Everyone has heard a myth or two about cancer (hello, sugar!) The American Society of Clinical Oncology (ASCO) published eight "Myths and Facts About Cancer." Some of the myths they brought up were ones we've heard from patients, others...kind of cringey. We thought we should tackle them one by one. Not surprisingly, there is often a vein of truth that keeps these so-called myths alive.
Tina and Leah have decades of experience as naturopathic physicians and have sifted through the data, so you don't have to! Just hit "play" and enjoy the show! We promise it's entertaining, at the very least.
ASCO's 8 Myths and Facts About Cancer
Spider Legs in Bubble Gum?
Oh, that's a myth, alright. Link to the truth re: spider legs in bubble gum.
Link to our previous episode on sugar-- E58: Does Sugar Feed Cancer?
Our website:
https://www.thecancerpod.com
Have an idea or question? Email us: thecancerpod@gmail.com
Join our growing community, we are @TheCancerPod on:
THANK YOU for listening!
Everyone has heard a myth or two about cancer (hello, sugar!) The American Society of Clinical Oncology (ASCO) published eight "Myths and Facts About Cancer." Some of the myths they brought up were ones we've heard from patients, others...kind of cringey. We thought we should tackle them one by one. Not surprisingly, there is often a vein of truth that keeps these so-called myths alive.
Tina and Leah have decades of experience as naturopathic physicians and have sifted through the data, so you don't have to! Just hit "play" and enjoy the show! We promise it's entertaining, at the very least.
ASCO's 8 Myths and Facts About Cancer
Spider Legs in Bubble Gum?
Oh, that's a myth, alright. Link to the truth re: spider legs in bubble gum.
Link to our previous episode on sugar-- E58: Does Sugar Feed Cancer?
Our website:
https://www.thecancerpod.com
Have an idea or question? Email us: thecancerpod@gmail.com
Join our growing community, we are @TheCancerPod on:
THANK YOU for listening!
If I knew the cure for cancer, I wouldn't be selling it. I would be handing it out on the corner to everybody.
Tina:Oh, I told people I would have a giant sanatorium on a hill where you check in the front door with cancer and, whatever it takes, we get rid of it, and you check out the back door without it, like if I knew how to cure cancer, I would just create a facility to do just that, like a factory, just cranking them in, cranking them out. Yeah, just come on in the front door, we'll cure you, we'll send you home out the back door. I'm Dr Tina Keizer and, as Lea likes to say, I'm the sciencey one, and I'm Dr Lea Sherman and I'm the Cancer Insider and we're two naturopathic doctors who practice integrative cancer care, but we're not your doctors. This is for education, entertainment and informational purposes only.
Leah:Do not apply any of this information without first speaking to your doctor.
Tina:The views and opinions expressed on this podcast by the hosts and their guests are solely their own.
Leah:Welcome to the Cancer Pod.
Tina:Hey, lea, did you see the eight myths about cancer that was put out by the American Society of Clinical Oncology?
Leah:Only because you told me to, because that's what we're talking about today. I hadn't seen it beforehand, but I did do a search to find it and apparently there are also 10 myths and 12 myths, 15 myths, I don't know. So there are a lot of myths out there about cancer.
Tina:My thought is, since they're myths, it's almost an indefinite number, because you could just make them up.
Leah:Oh totally.
Tina:48 myths about cancer and just Just name random things. Yeah, yeah, you grew up with a dog. You grew up without a dog. You did this, you did that and since it's a myth, there's no limit.
Leah:Yeah like remember the spider legs in Bubblicious? That was like a urban myth. No, I do not. These aren't really urban myths. Oh yeah, when I was a kid, that Bubblishus bulgum, apparently there were spider legs in it, which was never true. I never saw anything that said it wasn't.
Tina:We'll never know.
Leah:Yeah. So these myths, they're kind of interesting because some of them, I think, are like old school thought.
Tina:Mm-hmm.
Leah:But I guess people don't really know. We know stuff because this is what we do, and there are people out there who probably still believe the things Like remember I don't know, I'm old enough to remember when people would talk about cancer they would whisper it you didn't talk about cancer. It was like so-and-so's grandma died from cancer. And so I think the more that people are talking about cancer and it's more out there, it's so, unfortunately, so commonplace that a lot of these myths aren't so mythical.
