SPEAKER_03 0:00

Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Connection in Progress. This podcast is all about having real conversations that go beyond what happens Sundays. Because life doesn't pause when service ends, and neither do the struggles that people carry. Today we're continuing our series called The Silent Battle Within, where we've been talking about mental health, the whole thing. Pressure, identity, emotional health, different misconceptions. And today we're going to be continuing that and talking about our episode for the day. It's called Finding Identity Beyond Expectations. Because pressure catches up to everyone. Last episode we talked, we ended up ended off talking about identity versus performance, and we're going to kind of continue that conversation today. I'm joined by the amazing people of Living Hope, Miss Kia and Mr. Robert Hart. Thank you for joining us again on this episode.

SPEAKER_00 0:52

Our pleasure.

SPEAKER_03 0:56

Today we're going to be talking about, I think, my opinion, one of the hardest things that people realize when it comes to identity. And that is their identity becomes attached to their performance. Whether if it's the performance at work, whether if it's relationships, to give a personal, to give examples, for example, a mother, her identity may become that she is just a mom, but there's more to that mom. I'm a father, whether he's a military dad, you know, typically their identity may become they're just a military dad, but there's more to that person. And so we want to talk about, you know, we're going to talk about what healing actually looks like and how to hopefully begin that process and recovering your identity beyond of what those pressures and expectations. But before anything, I would like for us to open us up in prayer. Um, just so we can have our hearts in the right place if you guys don't mind. Let's pray. Heavenly Father, Lord, thank you for this most wonderful and gorgeous day, Lord. Thank you for another day of life that you've given each and every single one of us, Lord. Be able to do your kingdom work another day, Lord. I pray for this podcast, Lord. I pray for everything that we're doing, Lord. I pray that the Spirit enters us, Lord, guide our words, guides our thoughts, Lord, to be able to speak on what you want us to speak on, Lord. I pray for every listener, Lord, that may be tuning in. And I just pray that you have them receive what you want them to learn today. And thank you for this amazing opportunity that we get to talk to people and just essentially talk about it. Continue to guide us and protect us and let us be a shining light for your glory. Pray this in Jesus' name I pray. Amen. All right, so I just would like to just jump right into it and talk about when pressure stops being sustainable. So I think sometimes people carry this pressure so long that they don't realize how heavy it's become until it finally catches up to them. So I would like to start off and ask you guys, what does emotional exhaustion usually look like before people recognize it?

SPEAKER_02 2:55

Well, I would say a lot of times it's irritability over small things, irritability over small things that maybe normally wouldn't bring those responses. This is interesting, chronic fatigue that doesn't get fixed by sleep. I had somebody just the other day saying, I'm tired all the time, but I sleep all night, and I'm still exhausted when I wake up. So that's often a sign of that. Um a feeling of numbness, or not feeling deeply sad, but also not being able to feel joy. So those are some, I think, indicators that there's emotional exhaustion, and people may not always recognize that that's what's going on.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

Well, and I just want to point out that, you know, there's this principle that we see throughout creation, and that is that it's adversity that makes us stronger. It's pressure and stress, right? Not naps that make us stronger. And so figuring out how to balance pressure and stress in a way that doesn't become exhausting or overwhelming is really one of the challenges that we all have to face because uh we do need adversity in our lives just to make us stronger, right? And so I agree with Kia. Certainly there are some signs where it's crossed a line, um, right? When we're over functioning or overperforming, um, that's often an indication that we've taken on too much because you know, Christ Himself said, Come to me, all of you who are weary and overburdened, right? And I will give you rest. So when we're feeling exhausted, often it's a time it's a sign that we've picked up too much, and it's a sign that we have taken on more than God has even called us to do.

SPEAKER_03 4:52

So thank you so much for sharing. My next question is when do people realize that the pressure that they're carrying is no longer sustainable?

SPEAKER_02 5:03

I would say that usually when the body or relationships protest, something's going to speak back to the person, giving that feedback. It's a matter of recognizing that's what's going on.

SPEAKER_03 5:17

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:18

So it could be um, you know, as we said in previous podcasts, sometimes if it's super severe, the body just shuts down. People will end up getting sick, people will have to, you know, they have to take a break because they can't keep going, or they'll start to get feedback in relationships that you seem off, or is everything okay? You're seeming a little cranky or unhappy. And as best we can, if we can notice that's happening in more than one relationship, to not be defensive about it, but slow down and kind of just notice, well, what is going on inside of me?

