Stop. Sit. Surrogate.

Service, Sacrifice, And Building Families Beyond Blood

• Kenedi & Ellen Smith • Season 5 • Episode 24

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What happens when military life meets surrogacy? We welcome back Whitney, a two-time gestational surrogate and Coast Guard spouse, for a candid, practical, and heart-forward conversation about building families while navigating orders, insurance, and constant change. Whitney opens up about the moment a medical retirement notice landed the night before transfer, how she planned around potential moves, and why a supportive command and tight-knit base community made all the difference.

We get real about TriCare and the secondary insurance most surrogates need. Whitney explains the Prime vs. Select trade-offs, how maternity claims can wrongly hit TriCare, and what to do when providers bill the wrong plan. She shares a cautionary tale about DEERS auto-enrollment, escrow closing too early, and a postpartum complication that surfaced months later—plus the fixes a good agency should own. If you’ve ever searched for surrogacy insurance, TriCare and surrogacy, or escrow timeline for surrogacy, this is the clarity you’ve been missing.

Beyond logistics, this is a story about chosen family. Whitney’s neighbors and friends stepped in with meals, childcare, and quiet companionship in hospital waiting rooms, showing how military communities become a lifeline far from home. Her kids formed deep bonds with intended parents, learning that families are built in many ways—and that love, not just DNA, holds them together. We also talk about the HBO docuseries that chronicles her journey alongside global family stories, offering a needed counterweight to loud headlines and tired myths.

If you’re a military spouse weighing surrogacy—or an intended parent trying to understand the terrain—you’ll leave with practical steps: confirm station stability, secure surrogacy-friendly insurance, extend escrow through postpartum, and build a local support web before transfer. Subscribe, share with someone who needs real-world guidance, and leave a review with your biggest question so we can cover it next.

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SPEAKER_02:

Welcome. We are a mother-daughter podcast about all things surrogacy. Together, we have brought eight beautiful babies into this world, and we would like to share through education and knowledge about surrogacy with those who want to educate themselves on the topic. This is Stop Sit Surrogate. Hey everyone, if you ever thought about becoming a surrogate, I want to share something with you. Stopsit Surrogate is now a matching and referral agency that helps guide you through the very first steps of your journey. We'll walk with you until you're matched and connected with a trusted agency that supports you all the way through. It's such a meaningful process, and knowing you're not alone makes a huge difference. So if you're curious about surrogacy or ready to take that first step, check us out at stopsitsurrogate.com. Hi everybody, welcome back to Stopsit Surrogate. Today we are welcomed by a repeat guest. We love her so much. And um, I'm gonna let you just reintroduce yourself.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm Whitney. Um, I am a two-time gestational surrogate. Uh and possibly on my third journey, maybe, who knows? Um, and I'm a military wife, and yeah, happy back.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh my gosh. Well, I'm happy to have you here. Uh so a little bit about what today's about is um I asked a couple weeks ago, you know, what kind of stories would you guys like to hear? And I had a couple girls reach out asking about military spouses, and Whitney was like, I'm one. I was like, Yay, Whitney. So um she's here to answer a bunch of questions that I don't even know. So we're just gonna get right down to it. I mean, um, because you've been on before, but um, do you just like a like a little nutshell of like how you got into surrogacy?

SPEAKER_01:

Oh yeah. Um, I'm adopted. And then like I knew families were like I knew there was different pathways to parenthood and that different family, like not all families were the classic mom, dad, two kids, like families made in different ways, shapes, colors, sizes, you know. And I knew that I wanted to be a part of something special for someone else. So originally adoption was on my mind, but then like when I got married and had my own kids, I was like, no, like I want to do this for someone else. And um I remember seeing like just like you, I saw Phoebe on Friends. She was like my first, like, I was like, oh wow, you can do this for someone. And then like I looked into it. Um I was on the process for like two years, and then that whole journey just like got washed out. And then I restarted again like two years later, and then that was successful in 2022, was my first successful birth, and then 2024 was my second.

SPEAKER_02:

So just last year. Oh, yeah, wow, yeah. And we're just gonna throw this in there, Whitney. Whitney, I have not watched it yet, but I'm about to. I'm literally, that's all my plans tonight. But Whitney was on an HBO. I'm throwing this out there, I didn't even ask you. Whitney was on a HBO docuseries, right? Like it's can can you explain? I promise we're gonna get into the military thing, but you're here, so now I have to No, I'm happy to.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm happy to. I'm really proud of it. Um, it's a eight-episode docuseries um about different family cultures and dynamics from around the world.

SPEAKER_02:

Um each episode is different.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh yes. So it all centers around Pedro and Ben, which was my IPs and their pathway to parenthood. Um, but because I was a big part in their pathway to parenthood, um, my family's in it a lot. Um, but it also explores like family cultures in China and Italy and Japan. Like he goes all over the world and interviews people with different family dynamics that are so much different than they are in America. And it's truly beautiful. You see, like that not all families are created equally, but they all are based in the root of love and it's super special. Um and our sorry, the second episode, which comes out tomorrow, is completely our story. Um but we're okay but we're in every episode with them.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh my gosh. Somebody somebody was saying, because I I watch things while I work because that's when I have the most time. But they were like, it's in a different language, so you'll have to read subtitles. Is that true? So I have to read subtitles?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, so Pedro is Brazilian. Um native language is Portuguese, and the docuseries was um released first in Brazil. Okay, but then it's worldwide. So um he's talking to the camera just one-on-one, he is talking in Portuguese. So you have three subtitles, but the majority of it is in English, a lot of it's in English. Which is like one-on-one and doing his like um like what do you call them?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh like little interviews type things, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

But most a lot of it is in English.

SPEAKER_02:

So, this is one of your intended dads that like put this whole series together. That is so freaking cool. I'm like so excited. I was like, Oh, I know what I'm watching now.

unknown:

Like this.