Tina:Yeah, and when anything is reduced to one line, like the myths we go through by ASCO are found on a PDF that they recommend people look at. When anything is reduced to one line, it's often an oversimplification, so that I may or may not agree with every myth. Like some of these myths, I was like well, can you really call that a myth? There is some truism to that.
Leah:Right, it's like a headline. Right, it's like we're just trying to grab you.
Tina:Yes, yes, and of course, very little is completely black and white. I mean, it really is a massive gray area and a lot of things depend on context, and so reducing anything to a list is tough to do, unless it's like blatant myths.
Leah:Cancer was created by aliens to control us Like that Exactly. Now, that's a myth, is it? Show me the evidence to prove otherwise. I did my own research.
Tina:Tina, that's a whole different show. Aliens and Cancer. Let's just go to the first. What's the first myth?
Leah:All right. The first myth is cancer is contagious.
Tina:Now, if you're a veterinarian and you see animals, this is true of some cancers in the animal kingdom, is it really? Yeah, yeah, some of them are contagious, but we won't talk about that.
Leah:Wait, hold on, we're going to have to talk about this in the sidebar.
Tina:I'm really curious. Look up Tasmanian Devil on Google. But in people, cancer itself is not contagious. But we should say what ASCO says, because I do agree with ASCO on this one Cancer is not contagious, but some of the organisms that give you a higher risk of developing cancers are contagious, right?
Leah:And if you have had exposure to one of these organisms, it's not 100% guaranteed that you're going to get cancer.
Tina:No, just raises your risk of developing it. So the classic example is human papilloma virus, better known as HPV. Hpv virus has been known to be underlying cause for squamous cell cancers, which is probably most well known as cervical cancer, but that includes anal cancers. It includes some throat cancers. Anywhere there's squamous cells in the body, HPV can induce a cancer and, like you just said, the presence of HPV doesn't do it. There's different types of HPV. They number them, so there's 16, 33, 18, et cetera. Some of those are more cancer causing than others. Pap smears are a classic example of trying to find HPV and remove pre-cancerous lesions. They'll test If there's HPV present, they'll then subtype it and say is it any of the most high risk forms of HPV? Now, the HPV is contagious right through sexual contact in that case, but the cancer is not the cancer itself isn't Right, right and that's like.
Leah:So liver cancer one of the possible causes of liver cancer is the hepatitis virus and it's hepatitis B and C, and there is a vaccine for B, there's nothing for C. The cool thing, the cool thing, the cool thing about hepatitis C is now there are treatments you can get that it's a really, really great, effective treatment. So hepatitis A, which is the one that you get from food, typically that's not implicated in developing liver cancer.
Tina:Right, and so, while the virus is, whether it's A, B or C, while those can be transmitted between people in various ways, whether it's through food or through blood products or sexual contact, however it's transmitted between people, that's contagious, raises the risk of that liver cancer, but the liver cancer is not contagious.
Leah:Yeah, so the myth itself, cancer itself is not contagious. But the? What do you call it? Starting point, what would you call it? The catalyst, the? Is that you like that word? You're nodding, I'll buy that. Okay, so the catalyst for certain cancers may be contagious, like H pylori, right, the bacteria that is resides in one stomach. That can potentially lead to stomach cancer. But there are a bunch of people that have H pylori that are never going to get stomach cancer.
Tina:Exactly. All right, so we agree with them. Cancer is not contagious.
Leah:It's not contagious.
Tina:Well, you agree with ASCO. Okay, let's go to the second one. Here's the myth If you have a family history of cancer, you will get it too.
Leah:It depends, right? I mean, if you have a family history of cancer and it's something that is because it's genetic, you may have an increased risk and appropriate screenings would be advised. But you're not even guaranteed. Even if somebody tests positive for, let's say, the barocca gene, which increases your risk of several different kinds of cancer, most popularly breast cancer, it doesn't mean that you're going to get cancer.
Tina:Agreed. Yeah, so what they're saying is the myth that people believe is, if your family has a history of cancer, you will get it too. That's what they're calling a myth. Again, this is one of those. How do you even begin to make a blanket statement? Because, in the case you're stating with barocca, you might have an 80% chance of having breast cancer if you have a certain baraca mutation, or even 60 or 65% for ovarian with certain baraca mutations, but it's not 100%. So you can't make a statement that says you will get it too, because that means two or four out of 10 won't get it, even though they carry a very high risk gene for it.