SPEAKER_00 5:55

Well, and I think for me and a lot of the folks I work with too, when when my insides and my outsides don't match up, right? When they're not lining up. So outwardly I still show up for my job, outwardly I still uh show up at dinner time and we have conversations, but inwardly I feel that disconnect, or I feel that sense of resentment or burnout inside. Um, that's a big sign of it, I think, in my own life. And when, you know, I'm not in a rhythm of rest, but rest actually feels a little more like a luxury, like, oh, finally I get to take a breath. Um, I think that's a a big sign there too, that pressure is unsustainable in my own life.

SPEAKER_03 6:46

Wow. I never thought of it that way. Finding rest as a luxury, especially, you know, we're always preaching that, you know, rest is a biblical practice, you know, that you should be doing daily. So when it's being seen as a luxury, it's like, hey, that's a red flag. I never thought of that. Whoa, that's crazy. Um so after identifying these signs, like if somebody's relating right now, like, well, that's that's how I'm feeling. Um, what is your guys' recommendation that like what's the first step after that? Do you guys have any tips on well?

SPEAKER_00 7:24

I think one of the first steps that I encourage people to do um is really just slowing down and kind of recognizing. Um in my world, I use the word assessment a lot, uh, but just recognizing and noticing what is happening in me, right? What's happening internally, what's happening like what Kia was saying earlier, physically in my body. Uh, just pay attention to the cues that that are going on, uh, particularly internally. Those are uh the big things I try to encourage people to do. And it's hard to do that, right? We don't live in a world that encourages us to slow down. We live in a world that encourages us to speed up, right? Turn off your oven, turn on your air fryer, turn off your air fryer, turn on your microwave, right? Turn off the microwave and just Uber eats it straight to your house so it can go straight into your mouth. That's not slower, right? That's faster. So encouraging people to slow down and just notice uh what's happening, particularly internally, I think is a big part of this process for me.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

Something that's coming to my mind is the concept of dissociation. And a lot of times I I'm under the impression that most people probably think, oh, only really crazy people dissociate. However, there's research to show that we're most people are dissociating, what, 60, 60% of the time?

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Half the time, half of the time.

SPEAKER_02 9:06

Meaning we're not present. Our minds are on the past or in the future or somewhere else. And so I think that's also a bit of a red flag when you realize or you get the feedback. I don't you're here, but you don't feel like you're here. And you're realizing I'm constantly thinking about what's next or what I should have done differently. So really, when you can slow down and recognize I'm not in the journey, I'm not in the present, I'm not enjoying this experience, then just even realizing that and becoming more intentional of I want to be here right now with you, Louise, and with you, enjoying this experience. Um, we can do that when we get intentional about it, but sometimes if we don't slow down to notice that, we just miss the day. I don't know how many of you have experienced, I think all of us probably that drive. We realize I don't even remember getting from here to there.

unknown 10:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:01

Because my mind was in totally different places. And that's dissociation. And we've learned to function in that state. But it's it's a sign that we're not, yeah, fully getting to enjoy the experience and being present.

SPEAKER_03 10:18

That's so funny that you mentioned that. I had somebody ask me yesterday, you know, how how did church go and how did it, you know, how was it? And my response was overall it was great. I was like, but for some reason, like I I didn't feel here for the first time. Like it was it was very like different. And I was like, it went good. I got to talk, talk to people, I got to serve the Lord, and but it just felt different for some reason. And so it's funny that you mentioned that because it's like, whoa, like I'm like, I love this free counseling session. No, but um, I would like to, you know, transition into the healing aspect part of it. Um, you know, the hardest, I think one of the hardest parts of healing is not just letting go of the pressure, but also letting go of the identity that's attached to it. So I want to ask you guys, what in your guys' opinion, what is harder to let go? Um, the expectations or the identity attached to them? Personally, I would probably be on the side of expectations, just because I don't ever want to stop doing what I'm expected to do. Um, but I wanted to see what you guys would say in your professional opinion.

SPEAKER_02 11:32

It's an interestingly worded question. What comes to my mind is identity just because I think humans confuse being needed with being valued really easily. And so there's this thought if I'm the one who holds everything together, if I'm the fixer, if I'm the strong one, then I have worth. And so to imagine not being the fixer, not being the strong one, that can feel very threatening to somebody if that is where their sense of worth is. It's really hard to shift and say, I can sit still and do nothing and be fully loved and still have value. I think that's a a really tough thing for some people to connect with.

