, Lord, as we break this bread, Father, we understand that this bread symbolizes the body of Christ. Lord, and as we break this bread together now, Lord, Father, thank you that your body was broken for each and every one of us. And as we take this bread together now, Lord, Father, I thank you, Lord, that Calvary, Calvary is hope. Calvary is new beginning. Calvary, the cross of Calvary, is everything that we need. So Lord, my brokenness, my worries, my doubts, my sins, my history, my now, everything, Lord. I want to learn. I want to learn to walk different with you. Lord, from this moment on, I want to walk more in faith. I want to walk more in your love. I want to walk more in the Ten Commandments. I want to walk free. Lord, I want to, I want to walk, Lord, as a child of the living God. Lord, I want to walk, Lord, shackles, take the shackles away. Take the chains, take the restraints away. Take it all off, Lord. And Father, bring bring freedom in the name of Jesus. Father, I pray for brothers and sisters today, as they break bread with us, Lord, that freedom will abound in hearts today, a mind. Lord, that the fear, Lord, won't won't control, the fear won't dictate, the fear won't lead. But Lord, that we will know that our Redeemer lives, and because he lives, we can face tomorrow. Come, Holy Spirit. I thank you, Lord, for every area of our lives. I thank you, Lord, that you are stripping us all back, that we are being washed in the blood of Jesus. But Lord, this symbolizes the body of Christ in Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_02 24:00

Amen.

SPEAKER_00 24:03

Amen. Thank you, Jesus. Thank you, Holy Spirit. Just take a moment. Someone's going to pray in a moment for the cup that represents the blood of Jesus. Just take a moment. Perfect love drives out all fear. I'm going to be more open when I talk. I'm going to be more open from the pulpit and talk about my fears and my doubts when we're online and when wherever we are. I feel lost. I feel broken. I feel ashamed. I feel bad. I feel a wretch. But Jesus is working within me. Jesus is setting me free. Jesus has given me a hope and a future. If he can do it for me, how much more can he do for you, brothers and sisters? Let's bring each other to the cross. Let's bring each other to the cross through prayer. Let's edify and encourage everybody. Send a text to your church family. Send a check a text to your to your church family and say, Jesus is calling you. Jesus is calling you today in the mighty name of Jesus Christ. He's calling you afresh. Simon, will you pray for this cup, please?

SPEAKER_01 25:06

Thank you, Ben. I think you put that really beautifully. And um so as we we come to the cross, as we come to to take the bread, and the bread will edify us, the bread will build us up, the bread is Jesus, and and so we we lift Father, we lift Jesus up to you today, and we say we we thank you for him. We thank you that he came to this earth and and we thank you that he died on a cross for our sin that put him there, each and every one of us. And we thank you that even if there was only one of us only, sir, he'd have come. And we thank you for that. And we thank you that he rose again to save us and accept us. And we thank you, Father, that that he led us to you, Father. And we thank you that he separated us from the world, and we know he's coming again in glory. So we thank you, Father, for Jesus, and Jesus, we thank you for everything you've done. We are nothing without you, but every man with you. And as we bring all our stuff, all our crazy, horrible stuff before the cross, Father, let this blood symbolize the cleansing, healing, yes, Lord, the power of the blood of Jesus. Amen. It's the blood of Jesus that cleanses, that cleans us out, and and we just want to take this blood in remembrance of you and to walk away cleansed from the cross in Jesus' name.

SPEAKER_00 26:33

Amen. Amen. Amen. Thank you, Jesus. Lord, we love you and we bless you. Lord, draw us, draw every one of us to a deeper, greater walk with you in freedom. Perfect love drives out all fear. In Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. What a great opportunity to take that in the middle of a podcast in a time in such a time as this. You know, the world is broken, everything is happening, and everything is going on, but we're still in the book of Exodus, chapter 20, and we're we are hanging around that that text where it talks about about stealing, isn't it? But you mentioned something earlier on that was really, really interested me through this conversation about the thieves on the cross. Who was on the cross? Well Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 27:25

Jesus was on the cross, but there were two thieves either side of him, Ben, weren't they?