SPEAKER_01:

He's a journalist, like he wanted to document his journey to you know parenthood, and yeah, you know, he did it in a really beautiful way. So, you know, each everyone else's stories kind of like tie into his a little bit or ours a little bit. So um, you know, our main story is tomorrow, but we're in each part because you know, he'll like be talking to a family in Japan, and then it kind of like pans out and goes back to him and us and how like that ties into his story too. So it's really it's amazing. I haven't watched, I've only seen the first episode because right, I'm watching in real time with everybody else, but um it's exciting and nerve-wracking, and you know, I know there's gonna be like some naysayers out there, but I'm just really proud of what we did together and this little girl that's here, and you know, I'm I'm proud to be in something that's going to educate.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, I think that's the beauty of this, is like it's finally something out there about surrogacy that's like positive, like happy, like not like let's put like negative spins on it. It's like, like you said, there will always be naysayers because that's just the way the world goes round. But this this was done in a good light. Like, so it's you know, there's no there's no bad blood on it.

SPEAKER_01:

And just something I'm really proud of.

SPEAKER_02:

So I'm you should be. I'm excited. So we get to watch you have birth. Were they in there? Wait, were they in there? Yeah, girl, you were brave.

SPEAKER_01:

I want people up in my business. Well, the film crew wasn't there. Um we tried to keep the film crew there because they were supposed to be there. Oh, but they were like on the other side of the world at the time, and she was like, I'm not waiting anymore. I'm coming. So my husband filmed it from like my shoulder, like my head. Oh, okay. Like, you can't see my business because you know I don't think HBO would allow that, anyways.

SPEAKER_02:

Maybe they would. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01:

It was like up on my head filming um like her delivery, and they were like next to me, like um holding my hand.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh my gosh, I'm so excited.

SPEAKER_02:

I'm so proud of you. That's amazing. You're just like wonderful. I already knew that you were wonderful, but like this is just like okay. I could sit we could sit here and talk about this all day, but whatever. We'll we'll move on. Um just real quick, what's it called?

SPEAKER_01:

Just that way everybody can sorry, unfamiliar, so somewhat familiar. Sorry, somewhat familiar on HBO Max, right?

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, perfect. Okay, all right, moving on. So um Whitney's amazing and he's also a military wife. So you were a surrogate both times while your husband like was he like active duty?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. He just retired. Well, he's actually still considered active duty right now, even though he's on like terminal leave. He's just using up all of his unused vacation. Um, but he is officially officially retired completely come December 1st.

SPEAKER_02:

Wow. Where in the world does that mean? Like me, retired means like pack up my bags, I'm done. Like, here I go.

SPEAKER_01:

Like he uh, so he's been in since he was 18. So like 20 years, um, and he wanted to be in it longer. He just um is no longer medically fit to serve. Um, he type one diabetic, he developed type one diabetes while he was in the service, um, and he is considered um, he's not worldwide deployable, so no longer be in the Coast Guard anymore. So, but he retired, he has like all of his benefits, he has, you know, tri-care insurance for life. Um, and he, you know, he gets his retirement and stuff, which is amazing. Uh, so we're really proud of him. But now he's like, now what? What do I do?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. Does he have to work, or is it like when you retire from the military, is it kind of like you retired like normal people?

SPEAKER_01:

He probably like he we he still has to work, yeah. Oh, it's like a percentage of his pension. Um, but we could probably like live off of and be fine with his pension and and my job, but um we like to travel, we like to do things. Sure. So we wanna we wanna do the fun stuff too.

SPEAKER_02:

So yeah, for sure, for sure. Okay, so then okay, so I guess I'll just go to my questions because I have questions, but they're probably in here. Um let's see. Okay, so military military families move often. How did that impact your surrogacy journey from screening to matching to delivery, or did it not?

SPEAKER_01:

Um, so initially when I looked into surrogacy in 2017, we were in Florida. Okay, and at the time my husband was traveling a lot to Panama and to like southern Florida, and that was like the height of Zika.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I think I remember this conversation. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01:

And they were like, okay, unless like he gets tested every six months because areas, like you can't do this. So it was like pushback, pushback, push back, and then like I finally was like, This is too much, and then we're moving to Hawaii, so I was like, this isn't the right time, you know. So Hawaii, and then in the beginning of 2019, or like August of 2019, I started to kind of think about it again. Okay, but then the pandemic happened, and I was like, this is a sign that this is just not the right time. Right. And then March of 2021, I was like, let me open that door again. And then I knew I was gonna be in Hawaii for four years.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

So I knew like we were for a while. Um, and that's how I found I found my first um set of IPs in Hawaii. And then um with Isabelle, I was in the hotel in in Connecticut, about to go to transfer the next day, when we got the call from the military that told him, so we're gonna um medically retire you. And he had like 18 years in at this point. And they're like, so that means like no retirement, no this, no that. Um, you know, we're gonna give you a um a severance, and that's it. And that'll be in like six months. And I was like, I'm getting pregnant tomorrow. Oh my god. So like that meant yeah, that meant like we would have been moving when I was like six months pregnant from Hawaii. And I was like, what does this mean for this? So I immediately called my agency, my um sor um, my case manager, and I was like, we might be moving from Hawaii, and I don't know where we're moving to. Yeah, I don't know what to do now because I'm my transfer is in the morning. And she's like, it's okay, we'll figure it out. She's like, Are you going to Michigan? I was like, nope. She's like, Are you going to Louisiana? I was like, nope. She's like, then we should be fine. Like we can work around this.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh.

SPEAKER_01:

And I was like, okay.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

And we kind of decided, like, if anything, I would just move a lot sooner.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay. Oh, like you would move before he would?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. So that like I wasn't like too far along to Oh, I see where you're going. Okay. But then I went for transfer, things were fine. It took, I was successful. And then he was like, I'm fighting this.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh, good for him.