Leah:Yeah, and so I think that's where naturopathic and integrative oncology come into play, in that there are things that somebody can do to help to further reduce their risk. But even that's not a guarantee, because we're just reducing the risk, we're not preventing.
Tina:Right, and you and Asko agree on that, because that's exactly what they write. Under that myth they're said things like exercising, limiting alcohol and avoiding tobacco products and maintaining a normal weight All of those will reduce your risk, regardless of your family history. So that's an interesting one. I think the thing with you and me is we individualize treatment, so it's hard to make any blanket statements anyways, because we're always sitting with an individual and looking at that person's risk like what is it? Is it genetic? Is it other risk factors that they're carrying? Yeah, and I would add reducing stress yeah, important for so many reasons. Yeah, yeah. So it is a myth. If you have a family history of cancer, you will get it too. Agreed, it's a myth and the individual scenario will dictate how strong that myth is or how much to dismiss that idea. Right.
Leah:Yeah, so the next one is cancer thrives on sugar.
Tina:This is why I wanted to do this list.
Leah:Really, we already talked about this. We have a whole episode on this.
Tina:I know, but what if someone didn't hear the whole episode on sugar?
Leah:Well, listen to today's episode all the way to the end and then go back and listen to. I don't remember what episode it was, it wasn't that long ago, but go back, you'll see it. It says it's one of our myth-busting episodes.
Tina:Does sugar cause cancer?
Leah:Yeah, so okay, let's do a quick summary of this.
Tina:Okay, basically, asco says this is a myth. Cancer thrives on sugar. Fact this is according to ASCO, there's no conclusive evidence that proves eating sugar will make cancer grow and spread more quickly. All cells in the body healthy and cancer cells depend on sugar to grow and function. No proof that eating sugar will speed up the growth of cancer or that cutting out sugar completely will slow down its growth. And then it goes on to say this doesn't mean you should eat a high sugar diet.
Tina:Too many calories from sugars linked to weight gain, obesity, diabetes and those increase the risk of developing cancer and other health problems. So that is the ASCO party line. I pretty much agree with that. I would still say in my observation, regardless of studies, when people keep their blood glucose on the lower end, they do better, and maybe that has to do with reducing inflammation and this is with cancer present. These are people who have metastatic cancer or they're going through treatment. But if you can keep the blood glucose on a lower end and still feel fine, of course you don't want to tank your glucose to the point where you don't feel well. To me, I mean, my best outcomes over the years have been in patients who are capable of doing that and made that a reflection of an overall system that works better. Or maybe it's a coincidence, but I can just tell you that's my observation.
Leah:Yeah, I mean it could be a combination of all the other things that you are doing with those patients. But if somebody has done a lot to reduce, I'm going to talk about it being like refined sugars. I'm not talking about fruit. I've had patients who are like I avoid all sugar and I don't eat any fruit. So, yeah, I would just say avoiding those refined sugars. But then if you have something every once in a while I mean, we've talked about the effect of dysregulated blood sugar on side effects like fatigue and hot flashes. So it's not necessarily like I went to a birthday party, I ate a piece of birthday cake and now I have cancer spread throughout my body. That's not how it works, right? No, you know, if all you're doing is eating packaged processed sweets and maybe you're nauseated and that's all that makes you feel better, you know, talk with someone, talk with a professional who can find alternatives that might provide you with a little bit more nutrition.
Tina:And how do you control your blood sugar Right? So I'm always about the glucose, because the cells in the body have no idea what you put in your mouth. Whether you just had a glass of apple cider or a glass of Coca-Cola, if the amount of sugar is very similar, the cells in your body don't know the difference. My point is just because it's a natural sugar doesn't mean it's always a pass. It has to do with how your body handles sugar. Like can you have apple cider and not have blood glucose go really high?
Leah:Well, and that's where it comes into. Like, what are you having that with Right? Another thing I have said before on the show and I say to my patients is have sugar with a meal, not as a meal. So waking up in the morning having a glass of orange juice as your breakfast, that's not, I mean, that's not good for anybody. No, that's a lot of sugar. There's no fiber, fat or protein to help your body to slow down that sugar metabolism.
Tina:So wasn't it? That was that the episode where we came up with the term naked carbs? Oh, I don't remember. No, I'm pretty sure you declared it to. You know, one of your next t-shirts, or something.
Leah:It could have been this memory. This memory isn't what it used to be. I'll go with it. Your memory is good, We'll go with it. Yeah, naked carbs. I remember when I came up with that.
