Joey Pinz Discipline Conversations

#846 CyberBay 2026 - Sandy Kronenberg: 🚨 When AI Can Pretend to Be You

• Joey Pinz • Episode 846

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Artificial intelligence is transforming the world—but it’s also creating new cybersecurity threats most organizations aren’t prepared for.

In this episode of the Joey Pinz Conversations Podcast, Joey Pinz sits down with cybersecurity innovator Sandy Kronenberg to explore the rapidly growing danger of AI impersonation, deepfakes, and social engineering attacks.

Many of the largest cyber breaches today don’t begin with sophisticated malware—they start with human trust. A convincing email, a fake Zoom call, or even an AI-generated voice can trick employees into approving payments or exposing sensitive data.

Sandy explains why traditional cybersecurity tools like firewalls and antivirus are no longer enough. A new category called “Disinformation Security” is emerging to protect organizations from deepfakes, impersonation attacks, and AI-generated fraud.

The conversation also dives into the future of AI, the coming impact of quantum computing, and why verifying identity across digital communication channels will become essential.

Joey and Sandy also discuss entrepreneurship, building companies in the tech industry, and how personal habits—like fitness and routine—play a major role in long-term success.

If you want to understand how AI is reshaping cybersecurity, trust, and digital identity, this episode delivers powerful insights.

 

🔑 Top 3 Highlights

🔥 1. The Human Layer of Cybersecurity

Most cyber breaches involve a human mistake—not a technical failure.

🤖 2. Deepfakes & AI Impersonation Are Accelerating

Just a photo and seconds of audio can allow someone to convincingly impersonate another person.

🔐 3. A New Cybersecurity Category Is Emerging

“Disinformation Security” aims to detect fake identities, deepfakes, and social engineering attacks in real time.

 

 

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Hosted by Joey Pinz, this Discipline Conversations Podcast offers insights and inspiration.

 

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SPEAKER_01

Cyber Bay 2026. What a great event this was uh here in March in Tampa of 2026. Uh of course Arnie Bellini heads this great, great initiative for uh Tampa Bay here. But the Cyber Bay uh 2026 event was excellent. Uh lots of great attendees, a great mix of attendees, great keynotes, great breakouts, and of course great vendors. And I was there, had had four great conversations, wonderful conversations. Uh Sandy Cronenberg started it off uh when AI can pretend to be you. Very interesting discussion with Sandy on that. Kat, Kat Carol, very, really, really intriguing uh woman. I really enjoyed our conversation. AI scams are exploding. Are you ready? Very, very uh interesting conversations. Then of course with Linda Nihon of oh, incredible science, policy, and smart work in a changing world. Do you understand what it means, these policy departments and universities and what they do? I didn't. She sheds great light on it, great insight, wonderful talking to Linda. And then lastly, oh Kendra Siler, really, really interesting talking with Kendra. How art, AI, and neuroscience shape the human mind. Really great conversation with Kendra. I wish her well and thank you all for your time. And thank you for watching and listening. Hi, I'm Joey Pins. And here's my 45-second introduction. After starting my business in the 90s, I started developing poor habits of eating in my diet because of working way too much. Before you know it, I found myself 340 pounds. The doctor told me if I don't lose the weight, I'm not gonna see my daughter graduate. Took the next seven months, lost 130 pounds. People think there's some secret. Ask me, how'd you lose that weight? Like there's some secret. There is no secret. How'd I lose the weight? Just one word. Discipline. I've had other successes in life, and I attribute them all to discipline. Now I'm not the king of discipline, but I believe that it can help all of us. Friends, colleagues convinced me to start a podcast. The podcast mission: how do we better ourselves and society? I talked to interesting people in health, fitness, sport, wellness, business, technology, science, art, and culture. And I eventually asked them how discipline plays a role in their life. Podcast vision, growth through learning from others.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_01

So you're a hockey player?

SPEAKER_03

Yes, sir. Just uh pickup, nothing crazy. It's something I picked up in my 30s.

SPEAKER_01

I was gonna say, you you don't have the you don't have the frame, it would seem.

SPEAKER_03

Well, actually, uh, you know, I was uh in New York and uh the great one uh was standing right next to me and I was looking down at him. So uh Yeah, he's not that big.

SPEAKER_01

It's a really good point. Wayne Gretzky is not that big.

SPEAKER_03

All the boys now are huge.