SPEAKER_01:

I can't believe at 17 and a half years they're gonna say you're you're done, like that's it.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

You have to make it to 20 years to get your like full benefits and full retirement.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

And he was like, Nope. So we fought it. He obviously won, made it to 20 years. But yeah, it was definitely like you might be moving, like in the middle of this journey.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_01:

But to answer your question, like we I never had to. We were in a place where it just worked out where we were in the same place the entire time.

SPEAKER_02:

But your agency, even though you didn't have to, your agency was like, as long as you're not moving to these three places, which I'm assuming is because the law's there. Yeah. So because you're not moving to these three places, uh, we can make things work.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. And so like anything else like was manageable, um, they could figure it out. Uh but in most cases, they do want you to be in the same place for at least two years. Like, know you're gonna be there.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

I think because our situation was so unique. Sure.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And I mean, I know I I have military friends, so like I knew I know that like, you know, oftentimes it's like, oh, we'll be here for a couple years, but things do come up in the middle of it, and they're like, just kidding, now we need you over here.

SPEAKER_01:

Like, you sound with journey, it was like, are you gonna be in this place for at least two years? I was like, Yeah. And then like if you weren't, there was kind of some gray area, but which is fair.

SPEAKER_02:

That's that's understandable. So, how did your partner's service schedule or deployment affect your surrogacy experience emotionally or logistically? Was he like living with you, or like were you guys like separated like while he was deployed? I put quotes because I don't know how this works.

SPEAKER_01:

So he uh he hasn't deployed since like 2000. It's been a minute. It's been a minute since he the entire time we were in Hawaii, he did not deploy at all. Um so we were together, and the job that he had in Hawaii was a so it's gonna sound crazy, but he was the manager of a bar in Hawaii on the Coast Guard base. It was it's a Coast Guard bar, and he managed it. Um and so like for the both journeys, like if I needed him, he was around. Like um, his co-manager was super supportive of the whole thing. She was amazing. Um the Coast Guard, like the Coast Guard as a whole is very supportive of families and of these type of things. Like, if he would have been on the because his his official job in the military, he's a helicopter mechanic. So even if he would have been on the hangar, like doing maintenance or even being like a supervisor, if something would have come up, he would have easily been able to come home and be with me and help me in, you know, the um the Coast Guard's super family oriented. Some of the services are not. Um I have a lot of friends whose like husbands have missed their births. Like other own children, yeah. Oh, how sad.

SPEAKER_02:

That's nice, at least. I mean, for that section. Oh, okay. Have you ever thought about growing your family but aren't sure what your options are? Or maybe you're someone who wants to help others experience the joy of parenthood. That's where Paying It Forward surrogacy comes in. Paying It Forward surrogacy is a full-service surrogacy agency that guides intended parents and surrogates through every step of the journey with compassion, transparency, and personalized care. From matching to legal support to emotional wellness, they make what can feel overwhelming feel deeply human and supported. Whether you're considering surrogacy to grow your family or you're ready to become a surrogate yourself, paying it forward surrogacy is there to walk beside you every step of the way.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, so um let's see. The the biggest challenge I think with like military and surrogacy is the insurance.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, yeah. So why don't we get into that? Because that's what you said kind of at the beginning, right? Is like insurance. So you said something about again, I literally know nothing except for fight for my country. Like, and that's shame on me, because like there's so many different branches of like the military that like I just can't full army.

unknown:

Like that's all I know.

SPEAKER_01:

Like worries of every branch too, so it's you know yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So when it comes to insurance, you because like I always hear I always hear like, oh, okay, like we're gonna like people marry young in the military, uh, because like insurance. And I'm like, oh, is it like great? Like is the insurance like wonderful? Is it's like it's like decent?

SPEAKER_01:

It's pretty good health insurance, yeah. Um so there's two sides of tri-care. There's tri care prime, which is um if you live within a certain amount of um miles to a military facility, then you have to see the military doctors there.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

So like in Hawaii, there's a military base every 10 miles, there's multiple in Hawaii. So yeah, I had to see a military doctor um when we live in Hawaii. But if you choose, if you that's the one that's like you don't really pay out of pocket for that one, and there's no co-pays for anything. If you choose to go tri-care select, then you have copies and deductibles, but you can go where you want. Like anywhere you want? Like you can see any doctor you want. Like with prime, you have to have like a referral for anything from your primary care physician. And with select, it's like I need to go see an ENT, I can just go see an ENT.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, so the Select is like a PPO and the prime is like an HMO.

SPEAKER_01:

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, okay, understood. Very interesting.

SPEAKER_01:

As a whole is not surrogacy friendly at all.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, so it's not. So you would need to get additional insurance.

SPEAKER_01:

But the problem that I ran into the most was that whatever wasn't paid out by the additional insurance, they would bill Tri-Care. And then TriCare, what's in it to me? They're like, what's this? I'm like and like some stuff they did they just covered. Oh but yeah. Like, because I some stuff I didn't get a bill for, but like some stuff, like both deliveries I never got like a separate bill for or separate.

SPEAKER_03:

Really?

SPEAKER_01:

So I think TriCare just covered it and didn't ask questions. But so there's a program called Dears.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

And like when a military member gets married, they enroll their spouse in deers. This is how TriCare tracks who's like in the family.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

Have a kid, you have like 30 days to enroll them in deers. Or if they get like a bill, they'll enroll them like automatically.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

We'll call him Squirt, because that's what I call him.

unknown:

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

He was enrolled automatically. And I didn't know until he was like five months old.

SPEAKER_02:

What? Wait, did you give birth for the first one? Did you give birth at like oh wait for the first one? Oh gosh, wait. Did you give birth then at a military facility?

SPEAKER_01:

No, because of my additional insurance that I had, um, I went to like a regular doctor.

