Melia is the youngest member of the bar in Queensland, and one of only two Aboriginal female barristers in Queensland. Hear how Melia took a journey from wanting to see the world as an air hostess, to how she fights a sense of "imposter syndrome" to become a barrister.
As a barrister in Cairns and Brisbane the cases she takes on are inspiring. This career journey is not only an example of the importance of finding a career, but also a fight that you are incredibly passionate about. We discuss how to find this kind of passion, and how to channel it into a career.
This was an incredibly powerful conversation that aside from the career journey, is one that I recommend anyone listens to. Meet one of our amazing people that well deserves 45 mins of our time to hear her story.
Melia is the youngest member of the bar in Queensland, and one of only two Aboriginal female barristers in Queensland. Hear how Melia took a journey from wanting to see the world as an air hostess, to how she fights a sense of "imposter syndrome" to become a barrister.
As a barrister in Cairns and Brisbane the cases she takes on are inspiring. This career journey is not only an example of the importance of finding a career, but also a fight that you are incredibly passionate about. We discuss how to find this kind of passion, and how to channel it into a career.
This was an incredibly powerful conversation that aside from the career journey, is one that I recommend anyone listens to. Meet one of our amazing people that well deserves 45 mins of our time to hear her story.
Chris Potts:
Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Careers Night. This is the podcast where we ask our guests two simple questions. What's your job and how did you get there? My name is Chris Potts, and I'd like to thank you for joining us and giving us your time to join this conversation today.
Chris Potts:
Today's episode is a brilliant one, and one that was incredibly powerful and impactful on me to the extent that I recorded this some time ago. It's taken me a long time to build up the confidence. I guess the courage to do it justice and to start with a personal story.
Chris Potts:
So, I wanted to do that as a complete aside and I thank you for the patience and tolerance to join in on this part and to stick with me. It's important to me that I articulate this to just contribute to this conversation, I guess the undercurrent to what we explore in this episode.
Chris Potts:
So the story is that going back in when I was at school in year eight. I remember we were studying a book. It was one of Shakespeare's plays. I remember trying to contribute to one of the conversations and using a racial term that I thought at the time and believed to be a quote from the book that was immediately replied to me that, that was an inappropriate expression to use.
Chris Potts:
While there was no underlying malice with it, there was no intent to be inappropriate, I remember the shame and the embarrassment that I felt particularly to hear later on that I overheard a conversation between some of my fellow students. One of them was telling someone else about the fact that I'd done that. I just remember being absolutely mortified that I had accidentally used an expression or a word that had caused harm and hurt to people.
Chris Potts:
For me, that was a very strong influence for what later became a theme through my life is to avoiding these conversations altogether. The fear of replicating that guilt I had, that embarrassment at causing that pain or using the incorrect expressions meant that I no longer engaged in those conversations. I took it as an easy way to opt out of those.
Chris Potts:
That's been a theme for my entire life. It's something that as society matures, as we start this journey of healing, I've become more acutely aware. I've decided more recently to just throw myself into it and to try and move forward and have these conversations.
Chris Potts:
I've been incredibly fortunate recently to start an assignment as a part of my studies where we're supporting social enterprise. For us, that includes working really closely with the most passionate, powerful Aboriginal spokesperson and founder that I could possibly hope to learn from.
Chris Potts:
It's been really heartwarming and encouraging to be involved in that process and to feel my curiosity on the subject matter is helping. I hope to be able to through that assignment and through these conversations contribute to the healing conversation that I'm learning so much about the importance of it.
Chris Potts:
I'd like to start my recording by acknowledging that it's being held on the lands of the Bunurong people. I wish to acknowledge them as the traditional custodians. I would also like to pay my respect to their elders past and present and Aboriginal elders of the communities who may be here today.
Chris Potts:
So, thank you as I said for bearing with me on that. I'd like to now move forward into the more traditional starting of the episode. I'm incredibly excited by this recording and this conversation that I had. As you can see by where we've gone, it's been incredibly powerful for me.
Chris Potts:
Today's episode is with a really special guest, Melia, who is a barrister doing some incredible work for some incredible people. To me, there was one quote through this that absolutely resonated and one that I reflect on regularly for the many months since I recorded this and that's, why would I want to do anything else? To me, that is someone who has absolutely found their purpose, their reason for being, and for working. They understand what it is that they can contribute to this world.
