The Other 6 Days

The Heart of Generosity | The Other 6 Days | Episode 40

• Southwest Church • Season 2 • Episode 40

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As we head into the holiday season, the idea of giving & receiving is at the forefront of many people's minds. In this episode, we address the cultural joy's & pressures, the biblical principles and some practical ways we can engage with the kind of generosity that is rooted in love & at the heart of the gospel.

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Speaker 1:

Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Other Six Days podcast, where we chat about life outside of Sundays and what it means to live from our gatherings, and not just for them. I'm your host, cj McFadden, and always here with Pastor Ricky Jenkins, and on this episode we're going to talk about all things, generosity and why it's so much better to give than it is to receive. So, first off, ricky, I got to ask you a question Are you a gift giver or are you a gift receiver? I'm definitely a giver. You're a giver.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, I love the joy of figuring it out and presenting it and seeing their face. Yeah, I like. I mean, give me gifts all day. Yeah, you know, but that doesn't. Yeah, yeah, but it doesn't.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I'd rather you give me money to go buy what I want, that's exactly.

Speaker 1:

I literally wrote down the same thing. I said I'm really neither. I said I actually enjoy getting gifts but I'm very picky, so it usually ruins it for the gift givers. And then I love to give but I don't like giving small things like you know things that. And unfortunately things I think are trivial. So I desire those extravagant gifts, Like I want to give extravagantly, but I'm not wealthy so it's problematic.

Speaker 2:

I'm the same way I love to give, and so I married a cheap woman, right, and so I would go literally like I'd go for birthday, I'd go to Tiffany's, you know, and I'd do this and do that, and it took me four or five years worth of gift giving to realize that man, you know, april will like flowers, but she doesn't need to have them. Yeah, all she all. When April gets flowers, all she could think is that's 75.

Speaker 1:

That's exactly what that's.

Speaker 2:

April. So yeah, I've had enough gifts taken back and just OK, got it. All right. Sneakers Lululemon OK, got it.

Speaker 1:

OK, that's yeah. What's the worst gift you've ever given like? That that I've ever given, you got a response that you didn't. You were like I nailed it and I missed the mark on this one or just worse.

Speaker 2:

I used to. There was a time when I would give what I wanted, yeah, and I remember getting my dad. It was like his, maybe his, maybe his 50th. So that's 20 years ago, yeah, that's about right. And it's Christmas time and I got dad like this expensive journal, you know, leather bound, the gold bond, you know all that stuff. It's like a, it's like a $70 thing and it's like the leather felt like you know middle E medieval leather. It was great. And he was like hey, okay, thanks, oh, womp womp, oh, okay, got it. I should have thought about your needs.

Speaker 1:

That was pretty cute. Do you want me to wrap this up?

Speaker 2:

for you.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I did that all through my mom. She's like you got to think about other people, not just what you like. Exactly.

Speaker 2:

What about you yeah?

Speaker 1:

I gave one time. I thought it was a. It was a funny gag gift. I got a rotten gold tooth as a gag gift from someone, so I naturally assumed that it'd be hilarious to re-gift it at a church, church white elephant gift party. And so it ended up getting fought over and I was thinking, oh, this would be hilarious. When they opened it up, you know, and it got exchanged like 90 times Really, Of course, come to find out. I didn't know at the time that the gold was worth a ton of money. The gold tooth was.

Speaker 1:

So I was thinking about the rotten but it was a solid gold crown around the outside of the tooth Wow. So I'm thinking it's a gross decaying tooth and they're thinking that's gold. That's gold. Melt this baby down. So everyone fought over it. It just like 300 bucks worth of gold or something. So I ended up giving the best gift so that's like the best and worst. That's hilarious then I was bummed because I gave it away and I was like I could use the money exactly totally, that's hilarious, wow, weird, huh, wow.

Speaker 2:

I remember this one time this couple in our church we were young, so we had just gotten married and this young couple, um, for our gift, said, hey, they were at our wedding. They said, hey, we'll give you your gift when you get back from your honeymoon. So they sat us down and you know, hey. So we decided we have this timeshare and we decided to give you guys a vacation, oh, nice. And so we were like, oh, thanks, that's great, that's great, yeah. So just pick out the, the date, and the four of us will just have it.