Breaking Bread: Prayer For Freedom

SPEAKER_00 27:28

Yeah, so when you look at that, what their lives are there? They were these were they were accused and found guilty of stealing. But they was next to Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 27:39

They were next to Jesus, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

Jesus What a fantastic, unbelievable, but believable, right but true. That is the power of the love of Christ, isn't it? Yeah. That Jesus doesn't reject anybody. Jesus doesn't turn anybody away.

SPEAKER_01 27:57

And and here we see on it in this example, and it's just an amazing example, because we see again it has to be a heart thing, Ben, doesn't it? Because one rejected Jesus right at the last moment, and the other one accepted him, you know. And what it tells us is that it doesn't matter when you turn to Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 28:18

At your last hour, at your last moment, at your last breath, the last second. Jesus never turns you away.

SPEAKER_01 28:26

And you see it in the world. I see it so much.

SPEAKER_00 28:30

I see that so much. You know, life is very fragile, life is very thin, life is very powerful.

SPEAKER_01 28:37

Very just briefly, the the countenance of someone who leaves this world having accepted Jesus, is it different to someone who's rejected Jesus?

SPEAKER_00 28:50

There is a very big difference between when someone takes um their last breath of life, let's say it like that, that that have accepted or knows or walks with. There's so many different ways to look at that, that has a faith with the God of Israel. That's the best way to put it like that. That because um when someone may give their life at the end, they haven't lived in the fullness of God's glory. So the best way to put that is when you see someone called from this world that leaves with the Holy Spirit and the deity, there is something very different between someone that doesn't leave this world with Jesus Christ. You can see it on on on the carcass on the on the body. Is there's peace spreading? Is there a peace on the world? There's a peace. Yeah, when people leave with the God of Israel, there is a peace. When people I don't even like saying it, when people leave without without that, that that is very harrowing to watch. That is very disturbing to see, to see that there is two different types of death. Two different types of death. A death with Jesus and a death without.

SPEAKER_01 30:02

I mean, we're right down to the wire on this one, ain't we?

SPEAKER_00 30:05

You know, you know you can't get any clock, you can't get no, this is right.

The Cup: Cleansing And Hope

SPEAKER_01 30:10

You know, and I a story that's always still with me, and it is a true story about uh a um a vicar who who used to go into a a church in London, and uh he's uh this man's daughter said um uh he was he was dying. He was dying, he was in the he was in the hospital, and uh she said to the vicar, will you come and pray? My father is not a believer, and she was. And uh he went along, she went, he went along and and there was a man and um he he rejected Jesus uh there and then to to the man's face and and and the vicar just said to him He said there's a chair there he said just just imagine Jesus is in the chair with his arms open for you. Wow. And and the man said, No, I'm not interested, and and walked away. And it was uh a couple of weeks later he saw the lady again, this the vicar, yeah, and he said, uh this is a true story, and it really it wells me up, to be honest with you, because she said, he said, Well, uh how was your how's your father? She said, Well he died. Um I'm sorry to read that, he said, but a funny thing. Oh dear when he died, um they found him uh out of the bed with his arms around a chair. Wow. Oh my goodness, we're gonna be able to do that. Loving Jesus, loving Jesus. That's the that's the difference. And people say, if people say he ain't real, yeah, this is nonsense, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 31:41

Jesus, Jesus is real, brothers and sisters on the other side. You know, we are in the Ten Commandments, but the Ten Commandments opens up everything to God. So just because we might not be on uh the the stealing one which we are on, but this this is really, really important because Christ doesn't want us to be robbed of anything. So there's two sides of stealing.

SPEAKER_01 32:03

There's a there's Ben's the physical, there's many sides to stealing.

SPEAKER_00 32:08

There's the physical, and then then you look at the spiritual and you look at the cross of Calvary with the the two thieves, and you look at what Simon has just told us that fantastic story. You know how many people have been robbed of of so much that the scriptures had. But why have we been robbed? Who tries to rob us? Who tries to keep that from us? What what is all that about?