Chris Potts:
The journey that she took there, the leap of faith that she made and how close she came to not being there, I think is one that's incredibly powerful. For anyone who's interested in this world that's keen to hear an incredible story, I really do believe that this is one that you'll get a lot out of. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do. So, let's jump straight into it.
Chris Potts:
As I do with every episode, I'd just like to simply start with I guess introducing yourself and tell me, what is your job?
Melia Benn:
So my name is Melia Benn. I'm a barrister-at-law. Before I get started, I'd like to acknowledge that I'm one of the people of the Gimuy-walubarra Gunggandji people's land. I acknowledge that they never ceded sovereignty. So, I get to work in Gimuy. My family is actually Mamu Gunggandji, and my ancestors come from Yarrabah and also around the Innisfail area around Cairns here.
Melia Benn:
I am a barrister who has chambers in Cairns, and I also have chambers in Brisbane. I consider my practice to be quite national as I spend a lot of time in Western Australia and Northern Territory, as well as Cairns, and Brisbane, and other regional towns.
Chris Potts:
Very good. What is the type of work you take on that has you traveling so far and representing so much country?
Melia Benn:
So I am briefed in a few different class actions, one which we have in two different states, which is stolen wages, which is a class action that's been replicated from a successful settlement here in Queensland where the amount that we settled eventually was 190 million. That is to recognize all the stolen wages that were taken from Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people. They never got their pay. We are doing the same thing in Western Australia and Northern Territory, and eventually other states as well.
Melia Benn:
So, I go over to both of those states when Covid's not interrupting everything and sit on country, taking statements and evidence from the old people.
Chris Potts:
Wow. That's incredible and what an achievement you've made so far. Is that representative of what you were after at the time or how does that hail into what was done, I guess?
Melia Benn:
When I went to law school, is that-
Chris Potts:
No, sorry. The case where $190 million.
Melia Benn:
I unfortunately wasn't a private bar when that action started. I only got to be a part of it at the very tail end when the settlement was being administered. My role in that particular case was to go out on country in Queensland, speak to mob about how the money was going to be divvied up between everyone and get bank account details.
Melia Benn:
It's almost like a roadshow. The court orders it, so you have to go out and explain to everyone in person what they've decided to settle on because once they've signed up into this class action, they can't sue the government separately. So, they all need to be a part and we need some buy-in from them.
Melia Benn:
Also, it's not something that we can just do like this on a video link to a town hall in the middle of common yard or something like that. You actually have to go out and speak to these people in person and show your respects in that way.
Chris Potts:
It must be an incredible privilege for you to be able to do that. Is it one of the highlights of the job to ...
Melia Benn:
Yeah. When I went to law school and stuff, I didn't even really know that this is something that I could do at the bar. At the time of doing the bar practice course, I really was just doing the course to get it done. Then to go back to the coroner's office and work there, have a couple of babies or something.
Melia Benn:
I met someone when I was at the bar practice course, and he introduced me to this line of work. So when I first came to the bar, I wasn't on the brief yet, but he invited me to a meeting at this solicitor's office which was a meeting. I think there were about 10 elders there, all men, and all sitting around a table and including some people on the phone. I was just observing that day.
Melia Benn:
Hans Pearson was our lead applicant in that matter. So, he was sitting in the middle of the table. Everyone is addressing him. I got to meet all these amazing people who lived through just the biggest, so much brutality by the effects of colonization and the like. So, he worked for 28 years and got I think 10 pounds at the end of those years of being a stockman and working his guts out, thinking that at least one day when he finishes, he will get something for that. He never did.
Melia Benn:
So, I'm sitting around these people who have just lived the most incredible lives, really resilient, but yet still not bitter. These people are just so elegant, so beautifully spoken. That there's no yelling going on. No, one's mad. Everyone is just looking for something to come to peace with what happened to them.
Melia Benn:
After the meeting, I text Joshua Creamer who had put me on to observe that day and I text him. I said, "Why would you want to do anything else?"
Chris Potts:
Wow.
Melia Benn:
"This has to be the best job ever." Like just, "Why would you want to do anything else?" That's before I even went on country. Then you get the proper brief for the class actions that are just starting, going out to the middle of nowhere, places I've never heard before sitting on people's front lawns, recording their voices.
Melia Benn:
These people are well, old for Aboriginal people. They're the late 60s and 70s. They're super old for Aboriginal people and just sitting around. My specialty is speaking to Aboriginal women.
Chris Potts:
Yes.