SPEAKER_01

In this fast-paced MSP landscape, how do you stay ahead? Introducing Msp Influencer.com, your ultimate hub for MSP news, insights, and community connection powered by Forza Dash. More than 75,000 MSP subscribed to our MSP Influencer Pulse weekly newsletter, staying informed and ahead of industry trends. Tune in to emerging podcasts from Joey Penns and leading MSP voices, offering essential tips, powerful insights, and success stories. Explore our multi-authored blogs, crafted specifically for MSP leaders, delivering fresh perspectives and actionable strategies. Celebrate excellence with the industry leading Forza Dash MSP Influence Awards, recognizing innovation, leadership, and impact in the MSP community. Join thousands of MSP professionals who trust MSP Influencer.com to grow their business and expand their networks. MSP Influencer.com, where today's MSP leaders connect, collaborate, and conquer, all powered by the Forza Dash platform, helping MSP vendors work effectively with MSPs and helping MSPs grow. They are huge, they're fast, yeah. It's very different. It's incredible. Yeah, are you Red Wings? So you're a Michigan guy. I assume you're Red Wings. Yeah. Yeah. It's uh hockey's in a pretty good state right now after the Olympics, and we have the lightning here. It gets a lot of follow here in Tampa.

SPEAKER_03

Oh, for sure. For sure.

SPEAKER_01

Plus they won Stanley Cups, that helps. Of course. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It really helps. We're here at Cyber Bay here for the big event. What are some of your goals this week, Sandy?

SPEAKER_03

You know, uh just recently learned of it, and uh, you know, we've got some investors down here as well as some clients, so I thought it would be a good uh uh conference to come to.

SPEAKER_01

Tell me about uh NetArx.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, sir. So uh NetArx provides uh companies an ability to identify social engineering and deep fake attack how so? So, you know, if if you think about most cybersecurity incidents, a lot of people think, oh, I need protection with things like firewalls and antivirus and anti-spam uh, you know, to prevent against phishing attacks. But the truth of the matter is some people think uh it's as high as 90%, but most documented cases now it's showing about two-thirds of all cybersecurity events have a human element. And so the problem isn't the current cybersecurity equipment, uh technology, software, EDR, all of those things are helpful, but the vast majority of the massive breaches that you've all heard about in the last few years, there's a human element. There was someone who clicked something in an email they shouldn't have, someone who was convinced that, hey, you know, this was an approval that they received. You know, just as recently as a few weeks ago, BlackRock had $400 million stolen.

SPEAKER_02

I saw that.

SPEAKER_03

And last year, Ascension, they were taken down by an individual clicking on a phishing email, which allowed just a little bit of uh an open door uh for malware to be installed at some point later than it elevated to a ransomware attack and took them down and had a $1.5 billion impact on that business.

SPEAKER_01

Amazing.

SPEAKER_03

It mil affected millions of people, 100 hospitals down for over a month. And what we provide is an ability to protect organizations from those types of attacks.

SPEAKER_01

It would seem to me there's got to be training and mindset there because the people clicking on these things haph hazard hazardly.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, so you know, look, security awareness training is helpful, but asking Bob and accounting to be a human firewall is laughable. It's it's it's not a strategy. It's it's it's dangerous, and the truth of the matter is we need to evolve. And so what we've built is a suite of tools to provide organizations, it's a brand new term, new category. Gartner is now really pushing this new term called disinformation security. Disinformation security. So so when you think of you know different categories, you think of viruses protection, you think, you know, antivirus, you think of firewalls, you think of EDR. This is literally a brand new category that will by 2030 will be a $20 billion category. Disinformation security. And and within that, that includes social engineering, impersonation, um and deep fake.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, during the pandemic, we were exposed to dis is it was it disinformation?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah. And that's one of the reasons why they chose that term is because a layman would understand disinformation, right? Hey, this social media post is real or is it fake? And that's a huge problem right now. You have a lot of people with access to AI tools, and so chief marketing officers now care about disinformation security. So they're interested in brand protection. Is this image of our CEO dancing on a tabletop? Right, right, is that real or not? Right, and and so with our tool set you can determine instantly is this post real or not? Is this maybe it's an HR department and is this driver's license real or not? Or maybe you're on a team's a meet a Zoom call and is this person real or not? And so we provide real-time, multimodal ability to determine if you're talking to a real person or not. Wow.

