Benjamin Kanarek Interview: Paris Fashion Photography (Behind the Scenes)

Paris fashion photography behind the scenes with Benjamin Kanarek on three Paris model shoots with Antonia Przedpelski, Aurika Popova, and Tiana Tolstoi. This interview with Benjamin takes you right into the production and photography details of capturing these Numéro Russia and VOGUE shoots. All cameras used were Fujifilm.

📸  More About Benjamin Kanarek
Website: https://benjaminkanarek.com
thebkmag: https://thebkmag.com/
YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/benjaminkanarek
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/benjaminkanarek/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/benjamin.kanarek.7
Facebook Blog: https://www.facebook.com/Benjamin-Kanarek-Blog-191339037872
Clubhouse: https://www.clubhouse.com/club/photo-stop

🎬. Production Notes
Producer and Host: Chris Lee
All photography by Benjamin Kanarek
All video footage from Paris of fashion shoots directed by Frédérique Renaut
Very special thank you to both Benjamin and Frédérique for the use of their footage, images, and time in the making of this interview. 👍

Transcript

0:00

- Having a model almost die on a set is not something- [Benjamin Kanerek] Or think they're dying.- Right, or think they're dying. (laughs) You know, that's, jeez.(bright rock music)- Hi, everyone. Welcome to the Done Over perfect podcast. My name is Chris Lee and today on the show fashion photographer, Benjamin Kanarek. Benjamin is currently based in Paris and his amazing fashion photography has appeared in Vogue, Harper's Bazaar, Glamor, Elle. I mean just to name a few. We had such a great time the first time, he had to come back. I mean, it just, it had to be done. Benjamin, can you hear me?- [Benjamin Kanerek] Loud and clear.- How you doing, man?- [Benjamin Kanerek] I'm really good. It's a pleasure. It's a pleasure to be back.- Thank you, thank you. Well, I know you've got some big projects in the works and what I'd like to do, if we could, talk about the Vogue film shoot. You live in Paris, and you're going to do this incredible Vogue film shoot, How do you start something like that?- [Benjamin Kanerek] I was commissioned by the magazine to do this shoot. The theme of the actual story had to have something to do with cinema, because it was a film issue. Frederique and I, and my partner, we were discussing how could we best serve the theme of the magazine? How could we do it? Especially under the circumstances we're living under, which is as you know, COVID-19 and all of the restrictions.- Yeah, right.- [Benjamin Kanerek] And as you know, at least in Paris, pretty much all of the hotels were closed. So we had several issues that we had to deal with and solve before we can even embark on putting the production together We finally, after discussing it decided perhaps it would be a great idea to set up a scenario where we actually see the set of a film being shot, a major motion picture being shot on location. And I was there to chronicle it, perhaps I was the guy on the set hired by the production company to film the actual filming of a movie.- So it starts with a story. In other words, you come up with a story idea first.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Absolutely.- Okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] You just don't do a shoot without having a theme. So you see all of the lights, they're all exposed. You see all of the crew, the more crew on the set for me, the better. I wanted them to dress, kind of uniformly in black, so they didn't stand out and take away from the major subject, which was obviously Tiana Tolstoy. So we decided that the scene would take place in the iconic lobby of the Hotel Regina, everyone can look that up. I brought all the gear, in fact, I made sure that I brought classic cinema lighting to the shoot that would not only really be integrated as a lighting source for the shoot, but would be set up as if you were actually shooting the scene, the Mandarin, you know, the orange Mandarin lights we had on the set were used to light the scene for both the video that Frederique filmed and the stills that I shot. That really freed me up, because we didn't give a crap about what was on the set. I bought a clap board for the shoot, which you see in the images.- Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] So the next step obviously is, we've now informed the magazine that that is our theme and they're thoroughly stoked and really thrilled, Obviously. We then go through our process of putting our team together. Now, the first person we have to find is the stylist, even before the model, because- You hadn't had the model yet?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, no. We hadn't even bee no, of course, we didn't even start the casting yet, because,- Wow.