Speaker 2:

I was like what? And at the time I didn't know how to tell people in my church no, yeah, you know what I mean. I just didn't know how to say oh, thanks so much. But you know we're not doing that Deal with it. You know what I mean, that I have that gear now. But, dude, like we literally got on. They had a business called Megabus that was like supposed to be new and improved, greyhound, was supposed to be fun and you know all this stuff with Wi-Fi and we and we barely knew them and we got on a, we went to Nashville, three hour drive or wherever. We went to this timeshare thing and it was like it was so bad. We had no chemistry with him. He expected April to do all the cooking.

Speaker 2:

It was just so strange that is awkward. Like we spent the whole weekend in our bedroom after, like, that first morning was just so awkward and we just in our bedroom looking at each other and we just covenanted this will never happen again. It was a good learning lesson. Yeah, how are you going to give me your vacation? By the way, we're going with you. Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1:

Oh, that's pretty bad. It's the worst. Well, all right. As we head into this holiday season, the idea of giving and receiving is on the forefront of many people's minds. Today, I thought it might be beneficial to spend some time on the topic of generosity from a cultural, biblical and practical perspectives. So maybe let's just start with some general observations about generosity. You know the science, culture, stuff like that, sure.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah. Well, I think you know it's just. You know, when you think about, let's move away from what the words evoke in us. When we hear generosity, right, everybody already presupposes, wherever it is, they may think we are going. Yeah, but man, here we like. We love exploring stuff, we love kind of capturing stuff that we didn't get to fit in on a Sunday, yeah, but just think about the human enterprise, right, like generosity is one of the telltale signs that we are human. Right, like I'm going to give CJ this because I thought about him, I just wanted him to have it. Yeah, right. Like I'm going to give CJ this because I thought about him, I just wanted him to have it. Yeah, right. And we do that from time to time, whether it's our kid, our spouse, a coworker, right, a stranger.

Speaker 2:

Like we do that because deep down, there's something that happens when I let go of something, for your sake, that's in me when I let go of something, for your sake, that's in me and even though I have less of what I had before, what I needed I have more of. And so there's a wonderful human thing that happens there that stems from the heart of God. Right, that's how God is. And so, just thinking about it, when you think about it from that perspective, with whatever the scripture has to say about it, I hope that our listeners are channeling that. Yeah Right, like, deep down, we all do this because we're human and deep down, we all think it's a good idea that there's no such thing as a great society or a great family, or a great marriage, or a great parenting, or great relationships or great teams without this fundamental virtue, what it means to be human. So, anyways, that's what I think when I come to that.

Speaker 1:

No, that's great. We're literally wired to be generous. It's intrinsic, it's something inside of us, it says. According to a Cleveland Clinic's health blog, helping people and giving things can increase the feel-good chemicals you talked about this before, you know dopamine, serotonin, oxytocin. So those things produce happiness, pleasure, safety, trust and connectedness. So the science behind it even just says that it activates our brain's reward pathways and can make us feel good. So, just at a biological level, generosity is, it's intertwined, it's a part of who we are, you know. Like, like you said, that's so, so good. Intertwined. It's a part of who we are, you know like, like you said, that's so, so good it's.

Speaker 2:

And it's also the thing we are looking for as we consider connection, as we consider consider careers, as we consider education, as we consider making a fam, starting a family, as we consider choosing a mate. Right, we are all looking for generosity, right, like we're all. Are you going to be a generous person to me? Like, are you going? We're all? Like, are you going to be a generous person to me? Like, are you going to gift to me? Are you going to bless me? Right, like, we're all hanging that. We're all hanging that. So, for whatever reason, what the church says, we're like oh no here we go again.

Speaker 1:

Well, yeah, I think we've jumped to. We'll get to that down the road but, we've jumped to a point in what generosity is viewed through the church versus what we're talking about right now at a basic level. Exactly right, Because most of our marital disputes and things like that come from like you know, man, you're always thinking about yourself and not about me. That's usually what you say to me, but you know what I mean.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah. You know it's time for a shoebox Franklin Graham's ministry, Christmas shoebox things where in April took our kids to Dollar Tree and some other places. Yesterday, and you know how shoebox ministries works, you get this picture of a kid, and they're eight and it's a girl from Thailand and I'm going to go shop for her. Well, my kids are trying to not be at Dollar Tree, they're trying to be at Target, right, Like they're trying to give this kid, this eight-year-old. Like Mom, can I get him an Xbox game Like baby boy?