SPEAKER_01

Disinformation security.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, so you've heard of two-factor authentication. Of course. We're 75 factors right now, and we'll continue to keep growing and adding more and more factors. But in the AI world, we don't call them factors, we call them features. And so those features are no not too much different than a physical feature, but a digital feature. Things like your IP address, your email, your tenancy, the encryption schema you're using, the devices you're using, all of those leads a leave a digital fingerprint. And those features, just as I recognize you sitting across from me, are how I would recognize you if you're on the other side of the planet. Because we've gotten to a point where people can no longer trust what's on their screen. And the tools that have been built, you get a link in an email and you click on it, and it launches the Zoom call. Zoom has had to make it so easy during COVID so that everyone can continue to work and do what's necessary. And so what we've done is basically pulled it back by able by providing you a visual indication of threat right on your screen, it's a traffic light, red, yellow, green. And so that traffic light, if it's green, it's someone you've worked with often in the past, and and whether or not you've had phone calls or text messages or emails with them, and all of those modalities we provide in real time.

SPEAKER_01

What's gonna happen with AI in the next six months?

SPEAKER_03

Well, it it just is is is continuing to evolve and make people have an ability to I hate to say it, impersonate anyone at a moment's notice. It's it's shocking just how well it works, and you can use any laptop or computer that's you know about $2,500, $3,000 or so, will have some of the latest NVIDIA chipsets, those GPUs can render images in near real time that I can grab and use of you, plus maybe six, ten, fifteen seconds of audio, and I will convince anyone that I could be Joe. Pretty much in in it's that simple. A single image and about 10 seconds of audio, and I can do that on pretty much any device.

SPEAKER_01

So that's the future of AI, impersonation.

SPEAKER_03

Absolutely. And so I feel that you know you're gonna have more and more situations where people are going to be convinced, duped into doing things, and and I believe we haven't had that Zoom COVID moment yet, if you understand what I'm saying, right? So a few years ago we had that MGM outage. Yeah, that was someone calling into their help desk and convincing them to reset a password. That resulted in MGM losing about uh $150 million uh all told. Then fast forward, you've got Ascension, which was $1.5 billion. Lazarus stole another $1.5 billion from a crypto company. We're gonna see a 10X event this year or probably within the next 18 months. And the way to protect against impersonation is what? So you need disinformation security tools on on all forms of of communication. And so we've built uh an ability to provide continuous identity and so that continuously verifying, you can't just you know do it at the border, you know, ATO and and so you know, account takeovers, if you will, um, are just not the answer because there's just no ability to continuously monitor someone with existing tools. You get someone's credentials, they log in, they're in, right? You can't you can't just expect to stay the course and not be exposed.

SPEAKER_01

So we're told to have a password that we can give loved ones that that the an AI won't be able to determine, so they'll know it's us.

SPEAKER_03

Passwords are dead.

SPEAKER_01

Uh maybe not a password, but at least a phrase or something that we can Yeah, safe words, right?

SPEAKER_03

People often say, oh, well, uh we just use a safe word. I'm like, okay, well, that's the same technology people used 3,000 years ago. So I think we can you know move on from that.

SPEAKER_01

So the only way to save it is to have these kinds of tools. Yeah. I'm skeptical about that.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I I I I think that it needs to be so easy. So for instance, with our platform, when I join a Teams, a meet, a Zoom call, or I call someone on the phone or I text them. The point is it needs to be seamless and easy and part of just the regular communication. You can't stop and expect someone to type in a six-digit token code. It's too much friction. So instead, what do you do? If you're using a disinformation security tool like NetArx, you basically insert our agent andor install our app or put the plugin on your device, and and and at that point, you're protected. You don't have to use it every single time you make a call to someone, but if you're looking for an approval on a few million dollar purchase, you would get that verification. And and or if you're getting on a Zoom or Teams, it's just seamless. It just automatically connects. So I don't have to do anything, yeah, and I'm still protected. So that's the key. It needs to be embedded into your typical workflow.

SPEAKER_01

But when I ask you about the future of AI in six months, you go, you go, is there anything positive that's gonna happen? What's AI now?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, there's lots of positive uh capabilities that you know people are using those efficiencies to develop and or to organize and as as alternatives to hiring new people. Yes, there's there's a lot of positives. But just like anything, there's a lot of power there, and there's gonna be a lot of people who use that power in the wrong ways. And some people just go after elderly, and and that's a real shame. And and so that's the norm, not the exception. Uh when when we're seeing, you know, bad guys who get these tools, it's like, hey, what can I use it for? And so fleecing, you know, grandma to send $3,000 because Johnny's in in jail and needs to get bail overnight. It's terrible. It's terrible, but it happens tens of thousands of times a year, and the FBI can't do anything about it because there's just too many cases. But when you look at organizations and the fact that organizations, especially the defense industry, they're hiring North Korean bad actors already now. Many of them don't even realize it. Many of them don't realize that people are in their networks. Many people don't realize just how much fraud there is. Lawyers, class action lawsuits where we've got um uh a receipt because you bought something and you want to actually receive a claim. A significant percentage of the receipts now that are being filed are AI generated, and so you need to be able to determine are those real or fake. All of those things fall under disinformation security. Are you optimist or cynic? Total optimist.