Tina:Oh yeah, no naked carbs.
Leah:Hashtag trademark. Ok, let's move on. Next one you read it OK.
Tina:The next myth Cancer treatment is usually worse than the disease. Leia.
Leah:Inserting crickets chirping. I will say, as someone who was diagnosed with early stage breast cancer and really had no symptoms other than a lump, yeah, my chemo sucked. And so, at the stage cancer that I was diagnosed, yeah, the treatment was bad. Would I not do it if I were to do it again? No, I'd still do the treatment. But and I've heard this from other people too patients who maybe just had surgery for their cancer I'm not gonna say just had surgery, surgery is a big deal but patient whose only treatment was surgery, the recovery time can feel a lot worse than one felt possibly before the cancer was removed. Same with radiation. You know like it's. I like what Asco says. This is what they say.
Leah:Although cancer treatments such as chemotherapy and radiation can cause unpleasant and sometimes serious side effects, recent advances have resulted in many drugs and radiation treatments that have more manageable side effects. That is true, but there still are old school treatments being used and not everyone responds to the anti nausea medications that they're prescribed. Not everyone has access to somebody who practices integrative oncology and can help to manage the side effects. Right, yeah, I mean, I'm thinking of one person in particular who was diagnosed with a brain tumor and had it removed with surgery and was having so many problems after surgery and they're just like I feel worse, mm, hmm, but at the same time, if your treatment is extending your life, yeah, I think you bring up a good point.
Tina:What's the disease process? How early are we catching it? How is this going to change the trajectory for that particular person, their prognosis? So I think to myself, if someone doesn't get the intervention let's just say someone and I have had this happen where patients don't want to get their breast lump removed or they don't want to have a surgery and they want to do something totally naturally, what they're not privy to is the trajectory of that if you don't get the intervention Right.
Tina:So so it's kind of like a fire you have to go through like like to get to the other side of it, to be on the other side of it, to be on the other side of treatment and hopefully without any cancer left in your body. In this earlier stages of cancer, certainly the decision to do the treatment is because you're trying to eradicate the disease. I think it's similar to getting through the fire because you do have to get through a tougher time. You might be perfectly healthy and have cancer sitting in front of me. Perfectly healthy, you exercise, you eat. Well, it happens, right, cancer just happens sometimes. And then you go through treatment and you feel like crap. Through treatment. The idea, hopefully, is to get you back to that first day we were sitting together and now you're cancer free and you feel great. So yeah, but that's the privilege of people who are caught early. Their disease process is caught early.
Tina:People with metastatic cancer, people with tumors that are so extensive in their body that the treatment may or may not extend their life, have a different decision to make, right? So sometimes you know there are actually studies, and this was before the immune agents, but I will share with you. There were studies before the immune agents for lung cancer. There was a classic study that showed people with lung cancer who just went into basically supportive care and no active conventional care lived longer than those who took the chemo. Now we have immune therapies, thankfully, and that's a totally different decision to make, but at the time that was really profound, that just supportive care. Those people lived longer and of course they had a better quality of life because they weren't going through chemo. So back to the myth cancer treatment is usually worse than the disease. There's some truism to that for the case of early cancers, but it's worth it at the same time because then you're hopefully without it in the end.
Leah:Yeah, and I mean we've had our patients who had advanced cancers that when they received their treatment it may have been hard as they were going through it, and then they feel this relief, or even as they're going through it, they're like I can breathe. Yeah, I have this radiation burn, but I can breathe now.
Tina:Quality of life counts as part of this decision, especially for later stages.
Leah:Yeah, so this is the plug for what we do. This is why you see someone who is well-versed in managing the side effects of cancer treatment and is up to date as to what cancer treatments are.
Tina:Yeah, yeah, it's a lot to know about being an integrative oncology requires any practitioner. I don't care what letters are after their name, what their degrees are. You have to be steeped in both conventional and the alternative world and know when, regardless of philosophy or paradigm that you ascribe to, what is best for the patient at any given time. Sometimes conventional medicine is the best thing to do. Sometimes you go out and you take a break from conventional for three months or six months and you get yourself all healthy again so that you can extend your life and improve your quality. So this is why, yeah, working with someone who knows the landscape is so essential, because most people are going through it for the first time. They don't know the cancer landscape, so how would you possibly navigate it if you haven't been there? So that's what. And we don't even practice. We're not even pushing our own practices just for the listener out there. It's not like we're taking new patients, either one of us.