- [Benjamin Kanerek] The key to every major photo shoot, regardless of whether it's fashion or beauty or accessories, or jewelry is the styling, is the stylist. So we went shopping and we found someone, now that we had our stylist, we then were able to do a think tank discussion between Frederique, our stylist and myself about what is it we're trying to accomplish. And the type of looks that we're going to integrate into the shoot, and very quickly I need everyone to know that it isn't just carte blanche about the looks you choose. You choose looks that correspond with the season in which the images will be shown in the magazine.- Are you only working with Frederique or had you, were there any other people providing input to the creative aspect of it?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, no, not at all. It was just Frederique and I, because we, the way it works with Frederique and I, and maybe we're lucky is that once we have an approved theme we have cart blanche, we have complete freedom, which is wonderful. It was Frederique and I who decided on the stylist and the stylist we did decide on was a stylist we had worked before for Vogue magazine and we felt he could do, he could do the job and he did it. Okay. So now we have our stylists. So now the big classic thing either I know specifically the girl I'm looking to get and trying to get, if I can get her, I'll be happy. So before I even do a specific casting, I'll go directly to that agency, regardless of what agency it is, maybe it's Titanium, and I'll say, can we get Caren Jepkemei for this shoot or Frederique will do, we'll look and go, my God, this girl at models.com is rising really quickly. And so we call the agency, say, will they be in Paris for the collections? And they'll say, well, look, if you can assure us that you will definitely book her, we will go out of our way- Wow.- [Benjamin Kanerek] and make sure we get her into town. We knew she was available we didn't confirm her. We don't confirm anyone until we have the accord of the magazine. So they knew who she was, And they went, yeah, okay, Go. And it was like the shortest sentence. "Yeah. Go for her." We then start a casting for hair makeup. And we had a manicurist on this as well when you're shooting for a magazine as important as Vogue, What I like to do for me personally, to keep me in my comfort zone is to work with at least one individual you worked with in the past, so you feel at home, you know, you feel, it's like a family. So we had our team, we had our date. We showed up the day of the shoot, brought all the gear.- Now, how does gear fit into all this?- [Benjamin Kanerek] Oh, I knew (laughs) You go through a testing period? Before you go into a photo shoot?(Benjamin laughing)- We gotta talk about gear, I mean, you're going to a photo shoot (laughs)- [Benjamin Kanerek] For me, it's the least important. And the easiest, I know the space I'm shooting in, but I also see light with my eyes. I can feel light. I know the kind of ambient light. I know it's on the ground level. I know it doesn't get that bright, but I know there's ambient light. I know that if we're ready to start shooting around 11:00 am after hair, makeup and nails have been done, I figure we're going to be on the set. We start at nine. So we'll be up shooting our first change

between 10:30 and 11: 6:39

00.- Do you recommend photographers-- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yeah, absolutely.- go to the location in advance?- [Benjamin Kanerek] A pre-light, yeah- To do exactly that. To see the light.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yeah, absolutely.- Okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] At least get a lay of the land, because at least that'll give you an opportunity to plan what you're going to do. It'll give you an idea of where you can go from A to B, Well, from one to two to three, to four, to five clothing change,- Got it, okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] where are you going to shoot it? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I didn't want to take my GFX. I shot it. Yeah. I shot the whole thing at 80 ISO. I just think it's got a little bit less noise- At 80?- Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] (laughs) Look at his face (laughs)'Cause there's less noise. There's less grain. Yeah. There's less grain. If you know your latitude, if you know your extremes, I mean, I don't even have to argue the point unequivocally. I know the base ISO is one 60. When you shoot at 80, you put it one 60, look in the shadows at one 60 and look at an 80, the 80 looks like a really good full frame. Nikon the D810.- In the raw file, you're talking about?- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yes sir, in the raw file.- I'm actually really stunned that you shoot at 80, which I mean, I'd like to do some trying out and testing. That's incredible.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Oh, please, in Capture One, remember.