The Inner Wealth Podcast

Ep233. Part Two — Survival vs Conscious Relationships: The Rebuild After Collapse (with Angie).

• Mike Kitko

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In this episode, Mike and Angie continue their ten-part series by moving deeper into the heart of their transformation — the shift from a survival-based relationship to a conscious one. After laying the foundation of their childhoods and early conditioning in Part One, this conversation explores how unconscious patterns, nervous system wiring, and unresolved inner conflicts shaped sixteen years of toxicity, volatility, and emotional harm.

They walk through the moment everything collapsed, the decision to rebuild rather than repeat, and the painful truths required to move from fear, control, and projection into responsibility, ownership, and growth. This episode draws a clear line between relationships driven by survival and those rooted in consciousness — and why nothing truly changes until each person takes full responsibility for what’s happening inside their own body and nervous system.

Key Takeaways

  1. There Is Never Only One Toxic Person in a Toxic Relationship
    Survival-based dynamics are mutual, even when the pain expresses differently for each partner.
  2. The Nervous System Prioritizes Familiarity Over Safety
    People repeat unhealthy relationships not because they want pain — but because their nervous system knows how to survive there.
  3. Unspoken Expectations Create Hidden Resentments
    When internal conflicts are outsourced to a partner, the relationship becomes a battleground instead of a bond.
  4. Triggers Reveal What Needs Healing
    External events don’t create emotional reactions — they expose what’s already stored beneath the surface.
  5. Conscious Relationships Are Built on Ownership, Not Control
    Growth happens when each person cleans up their own triggers instead of demanding the other person change.

Notable Quotes

  • “There’s never only one toxic person in a toxic relationship.”
  • “The nervous system has one job and one job only — to keep you alive.”
  • “Nothing on the outside of you can solve internal conflicts inside.”
  • “When you expect the external world to solve internal conflicts, this is when you’re in survival mode.”
  • “A conscious relationship is built on an unbreakable commitment to work on everything together without guilt, shame, anger, threats, and blame.”

Call to Action

📘 Inner World, Outer World — Available Now on Amazon
 A guide to understanding how the inner world shapes the outer life. Order yours here!

👥 Message Mike or Angie Directly
mike@innerwealthglobal.com angie@innerwealthglobal.com

Music Credit: "What's Left of Me" by Wes Hoffman & Friends

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Series Setup And Past Wounds

SPEAKER_02

Do you ever wake up feeling like there's something missing you like? Do you ever feel the need to explain your business? Are you running your life or is your life running yourself? I'm like GitHub and I'll help you design and create a life so authentic and aligned with who you really are, you'll get excited just to wake up. I'll help you create real wealth, success, and freedom from the inside out. Welcome to the Inner Wealth Podcast, where we learn and choose to live inspired each and every day. Not everything about our lives, but you know, you know, about our lives and our paths, path and our journey. And last week, uh a couple two weeks ago, we introduced it. We introduced this series because it was a kind of new idea that we had. Um, and last week, part one was really about just our past from you know our childhood. Angie's expressed her childhood, I expressed my childhood. Hers was much more, and this isn't a comparison game, but Angie's was much more compelling and much more painful and much more to endure than mine. But it's it's important to have both both childhoods out there and both experiences of life because it builds upon each other. And when you merge these into uh into one relationship, I guess, or or shared energy pattern, then it creates a dynamic that was very toxic. And we shared that the first 16 years of our life were our our lives together, were very, very toxic and very uh we endured a lot together, we endured a lot of hardship and there was a lot of physical, mental, emotional abuse in our in our lives, in our marriage, and and in our parenting and the way we parent our kids. And uh in 2016, everything collapsed and we got the the opportunity to rebuild. And last week I kind of teased that this week would be about the difference between, let's call it a uh a survival-based relationship and a conscious relationship. Because the the path going forward that we're gonna talk about over you know the next the next eight, not eight or nine weeks, including today, is very much how to shift everything from a survival-based lifestyle to a to a conscious lifestyle and a survival way of being to a conscious way of being. And it really, I think the story and the crux and the things that that that we're asked about a lot is how did you two rebuild your relationship from all of that and move move into this in this new lifestyle where people can only see uh you know how we're living now. They don't most people in our lives haven't seen, didn't see the the carnage and the wreckage of the past, but it looks night and day. And uh I think this is where the story really, really gets good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and uh first I want to apologize for how I sound. I am absolutely atrociously sick again, for like the third time this winter. So please forgive me. And uh, this is funny that ties into a conversation we had on our mastermind yesterday about embarrassment, about people feeling embarrassed about how they show up. And I was mentioning, I was relating to one of our clients talking about her being feeling embarrassed about showing up on camera discussing real estate. And I talked about how I, you know, I'm still a little self-conscious about how I look on camera. And and uh so the universe said, Hey, let's go ahead and give you one more thing to be self-conscious about. You're probably gonna cough and sniffle your entire way through this podcast. So please forgive me. I sound like a frog.

SPEAKER_02

Um so there's there's tissue paper here, and there's water and everything we can to minimize because she sneezes every few minutes and she coughs in between.

SPEAKER_01

But we're still gonna get this done.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So yeah, I'm I'm ready to talk about this because um, you know, when when you when you you created the structure of this the series, I think one of the first things that I thought about was the conscious versus unconscious relationship piece was how I reacted at first when you when you decided, when you made this decision to start this this journey, and I was still kind of not on board, but was like, okay, I don't want to lose my family. And I love telling this story is I remember when you when you had brought this to my attention, you weren't gonna work for anyone else, you're gonna start your own business, and you started working out, you started eating healthy, you were losing weight, and I was like, all right, if this dude's gonna get hot and rich, that's my time. I put 16 years into it. That is no one else's, no one else is getting that. So that was a pretty damn unconscious way to look at it. But yeah, you know, that that was my my first thought.

