It starts with data and listening to the system -- practical insights for approaching equitable resource allocation in school districts -- with Jayne Christakos
Opening music:
Jayne Christakos, guest:
The budget is merely a story of what’s important in the district, right? And so we want to really help move the systemic work that's going to improve outcomes for kids -- and asking those questions is how it's going to happen.
Tatia Davenport, CEO, CASBO:
Welcome to Budgeting for Educational Equity, a new podcast series presented by CASBO and WestEd. I’m Tatia Davenport, CEO and executive director for CASBO. Our goal with this series is to raise understanding about resource equity in education -- and to help you think about and apply tangible strategies to equitably allocate resources in your school communities. It’s my pleasure to introduce Jason Willis. Jason has served as a chief business official in several California school districts, and he is currently the director of strategic resource planning and performance for WestEd. Jason...
Jason Willis, host:
Thanks, Tatia. A core part of the work we all do in education is about systems. And of course, systems are made up of individuals. Throughout this series, we’re going to mix in specific experiences and examples of leaders and practitioners who are doing the work of ensuring a more equitable allocation of resources every day. We’re going to explore what their motivations are, what tools they’re using, what’s working, and what they’ve learned.
[1:35]
Jayne:
So, as a CBO, you can look at outlier expenditures -- you can do that through analytics. You know, I can tell you what our district spends a lot of money on. There's a lot in counseling. Well, it's a board priority to have counselors at all of our school sites....
Jason:
That is Jayne Christakos. We introduced her briefly in the first episode. Jayne is a veteran chief school business official who has served in several California districts, including the past six years as CBO with San Bernardino City Unified, where she just retired in June. San Bernardino is among the 12 largest school districts in the state with nearly 50,000 students.
Jayne:
So, is it always equitable? Well, a smaller school site may have a full-time counselor and a large school site might only have one -- but you have to look at need at each of these areas...And so, how do you come up with a way to allocate funds equitably? You really have to work with your instructional folks and you have to listen. We can start with enrollment numbers and unduplicated [student counts]. You can start with all of that, but you have to listen to the need and you have to look at how the dollars are being spent, and if we're seeing the outcomes for those investments.
Jason:
When it comes to school finance, Jayne is a go-to person for so many people. She has often led workshops and testified before the legislature about the realities of district budgeting; she’s a CBO mentor. And when it comes to the day-to-day work of school business and educational leadership, Jayne brings not only a tremendous expertise but a tremendous passion.
Jayne:
I love what I do. [But] as you know, Jason, being in a large urban district is not for the faint of heart. (Laughter)
Jason:
No, it isn’t.
Jayne:
It’s kind of like dog years.
Jason:
So, Jayne, as we think about and work to sharpen our focus on equity and resource allocation, where is an impactful place to start?
Jayne:
First of all, you have to use data. You have to be able to be comfortable reading it, be comfortable with the good, the bad and the ugly, right? And then putting systems in place to really support our kids. And you can't wait a year. You have to be looking at this constantly because we don't want anyone getting further behind -- and certainly, our goal is to have them well ahead.
[4:04]
Music.
Jason:
Of course, data is a broadly used term, almost as ubiquitous as “equity” at times. So I want to quickly break it down for purposes of our conversations:
There are at least four types of data that we use in education: achievement data, demographic data, program data, and funding data. For some folks, the first thing that comes to mind when they hear data is information that is collected from assessments taken by students. But we know data is so much more than a test score. It can be about attendance, about safety, about the effectiveness of a specific program or effort.
And it’s when you combine these different types of data – really helping to paint a full picture – that it becomes a powerful tool to educators and school communities.
At its best, data helps us identify where students are being well served and where more is needed – and -- it can more clearly show us where those disparities exist among our populations of students, as Chris Edley described in our first episode.
[5:06]
Jayne:
I think you use data as much as possible and not to make it sterile, right? What I find is we all can base things on our own experiences: What worked for us -- and so we think that works for everyone. And so how do you look at what is the science behind it? What is a proven way to improve outcomes for kids, to build the capacity of our teachers -- all the things that support them? And it helps when you have proof, right? So you can't just wait for years to see if it works. How are you looking at the data all of the time, all of the time.
Jason:
Mmmm-hmmm.
Jayne:
How do you make it safe to look at data and to, you know, work together, to have a system of support at the district office -- but it [also] has to happen at the school site. That's where the action happens -- and how are leaders working with their teacher leaders and feeling safe and looking at data? Is our collective objective being met and then, you know, collective celebration and accountability. And then the willingness, it's okay to turn around and look at something that needs to be improved. But you have to have a culture that allows for that trust and that work to take place. And if if all the systems and all the arrows aren't pointed in the right directions or in the same direction, you're going to have chaos. And so, I I think that has a lot to do with budgeting for equity.