SPEAKER_00 12:24

I agree with that. I think identity is a lot more challenging for me personally to shift uh than expectations. Uh for example, if if my identity is supposed to be I'm the protector and provider in my family, um, then my expectations of how I do that can modify. If my wife is a physician, for example, um, she's probably going to make more money than me, right? Um, well, am I not still ensuring that we're being provided for by staying married to her? Right? My expectations can shift to say, well, do I have to be the one earning the income, or do I just need to be making sure that our needs are taken care of, right? Is the mortgage paid? Do we have food in the refrigerator, right? Do our kids have clothes? That type of thing. So for for me, the expectation part's a little easier to manage than the identity part in terms of shifting or embracing.

SPEAKER_03 13:29

So why do you people tie their worth so closely to their performance?

SPEAKER_00 13:38

I have even in the question and in how we talk about it, and I think I mentioned this last uh series that we went through, um, the very word worth or value are economic terms, right? It's connected to money for so many people. And when you start thinking about that, what is paid in our society, right? Certain things are paid and certain things are not paid. I have never once been paid for changing my children's diaper. Not once. Um, so often if I am the one who's responsible for caring for my children, from an external perspective, that might be viewed as worth less. So when you start thinking of an identity, is caring for children worthless? Well, of course it's not. It's hugely important. We're charged with training up our children in the way they should go, pointing them to the Lord. And part of that is helping to care for them. But if I'm not being compensated financially for that, our society tells us that is literally worth less because we don't pay for those things. Um, we pay for flipping a burger, we pay for getting a degree and uh becoming an attorney or a physician or a police officer or something professionally. Um I think that plays a big part in this whole sense of discussion about what is valuable and what is worth. Because again, there's that word valuable. That's an economic term. So the things in life that we're not being financially compensated for can often be viewed as somehow worthless.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

Completely. I completely agree with that. I think that's very true. I also think it's connected to the intangible versus the tangible. And this may sound like a far stretch, but what came to my mind is even in trying to worship an invisible God, I'm thinking about when I'm not gonna say this well, but way back when Jehovah, when the God, the Christian God was being introduced to people, part of the challenge was it's not, it's he's invisible. There's all these visible gods that you know, like the idols that they were worshiping. And it was a huge challenge to say, we're bringing to you, introducing to you this invisible God to worship. Like what that that's that's so hard in a way. And I think kind of in the same way, our worth being tied to just being like a to-do checklist is tangible. I did this, I did this, I did this. So there's my worth, or there's your worth. Look at all you've done. But to just say it's just in who you are, who you were created to be, this unique you. That I think that's just hard to grasp, even though it's the truth.

SPEAKER_03 17:16

Oh, what an amazing point. I mean, biblically you see it in Exodus, right? Like you see them like the Israelites struggle so much because they wanted something so tangible. And you know, it's it's not the case, um you know, with God. And so what an amazing, I never thought of it in that perspective. Well, what an amazing point.

SPEAKER_00 17:37

Um well, and uh just one final thought on that. Even when Christ was starting his ministry, he he wasn't uh outed yet, if you will, right? Before he did a thing, his father said to him, This is my son, and whom I'm well pleased, right? That was before he did a single miracle, before he had shown his very nature and character being God publicly. He hadn't done anything yet. And that is a huge, huge reflection of how God sees us and how he wants us to see ourselves, that we were fearfully and wonderfully made unique expressions of an infinitely creative God, uh, not because of what we've done. Right?

SPEAKER_03 18:36

Thank you so much for sharing that. Amazing. So what are some of the biggest expectations that people tend to silently carry that are not so vocal that in your guys' opinion it needs to be vocalized?

SPEAKER_02 18:52

Well, I kind of think of two categories. There's the expectation that we shouldn't disappoint others. Three categories that we shouldn't disappoint others. Um the concern that I'm either gonna not be enough or I'm gonna be too much. So this balance, this expectation of playing the perfect balance, like it's okay to be to show up, but don't show up too much. And so it's just I think we're all walking around hoping others are gonna strike the right balance and that we feel like we need to strike the perfect balance. But it's it's all subjective and it's all shifting as to what's needed. So those are really difficult expectations to meet, especially if we're not talking about it. We're not talking about the expectations openly.

SPEAKER_00 19:50

I I think that sometimes we can receive expectations or carry expectations too, based on gender differences and gender roles, whether they're assigned or we pick them up, right? I think as men uh we can silently carry the expectations that we're supposed to be strong, right? That we can never fail, that we're always supposed to fix things. Um, and a lot of times these are just burning in the background, um, not stuff that are out loud uh and spoken, that we can't be, that we can't experience uh pain or we can't express uh emotions. Sometimes that's a uh hidden expectation that we carry around. Um and certainly those shame messages like Kia was saying, uh, I'm too much or I'm not enough, right? I'm not a uh a good enough provider, I'm not a good enough uh uh husband, uh brother, leader. Um and I think there's a lot of expectation just to practically be perfect. Um so and those are all kind of unreasonable lots of times. Um and when we carry them silently, uh we we're unable to get feedback from the body of Christ that hey, maybe that's not the way to go.