Speaker 1:

he ain't got no Xbox you know.

Speaker 2:

But again, these children excited about man, there's something in it for me that I have to have. That can only happen when I give, when I'm generous and I just it's just. I think you're so right to just capture it and channel it as this essential human virtue and enterprise that we're all engaged in on some level.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we'll talk about how we flesh that out and wrestle with it and all those things, but yeah, it's in us. So a common misunderstanding of culture is the difference. We hear this one quite often as a difference between we hear the words, but what's the difference between philanthropy and generosity, like when we kind of think about that? You know, frame that for us, yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah. So you know, love that One of the best books you'll ever read on generosity is called Gospel Patrons. Wonderful storytelling in that book. But it's kind of sets it up as the difference between the two. Both give right, Both want to make the world a better place and both agree that life is not about what you gain but what you give your life to accomplish. But this is the thing about philanthropy Philanthropists will be remembered for giving the good things. Mm-hmm, Gospel patrons are remembered for giving to God things. That's the difference. And don't hear wrong in philanthropy, Just hear that there's something in the gospel world that I like to call E-R-O-I I got this from a guy named Lee Domingo which is this idea of eternal return on investment.

Speaker 2:

Philanthropists, by and large, are going to get a return on investment. It comes from a good place, right? So if I give to this charity, right, they're going to be able to say, hey, with this $1 million, this is what we're going to do. And there it is, and that's great. You know what I mean. We're going to build a wonderful safe haven for stray cats, right? There's nothing wrong with that. I'm sure stray cats need some help out there, it's all good.

Speaker 2:

Right, but, man, if I give this million dollars to you know this ministry that the church is engaged in, that's going to be an eternal return on investment, way after I'm gone.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, you know what I mean. So anyways, yeah, oh, that's so good. I love that We'll dig into that legacy thing a little bit more for sure.

Speaker 1:

But yeah, like you were saying too, you know the philanthropy right. That one prioritizes the people's minds and body, you know so kind of our physical, material piece, and the other one prioritizes souls. That's right and so, and they're usually, philanthropy addresses symptoms, right, Kind of immediate needs, things we can fix now. And then the other one is the core of the issue is the disease right the disease of sin, so good.

Speaker 1:

So well, let's now I guess we already started, but let's talk a little bit about generosity from a biblical perspective kind of, where we see that in scripture.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so like you're not going to be able to read too many pages of your Bible without seeing the spirit calling us to this essential feature of God's character and person, which is generosity. Right, and so our whole faith is centered on the fact that God was generous and took us off the cross and put Christ, his son, on it. Right, and so it makes sense then, that man kind of interwoven in the tapestry of the salvific narrative in Scripture, is this givenness to generosity that God has on the part of himself right, insists that it's on the part of his people as well, even when it's not. In fact, it's especially in so far that that generosity is not necessarily something that's transactional, it's always transformational. Something that's transactional, it's always transformational, and so the reason why God calls us to it it's not so we can get something out of it, so that we can become something by it. Right, and so that's. And so my point is you just can't, can't read too many pages of scripture without seeing this, some of the kind of banner passages though.

Speaker 2:

Matthew, chapter six, which is what I like to teach generosity from when I rooted class. Giving is the only way to transfer earthly wealth into eternal impact. Acts 20, jesus says love one another. Proverbs 11, one gives freely yet grows all the richer. Another withholds what he should give and only suffers want. Whoever brings blessing will be enriched First. Timothy 6, right Love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. The most loving thing you'd ever do for somebody is point them to the hope of the gospel. That's the most generous thing we can do in all other places.

Speaker 1:

So yeah, no, that's so good. I know we always talk about. You hear that term thrown around blessed to be a blessing.

Speaker 2:

you know that's right, and so you know Christ calls us to see that, and so I always look at it.

