A small company in Brooklyn New York called Square Roots looks to change the tide and take back the heart and soul of farming, by growing organic food in shipping containers, and by creating meaningful jobs in modern farming. Square Roots actively incorporates diversity, equity, and inclusion in as well as a starting base pay that would surprise anyone
PICTURE THIS: a tractor trailer, fitted out with all the necessary equipment and technology to become self-contained farms - which can be placed inside cities around the world to feed urban dwellers
Alex Pate is farm manager of Square Roots Brooklyn operation. He grew up outside Chicago, became a teacher. After becoming disenchanted with his purpose, he found urban agriculture to be a natural extension of an interest in the recently legalized cannabis industry.
For more on Square Roots:
https://www.squarerootsgrow.com/
A small company in Brooklyn New York called Square Roots looks to change the tide and take back the heart and soul of farming, by growing organic food in shipping containers, and by creating meaningful jobs in modern farming. Square Roots actively incorporates diversity, equity, and inclusion in as well as a starting base pay that would surprise anyone
PICTURE THIS: a tractor trailer, fitted out with all the necessary equipment and technology to become self-contained farms - which can be placed inside cities around the world to feed urban dwellers
Alex Pate is farm manager of Square Roots Brooklyn operation. He grew up outside Chicago, became a teacher. After becoming disenchanted with his purpose, he found urban agriculture to be a natural extension of an interest in the recently legalized cannabis industry.
For more on Square Roots:
https://www.squarerootsgrow.com/
The following is a conversation with Alex pate urban farmer committed to bringing organic sustainable food to the urban dwellers of Brooklyn, New York. I'm Thom Pollard This is tools for nomads, where you meet inspiring, insightful, passionate individuals, nomads driven by creativity, and an insatiable curiosity for life's big questions. Wherever you're listening or watching, be sure to subscribe, like, comment, leave a rating and review. In the United States today, the number of family owned farms declines concentrated animal feeding operations dominate animal production, and have a huge influence on crop growing. A small company in Brooklyn, New York called square roots looks to change the tide and take back the heart and soul of farming. By growing organic food in get this shipping containers. And at the same time, they create meaningful jobs in the modern farming industry, actively incorporating diversity, equity and inclusion in their business as well as a starting base pay that would surprise literally anyone. So picture this, a tractor trailer fitted out with all the necessary equipment. So container units ultimately become farms placed inside cities around the world to feed urban dwellers. The mission of square roots to responsibly bring locally grown food to people in cities around the world all year round. My guest today Alex PEI is farm manager of square roots Brooklyn operation. He grew up outside Chicago became a teacher in the city of Chicago. And then after becoming somewhat disenchanted with what his impact actually was in the teaching world. He found urban agriculture to be a natural extension of his interest in the recently legalized cannabis industry. Now Alex is committed to the square roots mission of bringing organic sustainable food to people around the world. His story is fascinating. Here's Alex pate from the square roots farm in Brooklyn. Background noise in all. So Alex, great Sanya seriously, thanks for taking the time. And I am really interested in hearing about square roots. But wanted to ask you first a little bit about your journey. How circuitous was it for you to find your way into farming as a young man entering farming? Yeah,
Alex Pate:you know, I never actually growing up ever considered agriculture, horticulture as any viable career path. Right. I think a lot of our minds, we are told what agriculture is, and we think of, you know, large industrial scale farming with you living in some place off in the country, and that, like you are doing that, and so that had no appeal to me. And actually, like, when I was younger, had a really difficult time actually finding something that I was drawn to in a capacity that I want to pursue professionally. Like, it was actually, a lot of, you know, my personality, I think was derived from not taking interest in any of these, like main subjects that I had been brought up to study. And so once I got into to undergrad at DePaul University, hopped around to a few different majors, but ultimately landed on education. And I think that, you know, I was fortunate enough to be around a lot of like, really quality educators, I think, at the time when I was in undergrad in 2010, to 2014. There was a large initiative in the city of Chicago, as well as other urban areas as well, but to really emphasize the importance of minority teachers being put into the classroom and placing themselves in the classroom and choosing that career path, because of how important it was to have you know, representation in the classroom and for students to be able to see themselves parts of themselves reflected in, you know, the people that were teaching them. And so I really internalized that and it was really encouraged by a number of my professors to pursue that and so started down that route. But as a lot of teachers as well, like I absolutely romanticized the profession, you know, and thought, you know, black male, I can have this this, you know, impact on black and brown students and it'll be great and like, once I started teaching, you know, realize that a lot of the commonalities that I thought existed, actually didn't and that you My, you know, skin tone my race, however you want to phrase, it was actually one of the only things that I had in common with my students, I, I've never lived in poverty, like like some of my students have, I've never wondered where my next meal is coming from right, I honestly took a lot of those things for granted. And so, during my time teaching, I taught for three years, and during that time, took a lot of great things away from it, and really enjoyed the experience. But it was also really depressed during that time. Because, yeah, of what living in poverty