Filing For Divorce As Wake-Up Call

SPEAKER_02

And and I I think for me, now now as you're saying that, I think uh uh instead of just talking about a you know a kind uh a survival relationship versus a conscious relationship, I think it's maybe discussing setting the stage for how you know how it all happened, and that uh at some point when I started doing all this work, I got really, really tired of the life. You know, I I Angie was no fun to be around anymore. That the energy was awful. And it wasn't she wasn't a you know, she was no worse of a person, but as my energy was elevating and as my consciousness was elevating and as my awareness was elevating in all of these beliefs, and I started seeing through some of the fog, I was like, I'm not willing to be around this anymore and and deal with this. And I tried to do things to help her step into a higher step way, and I I would earmark little pages of things that I was reading and send videos of things that I and she wouldn't read any of it, she wouldn't listen or watch any of it. She just completely ignored it. I'm like, okay, well, if she's not gonna like, if she's not hungry for any of this and and she doesn't have an appetite or she's not open to any of this, obviously she's not gonna grow, we're gonna grow apart, we are growing apart, and I filed for divorce.

SPEAKER_03

Right.

SPEAKER_02

And when I came home uh and told Angie that I had filed for divorce, which we had threatened a billion times. Literally, a billion. Uh I told Angie and she was high, and she was on the phone, but she was very, very high. And she basically laughed at me. Yeah, and and I went to we had been sleeping in separate bedrooms for months, and and I went, I went into uh my bedroom and uh which just happens to be our cat room now. So we're cleaning out the energy of that, all that madness. But uh I went to the bedroom, my bedroom, and the next day I woke up because I was still doing my spiritual work, my spirit, my my meditating, my my work, my my reading, my whatever, my energy work. And I and when she came downstairs, she she was sober-ish again, whatever. And she said, I don't want this. And I I was in a place of total resistance. I was like, no, I just gave you months and months and months of opportunity, and you wanted nothing to do with now. I dropped the hammer and suddenly you're on board. So it's just gonna be a matter of time before you've returned to the old behavior. And I know I've resisted it. You what's your perspective on that? Tell tell your side of that story.

SPEAKER_01

I just that's why that that's I just told it. That was it. That was my entire thought process.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

That that was it. I mean, yeah, and I remember oh, I also remember there was there was I remember one one of the most painful things I remember you saying to me was you came into our bedroom one day and you were like, Your energy is disgusting and I cannot be around you.

SPEAKER_02

And you don't feel good to be here.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah. However, you said it, it was just, I was like, wow. And I think that was, and again, subconsciously, because back then I couldn't I couldn't have told you that this is what what was happening. Um, but looking back, it was like that was probably a pretty pretty pivotal thing that you know, like, wow, what do you mean, my heart of me? What do you mean?

SPEAKER_02

You know, that was very up to the point that I started growing, I felt the same as you.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And when when there's two people in a relationship, typically, if you think about, you know, the the popular version of this is called the law of attraction, where if I'm a one, then she's a one.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Because I attracted her into my life. So uh, and and or vice versa. Like if I'm looking at her, going, she's a, you know, she on a scale of consciousness zero to one or to ten, if if she's a one, then it means I'm a one because I'm like we're right, and nine's not gonna be other one.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah.

The Law Of Attraction And Levels

SPEAKER_02

And when somebody starts a spiritual journey and a spiritual work and really starts to let go of of shadows and path, and we're gonna talk about Samscaras and all this stuff, and start releasing things from the nervous system and start reshaping their belief system, they're gonna start moving up the scale of consciousness, you know. Maybe at first it's a 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, but then as you as you understand the work, you start to make bigger moves. And and the the the wider you get on that scale, the more uncomfortable it is. And there's only there's only three things that can happen, right? One is the person that's a one tries to bring the other person back down. The other is the person that's that's in the at a lower level of consciousness says, How do you do that? I want to, I want to participate with that, and and jumps up to that level, or they separate, right? So, and I worked kind of tirelessly. Uh, tried to get her to come up to because I was feeling better and I was experiencing different things and I was seeing life differently and and seeing the the madness. And I tried hard to get her to come up because I didn't want to lose her, and but she tried hard to get me to come back down, and then when I filed for divorce, it was that it she I think that's when it finally there was there was that message that wow, he's not coming back. And unconsciously, she's saying he's not coming down back down to my level, so I gotta jump up to his.

SPEAKER_01

Because up until that point, I think it wasn't it was just me trying to pull you back down. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Well, and then the both of us were for 16 years. I mean, to be fair, for 16 years we were both at a one, yeah, and we didn't we couldn't articulate that we were both in a one, but this is the important part to understand. And I remember being out on a run and I was listening to an audio book when I heard this line, and and it it it was like a lightning bolt and and uh a spark of not inspiration but of awareness that I had always been looking for. And I hear, you know, in my coaching and in my teaching or in workshops, we've had we've had people in our workshops that were just complete victims of of relationships, and they just kept pleading victim over and over and over. This person's doing this to me, this person's doing this to me. And the it was an insight that said, there's never only one toxic person in a toxic relationship. Yeah, and that's a very, very hard bill to swallow when somebody says, It was all you, they're toxic, they're narcissists, they're there, they're there, there.

SPEAKER_00

Like I'm fine, they're the problem.

