Pelvic Floor Power For Surrogates

#surrogacy 
#ivf 
#surrogate

Jessica’s Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/vibrantcoastpt?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==

Surrogate Wellness Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/surrogatewellness?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==

Leaking when you laugh. Back pain you’re told to “accept.” A recovery window that feels like a mystery. We wanted better answers, so we brought on Jessica, a Doctor of Physical Therapy who specializes in pelvic floor health and works with surrogates across the US through virtual coaching. She breaks down what pelvic floor physical therapy really looks like today, how it connects to your core and glutes, and why “common” pregnancy symptoms are not automatically “normal.”

We dig into the practical stuff surrogates and intended parents care about: when to start pelvic floor support during a surrogacy journey, how virtual assessment works, and what changes actually reduce prolapse risk. Jessica also shares how postpartum recovery can begin with breath work and gentle mobility well before the classic six-week clearance, plus what to consider after a vaginal birth versus a C-section, including scar support and abdominal rehab.

Then we zoom out to the data behind prenatal exercise and pelvic health. We talk research-linked outcomes like lower risk of gestational diabetes, preeclampsia, prenatal depression, and C-section, along with benefits that support baby outcomes and placental health. If you’re a surrogate building your support team, an agency updating benefits, or an intended parent who wants the healthiest possible journey, this conversation is full of actionable, evidence-based takeaways.

Sponsored by U.S. Surrogacy LLC. If you found this helpful, subscribe, share it with a surrogate or intended parent, and leave us a review so more families can find these resources.



Links:

The website: vibrantcoastpt.com

The App: vibrantcoastpt.com/vibrantstrength

The Surrogate Wellness Program: vibrantcoastpt.com/surrogate-wellness-program

Surrogate Wellness: https://surrogatewellness.com/meet-jessica/

https://stopsitsurrogate.com

Transcript

Welcome To Stop Sit Surrogate

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome. We are a mother-daughter podcast about all things surrogacy. Together, we have brought eight beautiful babies into this world, and we would like to share through education and knowledge about surrogacy with those who want to educate themselves on the topic. This is Stop, Sit, Surrogate. This episode is sponsored by U.S. Surrogacy LLC. If you've ever dreamed of helping grow a family or are hoping to grow your own, U.S. Surrogacy LLC is here to guide you every step of the way. They are a dedicated surrogacy agency committed to supporting intended parents and surrogates through a compassionate, ethical, and well-supported journey. U.S. Surrogacy LLC works with amazing women who want to make a life-changing difference by becoming a surrogate while also helping intended parents experience the incredible gift of parenthood. Their team focuses on transparency, strong communication, and personalized support so that everyone involved feels confident, cared for, and informed throughout the entire process. If you've ever considered becoming a surrogate, or if you're an intended parent exploring your options, US Surrogacy LLC is ready to help you take that next step. To learn more about their programs and how you can get started, visit us-surrogacy.com. That's us-surrogacy.com. And now let's get into today's episode. Hi everyone, welcome back to Stopsit Surrogate with Kennedy and Ellen. Hey everybody! Today we are here with a very fun guest. I'm very excited to jump into this. So, would you like to introduce yourself?

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Yes, absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. My name is Jessica. I am a doctor of physical therapy and I specialize in pelvic floor health. And I own a in-person pelvic floor physical therapy clinic in California. But I particularly specialize in working with surrogates. So I co-founded the surrogate wellness collective with a dietitian named Ginger. And we work with surrogates in the US to support them throughout their journeys. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 2:22

And we I'm just gonna jump in. I did pelvic therapy. Like I didn't know. Oh amazing. I did it, but not like while I was pregnant. Amazing.

unknown 2:30

Really?

What Pelvic Floor Therapy Really Is

SPEAKER_02 2:31

Amazing. Like literally. Yeah, I still do it to this day. Yep. It's helped in so many ways. Like I laughed when they said, You're gonna go to pelvic therapy. I went, yeah, right. And I did, and it was the weirdest thing. Like, oh, this is fascinating. And it works. It 100% works.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

So can I can I state the obvious like thing that probably goes in people's minds? It like it's not just a bunch of Kegels, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:55

Like, right. No, they don't before, you know, a long time ago, that's kind of what pelvic floor therapy was. But now we found that your pelvic floor works in coordination with your whole body system. So your core and your glutes and your inner thighs. So we work on essentially strengthening all the muscles around your pelvis as well as your pelvic floor.

SPEAKER_01 3:22

Wow. So how'd you get into this? Like what directed you to this part of a career?

SPEAKER_00 3:32

Well, I always I always wanted to be a physical therapist. I love how the human body moves. And so I knew that since high school, but I seven years ago started working in an orthopedic clinic, and I continued to have women who were in pain or leaking, and I knew it wasn't something that I could help with because to be a pelvic floor therapist, there's further training. And where I lived, there wasn't really anyone to refer to, at least at that time. And so it was a goal of mine to become a pelvic floor specialist and support women and give them the resources that they did need because they weren't getting the care that they deserved, essentially.

SPEAKER_03 4:18

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 4:18

It's almost like pads are in your future if you're over a certain age. That's kind of what I was told.

SPEAKER_00 4:23

Sorry, I'm just saying, or if you have a baby, you're going to leak, or pregnant pregnancy is painful and just suck it up. So yeah. None of that has to be true. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 4:35

Fine. So none of that has to be true. So all those little shoots and pains down in like the lower part is not normal.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

I mean, a lot of those symptoms are common and many women experience them, so it's normalized.

SPEAKER_03 4:51

Okay.

Normalized Pain And Leaking Debunked

SPEAKER_00 4:52

But it doesn't have to happen. And that's why I'm super passionate about helping women and supporting surrogates and not being in pain during pregnancy.