Speaker 1:

I'm like man, as you see, and you said it generosity woven throughout the tapestry of the you know, salvific narrative and scripture. What's in it. Then we have to unpack that even deeper and say, you know, there's well, it's just something he's called us to do, you know and he knows is good for us, but there's so much more in it. So I even I've looked at it and we'll move into this a little bit but beyond, the tithe is what I'm calling, you know, and when we talk about tithing, we're talking about giving a 10th, and you know we see those passages throughout scripture. But we're actually called to extravagant generosity in light of what Christ has done, and so I like to frame it as what is, instead of what is the minimum, I can give, embrace more, what's the maximum impact? I?

Speaker 1:

can have or what's the maximum I can do.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, generosity is freedom. Yeah, and it's why Satan works so hard to blind us to his virtue. Yeah, it's because the most free people, the most happy people, the most healthy people I know are generous people. Yep.

Speaker 1:

Every time.

Speaker 2:

And in every culture, in every country. Yep, right by the country, yeah, right by the way. Yeah, and it's so. I don't, I wouldn't even want us to think singularly of a financial perspective.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, Socioeconomic, socioeconomically.

Speaker 2:

Right, I've seen people in Mozambique with nothing, nothing, right, give me part of their meal. That was really hard to come by and to see their light. Their really hard to come by and to see their light, the light on their faces. You know what I'm saying, and so just you know.

Speaker 2:

The whole idea, though, that I'm trying to bring to bear is that generosity and, biblically speaking, is this framework of freedom, and so far, the generous person realizes that nothing I have actually is owned by me.

Speaker 2:

It's owned by God, yeah, and he's charged me to be a steward of this little bit he's entrusted to me, and he's made this promise. He says I will put on your heart what's on mine, and there will be these moments in your interactions with your spouse and with your kids, and with your family, with your coworkers and with your business ventures, and with your church family, with your coworkers and with your business ventures, and with your church family, with your kingdom assignments. That God says I'm going to put on your heart, I'm going to spark you, I'm going to help you see something, and I'm going to whisper to you. This is what I want you to do with your time, with respect to what I just showed you. Oh hey, this is what I want you to do with your talent, with respect to what you oh hey, this is what I want you to do with your talent with respect to what you oh hey, this is what I want to do with your treasure, with respect to what I just told you.

Speaker 2:

And the spirit says that God, through the Holy Spirit, will show us, he will teach us, he will tell us how he wants us to move with our time, talent and treasure. And this is what I've learned, cj. And this is what I've learned CJ. I've learned that when I give in to that and give over to that the freedom of delight, knowing that I've been obedient to my father, knowing that I get to sit back and watch the fruit of what that little old seed is doing in God's kingdom, what I get to be, I get to partner with God. It's just an amazing thing. And so don't hear me say I'm a pro at it or anything like that. I'm just saying I've got 30 years and walking with Christ under my belt now, and I know what it's like to not be generous and I know what that life is like. And now I know what it's like to be generous, and I know what that life is like and I like the generous life way better.

Speaker 1:

Well, man, you said it as you were saying it just resonates with me.

Speaker 1:

I'm just seeing the things play out in my mind and I'm like man. The peace that I encounter when I engage in the things that Christ has called us to through generosity but it is through a. I find it in a proximity to him. That's relationship with Christ right, when I invest back all of those things that he's given to me and saying here's what I want you to do with your time and your talent and your treasure. I'm engaging in a relationship like with the God of the universe.

Speaker 1:

Almighty God that he would be close to me to speak to me, and allow me to you know, carry out the things that he has for others, and that's fulfillment.

Speaker 2:

And that's the peace. Well, let me you know fulfillment and peace is such a good way to capture it. Let me tell a story of our church. Pandemic had hit. We're still kind of shut down. We were doing the food lines and we had like dozens and dozens of cars coming up here to get food for stuff through near our door and then our nurses and doctors were kind of struggling because there was like COVID was just tearing things up Our law enforcements.

Speaker 2:

They were having to work so much overtime so they needed help with counseling funds and some other stuff. So we said let's do a campaign call and we called it Make Jesus Famous. Now it was old school and we did it like a Jerry Lewis St Jude telethon and I just would never forget like no, we got to have it where people can call on the phone like the old shows.

Speaker 1:

And we basically had a variety show and it was all live.