Leah:Oh yeah, that's right, because I'm back in retirement, yeah.
Tina:So I just want to make that clear. This is not a commercial for ourselves. We're not pushing you to our clinic.
Leah:Call 1-800-TINA-IN-LEIA.
Tina:So there's the Oncology Association of Naturopathic Physicians. There is.
Leah:Society for Integrative Oncology yeah. The functional medicine practitioners yeah.
Tina:All of them so we can link to some of those so people can find maybe some trained practitioners out there.
Leah:If anyone's in your area or you can do a remote consultation sometimes Okay, we're going to take a break and then we're going to come back with the last four.
Tina:All right.
Leah:We are back. We are talking about the ASCO 8 myths about cancer and we are on number 5. Tina, take it away.
Tina:All right. Myth number 5. It is easier to remain unaware you have cancer. That's the myth. I guess some people must believe that it's easier to remain unaware you have cancer. I guess this is like not getting a screening, not looking at something or having an abnormal mole and just kind of ignoring it, that kind of thing.
Leah:So this one's just Okay. I've never heard this as a myth Like oh, it's better to know that you don't have cancer.
Tina:I think this might be denial. I think this is kind of like the if it ain't broke, don't fix it, kind of thing.
Leah:Well, I'm reading the fact, because I didn't read the facts before. Okay, so what they say is you should not ignore the symptoms or sign of cancer, such as a breast lump or an abnormal looking mole. So, yeah, okay, I can see where somebody would think like, oh, this lump is just going to go away. Oh, this lump on my leg, it's nothing. Yeah, no, like, get it checked out.
Tina:I would call this myth. Denial is a perfectly fine way of coping, because it's not that you're remaining unaware, it's that you're ignoring something that's going on, which means you are aware that there is a lump or an abnormal looking mole. You're deciding to do nothing about it. So it's not. It's worded funny. It's easier to remain unaware. You have cancer is a weird way of putting it.
Leah:Yeah, because you want your cancer to be caught as early as possible.
Tina:But some people do kick the can down the road and they're like oh, that's just hemorrhoid, that blood in my stool.
Leah:Right, or I've had that mole my whole life. I mean, I'm getting older, just changed how it looks, yeah. Or they could be like me, who had all of the services available to me and I was like, oh, I'll get to that, I'll get to that. My dad's in the hospital, my dad's sick, my dad's dying, I'll get to that, I'll get to that. Putting yourself second is not good, so yeah. So if you have something going on, even though you've got life going on around you, check in, make sure that you take care of yourself. But same with my mom, right, my mom had indigestion and a lot of digestive issues as my dad was going through treatment, as I was going through treatment, and she was seeking help but was going kind of the wrong path, but none of us knew that she had ovarian cancer and those were the signs, and so it was just kind of like putting it off while my dad was in the hospital and yeah.
Leah:I tend to make this show about me, don't I? This is like my therapy session.
Tina:Well, you do have a lot more cancer in your immediate past than I do. Well, there you go. There's that. Plus, you're relatable. I'm the geeky one that you know on the side.
Leah:All right, as we laugh, I'm going to read the next one Myth my attitude will have an effect on my cancer. So what they say is there's no scientific evidence that a positive attitude will prevent cancer, help people with cancer live longer or keep cancer from coming back. However, things that promote positive thinking, such as relaxation techniques, support groups and a support network of family and friends, may improve a person's quality of life and outlook. We're inserting more crickets Tripping. What's going on?
Tina:here. Well. And then the next line said it is important to remember that placing such importance on attitude may lead to unnecessary guilt and disappointment for reasons beyond your control, if your health does not improve.
Leah:I mean, I have had patients with the most wonderful positive outlook throughout their treatment and it didn't change their final outcome, their life throughout. I'm thinking of one in particular and I'm going to get emotional because I really, really loved this patient. She was very positive, she was kind of the backbone of the family, the matriarch, as one would say. Even when she was in the hospital and she was going to transition to hospice, she was talking about things like I need to get my husband all of the passwords and he doesn't. I take care of all the banking. She still had this amazing, matter of fact, positive attitude that, honestly, I don't think I would be able to have. But that was her. She passed. It wasn't something that I don't know. It didn't change the outcome, but her life throughout treatment, I don't know, she was living her life. She was going to Vegas, she was doing family event, I don't know.