SPEAKER_03:

Then that's so weird. Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

That's the hardest parts of Nagel because if I have a cold, then I go to my doctor and then Tricare is like, wait, you have this other insurance.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Like, yes, but this, and they're like, Oh, okay. So then they'll cover it. But like if it's all like anything to do with, you know, maternity or it's all the other insurance, but they bill Tricare as a secondary, and sometimes they pay it and sometimes they don't.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, how crazy. Okay, but that baby was enrolled automatically.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and I didn't know. Um, I think he was like five months old when I found out because I went onto my portal because I was scheduled for myself, and I clicked like the box to drop down the link to give me the names, and I seen his name, and I'm like, oh no. Oh no, right. So we had a call and like do all of this work and like explain to get him removed. And it was easy. We it was but at first we were like, oh no, like if they see any bills, are they gonna like make us pay for them out of pocket? Because at this point, escrow's closed.

SPEAKER_02:

Right. Like, what do we do? Oh, yikes. Okay, but that all got taken care of. It was fine.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and then sh Isabel was never enrolled, um, which I I kept looking, I kept checking for her, but she was never enrolled. Um, but the insurance part is definitely the trickiest part to navigate because tri-care is very finicky.

SPEAKER_02:

So when you say it's tricky to navigate, are you talking about like during the journey or like getting the getting the extra health insurance?

SPEAKER_01:

Just during the journey, like getting the additional getting the additional um it was easy. My face did all that for me. Um you know, I would get paid every month and then I like they would pay me and then I'd pay the insurance because legally no one else can pay your insurance premium for you.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_01:

I didn't know. Um, so they would pay me and then I'd pay the insurance directly. Um, but it was just tricky to navigate because of having the TRI-care and the other insurance and tries very separate because like I didn't know what I could use this insurance for, what I couldn't use my tri-care for. It was that was the tricky part for me.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, like navigating through that. I had a s I I've had it similar when I was gosh, when I first was a surrogate, but it wasn't, it wasn't military stuff. It was I was on um like Medi-Cal. Like, and but I I had to use that for like my personal self, and then I had to use, and even to this day, I'm like, I don't have Medi-Cal. I have health insurance with this job. Please stop trying to bill the second insurance. I wish that like people would just ask before they do it.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it was yeah, it was interesting for that that part.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, okay. So, but did that it never ended up costing you like extra? Like it was a headache to deal with at times, but it never like costed you like financial stress or the it did.

SPEAKER_01:

So my first journey, uh right after I delivered, I got like really sick and had to go back to the hospital.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

It was a total fluke thing, but um, I went back to the hospital and because it was related to the pregnancy, it was supposed to be paid to the um surrogate insurance. Yes, yes, they denied it for whatever reason, and then Tricare denied it, but I didn't know any of that until he was like six, seven months old.

SPEAKER_04:

What?

SPEAKER_01:

And then I was like, oh, so then I reached out to my caseworker with that um insurance, uh with that uh surrogacy agency, and they're like, oh, like escrow's clothes, like you can talk to the IPs about it and have them pay it. And it was like a$2,100 bill. And I was like, oh no, like this is this is bad. I was like, you just talk to them. Um and some perspective, like my IPs and my first agency, they had a really bad, like go around. Yeah, they did not speak to each other.

SPEAKER_02:

Um with like like the ape uh the IPs did not get along with the agency type thing. Okay, yikes.

SPEAKER_01:

Like mid-pregnancy things just weren't really sour. Um, so my agency was like, Yeah, you can talk to your IPs and tell them, like, yeah, see if they'll pay it, but Estrow's closed, so it's out of our hands.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

Want me to ask my IPs to just pay this? And I am so weird about money and like talking about money that I was just like, I'll just pay it. So I just remember. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04:

That's right.

SPEAKER_01:

And then last year, I think it was, or two years ago, um, I was with my IM and we were having a few drinks, and my husband let it slip about that. And she's like, What, Bill? And I was like, nothing, it's taken care of. And she's like, Tell me. Oh no, oh my gosh, why wouldn't you tell me? I was like, It's fine, it's taken care of. She's like, I owe you a vacation. Oh, that's very sweet of her. You didn't tell me, like, you know, like you shouldn't have paid for that. Like, if she's very, very like, she's like my little bulldog, she's always in my corner, she's always fighting for me. Like, I love her so much. Um, but she was like, first off, like they shouldn't have put you in that position to tell you to do it.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, they shouldn't have. That's that's not on you. That's what's our what's an agency for?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, like no matter how things ended with us, like that was their job. They should have reached out to us and talked to us about it. But second off, like you should have never felt like that was on your responsibility. But you know what, we're under the bridge, I paid for it, it's it's over, whatever. Um, but and it did happen the second one too.

unknown:

Really?

SPEAKER_01:

Like way after. But my agency that time was like, we'll take care of it, we'll figure it out, and like they, yeah. Oh, well, that's nice, it's a different agency.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Clearly. Wow. Okay. Yeah, that's the scary part of that, huh? Like with even with any insurance, like where it's like you don't get the bill until like weeks, maybe months later, and it's like that long.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh long because the surrogacy insurance denied it and then Tricare denied it.

SPEAKER_02:

Right.

SPEAKER_01:

But we had to go through both insurance companies, it took months, and then it didn't get to me until like six months later.

SPEAKER_02:

And I was like, Yeah, yeah, escrow definitely would be closed by then. Yikes. Well, I'm glad it got figured out.

SPEAKER_01:

It's a bummer that you had to front the first one, but now we you know things things to look out for, people when you're interviewing agencies. I missed out because actually it was three months. The first time it was only three months, yes, because when I told this to my um case manager with my second agency, she's like, they closed escrow out at three months. And I was like, Yeah, she's like, that's not normal.

SPEAKER_02:

No, that's not normal.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, because yeah, mind you, this is like five years ago, so or four years ago, whatever it was. Yeah, it was three months they closed it out at no that yeah, that's not that's not normal because I had um once I had like my eight-week postpartum and then like four weeks more, they they were done.

SPEAKER_02:

Really?

SPEAKER_01:

I'm remembering that now, yeah. Six months, yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Cause I think well, and I know like some states now are some states are like, oh, it's like it has to be like open for like a year. So like I know that they're like getting longer because like just like health things just come through. Health industry just sucks. Sorry, it does.