Melia Benn:
So, that's why they wanted me on these teams. Some of the things that they talked to me about in the way that they were treated or sexually assaulted and the like. It's not appropriate to be told to men. So, I come along on these trips specifically to speak to women.
Melia Benn:
So, I'm sitting on their front lawn with their best little blanket. They think it's an honor for me to be at their house, but I'm sitting there thinking, "I'd do this for free." You know?
Chris Potts:
Yeah.
Melia Benn:
Someone paid all my bills. I would do this for free because the honor is all mine, the privilege and honor is all mine.
Chris Potts:
That's incredible. As you're telling that story and that realization that is if you want to do anything else. That's a goosebump kind of realization, isn't it? It's just truly incredible. I want to come back to that journey and what that looks like for you.
Chris Potts:
If I can just circle right back to, if you can talk us through some of the language, so bar, and chambers, and what that journey looks like, I guess would be really valuable.
Melia Benn:
Yeah, sure. I'll start from the very start. So, I went to university here in James Cook locally in Cairns. We had, I think there was 80 people that started with us. Only 12 people actually ended up graduating. So, it is a course where people start and you drop off quite dramatically after the first semester.
Melia Benn:
I was very fortunate though that there's an indigenous school, a really good one at James Cook. So, I met some really lovely older women who were a year ahead of me or two years ahead. I also was very fortunate to have a tutor who helped me through those times where you feel like you're actually not smart enough to do this degree, things like that, all that imposter syndrome but he was fourth year. So, he was a really good mentor in that way.
Melia Benn:
At the time of uni, I was working at a law firm just as a secretary. Cairns really small, job opportunities are really tight. There wasn't any room for me to become a lawyer with that firm. I was approached by another local firm to do conveyancing and property law. That was never going to be a passion of mine. I remember distinctly sitting when conveyancing as a subject thinking, "I'm never going to do this. I'm just going to pass this subject. I don't care. I'm not going to practice in it." They're my very first job. It was amazing.
Melia Benn:
Anyway, things like that happen for a reason because whilst that wasn't the type of job I want to do, it still gave me really good skills that were transferable into other parts of the law that I ended up going into. So I did that for about 18 months, and I had always wanted to go to court. So when I was at uni, I always wanted to do an area of law where you go to court every day.
Melia Benn:
So, I was speaking to a barrister here in Cairns that my mom knew and he said, "Oh look, you should try getting into the office of the Director of Public Prosecutions," so the local prosecuting office for the state. You'll have to start as an entry level, but you work your way up. So, I went and had an interview for that job.
Melia Benn:
At the same time, another job came up like I went and did the interview for it and everything. It was in a private firm doing litigation and insolvency. So no court work, but the good thing about that job was that it was permanent. It paid really well for a young lawyer, and it was a solid solicitor job. It wasn't a clerk or anything like that.
Melia Benn:
So, I had to make a decision because I got offered both of those jobs and I had to make a decision. Do I go with the job that I actually want to do, which is court work, criminal work as a clerk and earn less on a three-month contract with no guarantees with-
Chris Potts:
That's high risk.
Melia Benn:
We hadn't actually bought a house at that time, but we were about to. So, I knew I was about to have a mortgage for the very first time. So, the best advice I was given about trying to make a decision for that was the barrister who lined up the job with the DPPs.
Melia Benn:
He didn't want to influence me in any way but he said, "When you wake up in the morning tomorrow when you have to make the decision, when you wake up, take the job of whichever job you thought of first when you wake up because that's the job you really want to do."
Chris Potts:
Yup.
Melia Benn:
I woke up and I was like, "Oh, I want to go to court. I want to do the DPP job." So, I took that job. By chance, a woman I used to ... Well, she's actually a very good friend of mine. We went to uni together. We were sharing an office at the property law place.
Melia Benn:
That other job was actually way more suited to her and the type of law that she wanted to do. So, I put her name forward for the other job. So, she went and did that job. I went to the DPP. My contract was extended. The gamble paid off, but I just thought and I still think all the time that advice was just pure gold.
Chris Potts:
Essentially, that advice was you've got to do what you love doing. Follow your passion. Don't be swayed by the pay or other elements.
Melia Benn:
So that was six years ago now or something. I always think when people come and ask me, "Oh, what should I do?" They might be in a similar predicament. I'm like, "You know, life is short. Certainly, I've had experiences this year that remind me of that, but life is also really long and your work life is really long."