is, and all of the baggage that comes with that. And I was not equipped to deal with that. And I felt helpless in a lot of ways because, you know, I have this scope of impact that, that doesn't leave the school, right, it's in the classroom. And when kids when individuals are busy focusing on meeting their basic needs, right, the classroom is the last thing that they that they care about. And so from that it kind of forced, like this internal crisis in my mind of like, okay, this isn't where I want to be, you know, what is it that I want to spend my time doing and coming out of undergrad I also, for myself was was at this point where it's like, what have I done in my life, that actually qualifies me to be in the classroom to teach kids? Like, I haven't done I haven't done shit, you know, and so, and, and so that was kind of incentive to is like, no, let's find what Alex wants to do. Because when you find a passion like that, when you, you know, gain this hunger for knowledge within a particular industry within a particular field, that's where you start to become an expert, right, not having completed four years of undergrad and absolutely passed this content test. And so at that time, then, the state of Illinois had already decriminalized cannabis use, but was in the process of, you know, legalizing it fully. And with that, kind of like being on the precipice of that there was a lot of discussion at the time, they've kind of shifted away from that now, but the state of Illinois put a lot of emphasis on, we want to, you know, address the inequalities that have resulted from the war on drugs. And that means, like, a lot of black and brown people have been unfairly targeted, incarcerated, find all of these things that came along with that. And so I saw an opportunity there was like, okay, you know, I can try to enter that field. And in the similar way, you know, that I think, you know, we see breweries pop up, and people go to a brewery because they know, a brewer, they know, a company, they know, like a distillery. And they seek out that, that, you know, that product and they go to the brewery for an experience, I kind of foresaw like a similar scenario. And I still think that this is going to be the case with with cannabis where it's like, you know, you can have growers that are known for, you know, their strange, you can have experiences built around around the cannabis use consumption, whatever it is. But as I got into that, and started to like, you know, just start to do like some basic research, I took some direct certification courses within agriculture, it became abundantly clear to me that there are a lot more significant things happening within agriculture, specifically around food access around achieving food sovereignty around and I say that I don't want to under state the food sovereignty piece, because there's a lot that goes into that. But essentially, that, you know, the empowerment that comes with people being able to dictate how their food is produced, where it's produced, what they eat, that that is so profound. And similarly to like just farming generally as a as a field, right? People aren't given insights into that to understand how significant that actually is. And so once I started to get into that, I realized that like there's so much more here than than cannabis. And then I think as well like similar like, I can still do that thing like but growing cannabis doesn't need to be my my main focus, right? You learn how to grow plants, you can grow whatever the hell you want. And that's like a really exciting thing. And so after that, then I started volunteering at this community farm, and they're based around community farming, so they grow a variety of fruits and vegetables, they manage three different farm sites, and sell all of their produce on a sliding scale. So we don't have we only have suggested prices. A lot of times like our food is given away for free. We work with mutual aid organizations to distribute food. And just over the past two years, I've set up about 75 bridges on the south and west sides of Chicago that are hosted by various companies, organizations, individuals, that provides a 24 hour access fridge and pantry where then our network of a few 1000 volunteers stocked those fridges clean those fridges so that people can access food whenever whenever they need to. And so those are like really powerful missions, you know that I think a lot of people are kind of like searching for work. That seems that meaningful, right. And I think, and that's what I've really seen in is really just kind of firmed. This trajectory that I've kind of set out on is like, the intersectionality, of agriculture, with art, with architecture, with medicine, with housing, like, it touches everything. And that's what's so exciting is that the exposure to it allows people to take their particular skills, and choose then how they want to engage with agriculture. And that's what I see as being a huge piece, as what's happening, what I was doing in farming in Chicago, what we're doing here at square roots, what every so many small community based farms are doing is allowing the pathway for people to engage, because you can't think critically or creatively about things that you don't know about. And so that's the biggest piece here that it's like, this is this is the ensuing food related aspect of this revolution that everybody has been talking about, right that like it's incremental, it's never going to be popped down all at once. But this is, as it pertains to food sovereignty, what that aspect of the revolution looks to achieve, it's empowering people to control their means of food production, and food consumption foods to say and sustains our life. So
Thom Pollard:you obviously had this, this empathic sense this this desire to help people. And so you went out seeking knowledge in a different place. And I think that whole idea of the the cannabis industry shifting, it brings up some great points, because there's the people who are succeeding in that are at least doing it well, not necessarily making a lot of money. They have to know horticulture, they have to know how plants work, they have to know how to get the most out of a tiny little area. And it's usually not like 10 acres hidden in the woods, in like the Northwest. It's like in in a basement in a four by four box with a with a light on it. So it's like, it's really a fascinating journey. You know?