SPEAKER_04:

It does.

SPEAKER_02:

I work for it and it sucks. And it's just like, yeah, so they're very slow to everything. But three three months is really, really short. That's that's that's definitely on that first agency, and they should have like we were so new to everything that I'm just like, okay, I you know you don't know what you don't know, right? You just you don't know, and that's the that's the aggravating things. Oh gosh. Um okay, so uh what kind of support did you find within the military community during your journey? Were people understanding, curious, or maybe even hesitant? And I have an additional question to that. Are there a lot of military wives? I constantly would hear all the time in the beginning of my journeys, like, oh, are you a military wife? I'm like, no, do I have to be a military wife to be a surrogate? Like, that was the question I got all the time, and I was like, I don't understand. Is this like common?

SPEAKER_01:

No, I don't feel like it is at all. That is so crazy. I mean, I feel like it's kind of the opposite, because like I don't want to like get thrown to the wolves. Stereotypic stereotypically stereotypically that's the one. I got you. Military men are a little bit more like this is my wife. Reserved. Yes. And so I don't it's not a super common thing. And a lot of like A lot of our friends were supportive about it, but a lot of people we talked to were like, I would never let my wife do that.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh my God, I hate that term.

SPEAKER_01:

Or, you know, like that's just not for us, or right, right, right. And I did I did hear a lot from women who were like, my husband would not be okay with that. You know, and I'm like, I can tell my husband I want to like start a hot air balloon for him tomorrow, and he'd be like, Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

How can I help? Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01:

I never got that whole like my husband wouldn't, and I'm like, Well, yeah, I'm like, my husband's like the most supportive human being on the planet.

SPEAKER_02:

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SPEAKER_01:

But I was like, you know, like, you know, it's it's different for everybody, and I get it. Um, you know, some people just aren't open to the idea of it. Um I think like I'm trying to think of like any other like military spouses that I know. I it's not super common within the really, I don't feel like it is.

SPEAKER_02:

I don't know why. I just would constantly, I was constantly asked all the time, oh, are you a military wife? No, I'm not. And then it would be like, oh, you know, like a lot of military women do this. And I'm like, what like okay, cool. I like I don't know. Like, is that like and I always thought that was like a weird thing. And the thing that I was told is like, oh, well, what else are they literally? This is what I was told. What else are they gonna do when their husbands are away? I'm like, I I don't know, like have a life? Like, what do you mean?

SPEAKER_01:

Like it was the most night, it was the most um like just have kids and you know it's so weird.

SPEAKER_02:

So that's why I was like, oh, is there like is this like a common thing in the military world? But you're saying not not so much. Did you live on base?

SPEAKER_01:

No, we didn't. Um that he worked at was on base and it was like open to like all different branches, and all different branches came. Okay, and I consistently ran into the comment of you're the first person I've ever met that's done this. Really? Like, okay, so and it was all military, so I don't feel like it's very guessing. My husband was stationed with a guy in Florida or Michigan, Michigan. Um, and his sister-in-law was a surrogate, and I think her husband was military too. But I've never there's nobody, I think there's like two of the surrogates I know who are military spouses.

SPEAKER_02:

How funny. I don't know where this stereotype came from.

SPEAKER_01:

Like or one of my case managers with my last agency, um, or one of them who helped with my um case. Yeah, she's a military spouse. And then that the guy that my husband worked with, his sister-in-law. But it's not like something that I it's like super common.

SPEAKER_02:

Not like all the military wives are getting together every Sunday being like, how's that bump going? Like, you know, like yeah, like No, I don't think so. Like it's but where people so okay, so um because I I underst I mean I do understand when people say, like, oh, you know, my husband wouldn't feel comfortable with this, or oh, like I would never let my wife, and I do think that that all re revolves around the lack of education due like with surrogacy and like the myths that are out there and things like that. But I do know that the military is a little bit more reserved at times. So all around, were you kind of like accepted as like this was like an okay thing to do?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I mean everyone that we met or talked to, like I've only had like a handful of really bad run-ins with people. Okay, and like most of them were strangers, two of them were people that I actually knew. But then we're like military community. Um, all of our military community, friends, family, like they were all super supportive. Right. Like constantly checking in on me, like making sure I was okay. Like, no, we had uh so much positive, you know, feedback from it.

SPEAKER_02:

And how does because you know, in the beginning of like being a surrogate and everything like that, and like it's like how's your support? And like who's your support people? Because you're a military wife, like I would say what, nine times out of ten, you're not near family. Like, so what is your support? Like how do you how do you get past? Like, that's always been my question is like how what do you women say is like your support besides your husband? Because a lot of times agencies are like, well, you gotta have people, and it's like, well, sometimes grandparents are like across the country.

SPEAKER_01:

Luckily in Hawaii, we had a very good community of friends. Oh, okay, good. A really good community of friends, and they were all like super supportive, like you know, cooking for me after I had the babies and like you know, checking in and me, like taking care of the kids, and uh, you know, just really good friends, really good support, like the kind of family that people wish they had. For sure. Not blood, but blood doesn't make family, so it wasn't family for sure. Um, you know, everyone like uh I had to spend a little bit of time in the hospital after I had Isabel, um, like weeks after I'd had her. I had to go back to the hospital. Um, nothing scary. Uh just like my blood pressure kind of shot up and I I I panicked.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

But um one of my friends came and sat with me because my husband had to work and I was like, no, you go to work, like it's fine, I'm fine. Um, but one of my friends came and sat with me like all day at the hospital. She brought me like, because I I went to the hospital in makeup because I had had makeup on when I went to like when I went, and I was like, I'm wearing like two-day old makeup. And she's like, I got you, girl. She like came and brought me like makeup remover and like face mask and like um a coloring book and all this stuff she brought. Like, she's like, you know, this is for you, so like you have something to do. And that was um, and her husband's a marine, like uh, she had I think she had given thought to doing it at one point in her life. Yeah, and then she's like, No, like it's just you know, I'm I'm too old now for it, but she had she had considered it at one point in her life too. So, but she was supportive and we had friends that cooked for us and you know, just took care of the kids, and it felt like it felt like my family.