How Pelvic PT Entered Surrogacy

SPEAKER_01 5:03

That's very cool. And now I gotta ask, how'd you get not just to this, but how'd you get your how'd you come to surrogacy? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:12

Right. Yeah. So four years ago, I opened my clinic in California and was primarily working with pregnant and postpartum women. And I met an agency owner in California, and she found out what I was doing and just thought how much that I could support her clients. And so I started working with one agency, and then it kind of just snowballed when people heard how much I was helping their surrogates and supporting them and throughout their entire journey. So it's kind of grown from there. So the last three and a half years I've worked with uh different surrogacy agencies throughout their entire journey and healing postpartum as well.

unknown 5:57

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

It's very cool. I didn't have that when I was doing surrogacy. Nobody even thought about it. Nobody even thought about it. Like, yeah, just deal with it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

And I did surrogacy within the past decade.

SPEAKER_02 6:07

So and it wasn't really a big thing. Like, honestly, we I I personally only heard about it because like I needed it. And they were like, You're gonna go. And I'm like, okay. But I didn't know about it until we started that it was helping people in their pregnancies when we until we started uh podcasting and and talking to we talked to another pelvic floor mama, I think it is. We talked to her, um, and she I was like, What? Yeah, amazing. And now there's you, and it just seems like it's open opening doors and helping tons of women. It's amazing, amazing.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

It's becoming more normalized and like about like, hey, this is there's there's ways to help. There's ways to have to suffer.

SPEAKER_00 6:48

Yeah, totally, totally. And um, I know a lot of agencies are saying that their surrogates now are requesting that as part of their benefits package, which I love it. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 7:00

And are agencies putting it in the packages, or does like a surrogate literally have to ask for it? What do you find?

SPEAKER_00 7:06

Yeah, the way I work with many agencies is it's within their benefits package, but other agencies have it as an option that if a surrogate, if a surrogate requests it, then I'm a trusted partner. So it depends on the agency.

SPEAKER_02 7:20

Yeah. That's that's crazy that's incredible that it's even being offered.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Yeah, really.

SPEAKER_02 7:24

Absolutely, really.

Best Timing For Therapy And Training

SPEAKER_01 7:26

So how I know I have like a whole list of questions here, but like I said, we kind of just jump all over, we all get we get it all covered. But how does okay? So I'll just give an example. Like I'm losing track of how many months pregnant I am. I think I'm like four months, like I'm the end of my four months. Should I have started this in the beginning? Should I have started this pre? Is it cool to? I mean, obviously it's better late than never, but like when's the ideal time to start? Is this before transfers?

SPEAKER_00 7:54

So I mean it's never too late. I'll start with that. Yeah. But I the way I work with surrogates is just because every fertility clinic is different with first trimester and activity during first trimester, I typically start with surrogates at the beginning of second trimester, just because across the board they're clear for movement. But outside of any assistive reproduction, you can start during first trimester, absolutely. And you know, in a perfect world, pre-transfer or pre-conception, it would be great just to assess your pelvic floor and kind of know where you're at.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Nice. So when you because mom, you've done this, but like so when you say assessed your pelvic floor, in my head, I'm like, okay, like what level is it on? Like, am I like penthouse or like am I like basement? Like, is that like kind of what we're like?

Virtual Care Assessment And Anatomy Basics

SPEAKER_00 8:50

What we're and they're like that, you know, and then all the levels in between, but like is that kind of the assessment, like how high or how low, or I mean, in person, yes, you do an internal exam and see like how much tension or how weak a pelvic floor is, but with more in the surgacy space, I do everything virtually, and I can get a feel for based on your symptoms, if you have a more tight or weaker pelvic floor, if you experience, say, pelvic heaviness or leaking with certain things. And most of what I do is education on how to support your pelvic floor and like what exercises to support your pelvic floor, and then transitioning to delivery prep in third trimester as well.

SPEAKER_03 9:38

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 9:39

That's it's amazing. You can do that all virtually, like seriously. That's even cooler because not all there's not a lot of you right.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Yeah, I mean, hopefully it's a booming feel, but if there's not a lot of you, that's definitely doesn't with small, I mean, many surrogates have their own children who are young children and juggling a lot. So to add like another appointment that you have to go to in person can be a lot. So yeah, it's nice to help, you know, squeeze in after work or whenever it works for them. And I have an app that I send them home with everything, so then they have videos of what to do throughout.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Cool. Wow. Because in my head, I'm like trying to think of like like you know, like the anatomy, like the of like a skeleton, like in the science class. And it's like, okay, that's the pelvic bone, got it. But are you it's more so like muscles and everything that are like are with the pelvic bone, not maybe like because I'm if your pelvic bone or something, like I go to the chiropractic, so like if I have like things out of place, he'll pop it into place. So this is more like what's going on that's supporting that structure.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Yes. So your pelvic floor is a group of 26 muscles that they run from your pubic bone in the front to your tailbone in the back. So it's like front to back, like a hammock, and then sit bone to sit bone. So it's a muscular hammock that supports your pelvic organs. So your bladder, your uterus, your rectum, they all sit and your pelvic floor supports them.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

Wow. That's a big responsibility for that pelvic floor. Definitely. And I put a couple pregnancies on that, or even one, like yikes. Absolutely. They put electrodes, like literally, and this was probably eight years ago when I did this, like on my inner thighs. And then I had to do like movements and it registered on like a I don't want to think of it's a tens machine, but like a and it registered, and she saw how how weak it was that way. Like, so she literally got like a sense of it. And I was like, oh, and then she told me how to do the exercises, and you could see when I did them, like it would spike up, like I was doing them, I was engaging those muscles that she told me to engage. It's not well, that was that was hard to to know where those muscles were and to like go, how do I do it? So, do you find women are able to engage those muscles fairly easily because you can't see, right? It's all by feel, like, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:10

Yeah, I mean, most women have never tried on their own before. So it it takes a lot of like talking it out and virtually too. I'm talking to people and teaching them how they can assess themselves and everything. But I definitely have learned all the cues to be able to teach someone. Yeah.