Melia Benn:
So, you should do things that make you happy because when you do law, a lot of the content that we do is really heavy on your heart. It's quite traumatic. If you're doing it and you don't like it, you're not going to be able to do it for very long because you're not going to have anything to keep you powered. So, you don't have that tank of passion to dip into when you're feeling really low or just needing a bit of a pep up or a reminder why you work so hard. So, I think you're right. That's basically what that advice was.
Chris Potts:
Do you know what it was that attracted you to the courts? What was the burning inside you that said, "I really want to go to court?"
Melia Benn:
So I love Jim Carrey, and this is such a disappointing answer to that question. He did that movie Liar Liar, and he's a family lawyer. I thought that movie was hilarious, but it's so interesting how the part of going to court in that matter and having a client and dealing with all of that.
Melia Benn:
Then in grade five, I was going about primary school here in Cains. My teacher at the time, I don't know, I'm conspiring at this point. I think he had this list of assessments to do very quickly in a day that he hadn't done in time for our report cards.
Melia Benn:
One of those was we had to sit around in a circle. He gave us a piece of paper, so we hadn't seen it before. You had to read it out and you were assessed on how you spoke and how you presented something in such a short amount time. So I just did that and I got the highest mark you can get for that and realized that, that's something that I'm actually really good at, being able to pick up something and present it very quickly in a way that having pauses in the right way, pronunciation of words, and expression was something that I really excelled at.
Melia Benn:
Obviously at the time I wasn't thinking, "Oh, that must mean I'm going to be a lawyer." I do think about that sometimes when I'm given a task like that and I'm doubting myself. I think, "No, this is something that I've been good at since I was a young child."
Chris Potts:
That's an amazing realization. I really like that. So, at what stage did the desire to become a lawyer manifest?
Melia Benn:
Manifest? Mom always tells the story. I always got around saying, "I'm going to be a lawyer when I'm older." Then in grade 11 and 12, I had a lot of stuff going on at home with my family. I didn't enjoy school anymore. It wasn't something that I wanted to put or could put a lot of time and energy into. I lost interest, but I still put on my preferences when you get your OP score and everything that I would like to do law.
Melia Benn:
Putting that to the side, I decided I actually kind of want to get away from Australia and Cairns and things for a little while. So my auntie at the time, she still is technically a Qantas flight attendant. I thought, "Oh, I'm going to do international flight attending, and see the world, and live a little bit."
Melia Benn:
I had my forms filled out and all of that, but my mom and my stepdad at the time had broken up. I have two younger siblings, one of which is nine years younger than me. Mom was still studying to be a nurse at the time. So, she would do prac during the day, work at night or vice versa. So, she needed me really. I had my license and stuff by that time. She needed me to be at home and to chip in with cooking dinners, picking up the kids from school, and stuff like that.
Melia Benn:
So the timing wasn't right for me to get away, like I had wanted to. It worked out because JCU or James Cook just randomly called me one day and said ... This is like a year or two after school too and said, "You never followed through with your preference with your application. Whilst your OP has lapsed, you can do an arts degree. Then if you do well in your arts degree, you just transfer that over to a law degree. You will not have to do any extra time. So, you should really think about giving that a go."
Melia Benn:
Like I said because I couldn't go overseas or anything like that, I thought, "Okay, well fine. I'll go do this arts degree. If I hate it, then I'll keep working. If I like it, I'll do what I always said I was going to do and end up going to law school."
Chris Potts:
Wow. That's really interesting. I'm sure you're not on your own there in the interest in flight attendants. Unfortunately or fortunately I guess for your customers or your clients now, that's not the way it played out. I get a sense that you are someone who cares very deeply and you put your plans aside for your family.
Chris Potts:
You talked about the work you do, working with the indigenous elders and hearing their stories. You spoke about the fact that this work weighs heavy on the heart. How do you juggle that? I assume that for someone who does care deeply and is connected to people so closely in this particular work you do, how's that play out for you?
Melia Benn:
It's really hard sometimes to keep your cup full. It is important to be able to pour from a fuller cup than an empty one because to your client, you're their only lawyer. They don't know that I have 20 or 30 other clients. So each and every time you meet with those clients, you've got to be your best self and presenting in a way that makes them feel really seen and really heard. Otherwise, I'm not going to be able to build relationships with them.