SPEAKER_03 21:18

So thank you. So uh you guys kind of had mentioned it in your guys' explanations, but um how do people sometimes confuse being needed with being valued, and how do we separate that?

SPEAKER_00 21:39

Well, it's it's tough for me to articulate maybe specifically, but I you know, when I think of Jesus, what I think of is that he was I mean, crowds followed him, they wanted him, but he often withdrew, right? He often made time for himself. Um Um even though they wanted him, right? Um, he needed to take time for himself and his closest companions, right? He often called Peter, James, and John to go with him to reflect and to regroup together. So um it wasn't always about being available to others, it was about attending to really the need of the moment, and sometimes that need is for self-care.

SPEAKER_02 22:34

So I have a hard time separating them, to be honest, because I think being needed and valued do go together in a way. But what I'm thinking is like I think the confusion comes in with being needed, being connected to doing things. I need you to do things. But if we think of our worth being in just wow, God created something one of a kind, amazing, and you, there's no no other you and no other me. We're all part of the body, and we're needed just because we're a unique piece of the puzzle.

SPEAKER_03 23:20

Right.

SPEAKER_02 23:20

And sometimes, like in a body, we're not always, you know, my hip isn't always in action. I'm sitting here right now, my hip isn't in action, but it's needed, and there will be a time, there'll be a moment when it's gonna play its part, but it's not all the time. And so I think just confusing the idea of always needing to be performing is more of the issue than actually connecting need and value. And there's more than way to look one way to look at that, but that's what's coming to my mind right now.

SPEAKER_03 23:54

It's amazing. So it's definitely okay to be needed, right? And there's value in being needed. However, it's also important to make sure that you're not always being needed, if that makes sense. Take those breaks of self-care, just like Jesus did. And um, you know, understand that it's not selfish, because I think that's a very big thing in society. Like it's like, oh, you're doing that for yourself, how selfish, you know, and it's like, no, you know, it kind of goes coincides with rest in a way. Like some of those things are needed, and and that's definitely okay. Um, I love the connections that you guys make. So I think um a lot of people know who they are for others, but not necessarily who they are outside of those roles. So my question for you guys is what helped you, or what in your experience, how have you been able to help others um being able to see beyond like those identity roles? So, how have you guys been able to help others see themselves beyond their identity roles?

SPEAKER_02 25:00

Does something come to your mind right away?

SPEAKER_00 25:02

Well, just that idea again that we're unique creations, that God knows us and he calls us by name, um, that's unique, right? As opposed, I think last time we talked about this, Luis, right? That that idea of roles can tend to be stereotyped and stereotypical, right? And although stereotypes are always wrong when applied to an individual, um, they're generally pretty useful in knowing, right? So, like I think it's nice and important for us to understand and know roles, but not to be stuck in them, not to be not to think that is the whole of our uh identity is in a role.

SPEAKER_02 25:48

So yes, because when I hear roles, I think of doing. So kind of circling back to this being rather than doing. I think a healthy identity is rooted in being rather than doing. Who am I to God and who is he to me, and who am I to these, to my community, and who are they to me? Um the idea of shifting in in more Christian lingo from slavery to daughterhood or sons, sonhood, um, in our relationship as a daughter or a son of God, we it's just who we are. There's room for mess-ups, there's room for all sorts of things that don't shift my identity as God's child. Whereas if my identity is rooted in doing and doing well and not making mistakes, then when I falter, suddenly my identity could feel like it's at risk. Am I still gonna be your wife, or are you gonna boot me out? Am I still gonna be your mom or are you gonna just own me? You know? So there's a lot of feeling liable. But when we can have that rooted identity as a son or daughter to God and know that that is secure and that is stable, then we function from in a from a more stable place because we're connected to our true identity.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

Well, and you you reminded me of a little expression that I haven't said in a while, but right, that we're called human beings, not human doings. Right? That's we're supposed to be human, not do human. So I like that.

SPEAKER_03 27:42

I love that expression. That's an amazing, that's an amazing perspective. You kind of shift the focus of like, you know, we're not just checking off, like you mentioned earlier. We're not just checking off tasks, you know, in a list. So um how do people separate identity from performance? What are ways that people can do that and not be so focused on just doing it?