Prolapse Prevention And Symptom Relief

SPEAKER_01 12:31

That's super just like so. It's fascinating to me because uh yeah, I don't even know what to say. I well, I have a quick question, but again, I'm just gonna like be here with a billion questions for you. But no, okay, so my mom had said, like, you know, if you add on a bunch of pregnancies, because that is a lot, that's a lot, especially if you never work these out. I mean, I think walking and you know, squats that that's gotta do something, right? Like, I'm I'm working my glutes, it's gotta do something down there, guess not. But like my my fear, because I do know older women that have had uterine, it's called uterine prolapse, right, mom? Yeah, we're like, so would pelvic therapy either help prevent that, or can you come back from that if you already have it and like you go to pelvic therapy?

SPEAKER_00 13:19

Yeah, I mean both. So in my surrogacy wellness program, all of the education I provide is helping reduce the risk of prolapse. So I teach how to move during pregnancy. So, like the way you go to the bathroom, the way you pick up your kids, the way you exercise, all of that can increase the risk of prolapse. So I teach them how to essentially reduce the risk and the way you push with a vaginal delivery, and then also just healing postpartum can reduce the risk. So all of that combined really helps. And then, like you said, with squats strengthening your glutes, all the muscles around your pelvis helps reduce the risk of prolapse. But if someone's coming to me, so multiple pregnancies can increase the risk. And a lot of surrogates I work with have had multiple pregnancies. And so if someone's coming to me with prolapse pre pre-pregnancy or pre-journey, I can help reduce the symptoms by giving them exercises and everything that way.

SPEAKER_01 14:27

Wow, that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_02 14:29

Because I always thought you had to have surgery to like you know, put it back a little sling, the bladder sling or whatever, right? I think that's what it's called.

SPEAKER_00 14:37

Right. Yeah, that that's an option for very severe prolapse, but more minor prolapse is super successful with physical therapy.

SPEAKER_02 14:48

Very cool. It is because that's what I went for.

SPEAKER_01 14:50

Yeah, I know that's why I mentioned it, mom.

SPEAKER_02 14:52

Didn't know you were gonna say, so like when you would turn on the water at the sink, like literally I would pee my pants. I mean, we're all women, I don't care. Yeah, I don't do that anymore. I'm so real. Yes, so it works.

SPEAKER_01 15:03

Yes, absolutely. Okay, so you're saying um, so back with like surrogates, so you know, second trimester where they can start working on this, and then when it comes time, so you're doing like exercises, you're strengthening for for ultimately for for birth, yeah. And then what what is postpartum with pelvic therapy like? Like, do you do you still take that six weeks off because you're not supposed to exercise? But is phys is physical therapy kind of in that range still?

Postpartum Rehab After Vaginal Or C-Section

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Yeah, yeah. So going back with during pregnancy, I don't just do pelvic floor, I'm also like a prenatal trainer as well. So I'm giving them full body strength workouts throughout each uh each month we meet. And so I'm giving like my warmups and cooldowns are pelvic floor specific, but the main part of the workouts are pregnancy-specific workouts. Okay. So that's to prevent pain, to prevent back pain, to prevent pubic synthesis pain. I'm just helping them stay strong during pregnancy and then transition to birth prep, and we talk through lots of birth prep workouts as well. But then postpartum, like asking the six weeks, uh, I do start things earlier. So we know six weeks is like full bone exercise clearance, but if you look at any other surgery or injury, you don't you don't want to just sit and do nothing for six weeks and then do everything six weeks. It's not like a green light, red light. It's so I do a lot to facilitate tissue healing in that first couple weeks. It's a lot of breath work and like light mobility and so much education with surrogates because you don't have a newborn slowing you down. So that's like the biggest thing that I see is like a week postpartum, they're wanting to go to Disneyland with their family or you know, do something because they're you know, the journey's done, it feels like, but it's a lot of education and then gradually, you know, light light movements and exercises, laying down and then progression to more body weight. And then when we're at the six weeks, that's more like a full body weight exercise program, and then gradually adding in and dumbbells and resistance.

SPEAKER_01 17:35

So, how long are you with how long is it contracted? Like for those that that star gets like, you know, it is in their benefit package or they do request you. How long are you with them for?

SPEAKER_02 17:46

So two-part question. How long are you with them for? And how often do you meet? I think you said monthly, but is that through the whole journey, even postpartum? So that's two parts.

SPEAKER_00 17:55

Yes. So I meet with them monthly. So seven times during pregnancy.

unknown 18:00

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:01

That's once a month, and then three times postpartum. Once I do it once a month typically, but it depends on how their birth went and if they want to see me like right after birth or wait a couple weeks. So the exact timing postpartum differs based on what they want, but typically for about three months postpartum, we're meeting.

SPEAKER_02 18:22

And if someone has, sorry, if someone has a c-section, like we were going the same way, mom. It's like okay. It's the else, I think. Someone is a c-section versus vaginal, like maybe they planned it or maybe it was just unplanned. Can the recovery for pelvic birth start postpartum? Kind of when you said like with some breathing, or do you wait a little bit longer?

SPEAKER_00 18:43

I start early with a c-section too. So what's what's pretty interesting also is the pregnancy program. Prenatal exercise can reduce the risk of a C-section by 30%. Prenatal exercise and pelvic floor therapy. So there's a lot that we talk about that way. But then C-section-wise, yes, we we focus on like ab rehab and how to get in and out of bed and how to support your incision, scar massage, things like that. Oh, scar massage.

SPEAKER_02 19:14

No, ever.

SPEAKER_01 19:18

Um okay. Wow. I'm like stuck on the like prenatal thing. I'm like, okay, I'm going right after this, I'm signing up. Like my beer is a C-section. I'm like, no, I'm not gonna, I haven't had one. So 30%. That's crazy. Is it because is it because you're just like preparing your body? Like you're making it, I don't want to say healthier because I don't know the correct terms here, but like, is there any logic behind why?