SPEAKER_01 32:29

Yeah, well we've got an enemy out there, Benton, who um who blinds the eyes of um uh and he's the prince of the power of the of the air, and he is the prince of this world. So so he's you know, right at the last right at the last herb. You see, he's battling for that soul as much as you would be in a hospice, isn't he? You know, he's so he's battling uh coming against uh whatever uh you know whatever Jesus is saying to that particular person, he he wants that soul for him, but you know the problem is that um there's no free lunches with him, you know. Whereas with uh Jesus' freedom, forgiveness and acceptance and everlasting life, yeah, with this other fella. I mean, the thing is, as you quite rightly put it, you know, as soon as we stare in this tag for us for a few moments, this earth suit will disappear. But your heart and your soul will live on forever, don't it?

SPEAKER_00 33:26

In eternity.

SPEAKER_01 33:27

And it's if we have a choice, where's it gonna live?

You Shall Not Steal Reframed

SPEAKER_00 33:30

What eternity? What what the lake of fire or heaven, yeah, the way I treat people, the attitudes, everything, you know. There are many ways that stealing can be looked at, you know, and religion can steal so much away from people. Religion business can steal, life can steal, the world can steal, but being spiritually stole, uh and what I'm not a very good way to pronounce the put that, but maybe I'll put that a little bit different. Having having your your your understanding of church and religion being stolen and taken from you purely by certain denominations telling you certain things when actually that isn't actually quite true. So there's wrong teachings there's wrong doctrine out there, Ben.

SPEAKER_01 34:16

And and and so you're being robbed. And robbed of the truth. Jesus said in in John 10 10, and many people think this was the he's talking about the enemy, the devil, but he's actually talking about religious leaders at the time. If you read the if you read it in context with the rest of it, he said he said uh the end um the thief comes to you know rob, steal, kill, and destroy, or what you know, and and that's what he's after, isn't it? That's what these that's what the um some of these denominations are doing. They're in directing people in wrong doctrine, is in putting you at the centre of stuff rather than Jesus and the cross.

SPEAKER_00 34:55

So you're they're robbing you of the truth. They're robbing you of the truth, and I think that could be the biggest thing that could ever be stolen or tried to be taken from you is the truth that Jesus loves you. Jesus loves you abundantly, whoever and wherever you are at this moment in time, Christ loves you. Whatever is going on in your heart and your mind, Jesus loves you abundantly.

SPEAKER_01 35:17

A mate of mine, Ben, a mate of mine, a good mate of mine, uh in his uh in his testimony, he's got a great testimony, a real uh inspiring testimony. He when he came, actually came to to faith, um his wife found him calling out, I've got it all wrong, I've got it all wrong, I've got it all wrong. Yeah. Because he's finally know the truth. Exactly. And and if if we're not in our Bibles, if we're not in the Word of God, then we can be quite easily led away by a different doctrine, can't we?

SPEAKER_00 35:49

Yeah, yeah. And I wonder if there's anyone out there that actually feels that they've been robbed of the teaching of the gospel. I know it sounds funny to put like that, but I wonder if anyone is out there that feels that they've been robbed and they've they've not wasted years in church, but they're you you're actually thinking to I'm actually thinking to myself now, what has actually happened to me through church all these years? What has actually happened to me? What really has gone on in me? You know, I grew up in church and all sorts of things and and everything and all types of things have have gone on and and everything. And now I really believe now I'm I'm walking in in a bigger and a stronger relationship with Jesus than I've never had before. But but this happened through lockdown to me. This happened in lockdown. Lockdown was a critical thing for me when the key of the church was locked, but that brought a fear that I never thought I'd be. Your church wasn't locked out, was it, Ben? Don't turn the authorities. We're online, don't you won't turn out. We were locked, yeah. Of course we were.

SPEAKER_01 36:53

But you you you bring an interesting point because right at the start of lockdown, a mate of mine from the States contacted me and said, It's in Simon, this is a time you've got to press into the law more than anything else. They speak like that over there. Um, and and he was right. He's right, he was right, and you're right, Ben. This is a time through a lot of stuff we discuss on the podcast, and our podcasts go back, we got loads of them, you know.

SPEAKER_00 37:21

Right back through lockdown.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

And what we realized at a very, very early stage was we have to come to our own garden of Gethsemane, Ben, don't we?