Tina:Yeah, if the myth is, my attitude will have an effect on my cancer. Our emotional selves. We can't separate our molecules of emotion that run throughout our bodies, our neurotransmitters, and all that from our physical self. They're so intertwined. While you can't will yourself to live or have such a positive attitude, your cancer goes away. That's not going to happen.
Tina:There are effects of our emotional state of being that affects our immune system. It affects even the cancer cells directly, because I can think of cancers like ovarian cancer that have more receptors for neurotransmitters on the actual cancer cells. It's tough. It's a tough line to walk because you can't control your cancer with your emotional self. Necessarily I don't think you can probably affect your overall physiology, but probably, like you can with a little nutrition changes. There's like diet, exercise, emotional well-being. They all affect your physiology and they're all going to have some effect. They're not going to be miraculous as a one-stop shop kind of thing. I don't completely agree with this myth. They're calling it a myth. This is an untruth. My attitude will have an effect on my cancer. I do think it affects the cancer, even directly.
Leah:I know that people who have a social network, a sense of community, fair, better. But you could have a great attitude and not have that, and you can have social network and have a poor attitude.
Tina:Which is why I say it's really hard to make absolute statements in anything in cancer care because it's all gray, it's like a few degrees left, a few degrees right it might affect the trajectory or your prognosis and you can make those decisions. I've had people who said I know smoking is not what I should be doing right now, but I love smoking and I don't care about the quantity of my life, I only care about the quality, and smoking means that much to me. That's their prerogative. It may not be the choice I would make for my own body and my own self, but there's kind of like that I think about it with like this you try to be positive, you try to do everything you can and then you let go. It may affect it, it may not affect it, but all you have is your quality of life. You do have some control of your quality of life on a day to day.
Leah:We're not talking about toxic positivity. There's no place for that.
Tina:I don't even see that because I'm not really a social media person, but I feel like that's where it's displayed the most toxic positivity. I just had chemo and I'm doing cartwheels on the beach.
Leah:That was my thing, that's my story, I know, you know that's my story.
Tina:I know.
Leah:I think I did try to portray myself as positive when I was making my videos, but I think I was also kind of real. I had a different perspective of what my treatment would be because I was familiar with it.
Tina:Yeah, Authenticity over toxic positivity, or inauthentic positivity for that matter.
Leah:There's no need you could have a positive attitude and still have realistic emotions and down days and all of that kind of stuff. I think of it more like doing things that help you to reduce stress, to help to quell anxiety.
Tina:Maybe that's not attitude that still plays a big part, maybe that's it, I think of attitude as kind of enmeshed in your mood, right? So anxiety, depression, anxiety in particular, can be detrimental to the body because the cortisol levels are high and there's definitely data on high cortisol in various cancers, whether it's metastatic breast cancer or ovarian cancer. I know there's kidney cancer, high cortisol levels, which is associated with stress and insomnia. By the way, it's bad for your prognosis. People who have really high cortisol don't have as good a prognosis as those who can take their anxiety down, their cortisol levels down. So is that attitude, is that mood? I guess technically I may be conflating the two.
Leah:Yeah, I think yeah, I think that the attitude thing it's like I don't know, my dad had a really positive attitude. Yeah, I didn't get him very far, right? Okay, let's move on, because I'm getting bummed. I'm getting bummed out here.
Tina:I like the next one. You go for it. Drug companies, the government and the medical establishment are hiding a cure for cancer. That's true. I feel like that deserves some kind of ominous music or something no one is withholding a cure for cancer.
Leah:I used to tell patients that when they would say that to me, I would say you know, if I had the cure for cancer, if I was, like you know, being a naturopathic doctor, people are like you know how to cure cancer naturally. Of course you do. I was like if I knew the cure for cancer, I wouldn't be selling it, I would be handing it out on the corner to everybody.
Tina:Oh, I told people I would have a giant sanatorium on a hill where you check in the front door with cancer and whatever it takes, we get rid of it, and you check out the back door without it. If I knew how to cure cancer, I would just create a facility to do just that.
Leah:Like a factory just cranking them in cranking them out.
Tina:Yeah, just come on in the front door, we'll cure you, we'll send you home out the back door.
Leah:Yeah, and then, in terms of drug companies, the government and the medical establishment, hiding a cure, hiding a cure, and oftentimes that cure is something natural, is what I hear.
Tina:Oh yeah, or it's Non-profitable.