SPEAKER_02:

So I feel like oftentimes when I talk to like because I I have some people that like live near me and like some my my kids' friends' parents are military, and so and it seems like their their unit, like their friends of the military, like they're all very close, like they're all very like that's like a second family. So is that is that I'm assuming that's kind of common. That's kind of how I always hear it. Like, oh, these are like my brothers, these are my sisters, these are like these are my people's. So that's gotta be like really nice to to have that extra group.

SPEAKER_01:

Like it because no one else knows what you're going through except for other military members, you know, like where we lived in Hawaii, we lived in a neighborhood that was so saturated with military, but it was every branch. Oh, and they would all pick on each other about you know being in the different branches, and there's like this rivalry, but it's like a funny rivalry between the branches, and uh, you know, we we had this like you know back and forth with all of our friends, and but at the end of the day, like it really was just this huge big family unit, you know, that like showed up in the biggest ways for us and for each other, and you know, our our there was like 30 of us, and we didn't ever that's so cool. Like we did everything together. I think I think you'll see in the documentary too. Um, because they show us trick-or-treating one night and like our entire group, it's like 30 people trick-or-treating together.

SPEAKER_02:

Overwhelming, but so cool. That's so cool. No, that's sweet. I well then good. So then you guys have support. I mean, obviously, I'm just going off of your story, but I the majority of what I hear, right, is because people live on base as well.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. And yeah, those communities are super tight knit as well, right?

SPEAKER_02:

Right, right, right. So it's nice that like even if you don't live on base and you're in a saturated community, that's so fun. Oh my gosh, I want like 30 friends that don't annoy me. That would be so nice. Um, okay, so how did your spouse and children react when you told them you wanted to be a surrogate?

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, so positive. Um, my husband knew, like, at some point in our marriage, I was gonna either like, let's adopt, let's foster, let's do this. Like he knew. Um, so when I brought it up to him, he was like, Okay, you know, yeah, like that's what you want to do. I'm on board. And my kids were so little the first time. God, they were they're like five and eight, I think. But they were so used to me fostering like animals. Oh, that's kind of how I explained that to them. You know, gonna I'm gonna foster a little baby in my belly for a long time, and then when it's born, it's gonna go live with its forever families, just like when we foster kittens and puppies, and they were like, Okay, you know, like makes sense, and like the second time, like once like they were older, um, they just understood like the baby was not coming home with us, they would get to meet the baby, but it wasn't like you know, our baby to keep. And uh, my kids adore both sets of my IPs. Like, my son doesn't like a lot of people at all. And if you ask him on any given day, like who are your favorite adults? He'll say, besides you and dad, I'm like, Yeah, and he'll say, Uncle Ben, Uncle Pedro, and aunt and uncle from the first. Um, how sweet. So much, my kids love them, like they beam when they're around. Oh, yeah, it's that's sweet.

SPEAKER_02:

That's the beauty of surrogacy, because then you you get additional family, uncle, uncle, auntie, uncle. Like, what? That's sweet.

SPEAKER_01:

Very special relationships.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes. Surrogacy can be this, people. It can be this, and it is this more often than not.

SPEAKER_01:

It makes me sad that not everyone gets this, you know. Not everyone wants this, which is also for the ones who do want it and don't get it, or you know, if IPs are not forthcoming with their intentions or who they truly are, like it just makes me really sad, you know. It's hard to navigate that. Very and and everyone's like, Oh, you can do it again, you can do it do it again. And I'm like, I'm hesitant. Like, if I did it for another family, like I got super lucky twice. I'm not trying to get on that.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh, you know what, Whitney, where were you a couple years ago? I should have I should have stuck by you on that. Oh, I got lucky two times. I shouldn't have done it. That third time, man. That third time. You're rolling the dice on that. Uh, did the experience strengthen or change your family's perspective on community?

SPEAKER_01:

I think it strengthened especially my kids and my husband's because we knew that we were done growing our own family. Um and being able to extend our family in such a unique way. You know, it really gave my kids the like the perspective of again, like not all families are created equally, but they're all rooted in love. And, you know, it I think it really did open their minds to you know the differences of the world and like how like what one person says a family should look like or a family is isn't what it always is.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

There's no one size fits all.

SPEAKER_01:

Kids definitely have like pretty open minds because of surrogacy and I mean more or less how I how I raise them as well, but surrogacy definitely like broaden their perspectives and views about families and and life itself.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I I agree with you on a hundred percent. Um, so do you think surrogacy fits well within the values of the military community, like service, sacrifice, and helping others? That's a good question.

SPEAKER_01:

Absolutely, because I mean, it's literally all of those things. Yeah, you know, it's a service, it's a sacrifice, it's you know, helping others, and you know, um, you know, I'm not going off to war and fighting for my country, but you know, I'm fighting to give someone else something they wouldn't have otherwise.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm sacrificing, you know, my body. I'm sacrificing, you know, maybe a trip that I want to take that I can't take because now I'm pregnant. I'm sacrificing, you know, holidays or visits with my family because I can't travel, you know.

SPEAKER_03:

Right. You are.

unknown:

Yes.

SPEAKER_01:

I don't know if like the upper heads of the military would agree with me, but it's definitely I would say that it's aligned with those same beliefs. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

I yeah, I think if you put them side by side, for sure. I mean, it would be if you did if you did a pro and con list, I I think a lot, I think a lot would align. Yeah. I whatever the upper say, do the it would be that. Um let's see.

SPEAKER_01:

You know, the military is all about like doing the greater good for the majority, you know, or like you know, you're sacrificing something from yourself to make someone else's life better, you know, sense of like the military is the military to keep the states free. You know, I sacrificed certain aspects of my life to give someone else the ability to be a parent.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, a hundred percent. You're like you are you are just fighting a different battle. You're still fighting, you're just fighting a different battle.