SPEAKER_00 19:42

I mean, we're still doing research, yeah, and those are initial research studies, the statistics, but what relaxing your pelvic floor, so your pelvic floor can create labor stalls, which can then lead to C-section. So relax, relaxing your pelvic floor, working on opening up each level of your pelvis to reduce the risk of labor stalls, and just so yeah, supporting your overall health during pregnancy as well.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

Why why are obese not like sending women here to or saying, hey, here's a card, here's a here's a to your company, to your your wellness click. Like I'm dumbfounded. Why aren't insurance companies doing this? It's much more expensive to have a C section than it is to have a vaginal delivery. Like, get on board, healthcare.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

Like I know, I know. I'm trying. Hopefully, one day. I mean, this is kind of I mean, heck, the fact that pelvic therapy is like a thing now that's often it's even talked about.

SPEAKER_02 20:42

Like people were just like, yeah, no, I'm not talking about that. Yeah, going in the right direction. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 20:46

Um I think oh sorry, go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 20:48

No, you go.

SPEAKER_00 20:49

Oh, I was gonna say, I think to add to that with the reducing the risk of C-section. So prenatal exercise also reduces the risk of pre-eclampsia and gestational diabetes, you know, so many different complications. So that can also add to that as well. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 21:06

Oh, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 21:07

Well, these are when you say you're working on it, like are you literally going to insurance companies? Are you are you trying to get this part of like an insurance, like a package for like a I'm curious?

SPEAKER_00 21:18

You could say no. Um, I'm not not necessarily with insurance companies, more just trying to get a bit of education out as well as all all other pelvic floor therapists. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:29

Gosh. Wow. I wanted to go back to the C-section because I had a question about that. Because I mean, I know stuff about it. I tried not to, because I I just I try. Well, I just am so afraid. I hear horror. My mom's had a my mom's had a horrific C-section. So like, but with a C-section, are they cutting your is that low enough to be cutting your pelvic floor muscles? Now that you said there's 26 in there, I'm like, wait. I mean, I know that I know that you gotta cut through like a like little. Eight layers, something like that. So it's like, are you messing up now your pelvic floor muscles as well?

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Well, your pelvic floor supports your the growing baby during your pregnancy. So your pelvic floor is still affected with the C-section, but it's not the incision is not through your pelvic floor, it's through your abdominal wall. So it's above it. Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

Well, still. Yikes.

SPEAKER_02 22:27

And your abdominal wall needs to be strong because that in turn holds up and helps.

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Right. And your pelvic floor and your core, your abdominal wall, work together. Okay. So every time you exhale, they work together. Wow. So it's all it's all related.

SPEAKER_01 22:44

Yeah. Well, and speaking of related, you work with this kind of not that you're related to her, but I promise it's you work for um you did you co-found surrogate wellness? Yes. Yes. Okay. So we we just spoke with Ginger, so I believe she's like a week or two prior to this airing. Um yes, so she is the nutrition side, and you are the so she is like the inside, and you're like the physical health. Yeah?

SPEAKER_00 23:15

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

Okay, so putting this together, that's like there's huge benefits in having in having both, right?

SPEAKER_00 23:24

Yes, absolutely. Yeah, combining both. I mean, there's so much research to support both the surrogate's health and the baby's health with nutrition and exercise together.

SPEAKER_03 23:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:36

Now, when surrogates, because I know that she works with surrogates too sometimes. So are you guys like a package or is it sometimes just singular?

SPEAKER_00 23:49

We can we have separate packages within our company, but many agencies hire both of us to work, so both of us work with the same clients, same surrogates. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:03

No, that's great. Best of literally both worlds. Yes. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

And I bet I I don't uh hey, and maybe I might be going too far on this one, and just tell me to be quiet if I am. Um with the one, because I think Jinger said there's one specific agency you guys are really working with, yeah. Like they offer the packages to everyone in their like all their sorts. Okay. Has there been any research done on those surrogates? Are that like have their births been easier or the recovery's been easier or compared to what the surrogate was used to before? Because obviously she's had other births or a birth. Any or is it too new?

SPEAKER_00 24:40

I mean, I haven't done an actual research study, but more just their feedback to me. I've, you know, last week I had a surrogate seven weeks postpartum on her fourth delivery, and she says she feels stronger seven weeks postpartum than she did even before her journey. Wow. I've had multiple surrogates who have leaked since their very first baby, and now they don't. I've had surrogates who have debilitating sciatica, debilitating sciatica their entire pregnancy, previous pregnancies, yeah, and had to leave work early, go on leave, and they were fine without pondering.

SPEAKER_02 25:22

That's research right there. I don't have it in the book. That's verbal. I should have asked it as verbal. Yeah, that's that's fantastic. That wow. I feel like it's such a win-win. I just don't understand why everybody's not getting this. I know. Yeah, absolutely. You guys would be inundated if all the agencies were doing it, but it would open up more doors for more pelvic therapists and more nutritionists and more, yeah, it would.

SPEAKER_00 25:48

Yeah, definitely. It definitely would. Um, I think right now it's seen as more like a concierge service or extra, but I think if agencies saw and intended parents saw how much it helps the surrogate and their baby's health, then I think I think it wouldn't be seen as such a concierge service and more of just an essential part of the journey.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

It's like mental health. We were talking to your co-founder about that. That that the mental health is now not necessarily considered concierge, it's almost like in every package. And so this is going to be. You know for sure. You know it just in in due time.

SPEAKER_01 26:30

Hopefully sooner than later.

SPEAKER_02 26:31

But yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:32

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. No, absolutely. Um kind of piggybacking off of that because it was kind of like, you know, all together. But what advice do you give to surrogates who are struggling with fatigue, back pain, or stress at various stages of pregnancy? And they come to you. Maybe they come to you late and they're like, This is all the things I'm going on, or if they're skeptical about, wow, will this really help me?