SPEAKER_02 28:11

I just think it has to be intentional. I think if we mindlessly go about we're not going to separate it. It's not a natural thing. I think it has to be an intentional. This is where I I don't know what you said earlier about rest being a luxury. Is that what you said? Yeah. Um, it needs to become part of a built-in time where you slow down and you remember and you lean into your identity. Sometimes I just like even slow down with God and I just say out loud the truth of my identity. I'm already forgiven today ahead of time for wherever I might mess up today. I'm loved as high as the heavens are over the earth. And just pondering that. Wow, that's a lot of love. Just really getting in touch with the truth of that and choosing to lean into it as I go about my day will completely change my posture as I walk through the day, my resilience, how I interact, and how I view what's going on. But if I forget to do that, I'm forgetting even your question. I I will just not connect to the identity. Right. And I will be about what did you say, the doing. Is that what we're separating? I forgot what we're separating.

SPEAKER_03 29:39

The identity from yes.

SPEAKER_02 29:40

I got all into thinking about who I am to God. That's just so cool. It's a nice thing to get distracted by.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

That's being, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:50

I mean, it is so profound when you lean into it. It's like, whoa.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

Yeah. Well, and what you're describing, Kia, is a lot of what we do, certainly, and a lot of what we encourage other people to do in our practice is renewing our mind, right? That we pay attention to the things that we're thinking, and we choose actively to think about the things that are true, that are right, that are noble, that are good, that are excellent, that are praiseworthy, like Paul encourages us to. Um, and that renews our mind and it reminds us of who we are, right? Reminds us of who we are more so than the doing. Like, you know, I think of the fruits of the spirit, love and joy and peace. Well, how do we do those things, right? Those are states of being, right? Those are emotional states. Um, they're not action states. Um, and they are the response of being rooted in Christ, right? We can go out in our front yard, and we've talked about this example before. We do have a tree in our front yard. It looks like Charlie Brown Christmas tree, right? It's hilarious. Um, we could go out in our front yard and tape bananas to that tree. Does that make it a banana tree? Of course it doesn't, right? Uh bananas come from a healthy banana tree. They are the fruit, they're the product of it. Um, when we are operating in our identity, we don't have to go and try to duct tape fruit to our lives by what we do. Simply being healthy and rooted in Christ, we are going to produce these things. They're just going to naturally flow from us. So I think that's a big part of kind of the identity part really is about how we're attaching and how we are connecting with the Lord. Um, and those things just flow naturally from it, as opposed to the other way around, right? If we earn it, if we go out and we do things, right? If we give a thousand dollars, then therefore we've done the right thing, or if we go uh cut our neighbors' grass, or those are about actions as opposed to how can I love my neighbor the way God has loved me? That comes from an internal state of recognition that God does in fact love me and wants me, and then I then turn around and want to love him because he first loved me.

SPEAKER_03 32:33

So it's it's really neat that you mention that. Um I've actually my my quiet time recently has been I've been learning about um essentially the awe of God. And one of those one of those things is having a fear of God, not in the sense of like God is scary, but a fear of ever being separated from him. Um and it compares like what you had mentioned, like being not only like in awe of his magnificence, um, but in creation, like whether if it's like a nature walk and it's just like wow Lord, like you created this perfect system, and being able to be in his presence in that way, um, but also like on his love. And um I'm I'm reading this book, it's it's a guided book through scripture, and it just highlights like different moments of scripture, for example, uh like Solomon, um and how he was just so wise, but at one point you see you know him being separate essentially being separated from you know from God and kind of see like his downfall and how it started, and it's just like always leaning into that love, um, so you can constantly be in his presence. So it's really neat that you guys mentioned that because it kind of coincides together. Um, so what roles do community play in healing?

SPEAKER_02 33:57

Well, we need friends to love us when we have nothing to offer. And I think that's a big part is it's easy for community to appreciate us and for us to appreciate others in the community when they have a lot to offer and it benefits us, or we can benefit them. But recognizing that we all are gonna go through our ups and downs where when we're for whatever reason we're less productive, we're less capable, we're less whatever, and just providing acceptance and love, meeting us right where we are, that's um strengthening and encouraging to our spirits. And I think we just need to do that for one another.

