Feeling Guilty When Life is Good: Shamans Cave

People who have strong spiritual practices tend to be very empathetic people. And when others are suffering sometimes we feel guilty when we have risen above and found practices and tools to create a good life. But life is for learning. And if you did your inner work and are out of the realm of suffering it is your destiny to feel joy and happiness. Instead of feeling empathy it is compassion that is being called for when looking at the lives of others. It is time for you to feel harmony, peace, and ease in your life as you do your inner work. Honor all you have done.

Join this fabulous show and listen to Renee and Sandra talk about how to hold yourself in ease in a world where people are learning important lessons through some form of loss and suffering. We are all learning! And that is what we came here to do.

Transcript

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Renee Baribeau: Hello everyone, I'm Renee Barabal, the Practical Shaman, and welcome to the Shaman's Cave!

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Sandra Ingerman: Hi everyone, I'm Sandra Ingerman, and welcome to the Shaman's Cave. And today, we wanted to talk about… this is a topic that, that I've dealt with a lot, so I think that other people deal with it too, and I watch it.

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Sandra Ingerman: So, we're living in a world that is just filled with amazing amount of drama, and we're just all being assaulted by all this negativity.

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Sandra Ingerman: Which is why I think people are cutting off of social media, cutting off of the news. They really can't handle being assaulted by so much negativity every day.

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Sandra Ingerman: And that's actually a very healthy choice, I think, that people are making right now.

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Sandra Ingerman: But one of the things that's come up for me a lot,

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Sandra Ingerman: and I know it comes up for others, is that when we're on a spiritual path.

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Sandra Ingerman: And we find a way… we're not completely out. We're trying to work a way out. We're trying to find a path that leads us away from the dramas of the world.

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Sandra Ingerman: There's a part of us that holds ourselves back.

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Sandra Ingerman: of how can I lead myself away from the dramas of the world and create a good life for myself while so many people are suffering on the planet?

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Sandra Ingerman: Isn't it important for me to suffer with everybody else?

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Sandra Ingerman: Who am I to create a good life for myself?

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Sandra Ingerman: while other people are suffering. And so, I think that there's this unconscious, when we start to do a lot of spiritual work.

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Sandra Ingerman: And we start to work with light. The work I teach with Transfiguration is really big right now. A lot of people are writing about that.

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Sandra Ingerman: When we start to find that inner joy inside of us, inner joy is like love. It's actually unconditional. It's not conditional.

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Sandra Ingerman: When we use our spiritual practices, and we're starting to find a way through to a better life.

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Sandra Ingerman: There's an unconscious hook inside of us that pulls us back.

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Sandra Ingerman: into the tribe of suffering. How can I leave my tribe and create a good life for myself?

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Sandra Ingerman: And we have to really understand that every single person on this planet has chosen a particular destiny.

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Sandra Ingerman: And sometimes that sounds, you know, it sounds, incorrect to say things like that. It sounds like we're dishonoring people by saying, oh, you chose a life of suffering.

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Sandra Ingerman: But the point of life, the point of life on Earth is about learning, and so we're all here to learn something.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so, if you've already learned, have your lessons about suffering, and you've moved forward on the river of life, and you're starting to use your spiritual practices to create a really good life for yourself.

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Sandra Ingerman: it's important not to feel guilty. You did your work, and your work is still in progress, and you're still learning about a different aspect of life, about a different evolution of life.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so it's about honoring everything that you've been through, and everything that you survived, and that you are coming through to a different place in your life.

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Sandra Ingerman: And that we have to have compassion, deep, deep compassion, for people who are going through suffering, but not to let ourselves say, I am not gonna shift.

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Sandra Ingerman: out of the place where people are at right now, because I feel too guilty to do that.

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Renee Baribeau: I think that's really important, and the reminder that

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Renee Baribeau: That when you close a gate on suffering that's not yours.

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Renee Baribeau: Because it's not yours. Some… you have plenty to have things around in your own life, but if you start adding to, you know, that big sack you're carrying of suffering, and the stuff that… if you can't discern which is

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Renee Baribeau: Yours to tend to, which is not yours to tend to, it becomes heavier and heavier and heavier, and then you, you can't show up where you're really needed most in the world.

