Boudoir Photography Using Fujifilm (with Michael Spatola)

Boudoir photography using Fujifilm cameras and lenses with Los Angeles photographer Michael Spatola. In this video, we discuss boudoir photography, what makes a photo sexy, confidence, posting, lighting, gear, clients, and emotional moments of the genre. All photographs and BHS videos courtesy of Michael Spatola and copyrighted by Lifestyle Boudoir.

** MICHAEL'S PORTFOLIO AND INFO  **
Website: https://www.lifestyleboudoir.com/
YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@LifestyleBou...
Instagram:   / lifestyle_boudoir 

If you found this video helpful, please reach out and let Michael know! He's on IG, YouTube, etc. He gave considerable time and effort to share his knowledge with all of us in this video. 👍

Done. Over Perfect Podcast: https://doneoverperfect.com/

Transcript

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Hi everyone and welcome to pal2tech and the Done Over Perfect podcast. I have a very special guest, Michael Spatola, who is currently a Boudoir photographer in the Los Angeles area. Michael, welcome to the podcast. Thanks so much, Chris. It's been a long time and I've been looking forward to this. Michael, I personally hired to shoot my own wedding, so we're going on 24, 25 years ago. I don't know if I cried at your wedding or not, I can't remember, but, um. Look at that photo he took. It was shot all on film. I don't think you were able to hit playback right when you shot. And, you know, check the shot. You see that? Absolutely incredible. And you know what? We had a fire blazed through where I live. If the police come knocking on your door and they go, excuse me, you have 15 minutes to leave. There's a fire coming down your street. I am the one guy that can tell you. Those photo albums were one of the first things I grabbed next to the family dog and, you know, a couple of others. But I'm saying that's how important it is to me. What exactly got you into Boudoir photography? Like most photographers early in their career, they shoot everything actor headshots, model portfolios, family portraits, babies, children. I had always done Boudoir as part of my offerings. This is one thing that when it's done well, cannot be replicated by the client themselves, right? They really need someone who is skilled at lighting, skilled at posing, skilled at putting them at ease in front of the camera. And that's huge. They're in their underwear in front of a strange man. Yes, I have a female assistant, but they're in their underwear. We're taking photos. And if I don't have the ability to keep it super lighthearted, keep it relaxed and chill, and for them to have fun, the photos are not going to be as good. Some people don't even understand what Boudoir photography really is. What is it? Yeah, okay, so Boudoir photography is not me taking pictures of scantily clad women, even though I am. That's not the main thrust of it. The main thrust of Boudoir photography is for women to look at themselves, and maybe for the first time in their life, see themselves as beautiful, confident, strong, powerful, and yes, even sexual beings. None of the people who pay me for my work are models. They're normal, everyday women that may even think that they're doing it for their significant other. But the bottom line is they're doing it for themselves, whether they realize it or not. I don't care what their spouse thinks at the photos. I don't care what their significant other thinks of the photos. What I care about is that woman looks at those photos and sees themselves through my eyes and sees themselves like they may have never seen themselves before. To get that ego boost, to make them feel like, hey, I'm on cloud nine, I can conquer the world now. I think of Boudoir as an art. I create images that I feel are timeless. There's a timeless quality to them. I try not to follow the fads right? And create images that they could hang on the wall. And 20 years from now, they'll still look at it as art. The session itself is about three hours long. They come in, I have a makeup artist who's also my female assistant. That's very important to the process who makes them beautiful. First thing we do is go through the lingerie together. Usually they'll send me pictures of what they're going to wear ahead of time, but sometimes they bring a few extra outfits and it's nice to see them in person, too. I give them to my makeup artist, and then I start putting together my plan of action while they're getting made up. And my plan of action is which outfit of my photographing first, second, third, fourth. Obviously, we usually start off with the most innocent, sweet stuff first to ease them into the process and then usually end up with the craziest stuff. Sometimes you might have, say, a client and they're a little, they're just not opening up. And how do you get them to open up? And I think a lot of Boudoir photographers who were up and coming would like to know your answer to that one. Okay. I got a good answer for that one. So they've gotten their makeup done by this point. And they're they feel like they're looking beautiful, but they've never worn lingerie in front of a strange man before. Right. Maybe they have, I don't know. Lights and the whole thing, you know. Right. Um, and that's something we'll get into in a little bit too, is the lighting, I think is very important to get them to relax in front of the camera. First of all, we're playing music that they