SPEAKER_00 34:45

You know, I think of this idea of community, it's one of my core principles, right? Um again, right there in Genesis chapter two, it's not good for us to be alone, right? We need one another. And um, I started to say earlier that whole notion of when we're first born, we need our families to care for us. That's our first community, right? We come into the world looking for those who are supposed to be looking for us, right? With a sense of, hey, we're so glad you're here. That's what the community in the body of Christ is supposed to be. We're supposed to be that place where we're like, hey, Luis, I am so glad you are here. Me sending you that signal, and there's no real English translation for this, but you know, in that prayer uh that uh I believe it was Aaron, right? And or Moses was praying, Lord, may the Lord bless you and keep you and make his face shine upon you. That face is the face that says, I'm so glad you're here. Right? I am so glad you're a part of us. That is what community is supposed to reflect. We're supposed to reflect God's face to one another by saying, We are so glad you are here. We're glad to be a part of your life, and we're glad you are a part of our life. I think that's the part that community plays, not only in mental health, but in spiritual growth and development. Um it's a necessary ingredient to life.

SPEAKER_02 36:39

There's a book that we've both appreciated called The Second Half of Church. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 36:44

The other half of church.

SPEAKER_02 36:44

The other half of church. The other half of church. And I really love that it's spending time really emphasizing beyond knowledge. Sometimes in church, our focus can be have knowledge, know the scripture, and of course, that is vitally important, but it's uh highlighting how the experience of one another is profoundly important and a necessary component to having a healthy church. How do we interact with one another? Do we sense that if if we're not here, it it matters? Somebody's gonna say, Where were you? You were missed, or when you even just walk in and people are like, I'm so glad to see you. How did that thing go this week? Like that is actually so important and a really important part of being the body and a part of church, as much as the knowledge.

SPEAKER_03 37:47

Wow. That's amazing. Definitely, definitely good notes and you know how to build the community. Um, but how do you feel received? Um because I feel like in today's society that's that's one thing that's there's always a hesitation. Like and obviously speaking from personally, I don't know if anyone can relate, but like I create a hesitation in myself. It's like no, like they're not gonna welcome me. And it's just like it's back to like what we said in one of the episodes, like it's all in your head. Like it's your community, they love you, just go. And it's just like, ah, you're right, you're right. Like it's all in my head, and it's important to be in community, you know, with those people. So, you know, we kind of transition into healing, and I think healing sounds good, right? Everyone wants healing, right? But a lot of people don't know what healing looks like and looks like in real life. And so I want to ask you guys, what does healing actually look like for you guys? Like, whether if it's you know, you've been counseling someone and it's just like you you're getting better, whatever it may be. Um, but what does healing actually look like? I don't think so.

SPEAKER_02 39:00

That question it could be answered in a lot of different ways. Um one aspect of what healing looks like is taking care of self as well as taking care of others as difficulties arise. Going back to something when something was overlooked and you realize it, coming back and saying, I hopped over this with you, or I hopped over this in myself. I need to slow down and and um work with that rather than sweeping things under the rug and let's just move on, let's just get past it, whatever it is, whether it's a physical something, I need to go to the doctor something, or an emotional something. There was a little hurt and tension there, but whatever. Just keep moving. So I think that can be part of it. Um knowing, you know, when I think of like the idea of healing, I I what came to mind was running for some reason. I ran this morning, maybe that's why. Um but you know in a run when to sprint, when to slow down, and when to actually stop and rest. And so I think that part of healing is getting in touch with that. You know, it's okay to sometimes push ourselves beyond an uncomfortable boundary. That's appropriate at times, but you don't do that nonstop. And so being able to assess this is a moment, I need to actually stop for a bit, or I can keep going, but I need to slow down, being comfortable communicating that with others and honoring that in others. Um, appreciating when someone else is able to say, I need to take a break. And sometimes that's not what you want, but if we're gonna be healing, healing agents to one another and bringing healing, allowing healing in our own lives, I think that's a big part of it.

SPEAKER_00 40:56

I agree. And I don't want to be unnecessarily complicating, but I want to just acknowledge that healing is a challenging word for me personally, um, because um, and I parallel the emotional uh and mental side of healing with the physical, because I think more of us recognize the the physical uh because we can see it. Um but let's say for example, um if I have a tragic accident and I lose my leg, when exactly will I be healed from that?

unknown 41:40

Right.