Weapons Of The Weak: Guilt To Blame

SPEAKER_02

Right. And I think that's how a lot of people I remember being in corporate, and we had an HR, uh, an HR leader in in our business, and she said that she wanted to go to couples counseling because you know, her marriage was, you know, there was she had a heart some hardship in her marriage. And when the counselor started turning the you know, the mirror on her, she's like, No, we're not here for me to be fixed, we're here for him to be fixed. And the counselor's like, Yeah, but maybe you own some of this. And she said that was hard to hard to endure and hard to swallow, but eventually she saw that how true that was in a toxic relationship. And what I mean by that is where there's physical, mental, emotional abuse, where there's a where's uh there's a lot of addiction, where there's you know, lack of peace, where there's lack of communication, lack of disharmony, where you know, there's there's uh my five uh my five weapons of someone who's operating from a place of weakness, uh guilt, shame, anger, threats, and blame. If if those are weapons that people use when they are trying to be a victim, all right, when they feel like they're a victim. Guilt and shame, anger, threats, and blame. And I put them in that order just so that they kind of roll off the tongue and and and you know they're cheeky. Guilt and shame, anger, threats, and blame. If you use those in your life, or or if you are in a relationship where those are present, if they're if they're a weapon that you use against someone, or if they're a weapon that somebody uses against you and you continue to let it fester, then you are in a toxic dance, all right? And that's a hard pill to swallow for some people, especially people that think that they have it figured out and everybody else is all fucked up, because that's where we were. We we were all fucked up, but we didn't know it. Well, I mean, it was it it didn't feel good, but we looked outside and we said, Yeah, you guys are all doing it wrong because whatever XYZ we justified our poor behavior.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I can't remember how we did that, but we did. I I it was nuts.

SPEAKER_02

So so just think about that. If if if if you have you're in a toxic dance, it and and you have some semblance of victimization or something, right? Some area of weakness or operating from some place of fear, if you use guilt, shame, anger, threats, and blame, it to try to control the environment or control other people or uh control circumstances or manipulate circumstances or get things to to happen for you, the uh to get people to give you what you want.

SPEAKER_01

To behave in a way that you need them to behave. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. So if you use any of those to influence the world outside of you to rearrange itself or to rearrange something so that you feel that you can be okay, then then there's there's something in you that's certain that's very survival-based. And I think that goes back to that's how we kind of start with survival relationship versus conscious relationship.

SPEAKER_01

And that's and that's when when we talk about the the one trying to bring the person back down. I think that that's that's what it was was again back to the comment I made that was another piece of the survival relationship was this is how we've always behaved, this is how we've always shown up, this is how we've always acted. We need to continue this way because that's that's safe. That's all we knew. It's all I knew, it's all we knew. And I mean, and again, going back to talking last week about our childhoods, that was better than how I grew up. So in my mind, it it was everything was fine. And again, think talking this out loud right now is just makes me realize how absolutely insane and ridiculous and backward it all was.

SPEAKER_02

But but that's the life that we lived. And next week we're gonna talk about, and we still have plenty to go here because we're gonna describe a survival-based relationship and a conscious-based relationship. But next week we're gonna dive into the nervous system. And and I'm gonna just gonna tease this right now because this is important to understand. But the nervous system has one job and one job only. And what is it?

SPEAKER_01

To keep you safe. No, oh, to keep you alive, keep you alive. Sorry, sorry, Jen Kutch. You I just I sold that for me.

SPEAKER_02

That is that is everyone's first go-to. That is everyone's first go-to.

SPEAKER_01

It's not like we don't talk about this very damn week.

Familiar Pain And The Nervous System

SPEAKER_02

Every single week on multiple, multiple calls, the nervous system has one job and one job only, and that is to keep you alive, even if those conditions are unsafe, because the way the nervous system tries to keep you alive is to keep you in familiar circumstances. Familiar circumstances, and the even if they're unsafe, because inside of familiar circumstances, regardless if they're safe or not, it knows how to operate there. And unfamiliar circumstances naturally feel like there's there's no control, there's no familiarity, there's an uncertainty that the nervous system wants no parts of. So this is why self-sabotage happens constantly and commonly, because it's not that the person's a bad person, it's that their nervous system can't handle something that it's not super familiar with. The nervous system has one job and one job only to keep you alive. It does that by keep you keeping you in familiar circumstances, and it keeps you in familiar circumstances because it knows how to operate there. I think a requirement in joining the inner wealth mastermind is going to be getting that tattooed on everyone's forehead because there's a natural tendency to say safe. And that's the reason that people don't understand that people go from unsafe relationship to unsafe relationship to unsafe relationship to unsafe relationship because the nervous system knows how to operate there, and the nervous system is just trying to keep you alive.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think you've asked that question on every mastermind call for like the past three months, and either Jen or Rachel or somebody always comes out and says, Most people get it wrong. Yeah, it just feels natural to say to keep you safe.

SPEAKER_02

It's not true because I've worked with people that have been physically, mentally, emotionally abused in serially in relationship after relationship, and they keep entering these unsafe, unhealthy relationships. And when they're as as they're moving from unsafe to unhealthy and an unhealthy relationship to unsafe and unhealthy relationship, it's literally because their nervous system is wired to see that as familiar and natural, and it doesn't know how to operate outside of there. It doesn't mean they're stupid, it doesn't mean they're a bad person, it doesn't mean they're delusional, it just means they're operating at their highest level of consciousness and awareness, which is through the nervous system and as it's built at that moment.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, and and the the the saying, you know, you don't know what you don't know. And if you don't know how to be in a healthy relationship, for sure, what a toxic relationship is going to feel normal for you because that our relationship felt normal to me. And that was a step up from my last relationship, and it was a step up from where I came from. So every step up was just what was one level higher, but still like, oh, okay, cool. This is this this this feels right.

SPEAKER_02

But but you were still modeling a lot of this is why we did the the childhood last week, is a lot of what you were modeling in our marriage, you brought forward from what you saw a lot of dad and stepmom and and your mom and whatever grandmom with the liquor bottles and throwing liquor bottles and hitting people with liquor bottles.

SPEAKER_01

I was a baddie.

SPEAKER_02

I might have gotten a lot of shit thrown at me in our marriage, but you brought that forth. I saw a lot of a lot of uh trying to appease of of self self-sacrifice, not playing the victim, but I also saw a lot of retaliation and a lot of yelling and screaming and arguing and and and yelling and and tearing down and condescension and manipulation and and I saw a lot of that shit, so I carried that shit forward, right? And then inside the walls of our our home, there was just a lot of abuse. You held these unspoken expectations. I held these hidden resentments, and I also held some unspoken and spoken expectations. We both held spoken and unspoken expectations. And when our expectations weren't met by the other person, which was impossible, then then we we backlashed and and and we and we we we attacked. And it was just abusive, and volatile physical, mental, emotional abuse on freaking every level.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it really was.