SPEAKER_01

Doesn't sound like it, Sandy.

SPEAKER_03

No, well that's why I built NetArx. So we can defend people and defend organizations, and and so we've built the tool set to protect people.

SPEAKER_01

But isn't there ways that AI can be used against negative actors? Just natively?

SPEAKER_03

Yes, and and and companies like NetArx or Flock or you know, organizations that are leaning on on what was traditional technology. We're not doing anything crazy and inventing anything new. We're taking all these existing forms of encryption and communication tools, and we're just putting an additional layer on top of it in order to be able to provide that information to organizations in real time. No different than I I use Flock as an example. I was just watching a Cheeky Pint uh episode with a founder of Stripe, and and they're just looking at license plates in real time to give that information to law enforcement to get the bad guys super quick. And so those are the answers, those are the ways with which to provide that real-time information to protect against bad actors using AI to enhance their social engineering andor their crimes.

SPEAKER_01

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SPEAKER_03

All of that information is available. It's creepy. You just watched a mentalist on stage here at Cyber Bay, and and he's able to just pick up on cues, but AI is so much more powerful to be able to be convincing, and I don't have to give you the answer right away. I can continue the conversation by bringing up other things. Most people are easily warped and modified into a different thread because you don't want to be rude. People are trusting inherently. And so as long as I know enough about you to convince you that you are as who you think I am, right? So so it's it's it's not that hard if I oh oh hold on one second, I dropped my phone, or oh let me connect to my earbuds. Like those are those are daily comments that we make to each other to buy ourselves a few minutes or seconds while I'm looking something up. Interesting. Right? And and so social engineering is is very easily done, but the days of the Nigerian prince are over. Right. You don't have a single email that someone actually responds to. It's usually much more organized and concerted and and and choreographed on multiple modalities. So you will get an email. That email was actually probably some mail merge with some database that put a couple of interesting things that they were able to find out about you on LinkedIn. And and this is an attack vector, a kill chain that that we've seen a number of times with a number of organizations we protect. And we see an invoice and an email from an executive sending to the accountant, hey, pay this invoice for $65,000. And it it even has a phone number to call or an email or attachment. And and people do. They call that number, they immediately see the caller ID and they know exactly who it is. They answer it and have that exact oh, tell me the invoice number, let me look it up. And and you know, uh oh, I see that you've you've got this PDF wrong. Oh, it's a W9, please modify. That's not our corporate type. Oh, sure. And they respond, they give a brand new artifact. We've now crossed from verbal and and phone calls, email domains, physical attachments now. I've got my PDF, I'm sorry, virtual or digital attachments. I've got a PDF. All of those things are fake. And so, you know, the the can the ability to convince someone now is is pretty impressive.

SPEAKER_01

Where's quantum gonna take us?

SPEAKER_03

Great question. So that's the next, and and many of our accounts are now starting to ask for uh quantum, and and so basically what that is essentially is an ability to provide a zero knowledge proof that your solution can protect against quantum compute when we reach a point, maybe it's a few thousand qubits, maybe it's a million qubits, where current encryption like AES 256 can no longer withstand you know brute force attacks, and and you'll be able to effectively with a quantum computer render that in clear text within minutes or hours or a few days. And so, yes, our platform is uh actually secured with blockchain technology, and so we use a blockchain signature. Service with which to confirm the device that you're using is in fact that device. We lock it into the TPM on that laptop or the UUID on that phone. And so the way in which we continuously verify you are who you say you are using that device is through blockchain. We're using Ethereum wallets right now. Wow. And we can upgrade that wallet to a ZKP to provide that zero knowledge proof and be post-quantum. And so many banks and financial institutions are asking that of us and saying, hey, can you do that? And we say, sure, whatever chain you want.

SPEAKER_01

Fascinating. Is there something, Sandy, that you believed in steadily, firmly 10 years ago that you no longer believe?