Speaker 2:

Well, me and April hadn't talked about what we were going to get. We're going to try to raise a million dollars in a day, right, and the Spirit smiled in our church and we raised a million dollars in a couple hours, it is. I've never seen anything like it and we were obviously going to give. And I'm just going to be very vulnerable here and we've been talking about it for a couple of weeks. I think we can pull off $1,000. It's comfortable and that's what was in my head. Never talked to April about it. She trusts me to do all that kind of stuff or whatever. And I'm on the show, I'm on stage, me and Tim Kool are there and we're just doing our stuff, going from scene to scene, and April's in the back of the auditorium waving at me like what are we going to give? And I was like, oh crap, I didn't tell April, so I text her real quick. I was like, no, no, no, I didn't have my phone so I couldn't text her. So I was like, hey, such and such, such and such.

Speaker 1:

I was like come find me so I can tell you what we're going to do.

Speaker 2:

And April looks me. I'll never forget this because I'm the generous, I'm the like yeah, I'm the spender. Yeah, april's not the spender, yeah, so I'll never forget. April says and we're just excited, god's moving, like. And april looks at me, says yeah, and she waves, she puts three fingers up in there which meant three thousand dollars.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I don't even know where that's coming from, and I just remember but my wife's not that person.

Speaker 2:

You know she watches the much and she knows what we got. But, like I remember thinking, okay, god, if that's what you have communicated to my wife, that's what you've communicated to me, I'm going to trust you and CJ, all I can say is yeah, all I can say Yep, all I can say is to partner with the Lord that night in a very sacrificial way. It's so sacrificial. It's a little painful, yeah, but the joy that I still have on that day for what they did in her, what they did in me, yeah, I get excited about the next thing we're going to do. You know what I mean, because it's just like I want that feeling. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1:

So, anyways, I love that. Man there's nothing I love more than being able to try to transmit that to others, to try to share with them and show them what it looks like to show up and extravagant generosity in ways that at the moment might seem even painful. You know, you're like I don't know if we can do it. It's a stretch. It actually almost feels burdensome. Yeah, that's good.

Speaker 1:

But we go. God, I need you to show up and show off and do what only you can do in our lives and stuff. I'm going to trust you with the rest. That means the interaction with my wife, the financial pressures we already have, but that you're going to take care of that in a whole, nother way. Not just. You know that we're going to get some sort of blessing. We don't know what that blessing might look like, but the obedience there and the faith that it grows in me.

Speaker 1:

Like once we started doing that, changed our marriage. That was I would. I can't even tell people what it means to at some level, just to show up into when your wife looks at you and sees you take control of the house and show up and be generous in ways that you know that you might not be able to. She's like I'm interested in the Lord right now. That's right, and all of a sudden it starts changing things.

Speaker 2:

It changes things and it gives you this. It that God's called me to steward this leftover in my wallet that he didn't tell me to give away. It's something about it, CJ. It's something about, yeah, I'm just going to be honest, when we write that tithe check every month, right? Or when God's doing something and we just want to get behind it, me and April fund, I think, three different missionary families One, two, three, I don't know Anyways and we send these checks. I fund, I help, I don't fund.

Speaker 2:

I sent a check to a men's ministry who was the first to invite me to do a conference 15 years ago. They put me on and I said I'm going to send them a check for the rest of my life. That's sweet. Hmm, that's sweet, like I guess what I'm saying is is that it's something about knowing you're a part of something that matters. Yeah, you know what I mean. That really just number one. But then two, this part that Jesus didn't call me to give. I've now got this crystal clear clarity on how to manage it. Well, you know what I mean, because what I thought I was going to get out of spending $500, let's say, on a new Xbox that I can't get now because he called me to give $500 over there I realized that what I was trying to get out of an Xbox that I don't really need I got out of partnering with God. So the heart part is taken care of, and now I've got crystal clear wisdom on how to manage that stuff. And he scales it. So, anyways, that's. I hope that makes sense.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, no, it does. No, it's the things he knows. He knows in our life, the things that we need to let go of. It releases our grasp on acquisition and acquiring things and thinking that somehow accumulation is the end goal, because we know enough more is never enough, right? We hear all the quotes you know pursue to wealth, comfort and accumulation lead to greed, envy and strife, and then we find ourselves, though, falling back into that over and over and over again.