Survival Mode In Daily Life

SPEAKER_02

And that was that's a survival-based relationship. I feel I felt incomplete, I felt insecure, I was afraid of losing my family. I I was trying to feel, I wrote a book called The Imposter in Charge because I there was a level of inadequacy and insignificance in me that I was trying to solve, right? I felt unloved, I felt unlovable, and all of those things I was looking for her to solve. Right. And I she can't solve those for me. She couldn't solve those for me. And that's a survival-based relationship where you enter it to try to feel a sense of completeness with the other person, or expect the other person to fill up that come that incompleteness. Now, with with me saying that about what I wanted you to solve for me that you couldn't possibly solve, what did you what did you expect to solve for me? Or what did you expect for me to solve for you inside of our our marriage?

SPEAKER_01

I think it was just secure. I think it was simply security. I think it was just a security-based finding, you know, just just be feeling secure. I mean, because they're really, I can't think of anything that I was trying to get you to to solve within me. I I mean fear of abandonment, so leaving so so the the yep, abandonment.

SPEAKER_02

You just read my mind.

SPEAKER_01

Abandonment, um, safety, security.

SPEAKER_02

Yep.

SPEAKER_01

Um, yeah, I think that those would be the three main ones.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. And and look, this is it's not that she didn't love me, it's that I felt unlovable and unloved, and there's nothing she could do about that. It's not that she felt unloved or that I didn't love her, it's that she felt unloved and unlovable. And I think we shared that together. It's not that she that that I didn't make her feel safe, it's that she couldn't feel safe. She couldn't feel safe regardless of what was what was happening around her. No matter how much money we had, no matter how big our house, no matter how much, no matter, no matter how many vacations, no matter where we live, wherever you go, you're there, there you are. And nothing on the outside of you, and this is the point, nothing on the outside of you can solve internal conflicts inside. But when you expect the external world to solve internal conflicts, this is when you're in survival mode.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And I I think that that you growing up in a way that it was someone always dying or you know, being left. I think that it was a protection mechanism against that too. That it was so backwards, my God. You know, I just I knew like I was so used to people leaving that, you know, why he's gonna leave too. And we talked about that before.

SPEAKER_02

And I had no intention, zero intention. And it started, you know, it didn't start late in our marriage. That started from from the get-go when you know we bought a house and we bought a car, and you're like, this is your house, this is your car, and yeah, you're you know, it it at some point you it's gonna be yours, and blah, blah, blah. And just, you know, you're gonna leave me. And it's like, holy crap, you know, I'm not, I had no intentions of leaving her. There was just there was such noise inside of her that she was looking for some way to for me to rid those feelings and to stay in the familiar circumstances and remain to remain safe.

SPEAKER_01

No, to remain alive.

One Plus One Equals Less Than One

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, one day we're gonna sing this song together and everybody's gonna sing it. Now, and we're we might be just be talking semantics. So it, but but I think it's more uh I think it's more valuable to understand it's there to keep you alive, okay? But the point being is this isn't just an angie thing. Angie had all this this stuff flying around in her, this insecurity and these stories of abandonment and and rejection, and she's I'm just uh I'm just gonna leave her at some point. She had all those stories. I had my own. I had my own. That uh she wasn't doing enough for me, that she wasn't giving me what I wanted, and she wasn't the porn star that I wanted to be, and and all this stuff she, you know, uh I that she wasn't affirming me, she wasn't touching me enough, all these things that were going on that were all internal conflicts that I was depending on her to read my mind of what I needed, and when she couldn't do that, spoken or unspoken expectations, when she couldn't do that, then I took it out on her, like it was her fault. And really, that's a very survival-based lifestyle, and that's when you enter a relationship where one plus one equals 0.5, right? Think about that. One plus one equals 0.5. You and me together, we were less than one. Yeah, we we we actually hurt each other and tore each other down, we were worse off individually and in relationship because of the way that that we were shelling up. Yep. Is that true? 100%. That is a survival-based relationship. And then some people, when I say, hey, you know, what's the dynamics of a healthy relationship? One plus one equals two. No, no, if it's if a relationship is one plus one equals two, then you got the wrong relationship. Because uh a healthy, creative, creation-based, empowering relationship, one plus one equals greater than two. You're you're greater together. And the reason you stay together is because you, as an individual, you are better because of the other person, and the relationship is better because of each of your contributions.

SPEAKER_01

Well, you know, I and I look at I I'm makes me a whole person a good makes you a good per a whole person, and then our relationship and how we show up together is the whole person. And that's that makes sense at all. It's like the three, that's just because I see us too.

Personal Responsibility And The Corner

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, and I would say because of you, I'm greater than one. Yeah, just by just by your presence. That this is why I'm saying, yeah, you you make me in there's a conscious relationship, right? So a survival-based relationship, you you attack, and we still we we got some other stories to tell about the survival-based relationship and how we showed up because we I think this is going to be probably the most valuable episode in in the series, but uh in in the survival-based relationship, you're both depleted because of each other. I used to tear you down endlessly. I used to I used to physically, mentally, and emotionally challenge you and deplete you. And I'm gonna take ownership of that, but that's what I also received.

SPEAKER_03

Right. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Right? But so it was it was we it was reciprocal. Never one toxic person in a toxic relationship. So I would I would get torn down no matter how hard I worked, no matter what I provided for the family, no matter how much I was like, No matter how much your raises were, no matter, yeah, no matter how I showed up, what whether you know, Mike, you you need to come home early, and I'd come home early, and there'd be something else that that that I would get nagged for. It was just constant, both ways, both ways. This isn't a one-way street. It's important for me to I I can recall it from my perspective easily, but this was this is not a one-way street, it was an equal street fight. It was, it was, and um, it was all based on survival. Yeah, it's about trying to fill ourselves up through each other, and nobody can do that for you.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, Jerry Maguire, that movie really ruined a lot of people when they came out with that damn line, you complete me. Oh, yeah. Oh my gosh. You can't complete another person.