SPEAKER_03

Um my first Bitcoin was at $22, so I'm pretty much a big fan of things like uh I call myself a near futurist. Not really a long time. Uh so okay, so good thing, good question. Honestly, yeah. I did not believe AGI, for instance, yeah, was achievable before singularity. You know, Ray Kurzweil saying 2045. Sure. I think we're probably gonna get there sooner.

SPEAKER_01

Singularity.

SPEAKER_03

So humans, technology, yeah, AI reaching a point where it is more advanced than humanity as a whole. Right. Um and so we are starting to plateau, if you will, with the advancement on all of these AA, uh AI models, LLMs. Uh they're still impressive and they're still, you know, dramatically improving life. I mean, look at the latest cloud versions and how people are vibe coding together whole platforms. It's impacted software companies and automation, not so much cybersecurity in the near term, but I think there will be another few innovations in the next five or ten years that will reach that singularity point probably a little sooner.

SPEAKER_01

Wow. Yeah, because he did say 45, didn't he?

SPEAKER_03

I think that was the year. Kurzwell said 45, yeah. And and he's been pretty spread on, but I think this one, I think it may happen a little bit earlier than expected. You know, we all didn't quite appreciate Demis with Deep Mind andor the Google Transform uh Transformer paper in 2017. It it truly changed the world, right? It just truly changed the world.

SPEAKER_01

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SPEAKER_03

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01

Putting my health in the back seat and not working out anymore. And next thing I know, I'm in front of the doctor. She tells me I'm at 340 pounds. Oh my gosh. Yeah. So I gained all this terrible amount of weight. I knew I was getting big, didn't know I was that big. But she tells me if you don't lose this weight, you're not gonna see your daughter graduate. My daughter was just born.

SPEAKER_03

Wow.

SPEAKER_01

Scared the life out of me. Driving home, punching the steering wheel, you know, this is my pie hole. I did this myself.

SPEAKER_00

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

Decisions I make are not just about me anymore. Spent the next six, seven months, lost about 120 pounds, kept it off. Can't look at this as like a finishing line, right? These are lifelong changes you have to make. Yeah. When I tell people this story, they always say, What's your secret? What you do? And I always just say discipline, Sandy. I say focus, motivation, routine. How does discipline play a role in your life?

SPEAKER_03

It it's a huge part, and and it's everything from the scale that I have that I look and make sure that I am the same weight that I was in the last 25 years.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, you look good.

SPEAKER_03

Um but no, look, I I mean, uh I started my IT services business in my 20s, which uh morphed into an MSP. Uh I exited that in 2011. But you're absolutely right. Uh you're at a pace where I'm just drilling through Diet Mountain Dews all day long. And so I realized that I was getting a fluorescent sunburn, and and so I needed to change. Uh I could no longer eat whatever I wanted. And so I picked up tennis. Uh within a year or two, every joint hurt. Uh, my elbows, my knees, uh, my wrists, everything was just in in in pain. And so uh one day a bunch of of the guys I work with uh in one of my other offices was, hey, we're gonna go play hockey. Uh and so fell in love with it. So uh started playing ice hockey in my 30s and never felt better. Wow. And so there's not any of the joint pain. Again, this is pickup, not leagues. Leagues, some guys are beer leagues. A little too seriously brutal. Yeah, but in pickup, uh we play on I play on Thursday nights and Sunday nights, and um there are folks who are 18, 19, 20 all the way through 75, 76, 77 years old. And I'll swear to you, it is fantastic. There's an occasional collision, it's an occasional accident, but for the most part, it's not the trauma to your joints like running on a hardcourt is. Uh when you're on ice, you know, you come to a stop. Interesting. And if you think about it, it's not this violent end of motion, right? All this kinetic energy just stops. Right.

SPEAKER_02

Right?

SPEAKER_03

And in a hockey, you come to a hockey stop. You're sliding to a stop, right? And so if you think about that, that's a really good point. It's it's a lot less violent on your joints.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, because it's not as abrupt.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, and and you'll burn more calories doing that than anything else. And you know, look, all of us need someone to push them. And so that's why people hire coaches, whether it be in the office place or working out, and hey, I I've got my Pilates coach or my, you know, I'll do free weights with this coach. And and so um you don't need a coach when you're playing hockey. There's 20 other guys who are yelling at you, go hard or get off the ice. And so you are, and it and it's the ultimate hit, the you know, high intensity type of training in the fact that you are uh let's say it's a 90-minute skate, you are on the ice half the time going 100%, and then you're sitting on the bench waiting for your turn again. So you spend 45 minutes 100% and then 45-0. So it's on off, on off. And so I think it's it's pretty good uh fantastic in every respect, whether it's cardio, endurance, whether it's uh strength, core, everything. So super fan of hockey.