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Renee Baribeau: And…

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Renee Baribeau: we forget that we can have compassion for those other people that Sandra was just talking about, but it doesn't require that we have that possession over it. It's, you know, to really come from a place of, I feel you.

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Renee Baribeau: And… the first word that came in there, I don't want to be you, but, you know…

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Renee Baribeau: And I say that lightly.

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Renee Baribeau: But I can hold you in my heart, and I don't have to carry you on my… my back.

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Sandra Ingerman: Yeah, and, you know, again, it's also the understanding, like, for myself.

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Sandra Ingerman: I teach so much on manifestation, and I think everybody knows that, and I write about it endlessly, because I know… I know the power that we all have, and the power that we were born with.

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Sandra Ingerman: And that we are a seed of Source, so we have the same power of Source, so we have that same power to create different forms that we want to, manifest in this lifetime.

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Sandra Ingerman: And, but at the same time, due to the issues that I'm dealing with, I am in a physical, a really big physical place of suffering. I live in 100-plus pain all the time.

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Sandra Ingerman: But, do I have joy? Yes, I do.

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Sandra Ingerman: Because I work with my spiritual practices that I'm more than a body.

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Sandra Ingerman: And I find those spiritual practices, I find those things in life, the relationships with people, the hobbies I like to do, the beautiful relationship I have with my husband, the beautiful relationship I have with Renee and other people in the world.

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Sandra Ingerman: And it takes me out of that place of suffering.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so, I live with a particular amount of suffering in my life, and I understand I'm learning something, I'm learning something, and I'm working towards working it through.

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Sandra Ingerman: But it doesn't mean I want people to feel sorry for me about what I'm going through, because this is a life lesson for me. This is big.

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Sandra Ingerman: This is gonna change who I am in this world, and if I continue in my next lives, if I continue, it's finishing karma. It's finishing karma.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so, it's more about, create the beautiful life you want. And if you are suffering, realize there's another aspect of your life that you can move through.

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Sandra Ingerman: And I can really encourage you on that one. I laugh, I have joy in my life, in the midst of what I'm going through, and we can all do that. And I watch it in Indigenous cultures, I watch it with different,

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Sandra Ingerman: Native people, in that they are suffering a lot, but through their dancing, their singing, and their storytelling, they live a life of joy.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so, it's about not compromising your joy, not compromising your sovereignty, not compromising the destiny that you have of being a seed of Source, and that you can create a different life.

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Sandra Ingerman: We all have to realize that we have our own karma and our own destiny, and when we start to focus so much on other people's suffering.

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Sandra Ingerman: We actually end up sending a part of our soul to them, which is our vital essence, and so we actually hurt ourselves in doing that.

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Sandra Ingerman: And we hurt them in doing it, because we send this energy that they can't use. It's burdening energy to them.

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Sandra Ingerman: So, really working with compassion for others, but understanding you can still create a good life for yourself, and that's why you're here, to learn how to do that.

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Renee Baribeau: Yeah, it's really… whenever we start feeling sorry for somebody else or something, it's that judgment.

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Renee Baribeau: But you can really ask your own body, is this mine? Is this mine to carry? Is this mine to hold? But when I think that I know better for somebody else.

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Renee Baribeau: you know, I'm not a doctor, you know, I am a healer, but I still… I don't necessarily know what's right in somebody else's suffering, and I can also look at my own…

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Renee Baribeau: most of my own judgments around, you know, what I think that other people should be carrying or not caring, should be, you know, carrying. I know early on in my own healing, and it was necessary. I think I was in this period where I cried every single day for 3 years.

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Renee Baribeau: But it was really suffering of my own making when I look back at it now, but then it was, you know, it was massive, and it was a time where I had to be with my discomfort.

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Renee Baribeau: that was so great that it caused me to do some work to change, but what I learned really early in was that I didn't have to be in it all day long.

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Renee Baribeau: And I learned it quite by accident. I took myself to the movie theater once, and it was the first time I ever went to a movie alone.