SPEAKER_01:

You know, personnel or anything definitely wouldn't do that. But you know, I think that um both things can be honorable and respected in different ways, but on the same scale.

SPEAKER_02:

I think so too. I think you've said that beautifully. Um what advice would you give to other military spouses considering surrogacy? Their list.

SPEAKER_01:

Definitely be mindful of the insurance stuff because it does get very tricky to navigate um just because of how finicky Tricare is. Um and you know make sure that you're doing it for the right reasons. For sure. I mean, that's with anybody.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01:

Um, but talk to like try to find someone else who's done it as a house, or try to find someone who's just been a surrogate in you know, in general, um, and get like ask all the questions, get like to anybody who's looking into surrogacy, period. Research, research, research. Like knowledge is power. Surrogacy can be credible, but you have to ask all the questions and get all the answers because man, those that first journey, I didn't know anything, and there were some big surprises. So anybody who's came to surrogacy, like just make sure you're researching everything.

SPEAKER_02:

It's and it's it's hard, and it's hard. It is hard, it's very hard, and that's why it's it's oftentimes. I mean, everybody who comes on, right? Research, research, research, and it's like, well, what do I research? And it's like literally research everything, but also it's so hard to research everything. So if there's a specific thing you aren't even probably thinking of, just reach out to anybody in the community. And I know that anybody would definitely you know give you their ear and and and their advice on and anything, and especially like you said, Whitney, like military spouses, like 100% reach out to military spouses, reach out to people who've done it. If you don't know anybody, Whitney's done it. Whitney, Whitney's done it, and that's always open.

SPEAKER_01:

But like it is, it is, it's so hard. Because even like in my first journey, I was like, this is a stupid question, not gonna ask it. No, there's no stupid questions, like discussion surrogacy, because the more you know, the better journey you're gonna have, and it's just gonna make that it that much more beautiful and that much more special because you don't know the things you don't know, exactly. Surrogacy, there's a lot you don't know that first, especially the first girl round.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, for sure. There's still things I don't know. Like things are popping up all the time. I didn't know anything in this conversation, I didn't know about TriCare. I, you know, I didn't I didn't know about all of this. So, like, there's always things that you're learning, and it's hard to keep up with, but that's why the community is luckily built the way that it's built with so many helping hands and people.

SPEAKER_01:

So and I do there's like the especially the Instagram circuit community is just that's where I live. Yeah, yeah, like so amazing, like so you know, respectful of each other and willing to literally help anyone else out. Like, I think we're incredibly empowering for each other.

SPEAKER_02:

I think so. I know why can't Facebook be like that? Facebook scares me. Oh, I started getting into Facebook and I'm like, these people scare me.

SPEAKER_01:

A haunted house, but it's just a Facebook uh support group.

SPEAKER_02:

For real. Oh my god, it's I have like a lot of anxiety on Facebook. It's I don't like it. Uh let's see. Hold on. Let's see. Okay. But I like it, so it sounds fun. How has surrogacy impacted your identity as both a military spouse and as a woman?

SPEAKER_01:

Oh. Um it's deep. Yeah. I don't want to offend anyone who is a military spouse, but it has been my experience that a lot of military spouses, their whole identity is within their military spouse.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm a military spouse, I'm a marine wife, I'm a coasty wife, I'm a but then they forget who they are. I have been that person. I'm like, I'm Whitney, I'm a writer, and I'm a cat mom, and I'm a kid mom, and I, you know, foster animals, and you know, I I'm a good friend. And my husband happens to be in the military. Like and even like I don't even think that's his identity either. Like just his job. It's his job, and it has been a huge part of his life, and it has put it plays a huge part in his identity, but it's not his identity, you know. And I'm never the wife who wears my husband's accomplishments on my heart, because those aren't my accomplishments, those are his. And I'm proud of him, and I'm gonna cheer him on, like the loudest person in the room, but his accomplishments are not mine, and I'm not gonna wear them like they are. And a lot of military spouses tend to do that, which that's a fun thing. Um, and I think with surrogacy and doing something so impactful on my own, yeah, like that takes people to like see less of Whitney the Coast Guard spouse, and like, oh, Whitney the surrogate, Whitney the kind person, Whitney the giver. You know, so especially for those people who don't want to wear their their husband's rank, um, it gives them a little bit more of an identity. But even surrogacy isn't my own my only identity, like it's what I've done, and I love it. I will always talk about surrogacy until I'm 99 years old, but it's just a part of my story. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

I hear you there. No, yeah, that's beautiful, and it's very true because these are your accomplishments, and these this is this is a part of you, and you are just because you're a military spouse, does not mean you are military.

SPEAKER_01:

Like that's not that's not Whitney, that's Whitney's husband. Like that's and there's like been times where like I don't even tell people people he's like in the military, like oh my he's a helicopter mechanic. Like, because I just don't like I get weird about because they're like, Oh, thank you for your service. I'm like, I don't serve, he does, but like, yeah, it makes me feel like weird, but I'm also like the worst person taking compliments, so any like compliment or anything, I'm like, oh okay.

SPEAKER_02:

I get yeah, like it like clammy and awkward. Like, don't don't say that to me. Like you don't know me. Like it's just like weird. I agree. How funny. Oh my gosh. Well, what's next for you? Would you do another journey or would you mentor other other military communities who are interested?

SPEAKER_01:

I absolutely would. Like, I I really do want to do another journey.

SPEAKER_02:

Um, if it's meant really, I was not expecting that.

SPEAKER_01:

If it's meant to be with um, you know, like a sibling journey. I would yeah, I would love to do that. Um, if it's meant to be, if that's you know, a road that opens up, um, I would love to do that. Uh, but I'm not like setting my whole like life on that. For sure. I would love to mentor military spouses, I would love to mentor like anyone about it, just because it's something that I'm so passionate about and so I feel so strongly about, and and so many people have the wrong idea about surrogacy. And you know, this last year has not been the best for as far as news goes for surrogacy. I mean, the the two huge scandals that happened this year.