Speaker 1:

And generosity is a huge key that God wants to use to give us freedom.

Speaker 2:

That's right and it's why, like you know, you see some pretty darn good people who have not availed themselves to it and they lean into scarcity. They lean into fear.

Speaker 2:

They lean into sometimes a curmudgeon spirit, right, and then they allow kind of like churches who have a bad reputation, to become every church's reputation. You know what I mean. And they justify it and all I want to say to that person is that I get that and I see that I empathize with that, but you are missing out on a lot of what my boy, cj, calls fulfillment in peace.

Speaker 1:

Oh man, I've even seen a little bit. We'll jump into some practical ways we can fight, but I do I do know, wanted to tag on that, the, that wrong motive sometime. You know they, they lead wrong motives, lead to an expectation of reciprocity and result in resentment. So there is you know, I've seen it through some unhealthy behavior. So we have to look at that too through, like, where you know we say, oh well, they're giving and they're generous from an external perspective. Oh well, they're giving and they're generous from an external perspective. But really it's kind of, you know, they're trying to actually receive some reciprocity from that generosity. And like, I think, like in that there's something about just giving away with no expectations.

Speaker 2:

That's right. You know what I mean, that's exactly right. Well, god ain't the stock market. Yeah, you know what I mean and it's just. But the crazy thing is, god is better than stock market, and this is where I'm about to go. But it's just like we've relegated blessing to financial gain. Yeah, exactly. And material gain, yeah, yeah. And when you read scripture, blessing is all sorts of kinds of gains, namely spiritual ones.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and wisdom ones, and relational ones, and all those sorts of things.

Speaker 2:

At the same time, though, scripture says prove me now your wrath if I will not open up a window and pour you out a blessing which you'll not have room to receive. And hear me, that's still not transactional. That's not the reason I do it, but this is what I know. When I take care of God's business, I'm a witness. I'm 47 years old. I'm a witness that he has been faithful to take care of mine, and there'll be a coming of the day when he won, but I'll still be blessed. Does that make sense?

Speaker 1:

So, anyways, Well, it's so much so that in scripture you know I mean I got. He knew what he was doing with generosity. He knows what it does for you and he wants it so much for you that he said test me.

Speaker 2:

Like this is one of the, that's right.

Speaker 1:

And so you know do not test the Lord, your God, but in this area try me out and see what I do. You know what I?

Speaker 2:

mean. Well, he's a sovereign ruler. The scripture says he owns the cattle on a thousand hills, which which was kind of like saying Bezos is nothing on me. Yeah, you know what I mean. Like, if you understand that metaphor, what it meant in the ancient world, he's basically saying it's all mine. So if you really understand that framework, that it's all his and he says some of what's mine that's currently in your account you could borrow that. I'm letting you literally borrow. I'd like you to move some of my money over to this other account I got.

Speaker 1:

Yeah to these people I love, Exactly.

Speaker 2:

That's why I use freedom it frees you.

Speaker 1:

It frees you because it just makes sense, amen. So what are some practical ways we can fight selfishness and become more generous people?

Speaker 2:

First is conceptual. You got to read scripture. I've said this now for seven years. I think the best moments in your life are not going to be marked by great things that happen to you. Best moments in your life can be marked by great things you make happen for others. And I would say to our listeners don't stop yourself from experiencing the best moments of your life. And so we talked about this with our, with our, our congregation, just to kind of ways to practice generosity. So why don't you kind of model some of that out for us, cj.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah. Well, we shared a couple of the stories. So one of the ways is that you know you, that you share or that you show generosity is by sharing, is by getting involved or participating in generosity to others, so you can model it for people in your life, as I have had it modeled in my own. So that's a practical way.

Speaker 1:

Most of the ways that I've seen generosity play out is by someone having done like an old church I was a part of during a really hard time, just showed up and was generous to us and the most vulnerable time and so for vulnerable people to receive the gifts that you just you're like it really it puts, it makes it tangible, and so and then I said it too with our marriage like one of the highlights that I've seen, where we grew the most in our relationship together and stuff and where we got it was when we released our grasp on accumulation through generosity. And so I think, like I just see pivotal points of generosity in my life being modeled by others, practicing in myself and then now seeing my kids start to get it. So it's a really sweet thing. But I'd say, just to wrap that up, you've got to practice it and participate in it if you want to see the fruit of it.