- 80 in Capture One. So 80 ISO. All right. So you got your XT4, your XT3.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yeah, both. We use both on the shoot'cause I just received the XT4s, I would have done the XT3s with no problem. So I only had one flash unit, which I didn't want to look like a flash unit at all, which I think I accomplished, I don't think any of the images look like flash. I read for my ambient first. I'm pretending like I'm not using my flash. So I read the room and I'm reading it. And I'm seeing that at 80 man, one 20th of a second. That's what you need to shoot at to bring in the kind of luxurious dreamy, you know, David Hamilton, light flooding into the lobby and knowing that, I'm knowing that I'm going to be using my monopod. And I know that I'm okay because when I press the shutter, it's the flash that'll freeze that moment and I'm not going to go out of my way to shake the image. So I used just a monopod, to handle the downstroke shock. Interesting. I usually shoot TTL. I didn't on this.- You didn't?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, I used, I brought my flash meter and I was getting away with eighth-- Oh come on!- [Benjamin Kanerek] and 16th. Yeah. Eight power man. And it was just really,- Wow- [Benjamin Kanerek] I kid you not. So I was probably shooting at 35 watt seconds and I like drop-off, Chris. You would ask. Well, the question would be okay. Well what about a full body shot? Unless you have a full window light from the ceiling to the floor, let's call the umbrella for all intended purpose. A window light. Let's forget it's a flash. So whenever you use a flash, think of it as a window. If you were standing, maybe I won't use metric. If you were standing 10 feet from a window and it was side lighting you and you were facing speaking to someone in front of you. If that window doesn't go to the ground, it doesn't go all the way to the ground. You're going to have some drop-off, fall off from maybe the waist down. Okay? So when I light my subject, I love the drop-off. I don't want to light it in a way that is, that's totally unnatural. I don't find, it's not natural to have even lighting from the top of your head to your toe, because it just doesn't work that way. Unless you're in front of a window, that's facing a beach, and there's overcast guy coming in, and you've got that then, yes. So just remember for all of you shooters out there, regardless of the light source you're using, if it's natural light, flash, Cobb light, continuous light, it's all light. But to make the game, the fun of it, you want to play like a kid, pretend, just pretend, it's not a flash, it's a window light. So if you're using a bare bulb on a flash, what kind of window light would create that? Well, that would be a really hard sunlight bouncing off of a mirror perhaps-- Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] and hitting your subject. So just pretend whenever you use a flash, or any other ambient light, just imagine how would nature recreate that in reality, but all these photographers who go outside and obviously they're shooting, and let's say, the ambient light is F8. So they're shooting with their flash at F16 to really overpower the sun. So you get super saturated colors, blah, blah, you know those pictures, but guess what? That happens reality as well, because those wonderful moments when you're having a thunder shower and there's this opening in the sky that opens up and the sun shines through that little spot and hits an object. That's exactly like using flash outdoors. Anyways, I'm gonna shut up for a moment. I'm going way off on a tangent.- No, are you crazy?- [Benjamin Kanerek] Bring me back Chris.- I am riveted by this. I mean, and a lot of other photographers are, this is great. I mean, thinking about it as a window and keep going, man.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yeah. But I think it's a good idea. I mean, forget it's a flash. I mean, it's, I know it's a way of thinking, pretend Here's how you should be thinking or, how you could be thinking you walk into a space and think, I'm looking at my space right now. Okay, living room. And I'm thinking it's really warm. It's soft light, but I'm thinking what if it was 7:30 in the evening and the sun is setting and it's super warm and you know, there's a little bit of mist. Well, just do that. And I also would like to say that there's no such thing as fake light, even if it's the most strangely lit, unpredictable light ever. It's possible in nature, whatever you do, whatever you like, just make sure that when you do light it, you can stand by what you're doing. And it just comes across as you being able to see it in nature. That's all. So I'm going to shut up. Now.- That segment on lighting is so important. I mean that, I can't think of anything more important. And actually that's really, really great stuff.