The Thieves On The Cross

SPEAKER_00 37:29

The Garden of Gethsemane. Yeah, and I never realized, I never realized what that actually meant. I've read over that for so long, and I'm I'm being absolutely honest here, you know. I feel broken, I feel lost, but not in a way that I've lost my faith. Gotta be careful how you put that because you can't lose your faith. It's not that I just feel lost in society and culture, and I feel broke, I feel hurt. There was a lot of stuff in my past that is rising at this moment. God is dealing with stuff within me, stripping me back, melting me, moulding me, all that sort of stuff. I'm learning to walk very differently with Jesus, but it was the lockdown that was the trigger. And it really affected me.

SPEAKER_01 38:08

Let me ask you this, Ben. You know, um, so when we make a decision to accept Jesus Christ as our Lord and Saviour, all of a sudden we've we're not walking the way of the world, are we? We're a citizen of the kingdom. So we've we've turned around and we're walking in the opposite direction to the way of the world. But you get swept back. But yeah, this is what I'm gonna say. It depending on which church you go to, yeah, if you go to a church, or depending on which denomination it is, you swap the world for the way of the church, don't you? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:47

And you go the way of the church, which may not necessarily be the way of the Bible, may or but you don't you don't realise because religion and church has been hitting this drum for so long, it's such a mix of everything in it, and it it's so difficult to focus when the churches and a massive percentage of everything seems to be all swept up in one, and you're trying to live right, and you're trying to do this, you're trying to do that, you're trying to make a way in the wilderness and in the desert, and you're saying, Lord, help me, God help me. And suddenly you find yourself in a position of unfamiliar territory, and you think, How did I ever get to this place? Whatever happened to me on this journey. You've you know you're following Jesus, you know that you love him with all your heart, you know that you are looking and you are stretching out and you are really pressing for Christ.

SPEAKER_01 39:44

I think you put it in a good way, Benny. I think I think you can quite easily get swept up in ministry. You can get swept up with uh all the church stuff. And I remember um when I was dealing with uh a lot of uh men's groups, um some of the the uh less active men's groups were in the bigger churches. Yeah, yeah. Because the bigger churches like to keep everyone busy all the time, like to keep them going to uh this study, Bible study, this course, that course, yeah, and using up all of your time rather than um And you get caught in the the wills and the the business of church and religion and the process of living and everything gets swept, it's like sweeping a floor, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 40:32

When you sweep a floor, everything gets caught up.

SPEAKER_01 40:35

And you're and you look at this, Ben, but but it is the truth. Many people seek vindication from the leader rather than from the cross. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So many people have been looking to the leader, and if they're not careful, they'll be going, what does he say about that? Yeah. Rather than what does Jesus say about that? That's right, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it it you know I understand it, I I I get it, it's it's very easily done. But we've got to break that and we've got to say, hold on a minute, does what this leader says, what he's what his doctrine is, what he preaches, does it line up with the word of God? Because if it don't line up with the word of God, then I'm sorry, but you've got a question why you're there, really.

Spiritual Theft And False Teaching

SPEAKER_00 41:23

And that's the question is now, Lord, where do you want me? What should I be doing? Lord, can you lead me to the cross? You know, the Garden of Gethsemane, you know, we're we're we're in the we're in the Ten Commandments, but I never realized, you know, I keep having a little chuckle there. I never realized that the Ten Commandments open up so much, it throws, it it opens up Genesis to Revelation, but it draws you in in a way that God has got you. God has got you. And when you want Jesus more and more and you start to look within yourself, you know, the most difficult thing is to look within, to look within me and say, Lord, I thought I was where I thought I was further up the track than than I am. And suddenly, Lord, I realise that I'm so far back from the track.

SPEAKER_01 42:12

Because the standard is so high.