Speaker 2:

Well, I've been sensing about four years ago. Five years ago, April felt led that we should take. We tied 10% of our gifts to the kingdom and April just started praying and says, hey, I think God wants us to go up to 11% starting next year. I said, okay, well, babe, I'll start praying about that. And she says, no, you know, like God told us to do, oh, okay.

Speaker 1:

That's what we're doing.

Speaker 2:

We've been there about four years maybe three, four years but, cj, I've been sensing the Spirit saying I'd like to take that up and so I've been wrestling with that. We heard of a pastor's retreat. Ashley Woolrich from CCV in Phoenix Wonderful man of God Just told their generosity story, him and his wife, and scarcity and issues with their parents and money, and then their careers, and then they become pastors and guys. Just story after story after story of God's faithfulness. And he's just telling their money story how they struggled but then learned generosity and now 50% of their salary goes to God. And there wasn't a dry in the house and I remember listening to them saying I want to do that.

Speaker 2:

I want that, you know. And so I've sensed, the last seven, eight weeks or so, the Spirit saying, hey, let's figure this out. You know what I mean. So I'm excited. I'm not excited at all, I'm scared to death. But anyways, it's just to be honest. But I want more freedom, I want less hold, I want less strain and stress, and I've learned that when I'm obedient to Christ with time, talent and treasure, man, that's how quickly I can get there.

Speaker 1:

Well, I know that I've been privileged not lucky, but blessed enough that God, I've been giving away my life for kingdom things and I want to give away my life for the sake of others, as Christ has called us to do. Uh, for kingdom things, and I want to give away my life for the sake of others, as Christ has called us to do, and if that requires that, I gave away my money so that others might know the peace and the joy and the fulfillment and the things that I have. Like that's just something that I want to embrace and I want to step into cause. I know God has something beautiful in it and so, you know, I've reached that place and my, you know my faith and, uh, you know, and I'm just like man, god, whatever you want to do, if you, if it, if it be so, I would love to be able to give away the majority of what you give me so that I could do something to advance your kingdom.

Speaker 1:

And you know, and a little bit of. I don't need to see anything done with it. I would like to. It'd be fun. But you know, I'm just like man. Make me, I'd love to be available to do that. I love being able to, you know, give to others. I've they've done it for me. I mean little things like people letting us stay at their cabin on the way up somewhere when we couldn't afford it. I mean, do those things were such treats? Do you know like me and Kelly were able to connect and there was a sweet relationship building and thing that happened because of someone else's like minor generosity. And so, man, I just I would encourage that for so many other people. I want that for others as well. Game changers.

Speaker 2:

I love the little things we get to do. Now, part of this is just kind of being grown and we don't. I wish we could do more, but like I love it when a kid on staff is getting married, yeah Right, so we just had a wedding here.

Speaker 1:

I love being able to take you know a wad of cash and put that in their hands.

Speaker 2:

I love it when one of our kids at our church graduates, I love that and I will run into a student and they'll tell me hey, Pastor, I'm graduating and I've done this for years. And I say, hey, send me an invite. I ain't going, but send me an invitation and I love writing that letter to that kid and just $100 bill, you know what I mean I love. I love that because you know what. That's what some folks did for me and it marked me, that's a great word.

Speaker 2:

It marked me. So my first sermon was November 15th 1998 and I went broke. But I was just a kid and working at wherever I was working. I'm 21 years old. First sermon is a big deal, and I hope she doesn't mind me using her name. In fact I won't use her name because I hadn't asked her, so let's call her Ludella Gibson. How about that? I like that Wonderful woman in our church, yeah, gibson, how about that? I like that Wonderful woman in our church. Yeah. And I forget how she got word to me. I don't remember if she told me or not, but basically everybody's getting ready for my first sermon and she said I would like to buy you a suit. God told me to buy you a suit.

Speaker 1:

For your first service. Oh wow, it's special.