SPEAKER_02

Now, we made a lot of changes, yeah, and we did a lot of things, yeah, and we did a lot of work. What do you think helped? And there's probably no one answer. I'm just I'm just throwing out something to to stimulate your your thought process. What can you point at to say whatever made a huge difference? Just give me one of something that made a huge difference in us moving from a survival-based relationship to a creation-based relationship.

SPEAKER_01

It was the work I did on myself. For me, yeah, yeah, it was the work that that I started doing on myself and starting to see these these buried traumas and these buried emotions and these buried fears and understanding that all of those things, and also recognizing that you know, you seeing your changes and seeing your growth. And then I I that's that that's really it was as I started clearing my shit out. I mean, I like to say that we went, I describe it as a boxing ring where we both went to our separate corners and I worked on my shit, you worked on your shit, and then we came back together in the middle, and it was like, hey, are we gonna keep these gloves on or are we gonna take them off?

SPEAKER_02

Would would you would you say, and this is a leading question, okay? But I'm I'm I'm helping you exactly what you just said.

SPEAKER_03

Okay.

SPEAKER_02

I'm just I'm just putting a different, like shining a light in a different direction. Would you say that actually taking a look at yourself and taking ownership of what was going on in your body was the thing that kind of kind of like leveled you up?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02

Because I think that's what going to your own corner is.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And you said taking a taking a look, right going, doing your own absolute personal responsibility.

SPEAKER_01

APR. We used to talk about that so much.

Love Languages Without Obligation

SPEAKER_02

Personal responsibility. It's going and saying, look, I've got fucked up.

SPEAKER_01

I've got these things.

SPEAKER_02

There's these parts of me that I've tried to ignore, or I've tried to, I've tried not to look at, or I've tried not to see, or I've tried, I tried to to to to get you to try to take away from me or whatever. And they're mine and I own them, and nobody else owns them, and I'm not a victim of anything.

SPEAKER_01

And you know what? It wasn't it's not even take away from me, it's proved me right.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? You know, like with with with all things say when you would when you would threaten divorce. See, there you go.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, there you go.

SPEAKER_01

I remember saying that so many times. You're proving me right. You're proving me right.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, well, look, my favorite story was Mother's Day.

SPEAKER_01

Oh gosh.

SPEAKER_02

And look, that's no, this is a good one. But but but I I love so first off, the divorce thing that happened all the time. It's like you were trying to get me to divorce you so that you could say that all the threats that you've ever like were right. Yeah, you didn't want to get divorced, but you said it so often, it's like you were trying to get me to do the thing so that you could finally be right. Yeah, and as our good friend Brian Schroeder says, is I wanted to be right more than I wanted to be successful.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And he said, once once he went, or in his words, I wanted to be right more than I wanted to be rich. Yeah, right. And and when he gave up the need to be right, then it became rich. Yeah, but the point being is you wanted to be right instead of being like in a in a relationship. So stupid. I know. But here's my favorite story. Oh my gosh, this is my favorite survival-based story, all right. Mother thing.

SPEAKER_01

Girls were no, it was just Katie, I think.

SPEAKER_02

No, no, no, no. It was it was both. It was both pregnant with our second child. You weren't. It was me, you, and Megan, and the girls were very young. It was like six and eight, something like that. It was it it was late 2000s, it was somewhere around 2008, 2000, somewhere in that range. It was so somewhere in there, maybe six and four. So, somewhere in those age ranges, the girls were very, very young. And me and the girls wanted to take mom out for Mother's Day. And me and the girls were really excited to take mom out for Mother's Day. Now, we weren't going to like her favorite restaurant because the girls really love Buffalo Wild Wings, and it's the only place that could keep them occupied, and you know, where we they had great beer selection and everybody loved the food. So it's not like we were going to a real fancy place, but we were gonna go take mom out and celebrate Mother's Day. And we were excited. We talked about it all morning, and we were excited to tell Angie that we're gonna take her out for Mother's Day, and she said, You're only doing that out of obligation. I don't want to go out for dinner. What were you thinking?

SPEAKER_01

I no, I can't, there's nothing I can say to even just I wasn't thinking.

SPEAKER_02

But we spent all day and I'm talking about hours trying to convince you literally hours that we really wanted to take you hours, and then when I then when they said okay, well we won't we won't go like after after hours after you said hours I really wanted to go out for Mother's Day. Oh my god, this sounds so ridiculous. But we spent hours trying to convince her we really want to take you out. You just kept saying the word obligation. We're only doing it because it's Mother's Day, only doing it like, no, we want to, and we have we probably spent four or five hours trying to convince you.

SPEAKER_01

That is not an exaggeration.

Defining A Conscious Relationship

SPEAKER_02

We wanted to we spent four to five hours trying to convince you that we were excited to take you out for Mother's Day, and finally we were like, I was like, all right, Angie, we won't go. You're like, I really wanted to go with holy shit, you're giving me no way to win, and and then like I I I grabbed you and I held on to you, and I'm like, Why are you fighting this so hard? And you said, I don't know, because I didn't know and I still and there was so much angst, and there was so much pain, and there was so much insecurity, and there was so much inadequacy, and there were so many stories and beliefs inside of there that nothing could take it away, and you were looking for something inside to take it away.

SPEAKER_01

Oh my gosh, that's that story still makes me laugh.