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Renee Baribeau: And there was a sister act that was playing, and I thought for sure everyone in the theater was gonna be noticing how miserable I was, like they didn't give a shit. But I got my ticket, I went in, I sat down, I laughed until I was snorting.

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Renee Baribeau: You know, and on the way out, I heard this voice of spirit saying, okay, Renee, do you want to carry this laughter and this fun with you a little bit longer, or do you want to go pick your suffering up back at the ticket booth?

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Renee Baribeau: And…

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Renee Baribeau: in that moment, I realized, wow, that even if I'm in the middle of pain, or I'm in the middle of hurting, that I can set a timer on it. I can put… I don't need to be in a… sloshing around all the time. I can, you know, I can get on the phone with Sandra, and we can just have belly laughs, or I can take a walk in nature, but it's not…

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Renee Baribeau: It's not a commitment to suffering.

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Sandra Ingerman: Yeah, and I think it's… I think that's really brilliant, and I think it's really important information, and for me, where I've come to, it's just a cycle of life that I'm in. It's almost like I'm looping back to my original work. My original work was Soul Retrieval. That was the first book I wrote. I've written 13 books, and that was my first book.

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Sandra Ingerman: And what I'm realizing, because how I'm talking to people right now about this conversation that we're having.

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Sandra Ingerman: because I'm talking to a lot of people about it, is back, when I first wrote Soul Retrieval, and for, you know, the first 20 years after that.

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Sandra Ingerman: I had a very, very vibrant practice. You know, people waited 6 months to a year to come to see me. There was no online work. You came to see me, whether you lived in Greece or whether you lived in the UK, you got on a plane and you came to my house to see me.

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Sandra Ingerman: And I worked with hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people who had cancer.

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Sandra Ingerman: And they had their diagnosis. You have two weeks to live. And they came in with that, you know, to me.

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Sandra Ingerman: And so what I learned from all my years of working with people who were given a diagnosis of dying from something, whether it was cancer or something else.

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Sandra Ingerman: is that it's our soul that makes the decision. It's our soul that makes the decision on absolutely everything in our life. Everything.

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Sandra Ingerman: Whether you're gonna move through a period of suffering, because there's a lesson you need to learn, that's a decision of your soul.

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Sandra Ingerman: Whether you come to a beautiful place, that's a decision of your soul. Whether the next step of your healing is life, or whether the next healing, next step of your healing is death, that's the decision of your soul.

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Sandra Ingerman: Everything in your life is the decision of your soul.

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Sandra Ingerman: So, what I'm doing now, because I'm remembering my own work, is every day, I say I trust where my soul is taking me. I trust where my soul is carrying me to.

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Sandra Ingerman: And I think in a world that is so filled with drama, suffering, power over greed right now, if you can go within, and every day say, I trust where my soul is leading me now.

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Sandra Ingerman: That gives your whole body, your whole being, a sense that you're being led. You're being led, we all know we're being led by spirit and held in spirit. We don't have to talk about that.

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Sandra Ingerman: But what about if you knew that your own soul was also leading you through every adventure that you're going through in life?

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Sandra Ingerman: And that every person on the planet who's going through their suffering right now, their soul is making a decision about

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Sandra Ingerman: how to heal, and how to move forward. And we all have that, and if we can just drop in, I trust spirit, and I trust my soul.

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Sandra Ingerman: to lead me forward, and that's my mantra all day long right now. And my God, I cannot tell you… I cannot tell you how much responsibility it's taken away from my mind to figure out things.

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Sandra Ingerman: How much peace it's given to my heart, how much peace it's given to my body, just to know that my soul is carrying me to the next step.

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Renee Baribeau: Yeah, there's such freedom in trusting that you're being led where you're going.

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Renee Baribeau: And, you know, there's certainly… I heard once something called, you know, missed opportunities. And I don't look at missed opportunities as me not going where my soul wanted to go.

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Renee Baribeau: I look at them more as my soul giving me a couple of choices, and I get to choose and open the gate of the one that I want, and even… even in my free will and opening that gate, and it might lead to more suffering, that my soul still

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Renee Baribeau: You know, has another gate out on the backside of this that gets me, you know, a little bit further up along on the path.