Speaker 2:

And you know I remember her kind of saying make it a nice one.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

And men's warehouse was a thing in those days, and she said just go pick it out and have them leave it there. She said get the whole outfit. And she got me a Navy blue suit, white dress shirt, maroon tie, burgundy leather belt, burgundy leather Cole Haan dress shoes, which is a big deal in those days. Yeah, I'll never forget that. You'll remember it all to this day. I'll never forget that. You'll remember it all to this day. I'll never forget that. You know, and that's what it means when God calls you to do something. I mean, it's just 30 years ago, yeah, and it's still a part of me, I know.

Speaker 1:

So, oh, that's beautiful. Well, it's funny because one of the gifts that my daughter just a little thing and it doesn't, you know, it doesn't. It can be big things if that's what you have available in it, but it can be small things. You guys gave my daughter a little and you know, I think probably April had a little bit of input on this, but one of those thermoflasks and it had her name on it and said Addie, and she lit up.

Speaker 1:

I honestly was. I was taken back at how much that meant to her, for I think it was a graduation gift or something, but it was a gift and you guys get it. She opened that thing up, dude. She carries that thing around to this day and she just, she knows that you remembered her. It's a value statement, and so I mean, and you know, and not to mention just the opportunity, I mean practicing generosity opens up and roads to the gospel.

Speaker 2:

Yes, and that's the beauty.

Speaker 1:

Yes, right, amen. It's all about souls. It's all about souls, all about souls. So, as always on this podcast, we want to make sure we provide people with helpful resources. What are some things that you'd like to point people to that they might find?

Speaker 2:

helpful. So many good, so much good stuff out there the paradox of generosity, smith and Davidson it's just a good kind of eye opener. Gospel patrons John Reinhart has some of the best stuff out there about how God moves hearts and what the eternal return on investment. We have got a new advancement pastor that God's brought to us. His name is Andrew Stetsny and he's coming in soon and he loves this book Eternal Treasures, richard Garnett and the Go-Giver. He's talked to me about this book before a little story about a powerful business idea which is kind of like a generosity fable. You know, it's kind of it's intuitive, it's accessible and it's really fun.

Speaker 1:

So yeah, yeah, those are good resources. Yeah, we've got a bunch in there. Guys, check those out. Yeah, gospel We've got a bunch in there, guys Check those out. Yeah, gospel patrons I couldn't recommend it more and there's so many out there. But also, as always, guys, we want I want to remind you, we want your questions, comments and feedbacks here on the podcast. You know, make sure to leave a comment on YouTube or, if you're just listening, you can email us at the other six days at Southwest Church dot com. That's the number six, yeah, so let on. You know if you have questions about giving or things that you would like to get plugged into programs that we even offer. I mean, we offer things here at the church or we have recommendations of ways of getting you connected to help you be more generous.

Speaker 1:

And so anyway any last comments or thoughts before we wrap this up.

Speaker 2:

I'll just encourage everyone who's listening to start, just to start. Talk to Jesus, but just start. There's grace for us.

Speaker 1:

You know what I mean.

Speaker 2:

It's like, don't you know? You hear me and CJ talk about 10% and 12%.

Speaker 2:

We've been in a long time. You walk with Jesus and do what you got to do, but this, you know, I'm mindful of a comic who made the joke when she said procrastinate now, don't put it off, but don't let this just be something that stirs the heart and gets left on the back burner. It is, you know. I just want to encourage, I just want to make a challenge out there this speak I, not the Lord, because you got to talk to Jesus but find the lowest monthly bill you have and which is going to be on a streaming app that you don't watch I'm talking like $9.99. Whatever, something like that and decide what is the money, the little money that you wouldn't even think about anyway. It just is uneventful. You know what I mean. And give it to something in God's kingdom rhythmically and pay attention to what goes on in your soul and see if things don't change in six months, that's a word.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely, yeah, I echo that challenge for you out there. I just, you know, I guarantee God, god wants to do something in and through you and he wants to, he wants to use you in that way, and so I just say, step into that, you know, do something with it. And it doesn't have to be. You know, it's not about an amount.

Speaker 1:

Just do something it and it doesn't have to be, you know, it's not about an amount. Just do something, so good. Well, there you have it, guys. Thanks for joining us on another episode of the other six days podcast. Be sure to hit that subscribe, follow, share and like and, as always, spread the word and then take what you've heard and turn it into something you can do to further the gospel in the world around you. Until next time, peace.