SPEAKER_00 41:41

Right? Um that's kind of a uh a tough thing to put my finger on because maybe we can define healing as it's no longer bleeding or it's no longer infected. But if my leg is gone, it's gone. It's it's changed uh my life. Uh my leg's not likely to grow back. Um that's not to say that the Lord couldn't grow my leg back. He could. Um that doesn't seem to be his norm. That's not his typical response. His typical response is one day we'll have a new body, right? Then ultimate healing will take place. So, you know, this side of heaven, healing can be a challenge because for me, the first thing that I have to do with people is really determine how badly have you been injured, right? So, like when when we ask sometimes a simple question, like, okay, again, physical, if you've broken your leg, how long does it take for a broken leg to heal? Right? And the answer is, well, it depends. Right, right? Because isn't just a slight little fracture also called a broken leg? Right? Which is different from a compound fracture, which is where your leg is broken and like the bone, I know I'm not trying to be too graphic and gross, but but like when like part of the bone is maybe sticking out of your leg versus a shattered leg where it's broken in multiple pieces. So healing looks different in each one of those examples. So, you know, when I think about healing, whether from an emotional or mental point of view, the first thing we really have to kind of do is acknowledge and assess how significant was the injury. And I think sometimes because we want uh to remove pain quickly, we want to give very clear, simple, easy answers like oh, put a band aid on it, or oh, take some Advil, or oh, put this cast on. Um sometimes it's a Little more in-depth and complicated than that. And that's not to say that broken legs can't be healed. Right. Right. And if you lost a leg, it doesn't mean that you can never recover. It does mean that it might healing and the journey for you might look different than someone who had a fracture. Right. So did that raise more questions than it gave answers?

SPEAKER_03 44:25

No, I think what you mentioned is really important because obviously, you know, self-control and like growing and you know being able to identify when you're maybe regressing. Um it's like, oh, like I'm starting to go back into that place. Okay, Lord, like this is you telling me that I gotta slow down is important, but also understanding what type of healing you need and what healing looks like is also very important. Because you know, realism plays an important part of that, you know. We're not starfish, you know. If I lose my leg, I can't grow back a whole new one. You know, that's physically impossible. That doesn't, but that doesn't mean, you know, I'm gonna overcome, that doesn't mean I can't overcome the challenges. Correct.

SPEAKER_00 45:02

It doesn't mean I'm stuck right here in this place forever.

SPEAKER_03 45:05

It just means that moving forward might look different. And I think that's really important because I think sometimes in certain pain, like when I've talked with people, you know, they and I think this is where like we go back to comparison, that it's the thief of joy because we want to be healed like how other people are.

SPEAKER_01 45:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:22

And it's just like, and I think that's when you kind of go back into that dark place. It's like I'm never gonna recover from this. And it's just like, no. I mean, if we're being realistic, yeah, you may never be like that person that you're comparing yourself, but that's not the point.

SPEAKER_01 45:34

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 45:34

The point is that healing is gonna look different for you, and um, the challenges that you're facing right now, you can overcome just probably in a different way. Sure. And so that's a very realistic, you know, point of view, and I think encouraging, um, because that means that you know, and it's it's what God promised, you know, we're not stuck in the place that we are, and that there's oh, we can overcome, you know, almost anything just in a different way.

SPEAKER_00 46:00

Sure. Well, and hopefully you won't have to just cut out this whole last segment, but like I having said that, I can acknowledge a good way to identify when and where healing has taken place emotionally in someone's life is when I can recall an event but no longer feel it. Right. Right. I can remember how I felt when it happened, but I'm not feeling it right now. Right. That's a pretty good example of healing in my life. So, right, when I think back to um a conflict that Key and I had, and you know, certainly I could avoid thinking about it, but if I think about it, but I'm not feeling the same level of distress or discomfort. I just feel kind of neutral about it. Kind of like I feel like what I had for breakfast this morning. It's just data, it's just information. It happened.

SPEAKER_02 47:00

It's history.

SPEAKER_00 47:01

Yeah, it's history. That's a pretty good sign that something's healed emotionally when I can recall it, think about it, talk about it, but not relive it or feel it again. That's a pretty good sign that healing has taken place. Wow.

SPEAKER_03 47:16

So going back, that's a big thing. So um, two more questions um before we wrap up. What boundaries, in your guys' opinion, are important to protect your mental health and emotional health.

SPEAKER_02 47:33

Well, at the risk of being repetitive, but some of these things you just gotta keep coming back to. I think of this saying, I remember, I think the first time I heard somebody say to me, I will rest when I get to heaven. And that just sounded so spiritually amazing. And I felt guilty that I wasn't like that. Just this attitude of, and I get, I can appreciate the heart behind it, which is like, I want to run hard for Jesus. I want to do all I can do because we only have so long in this life. And there's definitely a place for thinking that way. That's the moments when you want to push yourself beyond the boundaries, and it's okay, and this is the right time. I have the resources for it. But recognizing that that cannot go on 24-7 every day for the your entire life, and there's not there does not need to be guilt for taking a Sabbath, for stopping, for slowing down. Um, so the I think those boundaries of just identifying those moments, what is the need of the moment here, and and being okay with it, making sure that you're not bringing condemnation along with the healthy decisions you're making. Celebrate the healthy decisions rather than guilting yourself for them.