love. You know, I send them a questionnaire and one of the questions is, what kind of music do you like? Because I want to have it playing for you when you're here. Them being in the right headspace is a little different from me getting them into the right headspace. We put on the baggy man's white shirt. There's a suggestion that they're naked underneath, but you don't see anything. So we'll start off with something innocent like that, um, with very soft window lighting. Okay, so there's no pop, pop pop of flashes. Yeah. Um, and then I demonstrate the poses. Now, you want to break the ice? Watch this fat old dude do the poses. Right? Yes. If I can do it, they can do it ten times. All right. It's a great tip, man. Um, that's it's like you gotta learn the poses. Don't expect to be able to direct them into the pose if you haven't tried it yourself. And that helps really get them into the. I can do this, too. Sure. And I don't like to show them a lot of pictures on the back of the camera, but usually the first setup after I know I have a good one, I'll go look and they'll they'll see it and go, oh, hey, I look good. Yeah. You know, and that that's it. From that point on we're fine. And I've seen extremely shy women like, who come in like I'm really shy. I don't know if I can even do this. And they become, like, sexual monsters by the end of the shoot. Yeah. It's like they're like dressing and undressing in front of me. I'm like, you know, you can use the restroom to change. Um, it's it's amazing how it's like a switch gets flipped and they become so much more comfortable in their own skin. I mean, it's only a three hour deal, but you can see a different person leave than the one who arrive. I don't have any fake looking sets. Everything looks like it's the real thing because it is the real thing. I get asked, can the husband come to the photo session? Yeah, and I have mixed feelings about that. Generally I say no and I don't say it no like that. I don't say no. You can't bring them. I'd say, you know what? I would so much rather you bring a best friend than a boyfriend or husband, because that best friend is not judgmental of your body. They are someone who's there to be your cheerleader, to be your support department, to be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, go, go. You look amazing, right? Um, some sessions where husbands come along and they critique the woman, or they want to direct the shoot, and obviously they're not looking through my lens. They're looking over my shoulder or from the side. They don't see what I'm seeing. And if they want to direct, buy your own camera and shoot at home. You're not going to get anything good. But, you know. Right. Um, usually it turns out great. Usually they're there just to be supportive, but I've seen it the other way, too, where they were controlling, you know, macho dudes that. Why don't you shoot her this way or, you know, hey, babe, uh, just open your knees a little bit more and say, oh, God, no, please. Even if I do any nude at all, it's always implied nude or very artistic nude, where you see nothing but the impression is there. How much does confidence and bringing out that confidence play and connect with the idea of sexy? What is sexy, right? And honestly, what is sexy? It's different to everybody. But I'll tell you, one of the things that's sexy to me is suggesting it rather than showing it. You don't need to see somebody naked. Spread eagle that that's not sexy to me. What's sexy to me is like, what's just beyond that right there, wearing an outfit. What are we suggesting here? Rather than what are we showing ? Usually within a week of the session, I have them come back in and we do a full presentation. So they come in, I make popcorn, we sit them down at the coffee table, and the photos are presented on my big screen TV. So they're seeing them, you know. Wow. Huge, right? That must evoke a reaction. Oh yes. The first thing they see is a slideshow set to music. It's made on Animoto. Um, and the the song that I've chosen for the photos is, you know, something that's very uplifting and very go girl power. Um, you know, and, uh, but not too much. So it's just it's a beautiful song and it makes them feel beautiful while they're watching it. And those photos are ones that I've sort of decided are my favorites. So they're not seeing all the photos in the slideshow. They're just seeing maybe 40 or 50 photos set to the music, and some of them are already turned to black and white, the ones that I think should be in black and white or turned black and white. So they're seeing it. Other than the retouching, how I would present it. All right. And that's the first thing they see. And my reaction is this. I watch them. I don't need to see the photos. I've already seen the photos. I'm watching them right? And what I see is the best part of the shoot for me. When they see themselves through my eyes and seeing themselves as that beautiful for the first time in their life. And wow, that's my gratification. That's my emotional, you know, that it's an ego boost for me, of course, but it's also that's how I get my gratification from the session is not just financially, but also seeing the expression on their face when they're looking at the photos for the first time. You know, sometimes you have to pick their jaw off the ground and sometimes it's it's just like you see them well up, you know, their eyes well up. Um, it's such an emotional, powerful thing. Um, and then