Melia Benn:
So, I have to be very careful about my mental health and also just doing things that bring you joy because if you are not doing that often enough, you will explode. That's proven to happen time and time again and that would just be a waste because I'm only one of two Aboriginal women in Queensland who do this job.
Melia Benn:
So if I'm not doing it, if I'm not there for mob and Avelina is the only person, or if Avalina's not there, then who's going to do this work? So, I'm very conscious of the fact that I have to be really careful about that. One of the ways I do that is, well I did say earlier, I have scheduled some days off. That always changes.
Melia Benn:
Maybe sometimes like this morning, I didn't come to the office until 9:00 or something like that because I had a late night. I called. That's the flexibility that comes with this job, but it's recognizing that it's okay to sleep until 7:00 AM. You don't have to be waking up at 4:30, 5:30 every single day. You can adjust your calendar accordingly to make sure you get at least a couple of hours here or there, where you have a little bit of downtime.
Melia Benn:
The other thing that I do is obviously I go home to country when I can because there is no replacing. There's no way of substituting being at home with mob. There's no substituting putting your feet in the ocean and having those chats with people like that.
Melia Benn:
I don't get to go very often. It's hard to line up days, everyone's busy, things like that. I only have a small backyard but for me, having a little piece of land is still really magical. If it's a nice day and if I have time, I just get my towel or picnic blanket and I have two dogs. I just lie down.
Melia Benn:
You keep your phone and your iPads inside. You just lie with your back on the earth, looking up to the sky, remember that you're a part of something bigger. That you're not the most important person in the world. That day and time passes on with or without you. There's something really re-energizing about having your back on land.
Chris Potts:
I love it and the imagery there. I know in my life, I certainly don't take the time to do those kinds of things and really appreciate what I do have and just enjoy those elements. It's so easy to forget that and to just get on with life without taking the time to do it.
Chris Potts:
I'm interested now, and my mind kept drifting to it. When you were looking at the DPP role and you got the advice to what's the first thing you think about in the morning of those two roles, where are you at now with that? What's the first thing that you think of each morning when you get up and start preparing for work?
Melia Benn:
I have a Golden Retriever puppy, so I don't get to have any nice waking thoughts like that anymore. In saying that, that is even more beautiful because she doesn't care what I've got going on today. She just wants my full attention and some breakfast.
Melia Benn:
As I'm going through the day, I spend a lot of time reflecting. I probably am an overthinker. You start thinking about your day. So for example this morning, I thought a lot about my presentation last night. So, I'm quite a young practitioner. I'm the youngest person at the bar here in Cairns.
Melia Benn:
Last night I did a presentation in front of all of my colleagues and solicitors who some of them have been lawyers for longer than I've been alive. So I'm up there telling them how to speak to Aboriginal Torres Strait Islander people, how to take instructions, trying not to sound like telling them how to suck eggs. So for me, it was reflecting this morning about how that went, reading emails or text messages with feedback about that.
Melia Benn:
Then, I started thinking about how I was going to answer the questions for your podcast today and discussing with my partner what we're going to do this afternoon. Are we going to take the dogs to the creek? So all really, really normal stuff.
Melia Benn:
I did also reflect this morning that last night we went for dinner after that presentation because I presented with the first Aboriginal silk in Australia, his name's Tony McAvoy SC. After that, we went for dinner at a magistrate's house here in Cairns. Her name's Jacqui Payne and she was the first ever indigenous magistrate to be appointed.
Melia Benn:
So, Tony's from Inala. I'm from Cairns. Jacqui is from Mount Garnet. There was other Aboriginal barristers and solicitors with us. We were sitting around the table and it's like Jacqui's got this most architecturally beautiful house. We're all talking around the table, and it felt really nice. We've all had really different lives, but regionally and don't come from very much, and yet we've all worked so hard.
Melia Benn:
I got to sit there around this room with all these amazing lawyers and a judicial officer sitting there thinking like, "Oh, wow. I can't wait for the younger ones to come and I want to invite them to my house and invite these other people as well, and for that table to just get bigger and bigger."
Melia Benn:
So, a big passion of mine is trying to get more black lawyers on board and to spread the load. So me and Avelina don't have to carry it all, but particularly women and just for people to see what they can be. I didn't know a lawyer, just certainly didn't know a black lawyer when I was growing up. So, I do think a lot and reflect a lot about how I can help get more lawyers, bring them to the table.