SPEAKER_00 49:01

Yeah. I agree. Well, and just a real personal example here. Uh, pretty recently uh I was involved in an incident that uh resulted in a concussion. So um a boundary that I've had to place is literally taking time off from work to recover from that. Um that's difficult, truthfully, it's difficult for me. Um I want to press through, I want to keep going. Um that's not a healthy thing for me. Um, it actually makes things worse. So, and you know, we live in a day and age where, you know, uh I I've used the broken leg analogy already, right? Um, if I take enough Advil, I'm not gonna feel the pain of my leg. Therefore, I can keep going, right? Does that actually help my leg? No. That actually harms my leg, that keeps the injury from healing. Um having boundaries to know when I need to slow down, when I need to rest, when I need to recover and repair. Um, it just means I have to know when to say no. Um, and that can be a challenge because right, the message we get in Christianity is there's only one answer, right? Yes, Lord. That is it. Um that's hard when I'm trying to discern in my life. Is the Lord calling me to do this? Or is this something I'm feeling pressure from internally or from a partner, from my family, from my boss, from my job. Um, so we have to use some wisdom and discernment in those issues of knowing when to have and what boundaries look like. And a lot of times they do look like saying no to even good things, right? Christian counseling, I gotta say, I think is a good thing. But even I have to say no when I'm concussed.

SPEAKER_02 51:12

So there's a book I have not read, but the title has impacted me. It's called Your Best Yes. That might not be precisely right, but I remember someone telling me that they were reading a book called Your Best Yes. And that phrase has always stuck in my head because we could say yes to a million things. But we lose our effectiveness if we're saying yes to too many things. Right. So we think a lot of boundaries is just slowing down and figuring out is this the best place to say yes? Is this something God is actually calling me to, or is it just appear that way because it's another ministry? How could that be wrong? But really just slowing down to discern that.

unknown 51:57

Right.

SPEAKER_03 52:00

Our final question to wrap everything up what would you say to someone who is listening right now, like a man or woman, who feels like they're not doing enough, who's like, I I need to do more, I can't slow down. What would you tell someone?

SPEAKER_02 52:24

I'm thinking we can sometimes change our goal of a day and realize we can be doing but doing differently and having success differently. For example, if I feel like okay, there's an endless amount of things I could do for my kids, endless. And especially if you're a person who still has a lot of children at home. It goes on forever. But sometimes shifting the goal and saying, okay, instead of trying to do everything that I could do for everyone, maybe my goal is gonna be that I want an hour, pause and make sure I'm in the moment. So it's a totally different goal. You're not doing less, you're doing different, and the different might be way more beneficial. So if it feels too painful to think of doing less, you can kind of trick yourself by saying, I'm not gonna do less, I'm just gonna do different. And the doing might be pausing.

SPEAKER_00 53:36

No, I like that. I like it. The example I use in my often a lot of times is if my goal is to exit this building, I see two exit doors right here immediately to my left. Um, if my goal is to go out those doors, but I am pulling, do I need to try harder to get out? Or do I need to try differently, right? Just if I slow down and go, oh, if I just push, it's a crash bar. I go right outside. So that's what I hear you describing. And I'm I'm with you on that. And here's where I'll just end on a nice little phrase that's maybe a little memorable to you. Um, since the question is, uh right, remind me, Luis.

SPEAKER_03 54:25

Um, yeah. What would you do to someone, men or women, who feels like they're just not doing enough?

SPEAKER_00 54:31

Yeah. I would remind them, do you need to work on becoming a better human doing? Or should you perhaps be reminded that you're a human being? I would remind them of that. It's okay to be who God made you to be. Worry less about the doing, but focus more on the being.

SPEAKER_03 54:59

Amazing. And I think that is one of the biggest things that people need to hear. That, you know, your identity is much bigger than what you produce for others. And it's important to remember what truly matters. But thank you guys all, listeners, and you guys, for joining us in another episode of Connection in Progress. Um, this has been another conversation in our series, The Silent Battle Within. And if there's one thing that I hope you take away from today, it's this that you don't have to earn your identity through performance. Healing takes time, growth takes honesty, and you're allowed to slow down and rediscover who you are beyond the expectation. Because connection doesn't stop on Sunday. We'll see you guys next time.