after they see the slideshow, then we go through all the photos and, um, you know, one at a time. Is this eye better? Is this eye better? You know, that kind of thing? If their husband's there, how's the reaction of the husband? Or significant other you know? Right. It's not for them. It's for the woman I photographed. But what I do see quite often is the husband sitting there. He may he may gush or he may be dead silent. But what I see is the hand eases over to his wife's hand and grabs it. And you see it squeeze the hand and they're like, you can tell they're loving the photos, um, because they're seeing them through my eyes as well. When you see their expression and they're seeing these photos for the first time. Mhm. Does that come into play where that, that, that's part of what they're realizing that they are confident? Yes. It's huge. I mean not only do I send out that questionnaire that has things like that on it, like what are you looking to get out of this session? All of my questions are sort of essay questions that forces them to open up to me a little. And, uh, one of them is, um, guys, get your pens out and write this down. Um. Take notes on this podcast! The photo session is over. You're opening your finished album and seeing it for the first time. What do you see? And the answer, overwhelmingly, is someone who's confident and comfortable in their own skin. Ha ha. Okay, it's what they want. They want to be confident and strong. There's no cutoff age for your type of shooting. My typical client is not in their 20s. My typical client is like 35 to 55. That's my typical client. It could be that they think they're doing it for their spouse, or they could do it to to celebrate their divorce. I'm coming back into my own again. Oh, God. Yeah. Um, maybe more of them than I have doing it for their spouse. Um, you know. Oh, man. Uh, part of it is either they're feel like they're coming back into their own. They're becoming the person that they used to be before their marriage. Or maybe it is to want to become someone else because they were so smothered in maybe a bad relationship or something. I don't want to transform them. I just want them to feel like it was always there, and it just needed a little coaxing to come out. As far as age cutoff, I can tell you my oldest was around 70 years old. Yeah. Um, and man, did she rock that shoot. Really? She, uh, younger girls have nothing on her. What's been one of your more memorable client experiences? That you kind of stopped and went? Uh, yeah. I'm not going to forget this client for a while. Well, I had some insane ones, but I don't want to go there. Um, but, uh, I had one where I had minimal contact with the client beforehand. Just a couple of email exchanges. I send them all the information they need beforehand. I have a whole lingerie guide. Pick the right lingerie for your body type and where to get lingerie if you don't have any. So I give them all this information. Well, the girl shows up at my studio with nothing like no outfits. Uh, I mean, even what she was wearing under her clothes was nothing. I mean, she had nothing with her, and I was like, you didn't bring anything because she goes, no, I think I just want to. I want to do this nude. And I was like, okay, okay, obviously I want to accommodate my client, but I also want to create art. Not like here am look at me naked. Yeah. Um, so I did body scapes, so I lit it to look like sand dunes and mountains and stuff like that. Posed in such a way that when you look at it, you have to actually look at it like double take and go, oh my God, that's, that's a female form. That's not a landscape. Um, and then I had some a couple of yards of sheer fabric, and we did somewhere that was just draped artistically, you know, I wasn't prepared for this shoot. I thought she was bringing lingerie. Out of that challenge came some really beautiful images that she was thrilled with. So challenge accepted, right? Yeah. Well, does that happen a lot where they they want to get completely nude? Um, well, part of that questionnaire that I send out beforehand asks, what level are you comfortable with? Do you want to just do lingerie ? Do you want to do implied nude? Do you want to do some topless, maybe just sort of covering up or do you want nudity? Sometimes they'll check off that. They want nudity. Does it always happen? No. It's because it's something I won't push during a shoot. There might be some where I go. Hey, remember you said you might want to do some naked? This is a good setup to do it in. Are you still comfortable doing that? Yeah. And leave it at that. You are a man after my heart with Fujifilm. Yes, a little bit. Yes. Tell us about your gear. Both with regard to cameras and lighting. Uh, cameras, I have X-T5, X-T4, X-T3, X100v, and XPro1. Okay. Um, my XPro1. Sadly, the shutter froze and I need to get it repaired, but I love that camera. That was my first mirrorless camera. What I shoot most with right now, even though I have the X-T5, I'm still shooting more with the X-T4, which might surprise some people. Why is that? My clients are mainly getting an album that's like 10 by 10 or 8 by 8. I don't need a 40 megapixel file for an eight by ten. I did this with the X-T3 when I went to the uh, from the X-T3 to the X-T4. I still shot with the X-T3 forever because I just eased into the X-T4. It was a little different. The setup was just a little bit different, you know, from camera to camera. Some things changed. Now