Leah:Yeah, there's no money behind it, or it's. It's horse dewormer.
Tina:And the antiparasitics. Well, I will say this money drives research and it is skewed. There's no meritocracy within research. It's not like, oh, the best idea wins the research grant. That's not how it works. So there is some very small vanatruth in that we don't look and we will never discover anything where there's no research being done.
Leah:Okay so I don't think that's hiding a cure. It's not like there's a cure behind a door in a vault. That exists and they're keeping it. It's more money talks and, yeah, it's a very messed up system. Looking at the cost of these drugs to keep people alive, the daily cost of these drugs is astronomical. That's a whole other show that I don't even I mean yeah, that's a whole other thing, but I'll give you that. Yeah, it's not like in the basement of the Capitol building there's some troll protecting a bridge that under that bridge is the cure for cancer. It's not true, or? You hear that a lot. I've heard it with people talking about leitreal. Well, you know that. What was it? Sloan Kettering or Mayo, or whoever did the research is hiding that data, sloan. That data is not out there. Oh, the data is out there.
Tina:Yeah, I think it's more of a. They're not hiding a cure because that implies that they know the cure. That's the difference. They're not hiding a cure because I don't think they know a cure to hide because it's cancer. So many things I will say. There is a look away. Put the spotlight over here, not over there, because research dollars are basically just lights that we use to shine facts through clinical trials, through basic sciences. Like you need the money to do the research, and if you don't have money flowing towards immunology which we didn't prior to the 2000s then we found nothing.
Tina:No one really researched immunology. As a matter of fact, when I was a resident 2001, I was told the immune system has literally nothing to do with it. I know that's a ludicrous idea now and no medical oncologist would ever say that now, because now there are drugs that are immune agents that we are treating cancer with. And I was floored the first time a doctor says to me wouldn't you know it? Look at that. We can actually use. This is an epiphany for them. We can use the immune system as part of our treatment and actually fight cancer with the immune system. And from a naturopathic perspective, every naturopath out there would say in unison no duh, but there was nothing in the research because the light, the research dollars, which shines the light on the facts for them was never turned on in that direction until relatively recently, you know last 15 years. So I'm not saying that they're hiding a cure, so much as they may not always be looking really hard to cure it, so much as treat it.
Leah:And the ASCO fact also mentions that there isn't a single cure for cancer, because there are so many different types of cancer that anyone who says that there is a cure for all types of cancer is full of who we.
Tina:Full of who we. Yes, Anything they say works 100% of the time, I don't care who they are alternative or conventional. 100% of the time will not happen. Yeah All right.
Leah:Last one. Last one If I'm not offered all of the tests, procedures and treatments available, I am not getting the best cancer care.
Tina:Well, this is nuanced, isn't it?
Leah:Well, I mean, I have had patients ask like, why aren't I getting this, this certain test or this certain you know scan? And you know they knew someone who got that, but their cancer was different or a different stage. So there are guidelines as to what procedures and tests you know and treatments are given in the conventional world. There are guidelines, so you're, and also insurance. Your insurance may not cover these things. I mean, I had never seen this. I had not seen this when I was at CTCA, but there were insurance companies that wouldn't cover certain anti-nausea medications. They wouldn't cover the new LASDA. So, yeah, you might not have the insurance if you're not getting all the tests that's possible but then also if they're not always indicated, sometimes maybe you do need those tests. Because I'm looking at your face right now.
Tina:Well, it's tough because I think it's regional. I do. I've talked to people around the nation doing remote consultations and I can tell you the term standard of care is a loose definition because there's a lot of leeway within standards of care and I do think insurance affects this tremendously. So somebody who has only Medicare will not get the same treatment as someone who has Medicare plus other coverage with a private insurer. So here's the myth again If I'm not offered all the tests, procedures and treatments available, I'm not getting the best care. I don't know if it's a myth, so much as sometimes it's true and sometimes it's not.
Tina:I do think that we should all of us, every practitioner out there, should explain why someone's getting a test and why they're not getting another test, right, right. So there should be. I always feel like cancer centers should always have a liaison of some kind. I don't care what they call it nurse navigator, patient navigator, liaison but someone who can relieve people of this idea. So let's just say someone's worried that they're not getting all the tests and they're not getting all the available treatments. The liaison can say well, let me talk to your care team and find out why you're not getting X, y or Z that you heard from your neighbor, or they might know the answer and be like because you have this cancer, they had that cancer. I don't know. I feel like this is a communication thing. I think so too.