Alex Pate:Well, I'll stop you there. Because think about what you just said, right? Like, illegally growing drugs in your basement. Right? How is that viewed from a societal standpoint, from our current legal system and justice system, which I'm not going to go into that, but like, tons of legitimacy in my mind. But so from basement growing illegally, your criminal based on legal definitions, to then a legal framework shifting? And all of a sudden, these criminals are all of a sudden actually plant scientists? Oh, yeah.
Thom Pollard:Oh, yeah. It's crazy. So you're in, you're on the ground floor. And you're working at a place called square roots, which I'm fascinated by it. Tell me about it. It's an amazing thing. So you're in the middle of Brooklyn, New York. And there are these containers that are essentially, it's a farm in the middle of the city, feeding people fresh, organic food. Absolutely.
Alex Pate:So we Yeah, our our square was just founded in 2016. And the campus that I am currently, managing this farm was our our first site. This is like our headquarters. This is where our research and development team is where we develop all of our farm systems. And I've actually been following this company for for a number of years, just kind of seeing what they've been up to, because of how profound, right, exactly what we're saying is that we have what's the equivalent of close to, you know, 75 acres of capable growing space that we have created inside of these containers. So we utilize a lot of just like, a lot of gravity to move water through our systems to allow plants to receive the nutrients that they need the water requirements, and what you know, square roots mission is, is to bring urban agriculture to urban centers. And, you know, I think longer term the goal being that we could theoretically have a campus of our container farms anywhere on Earth, regardless of the geographical location, regardless of the, you know, weather conditions associated with that geographical condition. And that is so profound to what our current understanding and system of of growing food is. and actually kind of goes back. And I love to like reflect on, you know, models of like Greco Roman societies and the way in which cities should ideally be laid out to allow food access, which we've deviated so much from. But that like, actually, in these sorts of models of understanding what a sustainable food system is, is that like our urban areas are built around our food production centers, so that the distribution of that food can evenly be spread out within an urban center that surrounds it. And we've actually adopted the opposite model in a lot of Western society. And so that's what's really great, and like powerful I think about square roots in particular is that we have this scalable model, that our farms are contained within these shipping containers. And so when we want to size up because we receive funds that we can hire more staff to operate these facilities, is that we can actually just purchase another one of these containers retrofitted to meet our system. And then we have additional space. So you know, Brooklyn is our is our headquarters and our original farm, we also have two farms in Grand Rapids, Michigan, that consist of you know, I believe, 24 zones where we have 10, at the farm that I'm at, and they're double stacked, you know, they fit within this really tight like area, square footage, area, and then can, you know, have the equivalent of potentially hundreds of acres of land that we're able to grow in a, roughly, you know, what is it 10 By 36 container?