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Renee Baribeau: with a lesson or two that I might have needed to learn along the way.

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Sandra Ingerman: For me, it's the opposite of what you just said. I've had some really huge missed opportunities, where I could have been a thousand times more public than I am right now.

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Sandra Ingerman: And I believe my soul stopped me from having those opportunities.

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Sandra Ingerman: Because I don't have the personality to be as public as I am now. I've never had the personality. And so, to be more public, that might have fed my ego, but my soul was saying, that would have killed you.

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Sandra Ingerman: And when I look back on the two missed opportunities that I had, and and I made decisions that were kind of crazy around them, that blew the opportunity.

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Sandra Ingerman: I now know it was my soul trying to protect me, because it was taking me to a place that would have fed my ego, and would have destroyed my life.

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Sandra Ingerman: But, I see them as missed opportunities, but they saved my life to have those missed opportunities.

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Renee Baribeau: Yeah, I don't know if we're so… so far… too far off, but yes, I hear that too, because there's been a couple of big ones in my own life, and I always call those my war stories. Like, you know, the guy who wanted to put me in every single mall with my restaurant across the country.

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Renee Baribeau: And I didn't… I don't know if I had the ego strength then to even accept that kind of an offer, or if it was

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Renee Baribeau: you know, my soul saying, hey, hey, Renee, you know, cooking was just going to be one… one stop along your journey.

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Renee Baribeau: So, it's hard to really know. I wonder if, when we do our little life review, if we get an idea, it's like, was that our soul, or was that us being egotistical? Kind of a good question. I would love to hear from other people at home whether they think that

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Renee Baribeau: their soul protected them, or their ego got in the way. Don't you think that'd be a really fun question to answer?

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Sandra Ingerman: That's a great question. That's a really great question. I mean, for me to reflect on my life right now, if I would have accepted those opportunities, if I would have made the change that would have, I wouldn't be here now. I'd be dead.

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Sandra Ingerman: It would have killed me.

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Renee Baribeau: We're glad you're here.

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Sandra Ingerman: Yeah, so… so, you know, it was like, heartbreak. This was… I missed this unbelievable… I said no to this, or I, I, I sabotaged it. I sabotaged one.

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Sandra Ingerman: And one was just the weather stopped me from getting someplace where, I had a meeting with a person that would have changed my life.

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Sandra Ingerman: And, now I look at it as, thank, oh my God, thank the spirits for not letting me get there. Oh my God, thank my soul for not letting me get there.

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Sandra Ingerman: And, it's just so important, and just looping back to what we're talking about in suffering.

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Sandra Ingerman: Is we do have a destiny, and sometimes we start to judge because our ego, it's like.

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Sandra Ingerman: We look at what's going on in the world, and our ego is going, this is not right, and it's not right. It's not right, what's happening.

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Sandra Ingerman: But, they're still learning. We're still learning. And so, in that particular way, everybody's going through what they need to learn right now.

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Renee Baribeau: And… and again, we… I think that this whole idea of, you know, I'm like a… I'm a sensitive, I'm a Libra, I want everything to be nice, nice. And last week, I had this experience where

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Renee Baribeau: I happened to say that I didn't take size, because I… in my mind, I'm not taking size. And somebody came back and put it right in my face, like, how can you not take size? You're a shaman, you know, like, how dare you not be suffering along with us? And…

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Renee Baribeau: But what happened was, for some reason, I had some compassion for what she said, and it absolutely… I dropped into something…

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Renee Baribeau: that I had been giving lip service to for years, And finally understood what…

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Renee Baribeau: What this particular person was trying to say to me about my privilege.

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Sandra Ingerman: food.

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Renee Baribeau: And…

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Renee Baribeau: And had I not… if I had gone down the tubes of not even being open to another perspective on what was

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Renee Baribeau: keeping me out of harmony with myself, which, to me, suffering is when I'm not in harmony with myself, and, you know, I'm splattering it all over the world. I was able to hold a question long enough to get a different input.