SPEAKER_00 26:59

Yeah, I think I've had surrogates who well, I'm just saying, oh, when I'm pregnant, I have back pain. That's just my pregnancies. I know it's going to happen, it's inevitable. And so I meet with women kind of in that state, or if they already do have back pain. And I just talk through all the things we can do. So we look at if they have young children, how they're lifting them, if they work and how they move when they're working. I give exercises to prevent back pain and braces that can be helpful if needed. There's, you know, so much that we can do. They're sleeping positions. There's we kind of address every part of their life to prevent that back pain from happening or address it if they do have a black back pain flare-up.

unknown 27:49

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

And then fatigue, I would say that the first thing to go when someone is super fatigued is often exercise. But I always talk to them, and exercise improves your energy, but it's it's hard to see that when you're in that super fatigue state. So we kind of find that perfect balance that you're exercising enough to improve your energy. I'll make um like nausea-friendly workouts or like fatigue-friendly workouts that are like on the floor. So it feels more manageable to be to say, okay, I'm just gonna get on the floor and do some movements instead of jumping. I mean, I'm not giving anything jumping around, but it's not a super on the elliptical, yeah. Like, no, yeah, right. So I think finding that balance that you're not feeling depleted from your workouts, but you're moving enough, it's actually going to improve your energy.

SPEAKER_01 28:45

That's completely fair. Yeah, because you're right. Like when you're tired, it's like really working out, that's gonna help. I'm tired. That needs energy. I need to give energy to that. Like it's it's kind of like a weird little vicious cycle. But if you have the right tools that you can offer, then obviously it's definitely, definitely possible. I mean, you said sleeping. Does that involve like does that involve those pregnancy pillows where like I was gonna ask that? Yeah, well, because like because again, I don't know much about like anatomy and stuff, but I'm I mean, I sleep with a pregnancy pillow and it raises like my right hip or whatever sides on. So I'm thinking that has to do with pelvic, like right or no?

SPEAKER_00 29:27

I mean, all the pregnancy pillows are different, but I definitely suggest having a pillow between your knees to keep your knees and hips in line. And so not everyone sleeps like that. So that's like a really easy start. And you know, just depending on if one hip is more sore than the other, we can talk through different pillow positions and sleeping postures and and stretches to do before or after you go to bed just to help with it.

SPEAKER_02 29:58

It totally just sounds like there are things you can do literally while in your home, even while you're sleeping, yeah, to help you. You don't have to spend thousands of dollars a year on a gym membership, right? Or on a or on a quote unquote, and I know I'm bringing in the nutritious side of this, but like a personal chef, like you can do it with education, you can do it. Granted, it might take a little work and a little bit more of a mindset, yes, and kind of get out of our comfort zone and try things differently, but but heck, if the potentiality is you're gonna feel better, you maybe have a better birth and better recovery, why not?

SPEAKER_03 30:37

Totally, totally, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:39

And I always make things that are manageable for people. So the research with all the benefits on reducing the risk of complications is 150 minutes of exercise per week. And that's a combination of like walking and strength training. So it's not crazy, not crazy, it's a little over two hours, right? Two, two and a half, and that's over seven days. Yeah. So but even something is better than nothing. So if someone can't hit that 150 minutes, I can make 10-minute workouts to support your body. It's just not maybe optimizing all of the health benefits. There you go.

SPEAKER_01 31:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 31:22

So so if someone, let's say there's a surrogate and she is getting these benefits from her agency, um, and your portion of these benefits, the physical therapy side of it. What's included? Uh it's we already talked about there's seven visits, right? Um, and then there's postpartum. Does that include the postpartum visits? Sorry, the seven. Okay. And then there's an app, right? And she has access to this app.

SPEAKER_00 31:49

Yeah. So there's 10 total visits. 10.

unknown 31:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 31:53

And we'll meet once a month for the video calls. And I have an app that I upload a new set of workouts each time we meet. So I'll upload it.

SPEAKER_02 32:03

Personalized to her?

SPEAKER_00 32:05

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 32:07

What? I applaud you because that's gotta take some time to get together and like even little pieces of paper from my physical therapist. Here, follow this. Like nice.

SPEAKER_00 32:18

These are personal. It's yes. So if someone wants three 60-minute workouts, I'll do that. If they want three 20-minute workouts, we'll do it with what equipment they own. And if they're going to the gym or if they're at home, and all the workouts are exactly personal to them.

SPEAKER_02 32:35

Wow. Incredible.

SPEAKER_00 32:37

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:38

They have access to this app after they're done with you?

SPEAKER_00 32:41

Or does it we do? I normally give them access for a few months postpartum and then we'll talk if they're still using it. I'll just let them keep it.

SPEAKER_02 32:49

But oh, you're so sweet.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

Thank you. Wow. I'm amazed to hear that like you're someone's like little Peloton trainer, basically. Like it's just like how I think of it. I'm like, oh look, she'll know my name. Yeah, yeah, that's funny.

SPEAKER_02 33:04

So fine. And I don't know if if you guys have been in the world that long, like the surrogacy world and the agency that long. Like, have you had repeat surrogates yet or not yet?

SPEAKER_00 33:13

I have. I have. I've been working in this space for three and a half years. So I've had a couple repeats.

SPEAKER_02 33:19

Okay. Oh, that's pretty cool. Super cool. Super cool. Yeah. That's really fun. That's very cool. This needs to be everywhere. I'm sorry. This needs to be in all agencies. And I know it's an extra cost. I get it. I get it. But really in the scheme of things. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In the scheme of things. Yes. Or in the fertility world. Come on.

unknown 33:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:39

Now I do have a question. So because maybe someone's hearing this and they're in the middle of their journey, right? So, like, really, the contracts are signed. They can't really do anything to add anything to it. Could could I'm assuming they can just come to you on their own and if they wanted to pay out of pocket themselves, yeah?