it's no more flip up screen, it's a flip out screen and blah, blah, all that stuff. And I bought the X-T5 and I'm still I'm shooting a little bit with the X-T5, but I'm easing into it so that X-T5 is going to last me for years because I'm not using it so much yet. I still have my S5 Pro somewhere that was on the Nikon body with Nikon lenses, but it was the Fuji sensor. Yeah, right. Um, I still have that somewhere, but it's a paperweight now. In fact, I still have my Kodak DCS 460, which was the first 6 megapixel digital SLR, um, built on the icon body and it was huge. And it was $27,000. Paperweight. When you're shooting with those cameras, what would be your settings that you're doing ? AF-C are you? Autofocus is the main automation. Everything else is manual. Obviously aperture on the aperture ring. And I have shutter speed on the front dial and ISO on the back dial. And literally I pretty much leave the 16 to 55 at 2.8, like almost 100% of the time. That's a great lens. And the autofocus is good on it. Um, sharp as can be, and it gives me every focal length that I need for Boudoir, so that almost never comes off my camera. And then the only thing I play with is honestly my ISO. So I pretty much have it set because, you know, 640 is you get the doctor 400, right? Yeah. So I leave it at 640 most of the time. Then I can change the shutter speed if I need to. But the way the light comes into my place, I'm doing pretty much at least a third of my shoot with window light. Even though I have a ton of Fuji lenses, I still love the 35 f/1.4. Beautiful Lens. Um, and I, you know, I have the kit lens, which is still an amazing lens. I keep telling people that it shouldn't even be called the kit lens. It's a great lens. Should not be called a kit lens. 18 to 55. I have the 56 f/1.2. Okay, you know, I have I have a bunch of lenses, but the 16 to 55 is perfect for what I do. Perfect. And where does it stay most of the time? Around the 35 millimeter equivalent. Okay, because I'm shooting a lot of full and half length photos. Um, for Boudoir, they want to see the whole outfit. They want to see down to the high heels, you know? Right. Um, so I'm not shooting it zoomed in all the way unless I want to get a face shot or, like, a detail shot. Maybe they're touching their pearls or something like that. Now, I have a whole host of these little manual focus lenses. You know, I got the Mitakon. This is the 1.4 TTArtisan's manual focus. I have the the Mitkaon 35 f/0.95. That's a great lens. I love that lens. I have the TTArtisan's 50 f/1.4. Or is it f/1.2? f/1.2. The f/1.2. Another fun portrait lens. But those lenses I use for me, I'm a content creator too, right? I have to put stuff on Instagram. A lot of my clients don't want their photos on Instagram. They're for themselves. They're for their spouses. Right? I use those lenses for me for fun and obviously their manual focus. So it makes me slow down a little bit and be more deliberate with my shots. Yeah. Um, they are not sharp like the 16 to 55 is sharp. Now that, um, 0.95, are you actually shooting manual with a model in 0.95 aperture? I have usually I'll stop it down one stop or so, just to make sure that focus isn't so razor thin. Yeah. I mean, you're talking about one eyelash would be in focus, and the one next to it would be out of focus. Yeah. I'll bring it. I'll usually bring it down to like 1.4 or something just to give me a little, a little wiggle room. Now, I already mentioned lighting wise, I do a lot of window light that is so non-threatening to the client. No pop, no flash. Of course, a cloudy day. I need to augment it a little bit. Yeah, or or boost the ISO a lot. And that as far as lights go now I have a half a dozen strobe heads, but I rarely use them anymore. Really? Um, I hardly ever have a softbox on my lights, by the way, I do use a V flat for bouncing the window light or a handheld reflector, but it's usually the V flat. I use the Godox LS 500 light sticks with the barn doors on them. Those replaced pretty much my Westcott ice lights because they no longer make them, which is the a sad day in my life you love when they stopped. Nice lights, I remember. I love ice lights. Um, I have two of them and I have replacement batteries, but eventually they're going to go away. Uh, Godox has come up with an alternative. They're not quite as soft, but I'm doing a lot of black and white that I want to look crisp. And so I don't need a softbox or a really soft light. And if I need to soften it, I can throw a black pro mist on my lens. Yeah. And soften it or soften it later in Photoshop. What do you recommend as a Black Pro Mist filter for the 16 to 55? So I'm using the the quarter strength okay. And um, it's a it's a Tiffin black pro quarter. Trust me, there's a group of people watching this podcast right now that are taking down notes. Seriously. I also have one, a little one that goes on my X100v. It just makes it more filmic. You know, it makes it. Yeah. You know, as someone who was brought up on film, I like my photos to look like they're shot on film. My other light that I use it every shoot, it's an LED. It's a SL 200. Three Godox LED. It's a big honkin light and on the front of it is the Godox projector. You know what I'm talking about? Yes. It's like the, you know, the optical snoot that you put the little gobo in, right? Right. Um, so I have the Venetian blinds. I have this other window one, the dappled light one, and I use it at every shoot. It's amazing. So I