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Renee Baribeau: And I think that being able to hold that question a little bit longer when you're going down the suffering tubes is really important.

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Sandra Ingerman: Yeah, I think that's really important, and I… and just to add to that, for me, what I've been sharing with people is when you start, focusing on the suffering of others.

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Sandra Ingerman: how much of your vital energy… again, I'm gonna bring it back to soul, because the definition of soul is your essence, your vital energy. If you look it up at Webster's, that's the definition of Webster's. It's your vital energy.

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Sandra Ingerman: So, how much your vital energy did you give away?

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Sandra Ingerman: And that's not healthy. You can't help people when you give your vital energy.

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Renee Baribeau: Hmm.

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Sandra Ingerman: It's not a way to help people. And it's a way to burden them, and it's a way to make you sick.

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Sandra Ingerman: So, you know, it's all about realizing that we're all here, we're all learning, and instead of judging everybody for their opinions, what they're going through, their life.

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Sandra Ingerman: Allowing yourself to ride your own river, you know, to ride your own current on the river, and to not feel like,

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Sandra Ingerman: For me, I'm just gonna use the same thing that, ISIS gave me years ago, is don't go down with the sinking ship. Don't go down with the sinking ship. And when the ground under you is starting to dissolve.

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Sandra Ingerman: Where are you looking? Where are you looking? If the ground under you is starting to break up, you better be looking forward. You better be looking forward.

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Renee Baribeau: That's so important. I think that's a really kind of a good place to put some closure on this.

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Renee Baribeau: And when you close that gate on suffering, especially the suffering that's not yours, it's not your work, it's, you know, it's yours to witness, but it's not yours to carry, and if you're carrying it, you'll feel it in your body.

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Renee Baribeau: If you're, like, feeling really sluggish and really out of sorts.

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Renee Baribeau: you might want to see who's… who else is suffering you're carrying, because once you give that back in a loving way, always send it back and trans… like Sandra said, everyone's talking about this transmutation again. When you can transmute it, and it's… kind of dissipates, it's not, like, changing form, it just dissipates, right? Is that correct? Then you can… your vitality returns.

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Sandra Ingerman: Exactly, yeah.

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Renee Baribeau: I just want to say that right, because I know that's, you know, that's your… that's your format of, you know, that's your form of method, but I know that when something really…

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Renee Baribeau: heals in me, it…

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Renee Baribeau: it's released. It's not something I'm trying to hang on to, make new bread out of it, you know, frost it up a new way. It's…

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Sandra Ingerman: Right. Yeah. Yeah.

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Sandra Ingerman: Yeah, it's brilliant. Yeah, so we hope that we've inspired you today to not get lost in the suffering of the world, but to really realize that you're walking on a path, and

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Sandra Ingerman: You have a lot of choices, and you have a lot of choices of how to create ease and harmony in your life, and don't feel guilty about it.

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Renee Baribeau: I know, I was really happy this week to see a friend of mine create a dispatcho ceremony for 12 members in her community. And I really believe, and this is… I really believe that this is the time that you gather your friends together in small groups around your own campfires and your own living rooms.

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Renee Baribeau: And do something that… It bolsters all of you in a way that is serving yourselves.

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Renee Baribeau: And that lightens the load as well. So that's my recommendation, is if you're really in a place where you're really struggling with your own suffering.

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Renee Baribeau: Gather a few friends and try to shift it through ceremony.

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Sandra Ingerman: That's beautiful. Thank you, Renee. That's a beautiful ending, and we'd really love to hear your comments on the Shaman's Cave, and what's happening for you around getting lost in what's going on in the collective.

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Sandra Ingerman: And what are the tools that you're using to be able to separate yourself from the collective, not from a place of not caring, not from a place of not being compassionate, but understanding that this is your life?

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Renee Baribeau: Hmm, I love that. Follow us over at Shaman's TV, come over to the Shaman's Cave, and if you feel inclined, share this podcast with somebody else who could use it today.

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Renee Baribeau: And we'll see you again in a couple of weeks.

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Sandra Ingerman: Hi, everyone.