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Here's something you mustn't forget. Tell me, you have a frame, right? Who's to tell you what's outside of the frame? Who knows where the light source was outside of the frame? Nobody knows. Nobody knows that next to the model, was a huge dormer window. Okay. No, or a bay window, unless you showed in the image. If you're not showing it in the image for all intent and purpose, you could say, yeah, she was sitting next to a bay window. So create that bay window, either shoot through a huge white scrim, whatever's outside of the frame is where you can really, really get creative. Like we did in the gentlemen only shoot. Let's talk about it. Okay, it was really racy. It could have been racier. I'm not as grungy as some photographers. And it was a challenge to me to get grungy. Even Frederique said, she knows it's hard for me to do that. For me personally, that was also a challenge. But I needed to stretch my limits. The reason we had to do that was the theme was Studio 54 in New York in 1979, snorting coke in the toilets, which we didn't do, but we had sugar, obviously,(laughs) Eric, our stylist actually took some sugar cubes and ground them. (laughs) There's one scene. You have to look-(Chris laughing) No, but really is one scene, If you look super closely at her finger, you see a line of coke-- In the video?- [Benjamin Kanerek] on her index finger-- In the video?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No in the video and in the stills. But yeah, but it's really quick. And if you don't know what to look for, you'll never see it. But it's there. We knew that the toilets of this incredibly gorgeous five-star hotel had these really ornate toilets, this toilet, which was all granite. And we wanted to recreate the disco environment. I even brought a disco ball, which I cut my finger on, by the way- Was that your disco ball from the 70's? Or did you buy another one?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, I bought it for another(Chris laughing) No, that's a good question. I can't, listen. I can't. I know I bought two. Okay? I also bought a smoke machine-- Oh all right.- [Benjamin Kanerek] not for this shoot. I'm the kind of guy who doesn't rent shit, I'll just go out and buy it.(both laughing) But this disco ball, it was so old. The little glass cubes were starting to fall out, fall off and you know, there's no checklist I going to get off. You'll be able to look at the images. You'll see them there. Two of them you'll see. In my right hand, I'm holding the camera vertically. And in my left hand, I'm moving the disco ball in front of the camera. So I can frame the image. So, you know, the images I'm talking about. So you'll see upper left, you'll see the disco ball, which is out of focus because I'm focusing on, on Ulrika and her girlfriend. I would be moving the disco ball in and out of the image, me looking at the back, it was very artisanal, let's put it that way and it couldn't be anyone else because they couldn't see what I was seeing. And so it made it look more realistic. Now one might ask, what kind of angle is that? Why would the disco ball be where they're at? That was kind of disconcerting. I don't have an answer for that, to be honest, (he chuckles) I don't think-- Okay, here's the thing though, and I want everyone to hear this. Now that you've mentioned it I'm looking at that photo and yeah, there is something off about the angle for sure. There wouldn't be a ball like that.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Absolutely.- Had you not said anything. It just brought the vibe of 1979 to me.- [Benjamin Kanerek] We're distorting reality now. Who's to say that in this club, there isn't a tiny alcove, a private room, that has an incredibly low ceiling a cave, a basement cave in a club that has a very low Casbah Casablanca vibe, that only has a four foot ceiling. And the only way you can sit down is you have to sit on pillows. There's a little disco ball just above your head. I can imagine that could be the rationale for that image.- This shot right here.- [Benjamin Kanerek] They're called Viktor and Rolf. Okay. And this is kind of a parody of the queen,- Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] as you can see, she's sitting on the throne.- Sitting on the throne, right- [Benjamin Kanerek] So-(Chris laughing)- [Benjamin Kanerek] So the idea, the idea was the following in the late seventies, early eighties, people didn't give a shit if it said men or women on the you just went in You use whatever was available. She was wearing her crown, but she doesn't know someone's taking a picture of her. Okay? Cause if you watch the video, you see her losing her temper and going "what?" and closing the door. Because if you watch that, you'll see the scene where she gets pissed off, that's Fred's idea-- Oh okay, okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] which was brilliant. So she's saying basically"fuck off" and closes the door. And as the door closes on the mirror door, then Frederique cuts to another scene. But this was perfect because it was kind of a parody of the queen. And here's the queen sitting on her throne and the door has a mirror on it. And we had her pull the door as close to her legs as possible. So we had that double exposure, and I thought that was really fun.