Thom Pollard:So what's it look like? So you open the door, and you've got this container, how long is a container truck was it like 450 feet long, or something like I
Alex Pate:think they're like 46 feet. And so you open their doors, and we have metal racks that contain our nursery space. So we have a nursery and it being contained, like from germination to harvest, everything takes place within the singular zones. So we have our germination chambers, which are actually just shelves inside of our zones that we seed inside of our trays as any farmer does. They'll live in there for a few days until they germinate, at which point we transfer them over to our nursery space, which is then hooked up to our singular source of water for the entire zone, in that and I say this, because it's just kind of pertinent to for people who are particularly knowledgeable about agriculture, generally horticulture is like, it's cool, because we have different beneficial fungi, different nutrient contents, different beneficial insects that we released within our zones, because what we're trying to do is replicate, you know, an ecological system that otherwise just naturally exists in the outside world. And that actually, there's a lot of nuance in trying to replicate that sort of ecosystem in a confined space. Because there are the knowns, the known unknowns and the unknown unknowns that like are actually contributing to a naturally occurring ecosystem that we're trying to emulate in our in our spaces. And so from germination to harvest, our crops are from take between 28 and 31 days. And so on our campus here. Yeah, it's extremely fast. But that also has to do with the crops that we choose to grow. Here at Brooklyn, we only focus on herbs. That is primarily dictated by just like market trends in the area. The lettuce, you know, market in New York City is pretty saturated. There are a number of hydroponic farms that operate here. And that's really like a positive thing, right? I think that like, we have a number of options for consumers to again, come in contact with these various forms of agriculture, purchase their product acclimate themselves to like what that means whether or not they like want to subscribe to supporting that sort of thing. And so we primarily focus on her. So here we are growing basil, that's like our biggest crop, focus on basil, parsley, and cilantro. And then historically, we've also grown chives and dill, and we're going to be reintroducing dill to our, our farms as well. So that will be the fourth crop that we'll be, we'll be selling but at our other farms. We also grow herbs, but there's less of a saturated market for salads. So a lot of our other farms grow variety of lettuces and mustard greens that go into salad mixes that we do. And that's what's really exciting too, because, like, I talked about this a lot as it pertains to Brooklyn, right? It's like at this campus in particular, we don't grow food for sustenance, right? It's like the farming that we were talking about previously, community garden is oriented around providing food for people to live off, right. And that's not what we're doing here. Here, but at the same time, the technology that we are refining here is impacting the trajectory of what urban agriculture will become. And just as any sort of into your question of like, okay, so can we drop one of these containers in some areas in the desert somewhere? Can we drop it in somewhere far north and near the Antarctic? The answer is yes, we can. But similar to any developmental technology is like where it starts out, it's very expensive, right. That's why square roots is a venture funded company, because they need the reason they need the financial resources to be able to access these containers. You know, while we are an agriculture company, we're primarily a tech company, because we develop the technology that controls our environment systems inside of our zones, right. And so all of that takes an immense amount of money, which individuals, small nonprofit organizations don't have the capacity to do. But with that trajectory, right, just as any technology like cell phones, right, at first, a very exclusive group of people had access to it and use it. But as different players began to come into cellular, the cellular device, whatever realm is that, like, people refined the technology, the materials required to build phones became cheaper. And as a result, more people became able to access phones to benefit from what they provide. And I view that in the same sort of way, right. And that was kind of a point of contention for me and in deciding was I going to join square roots was I going to leave community based gardening is because it's not the same sort of providing food immediately for people. But impacting that trajectory is so profound to me that that is kind of what's fueling my interest at this particular point in time, because we're on the cutting edge of of what, presumably, an industry that will be just as large, if not larger. And by larger, I mean, even more diversified than our industrial farming systems that we've historically hadn't had in this country. And so I think that that's, like, really exciting, especially because of who we have farm with us. It's urban dwellers, it's people who grew up in New York here, some people have, you know, degrees advanced degrees, other people are high school graduates, you know, and allowing the exposure to these systems is so valuable, because where we are, as an industry, the the experiences and professional experience in these hydroponic systems is valuable in itself. And so then when our farmers, you know, step into these roles, learn our systems, that that translates to so many other companies that are in hydroponic spaces, that that itself in addition to all the other benefits that we offer, in pay and everything, but that experience itself is so valuable, because there are so few people who have that hands on experience.