SPEAKER_00 42:14

Because the standard is so high. And the flaws, the character flaws that I've got, the worries I've got, the the silly ways that I've got, the issues I've got, the the struggles I've got, the fears I've got, the the insecurities I've got, everything. But trying to bring this stuff to the cross is so difficult because I'm not blaming the church in any way, shape, or form, but maybe religion. Is there anybody out there that that has been able to deal with all their stuff in their life because over the generations the church has taught how not to live in fear, not how to live in doubt, not how to live in sin. But it's been like this massive big shop broom that has been swept by all denominations and everything has been swept up together, and it's been like put in a box and on the shelf, and you can have you can have any anything, bits of different bits of denominations, bits of this, bits of that teaching, and suddenly we've got all this teaching out there, and it's so wishy-washy, it's it's it's made this feeling that church hasn't worked. What what's happened? The religious order, the box hasn't worked. It's not because Jesus isn't working, it's because my eyes have been focused on the structure and the running and the business rather than looking at the cross.

SPEAKER_01 43:38

Yeah, that's right. Rather than rather than uh the Bible and and the word, the cross. So it's um it's yeah, you've only got to be one degree out, haven't you? And and your mind suddenly your whole life is thrown all over the spin.

SPEAKER_00 43:55

And there's a really interesting thing happened yesterday down in Brighton in that university. I don't know. They've backtracked on that where they they said that the University of Brighton was was not taking a Christmas break, we're not recognising the word Christmas, we're taking out the word Christmas, and we're we're switching that for it's just a winter's break because the Christian festival could be offensive to those that are not in that. So there's been a big thing yesterday. So what I'm trying to say is there's that the world is always trying to rob us Christians.

SPEAKER_01 44:25

Well, it's happening uh that's happening more and more, isn't it? You know, well they've taken they've robbed us of Christmas anyway, haven't they? Yeah, because the world has taken over that. So, you know, I've got um Jewish friends, Asian friends, you know, who who are Hindus or whatever, they all have a good old infestival. But they all have a they all enjoy Christmas. They do. And they enjoy the world's Christmas more than what we do. Do you know? Yeah, but quite frankly, I'm fed up with a world's Christmas. I'm fed up with the world's Christmas. I wish and I got I got um I got hammered uh in a group, a men's group, uh, because I said I wish that um that the the Christian church stand up and and say we're celebrating Christ's birthday on another day to Christmas Day and let the world have Christmas, but we're gonna celebrate that. Yeah. Oh no, you've got to stand up. But it's it's overwhelmed. It's overwhelmed with commercialism. And the same with Easter. Yeah. The same with Easter. Easter is not bunnies and and chickens and chocolate. You know, it's the Christian.

SPEAKER_00 45:34

When when you think about what it is, and I actually think that Christmas should remind us, yeah, obviously, of the birth of Christ, but also the redemption saviour. Because that's what they that's what the wise men were looking at. That's the saviour of the world. Well, it the gift of salvation.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

And the thing is, you know, this is isn't when Jesus was born.

SPEAKER_00 45:57

No, we understand the dates are very different to the calendar of the born, because he was God anyway.

SPEAKER_01 46:04

This is when he became man. Yes. This is when he became man, but and and you know what, Ben, you know, Jesus is life, he's the only one in the whole of humanity now, since and forever, who can keep who's kept these Ten Commandments. The only one who's kept um all. And this one, this steal, as we quite rightly said last week, because we went into spiritual um uh theft, spiritual stealing, didn't we? Can you rob from God? That's what we said, and yeah, and we came up with the answer, yeah, very much so. Um but you can imagine the tablets then, can't you? So you've got you know five commandments on one side, five on the other side. Well, the the the five on on the other side, which start with, you know, you shall not murder, um, they all have got fed through them. Because if you murder, you steal a life, if you commit adultery, you may steal a partner, or uh if you commit false testimony, if you lie, then you're stealing justice from somebody, aren't you? You know, if you you covet in other people's possessions, then you want to take from other people, and you know, um it's all of that stuff. And and today we live in a society where there's a lot of it's always gone on, but it's exposed more. You know, there's a lot of stealing of humans, isn't it? There's a lot of kidnapping, there's a lot of human trafficking going on.