- This one right here, you must have fun with your makeup artist. (laughs)- [Benjamin Kanerek] Oh, okay. This is what I want to tell you. Yes. It's based on the Robert Palmer video Addicted to Love. Where you see all of the models in the background, they all have the same makeup. So it's like they're wearing a mask. Any of those girls, they almost look identical. And this is how we wanted Ulrika to look, because that's how makeup was worn. So she's putting on the blush and I'm saying more blush. I need her to look sluttier. (chuckling) She's gotta look, I said,- You said that?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, she doesn't look. She doesn't look slutty enough. I said, look, Ulrika, I need to tell you something. It's it's pure professionalism, on today's shoot. I am not here. I do not exist. You do not see me. You're at a club you're piss-drunk, And I need to feel that and see that in your performance, you are going to ask to have to act. Now, if you cannot act, and I, and I said this right to her. I said, I have a feeling that you're going to feel a little bit uncomfortable. I need you to know if I push you really hard. It's out of respect to you. I need you to know it's not personal. It's like shooting a film. And if you need to lose your temper please do, but don't leave the set. Okay? I need you to know it's the love and respect for our project. And so I had to push her on a few occasions and she was wonderful. And what's great, what a metamorphosis! By the two-thirds of the day she was beaming, Chris, she was so happy. For her it was a turning point. We gave her a totally new image. Now she's with Ford agency in New York. And I think that's as a result of the images. It was like shooting a film from 1979. For this shoot I bought some really shitty UV filters and I took hair spray because I wanted it to look like"love boat". You know, when the older actresses would come in super close, you know, the actress who's like in her mid eighties, where they're coming in super close and they've got a super soft focus filter. So you don't see any wrinkles, that is the look I was going for. So what you do is you take the, the UV filter with the screw, matching the screw part that's going into the actual lens. And that's the side you want to spray, not the front of the filter. So you spray up into the air, not on the filter. You spray up into the, into the air, your hairspray, you swing your hand through it once. You do it again, swing it through and you keep looking at the bag and no, that's not enough. You pulled it up to your eye, no it's not enough. I was averaging six or seven sprays to get what I wanted. Okay. That's the first part. And the second part to make it even more Tacky. And I used the term Tacky with a capital T I used cross star filter. (laughs)- Did you really?- [Benjamin Kanerek] (laughing) Yes. And that's why you're getting the cross stars. So I use a six cross star filter for the stills and Freddie had an eight cross star filter for the video. And so when you watch the video,(Ben singing) "I don't want to dance." You see right in the beginning when she's dancing, into the lens, into the camera, look behind her, see that light? That's the cross star filter. And the opening for the cover. You see the cover where she's sitting on the urinal.- (laughs) Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] You see that shot, with a bright light coming into us.- [Chris] Sure do.- [Benjamin Kanerek] That's a six cross star filter. And that is the flash going off. I didn't want any diffusion. I wanted it to look like paparazzi in a club. And so that's the light shooting right into her. And the red light you're seeing is my assistant, outside of the frame, literally if you moved the vertical frame over an inch, is holding onto one of the, wee light, you know, the RB9 little square powerful on red only. And we mixed a flash in that ambient light. And that's what we got. I loved it. It was so much fun.- Yeah, it's a wonderful shot. And when you were on set, did you tell them, okay, first we're going to do the part. You're a little drunk. You're at the club and you're starting to dance. Then you're going to do some coke and we're going to, you're going to get all wired up from that day. You're going to get drunk and you're going to be exhausted.- [Benjamin Kanerek] I've got a story for you, Chris. You're like almost psychic again. You're doing a Chris Lee like last time, I'm not kissing your ass or blowing smoke up your ass, Check this out, you're gonna freak. You see the image where she's on the floor, with the wine glass next to her? Look at her face.