Jason:
This seems like a good time to share a bit more data about San Bernardino City Unified. The district covers 160 square miles. Without any traffic, it’s about an hour’s drive east of Los Angeles on Interstate 10, with the San Bernardino mountain range towering to the north. The nearly 50,000 students I mentioned earlier attend 72 schools – and those students and their families? Ninety percent are eligible for free and reduced price meals; 20 percent are English Learners; and nearly 10 percent struggle with homelessness. Needless to say, the San Bernardino community has a lot of need.
[7:30]
Jayne:
A few years ago, I think 2018, we were looking at how do we provide support for our lowest performing schools. Now, you know, the state’s done this and the feds have done this many times. And we wanted to get ahead of what another agency was going to tell us to do...
Jason:
Jayne described how the district consolidated two assistant superintendent positions on the business and facilities side of the house into one job – hers – so they could create a new assistant superintendent position for continuous improvement.
Jayne:
And what they did is they, we, used our own metrics. We looked at a number of things: CASPP scores for ELA and math, suspension rates, chronic absenteeism rates, school-wide English learners and African-American youth. And there were eight elementaries, three middle schools and three high schools that fit this criteria that we developed.
Jason:
The district called this new program “TSSP” which stands for Targeted Support for School Progress. It included, as the name suggests, additional resources specifically to support improvement strategies at those targeted schools.
So Jayne, I want to pivot a bit here. Take us more into the discussions the district was having. You’re looking at the data, you’re identifying these needs, and people are saying…
Jayne:
…You know, it's like we have to do something because these schools are, it's not a good situation for our students, right? And you have people trying, it's not that folks aren't, weren't trying, so -- we really sat down, I remember, we were all at a big table and bringing in data and looking at everything from what they have in the classrooms, to the professional development, all of that. And we just put a plan together, all of us.
And we invested about six and a half million -- and first of all, over time, there were some inequities around technology and different things, just getting all of that set up and some systems in place, so that they can monitor progress for students.
And according to CDE [data], in one year, they had improved in many areas. So, it worked -- and it was all about how you have the leadership at the school sites, and just providing the support district-wide and really focusing on those schools.
Now the ongoing cost is I think about 4 million, but we can use LCAP, we can use Title I and they just continue to review the data and continue to get better. And the outcomes for kids are significant. So, our ELs improved significantly; African-American suspension rates decreased -- so they improved significantly; all suspensions improved significantly; chronic absenteeism improved significantly across the board -- so those are the first things -- you want kids in school, right, so they are learning what you intend for them to learn?
Now, of course, this pandemic has been a little challenging, but it's all about continuous improvement and using data to drive those changes.
[10:48]
Music.
Jason:
A key part of the work Jayne described included strengthening cross departmental collaboration. As she mentioned, the district created a new Assistant Superintendent position for Continuous Improvement. That leader is Doctor Rachel Monarrez.
Sound clip of Dr. Rachel Monarrez from a presentation at a recent school district board meeting:
…[We] demonstrated a commitment for opportunities for all of our scholars, not some -- again, thoughtful and cross integration with high academic achievement…
…We have to make sure that our students who have varying needs, those needs are being met.…
Miss Applegate is leading this team and she is with her ed services team, but it's not limited to ed services. We have people from our business services as part of it, because we want to make sure that our business operations are supporting the high quality academic achievement...The descriptor for this work group is to provide a multi-tiered system of support for academic behavioral and social emotional needs. So, you should hear that there's cross collaboration going on with the other two teams.
Music.
[12:00]
Jason:
So, Jayne, as you think about the work you and your teams have done to drive systems change and to achieve more equitable resource allocation, what are some other key elements? What other guidance would you give, especially to newer CBOs?
Jayne:
Yeah, that's a great question. So, as we come out of this pandemic and we already know there are inequities in the system, and we know there are many students underserved, that there’s going to be a need and a urgency, which there should be, to really meet their needs, right? And so, sometimes we try to do so many things that not everything can be done really well. And I think it's really important for chief business officers to listen and and ask questions, but make it clear that you're trying to understand -- not trying to dissuade them from trying things that are going to help support students. And ask the right questions, and not in an accusatory manner. You know, it's just, Help me understand? And then, How is this different than, you know, X, Y, Z -- how is it different? What is it going to bring about? Is there something that we don't need to do now in light of this new approach?
And just asking questions in a way that doesn't, you know, so they don't get defensive and they understand that you're trying to understand…
Jason:
Mmm.
Jayne:
It's listening to the system, listening to the instructional leaders, being willing to ask some questions where something may seem out of line -- questioning other things [like], can you do all of this at once? And that's what I think we tend to do in education: We want to try and do everything. Focus on that first instruction. How are we improving our first instruction? Then we can get in there right away with any additional support they need. But that's where the action happens -- that first instruction.