can get the dappled light or I can get a different window effect. And, you know, if I had to do this all over again, there would have been such a small investment compared to what I've invested over the years and equipment, because of the lights that I'm using and the camera and lens that I'm using, hence the $99 lens. Yeah, let's you know what? Let's take a look at those $99 lens photos. We're going to jump into those. And then I want to move into that was the X100v. What was the one? Yeah yeah. Well we'll check those out. So we're looking at this right here. You're telling me that this was taken with that lens that that you the 23 f/1.4, manual focus. The lighting on that is two of those, uh, Godox light sticks. And the light in the background is just the light that's on the nightstand. Now we're Brighter daylight. That's window light color. I mean, this is the folder with the 23 millimeter lens. So everything in here is manual focus. Wow. Um, and pretty much wide open. I love this one with the lighting. Yeah. Window light is gorgeous. You just need to know how to position the person to get the effect you want. That's short lighting, right? That's short loop, narrow light, whatever you want to call it. It's short lighting on her face. So it's lighting the mask of the face. And the shadow side is closest to the camera, so it's short lighting, but with window light and a V flat is filling in the back. These are the fake Venetian blinds. This is the Godox LED with the Godox projector, with the Venetian blinds gobo in it. Because you're manually focusing, are you using focus peaking is that you have is it's rather dark. I mean that would be a hard thing to be nailing I think. Yeah, it's on focus peaking red. Hi. You suggested that I believe in one of your old videos and I just went I just went with it. I was like, okay, I trust Chris. I'm going to do that. Yeah. For this one, I had the light stick in tungsten because the lights on the makeup mirror are tungsten. Okay. So if I did want it in color, the color would be balanced. A lot of people don't realize that the color of the light affects the makeup that they're wearing, too. One of the things these days I see a lot of is red gel from one side, blue gel from the other, and then the makeup gets all washed out, because if they're wearing red lipstick and the red light hits it, they're wearing no lipstick. You know, that goes back to my film career when I was a makeup artist. In the film industry, you got to know lighting, too. So let's jump from that lens to photos exclusively shot with the x100v, one of the hottest cameras in the world right now. The X100v I got it before it was, you know, when it first came out, before everyone wanted it. Oh, there's a beautiful camera. Look at that. It's so beautiful. I got the little thumb grip on it and I got the, the front hand grip on it because it is hard to hold on to for any length of time without those for portraits. I'll put on that that black pro mist in front of it. Okay. Um, and it gives me a much more filmic look. It's the same 26 megapixel sensor as the other Fuji cameras, and the lens is just as sharp, if not sharper, than the the separate 23 f/2 that you can buy. What's wrong with this picture? Nothing. Nothing, right. The only thing I would say is a lot of people want the redundancy of an extra card slot, which this only has one. Um, generally I don't shoot it for client shoots, but I still love it. I shoot it for fun. We're at the metro station. She's adventurous, which is great. Um, the back of those panties is literally a thong. And the L.A. Metro. In the metro? Yeah, that's the North Hollywood metro station. Yeah. Wow. I mean, you really play around a lot with, um, existing window light. The women who come to me are not used to being in front of the camera window. Light is not intimidating. Part of the light coming through the Venetian lines, going right across her forehead. And it kind of travels down. And then on her leg, it's going back up. When you're actually shooting this, are you saying to yourself, I want to line this up, or is that the last thing on your mind? And you're just the light's falling where the light's falling. You know, when I'm taking more time, I will look at everything. But the main thing for me is to have the eyes lit. So at least one slit of light needs to be going across her eyes so I can see the sparkle. Now, after I have that, then I'll play with the pose a little bit more to make sure it's really accentuating the body. Are you in Capture One or are you in Lightroom? How are you on the Capture One? Okay, and in Capture One, I try to make the color look as perfect as possible, but then when I'm playing with it in Photoshop, I've created a couple of actions that give it a more film. Like, you know, like the Portra 400 or Portra 800. That has that little bit of a green cast to it. It just has this just timeless look to it, and especially with black and white too. Oh, I can imagine. And but I'm looking at in the background the way you've got I mean, her shadow intersecting the shadow of the Venetian blinds. I mean, you could talk about this photo all day. This is one of my favorites of yours, Michael. This shot would be not the very starting out outfits, but as you're progressing through the shoot, you suggest that. And here it is. That one is also window light. If it's not hitting them directly, it's still soft light. If it's hitting them directly, then what I'll usually do is a large