Chris Potts:
I think that's an incredible cause. We hear so often that you can only be what you can see. I'm wondering for you how that played out. You said at different times during your studies, that imposter syndrome was there. Was that an element of this?
Melia Benn:
It still is an element of this. Most places that I go to, I'm the only Aboriginal person. So, there's not someone in Cairns that I can ... Well, Jacqui's here now. Magistrate Payne is here now. I rely really heavily on my contacts and picking up the phone, and I lean on them quite a lot.
Melia Benn:
I didn't have that as a child. I did have a mother though, who she persevered regardless of everything that was thrown her way. So, I guess in a way I could see that I could be whatever I wanted to be with that resilience that she taught me. I also draw on the resilience of my own people and what they went through but was still able to, despite all efforts to try and extinct us as a race, managed to have children, and then their children had children, and then I exists.
Melia Benn:
So, I really am a product of two sides of families who can beat anything. I draw on that quite often when I feel like I'm not going to be able to finish something, or I'm not going to be able to stand in front of those people when you need to have a moment of reflection. You think, "Well, my grandparents would have loved to have had the opportunity to do this. So, I have to do it and I have to do it well to honor them."
Chris Potts:
I'm sitting here feeling all sorts of things that I wasn't expecting honestly, at the start of this conversation. I guess where I'm going here is I don't even know what my question is, other than to say that it feels like what you do is important, really important.
Chris Potts:
I think a lot of people aspire to do things that matter in this world in their careers and very few find that. I'm trying to work out for myself what it is that you're doing that is most important. Is it the court wins? Is it the role modeling?
Melia Benn:
It's never the court wins. It's never because for me, if we're in court, we've already lost. If I'm in court representing an Aboriginal person and they're looking down the barrel going to jail, then society for me has already failed that human being. Yes, of course we celebrate on the days that we get a really good result and you have to celebrate that because small wins are still wins, and it's a part of a bigger course, sure.
Melia Benn:
For me, the way that I'll feel success is when I don't have to be explaining to my clients that maybe it's not worth going to trial because juries are inherently racist. Maybe my measure of success will be where I can retire, and I don't have to go to a talk every quarter to try and educate people on how to talk to mob.
Melia Benn:
I don't want to limit myself in what the ultimate goal would be. I've got to be very careful that there's a really big risk of tokenism or trying to elevate me and my colleagues. Maybe we're not quite ready, but just because you do need to normalize black faces in the judges, in the magistrates, and in positions of power.
Melia Benn:
For me, the important work really at this point is I might not be able to change the outcome, but I can at least make the experience for people the best that it can be and in a way that they feel respected.
Chris Potts:
It's powerful stuff. When you were studying law, did you dream or imagine that it could lead to this? That it could be this powerful and this important to you?
Melia Benn:
No because uni is such a slog. Uni is just trying to get through it. I didn't have that perspective back then. It would be good to say that I did, and that's why I've channeled all of that into this position that I'm in now. Things just happened along the way. It wasn't something that I was really purposely trying to do.
Melia Benn:
I do things very purposely now. I've aligned myself with people that make me realize my abilities and where I can make a difference and things like that. During uni, it was really just trying to get it done, trying to get a job that paid well so that I could help my family and things like that.
Melia Benn:
Where it all really changed for me was when I went to the bar practice course, and I met an Aboriginal barrister. He completely opened my eyes to what and where I can make a difference. Some of the things he said to me was like, "You got to think big to be big. Don't always have to be a struggling black fellow," which is what we put those ceilings on ourself because you think, "Oh, that's just how it's always been. That's what it's going to be like for me."
Melia Benn:
He thinks at a different level, which is like, "We need to be this big so that people can look above and say, 'Right. That's what I want to be too.' Then you can carve that path for them."
Chris Potts:
Do you feel like it's changing and it's having an impact? Are you seeing more black women want to become lawyers or follow in your footsteps?
Melia Benn:
Yeah. Doing talks or like I did that SBS show and things like that, that takes so much of my personal time. I'm opening my heart to complete strangers all for the hope that there's one little person out there, one little black kid in community sees it and goes, "Oh my gosh, if she did it, then I can do it."
Melia Benn:
Then sometimes I think that's really indulgent. Maybe I shouldn't be so, think that I could have such a big impact. It's that real, trying to check yourself feeling. Then you get an email from, like I got an email from a woman who's living in Canberra at the moment saying, "Oh, hi. I had always thought I'd eventually go to the bar, but I've just watched your SBS special. I've decided it is a matter of priority for me. I want to come to the bar now, and I'm going to do the course in the next session."