[13:55]
Jason:
Yeah -- that’s totally right. We do try to do everything at once –and that can be especially hard on all the people in the system…
Jayne:
You know, I learned early on during the great recession when we had to lay off some teachers and some of the best and the brightest that were just so enthusiastic coming in, right? And I went to the layoff hearings. So, it's not just a number that you're trying to achieve to balance a budget, it's people, you know? And so, the more human you are to the system, the better. And when your colleagues see that you're trying to advance what their work is, because that's their work, they appreciate it.
Music.
[14:50]
Jason:
So, Jayne, what what else is important to consider as we can kind of continue forward with this, as you think about how to kind of shape this work. What are we missing here?
Jayne:
So, you'll want to ensure that your policies in your system support where you're headed, right? So you say, We want equitable allocations, we want all our kids to achieve: Do our policies, do our practices, support that? And that's important, because otherwise you're fighting all these system issues to move forward. You have to be comfortable reviewing things -- and that's one thing about LCAP -- is being able to go back to the stakeholders and say, This is working or it isn't. And if it isn't, what are we going to tweak to make it work, right?
Jason:
Mmm-hmm.
Jayne:
We're making these huge investments. There's a huge need. And sometimes it takes time and sometimes longer than others. So, is it moving the dial -- because that's what it's for -- moving the dial for kids -- and supporting our teachers on the front line? Is it moving the dial? And if it isn't, [then it's about] having those courageous conversations. It's really important. And change is hard [so] make it comfortable to try things, right? Make it comfortable to say, This isn't working -- it was with the best intent that we tried this -- let's tweak it a little.
The other thing is, you can't just say that it's one thing . One thing doesn't stand alone. You can tear down or build up something by either layering or not layering, right? You could pull out a foundation of something because you think it's not working and it can destroy something that we're doing for kids.
And so, just being mindful that things are interconnected. And just trying to ask a lot of questions around that and what is the problem we're trying to solve? Because we can get lost in that. What are we trying to solve here? And how are we getting input from the people that are impacted by the decision? Because they’re the ones that really experience it day to day and see how we can support it. Sometimes it's little things that we're not doing to support the systems that will make it better and easier for them to move the work forward.
So, it's not easy and you can't just budget a certain way and think that's it, we're good. We'll just roll it over. You have to ask those questions.
Music.
[17:26]
Jason:
When Jayne Christakos spoke with me, it was only a few weeks before she was retiring from the district. Like any good CBO, she still seemed to be going a hundred miles per hour carrying out all of her responsibilities – and still, she was thinking about ways to improve.
Jayne:
You know, I was just trying to reflect on some of the things we've done. It's just so much. It's a lot. And just recognizing where we can get better -- and we can always get better. CBOs can always get better. I think it's always important to not say "no" right away. How do we make this work? We have to work together to make this work. And if it's a matter of not having enough resources, then let's look at some other things, so we can make this happen. And just being part of the solution is so important.
Jason:
Mmm-hmmm.
Jayne:
And I know we have a lot of people that fight the system because, ultimately, why? Because kids’ needs aren't being met, right? They wouldn't be fighting if everyone was achieving at the highest level and meeting all, you know, reaching all their goals and dreams. And so, there's systemic inequities -- there is -- and that's so great that people care enough, whether we agree on the approach -- that people are looking at the system and saying, Something's not working and we need to be open to that, and we need to address it, because when we're not meeting their needs, we need to be held accountable. Because it's not fair to the kids and they're capable. So that's what's important.
Closing music.
Jason:
Coming up on the next episode of Budgeting for Educational Equity: We’ll head to California’s Central Valley for a deeper dive into the experiences and examples of a superintendent and chief business official doing the work each day of ensuring a more equitable allocation of resources.
Sound clip from episode 3, Adela Madrigal Jones, superintendent, Sanger USD:
…Many times the first thing that our principals go to are people, you know. We believe in people not programs. So the people are going to make the difference. So they want more of the intervention teachers, or the extended learning time for our kids. And knowing that this is good for all students. Again, that conversation is about what all of our kids need. But how are we going to ensure that if you can only have the dollars for one additional intervention teacher, that that's going to those kids that we know are most in need of it?
Jason:
Our podcast is presented by CASBO and WestEd. This series is also made possible by the generous support of the Sobrato Family Foundation. The series is written and produced by Paul Richman and by me, Jason Willis. Sound, mixing and original music are by Tommy Dunbar. John Diaz develops our related written materials – be sure to check those out online and in our show notes.
And be sure to subscribe to this series wherever you access your podcasts.
We’ll see you out there….