SPEAKER_00 33:56

Yes, of course. And I've had surrogates find out about it later from other agencies and they'll present it to their intended parents. And you know, sometimes they'll be willing to fund it too. So of course it depends on the situation. But yeah. And and if they're not coming for all 10, like if they're mid-journey, I'll prorate based on how many they would see me for.

SPEAKER_01 34:18

Oh, very nice. And is it all up front or is it like a monthly like subscription?

SPEAKER_00 34:23

Like yeah, that's a good question.

SPEAKER_03 34:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:25

It's when it's in the benefits package, it's all up front. So I typically do it all up front. What since we have it just kind of included and I go through the agency, but yeah, I hold up. Yeah, well, that makes sense. It could be different.

SPEAKER_01 34:39

Plus, it makes you stick to it if it's all up front. It's like, well, I paid for it, so I might as well show up.

SPEAKER_02 34:45

My parents paid for it or the agency, yeah. Right, right. It kind of holds the surrogate a little bit, but I can't see if the surrogate comes to you for one time and she tries one of the things you say and it helps her. I mean, I'd be like baited breath to come back the second time. Like, come on, I need to come back the second time. Give me some more. Yeah. And then you're giving me personal workouts, like what?

SPEAKER_00 35:06

Yeah, that's like yeah. I've definitely, I mean, everyone that I've worked with has found something. Oh, even if they're not a super into exercise person, we'll make it fun enough for them.

SPEAKER_02 35:20

Yeah, I was gonna say, you don't seem so like gotta do it, gotta do it. You know, you're coming in there, you know, just like what equipment do you have at home? Do you have a floor mat? Do you have a tube, whatever those things are called, a yoga mat? I'll work with whatever you've got at home. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Makes it very feasible. You two are like a dynamic duo. Yeah. Partners, you are. Seriously, this is very fun. Yeah. This is very cool to even have out there in the world for yeah.

unknown 35:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:51

Thank you. It's rewarding. Oh, you have another question. Say it again. Oh, I just said thank you. It's been so rewarding.

SPEAKER_02 35:57

Oh, I bet it has. Oh my gosh. And you do this, this is you do this full time, right? This isn't like a little side thing. Yeah, yeah, for sure, do this full time. Heck yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

Yeah. I see patients in my clinic a few days a month, but the rest, I just see surrogates.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

Wow.

unknown 36:12

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 36:12

I was gonna say, I mean, if you're making your own videos, you gotta this has to be a full-time job. I can only imagine. Yeah, it takes a lot. I bet. Yeah. These podcasts take a lot. I'm like tired afterwards. I'm like, I gotta edit it. I can't imagine doing like how I don't even know.

SPEAKER_00 36:31

Yeah, that's no, that's yeah. So those are all so I have two apps actually. That that one is all I've recorded each individual exercise. Yeah. And then I compile them how it works. And then I have a separate app that's more like the on-demand Peloton type videos that anyone, not just the surrogate C World, yeah, that anyone does.

SPEAKER_01 36:54

But still, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:55

No, it's just so cool.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

So they can refer back to it if their hands are in the wrong place or they're they're not reading right. Yeah, no, 100% got that. Absolutely.

Misconceptions About Exercise In Pregnancy

SPEAKER_01 37:03

I have a question. I'm I'm curious, what are common misconceptions you hear about surrogate wellness that you'd like to clear up? Not your company, just like in general.

SPEAKER_00 37:15

Yeah, yeah. I think one of the biggest ones, and I've had some conversations with intended parents on it, is too, is especially in the fertility space, there were previous myths about exercise not being safe during pregnancy. And so I think that's a huge misconception, is we have so much research now to support moderate intensity exercise during pregnancy is safe and incredibly beneficial for reducing all the risk of all complications. And the only reason someone shouldn't exercise is if an OB has placed them on pelvic rest for a very specific condition. But that is very rare and it is very safe and doesn't pose any risks. So I think that's the biggest misconception. And probably the second misconception is that because a surrogate has had multiple pregnancies, that she kind of knows what to do and doesn't need the support. I've heard that too. Um I heard that. But I think one, it's also different when she's carrying someone else's baby because a lot of times they aren't exercising and want their guidance from me because they want to make sure they're doing things right. And so they really like my guidance that they know that they're doing something that's evidence-based.

SPEAKER_01 38:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Um, and then also just because you've been pregnant doesn't mean that you know how to do prenatal exercise.

SPEAKER_01 38:45

So yeah, that and not no two pregnancies are ever the same. Right, right. I mean, what a dream if they were. That's why most surrogates are like, oh yeah, I had easy pregnancies, I can do this. And then sometimes it's like, this was the hardest pregnancy ever. And it's like, you just never know what you're gonna get. Totally, totally. How funny. Um, what advice would you give to agencies or intended parents who want to better support the wellness of their surrogates? I'm assuming just like sign you.

SPEAKER_00 39:16

Yeah. Really? I mean, yes, but like that. Uh I think just knowing that wellness for their surrogate is one of the most important things to support a healthy pregnancy for the surrogate, for the baby, for the agency, everyone, it supports everyone. And when this is such a simple addition to a benefits package and just the journey, I think that's just something to think about and knowing that it reduces the risk of most complications.

SPEAKER_01 39:55

Yeah. That's a huge one that I didn't know. I'm like, damn.

SPEAKER_02 39:58

And I think as like an intended parent, I'm just trying to put myself like in their shoes. If someone came to me with this option and just said, hey, you know, the surrogate, I can give her the advice and the and the expertise and what have you to learn to learn how to exercise during pregnancy. Because say the surrogate never exercised before, you just don't want to go to the gym and start lifting weights. Like that's that no, that's not how you do it. Yeah, I, as an intended parent, would go, Yes, please have please offer her whatever advice you can and whatever guidance you can, because at the end of the day, it's the health of the surrogate, health of the baby is just gonna make the entire process and those intended parents, everybody a win-win. I cannot see why this is not in every single package. It's gonna be though, Joseph. It's gonna be. It is, it is. I can see it coming. Maybe not tomorrow, but I can see it. Totally.