Thom Pollard:So do you ever do Do you ever schools come and do tours or anything like that, or? Yeah,
Alex Pate:so we actually just had a a tour that was rescheduled to next Friday, because it's supposed to be pretty rainy tomorrow. But we have a number of people who are actually on our on our software engineering team, who have been volunteering with, with a couple of high schools, one of the high schools is going to come visit but they ran like a Tech course and after school, like Tech Club, and help do like different like programming projects, and software development projects with the students, and now are kind of like at the culmination of this this after school program are bringing the kids to see right where the tire meets the road, right where this software development piece, actually in real life informs what's happening on this farming level. And that's really exciting. Just because, I mean, at the farm I was at in Chicago, we frequently had groups of volunteers from from high school and high school age volunteers. And so many young kids, even while I was teaching are so interested in agriculture. And and that's what's exciting, too, is that like, it's the zeitgeist at this moment. Like that's where we are socially is that to our conversation earlier around, resource allocation and resource availability is like, we have not yet even seen what where we're going to be with resources not being available for people like we're just starting to get under the surface of this iceberg. And we're going to see some things that are really going to be concerning, right. And I think our younger generations are very tuned into that and see this looming crisis that is about to unfold that like it's starting to unfold, but there's a lot to come. And I think that there's an urgency in a lot of young people too. get into these meaningful fields where they can have that sort of impact, which I think is really encouraging. And honestly, it's the only way that we can go like because we're going to have to deal with these difficulties one way or another. And so we might as well try to get people interested in qualified in through training through different academic means through just like hands on experience, to be able to make informed decisions about this and to be able to deal with some of these things that we're about to see.
Thom Pollard:Well, we could probably unpack a lot right there. But there's less that we can count on, in terms of our future just seems we're kind of on a wishy washy ground right now. And what's going to be in one year, let alone 10, or 15 is?
Alex Pate:No, I agree. I think, you know, though, historically speaking, our species has a pretty bad track record of being proactive in addressing some of these issues, right, I think a lot and not just regarding climate change, I think regarding a whole slew of issues that we would have benefited from on a state level, you know, from a country standpoint, from a global standpoint, if we would have taken some of these things seriously and acted proactively. And so I think, you know, a piece that even goes to like, the Black Lives Matter movement that I see. And as a black person, I say this. And I think a lot of people of color share this sentiment, right is like, we have instances of repeated police brutality that have been happening, right. And as a result, and we've had the second coming of the civil rights movement, essentially, right. And those things have been happening. So now that the public is made more aware of them, there's a sense of urgency that comes with solving them and addressing them. And so in my mind, right, my parents raised me like, you need to be aware of yourself to these extents, because you as a black child, as a black man face these things. So you should proactively look to make sure that like you don't put yourself in those situations. Right. I'm fortunate in that way to have been addressed in that way. And so similarly, I think the sense of urgency in regards to climate change into in regards to addressing food resource issues in addressing use of water resources, preservation of soil rebuilding of soils, that the pressure to act on that the heat has been turned up, right, we're past the proactive piece, we're now reacting to that. And so I think I see that as being encouraging, just from the fact that like, we have not acted proactively in a number of instances. This is now the time that we are forced to make decisive, impactful decisions. And I see a lot of people rising to the occasion to do so. And I think that that's a really great thing because it's coming regardless of whether we acknowledge it or not. And there are a number of people who are like, we have no other option. So let's go out fighting.
Thom Pollard:You're listening to my interview with Alex Pate, farm manager of square roots urban farm in Brooklyn, New York. Tools for nomads is brought to you by top drawer top drawer. His mission is to make durable, sustainable tools for creatives who work to make the world better. From pens to Japanese house shoes to journals, leather bound journals, amazing photo albums, finely crafted paper bags, eyewear, handkerchiefs, lighters, keychains, check them out at top door shop.com or visit one of their dozen plus meticulously outfitted shops in San Francisco, Los Angeles, Boston, Berkeley, Chicago, and Tokyo. Top door shop.com. Alex, the idea of of the climate change and the condition. And near and far future of our planet has come up numerous times on this podcast and tools for nomads, people need to and I'm not trying to preach here but but there it's important that more and more people start to ask where they're getting their food from. And so what you're doing with square roots, and when a school, a group of school kids come in, you're saying I'm gonna empower you by teaching you something you can take this into your own hands, the food doesn't have to come from a farm in Minnesota or in Argentina, let alone to get your avocados or whatever it is we get shipped up here. empowering individuals and groups of people. Did I get that right and should I I'll stop talking now.