Religion, Busyness, And Losing Focus

SPEAKER_00 47:36

You know, human exploitation. Human exploitation, yeah. And a lot of that's done under the the banner of religion, you've got abuse under all that, you've got so much under that. This text that we started looking at, you know, I never realized how big I'm huge. And as as as a believer, I'm thinking this this is just um unbelievable that what the the truth the scripture, when you start looking and reading about stealing, automatically you think, oh well, I've taken that, I've I've stolen that and put in my pocket. But that's that's the minimalistic thing. It's it opens up so much more.

SPEAKER_01 48:14

It's huge.

SPEAKER_00 48:15

I mean and the world is always trying to rob you of what? Of your peace.

SPEAKER_01 48:19

It's trying to rob you of your peace, it's trying to your joy, it's trying to in part in you and make you doubt.

SPEAKER_00 48:26

Doubt yourself, doubt your faith, trying to Oh mate, it's taken away God, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 48:30

You know, but it's so you're wrestling the the world has robbed you of God.

SPEAKER_00 48:35

Yeah. Because you look at it, yeah. You look at the world.

SPEAKER_01 48:39

The world's robbed us of God. The world's saying you've got to worship the creation and not a creator.

SPEAKER_00 48:46

And we're pressed in our face with foreign gods all the time.

SPEAKER_01 48:49

All the time.

SPEAKER_00 48:50

Foreign gods are pushed in our face, and you're trying to live and you're trying to uh walk for Jesus, and then suddenly things happen, things blow up, things this happens, that happens, things come into life, and and you're thinking, God, and I think there are a lot of believers at this moment having uh their their joy robbed.

SPEAKER_01 49:13

Peace robbed. Oh, uh I mean they're they're peace robbed.

SPEAKER_00 49:17

Let's just remind people though, you can't have your faith robbed because you're grafted in. But as a human being, what happens is you you doubt, then you doubt. So your mind starts playing tricks, the wasteland and the battlefield of the mind. Not that your faith can be robbed because you have been given a gift and you have got the gift of faith. You've got the gift of eternal life. You you have got the gift of the living word of God. So that can't be it can't be stripped away. You know, you are saved and you are blessed, and you are a child of the living God. But your joy is robbed. Your your almost a sound mind can be robbed. Happiness.

SPEAKER_01 49:53

Ben they're they're robbing even robbing the uh the the children of the nativity, ain't they? Yeah, when you think about that. When you think they're robbing the children of the true meaning of Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

What does Christmas really mean?

SPEAKER_01 50:09

They're taking God out of education, they're taking him out of he's just another faith. He's just another God. You know, they're taking him out of education, they're taking him out of especially higher education, and now there's this other doctrine that comes in, the doctrine of socialism, the doctrine of the doctrine of uh Marxism, which wants to rob you of your property. You know, it wants to take away your property and give it to someone else.

SPEAKER_00 50:34

The question is, is are our houses safe? Well until every bean has been paid, the home doesn't belong to you, does it?

SPEAKER_01 50:42

It doesn't belong to you, no.

SPEAKER_00 50:43

Your car, until a car's been paid, it doesn't belong to you.

SPEAKER_01 50:46

Just like that, they could go.

SPEAKER_00 50:47

And just like that, and we've seen it, haven't we? A lot the last few years we see this big band of uh retired people that were robbed of their inheritance that they sewed into. So the world is always robbing you of trying to rob you of your property where they invested, and you've got that big band of retirement people that invested into so many different things that they was told that if you invest into this, when you've paid your mortgage, the equity within that will clear the rest off, blah, blah, blah. And then suddenly they they hear from these big financial companies. Endowments, that sorry, we made a mistake. And that has robbed retired people of a restful time in their life. So the world is always robbing, and how many people longer, you've got to work, you know.

SPEAKER_01 51:37

Yes, you get robbed. You're robbed all of that stuff, man.

SPEAKER_00 51:40

Then that affects your faith, that effect affects your understanding. You've worked all your life, you've paid into the system, and then suddenly you've been robbed of some peace where you thought, I'm gonna rest for a while, maybe go into something uh charitable work, and then suddenly you're finding that I think the biggest area where the enemy tries to rob us is of peace and joy. Totally.