How Agencies And Intended Parents Can Help

SPEAKER_00 40:52

Well, yeah, I've definitely seen progress. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:56

Oh, I I bet. I mean, even when I like me and my mom did surrogacy decades apart, I feel, I think like 20-ish years apart. And when I first started, it was like, okay, everybody meet at this one place. You're gonna speak to the psychiatrist or the psychologist or whatever, one time a month. That's it. See you next time, like like that. And now it's like you're assigned somebody. Here you go. Like this is your person every like anytime you need, on call. And that's only been within uh, I don't know, like eight, nine years. So I have a lot of hope. Hopefully it's sooner than that, but that this will be like here's the nutrition package, here's the here's the prenatal and the pelvic floor. Like these are all because if you put all of that together, it's like it's it's gotta be successful, like just for you as like a human and the baby. Like, there's no for everyone.

SPEAKER_00 41:54

And when a surrogate has such a positive experience with her journey, then she might want to go do a repeat journey. I've had multiple say that they felt so good, they'd love to do another one.

SPEAKER_02 42:04

And and her family benefits too, because she's bouncing back to her old self. And during maybe this time she's got some little maternity leave, she can actually do hang out with the kids, hang out with the husband, maybe have a little bit of rest time and enjoyment before they start back up to work or her full-time life or whatever she's doing.

SPEAKER_00 42:23

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've had some husbands actually do the workouts too, you know. Oh, so fun! Oh, so fun. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 42:32

I love that. That's cute. Well, because your your uh ginger said that the husbands will come and go, hey, I'm 20 pounds down after they're on like the nutritional thread. Yeah, yeah. See, win-win, whole family. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

That's cool. That's really cool. What uh what do you hope every prospective surrogate knows before beginning her journey? Wow, go on.

SPEAKER_00 43:02

Well, I think just knowing that so going into surrogacy, you're excited about just like it's such an act of generosity and an incredible gift to families, but also realizing that it is a physical and emotional journey as well. And just knowing that you can help create this strong support system. So like finding the various providers, be mental health, physical, nutrition, to be on your team and to support you through that journey can be incredibly beneficial and really uh change the trajectory of your journey and just really support your journey.

SPEAKER_02 43:43

That's a great answer. Yeah, that's wonderful. Yeah, and it's all true. Because it's a village.

SPEAKER_01 43:52

Absolutely. And uh for anyone listening who's curious about like how. Prenatal fitness or supporting surrogates, what's one takeaway you want them to walk away with today? Kind of like what?

SPEAKER_02 44:13

I was gonna say education, education, just mean I know, right? Just like education helps people.

SPEAKER_00 44:20

I think the biggest thing to take away is you don't have to wait until you have symptoms to address your physical health, your physical and pelvic health. So if you are on a surrogacy journey or you're pregnant, supporting your body before you have any symptoms throughout your entire journey will prevent symptoms and support your body throughout your entire journey.

SPEAKER_01 44:50

Yeah, that's perfect. Here, here why not prevent it? I would love to prevent anything I can. Prevention, prevention, and education. I mean, it's fascinating. What you do is fascinating, and thank goodness there's people like you because it's it's needed, not just for the surrogacy world, but for like women in general. It's just needed.

SPEAKER_02 45:12

But you saw that need, like you were literally working somewhere and you saw the need, and you're like, heck, I'm I'm gonna go get educated in this, I'm gonna go certify myself in this. And thank you for doing that because it's it's just that trickle down effect. It's people will hear this, people heard from a surrogate who's used you and ginger, like it's just that trickle down, and everybody's gonna, everybody's gonna benefit from it.

SPEAKER_00 45:36

Everybody, totally. And yeah, I think it's also been helpful for them that I'm so aware of the process instead of just going to like a random pelvic floor physical therapist. Yes, since I can speak to them using the right terminology and and understanding what their transfer cycle was like and everything like that.

SPEAKER_02 46:00

So cool.

Where To Follow And Work Together

SPEAKER_01 46:01

No, it's very cool. If people want to work with you or find out more, how can they reach you or where can they follow you?

SPEAKER_00 46:11

They can follow my personal business account is Vibrant CoastPT. And we also have surrogate wellness on Instagram, and then I have surrogatewellness.com. So they can either message me on Instagram or through our our website, there's a form you can fill out.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

Okay, perfect. And I'll link all that in the description so it's easier to find. Perfect. Oh my gosh, this is amazing.

SPEAKER_02 46:43

Did we forget anything? I was gonna say, do we address it all?

Research Stats For Surrogate And Baby

SPEAKER_00 46:46

Do we I think so? I guess I had some more statistics just like about the baby's health. Yeah, yeah. Uh yeah. How does pelvic health and strength conditioning improve pregnancy outcomes for surrogates? Yeah, so there's there's so many outcomes for both the surrogate and the baby with prenatal exercise. So the research studies have studied doing 150 minutes of exercise per week. So that's a combination of resistance training and some sort of moderate cardio, like walking.

SPEAKER_03 47:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 47:24

But so for the surrogate, they found a 38% reduced risk of gestational diabetes, a 41% reduced risk of pre-eclampsia, 67% reduced risk of prenatal depression.

unknown 47:39

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

30% reduced risk of C-section. There's a reduced risk of instrument delivery, reduced risk of low back and pelvic pain, and reduced risk of abdominal separation. And a 30% reduced risk of postpartum incontinence. So exercise during pregnancy reduces the risk of postpartum incontinence. Yes. And then for the baby, there's actually a decreased risk of preterm birth. There's when with prenatal exercise, there is increased capillary development in the placenta. So then there's actually better blood flow and nutrients to the baby with exercise during pregnancy, which is super cool research.

SPEAKER_02 48:27

Yeah, that's really cool research. I don't even know how they find that, but I know that.