- [Chris] (chuckling) Yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] And you see the wine?- [Chris] Oh yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] In the glass? Are you ready for this story?- [Chris] Yes.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Okay. This was the beautiful bathroom. I mean, it's all with gold faucets and beige granite. It's a circular bathroom. We were getting her ready. The first shot I thought of, which was a failure was that she would look at herself in the mirror, like touching up her lipstick, like in a club, you know, she's leaning over into the mirror. So I was looking through my camera realizing, her face is gonna look too tiny. The back of the outfit, the clothing isn't that exciting, no. So I backed out and then the whole team was about two or three meters outside of the bathroom in this kind of round circular entrance. And I see her shaking. It was almost as if she was having a stroke. And I said to her, oh, that's a great idea. (chuckling) That's brilliant. Listen, I didn't know. That's brilliant. I see her starting to waver, starting to move her body (indistinct) And I went running up to her head. Her eyes were up in the air. She was fainted.- What?- [Benjamin Kanerek] She was blacking out. Eric came running over, she blacked out. We were ready to call the ambulance. This was the second shot of the day.- Oh wow, my-- [Benjamin Kanerek] And we thought, oh my God, I hope she doesn't die on the set. It was really scary. We gave her some sugar. Frederique gave her some Altrient liposomal vitamin C, which went right away. And literally I kid you not within 15 seconds, She said, I'm fine. But she was fine, she was great she was back to normal. I think she had low blood sugar, or she probably didn't eat very much for the last week. And anyway, she ends up on the floor. I need you to know this had to be the greatest trooper, courageous model I've ever known, I've ever worked with. I mean, she was so professional. She's on the floor and opportunistic me and Eric went-- Hold it right there, good! (laughs)- [Benjamin Kanerek] Exactly! (laughs) Don't move, just stay there, you don't even have where she was lying down was where we lay her down. And all we did was Frederique moved the wine.(Chris wheezing laughing)- [Benjamin Kanerek] She only blacked out for a second, she gave her body gave out, we literally, we had to hold her up. We had to keep her from falling and injuring herself. So we lay her down- Lay her down, get the shot,(Chris laughing)- [Benjamin Kanerek] To get her and no (laughing)- I'm just kidding-- [Benjamin Kanerek] You're being a prick. No. (Ben laughing) That would be the epitome, that would be in the film Devil Wears Prada.- Not that I think that way, right? (laughing)- [Benjamin Kanerek] (laughing) Oh yes, you do, anyways. It's like saying to a model, jump off the Eiffel tower. You'll only get one take, but it'll be the best shot. We immediately brought her sugar. She came out of it really quickly. Frederique had her take down some of that liposomal, vitamin C, which is very glue on, very gluey texture and she came back. That is how we got that shot. And the only thing we had to do in post prod, because it was only water in the glass, was we changed it to red. And because when we came into the toilets, we wanted to fuck them up really bad. So they were already fucked up-- [Chris] Were they out of order or did you put black tape across them?- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, no. They were out of order, the guy at the hotel who invited us he said, do you want me to clean up the toilet? It's a mess.- Leave it, leave it, it's perfect!- [Benjamin Kanerek] Don't touch a thing, please. Exactly, it's perfect because that's how a toilet looks at three in the morning or five in the morning.- Let's talk about, you said there was another shoot called,- [Benjamin Kanerek] The most recent one, the black and white story- [Chris] Yeah, let's talk about that.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Sky writer. I mean, check out those shoes.- [Chris] I know! It's a uni look. It's Givenchy, the whole look is Givenchy- [Chris] And what angle lens are you using?