SPEAKER_01

So I too started my tech firm in the 90s and it morphed into an MSP and I sold it in 2019. Ah. So what what experience do you get from running the MSP to running a vendor now? Kind of being on the dark side.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, I went over to the other side. So look, I mean, as an MSP, uh as a managed service provider. Yeah, man, yeah, please we should uh be uh clear, right? So so as an MSP or managed service provider, we provided services to many Fortune 500 companies and and down and and you know, you're owning their environment, and there were a lot of stressful Friday night, Saturday, you know, type of cutovers and and all of the implementation and monitoring management, it's a beast. Nowadays I think the tools that are available to MSPs are amazing, things that we never had to standardize and provide that level of security, but it's needed now in this day and age with the level of automation and the potential for attacks. And so that's why I'm now on the other side is is is because of the fact that yes, now, you know, MSPs have some of these tools, but I didn't see anyone develop a tool set for the eighth layer. You know, the OSI seven layer model, right? Where the physical layer is layer one, presentation, what you see on your screen is layer seven. There's no one who's developing a tool for layer eight, the human. And so human defense is the problem, and so that's what I decided to do and focus on. I had started a private equity firm with uh a partner. Uh, my my partner and I, Rob, were sitting there at lunch, and it was with a mid-market lender, and he answers his phone, and I see the blood drain out of his face. And I'm like, Are you okay? And he says, We just were a victim of uh uh wire transfer fraud. And so that evening was the I started writing the first patent for NetArx, and and because I realized the world needs this. But more importantly, it's not just that the world needs this, it's that the world needs this from someone you can trust, someone who is domestic, someone who actually cares, because whoever has the keys of that kingdom that's scary and can make changes, and so you need to make sure that that this capability can protect organizations and that you can hold the owners of that company accountable. So uh it's a big concern, it's a big uh risk, and it's a little scary, but uh it's it's a it's a huge task. It's way more complicated than I had thought. If you had asked me a few years ago, are you gonna you know go down this rabbit hole and how hard is it gonna be? I'm like, oh, you know, create a couple inference models and then build some enterprise tool sets. And it's it's it's wildly complicated. Because you can't you can't just protect one mode or one modality, right? You have to protect everything. And and what do I mean by that? As an example, right? You're on any given week, you're not just on a Teams call, you're on a Teams, a meet, a Zoom, a WebEx, right? You're you're on two out of the four almost daily, right? And and so we need to protect all of those. But you need to also protect every browser. So you're using Chrome, you're using Edge, you're using Safari, right? And then you need to protect Android and iOS and and and and the list doesn't stop. And it's just you have to protect all of those things. And it's any form of communication because someone is at a country and they reach out to you on WhatsApp, right? And and that happens, or signal, or Slack. And so you can't possibly protect every single tool of every different form of communication. And so uh you need to be multimodality and have that awareness.

SPEAKER_01

So I mean half the challenge is this new concept of disinformation security is trying to explain to what as to what it is.

SPEAKER_03

It's a that's the biggest my biggest competitor is my biggest competitor is ostriches, people putting their heads in the road. Right. Like they're just oh, it's not a problem. And I'm like, and and the the the the real sad truth is a lot of organizations know it's happening, but it's not enough on the balance sheet, and only until it is enough of a problem, or there's some compliance change, because that's cap happening now too. There are compliance requirements for social engineering. How is your organization blocking or preventing social engineering attacks? And so a lot of people don't have an answer, and and we are, we we are the answer. It's an enterprise tool set that most organizations can use, especially like finance, banking, HR, marketing, compliance, ISOs.

SPEAKER_01

Great pleasure talking with you. Anybody listening, watching, how can they get in touch with you?

SPEAKER_03

Oh, well, just go to netarch.com, that's N-E-T-A-R-X. N-Etar X.com. Yeah, and uh reach out, say hi, and uh, we'd love to help. Thanks for coming today. Enjoy the show. Fantastic. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you for listening and/or viewing Joey Pins Discipline Conversations. Please share this episode with one or two of your friends who you think may benefit from the episode. Our website, www.t.joeypins.com. There you find lots of resources, and you can join our mailing list. Please follow us on all our social media, Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. Podcast information. The video version of our podcast is on YouTube. Subscribe. Audio is on all major podcasting platforms. So please follow them. And if you like it, please consider giving a five-star rating. We would really appreciate it. Thank you again for listening, for watching, and enjoying this conversation.