Alex Pate:The empowerment piece is huge. And I'm telling you it sounds a little bit Sounds a little romanticize. It sounds a little, yeah, let's kumbaya around all the topsoil that we were able to regenerate, right? Like, that's, that's fair. But at the same time, if people don't see what they start to think about if they don't see a lived vision of what they want our future to look like, that cuts down on the percentage of individuals who are going to try to do it. Right, I've been so fortunate to have the series of seemingly random events that have led me to coming to this conclusion. But as I engaged in urban agriculture, and I say it because like acknowledging the high school piece, and that's great. And we want to start educating people from a very young age, so that they can start to think about these things and make decisions around their career paths around what they do with their lives. With these things in mind, that's extremely important. providing pathways is what I see square roots doing as well, which made kind of the decision for me to join them a lot easier, because our pay here, you know, is starting around $25 an hour. Historically, agriculture has really taken advantage of physical labor, there's this terrible perception that physical labor is synonymous with unskilled work, is like the majority of people actually, that we if you just grabbed a random group of people and ask them to perform these farm tasks, whether it's harvesting, whether it's various sorts of like spacing, and seating and understanding the various factors that will impact our crops, that's highly skilled work. And I think that that's part of the Zeitgeist Movement is that like, people also find a lot of a lot of satisfaction in like, traits. And being able to that was one of the things that drew me to farming is like, I want to have a trait that like I have an area of expertise in, rather than being maybe more of like a generalist, which also a lot of professionals are moving towards. And so providing pathways for people to make responsible professional decisions, meaning I have a kid I need to support, how can I, you know, I need to prioritize taking care of another human being right. And so it would be irresponsible in a lot of instances for people to join to get into farming, because they're gonna be making below poverty wages, and will have no PTO and no health care, and like square roots provides equity to all of our full time employees, if you are a full time employee, here, you are a part owner of the company, we pay you above living wage, right, we have fully covered health care benefits. And so that's also outside of education, that's providing a pathway that's providing a responsible career opportunity for people to say no, like, there is a way for me to enter the field, this is how I can do so. And I think that as you know, we again, the infancy of where we are as an industry is the players who are in there now have their realm of in their sphere of impact is so much larger, because the competition in this field is relatively small at its current state,
Thom Pollard:Alex, so going to try to turn the corner here a little bit and bring it back to the things, if you will, the items, the things that belong to you that you keep, essentially, that are most important for your creativity and your productivity. So like what do you need to get your work done on any given day?
Alex Pate:So from from my role as farm manager, I'd say the number one asset that I need is an informed team. Yeah, that's it is an informed team. I lean so heavily on my two assistant farm managers who have, you know, a level of expertise in this system specifically. And then below them, we have, you know, a number of farmers whose level of expertise on our system exceeds mine, you know, and so that's what I think it is, is a level is a team and informed team that can do this because farming as well, you can't do that from under resource like single individuals, right? I think it's something like, half an acre is recommended for a single person to be able to attend to that that's the biggest thing maybe that's not the easiest answer. It's doesn't come down to a single travel or my computer, but I need an informed team. And that's what I have now. And that's where when we hire people, is what we look to build is a level of knowledge base that allows people to make informed decisions from a place of knowledge, to have that base of knowledge where then they feel confident, troubleshooting creatively problem solving, to then make this farm operate. And I think we're really Lucky as a company, to be able to have the financial resources from the venture funding that we receive, right, but to be able to have the resources then that we can offer to our staff so that we can hire really intelligent people to operate our farms. Because if we're operating on a shoestring budget, we can't write, who are we hiring, we're hiring anybody who will accept the job? No, we have the opportunity to be very selective with who we bring in. Because there are so many people vying to get into this field. And we can choose individuals who are not only passionate, not only informed, but like are willing to do the work. And two are looking to increase their their base of knowledge. Which is it's a beautiful thing. Honestly,
Thom Pollard:it truly is. That's a in not the answer I expected. But it's five times better than anything I expected. So I love that. Outside of just the work thing. What inspires you you talk to before we started recording, you met our friend Nick in common as in bands. When in grade school? Do you play an instrument? Are you a musician? Do you listen to music? Are you a runner? Like what are the things that you need to keep your head healthy between the years so to speak, to stay inspired and rejuvenated?