SPEAKER_00 48:32

Yeah. And they've also found that there's better stress tolerance for the baby. So if you exercise during pregnancy, there's that light bit of stress that the baby encounters. So the baby gets more used to that during pregnancy. And so during delivery, then they're more used to that stress and they have a better tolerance to that stress, which is pretty incredible.

SPEAKER_02 48:56

There's even incredible.

SPEAKER_00 48:58

I know. There's initial research that the baby's heart and brain has improved development with prenatal exercise. And there's even decreased risk of metabolic disorders like type 2 diabetes and different metabolic disorders later in life for the baby. So it's pretty incredible research, and there's just going to be more, but yeah, yeah, prenatal exercise is very, very essential. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:28

All agencies need to offer this. Right. Well, right. Like the outcomes, I they just seem to just outweigh everything else.

SPEAKER_01 49:38

Well, there's just no, there's no seem like a detriment to any of it.

SPEAKER_02 49:43

Like, I mean, if the surrogate overdoes, or like somebody's just like, yes, I'm gonna go run 18 miles and they've never done that before. Yeah, okay, that's a little extreme. We got that. Yeah, but but realistic thing. Yeah, yeah. And finding a coach and a partner like your company and you, Jessica, and it's amazing. I can't even understand why. Oh, yeah, I'll be quiet. Sorry.

SPEAKER_01 50:05

No, go ahead, mom. Say it for the for say it say it for a lot of time.

SPEAKER_02 50:09

I just I don't think it's necessary.

SPEAKER_01 50:12

No, I know. This one feels so helpful. But it and it sucks that like all good things come to those who wait. Yeah, we know the saying, but we're tired of waiting. But it it will I I can only imagine that this will become the norm, the standard. It has to, especially with people like you spreading education about it.

SPEAKER_02 50:35

Like it and surrogates singing the praises because they're all getting the benefits of it. Right.

SPEAKER_01 50:40

Yeah, the ease of mind from intended parents. I mean, like if they have the nutrition and they and they know that their surrogate is also, you know, do it like exercise, like keeping her body healthy in every way possible.

SPEAKER_03 50:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:54

Well, there's like that's gotta put them at ease. I mean, that would put me at ease being like, okay, she is eating, you know, she's eat, she's not just eating like not that most surrogates do, but you know, she's not eating McDonald's like breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Like, you know, like she's on a she's got some structure going on.

SPEAKER_02 51:09

So totally it's all it's all winning.

SPEAKER_01 51:12

This is all huge win.

SPEAKER_02 51:14

This is congratulations to you guys. This is awesome. Really seriously. Thank you. What a pairing. I mean, that's phenomenal.

SPEAKER_00 51:19

It's a great how do you guys even meet? Like do you can I we live in the same town. So I uh my physical therapy clinic that I own is in San Luis Obispo in California. Yeah, and she is a dietitian at our OBDYN clinic there. So we connected before or like around the time I started working with CRUC agencies, and I one of the agencies I was working with was looking for a dietitian. So I referred her, and then we realized why don't we just start a program together? Yeah, yeah. Light bulb.

SPEAKER_01 51:58

And slow is oh no, Cambria's small. Slow's not small. I'm thinking of something.

SPEAKER_00 52:03

I mean, it's it's fairly small, healthcare wise. It's it's like 45,000 people. Yeah, that's kind of compared to beautiful out there.

SPEAKER_01 52:11

Yeah, it's gorgeous, yeah. It's gorgeous. Wow. Oh my gosh. Well, thank you so much, Jessica. This was yeah, fascinating. Very enlightening. Oh my god. Thank thank you both so much for having me. Oh, of course. I'm I might be calling you soon.

SPEAKER_00 52:29

Good luck to you guys.

SPEAKER_01 52:30

Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 52:32

Thank you. Excited to spread the word.

SPEAKER_01 52:35

Yes, yes, us too. Well, this is I I can't imagine. I can't imagine you're not gonna be flooded after this. So keep your phone on. Awesome. Well, thank you so much. Have a great rest of your day.

SPEAKER_00 52:52

Thank you. You too. Take care. Thanks. You too. Bye-bye. Goodness.

SPEAKER_02 52:58

Wow.

unknown 53:00

I goodness.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

A little match made in heaven, those two.

SPEAKER_01 53:03

You know, no, like that's a per that's a perfect duo.

SPEAKER_02 53:06

That's a perfect duo.

SPEAKER_01 53:08

It's a perfect duo.

SPEAKER_02 53:09

Like, oh, it is hand in hand.

SPEAKER_01 53:11

I would love some for somebody to tell me what I should be eating so I don't have to think about it. And then I would love for somebody to give me like, this is what you should be working out, this is what you should do, this is what you should do to reduce the risk of having a C-section and all these horrible complications.

SPEAKER_02 53:26

And it's like And to improve your success at recovery too, after you have a baby. Because again, you don't have the newborn and you don't want to get back out there too, too fast, but you want to ease into it correctly. So, and she even said a couple of her surrogates have come back to her and just said, I feel better now postpartum than I did even before my journey started. And you're like, What? That's awesome, right?

Listener Outreach And Closing

SPEAKER_01 53:47

Yeah, it's amazing, amazing, fascinating, amazing, amazing, fascinating. Well, thank you so much, Jessica. If anybody has any questions or stories they would like to share, please feel free to reach out to us on Instagram at StopPeriodsitPeriod Surrogate or at our email at stop periodsitperiod surrogate at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_02 54:03

It's been another edition of Stopsit Surrogate with Kennedy and Ellen. Thanks so much. Bye.

unknown 54:08

Bye.

SPEAKER_01 54:08

Before we wrap up, a huge thank you to our sponsor, U.S. Surrogacy. Their support helps us continue to share real stories, educate our community, and connect families through the incredible journey of surrogacy. Thanks so much for tuning in to Stopsit Surrogate, where every story matters and every journey is worth sharing. We'll see you next time.