Melia Benn:
So, that's it. That's it for me. It was worth all that time because if that gave that woman some strength and inspiration for her to go and make such a big move like that. Those courses are six weeks long. You don't get any days off. I had to move to Brisbane. It costs a fortune.
Melia Benn:
So, they're not little decisions that people can just say, "Oh you know, I might just. Oh she did that, so I'll be able to." They're really big decisions. If I was a part of pushing someone to actually take the step, then it was all worth it.
Chris Potts:
Absolutely. Hearing your story and your talk, I just encourage you to don't check yourself. It's going to make a difference. It's so powerful and don't sell yourself short. It's incredible to hear. I'm reluctant to do it, but I'll move on to the final three questions that I like to close out with and just explore relatively quickly. Is there anything you would do differently?
Melia Benn:
That's a really loaded question I think, because I'm really happy where I am now. I think that mistakes and at the time you think isn't the right decision or sometimes you really want something like you want it so bad and you're so disappointed when it doesn't happen. Then six months later, you get this really amazing window into why you didn't get that and maybe something better more suited to you. Your course was waiting, and that's why you couldn't be tied up in this other thing that you thought was the be all and end all.
Melia Benn:
So, those questions are really difficult to answer without being honest with yourself and really all of our experiences make up the person that you are. So probably no, probably I wouldn't.
Chris Potts:
It's an amazing thing that just because the journey's tricky at times or rough at times. Once you get through those elements, doesn't mean you would necessarily want to change them because that's where you are now and where you are now is a fairly incredible place.
Melia Benn:
You learn to pivot. Okay. You end up in a spot and you're like, "Well, this isn't what I wanted." You become very resourceful. You pivot into another direction. Then when you sit back, once you're there, you think, "Oh wow, I wouldn't actually have wanted it any other way because it gave me skills along the way to deal with being disappointed."
Melia Benn:
The world at any given time is going to disappoint you. If you're not ready to turn that into something that you want or to pivot into a different direction, then you're never going to grow. So, I think it's really important to reflect on times you've been disappointed and to measure yourself by the times you haven't been successful. Then, how you dealt with that to come back from it too.
Chris Potts:
Awesome. It might be hard to answer. I think we've touched on elements during our discussion, but any idea yet what's next for you?
Melia Benn:
I'll be a barrister I think for a long time. I do have plans to hopefully have kids one day or maybe change. I already have been changing the type of laws that I do work in. So, I used to do a lot of criminal defense and I decided at the start of the year that I would like to make that a smaller part of my practice and to do other areas. All of that takes time though.
Melia Benn:
So ultimately, it would be good to have all of these class actions actually not being interrupted by Covid. I could spend a lot of time on country and things like that. I think that's the most exciting part about my job and being an independent, a barrister at the private bar. I have a lot of variety and a lot of autonomy as to what sort of law I want to do. So, I'll go with the flow as I develop my skills and see where that takes me.
Chris Potts:
That sounds amazing. I'm sure you have so much of it. For different groups of people and in different stages of their life, but final piece of advice that you would give someone.
Melia Benn:
Never sell your true self short. So if you want to be successful and you want to hold yourself out to be a certain way, make sure that you're always being your authentic self because at the end of the day, you've got to live with you. People will come and go. If you've portrayed yourself one way to one person and someone to the next, who are you really and how can you expect other people to be authentic if you're not being authentic? If all else fails, at least you were yourself.
Melia Benn:
Just being yourself, knowing yourself really well and liking yourself, and embracing all parts about you. If people don't like it, that's fine. You can't be everyone's cup of tea, but at least at the end of the day, you're going to bed saying, "Well, I was at least myself and you can be pleased and proud of yourself."
Chris Potts:
Awesome. So, I'd like to wind up here and just thank you again for making the time and sharing your story. It's so incredibly powerful. I am sure it will impact all of our listeners as it has me. I think what you're doing in your field of work is inspirational.
Chris Potts:
I hope it gets more coverage. It makes the change that you're hoping to make and has a really material impact on the lives of everyone that you're working with. It's an incredible to be able to speak to you and to hear about it directly from you. I'd like to thank you for taking the time.
Melia Benn:
Thank you, Chris, and thank you for being patient with me trying to get this time. I'm sorry. I've had to cancel a few times, but we got there eventually. So, thank you for having me.