Alex Pate:Yeah, I mean, I definitely have a really love physical activity. So I work out a lot, I do a lot of running. I actually yesterday just bought a new pair of basketball shoes, I've been playing basketball at the gym. So that's been a lot of fun. But I I've probably roughly on average, clocked about 20 miles a week running. So like that, that's a big thing. So besides those things that I really love, I also then you know, I have like a small garden, on the roof of my apartment, I really love my my girlfriend, and I love the outdoors. So we do a lot of camping outdoors, we She's a phenomenal cook. And so a lot of the produce that I get to bring home is prepared and just like amazing ways, you know, really allow me to like enjoy the produce to like the highest potential that like it could be. So that's really, that's really great. But you know, like, I think also, again, this might sound a little corny, but like, the inspiration of just working in agriculture and understanding this larger context is frequently looming over my work, because I am telling you, and this might be, you know, I attributed partially to the probably the amount of weed that I smoke. But it's also the transcendent nature, like our entire lives are transcendent. And I say that in this is that we are finite beings, we are finite, singular beings that are only capable of having a finite perspective of the shared reality that we all have. But we all have a tiny perspective of that huge, enormous, we can't even contemplate how large the reality is that we share. Right? So if if you operate from that as a baseline, right, then actually the majority of things that are happening, are bigger than a single person. Right. And that's like all like, that's the reality of it, whether or not like we choose to acknowledge it or not like that is the field in which we're all playing. And so once people can start to truly internalize that, then you become a transcendent being in that, like you can start to make decisions outside of yourself to impact this enormous trajectory that we are all sharing, and we're all bound to. And I say that with the caveat, because like, I'm just a Joe Schmo, like I'm normal people, I don't think that I'm this transcendent being in between, like, That's not the thing. That's not the point, I'm getting it. The point is that, like, we're all going to die, right? We all have this finite time. And things will continue on after us just as they continued before us. And so the healthy conclusion there from like, a mental standpoint, is that like, we are all intertangled both willingly and unwillingly. And so every decision that we make, has an adverse reaction. Right. And I'm not just saying that from like a physics standpoint, it is physics, but like every single thing that we do, has a reaction that down the line can impact other people in other ways. And I don't think everything we do here is like exactly spot on. There's a lot of refinement that needs to continue to happen. We are operating in that mindset. And as our culture more widely starts to adopt those things and as they become kind of ingrained into our culture, that it becomes easier for people to internalize those sorts of things. And then act from that transcendent perspective, from that omniscient perspective, to be able to determine, Okay, what do I want to make? My life? What do I want my contribution to that reality? What do I want that to look like?
Thom Pollard:Beautiful. So I almost said earlier, but but we were kind of on another path. I think that the majority of people on this planet, let's just say to make it simple 98% of the people on this planet, and it could be everywhere, I'm not saying in any culture, or any community are essentially just concerned about what's going to put food on their table that day what their immediate environment is. And so if they were to turn on a light, or put put extra gasoline in a car, or drive a bigger car, and I'm not even passing judgment on them, but but they're not so concerned with, you know, the health of the planet is much or, you know, they, they, they eat pork, and they don't care where the pig was grown. But then there's 2%, who think differently, think consciously about the greater community that we're in,
Alex Pate:you know, recently I was in South Africa, visiting, just like hanging out seeing a bunch of things a couple of years ago was in the Republic of Georgia, seeing things experiencing things meeting people, right. And this shared feeling is so pronounced. And that F that so many people in their geographic locations, and their little bubbles, feel the same sort of thing. And then to the piece of the 98%, the 2%, right is like there's also a critical mass, that if the structure is in place, people will just go along with it. Right? There's so many things that we just do, because structurally, it's easy for us to do, I bought a car because there are gas stations everywhere. So I can get gas when I need to go to the car, whatever. And so like, then it's like, how can we address those systems, so that people don't actually have to think about consuming food from a responsible source that it's like, so embedded right, that maybe it's that's the 2% that you're talking about is like who are the people that then are helping to implement these systems of care from a system a place of responsible action, that then for the people who want to actively participate? Great, let's bring them in, let's get more insights, more perspectives, but for the people who are kind of indifferent to it? What's the critical mass that it's like, we can have the people actively doing this, and then the rest of people are just going to kind of follow along because they're indifferent to it. And we'll get food from here. If it's easy for them. We'll get food from here if it's easy for them.