SPEAKER_02

And that's the kind that's the kind of stuff that we do when we're in a survival-based relationship. It doesn't always have to be that delusional, but but when when there's constant drama, constant conflict, it when even when there's patterns of drama and patterns of conflict, and patterns of guilt and shame, anger, threats, blame, when there's unspoken expectations, when there's this idea that you need to take care of the other person's wants and needs and desires, and you need to fulfill all that stuff, you're living in a you're living in a survival-based relationship. And and Angie, one time we were doing a podcast episode, and I brought up the idea, hey, what are your thoughts on the the five love languages? And you're like, oh, don't get me, don't get me started. That's a whole podcast episode, because all that book does is not all that book does, but a lot of people approach that book like, once I know their love language, it's up to me to fulfill it. And and that it's a greater reference book to understand the other person's love language, but it's their it's their job to own their love language.

SPEAKER_01

It's their job to own their love language. And I think that the one place where that book uh has a fatal flaw is that that it teaches from that space rather than learning the other person's love language and having the ability getting having the ability to recognize how they show you love because people show you love in the way that they that in their love language. So instead of saying, hey, I he I want gifts, it's you know, I know your acts of service, physical affection, you know, those those are yours. And so, okay, oh, so he's showing me love by doing the dishes, by hugs, by things like that. But he and that's just not my love language. I'm I'm gifts or I'm experiences, like I'm just quality time, and that's how I show my love. And it's right being able to recognize that in the other person.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, for sure. And understand they're they're living their life through their love language because that's what's most natural to them. That's the that's their their greatest instinct, is because that's that's how they're built to give in that way, right? When I when I cook you dinner, I am literally, that is an act of love for me because I and and especially if you ask me the greatest love thing, the thing that you can do to for me to feel loved, and this sounds ridiculous, but is to say, hey, make me a pot of chicken noodle soup. It's like you just filled me up. You just filled me up by asking me to to go into service for you. Now I get to go to I get to go to the grocery store, I get to cook you, then I get to serve you, then I get to clean up. There's nothing like that that fills my bucket up.

SPEAKER_01

But I don't want to go too far into this, but I just want to point out since we're getting so close to the good old Valentine's Day, I think that what people don't recognize is there are so many things on that love languages list that cause a lot of anxiety. I know for you, like date night plan, like things like that, date planning and all of that stuff and gift giving, that causes you a lot of anxiety and a lot of frustration because it's just not natural for you. And why would I put that expectation on you, on the person that I love more than anyone in this world? Why would I want to add pain and frustration and angst and stress into your strife and to your life? Uh, that's to me, that's just backwards.

Triggers As Teachers And Repair

SPEAKER_02

No, but that's my greatest, my love language is physical, physical affection and acts of service. So think about that sexually.

SPEAKER_03

Yep.

SPEAKER_02

Right? And and and all those years I expected you to be a porn star. It's the same thing. I was just trying to have those, those two love languages tied. And that's just not that's not in her DNA. So to expect her to either be that or become that, all it's gonna do is cause her to go out of alignment with her most natural state of being. Right now, if I say, hey, it's go time, she says yes. And if she says, hey, I want to go buy a bottle of perfume, I'm like, let's go. But I'm not gonna buy her a bottle of perfume and she's not gonna initiate sex. Yeah, that's just kind of how that's just kind of how she's built. And most people are like, no, I need my partner to do X, Y, Z. And that's why you're still living in a survival-based relationship. Now we're gonna move to a conscious-based relationship. We spent the first 40 minutes talking about uh survival-based, because I think that's the most important part. Now, in your best words, in your best way, describe a conscious-based relationship, a conscious relationship where two people are operating in not independence, not codependence, but interdependence, where one plus one equals three, and where both people are fulfilled within the relationship.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, so I was thinking about this knowing that this was our topic today, and that's it's kind of hard for me to really put into words. You're much better at the words thing than I am.

SPEAKER_02

Um you're better looking than me.

SPEAKER_01

Well, thank you. Um, but I communicate. And understanding, and just I think it's a lot of um observation of the other person and seeing how they operate and how they tick and what their love language is and what are their triggers and what are their responses and and just having all that understanding and being able to communicate those things at a level that's very safe and vulnerable.

SPEAKER_03

Sure.

SPEAKER_01

And knowing that knowing that this is not it's not me, my problem against you or your problem against me. It's us against the problem. It's us against that trigger or that that hurt or that trauma or whatever it is. I think it's just understanding that this is the the partnership is solid and it's we're we're in this together and not separate. It used to be me against you, and now it's us.

SPEAKER_02

Threats of divorce in a conscious relationship?

SPEAKER_01

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02

No, it hasn't been threat of divorce or of separation in close to a decade.

SPEAKER_01

Yep, no, and I mean, yeah, of course we still have our silly tift, but they're short, very short. Very short. They used to be weeks. We wouldn't speak, we would go to separate rooms, and no, there's none of that anymore.

SPEAKER_02

And it doesn't mean you don't get triggered.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_02

It doesn't mean you don't get triggered. It in in in my uh in my book, my the the the book that was released in August, Inner World, Outer World, I talk about a spiritual relationship. And inside of a spiritual relationship, there's a mutual agreement that we are going to get triggered. And when we get triggered, the person who's triggered, it's their job to clean that shit up.

Interdependence And Shared Destiny

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and I think that we've got and we've been able to get that space of, hey, I'm recognizing this, and you need to go figure that shit out and come back in a little bit. Yeah, and we somebody gets and being safe, and that's safe for us to do.