SPEAKER_01 52:02

That's 100% right. He's a robber of peace and joy, whereas the Lord wants to give you peace. He wants to give you peace.

SPEAKER_00 52:10

What does God say? Peace to peace and goodwill to all men.

SPEAKER_01 52:14

Yeah, yeah. He does say that, and that's and and and that is someone to cling on to. Because there's always hope. But he also says, he says, in this world you will have trouble.

SPEAKER_00 52:25

But take heart, I have overcome this world. Sisters and brothers, we have gone in 53 minutes. No, we have, we're in 53 minutes. We've got so much more, and it feels like we haven't touched the that that band, but the the thieves on the cross, you know, he cried out to Jesus, and I think that's where I am at this moment. You know, I'm crying out to Jesus. Will you remember me when you come into your kingdom? Within a twinkling of an eye, you'll be with me in paradise. Yeah, sisters and brothers, do you want to do you want to feel that today? Do you want to feel that on your heart today when Jesus said that? Of course, of course, I've called, of course, I will remember you. Lord, remember me. Of course I will. I'm going to prepare a place for you. Where's that, Lord? I'm going on, I'm coming back for you. Jesus is coming back for you.

Culture Wars And Joy Being Robbed

SPEAKER_01 53:16

And if you're, I don't know if if you've fallen short out there, if you which which many of us do, if you if you've fallen away from your faith, which which obviously many of us do from time to time, or or if you feel, and you know, I used to get this all the time um in prisons. Uh I I there's not a God that loved me. I'm not I'm I've done so much wrong. And just remember, you know, the prodigal son, and because the when you when your heart turns back to the Lord, as as with the thief on the cross, the arms are open. As with the Father's arms are open. As that old gentleman found as he fell on the floor and wrapped his arms around that chair.

SPEAKER_02 54:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:01

Jesus is there. Jesus is there. Jesus is with us. Jesus is with you. Jesus is with me, you know. And do you feel that your joy's been robbed? Do you feel your your peace has been robbed? Do you feel that your your livelihood's been robbed? Do you feel that you're just chasing around, chasing your towel, going round and round and round, and you're trying to restore and trying to and try and get back what the enemy had stolen, all that all that sort of stuff that's going on, and taking that territory back. Do you feel there's been stuff taken from you? Well, now is the time as we come just to close this, you know, open conversation, saying, Lord, I need you to heal me. Lord, I need you to restore me, Lord, because I feel that I've been robbed, but right now, Lord, I thank you that perfect love drives out all fear. Simon, do you know what? I think it'd be a good idea if you take us out in prayer.

SPEAKER_01 54:53

Yeah, but I mean you can't argue with that, can you? Perfect love, it drives out all fear. So what we'd say is if if if there's anyone out there who's and uh we know it's at a time uh like this where people are are in fear, there people are in doubt, people are um stressed, depressed. What we'd say is um quietly, don't have to shout it from the rooftops, it was quietly wherever you are, give give Jesus praise today. Lift Jesus up to the Father, lift him up, thank him for what he's done for you, thank him that he came to the cross and died and rose again to save you and led you to the Father. Let him lead you to the Father today, and let him build you up, and and we'll put an end to that fear, we'll put an end to that doubt, we'll put an end to all of that negative stuff and fill it with the mighty word of Jesus Christ and fill it with the word of God and the right doctrine. So we'll be praying for every single one of you out there. We love you. Um remember if you if you uh like this stuff, there'll be plenty more content coming your way. And if you do like it, don't forget to to give us a uh uh thumbs up and uh you know and maybe subscribe to what we're doing. So don't forget it's hashtag Christian Straight Talk, and we're wishing you a very happy, very Merry Christmas, a very holy Christmas, and bring it but above all, Ben, a very cross-filled Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 56:19

Yeah, yeah, that's very, very true. Yeah, that's so true. The cross, you know, closing this, it's the cross. Let's carry each other in prayer to the cross of Calvary. Let's carry our loved ones and our friends to the cross of Calvary, wherever you are. Let's get to the cross of Calvary today because that's where peace is at the cross. God bless every one of you in the mighty name of Jesus Christ. God bless. Take care, stay safe.