- [Benjamin Kanerek] It's the lens that I wanted really badly for the shoot, and thank God I got it. I almost bought a seven and a half millimeter, and I thought to myself, Kenerek, you're going to piss your money away. You know why? You'll get the lens, it's manual focus, you'll never pick it up. You'll never use it for professional shoot. You'll use even with the incredible focusing aids, you're just not going to do it. So just be happy that you have a 10 millimeter. And I didn't want the eight to 16, because I liked being able to go from 10 to 24. It's the brand new 10 to 24 water resistant OIS Fuji lens. I'm going to tell you something. This lens is (he squeals) fucking sharp. It's an incredible lens. It's like, it was so much fun. Oh yeah I went through all my exit files just to see,'cause I'm getting the 23 millimeter for my GFX, which is for all intents and purposes an 18, on the APFC would be a 12 millimeter. Okay, we know that, okay? So I wanted to know what would that'cause that's the widest lens you can get for the GFX. And that's why I didn't use the GFX for this,'cause the widest I had at the time was a 32 or 32 64, which is okay it's like 25 millimeters, but it's not crazy wide. So I would say about 75% were shot at 10, which is 15. But surprisingly to me, many of them were shot at 12 and 13, maybe 14 millimeters. And actually one of them were shot at 18, which is like a 27 because of my angle. But in most cases the most outlandish ones, the shoe shot was not as outlandish. I think it was the equivalent of a 24 millimeter.- [Chris] I love this shot.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Oh yeah, you do? That's interesting. You haven't asked me about the lighting yet. I'm a little bit surprised-- [Chris] Tell me about the lighting there, Benjamin.- [Benjamin Kanerek] You've let me down.- I'm sorry, man- [Benjamin Kanerek] I'll never do another interview with you again.- I got excited about the lens- [Benjamin Kanerek] It's over between us. It's done. I'm going to hang up now.- The shoes and the lighting. The shoes and the lighting.- [Benjamin Kanerek] So I had two assistants on the shoot. I initially started with TTL and I freaked out because TTL just doesn't work as well outside as I wanted it to. So I used again but I didn't have my flash meter. I didn't give a shit'cause I just, you know, you'd do one or two shots and you nail it after, you know, a couple of tests, we were holding a raw, the AD200, just on a light stand folded up so she could hold onto it. And she would follow her moves and stay within two meters from her, angled down at around 60 degrees. And the flash was in the vertical direction, because I didn't even use the round reflector. And it was just hard light. But because again I only want it to match the daylight. I didn't want to scream"Hi, I'm using a flash." I don't see any images there that look like flash. It's all balanced you see the background in the foreground. They look balanced. So I needed to fill because I was lying on my back. In most cases, that's why it's called Sky rider because the whole shoot was sky as a background.- I wanted to ask you about that, because when you got to La Defense, you obviously can't predict the weather-- [Benjamin Kanerek] The weather!- So when you got there, was it a matter of, oh my gosh, the sky looks incredible. Let's just go.- [Benjamin Kanerek] No, that's not what happened to be really honest with you. I'm going to tell you the truth.'Cause I don't want to lie to you. The weather we knew was going to be relatively overcast. There are two things that'll give it away. If you watch the video, you'll see where Frederique comped in sky, film sky.- [Chris] Okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] A week before the shoot, I went to Sacre Coeur, it was a cloudy day. I waited for a really sunny cloudy day. Okay? Where you have intermittent clouds and sun. And I went up to Sacre Coeur to the top, and just took the 10 to 24 lens and started shooting sky like crazy. Tons of sky and we comped in the clouds. To comp in the clouds and do the right perspective, is the challenge. Do you understand what I'm saying?- Yeah, yeah, I can imagine.- [Benjamin Kanerek] And that's where Frederique's brief, Frederique could have done it she's incredible re-toucher, but she hasn't got the time. So Frederique briefed Olga our re-toucher. When you introduce the sky, be conscious of two things, the perspective. Okay, how she distorts the perspective. And remember you have to put clouds on the buildings.'Cause if you don't have clouds reflecting on the buildings, it's going to look fake, so it was an incredible challenge. So that's how we got what we got. Remember I said at the beginning of our discussion, you can recreate reality. But if you want to recreate reality in this situation, you have to remember the sun is shining somewhere. And the sun is hitting an object somewhere. And it's reflecting off of something. Now because I was shooting up at her, and she was looking down on me in 60 or 70% of the images, I could have brought up the light on her face by two stops, but she would have been soft. And the background would have, of course that happens in real life, of course, but I wanted it to be well, Hey, we don't know where she's at. Is there a mirror light of a building hitting her back in the face? It's always about balance. That's all I'm going to say.