From Insecurity To Inspiration

SPEAKER_02

And somebody gets angry, and it's their job to clean up that anger, not the other person to change their behavior. It's because we're the a conscious relationship, uh, and this just came to mind. Okay, a conscious relationship is built on the foundation of um a com an unbreakable commitment to work on everything together without guilt, shame, anger, threats, and blame. Yeah. When they show up, you take ownership of one of those weapons of the week, and you bring yourself to a place of letting the other person know that you don't want to show up that way, and that they didn't deserve that, and that you are uh you're gonna actively work on that because you were triggered and you you reactively backlashed on the person, and the trigger was an act of service because that's how we grow. We grow through our triggers. As we're triggered, we see our growth opportunities, right? You see the stories, you see the beliefs, you see the pain. A trigger is from a place of pain, right? Yeah, take an orange, take a knife, put the knife in the orange, and if you're watching on video, you see a little my little graphic like of my hands, and you take the the knife and put it inside the orange, and and you you you twist around the uh the the knife and you pull it back out, and the orange juice starts to come out. And did the knife create the orange juice? No, the the the knife didn't create the orange juice, but the knife revealed the orange juice. So if I say, Hey, you look beautiful today, and you were like, What the fuck is that supposed to mean? Like the words didn't cause that, right? You you felt something inside, and you're you're thinking that the words that I just said cause that. It's your job to go and take that and take a look at that. Why did those words trigger it's the thorns, the thorns that that anger, whatever came up for you guilt, shame, anger, blame, threats, whatever, what jealousy, envy, whatever showed up, the emotion that showed up inside of you, that's yours to own and yours to clean up. The outside circumstances just reveal them. They don't, they don't create them. All right. And we can start to take a higher level of ownership and authority over our own life and our own circumstances. But you know, when when we're just walking down the steps and I was, I got we'll coming down to to record this, and I got triggered. And I was like, you know, whatever. Not not like violently, but there was no like there was no threats of where we'll leave each other or separate or divorce, and you know, it it that's just it's silly. We're gonna do this for the rest of our lives. And this is what for better or worse means, and this is what you know, till death to us part means. And those words to us aren't they're sacred, and it that's not from a religious perspective. I'm gonna emotional, those those words aren't from a religious perspective and they're not at an obligation because that's an I get to. It's like I get to do this for the rest of my life with this person that I cherish and I love, and I I just want to see succeed, and I want to succeed with her, and I want to succeed for her and because of her, and and I just want to do this together for better or worse. And sometimes it's really, really good, and sometimes maybe it's not. You know, we're going through a little bit of a little bit of a a not a dark period, but a little uh challenging period in our business, and and it's like we're gonna traverse it together, like, but there's no there's no escape plan. Right. That's the point. There always used to be an escape plan. Yes, and that's a spiritual relationship, and that's a very conscious relationship, all right. And it's built upon growth, and I'll I'll share from my perspective that she's my greatest champion. I'm her greatest champion. I do everything I can to empower her. The thing that we got in a tiff over is she was upstairs and we're going to do a podcast episode, and it's Wednesday, so it's her her day to curl her hair. And I'm like, nobody cares how you look on the podcast. And I started like getting a little, getting a little like, come on, let's go, bro. Stop worrying about what you look like. And that's all a projection of me for years worrying about how everybody perceived me.

SPEAKER_01

And that's when I said, Don't worry about what I'm doing. I mean, I curled my hair and put it back, so I'm gonna deal with it, but it was still a hair curling day, so I did it.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, so but but that's you know, those are the little things, and we get I get to shine a light on that and say, why did that why did that thing bother me so much? She's not a bad person, she had no bad intentions, and that's what a conscious relationship is built on.

SPEAKER_01

Is that yeah, uh recognizing those things is is that nothing that you do, I look at with any negative intentions, even yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Mutually beneficial intentions, yeah. Right?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and and and recognizing that, yeah, when those outbursts happen from either side, knowing that, oh shit, okay, just hit a trigger and they're gonna work through that. And just try and knowing, and it's just it's trust and vulnerability. I mean, that's that's to me, and when I'm when I'm talking with women in the mastermind who are struggling with relationship issues, and you know, we're not counselors or whatever, we're only speaking from our experience. But so many people can't have those conversations where it's just so surface level that and and basically you know, based on what what society says is normal. And once people start to learn that, okay, we can have these conversations, we can learn about each other with our soul sciences and the things of the sort of and and learning about who the who our partner is at their core.

SPEAKER_02

In on the soul science, yes. I'm I'm I'm building on to that in our soul sciences call. Because for for years, when she would say that, I would say something, and it was almost like I was countering what she was saying. And I just I always want to make sure that that's the empowerment part, right? The empowerment part of a relationship is I want to make sure she understands for whatever there's still this unconscious thing.

SPEAKER_01

Well, because I but that's how it felt to me, and I know now that that's not your intention.

Inviting Couples Into The Work

SPEAKER_02

I was always being critical and I was always like I was always going over top of her to correct her. So when I do that and I stop, there I can see this little this this this little you know, what I know whatever, and then I say, Nope, I'm gonna build on it, and then I can see her kind of relax a little bit, and it happens a lot. But the point is, is uh we we we are each built with a design, a unique design. We are each built with a unique purpose, and we are each built with a unique destiny. And what what a what a conscious relationship is, a bonded conscious relationship are two people living their own design, serving their own purpose, and living their own destiny together. Yes, together, and those destinies, those designs, those purposes, and those destinies build on each other, they don't collide with each other. Yes, they don't build, they're not in conflict with each other, neither person needs to be sacrificed, neither person needs to be martyred, neither person needs to be less than themselves, they don't need to devalue themselves, they don't need to give up their dreams, they don't need to give up their ambitions, they don't need to give up their hopes, they don't need to give up anything, they just need to take their designs, their purpose, their destinies, put them together and build on that. One plus one equals three. Yeah, I love that. And and the collaboration of two people living their design, their purpose, and their destiny. That when they're when they're conscious, they're a creative, they're not destructive.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And that survival relationship, in order for me to get what I wanted, in order for you to get what you wanted, both of us had to be different people and we had to be less than who we really were.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, and almost that almost comes with the word that just came to me was competitive. Like when you when you just have a competing, when you're just feel when it feels like you're just and and not competitive in that sense, but just always haven't had the edge up or the leg up or to be right. And yeah, to be right.

SPEAKER_02

To be right. We're always looking to be right. Right. Right. We attract even even if we had to make the other person wrong, yeah, we always wanted to be right. Right. And we were never we weren't really looking for times where how can we both be right?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

It was what can I how can I make you wrong so I can feel right? That was that's all inadequacy.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, two things can be true at the same time.