pop open diffuser and just put it in front of the window, effectively making it a giant soft box. That's the projector with one of the window goes in it. My projector unit was new, so I wanted to play with it often, you know? Now it has its place and I will still use it in nearly every session. This was a special thing. This is like I'm trying to figure out how it works in my space. The ones that I'm about to look at are shot on an X-T4 with the 16 to 55. It may vary a little bit, but that's my main setup. It's a different subject. It's a different feeling. She's got underwear on, but it's Calvin Klein, you know, pretty much basic that somebody would wear under their clothes. Not sexy lingerie. Um, and the sexiness comes from her confidence, the look into the camera. How are you getting these skin tones? Is it a complicated process you go through to get these skin tones? It's not. It's so each place that I shoot will have its own sort of white balance, if you will. I mean, I shoot it on standard and then I'll do the little trick where you push down on the D-Pad and lock the auto white balance on it. That's my white balance for that scene. So window light will have it locked on the window, like I'm using one of those pop open gray cards and it gets it close enough. I mean, is it perfect? No, they get stained or whatever, but it gets it close enough that in Capture One, I can adjust one photo and that copy that to all the ones from that setup. And it's a minute. It doesn't take long. Brighter obviously. And again those skin tones and that I can see now I'm starting to see your style more and more. You've got that window light again. Now I'm shooting with, you know, all tungsten balance. I may have not corrected it in camera perfectly with the gray card, because I really wanted a warm feeling to this. That's a Westcott ice light with the barn doors on it. Got it. And it's just one. You know, you've got a professional photographer when you can get a photo like this lit with one light. Something that you'll notice in a lot of my photos is they're not looking at the camera. The whole thing with Boudoir is there should be some mystery to it. It isn't. Look at the camera and smile. You know, if they're looking at the camera, they're looking at the camera with intention, with a little twinkle or a little sneakiness in their eyes. So even the ones where they are engaging the camera, you want that mystery? Okay, this is my friend Erika. She's an actress, model mom. She works hard on her beauty, and it shows in her photos. And that's one light stick. That's one Godox light fixture. It is. I see it. And nothing else. My preference is to shoot with as few lights as possible. Yes, sometimes I'll put a fill light in, but generally it's one main light and I would say 10% of the time I'll put a fill light in if that. For anybody who wants to try something like that, it isn't. Just do it quickly and get out of there. It's explore every possible angle with that one light. What are some of the other challenges that you, you're either facing now or you see happening in the future with this style of photography? So many people getting into it now, they join a Facebook group and there's a million of them for Boudoir photographers. Literally the next time you see a photo they post, it's a copy of what someone else had showed them. It's great to be inspired by other people's work. It's not great to copy them outright, right? And I try really hard to make my stuff not look like anyone else's. I feel that from you, I get that. Do you want to copy it exactly, or do you want to replicate that feeling for someone else? If there were a piece of advice that I could give to specifically male Boudoir photographers is if you're getting into it, to meet girls and see them in their underwear, you're in the wrong business, because that's not what this is about. You got to be in it for the right reasons, and the right reason is to make them feel amazing about themselves. Period. I just have so much respect for this space. I knew nothing about it. Before talking to you, you basically have a job that your goal is to make people feel good about themselves. I don't always agree with what my clients choose from there. You know, when they're choosing their photos, they may choose one that I think is like, oh, really? You want that one? But if it makes them feel great? Sold! Expression sells. Photographs doesn't have anything to do with the lighting, the posing. If they look at their face and they see an expression in Boudoir that exudes confidence and strength and beauty and sexiness. You've won. It doesn't matter if the lighting is good or the posing is. Yes. Do good lighting. Do good posing. Take great photos, but to be able to relate to them on the level that makes them feel good about doing the shoot while they're doing the shoot. You are going to get photos that they will absolutely purchase. I am going to leave links to Michael's website, Michael's YouTube channel, and Instagram at the bottom of this video. In the description. I cannot recommend Michael enough, particularly if you are in the Los Angeles area. Give this photographer a call. I've hired him, okay? And I still have his photos to this day, so I will vouch for him. So Michael, thank you so much for your your time today. This was an absolute pleasure, Chris. It was great catching up with you. This was so much fun talking about this stuff. We'll talk again soon. Thank you so much. Bye bye.