- What would you recommend to someone who is really intimidated with strobes or lights and they see your work and the way you've blended it so well. The open window analogy,- [Benjamin Kenerek] Okay that's helpful. Okay.- Do you have any other? It is. Do you have any other tips for things like, let's say you're shooting outdoors. How do you what's some of your tricks-- [Benjamin Kanerek] Making it look natural?- Avoiding the outdoor flash thing.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Of course. Absolutely. This is going to sound really simple and it is. Always match your or even under by a third, your ambient with your flash always match it. Don't go over it. You have to look at your surroundings. If you see in the background the sky, there's no thunder clouds and it's not black and menacing. Then the possibility of getting that stream of light hitting your subject is there's potential for that. But there isn't if your day is just simply overcast. What I recommend you do is just think of it this way, pretend when you have your model there, pretend there's a building behind you. Or there's a building to your sides. And that building is reflecting light back on your model. And if that is the case that reflection, if it's like a white wall or a beige wall, it won't overpower the model, because it's reflecting the available light. So in most cases and I've measured this, it may be a third under but if you didn't use it, you'd be under by a full saw perhaps or maybe more. So what I recommend people do I use and to be quite frank with my Godox AD600, I use TTL because I'm lazy. And what I do is I adjust accordingly. Because it's TTL, which is great. It's reading the ambient light of the environment. I know it's going to give me what I want. So I do my first flash and I think most cases it over exposes for some reason. And so I find myself with the AD600 I'm under, my flash is under from anywhere from one to one and a half stops for some reason. But when I do see the results, you don't know it's got flash. It just has the word I would like to use is presence. It has presence. Just try to think in terms of "My flash is not a flash.""It's just a light source that's reflecting from somewhere" And when you go outside, think of that as a set. Think of every place that you're shooting in as a set. Treat a flash as if it's a reflector that's the way to go. Think of it as a reflector.- As a reflector okay.- [Benjamin Kanerek] And then you'll start to make your stuff look real.- For your Shutter speed like on that shoot that you did for Sky- The sky shoot?- what was, yeah.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Okay. So obviously, I was using high speed sync. For example, one 500th of a second at F four, because you know it's an F four lens. She was standing up on a block of granite, guess that's 10 millimeters. I didn't even think of that lens until I realized, Kenerek you don't have anything wider than 16 millimeters for your Fuji gear. And when I've shot 16 it looks cool it's like a 24. When you come in super close to the subject, you get the subject, but you also get all that surrounding stuff. And I love that.- Yeah yeah. Like shoes those big shoes.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Those are the Doc Marten's, whatever you're looking at, let me see what you're looking at. Yeah. It's, Oh, that's crazy. That was our I guess the climax of the shoot. Yeah the jumping you're looking at the jumping in the air there were three in the sequence. I was really scared for her. You need to know this, the one you're looking at there, I was really frightened, because on the other side are stairs going down into the subway. So had she fallen behind her and she made the shoot. This is one person who had no problem expressing herself. From the get-go you press the start button. And she was like a Duracell battery on steroids.- Oh that's great.- [Benjamin Kanerek] It is, that's the shoot.- I think it's one of your best. I actually liked sky rider.- I agree. I love it. I mean the 1979 disco one was a real departure for a lot of your work from what I've seen.- [Benjamin Kanerek] It's true. It's true.- But Sky Writer just has this vibe that I personally dig. I love it.- [Benjamin Kanerek] You know Chris I got to tell you, it was a lot of fun and it was very exhausting, but it was worth it.- And I'm going to have links to everything we talked about today. All of the BK mag, the YouTube videos, the behind the scenes stuff, all of it will be in the description down below this video, please go check it out. Benjamin's work is incredible.- For those of you just joining us, Benjamin got a new microphone.- [Benjamin Kanerek] Yeah I sound so sexy to myself. I've never heard myself sound so good. I'm going to do a phone sex tape of myself, talking to myself.- Right perfect!- [Benjamin Kanerek] I know I know avoid that anyways.(benjamin laughing)- Now we return to our regularly scheduled program.- [Benjamin Kanerek] That was a family show of course.