SPEAKER_02

That's right. That's that's all that was all inadequacy. And what what I like to when I talk about uh creation mode versus survival mode, uh, there's three voices of survival mode: insecurity, inadequacy, and insignificance. And those are inner conflicts in us that we tend to try to solve through external circumstances and rearranging the external world. And in a relationship, when I feel insecure, inadequate, and insignificant, and I don't know what to do with it, I'm gonna try to get you to do something different to so so that I can resolve. So not I can resolve, so that those states can be resolved inside of me. You know, if you don't, if if those states aren't being resolved, then you're not doing enough, yeah, right? And you're not giving enough, and you're not whatever, you're not serving me enough because I still feel this insecurity, inadequacy, and insignificance. And that's just that's delusional. That's that's not that's not a conscious relationship, it's just survival-based. Yeah you're trying to get the other person to solve an internal conflict. The only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only, only voice of creation mode is inspiration. I get to, not I have to, I get to be married to you. I get to wake up next to you. I get to spend the rest of my life with you. I get to serve you. I get to empower you. I get to inspire you. I get to lift you up. I get to encourage you. I get to see you shine. I get to see you stumble. I get to see you not have it all figured out. I get to see you figure shit out. I get to see you confused, and I get to see you clear. I get all of it. I don't have to any of it. Yeah, it's all a privilege. And that's that's what a conscious relationship is. And that changes everything because then you never feel alone again. And if you do feel alone, you've just entered survival territory and it's time to get yourself back into creation territory because there's there's an inner conflict in you that's raging. Nobody can make you feel loved, nobody can make you feel lovable, nobody can make you feel appreciated, nobody can make you feel respected, nobody can make you feel valued, nobody can make you feel valuable, nobody can make you feel worthy, and no, nobody can make you feel anything more than you are choosing to feel at any given time. That's all your work. And if you think the power to change those things is outside of you, then you are living in survival mode and you are giving up the power that's rightfully yours. And in a conscious relationship, you take back your power together. But you take back, I take back my power, she takes back her power, and together that power becomes even more powerful. Whew, that was uh that was a good little ramble. Yeah, it was. Dude, I got like snot coming out of my mouth because I got a lot of things. It was good. I got a lot off my freaking soul.

SPEAKER_01

Good.

SPEAKER_02

That felt good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Any closing show?

SPEAKER_01

There's nothing to say after that. I can't yeah, no, that was that was beautiful, honey.

Next Up: Nervous System And Addiction

SPEAKER_02

This has been fun. This whole thing is fun, guys. I hope that uh a survival-based relationship and a conscious-based relationship is more clear. I hope uh this episode serves you wherever you are in any of your relationships. Years ago, Angie said to me that um that we are going to be doing work together with couples. Uh and my immediate resistance, my immediate stop sign went up, and I was like, the fuck we are. I am not a couples counselor, and I am not interested in doing any couples, any couples therapy. And the work that we're doing right now, and we have couples in the interwealth mastermind. If any of you are interested in joining and shifting from survival-based relationships into uh creation-based relationships, or from survival mode into creation mode in any aspect of your life where everything goes from an I have to and I get to. We'd love to, we'd love to chat with you. We don't, we don't just take couples, we do take people that are that are riding solo or single. The point being is uh we uh we keep shining lights on well going back to the the the couples thing, right now I think we are feeling more powerful in our ability to help two people inside of a relationship become more whole, complete within themselves, and then see the relationship thrive from there. Every once in a while, we run into a couple that they think they're gonna grow individually and are gonna become more compatible and they actually become less compatible. But there are some people that once they start doing the personal work, the individual work, the self-mastery work together, they become even more break, unbreakable than they ever thought they were. And if that any of that sounds interesting, we're gonna be doing more of this in uh you know in the coming months. Yeah. You excited for that? Very much. We're not just becoming a couple and a marriage, a marriage business, but uh not at all.

SPEAKER_01

I think it's just just we recognize the importance of doing this work together, and we just I just want to take that forward.

SPEAKER_02

And we have a lot to we have a lot of stories to share, which we teach from experience, but uh as I say in the in the inner wealth mastermind all the time, and in my work, in the community and in my work, I teach we teach from messiness, not mastery.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, we're not there, but never we'll be there. There is no mess.

SPEAKER_02

There is no there, but as we clean up our mess, we can teach other people how to clean up their messes and at least shine a light on them. All right. Um months ago, months and months and months and months ago, I went in and designed a uh a program, and I can't remember what it's called, but it was a couples retreat.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

You remember that? I do. I can't remember what it was called, but it was a couples retreat, and we were gonna, it wasn't gonna be about it was gonna be two great uh people, a great relationship that was looking to level up from there. It wasn't taking a poor relationship to a good relationship, it was taking a great relationship to something even greater. Um, because I think that's what we do every day. We take our great relationship and make it even greater and keep building on that. Um, I think we I've got an appetite for some of that, but for for helping people clean up their uh yeah, no, no, people no, we wait, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

They're not interested. No, don't come up to it. No, we don't take your problems.

SPEAKER_02

We yeah. Good, good, well, great, great degree. All right, guys, love you. Thank you for sticking with us. Next week is all about the nervous system. It's and and we're gonna focus on addiction. Do you know anybody who might know anything around here about addiction?

SPEAKER_01

Yes, and she's about to sneeze her ass off stuff.

SPEAKER_02

And it's not just our system. But but that is a addiction is very much based on them. And we're not we're we're not counselors and we don't have any licenses, but what our experiences is very much based on the nervous system and the ability or inability to manage the nervous system and to understand what's happened in the nervous system. So we're gonna dive deep into that. Hope you join us. Thank you for joining us this time. We got a long way to go, but we're gonna have a lot of fun getting there. If you enjoyed what you heard and you want to learn more, go to www.innerwealthglobal.com for more tools and recourse.