Thom Pollard:Alex, let's, let's put a bow on this and wrap it up a little bit. Tell me what what's the next year look like for you in square roots? And what can we expect from from
Alex Pate:there? Yeah, I mean, so from a square roots business perspective is like we are constantly refining our farm system. So at this point, what about while I'm talking to you, we're already like, understanding what ways we can change our farm system to make our operation more effective to be more water, like lower, I should say, increase our water, you should use water use efficiency, the way in which like, we can reach more communities around the country. So in the next year, you know, ideally, square roots, you know, we currently have four farm locations, in the next year, we should have close to eight. And they will be following a model that like, right allows us to scale up because we are installing confined space farms. And that's really profound just because like we also have funding and meaning that there are people with money who are interested and acknowledge the power that that this idea has, right. And so the proliferation of that will be exponential. So that's an expectation 100% I think from a more personal standpoint, in relation to square roots is that as the farm manager on our Brooklyn campus, I've been given a lot of autonomy to not only dictate like our production plans, and what that looks like and, and I get really excited as well, I'll spare you the details. But I get to kind of head our integrated pest management or IPM practices here on site. And there's a lot of like really incredible. A lot of really incredible things going on. I'll just drop one term for anybody who's listening in might want to look into this fig mo morphogenesis. And in brief, it's the mostly unknown mechanisms at this point in time unknown to humans, mechanisms inside plants that are receptive to physical touch. So whether that's animals passing them in the wild, whether it's air temperature, whether it's water, like we have discovered actually certain frequencies, that plants respond to and will perform at a higher biological level when exposed to these frequencies, right? Everything's a vibration. So like, Yeah, well, you just talked about that. So that's incredible, right? So that's really cool. And so I like that. And so we're going to be able to do like some really cool things, collecting data around all these pest management practices that allow us to not use chemicals to still, you know, dictate, like the levels of pests that we have in our systems, and then change things that like, allow us to counterbalance that. And so also one thing that I'm excited for that like, we are starting to kind of understand how we can engage with a number of other community entities and impact that behind me behind one of our farms, there's a weekly food drive that like that formerly incarcerated people are now like leading they have it's a food truck that they packaged meals for people in the community to just come and pick up meals. So we donate to them every week, we donate to a number of different community farm community fridges around the neighborhood. But we also are looking to host a number of events. Here, I'm talking right now with a number of friends of mine who are comedians here in New York. And back at the farm in Chicago, we did things like this too. But we want to bring a comedy show here and have our backdrop being you know, our open containers that people can see into our farms, people then can also engage in the social events that allow them to be in close proximity just to the farm to start the conversation around that we don't need it to be focused on this is the center there is comedy. Exactly. Right, exactly. And all these people are drawn to that. And all these people maybe don't even know yet they want to engage. And we can phrase it as right and what we're looking to do is like the admission fee is some sort of food donation that then we'll work with our partners to give that food but then it's also people can engage socially with us in a less conventional way. But start that conversation because the proliferation of these ideas, not just in agriculture, but in human rights and and, you know, justice for people of color, housing, justice, medical equality, that like those things, starting those conversations is pivotal to the success of our species moving forward.
Thom Pollard:From more information or about employment opportunities, look for square roots on their Instagram page square roots grow, or on their website at square roots. grow.com. Thank you, Alex. I look forward to seeing square roots with my own two eyes very soon. Thanks for visiting tools for nomads and up close and insightful look into the lives and habits of passionate and creatively prolific people like Alex Pate, who embrace and cherish the nomadic lifestyle. Be sure to subscribe, like and comment wherever you're listening or watching tools for nomads is brought to you by top drawer at top drawer. nomadism isn't simply about being on the move. It's about loving and living life, where the things we carry directly impact our productivity, our well being an even our identity. Top chore combines the quality and craftsmanship of our grandparents generation with the drive for independence, function and stylish sustainability. That all results in a collection of tools curated from around the world that helps you do your best work wherever you may be. Visit top drawer shop.com or visit one of their dozen plus meticulously outfitted shops in San Francisco, Los Angeles, Boston, Berkeley, Chicago, and Tokyo. Top drawer shop.com Thanks for visiting. I'm Thom Pollard. See you next time on tools for nomads.