Leah:I think that, yeah, I have worked with oncologists who are really good at explaining why you're getting this procedure, why you're not getting this type of imaging. I have worked with doctors who do that. Not all doctors have the time. So I think that, yeah, the idea of having someone that is part of the cancer center who can field those questions and maybe a patient has thought of a test that might actually be beneficial or something I mean, who knows they might have a provider who said, oh, you should consider getting this test, having a doctor who's open to listening to those options and not being dismissive, I think is important. Agreed, that's it. That's our list, that's their list, that's Asco's list and that's our take on it.
Tina:So you know what's interesting is whenever you oversimplify anything in cancer care. I don't care if you're conventional or you're natural-minded, but oversimplifications get us in trouble, because often there can be a little vein of truth. Like this says sugar doesn't advance cancer. I was like well, as you and I have talked about in that whole episode sugar feeds cancers more complicated than just a blanket statement like that. So there's a vein of truth in some things, especially ideas that have been perpetuated for generations, and so we got to look hard to say okay, what's the truth behind it and why is this perpetuated as an idea? If it's completely false, shouldn't it have shrilled up on the vine and we shouldn't even be talking about it then? That's my two cents. I don't care if you're natural or conventionally-minded, but if it's oversimplified, beware.
Leah:Episode 58. Does sugar feed?
Tina:cancer. 58. Okay, truth about sugar. I don't know, I just I had to look it up. I had to look it up, that's all right. It was going to bother you if you didn't look it up.
Leah:It was going to bother me if I didn't look it up. All right, so are there any myths that you have heard about cancer? If so, send us a message. Send us an email. You can message us through Instagram. We are now on threads cheering Yay, we've advanced. Oh, you didn't know, I've never been heard of threads.
Tina:Threads is what Twitter used to be. Threads is what Twitter used to be. So who runs it? Who runs it? Is it Instagram? Is that what it runs? Instagram and Facebook.
Leah:Yeah, it's the non, it seems to. Speaking of positive attitude, it seems to be very positive, very much a sense of community, more so than what Twitter has become. So, with the, I'm telling you this now oh, guess what, tina? Yeah, with the possibility of Twitter charging to belong. Yeah, I just, I, just I did it, I joined threads, so we're on threads All right.
Tina:You can update me on that on occasion. I doubt I'm going to look at it. I'll look at it. I'll take that back. I'll look at it if you tell me that it's relevant to look at I just did it yesterday, so we're finding out, we're going to find out. And meanwhile we are still on Twitter, instagram, facebook and you just signed us up for LinkedIn, I saw.
Leah:Yes, and we are on LinkedIn by the time this comes out. We may not be on Twitter because Twitter might be charging to be long. And there you go, we're outie, all right.
Tina:We're outie 5000. All right, oh, and on our website, if you go to our website, which is thecancerpodcom, there's also a microphone on the right hand side. So if you want to leave an audio message you have a myth you want to share with us, or a question like is this true or isn't it true? I've heard debate out there Just hit the microphone and you can leave us that as an audio and we will play it on the podcast, with your permission. Well, cool.
Leah:And we've gotten a few messages through the website, so that's nice too. It's nice to hear from y'all and get some feedback. So share this episode with somebody who you think might learn something. And you can always buy us a coffee. It's the weather's getting cold, we need our coffee.
Tina:There it comes.
Tina:It's always coffee weather, but you know yeah, yeah, if you could just hit even if you don't leave a review hit the five stars. That also helps bump us up and help people find us, and you can do that. On our website too. There's a little spot that says help us, help others. You can leave a little review there and we will put that out there in the world. And, yeah, it's all about helping more people. So, wherever you're listening right now, go in and give us a five star. In a couple words Great, that'd be awesome.
Leah:So on that note, I'm Dr Lea Sherman.
Tina:And I'm Dr Tina Kaser. And this is the Cancer Pod Until next time. Thanks for listening to the Cancer Pod.
Leah:Remember to subscribe, review and rate us wherever you get your podcasts. Follow us on social media for updates and, as always, this is not medical advice. These are our opinions. Talk to your doctor before changing anything related to your treatment plan. The Cancer Pod is hosted by me, dr Lea Sherman, and by Dr Tina Kaser. Music is by Kevin McLeod. See you next time. All right, I don't know why I'm laughing.