SPEAKER_02:

Isn't that crazy? They happen in the same like in the same year span.

SPEAKER_01:

And people are like, see, you know, the human trafficking, blah blah blah. I'm like, no.

SPEAKER_02:

No, people, those are just the things that make the news.

SPEAKER_01:

You know, it's it's like saying like every white guy with glasses might have a girl in his basement because you see it on TV. No, like you can't take one bad story and relate it to an entire community of people. It's just not how that's not how that works.

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01:

You're exactly but because of the dark shadow or the dark cloud that's been on over surrogacy for so long, these stories intensify that.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh, a hundred percent. And that's the aggravating part because so many of us are trying to like be like, there's happy stuff. I promise you, there even just this podcast alone, like 98% of it is like great. Like it's it's it's the good stuff. There's the two percent that's the crap. Damn it.

SPEAKER_01:

I know, I just I think like advocacy about it is so important because I mean we've we've got some wild comments, wild comments, but I don't know. Like to me, like knowledge is power in any subject.

SPEAKER_02:

100%, 100%, and also just like piggybacking off what you said, every category you look at in the world, like it does not matter, and not even surrogacy, just like it could be anything, it could, it could be the animal rights, I don't know, anything. Just like there's going to always be the negative things that make the news, and you're never gonna hear of like the positive things that are happening that are going on, the way that people are fighting behind you know the curtains, everything like that, until it makes the news, until some bill gets passed, until some big situation happens, and so it's frustrating.

SPEAKER_01:

Very frustrating, and I don't know. I it's another reason like I'm so so so proud of the documentary because it really shows like the beauty and the honesty and what surrogacy really is.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I think that's so amazing. I like you posted that and I was like, girl, be holding out.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I for like two years, I'm like, when's it gonna happen?

SPEAKER_02:

Oh my gosh, yeah, so because this was this was the baby that was born in 2024.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay. Yeah, wow. We started filming in October of 2023, I think. And then yeah, like we kind of just wrapped a few months ago. Um, but I've been like waiting for it to come out.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, well, everybody needs to definitely go watch it. Say say the name of it again, again say the name of it again. I went familiar on HBO Max with Whitney, with Whitney, with the wonderful Whitney. On Tues, Tuesdays, Tuesdays, on Tuesdays. Oh, okay, perfect. It's is it it's a is it like an eight-episode thing?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah, it's eight episodes. Um the episode with just us is tomorrow. It's really exciting, but I'm also really nervous, you know. But I you know, when they said it was coming out last week, I kind of panicked because I was like, I can't watch myself on TV, that's weird. Like, I don't even usually like re-watch like my Instagram videos. I just post it and I'm like never want to see it again. But watching it back last week, I'm like, I'm really proud of that girl.

SPEAKER_02:

100%.

SPEAKER_01:

Proud of her for like speaking her truth and being honest and vulnerable and you know, like sharing something so intimate with the rest of the world. That's so important.

SPEAKER_02:

100%. I'm very proud of you. Not that you know, I I put a star on you or anything, but like, you know, like not that my proudness means much, but it's just like you you were you're vulnerable. This is a very vulnerable thing, this is a very intimate thing, and this is a very powerful thing, and you stood on business and you used your voice. You were like, I have a voice, I'm I'm here. I'm gonna I'm gonna say it. I'm gonna say it in a beautiful light, and I'm gonna help, and I'm gonna advocate it in every possible way that I can. And I I've I admire you a lot.

SPEAKER_01:

I don't speak highly of myself very often, but I'm very proud of myself for that. Um, and I just hope that I speak well enough on behalf of the whole community because I want it to be shared in a great light, and I want people to just understand that it's such a beautiful, magical thing.

SPEAKER_02:

I'm I no doubt in my mind that you that you succeeded with that. My gosh. Well, thank you for answering all of these questions that I probably have no business asking because I just like uh what? But I hope it was helpful for people who are in the military because definitely that tri-care situation.

SPEAKER_01:

The insurance is the biggest task, and like honestly, like there's not a whole lot of differences between a military spouse's journey and anyone else's journey. There's like a few little different nuances, but um insurance is definitely the biggest. But yeah, like you know, reach out and ask questions and you know, and definitely make sure you're staying one place for a while, because that's a big key.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, for sure, for for sure. I mean, for anybody, like they don't want you moving a lot. They're like, what the you can't just like go from here to there, and it's like okay, which I get, I get they need stability and you know, different laws. If you're things are signed in one state, it gets tricky if you move to another, so for sure. But yeah. Well, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01:

I love being here.

SPEAKER_02:

I love talking to you. I know we gotta we gotta catch up more. Well, you have a beautiful time moving into your beautiful house.

SPEAKER_01:

Thank you. We're really excited about it very soon.

SPEAKER_02:

I know, you deserve it so. Excited for you. I want to see all the pictures.

SPEAKER_01:

I'll share some.

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, great. Well, thank you. Have a great evening, Whitney. Thank you. Thank you. Bye. Bye. Well, thank you so much, Whitney, for sharing your experience and for giving some tips for the military spouses out there, as well as advocating and this new HBO series. So everybody that will be in the show notes. If you have any questions or stories you would like to share, please feel free to reach out to me on Instagram at StopPeriod Sit Period Surrogate or at my email at stop periodsitperiod surrogate at gmail.com. And this has been another episode of Stopsit Surrogate. See you guys later. Bye-bye. Today's episode of Stop Sit Surrogate is brought to you by Nappy Ending Surrogacy Agency, Paying It Forward Surrogacy, and Surrogacy Simplified. Thank you for supporting the surrogacy community with us.

SPEAKER_00:

If you enjoyed this podcast, be sure to give us a like and subscribe. Also, check out the link to our YouTube channel in the description. And be sure to also check out our children's book, My Mom Has Superpowers, sold on Amazon and Etsy.